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verbalkint
August 13th, 2006, 08:44 PM
Seeing that the Asuran city-ship departed Asuras and Weir & company had time to come up with a plan and implement it before it reached Atlantis makes me wonder just how fast the city-ship hyperspace drives are. It must have taken hours to pull that reprogramming off for Rodney. For some reason I think the reason the ancients didn't just take Atlantis back to earth is that their hyperdrive engines aren't fast enough to distance themselves from the wraith and thus would have led the wraith directly to Earth and the rest of the MW galaxy. Just a thought.

Bragi
August 13th, 2006, 08:52 PM
Well. . .

We don't know how far away Asura is from Atlantis.

But speeds in Stargate have been frelled with so much that it's hard to say. An Asgard ship can travel from their home galaxy to Earth in minutes, but take a week to reach Pegasus.

It's a real mindfrell.

NATIK
August 13th, 2006, 09:11 PM
Well. . .

We don't know how far away Asura is from Atlantis.

But speeds in Stargate have been frelled with so much that it's hard to say. An Asgard ship can travel from their home galaxy to Earth in minutes, but take a week to reach Pegasus.

It's a real mindfrell.

Indeed, the writers need to decide on speeds and not change them according to storyneeds, instead change the locations if anything is to be changed.

Bragi
August 13th, 2006, 09:29 PM
Or explain why it might take longer.

Like, they couldn't go at full speed because of. . . I dunno. . . someone was cooking a turkey for some fresh sandwiches while they were in hyperspace, and it was draining power from the engines.

OriWillKillUsAll
August 13th, 2006, 11:18 PM
Well. . .

We don't know how far away Asura is from Atlantis.

But speeds in Stargate have been frelled with so much that it's hard to say. An Asgard ship can travel from their home galaxy to Earth in minutes, but take a week to reach Pegasus.

It's a real mindfrell.

We don't know it took a week to get to Pegasus with that, all we have is some vague comment from Wier about cutting down a couple of weeks of travel time, which is roughly two weeks via Deadalus. It may have been anything from 4 days to 4 minutes travel. It would have been helpful for all the 'Asgard hyperdrives aren't that great' crowd if she said "With their help, we'll be there in a week.", but she didn't.

Mister Oragahn
August 14th, 2006, 03:53 PM
Seeing that the Asuran city-ship departed Asuras and Weir & company had time to come up with a plan and implement it before it reached Atlantis makes me wonder just how fast the city-ship hyperspace drives are. It must have taken hours to pull that reprogramming off for Rodney. For some reason I think the reason the ancients didn't just take Atlantis back to earth is that their hyperdrive engines aren't fast enough to distance themselves from the wraith and thus would have led the wraith directly to Earth and the rest of the MW galaxy. Just a thought.

Unlikely. The lantian databank had all the necessary juicy info to produce intergalactic hyperdrives, which were far superior to wraith hyperdrives.

genome
August 14th, 2006, 03:56 PM
maybe the asurans were taking their time cos they werent in a hurry. thats something that was mentioned a few times bout the replicators they didnt really care about time.

immhotep
August 14th, 2006, 04:00 PM
Just for the record the Asgard did not move from their galaxy to ours in 4 seconds, they moved form Earth to the void between galaxies ... a much shorter trip.

genome
August 14th, 2006, 04:08 PM
we also dont know the distances travelled, may be to get from earth to pegasus we need to go all the way accross the mw and further i n the void then travel a fair distance in pegasus to get to atlantis, but to get to ida its like crossing the street, short trip to the void, shorter trip in the void than to pegasus. we havent been given an intergalactic map of the SG universe afterall.

obox
August 14th, 2006, 04:38 PM
Remember that the Asgard are so quick because their ships generate way more power then Earth ships. The Deadalus did the trip from Earth to Atlantis super quick when it had the ZPM powering it.
So that means i think:
More power = Fast hyperdrives

AsgardCarnage
August 14th, 2006, 05:11 PM
i'd still love to see a map, of the relationship between the galaxies. ida MW and pegasus. that would be nice. and as many people have said before it would be great if the writters would get their cannon together and stick to it. Restricting the physical laws in the SG universe will bread better writting i think it might stop them from being so lazy

verbalkint
August 14th, 2006, 09:11 PM
i'd still love to see a map, of the relationship between the galaxies. ida MW and pegasus. that would be nice. and as many people have said before it would be great if the writters would get their cannon together and stick to it. Restricting the physical laws in the SG universe will bread better writting i think it might stop them from being so lazy
That would be sweet if they did provide the audience with a map so that we could actually put distances between galaxies and planets into cannon. Come on TPTB, its been 10 years and we don't even have that yet, pick up the pace.

stevieg
August 14th, 2006, 10:13 PM
maybe the asurans didnt fully power up the stardrive to allow more power to destrot atlantis when they got there, or maybe its because the hyperdrive is of 10,000 year old design

Pasankoon
August 14th, 2006, 10:48 PM
That is something that ABSOLUTELY pisses me off all the time. How the writers change the laws of physics of the show just to suite story line needs. I am TIRED of that. Why cant they be consistent with the technology of stargate. Hyperspace travel is just one of many.

And as for a map we already have it. Milky way and peguses are about 3.5 million light years apart. And peguses is a dwarf galaxy which means that it is ALOT smaller than the milkyway. Ida is most likely one of the small galaxies that are in orbit around our own.

Metonic
August 14th, 2006, 11:17 PM
Well. . .

We don't know how far away Asura is from Atlantis.

But speeds in Stargate have been frelled with so much that it's hard to say. An Asgard ship can travel from their home galaxy to Earth in minutes, but take a week to reach Pegasus.

It's a real mindfrell.
maybe the asgard have to go thru our galaxy to get to pegasus. remember Pegasus is suppose to be like orbiting the MW(i think) so the location is changing so the speeds may as well...

I'd say tho that tehy were o nthat ship for abotu 30 minutes or so... lol...Rodneys a genius he has an entire hour going on in his head for every second we have in ours. lol

GreyFox
August 15th, 2006, 09:59 AM
stands to reason that cityship hyperdrives are slower duh

Bragi
August 15th, 2006, 10:55 AM
Pegasus orbits Andromeda.

PSp2gamer
August 15th, 2006, 11:40 AM
Do we have any proof that they were in a hurry, why always go full speed if they dont think that Atlantis is a match for them anyway.

Also, remember this is a CITY, not a Yo-Yo :cameron:. Even though there are 3-ZPM's powering it, remember that you have a Shield and a MASSIVE hyperspace window. Im sure the power requirements are easily met, but read the point above.

verbalkint
August 15th, 2006, 06:59 PM
That is something that ABSOLUTELY pisses me off all the time. How the writers change the laws of physics of the show just to suite story line needs. I am TIRED of that. Why cant they be consistent with the technology of stargate. Hyperspace travel is just one of many.

And as for a map we already have it. Milky way and peguses are about 3.5 million light years apart. And peguses is a dwarf galaxy which means that it is ALOT smaller than the milkyway. Ida is most likely one of the small galaxies that are in orbit around our own.
The thing is there seems to be some debate over whether the galaxies are in the same position in the stargate universe as it is in real life. I think that is one of the primary points of contention when hyperspace speeds are trying to be calculated.

Sauron18
August 15th, 2006, 08:08 PM
Actually, the Asuran planet is in a different part of the galaxy from Atlantis, this is mentioned in the episode.

From Weir and Sheppard's comments I'd go as far as to say they are on the other side of Pegasus, and if not, near the center, which would imply a complicated hyperspace route.

And yes, it's also a City, but nonetheless, I'd say Lantian Hyperdrives are probably the fastest.

nerus
February 13th, 2007, 02:36 AM
It wouldn't take long for Atlantis to return to Earth because they had 3 ZPMs, and from what we learnt in the siege it decreases the travel time. The reason why the Ancients left Atlantis in the Pegasus galaxy is because it could effect the timeline. (Dr weir from the future, Before I sleep)

Boxytheboxed
February 13th, 2007, 02:48 AM
maby good point

Øsiris øf the Øri
February 13th, 2007, 04:26 AM
It wouldn't take long for Atlantis to return to Earth because they had 3 ZPMs, and from what we learnt in the siege it decreases the travel time. The reason why the Ancients left Atlantis in the Pegasus galaxy is because it could effect the timeline. (Dr weir from the future, Before I sleep)

I doubt that is the reason. many Expected that they would come back. They wanted to bring weir with them to earth to live out the rest of her life and thus leave the timeline intact. So why not bring the city? It Probably stands to reason that launching a city ship straight into an armada that is probably at least 100 strong hive ships wise would be suicidal.

wise one
February 13th, 2007, 05:17 AM
i dont see why they didnt biuld some load more drones and destroy them all on orbit and once it was clear fly into orbit and to earth

Integrabyte
February 13th, 2007, 02:12 PM
Do we have any proof that they were in a hurry, why always go full speed if they dont think that Atlantis is a match for them anyway.

Also, remember this is a CITY, not a Yo-Yo :cameron:. Even though there are 3-ZPM's powering it, remember that you have a Shield and a MASSIVE hyperspace window. Im sure the power requirements are easily met, but read the point above.


Mate look back at the episode where O'Neill sends the marines to help Weir protect Atlantis at all costs until Caldwell arrives. If you watch closely you will see that Everett or what's his name says that Caldwell will be orbiting the planet in 4 days. He says a ZPM powers the asgard intergalactic hyper drive. It is well known that the ancient FTL drive is the refference point in the SG saga when it comes to efficiency,speed, and design. Power the stardrive with 3 ZPMs in parallel and you get to Earth faster than Caldwell did with the Asgard Drive; powered by a ZPM of course. Sure, shields, hyper space window, yadda,yadda. Remember 3ZPMs in parallel and not in series will yield more than enough energy to fly to earth in a short period of time.

