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GateWorld
July 14th, 2006, 02:40 PM
<DIV ALIGN="center"><TABLE WIDTH="450" BORDER="0" CELLSPACING="0" CELLPADDING="7"><TR><TD STYLE="border:0;"><DIV ALIGN="left"><FONT FACE="Verdana, Arial, san-serif" SIZE="2" COLOR="#000000"><A HREF="http://www.gateworld.net/sg1/s10/1001.shtml"><IMG SRC="http://www.gateworld.net/sg1/graphics/1001.jpg" WIDTH="160" HEIGHT="120" ALIGN="right" HSPACE="10" VSPACE="2" BORDER="0" STYLE="border: 1px black solid" ALT="Visit the Episode Guide"></A><FONT SIZE="1" COLOR="#888888">SG-1 SEASON TEN</FONT>
<FONT SIZE="4"><A HREF="http://www.gateworld.net/sg1/s10/1001.shtml" STYLE="text-decoration: none">FLESH AND BLOOD</A></FONT>
<FONT SIZE="1">EPISODE NUMBER - 1001</FONT>
<IMG SRC="/images/clear.gif" WIDTH="1" HEIGHT="10" ALT="">
As the Ori invade the Jaffa planet Chulak, Vala and Daniel must deal with their leader: Vala's young daughter, rapidly aged by the Ori to serve their purposes.

<FONT SIZE="1" COLOR="#888888"><B><A HREF="http://www.gateworld.net/sg1/s10/1001.shtml">VISIT THE EPISODE GUIDE ></A></B>
SPOILERS! PHOTOS! AND MORE!</FONT></FONT></DIV></TD></TR></TABLE></DIV>

TechnoBoY
July 14th, 2006, 07:04 PM
Well! The season premiere is over and now I'm watching the kick ass battle in SGA. Anyways....

Um... did they forget their plan to dial the supergate first so the Ori cant dial in? If I remember correctly the gate turned off. So shouldnt they activate it? Or do something better then just leave another scout?

Lucian Alliance still is stupid.

Whats her face the kid has creppy eyes.

Not a bad episode really! I'm hopeful of season 10.

I'm the first post! Whoo hoo! :)

Back to SGA.

Bobthespirit
July 14th, 2006, 07:05 PM
I did not enjoy last season, so I decided if I didn't like this episode I'd stop watching Stargate. Though, the show is looking up a little bit from last season.

At least, the 'One more reason for the males of this galaxy to believe in the Ori' line was funnier than any one-liner from last season.

Also, it looks like the writers are getting back to relying on the wits of the characters instead of just making everything deus ex machina.

And the daughter is much more interesting than I expected her to be. Though I wish Daniel didn't wuss out of shooting her. Maybe he could have shot and the priar stopped the bullet. That would have set the tone 'Daniel is not going to hesitate to do what's necessary to stop the Ori'.

Though, I was confused about Landry's hostility toward Woolsey. Sure, the Antarctica weapon might not work. But it might, so why not try? It seemed to me he was resisting a good idea just because it came from somebody he didn't like. Or so they wouldn't have to spend on the special effects.

That's the one good thing about Battlestar Galactica not being until October. Now, I might actually be able to enjoy Stargate.

captainpash
July 14th, 2006, 07:06 PM
The last scene in the ep was basically saying we're going back to our roots for this season. It looks to be good. Maybe like DS9 during the Domimon war good.

MarshAngel
July 14th, 2006, 07:06 PM
That was actually very entertaining if you overlook the implausibility of all that convenience beaming, particularly that last one with Daniel and Vala. Why would they drop their shields unless they intended to let them go.

IMForeman
July 14th, 2006, 07:06 PM
"This isn't war! This is Pest Control!"

Talk about one sided! Regardless of what Sam said, this is much, much worse than when they first encountered the Goa'uld. Nothing they have thrown at the Ori have mattered in the slightest. They really need to find something, or the Ori are unstoppable.

"You are superior in only one respect... you are better at dying!"

NowIWillDestroyAbydos
July 14th, 2006, 07:07 PM
Good episode. I see great potential for Season 10 (compared to the crappy 9th season). Cam is getting better and better every episode.

captainpash
July 14th, 2006, 07:07 PM
They had landed you can't land with a shields up. It would be kinda hard. The bubble around the ship and all.

IMForeman
July 14th, 2006, 07:08 PM
That was actually very entertaining if you overlook the implausibility of all that convenience beaming, particularly that last one with Daniel and Vala. Why would they drop their shields unless they intended to let them go.

Well, it was on the ground, wasn't it?

MarshAngel
July 14th, 2006, 07:09 PM
And the daughter is much more interesting than I expected her to be. Though I wish Daniel didn't wuss out of shooting her.

I second that. Granted the toddler sounded like well, a toddler singing lines but that's to be expected. Other than that she was really fascinating in all her incarnations. I almost wish she didn't have to grow up so quickly.

MarshAngel
July 14th, 2006, 07:10 PM
Well, it was on the ground, wasn't it?
I'm not sure why that matters. It was hovering over the city. Why would they feel the need to lower shields? I know, the battle is irrelevant but there should be a reason for everything.

IMForeman
July 14th, 2006, 07:10 PM
I second that. Granted the toddler sounded like well, a toddler singing lines but that's to be expected. Other than that she was really fascinating in all her incarnations. I almost wish she didn't have to grow up so quickly.

I wish they'd stuck with the Jodelle Ferdland version for a while. That girl is creepy.

yaaayoubetcha
July 14th, 2006, 07:12 PM
That would have set the tone 'Daniel is not going to hesitate to do what's necessary to stop the Ori'.

Daniel always hesitates. That's his job, he is the consience of the show.

That said, I thought it was a pretty good way to start the season.

Too bad about Chekov...I rather liked him.

Earth really needs to get better ships. They just keep getting their donkey's kicked.

I rather enjoy Adria. If they keep the character going with a sufficiently voiced gifted actor, I think she'll be a great focal for the season. Hopefully they don't kill her off until the end of the season.

Glad too see Claudia Black finally getting a ring credit, hopefully they'll make her a bit less silly. I like silly, but she needs to be more than a source of consternation for Daniel. She should have a fairly prominent role this season, being the spawner of evil and all that.

Can't wait for next week.

Dani347
July 14th, 2006, 07:16 PM
Okay, I might have missed it, but why couldn't they beam Daniel up before they did? Like, as soon as they found out he was on the ship? And, except for a couple of mentions, didn't seem to be much thought about him. *blatantly ignoring any potential cracks about my interest in having the team concerned about Daniel* Well, Sam did seem happy to hear from him.

Speaking of ships, I still find stories that happen on them to be dull. Booring.

What, did the producers decide that Teal'c hadn't been getting his full share of being captured and tortured?

Kvasir! Saving Sam. Working with Sam. I'm telling you it's love, love baby!

Ugh. Still hate the Ori, hate the whole baby thing. Hate the phrasing. Couldn't Vala's husband (what'shisface) say he wanted to save her instead of her soul? Or just stick to saying they want people to be on the path to enlightenment instead of salvation? And, not say anything is blasphemy? But, it was good to hear them talk about genetically altering Adria, and that she wasn't actually Ori, but created to be as close as possible, and not in their image, but in human's image. And, mentioning the battle between the Ancients, that she thinks the Ori need to destroy people to defend themselves from the Ancients. Plus, having Adria thinking that the Jaffa could be turned to origin, but still wanting to kill them.

Not much stood out. Like I said, ships don't interest me. Ori don't interest and disturb me.

Hopefully next week will have less Ori, and more team together for majority of the episode.

edain
July 14th, 2006, 07:16 PM
I tell you what the most amazing thing the difference in character of Cam from this season compared to last. Personally I did not enjoy the manner in which he spoke to Bra'tec. I was thinking to myself that maybe if it was any other person, he would kill him where he stands for saying something like that.

ussrelativity
July 14th, 2006, 07:18 PM
Definetely can't wait for next week!

Pharaoh Atem
July 14th, 2006, 07:26 PM
there did i great job tieing in everything from the space battle and the ori ships look cool especially on a planet

adria is going to be cool

i'm really looking froward to this season great start

Skydiver
July 14th, 2006, 07:31 PM
not bad, not fantastic. little draggy in places and, imho, very much a simple

let's put all the toys away from last season and get our clothes out so we can be ready for the next 19

no awe inspriring revelations, not :eek: moments...just a way to kill an hour

I think the biggest thrill i had was when the atlantis credits rolled and i saw Kavan's name ;)

Seshat
July 14th, 2006, 07:53 PM
Gotta love that Will Waring! :) I thought he crammed more action and cuts into this one ep than almost all of last season combined. In fact, there was so much backstory and explanatory exposition that I thought someone new to the show might get seriously lost early on. I'm not sure they can keep up this pace, or would want to, but it was much more entertaining to me than all the old memory-wiping machine and space corn stories of last season combined.

I'm glad the kid is growing up radically fast. I hate super-baby stories, but it looks like she'll be an adult by next week and just another full-grown adversary they must outwit all season long. I can live with that.

What is Sam's job this season supposed to be exactly? I mean, her purpose? Everyone else seems to have a seasonal story arc all laid out by this first ep except her. Even Kvasir has some of her usual "saves the day" techniques in her place. Maybe we are seeing the birth of Super!Kvasir instead of Super!Sam?? ;)

LOL4JACK
July 14th, 2006, 07:58 PM
I liked it, definitely much, much better than last years... now I just need some more mentions of Jack and I'm a happy camper.

At the beg of the ep I had the sensation that it was a movie based on SG-1, but then when our characters started to get together I had the feeling that we were back to my TV show...

Loved, Sam, liked Vala, loved the Daniel is dead again thing... Teal'c plssss he has no more symbiot give him a break with the torture :p we can really loose him now... and Cam... definitely better written...

Looking forward for more SG-1!!!! or SG-1 + 1

trinity23
July 14th, 2006, 07:59 PM
Okay, I might have missed it, but why couldn't they beam Daniel up before they did? Like, as soon as they found out he was on the ship? And, except for a couple of mentions, didn't seem to be much thought about him. *blatantly ignoring any potential cracks about my interest in having the team concerned about Daniel* Well, Sam did seem happy to hear from him.

Speaking of ships, I still find stories that happen on them to be dull. Booring.

What, did the producers decide that Teal'c hadn't been getting his full share of being captured and tortured?

Kvasir! Saving Sam. Working with Sam. I'm telling you it's love, love baby!

Ugh. Still hate the Ori, hate the whole baby thing. Hate the phrasing. Couldn't Vala's husband (what'shisface) say he wanted to save her instead of her soul? Or just stick to saying they want people to be on the path to enlightenment instead of salvation? And, not say anything is blasphemy? But, it was good to hear them talk about genetically altering Adria, and that she wasn't actually Ori, but created to be as close as possible, and not in their image, but in human's image. And, mentioning the battle between the Ancients, that she thinks the Ori need to destroy people to defend themselves from the Ancients. Plus, having Adria thinking that the Jaffa could be turned to origin, but still wanting to kill them.

Not much stood out. Like I said, ships don't interest me. Ori don't interest and disturb me.

Hopefully next week will have less Ori, and more team together for majority of the episode.
No one seemed to care too much about the possible demise of Daniel is probably b/c Daniel dies like every other week & then BAM, he's back. Even Jack said he was going to stop mourning Daniel (Threads) because just as you start saying nice things about him at his funeral, he turns up the next day.

* I would have loved to see more of the second little Adria. Little kids who play evil (for lack of a better adjective) are just more interesting then adults. Bacause to an adult mind they still possess? a type of innocence.

captain jake
July 14th, 2006, 08:28 PM
Okay, I might have missed it, but why couldn't they beam Daniel up before they did? Like, as soon as they found out he was on the ship? And, except for a couple of mentions, didn't seem to be much thought about him. *blatantly ignoring any potential cracks about my interest in having the team concerned about Daniel* Well, Sam did seem happy to hear from him.

Speaking of ships, I still find stories that happen on them to be dull. Booring.

What, did the producers decide that Teal'c hadn't been getting his full share of being captured and tortured?

Kvasir! Saving Sam. Working with Sam. I'm telling you it's love, love baby!

Ugh. Still hate the Ori, hate the whole baby thing. Hate the phrasing. Couldn't Vala's husband (what'shisface) say he wanted to save her instead of her soul? Or just stick to saying they want people to be on the path to enlightenment instead of salvation? And, not say anything is blasphemy? But, it was good to hear them talk about genetically altering Adria, and that she wasn't actually Ori, but created to be as close as possible, and not in their image, but in human's image. And, mentioning the battle between the Ancients, that she thinks the Ori need to destroy people to defend themselves from the Ancients. Plus, having Adria thinking that the Jaffa could be turned to origin, but still wanting to kill them.

Not much stood out. Like I said, ships don't interest me. Ori don't interest and disturb me.

Hopefully next week will have less Ori, and more team together for majority of the episode.

well one they were repairing the beaming technology and two he said he was busy. The reason sam gave for going back was to find daniel she seamed pretty worried about him to me as did the rest of the team. Also they were kinda preoccupied by the fact that 4 ori ships have entered are galaxy and are bent on domination over it.

I dunno I think the beaming factor and what not is quite entertaining. I think most episodes based on ships are all about BLOWING UP STUFF but not this one. Granted there was some explosions but there was also an amazingly entertaining story. So if you are saying that this was "boring" because it had no story and only explosions I completely disagree. however if you don't like them for a different reason then I appologize for jumping to conclusions.

Yep, I guess they did or perhaps they figure it was an appropriate response for the Lucian alliance to have.

There is one crucial piece missing and that is sex drive, I don't believe he has any. (Do we even know that he is a he?)

I thought the "baby thing" was actualy pretty freaking cool. Her eyes were very interesting I suppose it was all that evil leaking through. I think the youngest was the scariest simply because it was a little girl speaking the word of origin. The older she gets the less scary she gets IMO.

Why exactly don't you like the ori? what do you have against them?

I wouldn't count on it, seams the ori are a huge part of season 10. As for the "team together" I don't see a problem in that area.

Overall I thought it was a pretty damn good episode and I can't wait for the second half.

the fifth man
July 14th, 2006, 08:29 PM
IMO, great way to start off Season 10. I am very pleased with how things have started, and can't wait to see what lies ahead. Adria is going to be a kick-a** foe, I'll tell you that. Long live SG-1!:)

GhostPoet
July 14th, 2006, 08:32 PM
I nominate this best episode. EVER.

the fifth man
July 14th, 2006, 08:35 PM
I nominate this best episode. EVER.

While I wouldn't quite say best ever, it is definitely high up there in my book. Great way to start this season, I'll tell you that. I thought everyone was great in it, including the various girls they had playing Adria. For young actresses, they did a fine job.

Simhavaktra
July 14th, 2006, 08:36 PM
Ho hum. Even boring.

The Ori ships look even more like contour toilet seats than I remember.

Too many Mitchell closeups.

Even the action sequences left me with the impression that the production's attitude was "Chop, chop, boys and girls! Hurry up! Must get through all the little sequences in this pot boiler!"

The whole episode seemed to be a choppy series of rather disjointed, generally predictable and strangely wooden vignettes, not a smoothly plotted, balanced, well-crafted and well-rounded story. Dramatic tension was poorly employed and was actually built just as high for starships as for people. The resolution of the characters' situations from the cliffhanger end of last season were executed with a sort of detached expendience, and merited no further mention once they had been achieved.