Had the lantians needed more ZPMs in order to use the city at it's full capacity, they would have added the extra slots for additional ZPMs. As you can clearly see, 3 do more than enough.

cooky
February 13th, 2007, 02:39 PM
In real life, there are several dwarf galaxies within 50 thousand light years of earth, while the farthest reaches of our own galaxy are more than twice that distance. Just becase Ida is a different galaxy, doesn't mean its all that far away. This easilly explains the travel times between Earth and Ida, Pegasus or other parts of the Milky Way.

wilson359
February 13th, 2007, 06:38 PM
I'm no expert but size even the design of Atlantis could be a factor in the speed it travels at.

Bragi
February 13th, 2007, 06:47 PM
The shape of Atlantis has nothing to do with how it travels in space.

It's size does, however. It has an enormous mass, so maneuvering would be a real pain in the back side due to inertia. Also, the power required to send it through hyperspace would require. . . well. . . . we all know how much power it would require.

wilson359
February 14th, 2007, 01:29 AM
I was thinking more structually than anything (I should've been more clear)

knowles2
February 14th, 2007, 03:06 AM
inertia does not really mean anything anymore in Stargate they have inertia dampeners.Ours work as what 90% or more the ancients probably work at 100% efficiency, which inertia would not effect the performance of Atlantis.

wise one
February 14th, 2007, 03:07 AM
its all about power i guess, the more power the fater it goes

im guessing

Integrabyte
February 14th, 2007, 04:25 AM
I was thinking more structually than anything (I should've been more clear)


When Atlantis has the shield on it forms a bubble around the city. If you recall that is the "hull" of the flying city. I am sure you are aware that creating this bubble you eliminate the "aerodynamic issues" you have with a space ship. There is no risk that the edges are less aerodynamic than the front side, etc. Of course, size does matter but the 3ZPMs are more than enough. IF people doubt this, they should recall Janus. He illustrates the complexity of the whole ZPM trident. One can make some calculations to divide the 3 ZPM parallel power output. There are so many combinations, depending on the situation. If you are in a real hurry, you set 2 ZPMS for the stardrive and 1 for Shield +other vital systems. People here would argue that one is not enough; it is but not for a very long period of time, that is why with 2 100% ZPMs powering the star drive you would travel to Earth faster than Thor with his Neutrino hyper drive. Why? Because the energy output compensates the weight....

Analogy: A Maybach 62 is faster than most "smaller" cars because its weight is compensated by the hundreds of horse power added by the engine manufacturer.


P.S. Someone here mentioned that the Ancients should have taken the city back to Earth. When Weir travels in time to the Lantian period she is in the middle of a war. I think the Ancients were smart enough not to risk taking off in the middle of a Wraith armada. They were under attack for a long time, by the time they would have taken off, reach orbit (all this under wraith dart attack) there prepare to jump into hyper space (here a dozen hiveships attacking it). This could have been suicide. Best case scenario, they jump in hyper space and don't make it to Earth because the ZPMs end up depleted. Best course of action, sink the city and let the water take the strain off the shield. I still support the ancients. In order to discover the secrets of the universe you need to make mistakes.

garhkal
February 17th, 2007, 04:06 PM
That would be sweet if they did provide the audience with a map so that we could actually put distances between galaxies and planets into cannon. Come on TPTB, its been 10 years and we don't even have that yet, pick up the pace.


I would LOVE to see a map, of the galaxy, poissibly including important planets on it. Like Abydos, Dakara, Chulak, etc..
As to the Asguard and Ida, perhaps earth is on a 'spiral' of our galaxy that is closer to Ida that it is to Pegasus..


Had the lantians needed more ZPMs in order to use the city at it's full capacity, they would have added the extra slots for additional ZPMs. As you can clearly see, 3 do more than enough.

That gives me an idea for other 'areas' of atlantis the team have yet to explore. Say a secondary power station with another ZPM slot or two..

.jolinar.
February 19th, 2007, 01:57 AM
Remember that the Asgard are so quick because their ships generate way more power then Earth ships. The Deadalus did the trip from Earth to Atlantis super quick when it had the ZPM powering it.
So that means i think:
More power = Fast hyperdrives

This is correct. Tau'ri ships do not produce sufficient power to maximise the output efficiency of the Hyperdrive engine to 100%. Asgard ships have the nessesary power. When powered by the ZPM the Deadalus maximised the output of its Hyperdrive to 100% therefore traveling at the speed of an Asgard ship. Which is fast. So the amount of power provided is directly proportional to the efficiency of the Hyperdrive engine. More power faster ship.

galileon
February 28th, 2007, 10:37 AM
Or explain why it might take longer.

Like, they couldn't go at full speed because of. . . I dunno. . . someone was cooking a turkey for some fresh sandwiches while they were in hyperspace, and it was draining power from the engines.

i love it!

sparkygate
February 28th, 2007, 08:52 PM
This is correct. Tau'ri ships do not produce sufficient power to maximise the output efficiency of the Hyperdrive engine to 100%. Asgard ships have the nessesary power. When powered by the ZPM the Deadalus maximised the output of its Hyperdrive to 100% therefore traveling at the speed of an Asgard ship. Which is fast. So the amount of power provided is directly proportional to the efficiency of the Hyperdrive engine. More power faster ship.

So true, but then how long would it take for atlantis to travel back to earth?? or vice versa??

X04Shivaji
March 1st, 2007, 12:12 AM
Asura is from Hindu Mythology and means demon/or evil beings, just thought ud like to know there something where overlooking there is a mystry race in the galalxy and have the ability to make the x303's look second hand at end of the day it all comes down to research and devlopement and the lack of it other than the holograms tech, area 51 aint done jack, and why is SGC allways critizied they're the one's keeping Area 51 open...anyways....i think they should concentrate on improving firepower and speed they should find a way of delievering Mark 2 War heads in missle form

.jolinar.
March 1st, 2007, 12:34 AM
So true, but then how long would it take for atlantis to travel back to earth?? or vice versa??

Well considering it's more advanced hyperdrive engine, it's power supply and size.I would say it would take Atlantis around two days to reach Earth.
Try calculatingit better from 'first strike'

sparkygate
March 2nd, 2007, 01:41 AM
Well considering it's more advanced hyperdrive engine, it's power supply and size.I would say it would take Atlantis around two days to reach Earth.
Try calculatingit better from 'first strike'

Two days??? i thought it would be shorter tha that.... because having three ZPM powering the hyperdrive (shield wouldnt take up that much power and life support system too)

Halzman
March 5th, 2007, 03:34 PM
All we know from 'Frist Strike' is that Atlantis should of been in hyperspace for a few more hours. And that was to the nearest nonpopu;ated planet, with a large ocean. Although, we have no definate location as to were atlantis is in relation to the planet they were travelling to, but given the amount of power they had (alittle over a day with sheilds - taking a continuous hit from the beam) and McKays confidence that they would make it, its pretty safe to assume that an average solar system distance is acceptable - also keep in mind that they were looking for a nearby planet with a large ocean, indicating that there may very well have been a planet closer)

We know that it took the the daedulous in 'No Man's Land' <= 16 hours to reach the outer edges of the pegasus galalxy to catch up with the hives. Although, it should be mentioned that the hive ships took off from a location near Lantias solar system (indicated by the hive queen stating that theres a hive nearby in this system (i'd say within distance of 2-3 solar systems from Lantia's)) - so lets assume that it takes the hives around 20 hours to reach the outer-edge of the pegasus galaxy (they had to rest in order to recover from the effects of hyperspace radiation - and the daedulous needed time to make emergency repairs before leaving to engage the wraith ships with the orion).

It should also be noted that the information the wraith used to modify the hyperdrives were taken from the aurora mission files - so it is safe to assume that the wraith were using the Lantian Inter-galactic hyperdrive, as apposed to the aurora-class's interstellar hyperdrive.

And we know that it takes the daedulous 3 weeks to reach atlantis from earth. So figure 1 day to travel to the outer edge of the galaxy (from either location) and then 10-12 days travel between the void (that seems pretty realisitic). I beleive the asgard (when transporting Woolsey to atlantis) did the trip in 2 weeks ( I beleive Weir stated that the asgard were able to shave a week of the travel time).

And then we see the daedulous do the trip in 4 days with a ZPM tied into the system - a 3.5 million light year distance (as stated in the show).

So yes, power is the one thing that would enable any one of those ships to have faster hyperdrives/sublight, stronger sheilds, etc.

You also have to concider how many more systems Atlantis has compared to a asgard ship. Sure the asgard ship can do the trip in 2 weeks, but it probably has alot less systems, rooms, computers, etc to power, as apposed to atlantis, which is a 'flying' city. Even in 'First Strike', McKay and Zelenka had to shut off all non critical/secondary systems just to leave enough power to actually fly the city - with the drilling platform tied into the systems ( I beleive it was 70% of total power consumption is going to be used up during the first 10 seconds of flight ( you gotta make those ions build up enough force to move something as massive as atlantis - even if its in a zero g environment - and that can only be done by a) pumping more gas (fuel) which is unlikely since atlantis, dispite its size can only hold so much fuel -or- b) provide more power to the ionizers (which actually create the thrust using positive/negative charged grids - or w/e ionization method they use - it still comes down to what kinda electrical power you have).

The daedulous on the other hand has a small number of primary systems that need to be powered compared to atlantis and an asgard ship. Its primary systems are weapons, sheilds, hyperdrive, and sublight - but the naquadah generators can only pump so much power out - and those 'small' systems turn into huge power hogs, given the nature of them

So in a nutshell

Atlantis - atronomical amounts of power - lots of systems to be powered (primary, secondary, labs, housing, etc) - 3 week travel to earh from Atlantis (3 ZPM)

Asgards hip - lots of power - decent amount of systems (primary, secondary, some labs) - 2 week travel to earth from Atlantis (Unknown number of neutrino ion generators

Daedalous - not so much power - decent amount of systems (primary, secondary, hangars, some labs) - 3 week travel to earth from Atlantis/ 4 day travel with ZPM.

sparkygate
March 6th, 2007, 06:23 PM
makes you wonder what the Aurora class ship are powered by, the power requirement must be huge considering the size and fire power it carries

Gala
October 18th, 2007, 04:14 PM
Talking about laws of physics, did no-one consider how shields can now magically work while in hyperspace lol.