The result reminded me of nothing so much as an episode of some dreary, humdrum and predictable military soap opera, except that even soap operas generally manage to convey more fervor for their storyline(s) and more enthusiams for their craft.

A poor episode.

Nolamom
July 14th, 2006, 08:36 PM
Quite enjoyable overall - good storyline.
Vala:"she's hell-bent on domination of the galaxy."
Daniel:"How old is she?"
Vala:"a few hours"
Now THAT'S evil!

Persephone
July 14th, 2006, 08:38 PM
I rather enjoy Adria. If they keep the character going with a sufficiently voiced gifted actor, I think she'll be a great focal for the season.

I'm a big fan of what limited work the actress has already done, and I can't wait to see her in this role. :teyla: :cameron:

the fifth man
July 14th, 2006, 08:38 PM
Quite enjoyable overall - good storyline.
Vala:"she's hell-bent on domination of the galaxy."
Daniel:"How old is she?"
Vala:"a few hours"
Now THAT'S evil!

Indeed!:)

Unorthodox
July 14th, 2006, 08:40 PM
This episode sure has got my hopes up for s10. I do admit, I was surprised at how fast the Toilet-ships are...but at least some people finally got to see a. Ori fightercraft/landing craft (which pwned the Jaffa, mind you).

This episode seemed foreboding and darker than S-9. In S-9, it always was "It'll happen in the next episode." In this episode, it was like "It's happening NOW, and we're fu**ed." Maybe not the best in the whole SG universe, but if the rest of the series is like that, I'll be happy.

Major Gambit
July 14th, 2006, 08:42 PM
Defidently a great episode. I really like the new intro (because it has ori ships in it :D)

The Ori fighters were as cool as i thought they would be. I'm glad Tony got in on this episode too, that was cool. Vala was funny. Adrias eyes look weird too.


Did Colonel Chekov die?

the fifth man
July 14th, 2006, 08:43 PM
Did Colonel Chekov die?

IMO, that is still unclear. They specified that 6 survivors beamed off the Korolev, but didn't go into detail. We'll just have to wait and see.

Mitchell82
July 14th, 2006, 08:43 PM
I have to say that this was an excellent episode and great way to start the new season. Sorry about Chekov Wolsey not as much of an ass but still a pain. great story love Adria and while I would like to see more of the adolesent Adria looking forward to see her as an adult and she will be a big problem. Excellent efects and I believe this season has great potential and each episode may not bve as strong they will probably be great in their own right. i loved season 9 and this episode just confirms why I love Stargate so much! Bring on next week!

Jack: Somebody has to teach that guy how to die!

captain jake
July 14th, 2006, 08:43 PM
Defidently a great episode. I really like the new intro (because it has ori ships in it :D)

The Ori fighters were as cool as i thought they would be. I'm glad Tony got in on this episode too, that was cool. Vala was funny. Adrias eyes look weird too.


Did Colonel Chekov die?

They said a few people beamed off in time maybe he was one of them. (Who knows)

Nolamom
July 14th, 2006, 08:43 PM
The complete overmatching by the Ori ships shows how imperitive it is for the SGC to find a suitable weapon to defend this galaxy against them. Right now we are ill-equipped to fight them. Face it, we were blown away this time. Pretty much like the early days against the Goa'uld. But it won't always be that way. We gotta have faith. And look for some cool Arthurian weapons!

the fifth man
July 14th, 2006, 08:45 PM
The complete overmatching by the Ori ships shows how imperitive it is for the SGC to find a suitable weapon to defend this galaxy against them. Right now we are ill-equipped to fight them. Face it, we were blown away this time. Pretty much like the early days against the Goa'uld. But it won't always be that way. We gotta have faith. And look for some cool Arthurian weapons!

I totally agree. Because we haven't even put a dent in any of their ships yet. That is not good for our heroes.

Dani347
July 14th, 2006, 08:46 PM
well one they were repairing the beaming technology and two he said he was busy.

Okay, beaming tech broken. I buy that. But, if it were me, I'd ignore "I'm busy" and say, "you're on enemy ship. Saving you trumps busy."


I dunno I think the beaming factor and what not is quite entertaining. I think most episodes based on ships are all about BLOWING UP STUFF but not this one. Granted there was some explosions but there was also an amazingly entertaining story. So if you are saying that this was "boring" because it had no story and only explosions I completely disagree. however if you don't like them for a different reason then I appologize for jumping to conclusions.

I think beaming factor is boring. And, I found no entertaining story. But, hey, I'm fine if you do, so it should be fine that I don't.




There is one crucial piece missing and that is sex drive, I don't believe he has any. (Do we even know that he is a he?)

You mean Kvasir? Well, in my world he's a he. And, their love transcends all boundaries. To use a highly cliched phrase - "it's meant to be" :D




Why exactly don't you like the ori? what do you have against them?

I am not getting into this here. Go here:http://forum.gateworld.net/showthread.php?p=5446531#post5446531

Also, I've posted in this thread: http://forum.gateworld.net/showthread.php?t=25505 Please do not debate me on this subject in this thread, because it's off topic and will just get bogged down in a back and forth. Those threads are open for replies and are on topic for debating what's wrong with the Ori.


I wouldn't count on it, seams the ori are a huge part of season 10. As for the "team together" I don't see a problem in that area.



The Goa'uld were a huge part of 8 seasons and they didn't appear in every single episode, so I don't see why there can't be a break from the Ori as well. And, team together? Teal'c spent most of the episode on the Lucian ship. By himself (and by that I mean, without SG1) Daniel didn't show up on screen until about halfway through, spent most of his time with Vala (hope they mix it up, have all of them together, or if they split them up, have Daniel with someone other than Vala and vice versa at times) and didn't reunite with the rest of the team until the end. In fact, it wasn't until the end that every member of SG1 was in the same room. So, no, I didn't feel a warm rush of teammy goodness here.


Overall I thought it was a pretty damn good episode and I can't wait for the second half.

Glad you enjoyed it. Overall, I found it mediocre.

Horris Nell
July 14th, 2006, 08:47 PM
I got a kick out of the episode, more laughter then anything else when I watched it, I loved the "hide!" part with Vala and Daniel Jackson, just before her husband (? I think it is) comes in the room.

The Fifth
July 14th, 2006, 08:48 PM
Defidently a great episode. I really like the new intro (because it has ori ships in it :D)

The Ori fighters were as cool as i thought they would be. I'm glad Tony got in on this episode too, that was cool. Vala was funny. Adrias eyes look weird too.


Did Colonel Chekov die?

Six people got off right? I would image he would be one of the first to abandon ship. It does fit with his character.

gatewonderer114
July 14th, 2006, 08:49 PM
Very good episode in my opinion. It makes you wonder what they will do next to stop this unstoppable threat.

Nolamom
July 14th, 2006, 08:51 PM
Glad you enjoyed it. Overall, I found it mediocre.
That's what's great about Stargate - something for everyone. Some episodes appeal to some folks, some to others. Maybe next week or the week after will be more to your taste.

CCA
July 14th, 2006, 08:51 PM
I'll say the same thing I said at the Scifi Board

I really enjoyed the episode, though I was a bit annoyed by the fact that everybody that I ever known since birth called me at 9...is there some cosmic super power that knew that is when I wanted silence!

I enjoyed it and am all ready got my clock going down to the next episode

Arative
July 14th, 2006, 08:54 PM
Enjoyed the episode. Loved Adria eyes, as they say the eyes are the window to the soul and hers are firey red, little touch there to help her seem more Ori.

This season is taking us back to the beginning of SG-1 I think, basically fighting an overwhelming enemey with inferior technology, I love it!

Nolamom
July 14th, 2006, 08:55 PM
is there some cosmic super power that knew that is when I wanted silence!

You didn't know about the Great and Powerful Oz? Contoller of cosmic super powers and telephones...interrupter of new episodes and general cause of gnashing of teeth.

captain jake
July 14th, 2006, 08:55 PM
Okay, beaming tech broken. I buy that. But, if it were me, I'd ignore "I'm busy" and say, "you're on enemy ship. Saving you trumps busy."

I think beaming factor is boring. And, I found no entertaining story. But, hey, I'm fine if you do, so it should be fine that I don't.

You mean Kvasir? Well, in my world he's a he. And, their love transcends all boundaries. To use a highly cliched phrase - "it's meant to be" :D

I am not getting into this here. Go here:http://forum.gateworld.net/showthread.php?p=5446531#post5446531

Also, I've posted in this thread: http://forum.gateworld.net/showthread.php?t=25505 Please do not debate me on this subject in this thread, because it's off topic and will just get bogged down in a back and forth. Those threads are open for replies and are on topic for debating what's wrong with the Ori.

The Goa'uld were a huge part of 8 seasons and they didn't appear in every single episode, so I don't see why there can't be a break from the Ori as well. And, team together? Teal'c spent most of the episode on the Lucian ship. By himself (and by that I mean, without SG1) Daniel didn't show up on screen until about halfway through, spent most of his time with Vala (hope they mix it up, have all of them together, or if they split them up, have Daniel with someone other than Vala and vice versa at times) and didn't reunite with the rest of the team until the end. In fact, it wasn't until the end that every member of SG1 was in the same room. So, no, I didn't feel a warm rush of teammy goodness here.

Glad you enjoyed it. Overall, I found it mediocre.

Not if at that moment daniel was creating away to destoy the ori ship. Which from there point of view was completely possible.

Fine with me

Lmao...................

Actually it was on topic but whatever.

Yes, but almost every episode we were dealing with the gou'ald whether they were on screen or not.

Is that really why you didn't like it just because they weren't all in the same room?

the fifth man
July 14th, 2006, 08:56 PM
Enjoyed the episode. Loved Adria eyes, as they say the eyes are the window to the soul and hers are firey red, little touch there to help her seem more Ori.

This season is taking us back to the beginning of SG-1 I think, basically fighting an overwhelming enemey with inferior technology, I love it!

I love it too.:) I really feel that this season will be something special, as evidenced to me anyways by how great this episode was.

CCA
July 14th, 2006, 08:57 PM
You didn't know about the Great and Powerful Oz? Contoller of cosmic super powers and telephones...interrupter of new episodes and general cause of gnashing of teeth.

I had heard of him, that little sneaky head!!!! (wonders if Raid will work on him)

Nolamom
July 14th, 2006, 09:00 PM
It seemed to me that Cam was better written than last season. I liked that. I liked Vala too - not just as a cheeky gal, but as a woman who has experienced something outside the realm of normalcy - the birth of Adria. What a shocker for her.

starfox
July 14th, 2006, 09:01 PM
Not a bad opener. Renewed my love for the characters and the dialouge was pretty good.


I liked Emerson's line "I'm guessing that's a no," after he sees Teal'c in the scuffle on the other ship. It may seem a bit callous at first, but it just shows how absolutely tired of it all he was and how dire the circumstances were. When you see one of your guys attacked on another ship and can't even spare the energy to be worried, things are bad. Also, I just love dry humour.

Mitchell worrying about Sam was so lovely. It really shows the friendship between those two.

Vala. Still love her. I know she's a love-her-or-hate-her character, and I am firmly on her side. Her scenes with Adria were pretty well-done; they showed her unease with the girl as well as her concern for her. I really like that they didn't choose maternal care over the need to stop the Ori. Vala is an opportunist, trying to bring the girl over to her side is very in character for her. It also showed her sarcasm rather well. I liked the exchange between her and Adria about the Jaffa.
Adria: ...but in their hearts, I believe they know ascension is the true goal of our existence.
Vala: Then why are you slaughtering them?

It's a nice, cutting line. Wouldn't work for someone as fully indoctrinated/Ori-molded as Adria, but still, very nice line.

I love that the team (well, the team minus Daniel) went to the mothership with Bra'tac. Also love Sam's comment to Emerson.

Emerson: That's suicide.
Sam: Well, for Teal'c and Bra'tac, that's not really an argument against going.

Those Jaffa do have an aggravating tendency towards kamikaze runs, don't they?


Vala's husband was a nice touch. She really does care about him. It helps show how a situation like this can tear relationships apart, really messing up your sense of who to trust. Yeah, our heroes are all on one side, but the people on the planets the Ori wil be trying to dominate probably won't be. It's a nice element of the suffering of the common man.


Daniel's wish that he had shot Adria is an interesting look at his character. This is not the Daniel of old. His oh-so-Daniel-like hesitation cost them, but the fact that he even mentioned wishing that he had shot Adria shows the desperation of the situation. Honestly, this is the guy who cried over a robot five seasons ago, and now he's willing to shoot what is in form, a human girl.


Vala pushing Daniel out of the way and taking fire for him is a nice move for her. I also love his refusal to leave Vala, even though it would have been the better tactical move. Yes, I am a sucker for friendship moments like that.

Love Mitchell's 'live to fight another day' attitude. It shows logic and a willingness to retreat and regroup, a willingness to use intelligence instead of brute strength and indoctrination, which is really the only thing the people of Earth have over the Ori and their soldiers at this point.

Can't wait to see where this season will go.

the fifth man
July 14th, 2006, 09:02 PM
It seemed to me that Cam was better written than last season. I liked that. I liked Vala too - not just as a cheeky gal, but as a woman who has experienced something outside the realm of normalcy - the birth of Adria. What a shocker for her.

I thought they were both good in this episode as well. Both have come a long way IMO. However, I'm one that liked them both just fine last season as well.:D

Galilahi
July 14th, 2006, 09:02 PM
I did like it. But the whole ep seemed to be one big set up to me. i think it's going to take an ep or two to really get the balance and rhythm of the characters and new storylines. i do like that the sgc is going to have to go back to the, guerrilla by the skin of our teeth style.

i'm already equating adria to the anti-christ. "Damien! It's all for you Damien!"

Dani347
July 14th, 2006, 09:02 PM
Not if at that moment daniel was creating away to destoy the ori ship. Which from there point of view was completely possible.

How many ships did they have fighting and couldn't do anything? So, why would they assume that Daniel had single handedly found a way (and would destroy it while he was on it?)?



Actually it was on topic but whatever.

Actually topic is the episode, not Dani's problems with the Ori.


Yes, but almost every episode we were dealing with the gou'ald whether they were on screen or not.

Pertinent word there. Almost. Meaning not every episode. Meaning it's not without precedence that there might be a few that don't have the Ori or mention of them. For example, One False Step (no Goa'uld or mention) Prisoners, maybe WoO (fuzzy memory on that one), maybe Space Race (ditto). So, yeah, since not every episode had or mentioned the Goa'uld, I say it's possible that not every episode will have or mention the Ori. At least I hope.


Is that really why you didn't like it just because they weren't all in the same room?

Uh, yeah. My whole post was just "they weren't in the same room, they weren't in the same room." I didn't say anything else. Right.

Major Gambit
July 14th, 2006, 09:05 PM
They say that 6 people beamed off of the Korolev, where did they beam to? The Odessey?

Nolamom
July 14th, 2006, 09:05 PM
Good summation of the key points Starfox. you're right about Daniel - big difference from five seasons ago when he cried over shooting a robot. But he's faced some pretty big enemies since then and has grown too.

Nolamom
July 14th, 2006, 09:08 PM
They say that 6 people beamed off of the Korolev, where did they beam to? The Odessey?
You know, they didn't really explain that one.

L-JADE
July 14th, 2006, 09:11 PM
I like this episode better than Season 9 first ep. It's not great buf definitely better than most S9 yawn-fest.
IMO, Cam talks too much here while Sam is too quiet, Teal'c is forgettable as in no really meaningful talk-scene. Daniel is less talky than normal which is way better than his super-talk in S9 premiere.

Bragi
July 14th, 2006, 09:13 PM
It was pretty decent.

They did what was important; they found a way for Adria to be introduced, Vala to be rescued, and the next season to be set up. Everyone acted fairly well (even the two versions of Adria we saw), I thought.

I'm a little disappointed in the continuity. They completely forgot about the plan to dial out. Hopefully they'll explain in an episode or two why they couldn't. (I'd have it be something as simple as the new control crystal frying.)

FoolishPleasure
July 14th, 2006, 09:14 PM
Really liked this episode. Lots of excitement, great effects work, good acting. Nice to see Mitchell has the tough officer - much better that the wacky Cam we saw in "Off the Grid.

Gonna miss Checkov (unless he made it off the Koralev).

Highlight: Adria. Creepy and well done.

Thumbs up, all the way around.:)

Nolamom
July 14th, 2006, 09:16 PM
I'm a little disappointed in the continuity. They completely forgot about the plan to dial out. Hopefully they'll explain in an episode or two why they couldn't. (I'd have it be something as simple as the new control crystal frying.)
It was my understanding that the Ori dialed in just as Sam replaced the crystal - there was no time for the Earth group to dial out. Perhaps I'm mis-remembering from the end of last season?

Weir'sRedShirt
July 14th, 2006, 09:17 PM
As someone who really hated season 9, I loved this episode. The main reason I wasn't a fan of season 9 was Vala, but I have to say I loved her in this ep. She was funny but not over-the-top, and I hope the Adria(sp?) plotline will tone her down a little, because I think I could really love her character.

Favorite moment? When Sam and Teal'C insisted on coming in the hope of getting Daniel, because it definitely reminded me of how close these three people are.

And that was some pretty sweet flying on Cameron's part when he saved Sam.

Hubble
July 14th, 2006, 09:24 PM
Ho hum. Even boring.

The Ori ships look even more like contour toilet seats than I remember.

Too many Mitchell closeups.

Even the action sequences left me with the impression that the production's attitude was "Chop, chop, boys and girls! Hurry up! Must get through all the little sequences in this pot boiler!"

The whole episode seemed to be a choppy series of rather disjointed, generally predictable and strangely wooden vignettes, not a smoothly plotted, balanced, well-crafted and well-rounded story. Dramatic tension was poorly employed and was actually built just as high for starships as for people. The resolution of the characters' situations from the cliffhanger end of last season were executed with a sort of detached expendience, and merited no further mention once they had been achieved.

The result reminded me of nothing so much as an episode of some dreary, humdrum and predictable military soap opera, except that even soap operas generally manage to convey more fervor for their storyline(s) and more enthusiams for their craft.

A poor episode.

I agree. Boring enough that I can't muster up the interest to say anything more than you've already said. Except: what the heck is with Teal'c's hair?

L.A. Doyle
July 14th, 2006, 09:26 PM
It was alright. It was better than I thought, but it could have been better. Adria is interesting, though I still don't care for the Ori. The beaming people out all the time is getting old, so I like how they rescued Sam. Um...I want more team togetherness. Oh and Bra'tac! (((Bra'tac))) Glad to see him. Next week looks pretty good; I'm looking forward to it!

2ndgenerationalteran
July 14th, 2006, 09:27 PM
i agree the way they got sam back was something ive wanted to see for a while.

Osiris-RA
July 14th, 2006, 09:27 PM
Well. I won't bother with another big long running commentary (cause I already did one and I'm sleepy :P) But I will say that I have winkled out a depressing pattern with this big, bad, new enemy, the Orii.

They're a Goa'uld knock-off! Pure and simple! They wish to convert by the millions. The Goa'uld wanted the same thing and Rosemary's Baby is obviously the Anti-Harseisis. How can the new season be cooler when the bad guy is just a weaker, less character-driven spin-off of the Goa'uld?? It's like Stargate: SG1 has become Starscape, and they're stealing Stargate SG1 characters and bad guys, and winding it all into one big crappy storyline! I mean...who's falling for this?? They've given you the same old Boston Cheesecake and are calling it Coconut Cream Pie! (does that make sense?)

Carter seems impotent of her previous coolness and collectedness, and has no connection with Mitchell that I can see, Teal'c...I don't know whats up with him, Daniel...*flails hopelessly* What the bloody heck is everyone ON? Did we all take a stupid pill when I wasn't looking??

OK, rant over. You gotta admit, the writers could have simply kept the Goa'uld storyline and beefed it up a little, if the Orii are the best they could come up with.

And seriously - who's sick of space? This isn't Andromeda! (by the way, where was the elusive new Doctor? Didn't see her at all tonight. Is anyone even paying attention anymore? Yeesh)

Nolamom
July 14th, 2006, 09:28 PM
I agree. Boring enough that I can't muster up the interest to say anything more than you've already said. Except: what the heck is with Teal'c's hair?
He joined the Hair Club for ex-Jaffa!

CCA
July 14th, 2006, 09:30 PM
Oh I forgot to mention what I liked is how they went back and told you what happend to the characters, and how they got there, going back to the battle and how they got out of that scenerio.

MasySyma
July 14th, 2006, 09:30 PM
I loved it! It was a fantastic season opener.

The final episode of Season 9 did not have a finale feel, and it reminded me of most SG-1 two parters because the second episode usually outshines the first due to exposition needed to set up the plot. In this case, all of Season 9 was the exposition for a fantastic opener to Season 10.

Vala's role was well developed, and her use of humor was fantastic. I enjoyed when she commanded her daughter not to destroy everyone while realizing that she would have no effect. Kids just don't respect their parents these days. :)

Her daughter is creepier than I expected her to be, and given the way the Ori are cheating, I find the use of the super-aging baby ok. At least she is more personable than Orlin. :) Maybe it's that whole I will destory you before playing barbies thing.

I agree that I found it interesting that Daniel would suggest killing a child. He has changed considerably, but given the situation and his knowledge of ascension, I think the change of character is warrented. Adria is similar to Anubis's clone in Prototype. Daniel acted as needed in that episode, so the future could be intersting. I loved the sequence as the prior arrives and Daniel pulls Vala to safety. The next meeting between Vala and her husband should prove interesting.

Overall, I thought it was a wonderful episode, and I look forward to the rest of season 10. The team is back and even a bit better.

I just have one other kind of rambly thought, for the folks saying that Season 9 sucked but 10 seems good so far, have you considered that 10 would make no sense without 9? Season 9 wasn't designed to be the best season of SG-1; it was designed to turn the show's direction, and like Season 6 it will be loved and hated; however, it is crucial to the show. :)

Ace
July 14th, 2006, 09:31 PM
I just want to say how much I love Bra'tac.... =)

The scenes on Chulak were great... especially the brief but very cool battle between the gliders and the Ori fighters.

Great scenes between Daniel and Vala; Lucian Alliance; All around a great episode if only to tie up loose ends from the cliffhanger

Ace

technoextreme
July 14th, 2006, 09:32 PM
"This isn't war! This is Pest Control!"

Talk about one sided! Regardless of what Sam said, this is much, much worse than when they first encountered the Goa'uld. Nothing they have thrown at the Ori have mattered in the slightest. They really need to find something, or the Ori are unstoppable.

"You are superior in only one respect... you are better at dying!"
Isn't it weird though because Daniel technically is proof that those ships have a weakness. He should not have been able to ring onto that ship because of the sheilds but aparently they do have something funky going on. Weird that they couldn't replicate the results but then again they might have beamed the weapon into the priors room for all we know or it could have just failed.

And seriously - who's sick of space? This isn't Andromeda! (by the way, where is the elusive new Doctor? Didn't see her at all tonight. Is anyone even paying attention anymore? Yeesh)
Well it is a show about space and planets in space. There isn't any other way to transport massive armadas besides space ships.

They're a Goa'uld knock-off! Pure and simple! They wish to convert by the millions. The Goa'uld wanted the same thing and Rosemary's Baby is obviously the Anti-Harseisis. How can the new season be cooler when the bad guy is just a weaker, less character-driven spin-off of the Goa'uld?? It's like Stargate: SG1 has become Starscape, and they're stealing Stargate SG1 characters and bad guys, and winding it all into one big crappy storyline! I mean...who's falling for this?? They've given you the same old Boston Cheesecake and are calling it Coconut Cream Pie! (does that make sense?)Well. I personally like bad guys that are a little less character driven because it sort of adds to the mystique. Also, the Goa'uld just wanted to use people as slaves and really didn't care how. Baal isn't walking around anymore saying he is a god and earthlings should worship them. He knew it was a charade the whole time. For all we know the Oris can actually be so deluded they actually believe they gods (They certainly have the power). Also, Andria's powers are probably that of everything we have seen of the ancients powers (Oneill using freaky mind device to hotzone virus person) rather than a Haresis.

captain jake
July 14th, 2006, 09:32 PM
It was pretty decent.

They did what was important; they found a way for Adria to be introduced, Vala to be rescued, and the next season to be set up. Everyone acted fairly well (even the two versions of Adria we saw), I thought.

I'm a little disappointed in the continuity. They completely forgot about the plan to dial out. Hopefully they'll explain in an episode or two why they couldn't. (I'd have it be something as simple as the new control crystal frying.)

Yes they did do what was imprortant but IMO they did a hell of alot more than that. They showed us a entire different side to the ori army as in the smaller space craft, weapons, and what not. Wasn't there 3?

Well sam was out of air and when she came back aboard and the beaming technology was offline. So they couldn't really do anything about it.

Nolamom
July 14th, 2006, 09:36 PM
Now the next big question, what is happening on Chulak? Are the free Jaffa being slaughtered or are they becoming followers of Origin?

Mitchell82
July 14th, 2006, 09:42 PM
I was a big fan of season 9 and had great hope for season 10. After watchin "Flesh and Blood" I was not disapointed. I thought the story was done very well. They pick up right after the battle from "Camelot". They did very well patching up the plot holes from the end of "Camelot". I was sad to see Ceckov go but it didn't detract from the episode. The added conflict of the Lucian Alliance and the Oddesy was well done. I was skeptical to the Adria storyline, butafter seeing the kid in action I couldn't wait to see more. I liked the conflict at Chulak and th internal conflict between us and Bratac. Daniel did a great job on the ship and the rescue was done well. After Daniel and Vala's escape when the team was finally together was an excellent moment and the lokk on everybodys face especially Cameron was priceless.
Story: 10/10
The acting was done very well by everybody including the child Adria she really made the character seem very evil. I had no problems at all with the acting everybody seems to work very well together.
Acting 10/10
I beleve they pulled out a great episode and used every character to their fullest potential. I do think they should have used Bratac and Teal'c a little bit more but all in all good job.
Charatcer use:9/10
Dialogue was verry good. I really liked the line that was "now the ori will apeal to the male population better" All the dialogue was done verry well.
Dialogue: 10/10
I've already stated that I thought the story was great so it should come as no surprise that I thought the writing was done verry well and have no complaints.
Writing: 10/10
I thought this episode was expertly directed and was very smooth from frame to fram and from each different point of view, and when they jumped from one part of the story to the other.
Directing: 10/10
I couldn't have done a better job with guest casting. Each guest star did his/her job very well and a huge pluss to the young actress that played Adria. Very well done by all parties excellent guest casting.
Guest casting: 10/10
As always the musical score was excellent and the music fit every scene and situation. The music was seamlesly fit in place very well great job.
Music: 10/10
Visual effects were verry good as always. In my opinion they deffinatly pulled out all the stops for this episode. Great effects couldn't belive my eyes.
Visual Effects: 10/10
The edditing was done very well. They stopped and started at just the right time and if they pulled anything out you sure couldn't tell. I brlieve it was verry well done.
Editing: 10/10
Costumes and makeup were expertly done. The Ori warrior armor is very good looking and it fit Daniel nice and well. The makeup on the Prior was very good and they did an excellent job on Adria.
Costumes and Makeup: 10/10
I have to say they pushed the envelope on budget on this one. I would have to say the overall production value is excellent. It is worth every penny.
Production Value: 10/10
In conclusion they did an excellent job with the contribution to character arcs they picked up where each characters story was finished last and satyed well to each character. I believe this was an excellent start for a new season. I was very pleased with every aspect of this story. I am looking forward to the rest of this season and all the action that is to come.
Overall: 10/10
This was an exellent episode and i hope everyone reading this will find it usefull.
Mitchell 82

Famous
July 14th, 2006, 09:54 PM
Great episode! Tied up all the loose ends from Camelot well, if a bit predictably. Adria was awesome, very creepy, very passionate with her arguement to Vala(the one where she's talking about the Ancients lying, blah blah, etc :P), creepy in parts, very nicely done. I'm really looking forward to Counterstrike so I can see Morena Baccarin as Adria....now that will be cool. Mitchell's conversation with Bra'tac was okay, but had potential to be a kind of emotional/touching moment, but wasn't well enough developed(I guess that's the word to use for it) enough to have that kind of feel, so that was somewhat disappointing, but there wasn't really time for that and it was alright as it was. The prior with the scar over one eye was cool, I think I may like him better than the prior that we saw alot of last season. Vala's line about Adria making Origin alot more appealing to the men of the galaxy was hilarious, too. Overall, very good episode, really looking forward to next week.

coolove
July 14th, 2006, 10:00 PM
My god, that episode was incredible. I've been rewatching it over and over and enjoy every part. I really enjoyed seeing Daniel and Vala interact once again. This was a great start to season 10 and now I can't wait to see what's instore for the rest of te season.

Commander Jumper
July 14th, 2006, 10:00 PM
Wonderful,

The Characters were used to their fullest, they were in Character and overall they all fit well into the story's plot. Speaking of plot I think the Episode was very well written, the lines were witty (like always) but when the time came, they became serious, it looks like the Writers (after ten long and certianly satisfying years) haven't lost thier touch. But I have to give some of the love to the wonderful actors/actresses on the show, they just do it so well. They were so in character. They truly must love doing this and being together because it translates so well on screen. And of course the visual effects were stunning, they were incredible. So well done I was in awe at how AWSOME it looked. THe cotumes were also great, (Especialy Michael's Armor with the fire reflecting off it ;)) The directors are my new best friends, they did so well. The music was beautiful, it really added to the drama, it has always brought this, I dunno, extra flavor to the show. With the actors, writing, directing, vis effects, ect. as the main and important ingreidients the music is that secret ingredient that gives it that extra kick. Over all I was impressed I'd say it was one of the best season openers I've seen, it was a truly fantastic expierience for me and I just want to say....if I could meet all the people who helped with the production of this episode I'd give them all big hugs and thank them emensly for a job well done.....

2ndgenerationalteran
July 14th, 2006, 10:07 PM
well atleast we know the crusader armor isnt like kull armor. our jaffa with hundreds of years experiance and hundred of generations of being artificially selected (opposed to natural selection) should give us an advantage to the ori crusaders. and we got some of their tech, little stunner

GreyFox
July 14th, 2006, 10:12 PM
The last scene in the ep was basically saying we're going back to our roots for this season. It looks to be good. Maybe like DS9 during the Domimon war good.


whoa now that's something to live up to.




best SG ep ever. it beat camelot easily. great space battles ownage cg. looks to be ownage for s10 cept maybe ep2 (judging from preview). anyway ownage ep.

i should've known that ori fighters would look nothing like jumpers. tho their core tech is similar to ancient tech (canon since adria named them that way) like doors for one.


anyone else really enjoy the brief goauld glider/alkesh vs ori fighters scene? man these sg1 eps will not leave my dvr

Nolamom
July 14th, 2006, 10:17 PM
best SG ep ever. it beat camelot easily. great space battles ownage cg. looks to be ownage for s10 cept maybe ep2 (judging from preview). anyway ownage ep.