Otherwise it would be impossible :D

Halzman
October 18th, 2007, 06:13 PM
Talking about laws of physics, did no-one consider how shields can now magically work while in hyperspace lol.

Otherwise it would be impossible :D

well, that all depends on how you think a hyperdrive functions.

However, without getting into a never ending technical debate about something that doesn't actually exsist: As I have said, I beleive that Atlantis has two types of shields, an atmospheric and a defense. Obviously the power requirements for each of these types of shields would vary, significantly! One needs only be denser then air, while the other needs to withstand anything it was designed to go up against. Now, while Thor has stated that shields and weapons cannot be used in hyperspace, he never explains why, so you have to ask yourself that question. When it comes down to it, its power, in my opinion (weapons for the obvious reasons, you'd be traveling faster then the actual plasma shot could ever). A shield, like Atlantis's defense shield, requires alot of power just to active it. The more strain that is put on it, the more power is drained to recharge the shield. Now, what happens when your in hyperspace that allows you to maintain zero time dilation? You have a field that is pulling you and pushing you at the same time. Oops, looks like I do have to get into the technical stuff lol. Ok, if you've done any reading on ufo's or have looked at the air force these days there utilizing plasma to significantly reduce air drag. The Air Forces prototype shoots plasma out in front of the craft, which is then pulled around it, and then recirculated out the front. The amount of air drag that you reduce is relative to how much plasma you use. Now, with shields, plasma is also used. A magnetic field is created, and since plasma is attracted to magentic fields, they start to cling onto the field. The more plasma you use, the denser the field gets, the more it can withstand. I beleive in order to create an atmospheric shield (for electron beams) you need 2 kW of power, and its a small diameter, flat, not spheric - look up plasma valve if your interested.

Fortunatly, i'm working on a stargate ship-based mod for Half-Life and while I was working on the design document, i had to determine certain values for the ships power, shield strength, weapons, etc - I tried to keep the numbers 'realistic'. So for this topic, i'm going to set some standards, atleast for my claims.

ZPM = 5.25 TW (Terawatts)
Atlantis shield requirements = 3.9 GW (Gigawatts)

* For a real life reference, current nuclear power plants can produce as much as 250 GW of power

These estimates are based on the show information that 10 hive ships, firing 2 shots per second each, at the zpm at max output (there is significant evidence to suggest that a ZPM's power output can be controlled and limited, and in certain circumstances, will actually increase it power output, as seen in 'Adrift'). THe only flaw in these calculations is that we dont know exactly how long it takes to fully recharge Atlantis's shields. Assuming these power estimates are Watts per hour, and that the shield takes 90 minutes to recharge, they will work for the time being. Also, because we know that a ZPM can be depleted, my estimate, based on all my figures, leaves a ZPM with 78.7 TW worth of power.

Obviously the hyperdrive will require a given amount of energy to create the window, maintain the window for the time of travel, and then shut off the window safely (it has also been suggested that a hyperdrive, if not calibrated properly will destroy the ship going into hyperspace, and presumably when exiting - 'Lifeline'). If a defense shield is turned on you'd need to power for the magnetic field, and then enough power to create the plasma density needed for the shield. However, as stated, an atmospheric shield would require far less since it need only maintain an atmosphere. Will it still drain power? of coarse, but not as much as a defense shield. Atlantis is the only know ship that has an open hull design. Yes, it has been shown that an Asgard ship's shield can be modified to prevent atmospheric decompression (the episode were teal'c had to plant an explosive charge on the side of a belinsker).

So theres my reasoning as to why I feel Atlantis can have a shield on during hyperspace travel.

beale947
October 19th, 2007, 02:41 AM
Well we now know that Asura is within 2000 (+/-500) light years of Lantiea, like rodney says at the end of Adrift.


And I think the reason the shields don't work in hyperspace is because of the power requirements and the fact, that the ships are built more aerodynamically than Atlantis, which needs the shield to keep in one piece, due to the sudden acceration

Halzman
October 19th, 2007, 04:16 PM
Well we now know that Asura is within 2000 (+/-500) light years of Lantiea, like rodney says at the end of Adrift.


And I think the reason the shields don't work in hyperspace is because of the power requirements and the fact, that the ships are built more aerodynamically than Atlantis, which needs the shield to keep in one piece, due to the sudden acceration

Actually, that distance is not really from lantea... Atlantis was within 2000 light years of Asuras after it prematurely dropped out of hyperspace and after it had been drifting through space at the speed that it dropped out of hyperspace, the length of 'Adrift' - remember, it wasn't until 'Lifeline' that they made the jump. And also to mention, that distance of 2000 light years was the range the hyperdrive would be able to reach. It took the Apollo 50 hyerspace jumps to go from the nearest habitable planet with a large ocean to the original planet, Lantea (Lifeline) - we have no idea a) what the 304's hyperdrive speed is and b) the distance from Lantea to the planet with the large ocean.

And what does aerodynamics have to do with ships that obviously use anti-gravity technology, and for the most part, operate in space, where air drag is not even a concern.

2ndgenerationalteran
October 20th, 2007, 01:28 AM
Well one thing we did learn is that a partially powered Atlantis is faster than the Apollo, and presumably all 304s without a ZPM powering it.

JSPuddlejumper
October 20th, 2007, 04:24 AM
Atlantis is slower because of sheer size and the power requirement IMO. Nothing to do with the lack of tech.

As for who's ship is faster, all relative and ever changing.

Halzman
October 20th, 2007, 09:56 AM
Atlantis is slower because of sheer size and the power requirement IMO. Nothing to do with the lack of tech.

As for who's ship is faster, all relative and ever changing.

Actually, Carter while on the Midway Station in 'Adrift' stated that Atlantis should of beat the Apollo to the new destination planet.

The size of the ship has nothing to do with speed, considering the ships use anti gravity technology and that when in space, there in a zero gravity environment. The only thing that determines a ships speed is its sublight capabalities / type of hyperdrive and ultimately, how much power the ship has to play with.

Look up Ion engine if you want to learn about space propulsion systems.

JSPuddlejumper
October 20th, 2007, 12:46 PM
Larger the ship, the greater the power requirement. Thus, with 1 ZPM, or even 3 ZPM it may be insufficient to out pace a warship with 1 ZPM.

Apollo has no ZPM, with one I would bet it can probably beat any ship aside from an Asgard one or a MW Replicator one (who are the fastest by the way, 3 million+ light years in around 1 hour, I believe it was seaon 5 of SG).

Jarnin
October 20th, 2007, 04:28 PM
Atlantis was within 2000 light years of Asuras after it prematurely dropped out of hyperspace...
Pegasus is supposedly one of two real dwarf galaxies in the Local Group of Galaxies. Neither of the two are supposed to be any bigger than 3,000 to 3,500 light years in diameter. They're tiny galaxies compared to the Milky Way.

Without a ZPM, a Daedalus class ship can travel about 2 light years a second. That means that the Apollo should be able to cross Pegasus in about 25 minutes. With a ZPM it should make it in a little under 6 minutes.

In First Strike, Atlantis was traveling less than the diameter of the Pegasus galaxy (~3,000 LY), and it was going to take hours. Either the speeds of things aren't consistent, or Atlantis is a slow turkey.
If Atlantis is slow, it would be consistent with Aurora being a slow ship.

It's possible that very-fast hyperspace travel might have been a late discovery for the Lanteans. I mean, if they didn't discover it until the war with the Wraith, then it would jive with why Aurora wasn't a fast ship, but was being upgraded to be faster.

Ltcolshepjumper
October 20th, 2007, 04:48 PM
It's probably an inconsistency. The Atlantis stardrive is suppose to be very powerful. And if the Aurora can travel that close to the speed of light, it's hyperdrives have to be powerful. The reason we haven't seen that is because all of the ones we've seen have been damaged. Well, the Aurora might have been one of the first ships, so...

2ndgenerationalteran
October 20th, 2007, 05:17 PM
In Hyperspace doesnt the hyperspace engine just open the window and bring the two destinations closer, and the sublight engines provides the propulsion through subspace? If that is the case then, the aurora class would be capable of extremely fast hyperspace travel, the two types of hyperdrives may just be the ability of the hyperdrive to pull two places of 2D space closer together, so shortening the distance rather than making the ship faster.

In the case of the Asgard, their ships may have had the ability to travel at .99999c and combined with their IGHDs it could easily explain how they travel so quickly. And why the 304s go slower than asgard vessels even though they probably have the same HDs (if memory serves, our ships can reach .60c).

Halzman
October 21st, 2007, 02:44 AM
Pegasus is supposedly one of two real dwarf galaxies in the Local Group of Galaxies. Neither of the two are supposed to be any bigger than 3,000 to 3,500 light years in diameter. They're tiny galaxies compared to the Milky Way.

Without a ZPM, a Daedalus class ship can travel about 2 light years a second. That means that the Apollo should be able to cross Pegasus in about 25 minutes. With a ZPM it should make it in a little under 6 minutes.

In First Strike, Atlantis was traveling less than the diameter of the Pegasus galaxy (~3,000 LY), and it was going to take hours. Either the speeds of things aren't consistent, or Atlantis is a slow turkey.
If Atlantis is slow, it would be consistent with Aurora being a slow ship.

It's possible that very-fast hyperspace travel might have been a late discovery for the Lanteans. I mean, if they didn't discover it until the war with the Wraith, then it would jive with why Aurora wasn't a fast ship, but was being upgraded to be faster.

And yet it took the Daedalus and the Aurora 13 hours to go from Atlantis to the edge of the Pegasus Galaxy during 'No Man's Land'. If Atlantis, according to Carter in 'Adrift' should of reached their destination before the Apollo, clearly their hyperdrive is faster.