Excuse me, but what the heck do you mean by "ownage"? Is that even a word?

starfox
July 14th, 2006, 10:22 PM
ownage - noun. The state of being so much cooler/just plain better than everyone and everything else that you pretty much own them.

Mesenet
July 14th, 2006, 10:24 PM
Hope springs eternal? F&B demonstrates the writers are taking the first steps towards putting SG-1 back on track! It definately had something for everyone to be excited about. I am happy to see what was missing in S9 - the development of team dynamics, was starting to gel. The bonus was Mitchell's character showing some endearing leadership quality.

On to ep2.

Nolamom
July 14th, 2006, 10:26 PM
*chuckle* okay, interesting definition. Highly doubtful, but I'll accept it.

GreyFox
July 14th, 2006, 10:28 PM
yes that

Dream-a-Little
July 14th, 2006, 10:31 PM
Ok, I really enjoyed this. Second half episodes are always burdened with a lot of housekeeping duties but this one managed to accomplish tying up all the loose ends and positioning them for the challenge ahead in a well paced fun way.

I loved the harder edged take on Mitchell here. The flashbacks showing how everyone got to where they ended up were cool. IMO, the Sam rescue was the highlight of the episode. Really, really great! And in the end we have our team faced with a very big and not easily solved problem on their hands. Should be fun watching them figure out together how to get out of it.

Mesenet
July 14th, 2006, 10:32 PM
Adria was awesome, very creepy,
snip I'm really looking forward to Counterstrike so I can see Morena Baccarin as Adria....now that will be cool.

Bravo to Casting for the contiutity in the girls playing Adria as far as likeness and those piercing hazel/light brown eyes.

NotAscended
July 14th, 2006, 10:41 PM
Ok, I really enjoyed this. Second half episodes are always burdened with a lot of housekeeping duties but this one managed to accomplish tying up all the loose ends and positioning them for the challenge ahead in a well paced fun way.

Indeed. They successfully tied up all the loose ends from the S9 closer and actually introduced us to a lot of new information and the new characters that will play a role in the coming season. I really liked the way they showed (rather than just tell) us how the Ori fighters launch a coordinated space and ground attack on a planet (looking forward to seeing more of that), got glimpses of the interior of the Ori ships, saw how ideologically formidable Adria is going to be, and I was seriously freaked out by that one-eyed Prior protecting Adria. The Ori are a much more serious foe than the Gouald were, and it's going to be so cool to see how SG-1 finds a way to combat them.

Nolamom
July 14th, 2006, 10:42 PM
Adria's contacts certainly helped in the creepiness factor. AND the fact that she was only hours old when she was espousing Ori stuff. One wonders how much attachment she felt for Vala as her mother and how much stronger was her attachment to the Ori. In the end, I believe that she would have eventually destroyed Vala as a non-believer, when she came into full posession of her power. Perhaps in another day or two when she got full grown.

Dromag67
July 14th, 2006, 10:48 PM
Adria's contacts certainly helped in the creepiness factor. AND the fact that she was only hours old when she was espousing Ori stuff. One wonders how much attachment she felt for Vala as her mother and how much stronger was her attachment to the Ori. In the end, I believe that she would have eventually destroyed Vala as a non-believer, when she came into full posession of her power. Perhaps in another day or two when she got full grown.


Yeah I wouldn't want to be around her when she became a teenager. :cameron:

Hatusu
July 14th, 2006, 11:24 PM
I thought it was a very good episode. It moved fast and had lots of space scenes. The episode had a lush feel and great special effects. They took care and spent some money on this one.I was surprised that I actually enjoyed the Vala character.

I wonder where I can buy those Ori linens? :P

GreyFox
July 14th, 2006, 11:29 PM
and the fact that they said that 6 beamed off the korolev before it blew. checkov is one maybe?

Dark Falcon
July 14th, 2006, 11:32 PM
WOW! An awesome start to the new season!! Well
worth the wait!!:D

First of all, THE PRODUCERS OF THIS SERIES DECEIVED US!
They said that we wouldn't get to see the interior of an Ori
ship until "Counter-Strike." Boy, were they wrong! I like the
Ori ship's interior, it has a dark, gothic feel to it.:cool:

Adria was indeed a creepy character, her ability to talk so
intelligently at a young age was just...disturbing, if you will.

The flashbacks of the Camelot battle really shocked me.
There is one unanswered question that I should ask:
Was Chekov one of the six people that was beamed aboard the
Odyssey? Hmm...an empty part of the plot. Guess he's
gone... (sigh)

One part that made me dance was the fact that, THE ORI HAVE
FIGHTERS AND WE GET TO SEE THEM IN THE FIRST EPISODE OF
THE NEW SEASON instead of A LINE IN THE SAND. YAY!!:cool:
The problem was that in this episode we don't get a good close-up
view of the fighters, but they appear to be oval shaped.

I can't believe that the Ori shields could even withstand a ship
collision...with a nuke! How will SG-1 survive this season?
My full review will be posted at the Fan Review. Post yours
today!

nyxlily
July 15th, 2006, 12:01 AM
First impression: It was good. Some very great lines.. but all the last minute precisely timed beaming that saved the day is a little too convenient.

Theme: YAY. I liked the theme, I must say. At least it's not all Mitchell montages. And did anyone else notice that the team going through the 'gate at the end was still just the 4 of them? Vala might have joined the SGC, but apparently SG1 is still SG1. Unless they just didn't have a clip where Vala joins them in walking up the ramp.

I also like Mitchell in this episode. I like him last season, but more because of his wacky sense of humor and his one-liners. I didn't take him seriously with the exception of a few episodes. In this one, he was a lot more.. I don't know, it was like the seriousness of the situation finally made him realize the peril they were in and he need to step up. I like serious Mitchell rather than wacky Mitchell but still love the humor.

Sam.. can you imagine thinking she was the only survivor of the battle and calling out for help for FOUR hours with air rapidly running out? She kept her head though and kept trying. I also like how she had complete faith in Daniel being alive, however remotely it might be, and willing to go after him despite the suicidal nature of the mission.

Teal'c.. I always have nothing to say, unfortunately :/ I like the character.. well, and he was willing to sacrifice himself to save his people. Well, not saving.. they knew they were out gunned and out numbered.. Okay, he was not willing to abandon his people.

Daniel! Daniel Daniel Daniel. How did he know which room Vala was in? Assuming how huge the ships are.. there must be a lot of levels plus hundreds of rooms. And what a coincidence that he ended up on her ship. I wonder why he was pointing a gun at her when he first saw her. And, of course, the infamous line: "I should've shot her when I had the chance." He went on to say that she wasn't a child, but an Ori in the body of a human. Was that enough justification for him to kill her? That really disturbs me. I will just keep telling myself that he hesitated at the crucial moment, despite what he said later. Hmm.. could this apparent callousness be part of what lead up to Daniel being a prior? I mean, he was willing to kill a child to stop the Ori. Who can say he will stop bending his morals and believes here. What is he willing to do to stop this new threat? Is there a line he is willing to cross?

Vala.. she's witty and not over the top like last season. The writers did mellow her out while keeping her snarkiness. I LOVED the banter between her and Daniel. There were no put downs or sexual innuendos (that I caught..). I loved the fact she was willing to lie and take advantage of her daughter's need for her approval to sway her from the Ori.

Adria was great. The first one, while the dialogues were obviously memorised lines, the way they shot her was really creepy. The way she looked held some ominous undertone. The second one I loved and wished we saw more of her.

I clapped when I saw Bra'tac, that's how much I adore the character. I was a little disappointed though that he, a seasoned warrior, failed to see the futility of the sucide run and willing to sacrifice not only himself, but his friends. I guess Teal'c must have shared his sentiment since it was Mitchell who had to talk to him, with no success.

Timed beaming: First with Teal'c. Bra'tac's forces would have killed him if not for the LAST SECOND beam. Miraculously fixed mere moments before the ship blew up. Second: Emmerson arrived at just the right moment to beam Bra'tac and SG1 off moments before the ship rammed into the Ori ship. Wow, more good timing. AND third: Daniel, seconds before the Prior was going to do what he was going to do.

Could the writers please limit such timing coincidences to at most one an episode?

Overall, I enjoyed the action, the sometimes over the top exposition (the beginning with the Prior spieling out what Adria represents), and the interactions of the characters. With the exception of Daniel (whom I absolutely adore), I like how the characters were protrayed. And I enjoy Daniel the majority of the time.. just the last line. I just can't get over it.

NotAscended
July 15th, 2006, 12:10 AM
I agree that I found it interesting that Daniel would suggest killing a child. He has changed considerably, but given the situation and his knowledge of ascension, I think the change of character is warrented. Adria is similar to Anubis's clone in Prototype. Daniel acted as needed in that episode, so the future could be intersting. I loved the sequence as the prior arrives and Daniel pulls Vala to safety. The next meeting between Vala and her husband should prove interesting.


It's interesting but not unsurprising that Daniel would feel that way about Adria. In addition to the experiences with Anubis' clone, Daniel is the only one who experienced the "vision" given to him by the Harsesis. He learned already that the only way to defeat that kind of inbred evil is to deny it completely, and it's pretty clear that Adria has already given into her inbred evil.

I also thought it was very cool that Daniel pulled Vala to safety, rather than grabbing Adria at that moment. However, his motivations were probably equal parts unwitting protectiveness of someone who is a friend (well, almost!) and saving the one person who might be able to get through to Adria.



What is Sam's job this season supposed to be exactly? I mean, her purpose? Everyone else seems to have a seasonal story arc all laid out by this first ep except her. Even Kvasir has some of her usual "saves the day" techniques in her place.

I think Sam is being set up in this episode to be the voice of hope for this season. As nyxlily pointed out in the post above, at the beginning of the episode, alone in space, calling for help, she stayed calm and trusted that help would come. She is the one who doesn't seem to doubt that Daniel is still alive, and goes with Bratac on what seems like a suicide mission. Then, like a bookend, at the end of the episode when Daniel and Cam are saying how dire the situation is, she is the one pointing out how at the beginning of the Stargate program, the Gouald seemed undefeatable, expressing optimism that this situation will look the same in retrospect.

For much of the series, Daniel has been the optimist on the team, but it's fairly clear that he has lost much of that optimism. I think Sam is now taking on that role and I expect that throughout the season, she will be the one who keeps the rest of the team going through dark times.

Edited to try to make coherent sentences.

michey
July 15th, 2006, 12:18 AM
I absolutely loved it!!!!!!!!!

Great to have Vala back, and see her interacting with Daniel, I loved how they showed Vala cared for her duaghter without trying to make her overly maternal and out of character.

Yey for Season 10!!!!

Agent_Dark
July 15th, 2006, 12:19 AM
The episode was pretty bland overall. Not crap, but certainly not great either. As far as season openers go it was pretty weak.

Also, wtf was up with Daniel? :S Korolev is blowing up and he doesn't attempt to save anyone by getting them into the rings? There were at least two people in that room with him... And their plan to capture Adria was to basically fool a near-ascenion being with all the knoweledge of the Ori that a human can take. Good plan Daniel...

Dani347
July 15th, 2006, 12:22 AM
I like serious Mitchell rather than wacky Mitchell but still love the humor.

I thought he was good.


He went on to say that she wasn't a child, but an Ori in the body of a human. Was that enough justification for him to kill her? That really disturbs me.

Eliminate the "in the body of a human." If he said he should have shot an Ori would that be unjustified?

the dancer of spaz
July 15th, 2006, 12:28 AM
Yeah, I was disappointed by this episode. Something was missing, and hopefully it will come to me when I watch it again. But, to me, this wasn't season premiere material.

The fracturing of the team was a big thing for me, and it looks like that trend is only going to continue so... great.

NotAscended
July 15th, 2006, 12:30 AM
Also, wtf was up with Daniel? :S Korolev is blowing up and he doesn't attempt to save anyone by getting them into the rings? There were at least two people in that room with him...

I wondered about that, too. It seemed very uncharacteristic. However, on the second watching, I realized that he had just told them to arm the nuclear bomb with a 5? second delay. When the ship was hit and the bomb rolled out of the rings, I think he realized or thought that the bomb was about to blow and knew he had only a few seconds to get out of there.

Of course, that explanation suggests that *we* might have accidentally blown up the Koralev ourselves, which is a horrible, horrible thought.

michey
July 15th, 2006, 12:30 AM
But I dont think she is just an ori in a human body, she has childlike feelings too, with the wish of getting her mothers approval

nyxlily
July 15th, 2006, 12:31 AM
Eliminate the "in the body of a human." If he said he should have shot an Ori would that be unjustified?

Regardless of its form, if it was a true Ori, I don't think ANY of the team would have hesitated. Their enemy IS the Ori. During the fight with the Goa'ulds, they would have killed them with no second thought, but they'd have tried their hardest to save the host. Daniel did NOT think twice about shooting that tank full of INFANT Goa'ulds in the beginning of the series. The Ori is taking over their galaxy through bloodshed, so yes, it would be justified.

Adria is human though (with Ori knowledge) and that's a borderline moral issue that has yet to be explored. Is she innocent because the Ori did this to her? Or is she really an Ori, just human biologically, like Daniel said?

All in my opinion and observation, of course :D And everything is written for the express purpose of debate!

ETA: Thanks to above poster! I totally forgot that childlike aspect of her. So, she also has emotions to that of a human child. Really.. the more I think about it the more complicated it gets.. How can Daniel explain away those feelings Adria felt for Vala?

NotAscended
July 15th, 2006, 12:43 AM
Adria is human though (with Ori knowledge) and that's a borderline moral issue that has yet to be explored. Is she innocent because the Ori did this to her? Or is she really an Ori, just human biologically, like Daniel said?

All in my opinion and observation, of course :D And everything is written for the express purpose of debate!

Great point: what is Adria or what could she be? It's clear that at this point she isn't truly an Ori, because she is still gaining knowledge about them and growing. When full grown, will she actually possess all the knowledge of the Ori, or just some part of it--specifically, the part they want her to know and promulgate.

I think there will also be the question of whether she will eventually have free will. Right now, she doesn't seem to have any. She's just reacting to the knowledge flooding her mind or reacting on instinct (healing Vala's pain and then saving her mother). It's yet to be seen if when she is grown whether she will choose to continue to do evil if and when she realizes she can control her own actions.

nyxlily
July 15th, 2006, 12:46 AM
It's interesting but not unsurprising that Daniel would feel that way about Adria. In addition to the experiences with Anubis' clone, Daniel is the only one who experienced the "vision" given to him by the Harsesis. He learned already that the only way to defeat that kind of inbred evil is to deny it completely, and it's pretty clear that Adria has already given into her inbred evil.

That's a good comparison. The only thing is that the clone was fully grown while Adria was born and was briefly a child -Who needed her mother's approval (which, I have to say again, Vala took advantage of!). You're right though.. she seems inherently evil.. when Vala asked why she was slaughtering all those Jaffa, she didn't bat an eye. So, would it have been all right if Daniel HAD killed her? She's evil but childlike. Ahh! The moral issues! I would love it if the writers explore that more.


For much of the series, Daniel has been the optimist on the team, but it's fairly clear that he has lost much of that optimism. I think Sam is now taking on that role and I expect that throughout the season, she will be the one who keeps the rest of the team going through dark times.


Great observation! If nothing else, seeing Sam being the support for the team would be nice. Daniel could still be the moral center (though, who knows now.. argh! I wish he never said that last line!) but I can totally see Sam being the emotional support as well as voice of hope.

Dani347
July 15th, 2006, 12:51 AM
Regardless of its form, if it was a true Ori, I don't think ANY of the team would have hesitated. Their enemy IS the Ori. During the fight with the Goa'ulds, they would have killed them with no second thought, but they'd have tried their hardest to save the host. Daniel did NOT think twice about shooting that tank full of INFANT Goa'ulds in the beginning of the series. The Ori is taking over their galaxy through bloodshed, so yes, it would be justified.

Adria is human though (with Ori knowledge) and that's a borderline moral issue that has yet to be explored. Is she innocent because the Ori did this to her? Or is she really an Ori, just human biologically, like Daniel said?

All in my opinion and observation, of course :D And everything is written for the express purpose of debate!


But, it seems from her conversation with Vala, that she's not a regular child that they put Ori knowledge in. She was created by the Ori, her entire genetic makeup is Ori. They just chose a human vessel to put it in, because that way they could slip past the Ancients. But, it's not a human vessel like a regular human. I mean, they didn't take a little girl and put their knowledge in. They created a humanform creature whose genetic makeup was Ori.

But, I don't understand if it's not problematic for Daniel to have killed infant Goa'uld's, when he didn't know that they had the knowledge of the Goa'uld in them at the time, and arguably might have had some good in them, why is Adria different? She's the enemy, it's clear she does have the knowledge of the Ori, she's ready to kill.

It seems her connection to Vala isn't because she loves her, but because she thinks she can change her mind.

mburrows
July 15th, 2006, 12:55 AM
i loved this one, i cant tell in the beginning though, did the 2 new lucian alliance ships destroy the main one or what? lol


and the small little engangment of the ori fighters vs alkesh and gliders seemed too much like what happened in antartica so didnt think it was that inventive, but all in all it was a great episode, the kid adria could SO be the next chucky lol

Dani347
July 15th, 2006, 12:58 AM
That's a good comparison. The only thing is that the clone was fully grown while Adria was born and was briefly a child -Who needed her mother's approval (which, I have to say again, Vala took advantage of!). You're right though.. she seems inherently evil.. when Vala asked why she was slaughtering all those Jaffa, she didn't bat an eye. So, would it have been all right if Daniel HAD killed her? She's evil but childlike. Ahh! The moral issues! I would love it if the writers explore that more.


See, I'm not sure if she does need Vala's approval. She needs Vala's acceptance, which would mean accepting the Ori, which is what they need, because that's how they get power. And, is it because she's a child? If she were a full grown woman, would that be different? Was it shocking when Daniel said Khalek should be killed?

Probably totally bogus argument, but lets say the enemy was a shape shifter. Its still evil, but if it takes the body of a grown up, it's okay to kill, but if it takes the body of a child, the killing is called in question?



Great observation! If nothing else, seeing Sam being the support for the team would be nice. Daniel could still be the moral center (though, who knows now.. argh! I wish he never said that last line!) but I can totally see Sam being the emotional support as well as voice of hope.

He's said that line or variations before. Khalek, Apophis (and Apophis had an actual host, and I don't think Daniel was thinking of the host when he threatened to kill him).

That could be why the Ori decided to manufacture a human in child form. People have different feelings in someone who looks and acts like a child. They seem innocent. Vala would feel some kind of attachment and might try to persuade others that Adria is her child and all that motherly stuff. Even with the rapid growth, there was enough time to bond. And, the Ori know that Vala knows Daniel, so she could tell him that Adria started out as a child, and that would get the rest of SG1 knowing, which would possibly let their guards down, even when she grows up, because you might imagine a fully formed adult being evil, but if you have the memory of someone being a child, it brings up ideas of innocence.

nyxlily
July 15th, 2006, 01:04 AM
But, it seems from her conversation with Vala, that she's not a regular child that they put Ori knowledge in. She was created by the Ori, her entire genetic makeup is Ori. They just chose a human vessel to put it in, because that way they could slip past the Ancients. But, it's not a human vessel like a regular human. I mean, they didn't take a little girl and put their knowledge in. They created a humanform creature whose genetic makeup was Ori.

Perhaps that's the reasoning he used to justify wanting to kill her when he had the chance.


But, I don't understand if it's not problematic for Daniel to have killed infant Goa'uld's, when he didn't know that they had the knowledge of the Goa'uld in them at the time, and arguably might have had some good in them, why is Adria different? She's the enemy, it's clear she does have the knowledge of the Ori, she's ready to kill.
I don't remember when they discovered the Goa'ulds pass down memories genetically, but if he killed them thinking they could be innocent.. then I guess it's not such a moral leap for him to kill Adria in order to stop the Ori at all cost. The thing still unclear, for me, is whether Adria possess ANY human qualities, and of a child, at that. Could Daniel be sure she's really just an Ori?


It seems her connection to Vala isn't because she loves her, but because she thinks she can change her mind.

I think she does need, and love, Vala. She was not hesitating on condemning thousands of innocents for not believing in Origin -she was pretty cool about the slaughters going on outside. Yet, she is still trying to convince Vala and the fact she is taking the time, personally, in getting her mother to her way of thinking, shows more than mere conversion of yet another random human being.

Lord Shiva
July 15th, 2006, 01:05 AM
That was actually very entertaining if you overlook the implausibility of all that convenience beaming, particularly that last one with Daniel and Vala. Why would they drop their shields unless they intended to let them go.

They were sending out Crusaders into the cities to slaughter the Jaffa, you can't really send out ground troops with your shields up.

Lord Shiva
July 15th, 2006, 01:19 AM
I absolutely loved this episode - and it continues the fantastic storytelling that has given us the Ori arc which started with season 9 (yes, big fan of season 9 and I can tell I will dig 10 as well!). For those who debate if this is the Daniel we know and love because he would consider killing a child - please remember what he's gone through! The 8 years at the SGC, his Ascention, Desecention, near Ascention again all led him to become a little darker, more sarcastic person in season 9. This sarcasm and darkness continues into season 10 - its an evolution of the character, whether you like it or not. Heck, if I had lost my chance for Ascention not once, but twice, I'd be slightly bitter too!

nyxlily
July 15th, 2006, 01:21 AM
And, is it because she's a child? If she were a full grown woman, would that be different? Was it shocking when Daniel said Khalek should be killed?

Probably totally bogus argument, but lets say the enemy was a shape shifter. Its still evil, but if it takes the body of a grown up, it's okay to kill, but if it takes the body of a child, the killing is called in question?
Not bogus at all! That reminded me of Reese. She was an adult with the emotions of a child.. and she controlled the replicators. While she herself was not evil, she was emotionally unstable and on the verge of loosing control of the replicators. Daniel was -convinced- he could save her despite being overrun by those bugs. Was Jack justified in killing her? Would Daniel really have tried to continue to reason with her at the risk of endangering Earth? Could he have pulled the trigger if it was up to him? I think I would question any death involving a child, even in that of an adult body.

It very well could be my sympathies in Adria being a child, because I thought killing Khalek WAS acceptable. Would I have felt the same way if he said that of an adult Adria? Even I'm questioning myself :D



That could be why the Ori decided to manufacture a human in child form. People have different feelings in someone who looks and acts like a child. They seem innocent. Vala would feel some kind of attachment and might try to persuade others that Adria is her child and all that motherly stuff. Even with the rapid growth, there was enough time to bond. And, the Ori know that Vala knows Daniel, so she could tell him that Adria started out as a child, and that would get the rest of SG1 knowing, which would possibly let their guards down, even when she grows up, because you might imagine a fully formed adult being evil, but if you have the memory of someone being a child, it brings up ideas of innocence.

I think that's the bottom line. People react to the death of a child radically different to that of an adult. If I know for sure Adria does not contain one shred of humanity, I think Daniel is right in wanting to shoot her. But, I just don't know.

nyxlily
July 15th, 2006, 01:27 AM
The 8 years at the SGC, his Ascention, Desecention, near Ascention again all led him to become a little darker, more sarcastic person in season 9. This sarcasm and darkness continues into season 10 - its an evolution of the character, whether you like it or not. Heck, if I had lost my chance for Ascention not once, but twice, I'd be slightly bitter too!

I loved how they develope Daniel throughout the years. I liked the changes in him and the fact he can't stay naive forever.. but the -essential- Daniel has not changed. He was the moral compass and conscience of the team and I don't think he's changed in that respect. However, the thought of him killing a child crosses many a boundary. That's the debate anyway, whether Adria really is a human child (came standard with Ori knowledge:D)or a true Ori in human form, in which case yes, Daniel should have killed her.. despite my misgiving that she was in the form of a child.

And he chose NOT to ascend. He went back to his plane of existance by his own choice. If he's bitter about anything, it's the fact that Ascension is not what he expected.

Dani347
July 15th, 2006, 01:33 AM
Perhaps that's the reasoning he used to justify wanting to kill her when he had the chance.

Okay, this is probably me reading you wrong, but that sounds like he didn't say he should have shot her because he felt it was the necessary thing to do, but that he has this bloodthirst and is trying to find an excuse for it.



I don't remember when they discovered the Goa'ulds pass down memories genetically, but if he killed them thinking they could be innocent.. then I guess it's not such a moral leap for him to kill Adria in order to stop the Ori at all cost. The thing still unclear, for me, is whether Adria possess ANY human qualities, and of a child, at that. Could Daniel be sure she's really just an Ori?

Well, Vala did say the Ori created a human form child with their knowledge. It sounds like an Ori clone. But, did you have the same reservations about Prototype? Both Khalek and Adria were created by the enemy.

Dani347
July 15th, 2006, 01:38 AM
I absolutely loved this episode - and it continues the fantastic storytelling that has given us the Ori arc which started with season 9 (yes, big fan of season 9 and I can tell I will dig 10 as well!). For those who debate if this is the Daniel we know and love because he would consider killing a child - please remember what he's gone through! The 8 years at the SGC, his Ascention, Desecention, near Ascention again all led him to become a little darker, more sarcastic person in season 9. This sarcasm and darkness continues into season 10 - its an evolution of the character, whether you like it or not. Heck, if I had lost my chance for Ascention not once, but twice, I'd be slightly bitter too!


Ascension is something Daniel found wasn't worth it. He didn't lose it. And, he didn't think Adria should be killed (because it did seem like he thought that she needed to be, not out of any particular personal desire to kill her) because he was bitter. It's not like he was saying, "Life sucks and I'm p*ssed off. Might as well take it out on this kid."

Dani347
July 15th, 2006, 01:44 AM
Not bogus at all! That reminded me of Reese. She was an adult with the emotions of a child.. and she controlled the replicators. While she herself was not evil, she was emotionally unstable and on the verge of loosing control of the replicators. Daniel was -convinced- he could save her despite being overrun by those bugs. Was Jack justified in killing her? Would Daniel really have tried to continue to reason with her at the risk of endangering Earth? Could he have pulled the trigger if it was up to him? I think I would question any death involving a child, even in that of an adult body.


I don't think Reese had any idea that the replicators were killing. They were just toys to her. (But, now, I'm thinking I might be wrong on that score). Adria may not think the Ori are evil (but for that matter, neither do the Ori. ) but she is aware that they're killing and she's okay with that. Like Vala said, she's complicit. Strike this if Reese was shown to know and understand that the replicators were killing.

nyxlily
July 15th, 2006, 01:45 AM
Okay, this is probably me reading you wrong, but that sounds like he didn't say he should have shot her because he felt it was the necessary thing to do, but that he has this bloodthirst and is trying to find an excuse for it.

Eep, definitely didn't mean to come across that way. I meant that Daniel would be right in killing Adria if she truly is just an Ori in human form, like he originally said. His action -would- be necessary, in that case. I would NEVER, EVER think for a second that Daniel could kill for bloodlust. No matter what! Unless the writers write him that way, at which point I'll forget that episode plus any future ones exists and live in my own little Danny world.

And with that, one call tell I'm in dire need of sleep. Good night all : D

BigBadBob
July 15th, 2006, 01:45 AM
i saw part of the eipsode. I must say, it seems better than last year so far (after only 1 ep, you can't really tell).

Agent_Dark
July 15th, 2006, 01:47 AM
I don't think Reese had any idea that the replicators were killing. They were just toys to her. (But, now, I'm thinking I might be wrong on that score). Adria may not think the Ori are evil (but for that matter, neither do the Ori. ) but she is aware that they're killing and she's okay with that. Like Vala said, she's complicit. Strike this if Reese was shown to know and understand that the replicators were killing.
Reese seemed to understand that they were defending her. Considering she knew what happened last time her 'toys' defended her (ie destroyed all life on her home planet), I'd say she knew what was happening.

nyxlily
July 15th, 2006, 01:50 AM
Ascension is something Daniel found wasn't worth it. He didn't lose it. And, he didn't think Adria should be killed (because it did seem like he thought that she needed to be, not out of any particular personal desire to kill her) because he was bitter. It's not like he was saying, "Life sucks and I'm p*ssed off. Might as well take it out on this kid."

lol, that last bit amused me!

And I think I can come to terms with this whole thing. You said it wonderfully: He thought she needed to be [killed].

That puts my mind at ease.. somewhat. Now, where will he draw the line at what needs to be done? Would he cross any moral boundaries in order to put a stop to the Ori?

Okay, really.. I need sleep now!

Dani347
July 15th, 2006, 01:55 AM
Reese seemed to understand that they were defending her. Considering she knew what happened last time her 'toys' defended her (ie destroyed all life on her home planet), I'd say she knew what was happening.


In that case, strike my post on that. I was going from memory.

JanusAncient
July 15th, 2006, 01:56 AM
People clearly see the Ori as being evil, but not the humans of Stargate Command. They're willing to wipe out the Ori, or at least try, in order to survive, and if the Ori are telling the truth, all that they are trying to is survive as well. Adria was right, the Ancient's keep the basic truth about human existence from them. They don't share their knowledge, the Ori do. This I still think is my problem. If the Ori are never going to allow their followers to ascend, why create Prior's, Doci, Ori-ci, why give all of this knowledge, move them further down the road to ascension, if they will never be able to ascend? To be worshipped they don't need Prior's, monks will do just fine, but no monks are trained to become Prior's I believe the reason they created Adria as she is, is to give her time to adjust to the knowledge in her mind. Because, as evil as you think the Ori are, they aren't looking for sympathy, so there's no need to pull an Orlin, if you don't believe in them, they simply destroy you, end of discussion. It's my opinion that the Ori really believe that they are doing, all that they are doing, to ensure their survival.

Dani347
July 15th, 2006, 01:59 AM
That puts my mind at ease.. somewhat. Now, where will he draw the line at what needs to be done? Would he cross any moral boundaries in order to put a stop to the Ori?

I guess to answer that, it would be necessary to define what his moral boundaries are, and see if he acts differently from them.


Okay, really.. I need sleep now!