Here are some facts:

- A light year = 9,460,730,472,580.8 km
- Speed of light = 1,079,252,848.8 km/hour
- Our solar system is 26,000 (plus or minus 1400) light years from the center of our galaxy
- Milky Way is 100,000 light years in diameter, 1000 light years thick, and contains 200-400 billion stars.
- A dwarf galaxy contains 10-20 billion stars (conservativly) and is roughly 7,500 light years in diameter

In 'The Return - Part 1' The Aurora wasn't traveling at .99 the speed of light with its hyperdrives - That was with its sublight engines. Hyperdrives are for 'Faster Then Light' travel, sub light is anything below the speed of light. So how did the Aurora do it - and how would any ship with an Ion drive/sublight engine do it? Power - and in the Aurora's case it was a ZPM that gave them the neccessary power. Heres how ion drives work, since no one took the time to read up about them. You have a vacuum chamber which has a gas (such as xenon) pumped in, while also pumping in electrons (via CRT or RF), and then this chamber is surrounded by a permanent magent which contains both the gas and the ions within the chamber. Then you have 2 grids (more recently 3, to increase grid life) - The grid closest to the chamber is positive and then grid at the end of the engine is negative. The gas and electrons become plasma/ions, and the difference ingrid voltages is what pulls those ion/plasma through and out the back, creating thrust (NASA's Ion engines use 2kw of power to acheive their thrust). THEREFORE, the more power you can supply to those grids, the greater thrust you generate. The Aurora's hyperdrive FAILED, as explained by Captain Helia in 'The Return - Part 2' and it was her decision to head back to earth with the sublights, seriously boosted by a ZPM.

That is exactly why in 'First Strike', Atantis's stardrive required so much power up front (30%). It needed to generate and maintain the thrust to take it out of the atmosphere. Even with anti-gravity, you still have to do something to move it and an ion engine is the best thing to use in a zero gravity environment. Once your in space and your traveling at the speed you want, you dont have to supply to drive with so much power. Now, I'm guessing people get confused with the term Stardrive, since it refers to Atlantis's sublight engines and hyperdrive.

It would seem that the hyperdrive is more of a design issue then power issue. Its been shown ( 'Critical Mass' ) that the daedalus's hyperdrive can be made faster with the risk of burning out the drive. This implies that the 304's hyperdrive was only built to handle certain speeds. If anything, the 304 using a ZPM for hyperspace travel is the inconsistency! In every other instance, we have seen that the hyperdrive can be made to go faster with the risk of it burning out ('New Order - Part 1').

And it is safe to assume that Atlantis had Intergalactic Hyperdrives several million years ago, when they left earth and moved to Pegasus. By the time the Ancient began their war with the wraith, which was 10,000+ years ago, they already had aurora-class and atlantis class ships ('The Tower', 'Progency', 'Before I Sleep')

Zeltanar
October 22nd, 2007, 09:46 PM
That is something that ABSOLUTELY pisses me off all the time. How the writers change the laws of physics of the show just to suite story line needs. I am TIRED of that. Why cant they be consistent with the technology of stargate. Hyperspace travel is just one of many.

And as for a map we already have it. Milky way and peguses are about 3.5 million light years apart. And peguses is a dwarf galaxy which means that it is ALOT smaller than the milkyway. Ida is most likely one of the small galaxies that are in orbit around our own.

The Stargate sg-1 episode titled "Unnatural Selection" (season 6) confirms the relative speed of the Asgard vessel. The Prometheus enters hyperspace, and comes out in the middle of nowhere, due to the instability of the naquahdria, and then Thor arrives and informs them that he has been tracking their movement since they left orbit. He then returns to earth with the earth vessel in tow, in about five seconds.

Earlier in the episode (or it may have been at the end of the episode right before this one) Sam states that they are about 1,200 light-years from Earth. So if the Asgard can travel 1,200 light years in five seconds, it would take approximately 4.05 hours for them to reach the Pegasus galaxy. And they may have been slowed down, do to the earth vessel being dragged along, so they may be able to accelerate even faster than this.

This obviously does not fit in with the episodes we've been presented though, unfortunately the writer's did indeed change the facts in order for it to be more convenient for them to write the stories.

An-Alteran
October 23rd, 2007, 02:23 PM
Well. . .

We don't know how far away Asura is from Atlantis.

But speeds in Stargate have been frelled with so much that it's hard to say. An Asgard ship can travel from their home galaxy to Earth in minutes, but take a week to reach Pegasus.

It's a real mindfrell.
Dude?!

When have the Asgard travelled from their home galaxy to Earth in minutes?
Could you please show what episode this is from?

An-Alteran
October 23rd, 2007, 02:25 PM
The Stargate sg-1 episode titled "Unnatural Selection" (season 6) confirms the relative speed of the Asgard vessel. The Prometheus enters hyperspace, and comes out in the middle of nowhere, due to the instability of the naquahdria, and then Thor arrives and informs them that he has been tracking their movement since they left orbit. He then returns to earth with the earth vessel in tow, in about five seconds.
Are you taking into account TV-time vs. real story-time?


Earlier in the episode (or it may have been at the end of the episode right before this one) Sam states that they are about 1,200 light-years from Earth.
So if the Asgard can travel 1,200 light years in five seconds, it would take approximately 4.05 hours for them to reach the Pegasus galaxy. And they may have been slowed down, do to the earth vessel being dragged along, so they may be able to accelerate even faster than this.

This assumes that the time presented on screen corresponded to the time in the story.

Zeltanar
October 24th, 2007, 04:28 PM
When Thor transported them back to earth, you saw space distort slightly through the window in the Bridge, and within seconds they arrived back at earth. The characters were stunned at the speed. Honestly, the signs point towards it being nearly instantaneous. :)

Jarnin
October 24th, 2007, 09:25 PM
it is safe to assume that Atlantis had Intergalactic Hyperdrives several million years ago, when they left earth and moved to Pegasus. By the time the Ancient began their war with the wraith, which was 10,000+ years ago, they already had aurora-class and atlantis class ships ('The Tower', 'Progency', 'Before I Sleep')
Newflash! Any hyperdrive is capable of traveling between galaxies. Even ships without hyperdrives are capable of intergalactic travel. The only difference is the duration of the trip.

So, while Atlantis definitely had hyperdrive prior to their trip to Pegasus, it doesn't mean it is 'fast' compared to other ships, like the Asgard.


When Thor transported them back to earth, you saw space distort slightly through the window in the Bridge, and within seconds they arrived back at earth. The characters were stunned at the speed. Honestly, the signs point towards it being nearly instantaneous. :)
First, it was 8 seconds. In physics that's a lifetime.
Second, it was about 1,200 light years, which is, relatively speaking, right around the block.
If you do the math, with Prometheus in tow, an O'Neill class ship travels at ~150 lightyears a second, or about 8 times as fast as Daedalus (without a ZPM).

Hypothesis: Atlantis' FTL system is called a 'Star Drive'. Atlantis is millions of years old. Therefore, when Atlantis was originally built, it wasn't designed to travel quickly between galaxies, but was upgraded at a later time to do so. Once the Lanteans discovered the secrets of 'fast FTL', they deemed it "Hyper drive". Later they shared that knowledge with the Asgard, who improved the technology to what we see in current Asgard ships.

from_orion
November 15th, 2007, 10:30 PM
we also dont know the distances travelled, may be to get from earth to pegasus we need to go all the way accross the mw and further i n the void then travel a fair distance in pegasus to get to atlantis, but to get to ida its like crossing the street, short trip to the void, shorter trip in the void than to pegasus. we havent been given an intergalactic map of the SG universe afterall.
Exactly like in Prometheus Unbound it shows that the route to atlantis goes through many hyperspace hours of milky way territory.

Athosian Death facilitator
November 16th, 2007, 12:20 AM
We don't know it took a week to get to Pegasus with that, all we have is some vague comment from Wier about cutting down a couple of weeks of travel time, which is roughly two weeks via Deadalus. It may have been anything from 4 days to 4 minutes travel. It would have been helpful for all the 'Asgard hyperdrives aren't that great' crowd if she said "With their help, we'll be there in a week.", but she didn't.

Rodney said something like "We are stranded in the middle of another galaxy with limited resources Radek, the nearest Bob's Big Boy is 3million/thousand/hundred(i am unsure as to which.)

So if it takes 3 weeks to get to Earth via the Daedalus/Apollo/Odyssey can you guys extrapolate how fast the Asgard hyperdrives are? and from there we can most definitely say 'Atlantis is faster.'


The Wraith couldn't track the Ancients while in hyperspace and even if they could hyperspace radiation would cause them to stop and recover while Atlantis goes out of sensor range. derrr.

Athosian Death facilitator
November 16th, 2007, 12:24 AM
Exactly like in Prometheus Unbound it shows that the route to atlantis goes through many hyperspace hours of milky way territory.

That's just because the Prometheus is space junk with a hyper drive and and the Daedalus class has the hyper drive integrated into the ship rather than tacked on afterward.

Atlantis is even faster.


Have you people been listening?.lol.

sg8man
November 16th, 2007, 04:10 AM
Seeing that the Asuran city-ship departed Asuras and Weir & company had time to come up with a plan and implement it before it reached Atlantis makes me wonder just how fast the city-ship hyperspace drives are. It must have taken hours to pull that reprogramming off for Rodney. For some reason I think the reason the ancients didn't just take Atlantis back to earth is that their hyperdrive engines aren't fast enough to distance themselves from the wraith and thus would have led the wraith directly to Earth and the rest of the MW galaxy. Just a thought. That cant be the case because we know that the Wraith are not capable of anything aproaching inter-galactic speeds, so Atlantis should have easily outrun the wraith . . . which leads me to ask,
Why didnt the Ancients return to earth with Atlantis instead of just leaving it there on the bottom of the ocean?