You are getting sleeepy. Verrry sleeepy.

kmwhite
July 15th, 2006, 02:12 AM
I'm a big fan of what limited work the actress has already done, and I can't wait to see her in this role. :teyla: :cameron:

What I've seen: ...
Firefly's Morena Baccarin joins Stargate-SG1:
Baccarin will play Adria, the evil daughter of Vala Mal Doran (Claudia Black, who becomes a regular on the series for the 10th season)

http://television.aol.com/tv-celebrity-interviews/amanda-tapping

YES! :cameron: At least I know the girl is capable of acting. The child frightens me. Those eyes scare me the most. Like the stuff nightmares are made of... however, the episode was great. I'd also like to point out, I tried checking this page inbetween the two premiers, and it crashed my browser. o_O; I think I'm happy on page whatever...


lol, that last bit amused me!

And I think I can come to terms with this whole thing. You said it wonderfully: He thought she needed to be [killed].

That puts my mind at ease.. somewhat. Now, where will he draw the line at what needs to be done? Would he cross any moral boundaries in order to put a stop to the Ori?

Okay, really.. I need sleep now!

It's been pointed out that he acts as a moral compass to the crew, but let's look at the whole thing. Kill a child, save the galaxy? I think that with the lives of all the people he loves he'd do it, but I don't know that it'll actually come to that (read Prior [semi-pun intended] spoiler).

Dan2k
July 15th, 2006, 02:28 AM
A good episode, not the best though.

Creepy eyes on Adria, looks like she'll become an interesting character. Could be an interesting story to develop. Can't wait to see more of it.

Beaming out in the last second is getting very old. How many god damn times can you do it (in an episode)?! And why didn't they tell Bra'tac that Teal'c was onboard one of the ships when they started firing on them? Doesn't seem like the smartest idea to kill Teal'c just to scare the Lucian Alliance away.

Speaking of Teal'c, did he get a hair cut? Nice service on the Lucian Alliance's ships, in the heat of battle get a hair cut for free. They sould try it out more often.

I suppose the the writers hadn't decided whether to save Chekov or not when this episode was written, thus saying that six people got of the ship. I'll guess we'll see in a later episode.

Oh and I hate that they can't have some acknowledgement between the shows, in SG-1 they wanted to move the ZPM from Atlantis to earth to defend from the Ori and in Atlantis they wanted it moved because of the Wraith. They didn't even bother to mention about the problem the other series have.

kmwhite
July 15th, 2006, 02:39 AM
Speaking of Teal'c, did he get a hair cut? Nice service on the Lucian Alliance's ships, in the heat of battle get a hair cut for free. They sould try it out more often.

I suppose the the writers hadn't decided whether to save Chekov or not when this episode was written, thus saying that six people got of the ship. I'll guess we'll see in a later episode.

Oh and I hate that they can't have some acknowledgement between the shows, in SG-1 they wanted to move the ZPM from Atlantis to earth to defend from the Ori and in Atlantis they wanted it moved because of the Wraith. They didn't even bother to mention about the problem the other series have.

I really have to agree with you about the acknowledgements between the shows. Between the spoiler you mentioned, and the alternate crew from s9, i don't even know who has the damn thing..

As far as Chekov goes, I've actually grown fond of the character, and hope he was one of the six, and besides, that would be REALLY bad PR with Russia , so I think he was saved.;)

As far as Teal'c goes, has his head gotten larger or is it just me? Might be the hair, but he seems like his cheeks and neck are wider. Looks a little more intimidating. Probably just from working out, the man is huge...

Avatar28
July 15th, 2006, 03:21 AM
All in all an excellent episode and a nice followup from Camelot. I'm really excited about the implication made in the final scene. Still there were a few things that bugged me.

What happened to Kvasir's ship? He was there fighting the Ori and the next thing he's aboard the Odyssey trying to get the beaming back up. Why couldn't he fly his ship around picking up survivors (or just beam them whereever) and pick up Sam.
Likewise, why did Cam have to scoop Sam up in the hangar bay. He had an F302. Wouldn't it have made more sense to manuver it slowly out there to let her grab on? One would think it would almost surely have some sort of attitude thrusters since you would need them to help manuver in space and for landing procedures.

There were a couple of othes but I can't think of them at the moment. Lack of sleep and all that.

Skythe
July 15th, 2006, 03:47 AM
Overall a good episode; my only strife was with bratac; the fact that mitchell had the foresight to put the transmitter on him and not tell him and bratac trying to kill all of them just to destroy one ori ship seemed very out of character. I kept waiting for bratac to like pull off a mask and reveal himself as an ori or go SUPRISE! the ori brainwashed me!. But yeah.. Overall quite impressive.

AutumnDream
July 15th, 2006, 04:06 AM
That was good. And by good I mean totally sweet.

A) The scene with Daniel and Vala was roflcakes.
B) Vala is awesome. Took me until Crusade to start liking her though. :D
C) What's with Amanda Tapping? Lately her portrayal of Sam is so much different. It's not bad, but it doesn't even remind me of the Sam from previous years. Anywhere from the Sam in Singularity to the Sam in Window of Opportunity, to even the one in something recent like Threads. Zomg? What's going on? I miss "old" Sam.
D) OMG BRATAC DON'T GO ALL CRAZYJUICE ON US NOW!
E) I loooooooooooove Adria. So cool. I can't wait to see "Inara" playing her.
F) The storyline is getting so good. That would be so cool if it turned out the Ori weren't actually lying about the Ancient. But I <3 the Ancients.
G) Omg. I think Mr.Russian commander guy is dead. ; _ ;
H) Poor Chulak. D:! I never really liked that planet anyway.

kazzyk
July 15th, 2006, 04:10 AM
For me it was boring and I really really dislike the Ori as the new bad guys.

shockwave
July 15th, 2006, 04:14 AM
great episode
excellent season opener, ditto for SGA

liked the line where Vala said she named Adria after her stepmom, ***** of a woman

Tayla Rain
July 15th, 2006, 04:38 AM
The hallmark of a good episode is when its over you go ??? already??? which I did :), really enjoyed it and have high hopes the rest of the season will be as good or better

The_Gate_Builder
July 15th, 2006, 05:15 AM
Awesome episode, flawless (besides no explaniation of the asgard ship).

Sela
July 15th, 2006, 05:20 AM
I think it was a fairly good episode. The opening with Mitchell was very nice. Very grim which set the tone for the show. Mitchell was a lot more serious than we've seen him Not sure if that's good or bad. Vala was more toned down. That's definately a good thing. I almost like her now. Sam - where were you? Missed her pulling a solution out of the air. Teal'c - love the hair.

Loved seeing 'Brae' again. Always a pleasure to see him and Teal'c together. I was thrown off a bit by him wanting to make a suicide run. That didn't soound like him at all. Also as someone said before, I'm surprised he didn't deck Mitchell for getting in the way of that. Wonder how that relationship is going to play out. Will Brae ever trust him again? Will Teal'c? Hmmm...interesting.

I would have liked to see more about the child, her development and the effect that it had on Vala and those around her. It seemed to me that Vala got used to the idea of her growing faster pretty quickly. I'm sorry, but I think the whole maternal instinct thing is overplayed in sci-fi. No women I know, myself included, would feel too maternal about being used as an alien incubator. And every time the kid grew a size, I would at least be startled (more like freaked all the way out) as opposed to taking it in stride and trying to scold it for wanting it to destroy humanity. :) I do have to give much credit to whoever cast the youngest of the girls - she was amazing. Creeped me right out. All of the girls were very good, but the youngest really set the tone. Makes me really want to see more of her later.

Daniel did well this episode. I, for one, thought it was entirely in character for Daniel to want to take out the child. Daniel has been through a lot in these last ten years. He's learned a lot and seen a lot and he's grown a lot. I believe he's still the moral center of the team, but we have to remember that we're not talking about a human child. She's an enemy weapon. We're talking a creature designed to do one thing - destroy humanity. I understand Daniel feeling like they need to take her out while they still can. Sometimes, it has to be done and he was in the position to do it, so he needed to take his best shot. Not a popular opinion, I know, but I am a Jack O'Neill fan. :jack: You do what needs to be done.

Loved the set design, the lighting and the abundance of color on the Ori ship. Very rich looking set, lots of detail, loved the costumes. Vala was gorgeous - that's her look. Much more so than the dominatrix leather outfits.

Loved the design of the Ori ships. Much more of an elegant design than the ships we've seen in SG-1 so far.

Overall, I give it an seven out of ten.

Col. Shadow Quinn
July 15th, 2006, 05:24 AM
I wondered about that, too. It seemed very uncharacteristic. However, on the second watching, I realized that he had just told them to arm the nuclear bomb with a 5? second delay. When the ship was hit and the bomb rolled out of the rings, I think he realized or thought that the bomb was about to blow and knew he had only a few seconds to get out of there.

Of course, that explanation suggests that *we* might have accidentally blown up the Koralev ourselves, which is a horrible, horrible thought.

There is the possibility that we blew up the Korelev but the main explosion was the Ori weapon. Hey, remember the ship that attacked the Hatak from above, ther was funny. A really thought there was going to be a scene where Ori soldiers and Jaffa have a ground battle. Plus, I also hoped that we would destroy 3/4 of the Ori ships with the Odyssey. Anybody record the episodes of SG! and SGA, please email them to me if one of you did, because I would put it on Youtube.com for people to watch. I have an account on Youtube.

Cameron Mitchel
July 15th, 2006, 05:30 AM
Awesome episode, flawless (besides no explaniation of the asgard ship).
It was destroyed. Landry or someone said it got torn thru as well.

llama
July 15th, 2006, 05:40 AM
It was destroyed. Landry or someone said it got torn thru as well.

oooooo tought break for the asgard

Oranos
July 15th, 2006, 05:53 AM
I loved this episode and felt it was a great way to open season 10. It did, however, leave some unanswered questions...
Who beamed off the Korolev and where? Was Chekov one of them? Why didn't the Jaffa explosive thing go off? What kind of damage did the ship do when it crashed into the Ori shield? What will come of this apparent "weakness" in the Ori shield when they fire their beam weapon?
Did I just miss some of these or were they all left unanswered...:S


It was destroyed. Landry or someone said it got torn thru as well.
Landy said the entire fleet was torn apart including the Odyssey. It's because they had a lack of information and no communication from the fleet. They were all presumed destroyed. This, however, was not the case. The Odyssey and a Lucian Alliance ship survived the battle. The Asgard ship may have been destroyed or it may have fled. We never saw either way. Hey, another question for my unanswered list...

Farscapefan
July 15th, 2006, 05:54 AM
I do have to give much credit to whoever cast the youngest of the girls - she was amazing. Creeped me right out. All of the girls were very good, but the youngest really set the tone. Makes me really want to see more of her later.


From SciFi's blog by Alex Levine: "Here’s a little known fact about this show: the youngest of the children who plays Adria (the Orici) is none other than Robert C. Cooper’s daughter, Emma. She replaced a young actress who gave a great audition but froze on the day of the shooting."

valaCB
July 15th, 2006, 05:57 AM
Stargate isn't Farscape. I need more emotional scenes to be satisfied. Most of the episode bored me.
OK, Claudia. Some scenes she was fantastic and one or two i didn't like.
The ones i like : she was AMAZING in the delivery scene and the falling scene by Tomin's shooting. She was funny; In one scene when she asked Adria, why is she sitting in the dark, i was LOL!!! :vala: and i really liked Vala/Adria conversation, very interesting and well played. This kid actress is very good.

What i didn't like about our lovely Claudia: The one after the delivery, when they take Adria and Vala want to hold her was forced or not deliver right and when she meet Daniel in the first time was the conversation was too long and you can see that Claudia really wasn't into the scene by her body language all together i could feel the great chemistry between these two :) .

Cam, don't like Ben's acting at all. Like season 9 he continue to annoy me...and also something about his voice :S . But Ben will be in all 20 episode, so i guess i'll have to use to it.

Amanda was fantastic as always but, you know, she knows her character for 10 years now, so it was easy for her.
Like Chris's acting ability in this episode and Michael was amazing as well, he is a great actor IMO and sweet ;)

It was sooo weird to see all the 5 characters in the end of the episode. I mean...Vala, what are you doing in SG!??? I'll get use to that i guess.

I like the Vala/Tomin kissing :D

that's it,
can't remember more

Sela
July 15th, 2006, 05:59 AM
From SciFi's blog by Alex Levine: "Here’s a little known fact about this show: the youngest of the children who plays Adria (the Orici) is none other than Robert C. Cooper’s daughter, Emma. She replaced a young actress who gave a great audition but froze on the day of the shooting."
Really?! Wow. I'm even more impressed with her coming in at the last minute. She did nail that part. Totally freaked me out.

Get that girl an agent. ;)

Jace021903
July 15th, 2006, 06:00 AM
I enjoyed it a lot.

The energy level was high, the story was good and the baby made a lot more sense than I thought it would. :) And the little actresses did a good job especially the middle girl.

I loved all the characters tonight. I especially liked that they cared about what was happening to their teammates.

I thought Carter's rescue was cool--what can I say? I had to laugh when she was telling them just why it wouldn't work as they were doing it. :sam:

This toned-down Vala has more depth but still enough spunk to make her enjoyable. Claudia Black adds so much to the dialogue just by her inflection and body langage. My favorite part was her "lecture" to Adria about not being allowed to go marauding through the galaxy, Young Lady. And of course, she and MS have such great chemistry.

I really liked Cam; he's back to the likable guy from the first few episodes of season 9.

Poor Teal'c getting tortured again (((:tealc:))) I not sure about the hair yet.

Daniel has come such a long way as a character--resourceful and able to take care of himself. Would he have been able to kill child Adria? It sort of harkens back to his killing of the baby snakes in season one and he was a lot less cynical back then.

I don't really have any nitpicks. I was entertained and that's the important part for me. :)

I'm Just Sayin'
July 15th, 2006, 06:01 AM
I thought the episode was okay. Better than most of Season 9. I didn't keep looking at the clock wondering when it was going to be over like I did last season. Still not as good as most eps seasons 2-7 IMO. I can rewatch many eps over and over from earlier seasons. I don't think this will be the case with F & B.

Loved the girls that protrayed Adria - I think they did an excellent job.

I agree that something seems to be a little off with Sam's character. She seems to have lost her "toughness". There's more that's different - I just can't quite put my finger on it.

I wish Teal'c was still bald. I hate the hair.

Col. Shadow Quinn
July 15th, 2006, 06:18 AM
It was especially funny when Daniel stunned Adria and Tomin, so humorous. Suicidal Bra'tac was kind of funny. I was hoping to have some proof that Odyssey would destroy the Lucian Alliance ships, that would be cool.

Major Gambit
July 15th, 2006, 06:20 AM
Awesome episode, flawless (besides no explaniation of the asgard ship).


it was probably destroyed

yaaayoubetcha
July 15th, 2006, 06:21 AM
They're a Goa'uld knock-off! Pure and simple!

Well of course. It's what the writers know and it's what the show is about as far as villainy is concerned. The gate was always a Chariots of the Gods kinda thing and they were always investigating/comparing/debunking.

It surprised me that they spent so much time on Ba'al on Earth (though I rather like it and wish they'd do more with it) before presenting a new God enemy to be dealt with.

The SG-1 team has always been about proving to the believers that their belief is false. Now it's peasants rather than Jaffa. Only this time they're not wasting 4 - 5 seasons getting to big battle.

Col. Shadow Quinn
July 15th, 2006, 06:36 AM
it really enlightened me to know how Daniel and Mitchell survived. I hereby call Daniel a coward fow not helping those other 2 people. The Odyssey had alot of people onboard that was interesting, not often, you see a jaffa on an Earth vessel besides Teal'c. Vala could've beaten Adria you know, but maybe that wouldn't go so well. Tomin was a complete ass, Daniel could've shot him with his M9 Beretta and Adria too. I have no qualms about the idea of Daniel shooting Adria. Adria looks like a child but has the mental capacity of an evil genius. Tomin is a complete bubble head about Vala's true life. I was hoping to see an Ori ship explode too.

Ugly Pig
July 15th, 2006, 06:40 AM
Season 10, yay! Unlike last year, when I feared the changes (although I ended up enjoying it), I've been very excitedly awaiting this season. And now it's here! :D


PIGGY'S USELESS OPINION
of 'Flesh and Blood'
Well, that kicked ass. Suspense throughout the whole episode. Our new villain Adria, although she's still just a kid, came across as a genuine threat. Pretty good acting on her part, too, at least the older two versions. It's going to be interesting to see the character after she's fully grown.

Random Observations!
- The opening sequence was (obviously) slightly changed from last year in order to fit Claudia Black's credit in, but aside from that I believe there was also some additional new footage inserted at various points.
- I guess col. Chekov is dead. :(
- Surprisingly, Landry had the funniest line, regarding the IOA.
- Odd that they'd bring in Robert Picardo for such a brief appearance. I wonder if they're trying to give his character a more "permanent" presence?
- So what about Chulak? Are they frelled?
- Although brief, the battle over Chulak looked pretty good.
- Bra'tac acted uncharacteristically unwisely towards the end of the episode. Wonder if he'll be pissed at Mitchell for dragging him out of there?
- This is the first season opener in six years that wasn't a "To be continued" one.

Anyway, good show. If this was setting the tone for this season, then I can't wait for next week!


http://photobucket.com/albums/v413/uglypig/thumbsup.gif

Agent_Dark
July 15th, 2006, 06:42 AM
- Odd that they'd bring in Robert Picardo for such a brief appearance. I wonder if they're trying to give his character a more "permanent" presence?

Was probably shot at the same time as the Atlantis opener, where he had abit to do.

keshou
July 15th, 2006, 06:56 AM
I thought this was a fairly good season opener although not on par with some of my favorites over the years (Enemies, Small VIctories, Serpent's Lair)). A little draggy in places.

The good:
* Mitchell. I like this Mitchell! A little more seasoned, more serious about what they were facing.
* Vala. Really liked her in this one. Toned her down, yet they kept her street smarts and snarkiness. She recognizes BS when she hears it and is always thinking.
* Adria. Liked her way more than I thought I would. I was sufficiently creeped out by all three versions (I thought the middle actress was very talented)
* Sam's rescue. Thank goodness, a break from the trend of "beaming/ringing out in the nick of time". I thought the rescue was one of the better parts of the show
* Daniel/Vala. Decent chemistry in their scenes and less eye-rolling from Daniel this year now that Vala is becoming an ally and not just an annoyance. I didn't have any problem with Daniel wanting to kill Adria. Early Daniel just reacted passionately in shooting the baby Goa'uld. This Daniel seems to be very pragmatic in dealing with evil, in any form.
* Ori ships. Thankfully they shot them at angles that made them a little less "tidy bowls of doom" ;) :)
* Sets. I'm still not sure how the Ori adopted the Medieval look as their signature theme but the interior sets on the Ori ship looked beautiful. Kudos to the set designers/dressers.

The bad:
* Teal'c. Poor guy - the fallback for his character is just getting tortured now it seems. Teal'c didn't have much to do here - didn't even get to have a passionate argument with Bra'tac. And I miss Teal'c eye-shadow. I really do. :cool:
* Bra'tac. And what's up with Brae? Always ready to die for a cause but ramming the Ori ship (and taking all his friends with him) left me :tealcanime49:
* "Just in time". Yes, I know they have to have SOME explanation for how they rescue themselves but it's getting a little old that they're always saved just as the ship explodes or the guy shoots, etc.
* Ori in general. Still don't do that much for me but I continue to hope they'll grow on me. (Maybe having Adria will help - so far I like her better than some of the other "evil rapid-grow scifi kids". ) And I'd rather write on essay on time travel paradoxes than try to figure out the ascended "rulebook". yawn. :S

All in all, I'll continue to watch to see how S10 shapes up. I miss seeing the team as the family it used to be. But I was sufficiently entertained for the evening (at no charge) so thanks TPTB, cast and crew. Hard to believe it's been 10 years. :) :)

P.S. The scariest thing I saw all evening were some of those commercials for that new ""Superhero" reality show. :eek:

Squalll
July 15th, 2006, 06:58 AM
never mind that. what was Adria's name given by the prior. Orissai or Oricei? anyway it must start with ori.

Squalll
July 15th, 2006, 07:08 AM
and they is something weird about the Ori shields. An officer on Korolev says sensors show an energy fluctuation in the shields. I really didn't understood the last part of what she said wich was mentioning something about gunfire. The shields were weakening as the fire increased or not?

Col. Shadow Quinn
July 15th, 2006, 07:13 AM
It was Orici. I got a new target to abuse other than Ra and Anubis now: Tomin and Adria. By the way I make funny space battle pics wherethere are the stupidest yet funniest ideas you can imagine. I only made one serious picture. this year. Overall, Tomin is meant to be abused in ways that would make you laugh your ass off.

MasterPower
July 15th, 2006, 07:23 AM
Besides the space battles, I thought this episode was a little weak. I'm still looking forward to more episodes though. The previews for next week's episode went by so fast I had no idea what was going on.

SG-25CSAR
July 15th, 2006, 07:46 AM
The Ori invasion force is here.
The Jaffa have taken a heavey loss
The Lucian Alliance is now more aggrisive
The Korolev is destroyed and Chekov is possibly dead
All attempts to blow up an ori ship have failed and that one asgard ship got destroyed.
Adria is leading the Ori fallowers

SGC has its work cutt out for it. This is going to be interisting and a lot of the Ori ship's capabilities have been seen,They destroyed an Asgard ship a fleet of Hataks, one 304 and dammaged another 304.
I say we learned a lot from the Ori from a military aspect. It was a good epasode.

ToasterOnFire
July 15th, 2006, 08:19 AM
Random thoughts for this one:

-My brain may be hazy, but is this the first time SG1 and Atlantis were shown in widescreen? It really stood out here, so I can't remember if they've always done this and I just forgot, or if this is something new from SciFi. Either way, thumbs up! It does make a difference.

-While I thought both girls who played Adria did a great job, I was bored with the long conversation between her and Vala.

-I vastly prefer these versions of Vala and Mitch compared to what I saw last season. Can they stick around beyond the season opener?

-The whole transporter thing is getting a bit ridiculous. Korolev explodes? Don't worry we managed to transport some people to safety. Sam stuck in space? Sucks to be you, they aren't working! Daniel and Vala about to be charred? Oh look, we got the transporters working just in time! Mitch/Sam/Teal'c/Bra'tac about to ram something? Ditto. Too much dependence on the damn thing.

-The mission to save Sam was also somewhat of a stretch. There were no smaller ships that could have grabbed her? Mitch was the best one suited to fly the Odyssey and save her? When did he get the training on those big ships that makes him more suited than, I dunno, the people that actually are on them all the time?

-Between this ep and Atlantis's NML, I am so sick of the damn sparklers that go off when the ships got hit. :P

-Overall, the CGI scenes were great and the action certainly was there. I thought it barely edged out the Atlantis premiere but overall as a season opener it could have been stronger.

GateLadyM
July 15th, 2006, 08:35 AM
I felt this was a good start to the season. Vala was very good, I enjoyed the edgier Mitchell, and Adria is a wonderful creation, kudos to the girls who played her, they all did great work.

I'm not going into deep, analytical detail. One can find plot holes in every episode on every show on TV. I just watch for the entertainment value and I got my money's worth Friday.

I liked both SG1 and SGA, but I would give the edge to SG1 this night - it seemed more polished overall and I just like the characters better.

Ori Warrior
July 15th, 2006, 08:47 AM
I'll say the same thing I said at the Scifi Board

I really enjoyed the episode, though I was a bit annoyed by the fact that everybody that I ever known since birth called me at 9...is there some cosmic super power that knew that is when I wanted silence!

I enjoyed it and am all ready got my clock going down to the next episode
You've got to get the science of "call screening" down. :D If it's important they'll leave a message. ;)

I was surpised at all of the action, and we got to see alot going on. I had high expectations, and I say this episode actually was a little more than I expected! It's already in my top 5 episodes, only time will tell if I decide to make it #1. (I don't think you can ever call something "best ever" right off the bat, you have to wait for your current emotional state about it to die down.)

EDIT: Toaster, they've been widescreen since season 6. I have no idea why my season 1-5 DVDs are widescreen, while on tv they are fullscreen though? One of these days I'll have to watch a 1-5 ep on tv and pop in the same DVD to compare if it's just stretched or not. If you watch the DVDs on a high def. TV, you can tell that in season 6 they started to shoot at higher resolution and in widescreen, as 6-8 look ALOT better than the first 5 seasons. Season 8 says "mastered in high defination" on the box, but I suspect 6 and 7 were also cause the quality is high on them too.

Unorthodox
July 15th, 2006, 09:09 AM
I don't really feel like reading 4-6 pages, so if this was noted before, please don' kill me.

When the captain of the Oddessy (I know I didn't spell that right) listed the damage done to the fleet, he mentioned the Asguard vessel. We never saw it leave the battlefield, nor did we hear from it in the premiere. Is it possible, then, that the Ori ships destroyed the Asguard vessel?

TechnoBoY
July 15th, 2006, 09:15 AM
I always assumed it went into hyperspace and flew away. Last we saw of it it looked like it was flying away.

I mentioned this on the first page and I think its a big problem with the ep last night but it was in the beginning so probably everyone was too excited and didnt notice.

In the season finale last season they wanted to dial the supergate first so the Ori could not come through. Wel lthe gat closed this time. Why wouldnt they do what they planned first and dial it so they cant dial in more ships? Did they forget already?

Ugly Pig
July 15th, 2006, 09:17 AM
-My brain may be hazy, but is this the first time SG1 and Atlantis were shown in widescreen?
Hardly. SG-1 has been shown in WideScreen ever since the move to SciFi (season 6) and Atlantis has been shown that way since day one. :P

Lt.Colonel John Sheppard
July 15th, 2006, 09:18 AM
okay so Flesh and Blood First of all i would like to say that i gave this episode a 10 because i thought it was really good. The opening credits are awesome. We are going to be looking for that Anicent weapon of Merlin's.

I like the part where they are trying out the asgard beam and emerson asks what that was that beamed in and Mitchell is like "it was supposed to be a sandwhich". I had a feeling that Bra'tac wanted to ram that mothership down the ori throats. I don't think he wants to capitulate to another false god after spending 142 years worshipping the goa'ulds.

I think that the SG-1 team might have their hands full with this one. The goa'uld werent all that bad but these ori are pure evil and which means they are not going to stop intill everyone worships the Ori. I say we give them a fight. I say that we need to build more BC-304's.

Dr,jackson
July 15th, 2006, 09:33 AM
ok i've seen this ep this morning and I liked it but I just expected more of it ...

the kid is cute and daniel stays hot no matter what he wears .. and then that awfull hair of teal'c ugh .. oh well disnapointed me that there was no danny whumping in it would have liked to see that .. since I'm a smdw ( shippende mega danny whumper ) :danielanime07:


but I'm looking forward for the next ep!

captain jake
July 15th, 2006, 09:47 AM
ok i've seen this ep this morning and I liked it but I just expected more of it ...

the kid is cute and daniel stays hot no matter what he wears .. and then that awfull hair of teal'c ugh .. oh well disnapointed me that there was no danny whumping in it would have liked to see that .. since I'm a smdw ( shippende mega danny whumper ) :danielanime07:


but I'm looking forward for the next ep!

The kid was cute?......... not quite the word I would use to describe her. I think he either is going bald or he did like a box cut thing on his for head and yes it looks bad.(But I still love the guy)

As am I!

LMichelle
July 15th, 2006, 10:12 AM
I loved Vala in this ep. I'm glad she's still got her snarkiness. I hope TPTB don't tone her down too much.

Little Adria. Creepiest. Child. Ever. I could have lived without hearing "Hallowed are the Ori" coming out of a 4-year-old's mouth.

I'm glad Daniel and Vala got so many scenes together. He really was her knight in shining armor, wasn't he? ;)

Mitchell's rescue of Sam seemed a bit far-fetched. I know he's an expert pilot, but c'mon. Also, what's up with the handshake after he sees Sam in the infirmary? They're friends, not strangers.

I miss Chekov. Boy, TPTB aren't going to be satisfied until they blow up every ship, are they?

Overall it was a good ep. Not excellent, but good. :)

Scarym1
July 15th, 2006, 10:26 AM
Absolutely loved this ep!!!! :D

It rocked. It was suspenseful and well written. I love they managed to rescue Carter. That was a brilliant idea. It was neat to see that is was left to Cameron to convince Braytac not to commit suicide. Great idea to put a beacon on Braytac. The poor russians. :(

I love the line at the end where Daniel said he should have shot Vala's daughter. (I don't recall her name). It may seem cold hearted of Daniel to say that but it is the truth. Sam says that Daniel wouldn't shot a child. But Daniel again seems to be the only one (just like in Prototype) who realizes that this is not a human being they are dealing with. The child maybe look innocent but boy it is not!!! It is the embodiment of everything evil they are fighting against.

I am going to have to watch it again. later on this weekend.:) :) :cool:

ToasterOnFire
July 15th, 2006, 10:28 AM
Hardly. SG-1 has been shown in WideScreen ever since the move to SciFi (season 6) and Atlantis has been shown that way since day one. :P
Heh, guess my brain really is a pile of goo. :D

LoneStar1836
July 15th, 2006, 10:34 AM
My $0.02….

I hate Teal’c’s hair.

The episode was decent. Not the best season opener or episode of Stargate I’ve ever seen, but I guess I’d have to consider myself entertained.

I liked serious Mitchell in this one.

Loved Vala. (and mind you this is coming from someone who hated that character with intense passion when she was featured in Prometheus Unbound).

I’m trying to go into this season with a positive outlook though there is still some concern for several episodes for which I’ve read spoilers.

mburrows
July 15th, 2006, 10:47 AM
btw, i also wanna know wtf happened to the asgard ship, where'd it go? lol

CalmStorm
July 15th, 2006, 10:49 AM
I think this episode was a good start to the season. I'm actually looking forward to seeing how this all plays out.

I don't know why, but I was a bit caught off gaurd by Cam's demeanor during this episode. I was not expecting the attitude of the glass in not only half empty, but there's just a little bit of water in the bottom type attitude. I realize he was being realistic in his assessment, but to me, it seemed as though he felt the sitution was and is completely hopeless. That he'll fight till his dying breath, but he does not believe they will win. The redeeming quality was at the end, when he said, to some effect, the odds are really against us which means we have to come up with a different plan.

Loved Vala's role and will love to see how she fits into the picture. I think this episode has done a good job of setting the stage for what is to come, and I'm looking forward to it....more so than last season.

Mr.Clark
July 15th, 2006, 10:50 AM
Well I enjoyed it, but then I liked Season 9 too.