Jarnin
November 16th, 2007, 02:27 PM
Rodney said something like "We are stranded in the middle of another galaxy with limited resources Radek, the nearest Bob's Big Boy is 3million/thousand/hundred(i am unsure as to which.)
Pegasus is ~3 million light years away


So if it takes 3 weeks to get to Earth via the Daedalus/Apollo/Odyssey can you guys extrapolate how fast the Asgard hyperdrives are?
Daedalus from Earth to Pegasus = ~18 days
18 days = 1,555,200 seconds
3,000,000 LY in 1,555,200 seconds = ~1.93 LY/s

Asgard ship (Jackson Class?) from Earth to Pegasus = ~4 days
4 days = 345,600 seconds
3,000,000 LY in 345,600 seconds = ~8.68 LY/s

O'Neill class with Prometheus in tow:
Prometheus' distance from Earth = ~1,200 LY
Travel time = 8 seconds
1,200 LY in 8 seconds = 150 LY/s

Earth to Hala distance = ~4,000,000 LY
Speed = 150 LY/s
Travel Time = ~7.4 hours


and from there we can most definitely say 'Atlantis is faster.'
No we can't. In fact, if you go off the increments talked about in the series, Atlantis is much slower than Asgard and Taur'i ships.

Pegasus is a dwarf galaxy that is about 3,000 light years in diameter (in real life). That means it should only take Daedalus about 26 minutes to cross Pegasus.

The Asgard ship that shaved 2 weeks off their travel time to Pegasus should cross it in about 6 minutes.
An O'Neill class ship towing Prometheus would cross Pegasus in 20 seconds...
Yet Atlantis, which was going to take hours to travel less than 3,000 light years, is faster than those ships?

Something is messed up. I'm guessing the writers decided that Pegasus isn't the same size as it's real life counterpart.


That cant be the case because we know that the Wraith are not capable of anything aproaching inter-galactic speeds, so Atlantis should have easily outrun the wraith . . .
There is no such thing as "intergalactic speeds". The Wraith possess the technology to go to Earth right now, it'll just take them hundreds of years to get there.


Why didnt the Ancients return to earth with Atlantis instead of just leaving it there on the bottom of the ocean?
Plot Device. Brad Wright and Robert C. Cooper were originally going to have SG-1 discover Atlantis buried under Antarctica instead of the outpost. SG-1 was being renewed and they wanted the new series to be independent of SG-1, so they put Atlantis in another galaxy.

kymeric
November 16th, 2007, 05:18 PM
Pegasus orbits Andromeda.

..............makes me wonder wuts in andromeda, stands to reason if MW and IDA are inhabited, and PG is then AND would be too

NATIK
November 17th, 2007, 03:04 PM
At this point the only reasonable thing to assume is that Ida and Pegasus are completly made up and have no relation to real world galaxies. If we don't nothing fits and we may aswell stop discussing speeds like this.

JSPuddlejumper
November 18th, 2007, 04:54 AM
"O'Neill class with Prometheus in tow:
Prometheus' distance from Earth = ~1,200 LY
Travel time = 8 seconds
1,200 LY in 8 seconds = 150 LY/s"


Wow. I knew the Asgard had fast ships, but damn. So they do have the fastest ships. So it may make sense for Jack O'Neill to ask for Thor and he appears shortly afterwards...

And this is with the Promethus in tow.


Yeah, I also have a hard time believing that Atlantis would be that fast. It's dimensions, power requirment (constantly the shield must be on), would be a large deterrant to raw speed IMO. Now if was an Aurora class warship, ok.

Buba uognarf
November 18th, 2007, 05:23 AM
Actually Asgard hyperdrive speeds are inconsistant. They aren't that fast anymore this is obvious seeing as an Asgard vessel took 4 days to get to Pegasus.

It was clearly mentioned that Atlantis should have beat the Apollo to the new planet therefore Atlantis with one ZPM is faster than a 304, there's no denying that. It doesn't mean it's faster than a fully powered Asgard hyperdrive e.g. 4 days Earth to Pegasus but I wouldn't put it past it with 3 ZPMs powering it.

JSPuddlejumper
November 18th, 2007, 11:59 AM
Yeah, 4 days, but what class of ship was it.

Assuming it is their fastest ship, then the writers have downgraded to cover up a plot hole? Because Asgard ships insanely fast.

Jarnin
November 18th, 2007, 04:49 PM
They aren't that fast anymore this is obvious seeing as an Asgard vessel took 4 days to get to Pegasus.
It obviously wasn't an O'Neill class ship.


It was clearly mentioned that Atlantis should have beat the Apollo to the new planet therefore Atlantis with one ZPM is faster than a 304, there's no denying that.
Ah, your logic is flawed. It was clearly mentioned that Atlantis should have been Apollo to their destination, this much is true. However, it isn't said why this is the case. You're assuming it's because Atlantis is faster than Apollo, and that might be the case, but there are reasons why Apollo might be faster than Atlantis and still not arrive first.
When Colonel Ellis checked in with Midway, he said "As far as we can tell, Atlantis successfully evaded the Replicators beam and was able to enter hyperspace".
When asked "As far as you can tell?" Ellis replied "They're not at the predetermined rendezvous point."

This would imply that the Apollo stayed behind to confirm that the Asuran satellite weapon wasn't going to follow them, and they watched Atlantis enter hyperspace. When they showed up at their new planet and Atlantis wasn't there, they flew to the nearest planet with a gate to report to Midway.


It doesn't mean it's faster than a fully powered Asgard hyperdrive e.g. 4 days Earth to Pegasus but I wouldn't put it past it with 3 ZPMs powering it.
All the evidence we have of Atlantis' FTL speed says it's slow. Not just slow, like Daedalus without a ZPM slow, I'm talking slow as in taking hundreds of years to travel from Earth to Pegasus. The Aurora was slower, if it was going to take them months to travel back to Atlantis in a galaxy only 3 thousand light years in diameter; though to their credit, they mentioned that the Aurora was never built for speed.

I'm not saying this evidence is correct, I'm just saying that the evidence says Atlantis is slow. Maybe some day we'll get some real numbers from the show to actually see how fast it is, because right now all we have is relative approximations, and that is no way to try and figure this out.

from_orion
November 21st, 2007, 04:03 PM
That's just because the Prometheus is space junk with a hyper drive and and the Daedalus class has the hyper drive integrated into the ship rather than tacked on afterward.

Atlantis is even faster.


Have you people been listening?.lol.
Have you been listening? Prometheus in Ripple Effect was going to take about "3 weeks" to get to Atlantis. That's essentially the same speed as Deadelus' 18 days.

from_orion
November 21st, 2007, 04:09 PM
That cant be the case because we know that the Wraith are not capable of anything aproaching inter-galactic speeds, so Atlantis should have easily outrun the wraith . . . which leads me to ask,
Why didnt the Ancients return to earth with Atlantis instead of just leaving it there on the bottom of the ocean?
We don't know, the wraith ships may in fact be faster than atlantis, only difference being atlantis can continue in hyperspace as long as they have power, yet the wraith ships have to take 12 hour breaks I think between jumps.

Jarnin
November 21st, 2007, 05:33 PM
We don't know, the wraith ships may in fact be faster than atlantis, only difference being atlantis can continue in hyperspace as long as they have power, yet the wraith ships have to take 12 hour breaks I think between jumps.
The time between jumps is relative to the amount of radiation the hull is receiving. The faster the ship travels, the more radiation the hull absorbs, so the longer it'll take to regenerate.

Right now we don't know how long they need to regenerate during normal hyperspace travel, but it seems to be about a 1:1 ratio. For every minute in hyperspace, they need one minute of regeneration time. So even if a hive ship were able to travel the same speed as the Daedalus, it'd still take them twice as long to reach the same destination (but hives are much slower than Daedalus).

chyron
November 21st, 2007, 07:08 PM
Seeing that the Asuran city-ship departed Asuras and Weir & company had time to come up with a plan and implement it before it reached Atlantis makes me wonder just how fast the city-ship hyperspace drives are. It must have taken hours to pull that reprogramming off for Rodney. For some reason I think the reason the ancients didn't just take Atlantis back to earth is that their hyperdrive engines aren't fast enough to distance themselves from the wraith and thus would have led the wraith directly to Earth and the rest of the MW galaxy. Just a thought.

As the Asuran city-ship demonstrated on the first go around it took a little bit for the city to enter hyperspace, its entirely probable that the same applies to Atlantis. Although its been estanblished that the Atlantis hyperdrive can sustain the ship in hyperspace for much longer periods of time (the ep w/the Auroa sp?) than the Wraith, the Wraith would most likely had multiple hive ships ready to fire. Imagine some one on a motorcycle running through a swarm of bees, yes the bike will be able to out distance the bees but its highly probably the person will still end up with at least a sting or two.

sg8man
November 21st, 2007, 09:00 PM
There is no such thing as "intergalactic speeds". The Wraith possess the technology to go to Earth right now, it'll just take them hundreds of years to get there.

Ahhh . . . That's exactly what I meant.
"it'll take them hundreds of years" = they are not capable of "intergalactic speeds."

from_orion
November 21st, 2007, 09:19 PM
Sure the wraith can get to to earth, albeit slowly, only problem being they have no idea what direction to fly, since the only ones who found out were destroyed and they were not sharing information at that time.

Jarnin
November 21st, 2007, 10:40 PM
Ahhh . . . That's exactly what I meant.
"it'll take them hundreds of years" = they are not capable of "intergalactic speeds."
It doesn't really matter for the Wraith. They could sleep the whole way.


Sure the wraith can get to to earth, albeit slowly, only problem being they have no idea what direction to fly, since the only ones who found out were destroyed and they were not sharing information at that time.
Michael is still around.

Athosian Death facilitator
November 21st, 2007, 10:50 PM
No we can't. In fact, if you go off the increments talked about in the series, Atlantis is much slower than Asgard and Taur'i ships.



No, Atlantis should have beat the Apollo to the new homeworld.
Therefore the hyperdrive is faster.
It takes the Daedalus about 4days to get from MW to Pegasus.
So it's not really a question of speed but more a question of power.

Asgard ships aren't the same.
Asgard have been around an extra 10 thousand years and in that time have obviously upgraded their hyper drive technology so pfft.



Something is messed up. I'm guessing the writers decided that Pegasus isn't the same size as it's real life counterpart.




There is no such thing as "intergalactic speeds". The Wraith possess the technology to go to Earth right now, it'll just take them hundreds of years to get there.

No, they would totally ruin the ships(maybe) due to hyperspace radiation.
However it would as you pointed out take them hundred of years to get there . Yet i refuse to believe they would die, they could put it on autopilot or something, and hybernate until they reach MW.



Plot Device. Brad Wright and Robert C. Cooper were originally going to have SG-1 discover Atlantis buried under Antarctica instead of the outpost. SG-1 was being renewed and they wanted the new series to be independent of SG-1, so they put Atlantis in another galaxy.

Wasn't it supposedly meant to be a movie as well?

So glad it wasn't because STARGATE: ATLANTIS is so much better than any STARGATE MOVIE.(i am very bias)

Jarnin
November 22nd, 2007, 03:13 AM
No, Atlantis should have beat the Apollo to the new homeworld.
Therefore the hyperdrive is faster.
The evidence supports Atlantis being slow.


It takes the Daedalus about 4days to get from MW to Pegasus.
When equipped with a ZPM it takes 4days. When it's not equipped (most of the time) it takes ~18 days.


So it's not really a question of speed but more a question of power.
Power = Speed.


Asgard ships aren't the same.
Not sure what you mean.


Asgard have been around an extra 10 thousand years and in that time have obviously upgraded their hyper drive technology so pfft.
The Asgard gained access to a lot of Lantean technology and have since improved on it. I never said otherwise.


No, they would totally ruin the ships(maybe) due to hyperspace radiation.
Not if they stopped every few hours and allowed their hulls to regenerate.


However it would as you pointed out take them hundred of years to get there . Yet i refuse to believe they would die, they could put it on autopilot or something, and hybernate until they reach MW.
Exactly.


Wasn't it supposedly meant to be a movie as well?
If SG-1 was canceled after season 7, they were going to make a dvd movie to introduce StarGate: Atlantis. If the movie did well, it was going to be turned into a series.

Then SG-1 got renewed and SciFi wanted more StarGate so they created Atlantis. Rising was basically what the movie would have been.

chyron
November 22nd, 2007, 03:37 AM
It doesn't really matter for the Wraith. They could sleep the whole way.


Michael is still around.

You know...I would LOVE that as the series ending for Atlantis - the Wraith utterly destroyed, except for a single hive ship that has the coordinates for Earth that we jumping into hyperspace with the final shot of the Wraith inside hibernating waiting for hundreds of years that it will take... ::droolling with the possibilites::

chyron
November 22nd, 2007, 03:41 AM
The evidence supports Atlantis being slow.

If SG-1 was canceled after season 7, they were going to make a dvd movie to introduce StarGate: Atlantis. If the movie did well, it was going to be turned into a series.

Then SG-1 got renewed and SciFi wanted more StarGate so they created Atlantis. Rising was basically what the movie would have been.

Not a DVD movie - a full length feature film which is why they've got great effects for the episodes, the money was already budgeted but the film got shelved. TPTB have stated that multiple times.

chyron
November 22nd, 2007, 03:52 AM
Power = Speed.


And of course size does matter since a bigger ship allows for bigger engines.

umopapisdn
November 25th, 2007, 01:23 AM
Remember atlantis is a city, probably not designed for the fastest hyperspace travel though it is capable of travelling to PG from MW very quickly so it can't be that slow.

chyron
November 25th, 2007, 09:39 AM
Remember atlantis is a city, probably not designed for the fastest hyperspace travel though it is capable of travelling to PG from MW very quickly so it can't be that slow.

If you're thinking of aerodynamics, you're forgetting that it travels through the vacuum of space not to mention the shield would be in place to deflect anything that might be in its path when at sublight and to deal with the stresses.

Jarnin
November 25th, 2007, 06:31 PM
And of course size does matter since a bigger ship allows for bigger engines.
Bigger power source, bigger engines, etc, etc.


Remember atlantis is a city, probably not designed for the fastest hyperspace travel though it is capable of travelling to PG from MW very quickly so it can't be that slow.
What do you mean by "very quickly", and where did you get that idea?

DarkSullivan
November 26th, 2007, 10:20 AM
Seeing that the Asuran city-ship departed Asuras and Weir & company had time to come up with a plan and implement it before it reached Atlantis makes me wonder just how fast the city-ship hyperspace drives are. It must have taken hours to pull that reprogramming off for Rodney. For some reason I think the reason the ancients didn't just take Atlantis back to earth is that their hyperdrive engines aren't fast enough to distance themselves from the wraith and thus would have led the wraith directly to Earth and the rest of the MW galaxy. Just a thought.
For all we know, Asuras could have been on the other side of the galaxy.

Jarnin
November 26th, 2007, 02:33 PM
For all we know, Asuras could have been on the other side of the galaxy.
So what? The Pegasus galaxy is only supposed to be about 3 thousand light years across, which means (if Atlantis class ships are fast) it should take less than 30 minutes to travel from one side of the galaxy to the other.

Another thing to note is that Rodney's experimental puddle jumper with a hyperdrive was able to jump about 2000 light years, and when Radek and he were discussing it, they made it sound like that wasn't very far at all. If Pegasus is only 3000 LY in diameter, then that PJ would be jumping 2/3rds of the way across, which, relatively speaking, is a pretty big jump.

So I'm guessing the Pegasus galaxy in the show is only loosely based on the Pegasus galaxy in real life. In other words, Pegasus in the series isn't 3000 LY in diameter, it's much much larger (which is lame as hell).
That's the only way fast ships like the Daedalus could take hours for interstellar travel, and yet still take weeks for intergalactic travel.

If this is the case, then without knowing how big Pegasus is and having approximate travel times, there is no way to tell how fast or slow Atlantis is.

PrioroftheOri
November 26th, 2007, 06:48 PM
just look at the speedometer:D

umopapisdn
November 27th, 2007, 07:18 AM
Bigger power source, bigger engines, etc, etc.


What do you mean by "very quickly", and where did you get that idea?

What I meant by 'very quickly' was that it is capable of travelling at a similar speed to the deadelus (based on what I know from Adrift), that means that it can get to the PG galaxy in about 20 days, thats if its slower than the DD. Atlantis at that point was only powered by 1 ZPM afterall.



If you're thinking of aerodynamics, you're forgetting that it travels through the vacuum of space not to mention the shield would be in place to deflect anything that might be in its path when at sublight and to deal with the stresses.

I was talking about the fact they probably weren't focussing on it being able to go at the fastest possible speed where as on things like warships you would expect them to focuss on it much more.

sg8man
November 27th, 2007, 10:25 PM
So I'm guessing the Pegasus galaxy in the show is only loosely based on the Pegasus galaxy in real life. In other words, Pegasus in the series isn't 3000 LY in diameter, it's much much larger (which is lame as hell).
That's the only way fast ships like the Daedalus could take hours for interstellar travel, and yet still take weeks for intergalactic travel.

If this is the case, then without knowing how big Pegasus is and having approximate travel times, there is no way to tell how fast or slow Atlantis is.
You assume that everybody is always maxing out their hyperdrives. This might not be the case, or it might not even be possible, for example, If you were to drive everywhere with your foot down redlining, you're engine wouldn't last very long.

Jarnin
November 28th, 2007, 03:11 AM
What I meant by 'very quickly' was that it is capable of travelling at a similar speed to the deadelus (based on what I know from Adrift), that means that it can get to the PG galaxy in about 20 days, thats if its slower than the DD. Atlantis at that point was only powered by 1 ZPM afterall.
Nothing happened in Adrift that would allow you to do a speed comparison between Atlantis and Daedalus.


I was talking about the fact they probably weren't focussing on it being able to go at the fastest possible speed where as on things like warships you would expect them to focuss on it much more.
Except that we know Aurora was damn slow. It was going to take them months to get home if they didn't upgrade their engines. It should only take Daedalus about 14 hours to cross the Milky Way (Pegasus is much smaller than the Milky Way).

I'm not saying that all Aurora class ships were this slow, but they were until well into the war with the Wraith.


You assume that everybody is always maxing out their hyperdrives.
I'm assuming these ships are traveling at their normal cruising speeds at all times.


This might not be the case, or it might not even be possible, for example, If you were to drive everywhere with your foot down redlining, you're engine wouldn't last very long.
In the episode Critical Mass, Hermiod made some changes to make the engines faster, but he couldn't maintain that speed for very long (less than two hours). That indicates that they were traveling at their maximum (safe) cruising speed.
Can they travel slower? Sure, I suppose, but why would they if it's not going to damage their engines?

umopapisdn
November 28th, 2007, 11:00 AM
Nothing happened in Adrift that would allow you to do a speed comparison between Atlantis and Daedalus.


Except that we know Aurora was damn slow. It was going to take them months to get home if they didn't upgrade their engines. It should only take Daedalus about 14 hours to cross the Milky Way (Pegasus is much smaller than the Milky Way).


I'm going on the fact that Atlantis should have beaten them there, not the most sound arguament but at least is shows us atlantis isn't as slow as one of their warships, which i was wrong about their speed(I just watched aurora again), so they could still be around as fast as the DD which was my comment in the first place. Considering atlantis was only powered by 1 ZPM out of the 3.

Jarnin
November 28th, 2007, 02:00 PM
I'm going on the fact that Atlantis should have beaten them there, not the most sound arguament but at least is shows us atlantis isn't as slow as one of their warships, which i was wrong about their speed(I just watched aurora again), so they could still be around as fast as the DD which was my comment in the first place. Considering atlantis was only powered by 1 ZPM out of the 3.
You seemed to have missed the earlier discussion in this thread about the whole "Atlantis should have beaten Daedalus" scenario, so I'll recap:

There are plenty of reasons why the Apollo wouldn't have beaten Atlantis to their rendezvous, the most obvious is that the Apollo remained behind to make sure the Asuran satellite weapon wasn't going to follow Atlantis to their new planet. We know that Apollo remained behind and watched Atlantis leave the planet and enter hyperspace because he reported such to Carter when they reported Atlantis was missing. So, if they hung out long enough to watch Atlantis enter hyperspace, then it's quite possible they hung out long enough to make sure the Asuran satellite weapon wasn't going to follow them (a few hours).

We also know that Atlantis wasn't going to reach it's destination for 'hours' according to McKay. Daedalus should be able to cross [the real] Pegasus galaxy in about 26 minutes, which means Atlantis is slow if they were going to take hours to get to the nearest habitable planet without a gate that has a big ocean.


My working hypothesis is that the Lanteans didn't have fast hyperspace drives until long into the war with the Wraith. It was simply a technology that hadn't been discovered until that point. Once discovered, they radioed the upgrade information to their ships out in the field (like Aurora) and those ships were able to upgrade their "star drives" to "hyper drives".

sg8man
November 28th, 2007, 02:04 PM
Can they travel slower? Sure, I suppose, but why would they if it's not going to damage their engines?

I just proposed that they might not always be going at max speed to preserve their engines, pardon my in-(un?)clarity. It could explain a lot of things. But in any case you're quite right.

umopapisdn
November 28th, 2007, 11:19 PM
Ancient hyperdrive engines are probably as fast as a plot hole.

lvlister2005
November 29th, 2007, 02:39 AM
Right I want to make a few things clear if i may, Atlantis has a interstellar hyperdrive not an intergalactic one, so 10,000 years ago when the Ancient-Wraith war going on they must have stripped doen the hyperdrive for parts of whatever and left the main stardrive, hence travel between stars the stardrive, anyway the daedalus can travel with ZPM power to atlantis in about 4 days, with 3 zpms if they could utilize that power could get there in about half a day or even less maybe like 0.0000000000078 nanoseconds with power like that, we just dont know.

Finally i think atlantis could go at an infinite speed because simply we dont know what kind of speed hyperspace occurs at it could be 10 powers of light speed but the speed would be very fast.

umopapisdn
November 29th, 2007, 03:54 AM
If the PG galaxy is based on the real 1 it is about 3 million ly away, for the deadelus to get there in 18 days it would need to be travelling at around 7000 ly per hour, slower than 10 power the speed of light. (Presuming the galaxy is based on reality)

Myles
November 29th, 2007, 04:22 AM
If the PG galaxy is based on the real 1 it is about 3 million ly away, for the deadelus to get there in 18 days it would need to be travelling at around 7000 ly per hour, slower than 10 power the speed of light. (Presuming the galaxy is based on reality)

It's pretty clear that Pegasus is based on reality, but not very well. It is said in SGA(I think when they were talking about the Gate Bridge) that it's roughly 3 million light years from the MW, which is consistent with the Pegasus Dwarf Irregular galaxy, but there's too many inconsistencies. In reality, that galaxy is roughly 6 thousand light years in diameter. If the Daedalus can travel from the MW to Pegasus in 18 days then thats roughly 7000 light years/hour or 165,000 light years/day, as stated before. With those kind of speeds the Daedalus would be able to cross the Pegasus galaxy in less then an hour.

umopapisdn
November 29th, 2007, 11:21 AM
The writers probably took a real galaxy/ dwarf galaxy and manipulated the idea of it to suit their purpose so they can make it as far across as they like.

DaCk
November 29th, 2007, 02:08 PM
It's pretty clear that Pegasus is based on reality, but not very well. It is said in SGA(I think when they were talking about the Gate Bridge) that it's roughly 3 million light years from the MW, which is consistent with the Pegasus Dwarf Irregular galaxy, but there's too many inconsistencies. In reality, that galaxy is roughly 6 thousand light years in diameter. If the Daedalus can travel from the MW to Pegasus in 18 days then thats roughly 7000 light years/hour or 165,000 light years/day, as stated before. With those kind of speeds the Daedalus would be able to cross the Pegasus galaxy in less then an hour.

Perhaps you HAVE to travel slower inside the galaxy. There are larger objects located in the galaxies than in intersteller space you know. There was an episode i cant recall which one where a gravity well (i think it was. somethin with a large gravitational pull) disrupted the naquadria reactor and burned it out. Maybe its just like that in a galaxy. The objects arent physically there but you still have to avoid them because their gravity has affects on hyperspace travel.

sg8man
November 29th, 2007, 02:35 PM
Perhaps you HAVE to travel slower inside the galaxy. There are larger objects located in the galaxies than in intersteller space you know. There was an episode i cant recall which one where a gravity well (i think it was. somethin with a large gravitational pull) disrupted the naquadria reactor and burned it out. Maybe its just like that in a galaxy. The objects arent physically there but you still have to avoid them because their gravity has affects on hyperspace travel.

Dont think thats a real good explanation - galaxies still aren't very dense. Two galaxies could fly right through eachother, with the greatest likelihood beinh that not a single collision occurs.

DaCk
November 29th, 2007, 07:45 PM
Dont think thats a real good explanation - galaxies still aren't very dense. Two galaxies could fly right through eachother, with the greatest likelihood beinh that not a single collision occurs.

Riiighht... yeah two galaxies run into each other and nothing happens? There would be a lot of collisions. It doesnt matter about the density it matters about the objects and their affects on the space in hyperspace. We dont know how far out the gravity stretches in hyperspace. Or any other type of thing that could make it dense in hyperspace.

from_orion
November 29th, 2007, 11:43 PM
Riiighht... yeah two galaxies run into each other and nothing happens? There would be a lot of collisions. It doesnt matter about the density it matters about the objects and their affects on the space in hyperspace. We dont know how far out the gravity stretches in hyperspace. Or any other type of thing that could make it dense in hyperspace.
Sure things happen but it is true that more than likely "no collisions" would occur. However I'm sure that it would have a wacky effect on many orbits, causing destabilization of stable worlds.

umopapisdn
November 30th, 2007, 07:02 AM
Scientists don't really know why when 2 galaxies collide they separate again, the black holes should draw together but they don't, they believe this is a result of dark matter. With 2 galaxies coming together of course there will be collisions, their not like atoms there is a lot of space debris and many other objects. Gravity would cause things to happen like planets coming together and other such things.

J_schinderlin56
November 30th, 2007, 10:00 AM
Ok here are some more basic numbers

If we assume a round distance of 3 Million in a streight line from Earth to Lantia, and a 304 can get there in 3 weeks that works out to 1 million Light Years Per Week. That's 52 Million times the speed of Light! And Atlantis is faster! Geeze.

On a side note: That would mean that a 304 Could traverse the entire Observable UNIVERSE in just over 300 Years.

Myles
November 30th, 2007, 10:46 AM
Where do you get 300 years from to cross the universe? The observable universe is about 90 billion light years across. At a 1 million ly/week that is 90,000 weeks, which is 1730 years.

umopapisdn
November 30th, 2007, 11:12 AM
Ok here are some more basic numbers

If we assume a round distance of 3 Million in a streight line from Earth to Lantia, and a 304 can get there in 3 weeks that works out to 1 million Light Years Per Week. That's 52 Million times the speed of Light! And Atlantis is faster! Geeze.

On a side note: That would mean that a 304 Could traverse the entire Observable UNIVERSE in just over 300 Years.

The asgard can cross that in 4 days, that makes it 4.5 times faster. What do you think the observable size of the universe is?

Integrabyte
November 30th, 2007, 11:18 AM
Where do you get 300 years from to cross the universe? The observable universe is about 90 billion light years across. At a 1 million ly/week that is 90,000 weeks, which is 1730 years.

...and the universe expands in that time or not?

Jarnin
November 30th, 2007, 03:57 PM
It doesnt matter about the density it matters about the objects and their affects on the space in hyperspace. We dont know how far out the gravity stretches in hyperspace. Or any other type of thing that could make it dense in hyperspace.
In the episode Fail Safe SG-1 flew an asteroid right through the Earth, so if normal space and hyperspace interact, it's not much of an interaction at all.


Scientists don't really know why when 2 galaxies collide they separate again...
Uh, conservation of momentum?


...the black holes should draw together but they don't...
It depends on if it's a collision or a merger. If it's a merger, the two galaxies to combine, and the holes merge eventually. If it's a collision, the two galaxies might be ripped to shreds but the cores of the galaxies continue away from one another.


...they believe this is a result of dark matter.
Where are you coming up with this stuff? Please cite your references.


Ok here are some more basic numbers

If we assume a round distance of 3 Million in a streight line from Earth to Lantia, and a 304 can get there in 3 weeks that works out to 1 million Light Years Per Week. That's 52 Million times the speed of Light!
I got 60,832,886c but you're close enough.


And Atlantis is faster! Geeze.
Not according to the evidence from the show.


On a side note: That would mean that a 304 Could traverse the entire Observable UNIVERSE in just over 300 Years.
It could traverse the radii, not the entire observable universe...


The observable universe is about 90 billion light years across. At a 1 million ly/week that is 90,000 weeks, which is 1730 years.
Technically speaking, you're correct of course. The 13.7 billion light year radii of the observable universe has expanded to about 45 billion light years across. I think the previous poster was talking about the 13.7 billion light year distance however.

J_schinderlin56
November 30th, 2007, 05:30 PM
Where do you get 300 years from to cross the universe? The observable universe is about 90 billion light years across. At a 1 million ly/week that is 90,000 weeks, which is 1730 years.

Yup You're right! I just re did the math and got the 1730 Number 2. I did the math wrong the first time. Duh!

The size of the Observable Universe is about 90 Billion Light years. With the Radius being about 45 Billion Light years in any given direction from Earth to the edge, oddly enough indicateing that earth is somewhere in the center of the Observable Universe give or take a few Billion Light years.

Myles
November 30th, 2007, 07:45 PM
Yup You're right! I just re did the math and got the 1730 Number 2. I did the math wrong the first time. Duh!

The size of the Observable Universe is about 90 Billion Light years. With the Radius being about 45 Billion Light years in any given direction from Earth to the edge, oddly enough indicateing that earth is somewhere in the center of the Observable Universe give or take a few Billion Light years.

Well, I'm not well versed in the subject at all, but I would think it's because we can only see so far in every direction. That's why the observable is thrown in there. I suppose it's possible there's stuff beyond what we can see. It would be too ironic if we really were the center of the universe.

J_schinderlin56
November 30th, 2007, 09:08 PM
Well, I'm not well versed in the subject at all, but I would think it's because we can only see so far in every direction. That's why the observable is thrown in there. I suppose it's possible there's stuff beyond what we can see. It would be too ironic if we really were the center of the universe.

Verry True. I got this of Wiki:

In Big Bang cosmology, the observable universe is the region of space bounded by a sphere, centered on the observer, that is small enough that we might observe objects in it, i.e. there has been sufficient time for light emitted by an object to arrive at the observer. Every position has its own observable universe which may or may not overlap with the one centered around the Earth.

The word observable used in this sense has nothing to do with whether modern technology actually permits us to detect radiation from an object in this region. It simply means that it is possible for light or other radiation from the object to reach an observer on earth. In practice, we can only observe objects as far as the surface of last scattering, when the universe became transparent. However, it may be possible to infer information from before this time through the detection of gravitational waves.

The comoving distance from the Earth to the edge of the visible universe (also called cosmic light horizon) is about 46.5 billion light-years in any direction.[4] This defines the comoving radius of the observable universe. The observable universe is thus a sphere with a diameter of 92–94 billion light-years. Since space is roughly flat, this size corresponds to a comoving volume of about


or 3.56×1080 cubic meters.

The figures quoted above are distances now (in cosmological time), not distances at the time the light was emitted. For example, the cosmic microwave background radiation that we see right now was emitted about 13.7 billion years ago by matter that has, in the intervening time, condensed into galaxies. Those galaxies are now about 46 billion light-years from us, but at the time the light was emitted, that matter was only about 40 million light-years away from the matter that would eventually become the Earth.

umopapisdn
December 1st, 2007, 07:26 AM
Slightly off topic. There has been a theory that at one stage whilst the universe was just starting to form much of the matter actually went faster than the speed of light because of the amount of energy, because of the amount of energy the laws of physics as we know them don't apply.

Jarnin
December 1st, 2007, 02:12 PM
Slightly off topic. There has been a theory that at one stage whilst the universe was just starting to form much of the matter actually went faster than the speed of light because of the amount of energy, because of the amount of energy the laws of physics as we know them don't apply.
You're talking about cosmic inflation (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cosmic_inflation), but your conclusion is wrong.

Inflation states that not long after the big bang the universe expanded faster than the speed of light. No laws of physics were broken though, because space can stretch faster than the speed of light as long as local objects in that space don't exceed the speed of light.
Think warp drive: The ship isn't traveling faster than light through space, the space that ship occupies is traveling faster than light and the ship is just along for the ride.

2ndgenerationalteran
December 1st, 2007, 05:08 PM
Hey Jarnin, correct me if im wrong but in essense does the hyperdrive engine just create a field around the ship, creates the hyperdrive window, and "pulls" two locations of 2D space together? The propulsion in hyperspace would be the exact same as if it were outside, so sublight engines? Because if it is then we could come up with accurate numbers on how much more efficient asgard hyperdrives on asgard ships are, or how much faster their sublight is.

Jarnin
December 1st, 2007, 09:25 PM
Hey Jarnin, correct me if im wrong but in essense does the hyperdrive engine just create a field around the ship, creates the hyperdrive window, and "pulls" two locations of 2D space together?
Technically, pulling 2 locations together is considered "folding space".


The propulsion in hyperspace would be the exact same as if it were outside, so sublight engines?
If you were folding space, then yes, you'd only be able to use sub-light engines.


Because if it is then we could come up with accurate numbers on how much more efficient asgard hyperdrives on asgard ships are, or how much faster their sublight is.
Hyperspace travel in StarGate is not folding space. According to Carter in McKay And Mrs. Miller, hyperspace and subspace are synonymous. Wormholes travel through subspace. Now ships travel through subspace, though they call it hyperspace travel.

They've never gotten into the specifics of hyperspace travel, but I'd say it's a varient of warp drive, in that the ship inflates (warps) compactified dimensions (subspace) to allow it to travel through dimensions not normally accessible.
Basically, you're creating a wormhole, but instead of creating your own hole, you're using an existing compactified dimension.

In any case, this won't help us figure out the speeds of things.

umopapisdn
December 2nd, 2007, 02:27 AM
We can work out the speed of things like the deadelus and asgard ships as long as the places are based on reality, which it seems they partially are, but we don't really have enough evidence to work out atlantis. All this is is really conjecture.

from_orion
December 5th, 2007, 07:11 PM
We can work out the speed of things like the deadelus and asgard ships as long as the places are based on reality, which it seems they partially are, but we don't really have enough evidence to work out atlantis. All this is is really conjecture.
Very true we need an accurate intergalactic map.

Aegis
February 16th, 2011, 10:26 AM
This is correct. Tau'ri ships do not produce sufficient power to maximise the output efficiency of the Hyperdrive engine to 100%. Asgard ships have the nessesary power. When powered by the ZPM the Deadalus maximised the output of its Hyperdrive to 100% therefore traveling at the speed of an Asgard ship. Which is fast. So the amount of power provided is directly proportional to the efficiency of the Hyperdrive engine. More power faster ship.
No the ZPM produces way more power it's like comparing a zpm to the eye of harmony(it anchors the whole universe to a single continuity)

The Flyattractor
February 17th, 2011, 05:30 PM
No the ZPM produces way more power it's like comparing a zpm to the eye of harmony(it anchors the whole universe to a single continuity)

The Eye of Harmony as in the power source of the Time Lords in Dr.WHO?

Aegis
March 21st, 2011, 08:35 AM
The Eye of Harmony as in the power source of the Time Lords in Dr.WHO?

Yes

Mister Oragahn
May 1st, 2012, 10:22 AM
You're talking about cosmic inflation (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cosmic_inflation), but your conclusion is wrong.

Inflation states that not long after the big bang the universe expanded faster than the speed of light. No laws of physics were broken though, because space can stretch faster than the speed of light as long as local objects in that space don't exceed the speed of light.
Think warp drive: The ship isn't traveling faster than light through space, the space that ship occupies is traveling faster than light and the ship is just along for the ride.

Basically, the cloth on the table (universe) was being stretched faster than the gravy sauce puddle (light) that fell from the cup (big bang).

Alterus
June 26th, 2018, 01:34 PM
Well. . .

We don't know how far away Asura is from Atlantis.

But speeds in Stargate have been frelled with so much that it's hard to say. An Asgard ship can travel from their home galaxy to Earth in minutes, but take a week to reach Pegasus.

It's a real mindfrell.

Erm, when I thought it took the most advanced Asgard ship several hours to a day to travel from Earth to the outer edge of Ida, certainly long enough for Carter to build the time dilation controller

Xaeden
June 29th, 2018, 06:11 AM
Erm, when I thought it took the most advanced Asgard ship several hours to a day to travel from Earth to the outer edge of Ida, certainly long enough for Carter to build the time dilation controller

It took longer than usual because of the strain of towing the Prometheus. Thor described the journey as "many hours:"

THOR
The journey to our home galaxy will take many hours with your vessel in tow. You may consult your superiors en route.

Technically that could mean days, but the only lengthy gap was when O'neill went off to consult his superiors on Earth. They may have needed a few hours to talk it over, but it's unlikely it took them days to make a decision. The device you're referring to wasn't built by Carter. Rather Thor had it built for her using Earth-based materials. She was probably just studying it when O'neill interrupted her. After that O'neill says he's hungry, goes to cargo by three where the food is, talks to Jonas and Teal'c there, and, as they're talking, they drop out of hyperspace.

Laxian of Earth
June 30th, 2018, 10:55 AM
Indeed, the BC-304 Class ships just can't generate enough power to really run the Asgard-Systems at their most efficient (The Asgard don't build big ships just because! Their technology needs the room for power-generation! It's the same for the Goa'uld, that's why those Ha'tak can run superior technology, because they generate tons more power than a 304, a stock 304 could never fight a stock Ha'tak and even with the Asgard-Beams it isn't a guaranteed victory if the Ha'tak opens fire first (look at what happened to Sam's ship in the SGU opening episode, it got pounded - Asgard-Weapons offline (because of damage!) etc.)), thus they are slow, have (comparably!) weak shields etc. (I bet even the APBW is stronger or at least able to fire faster with a propper power-source!)

greetings LAX

Alterus
July 1st, 2018, 05:58 AM
It took longer than usual because of the strain of towing the Prometheus. Thor described the journey as "many hours:"

THOR
The journey to our home galaxy will take many hours with your vessel in tow. You may consult your superiors en route.

Technically that could mean days, but the only lengthy gap was when O'neill went off to consult his superiors on Earth. They may have needed a few hours to talk it over, but it's unlikely it took them days to make a decision. The device you're referring to wasn't built by Carter. Rather Thor had it built for her using Earth-based materials. She was probably just studying it when O'neill interrupted her. After that O'neill says he's hungry, goes to cargo by three where the food is, talks to Jonas and Teal'c there, and, as they're talking, they drop out of hyperspace.

Yes but the Prometheus’ is less than 10% of the mass of an O’Neill so I wouldn’t think it would cause much change in speed

Alterus
July 1st, 2018, 06:00 AM
Indeed, the BC-304 Class ships just can't generate enough power to really run the Asgard-Systems at their most efficient (The Asgard don't build big ships just because! Their technology needs the room for power-generation! It's the same for the Goa'uld, that's why those Ha'tak can run superior technology, because they generate tons more power than a 304, a stock 304 could never fight a stock Ha'tak and even with the Asgard-Beams it isn't a guaranteed victory if the Ha'tak opens fire first (look at what happened to Sam's ship in the SGU opening episode, it got pounded - Asgard-Weapons offline (because of damage!) etc.)), thus they are slow, have (comparably!) weak shields etc. (I bet even the APBW is stronger or at least able to fire faster with a propper power-source!)

greetings LAX

Erm a stock 304 is way more powerful than a ha’tak remember a 304 can stand on even footing with Wraith and even Ancient warships. Even without Asgard Weapons it's said that taking on a 304 with Ha’tak’s is a suicide mission with a victory only under certain circumstances, ie an ambush with a minefield and neutron star gravity