Interesting about Colonel Checkov. On the one hand, I'd love for him to have survived... On the other, the captain goes down with his ship. So I don't know.

My first question was: why didn't Mitchell just go get Sam as soon as the Odyssey arrive? He could have flown slowly and she could have grabbed onto the top of the 302, then landed safely.

Other than that, could the Odyssey have held Adria even if Daniel had grabbed her instead of Vala?

And Emmerson still isn't a patch on Pentergast.

Dani347
July 15th, 2006, 11:18 AM
I think it was a fairly good episode. The opening with Mitchell was very nice. Very grim which set the tone for the show. Mitchell was a lot more serious than we've seen him Not sure if that's good or bad.

I think, considering the situation they were in, it's a good thing.




I'm sorry, but I think the whole maternal instinct thing is overplayed in sci-fi. No women I know, myself included, would feel too maternal about being used as an alien incubator. And every time the kid grew a size, I would at least be startled (more like freaked all the way out) as opposed to taking it in stride and trying to scold it for wanting it to destroy humanity. :)

Don't you know that all women have the mommy gene? It can't be helped and doesn't matter under what circumstances. Although, I don't really think Vala was feeling all that maternal. She kept referring to Adria as a weapon, and saying they could sway her to fight against the Ori, not that they could save her. I think right after she gave birth she felt something, but even when she was asking Adria if any part of her came from her (Vala) it seemed like she was thinking she didn't like the idea of being an incubator and not having any control, rather than a real "my baby" feeling. Maybe at the end.

Bacardi
July 15th, 2006, 11:19 AM
bra'tac was totally out of character at the end and i think that spoilt it. i never thought that he would so willingly sacrifice sg1 and himself. even to protect chulak. he had to have known that he wud have died in vain. could he be losing the plot? he is gettin on a bit now afterall. how old is the character? Lord Yu syndrome anyone?

Quinn Mallory
July 15th, 2006, 11:55 AM
bra'tac was totally out of character at the end and i think that spoilt it. i never thought that he would so willingly sacrifice sg1 and himself. even to protect chulak. he had to have known that he wud have died in vain. could he be losing the plot? he is gettin on a bit now afterall. how old is the character? Lord Yu syndrome anyone?

I absolutely agree that Bra'tac's behavior was a bit odd. I mean it is quite well established that Jaffa are wlling to die in battle but it almost looks like Bra'tac was losing some faith that they would be able to win agains the Ori.

I would like to see this getting addressed in a future episode where Teal'c can pump some confidence back in Bra'tac or something. That would be a nice moment.

Quinn Mallory
July 15th, 2006, 12:03 PM
SG-1 hasn't been this helpless since the early seasons of the show against the Goa'uld. The positive was definitely how the team slowly discover how they all survived and get back together.

I did feel that the Lucian Alliance was a bit wasted in this episode. They could have given a much more interesting reaction to everything than they did.

Shutting down the Supergate has got to be priority in the future episodes, although SG-1 themselves will likely be involved in procuring the weapon to defeat the Ori.

The change in Teal'c hair was a bit too obvious for me. Couldn't Chris Judge had wore a wig or something and than unveil his new hair-do in a future episode or are we supposed to believe that giving Teal'c a weird haircut was part of the torture process by the Lucian Alliance?

Dani347
July 15th, 2006, 12:06 PM
The change in Teal'c hair was a bit too obvious for me. Couldn't Chris Judge had wore a wig or something and than unveil his new hair-do in a future episode or are we supposed to believe that giving Teal'c a weird haircut was part of the torture process by the Lucian Alliance?

*snort*

"He must be made to pay!"
"What shall we do? Beat him? Shock him? Skin him?"
"No, those methods are too mild for what he's done. I know." *pulls out scissors* "It's time to do some barbering"
*shudder*

The Engineer
July 15th, 2006, 12:13 PM
What an episode. I liked the visuals :), the ships, the plot, the dialogues.
Nice touch with the flashbacks.

Valaslonglostsister
July 15th, 2006, 12:24 PM
I can't believe i missed it! I was at florida! Can you guys do me a BIG favor, can you please show me where i can read the transcript and see the screenshots?

entil2001
July 15th, 2006, 12:35 PM
I was slightly worried that the record-setting tenth season would start on a low note, especially since I found the next step in the plot arc somewhat easy to predict. Those who remember my review for the ninth season finale will recall that I had the purpose of Vala’s child worked out before the episode was over. The promise, I thought, was in the execution of the next season arc and how the seeming overpowering nature of the Ori fleet would be handled.

I was pleasantly surprised by the fact that the premiere dealt with everything I wanted it to address, and managed to do so without too many plot conveniences along the way. Most of those issues came up as each team member was revealed to be alive and ready for rescue. The road to rescue was sometimes fraught with peril, but it was also a foregone conclusion.

The far more interesting part of the story was the reaction to the Ori threat. I was a little worried about how Mitchell would come across, since he was the new guy last season and could have been played up again this time around to overcome the lingering resistance to his inclusion. The character felt very natural in the story, as though the writers took some time over the hiatus to pin down the character once and for all. Time will tell, of course, but it never occurred to me that O’Neill wasn’t there.

Much of the time is spent on the Ori incursion and the fall of Chulak, which throws the status quo of the Stargate universe into a very nasty direction. I would have liked to have seen the evolution of the Jaffa Nation, but in a way, this is a logical step for Adria to take. The Jaffa are a massive power in the universe at large, and eliminating or subverting that power goes a long way towards crushing resistance. And it forces the Jaffa into a position of underground resistance again, which is something they know far better than self-determination.

So the situation is getting worse in the Milky Way, with the Ori establishing a nice beachhead and the Jaffa under the gun. Earth has also lost a lot of ships, and it seems like some new solution needs to be found. (Cue Merlin’s weapon from the ninth season.) This gives those annoying nits from the Lucien Alliance a lot of room to maneuver, though I imagine that they will ultimately realize that the Ori will demand their obedience just as stridently.

One thing I find very interesting is the possibility that the Ori are not the totality of the problem. Orlin told the SGC that the Ori steal the life energy from their followers and wish to destroy the Ancients for driving them out. Adria has a very different point of view. Adria claims that the Ori are the ones being targeted because they wanted to stop the Ancients from stealing the life energies of the human beings in the Milky Way. In fact, Adria claims that human life was created to serve the Ancients in this fashion.

Clearly the Ori are wrong in what they do, but it may be that they have a valid point. What if the Ancients are just as bad as the Ori? What if defending the Ancients is the wrong move? I see shades of the Vorlons and Shadows from “Babylon 5”. When Daniel mentioned that they need to learn more about how this whole “ascension” thing works, I wondered if the solution to the Ori might ultimately be a solution to the Ancients as well. And wouldn’t that factor into “Stargate: Atlantis” in interesting ways?

Much like the ninth season in general, I found that the Ori arc has revitalized my interest in the series, which was struggling for a few seasons before changes were forced to occur. I think that the new elements give the writers a lot of ground to cover and explore, and it doesn’t have to be a retread of everything that happened during the Goa’uld arc. I like how Vala has evolved over time (Claudia was gorgeous in that outfit!), and Adria should give the Ori threat a sense of focus in terms of storytelling. All in all, I’m very pleased with how this season has started out!

(As a sidenote: I also have a podcast associated with my various reviews called “Dispatches from Tuzenor”. Future episodes will highlight “Stargate SG-1”, so it might be something of interest . Go to http://entil2001.libsyn.com if you want to listen!)

Artha O'neill
July 15th, 2006, 12:42 PM
I absolutely agree that Bra'tac's behavior was a bit odd. I mean it is quite well established that Jaffa are wlling to die in battle but it almost looks like Bra'tac was losing some faith that they would be able to win agains the Ori.

I would like to see this getting addressed in a future episode where Teal'c can pump some confidence back in Bra'tac or something. That would be a nice moment.
You think something amiss.

...like he knows he's dying

Artha O'neill
July 15th, 2006, 12:44 PM
I can't believe i missed it! I was at florida! Can you guys do me a BIG favor, can you please show me where i can read the transcript and see the screenshots?
http://forum.gateworld.net/showthread.php?t=31007

freyr's mother
July 15th, 2006, 12:50 PM
I cannot wait to get home and watch both eps on my DVR! :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :D :D :D :D :D :D :jack_new_anime18: :sheppardanime23:

valaCB
July 15th, 2006, 12:51 PM
I can't believe i missed it! I was at florida! Can you guys do me a BIG favor, can you please show me where i can read the transcript and see the screenshots?
here you can see some Vala clips http://terrafirmascapers.com/index.php?topic=11212.0 . and here you can fine more about the episode http://www.benbrowderportal.com/

Skydiver
July 15th, 2006, 12:59 PM
Beaming out in the last second is getting very old. How many god damn times can you do it (in an episode)?!

yes, the 'get out of trouble free' card. one that they have, and i fear, will continue to use too often. That's the problem shows face when they get all fascinated by space ships...that pesky 'how to get from one to the other' issue

and, i can't be sure, did the stargate even get used in this episode???? I kinda fell asleep adn zoned out but did that nice round spinny thing show up anywhere but the opening credits?

captain jake
July 15th, 2006, 02:18 PM
yes, the 'get out of trouble free' card. one that they have, and i fear, will continue to use too often. That's the problem shows face when they get all fascinated by space ships...that pesky 'how to get from one to the other' issue

and, i can't be sure, did the stargate even get used in this episode???? I kinda fell asleep adn zoned out but did that nice round spinny thing show up anywhere but the opening credits?

Yes bra'tac came to earth through our stargate.

L.A. Doyle
July 15th, 2006, 02:26 PM
and, i can't be sure, did the stargate even get used in this episode???? I kinda fell asleep adn zoned out but did that nice round spinny thing show up anywhere but the opening credits?

Oh my gosh...I'm not sure either! Wait..didn't Bra'tac come through the gate? And I really don't remember if it was in the opening credits, but it has to be. I mean the show is called Stargate SG-1.

I'm really hoping for some more exploratory episodes this season. And yes, the beaming out is getting very old. Every once in a while is fine, but I'd like more creative escape plans.

I'm also a bit worried about Daniel this season. I don't know if I like the way his story arc is going. :(

Sam needs to do more than just be the scientist. That's great, but PTB, don't forget she is a kick butt soldier too!

Teal'c and the Jaffa story-I like that. I just want more screentime for the original three. Not asking for the Sam, Daniel, and Teal'c Show, but let's not make wallpaper here. And more TEAM interaction please.

Vala was toned down, so I could handle her. My opinion of Mitchell went up a tad.

I thought the episode was alright. I think next week's looks interesting. :)

OldSchoolKlingon
July 15th, 2006, 02:28 PM
The one thing I love about this two-parter is that unlike most two-parters in which part 1 is fairly slow and sets up the plot, then has a shocking cliffhanger and Part 2 is action-packed, both 'Camelot' and 'Flesh and Blood' were great and crucial to the plot.

betjam
July 15th, 2006, 02:42 PM
That was fun! I mean after months of nothing good on TV--hooray! Okay, have to fess up...I watched the show when it was first run and made my kids wait for dinner (rather than taping and watching later).

I liked how they phased in what happened to everyone. We knew Daniel was alive, we just had to wait for the how part. I liked how Daniel saved himself. He knew what was happening and knew it was now or never.

Daniel has met his match in Vala when it comes to talking. He could hardly get a word in. Has someone else asked just how long did Vala and Hubby stay on that bed while Daniel hid on other side? I thought he was going to put the gun up to his head as in "if this doesn't end soon, I'm just going to shoot myself."

Liked scene with Bra'tac and suicide mission. Teal'c looked at Cam and then back at Bra'tac and you knew where he stood with both of them. Still not 100% on Cam.

As for all the ships blowing up and the Ori threat being closer, does this mean we are now going to see more Stargate travel and less beaming up? I hope so.

Special effects were great. Especially with Sam being saved from space.

Overall, it was just fun to watch on many levels and looks to be a great season.

McDork
July 15th, 2006, 02:58 PM
Nice first episode with great potential for the rest of the series.

I loved how events were replayed, continuing from Camelot and the things we hadnt seen.

I hope Chekov is 1 of the 6, i was just beginning to like him. Although, the fact he could of quite possible died on a ship that was only gained from blackmail, would be the best case of irony. Ever.

Teal'cs Hair?! What. In. The. Hell. There are no other words. :mad:

I still adore Vala. The banter was perfect. Loved her outfit. :D

Cam was portrayed better in this episode than last season i think. But i do like him, however, i was "what the hell Cam" when he put the transmitter on Bra'tac, i thought he may of been setting him up somehow. Im glad it wasnt nothing sinister, other than saving Brae from himself. I agree with some other posters that him saving Sam with the Odyssey was over the top, the F-302 would of been a better option. :)

I didnt like the fact Brae was so out of character, but i guess not everything can be perfect.

I love Adria, i prefer the 2nd one of the little girl from Silent Hill.. the younger one was just creepy. And the older one was worse. The middle one was the lesser of 3 evils. Wish she could of stayed longer.

All the beaming at the nick of time is getting out of hand now, i wish i was that lucky.

Just one small query i have..

When Daniel "ringed" out, was it because the warhead aboard the Korelev, was about to blow? I thought that it was, and that prehaps the damage was self inflicted, and that was the reason the Korelev was destroyed.. but hubby says im wrong. what do you think?

Thats about it.. cant wait for the next installment. Now off i go to finally see Atlantis :D

L.A. Doyle
July 15th, 2006, 03:03 PM
I love Adria, i prefer the 2nd one of the little girl from Silent Hill.. the younger one was just creepy. And the older one was worse. The middle one was the lesser of 3 evils. Wish she could of stayed longer.
Me too. She was my favorite...if you can have a favorite little evil Ori girl.

Just one small query i have..

When Daniel "ringed" out, was it because the warhead aboard the Korelev, was about to blow? I thought that it was, and that prehaps the damage was self inflicted, and that was the reason the Korelev was destroyed.. but hubby says im wrong. what do you think?

Well, we saw the Ori ship fire right through the Korelev, right? :tealcanime49: But if the Ori hadn't gotten us, then that would have. Actually, I don't remember anything about a warhead...but I'm pretty sure I saw the Ori blow up the Korelev.

golfbooy
July 15th, 2006, 03:17 PM
Ok, so I'm sitting here trying to come up with a clever, witty opening to what will inevitably be a lenghty, loquacious litany the likes of which hasn't been read since the last time I spewed forth my thoughts on an SG-1 episode. Alas, the voices haven't stopped. They refuse to be silent. And I, ever their slave, am impelled to ramble on (and not in the cool Led Zeppelin way). So, uh, here goes.

After reading the thread thus far, I am surprised that so many others seem to share my impression of Flesh and Blood. Honestly, I'm usually much, much harder on episodes than most other posters. As such, I expected to find a much warmer reception of the episode here online. Right now, I'd put most people in the "tepid" camp--right along with me. Flesh and Blood didn't decend to the lowly depths of some of last year's episodes (The Ties That Bind, Off the Grid), but it is by no means the stellar season opener of years gone by. I'm saddened that the likes of New Order or Enemies is unlikely to be seen again.

Overall, the episode wasn't bad. I think that there were parts that worked and parts that didn't work. I was terribly underwhelmed by the ending, but I'll get to that in due course. To start, it has to be noted that Flesh and Blood was bound to suffer from the massive amount of cleaning up it had to do. In hopes of creating high drama the writers left the story in a real undignified mess with Camelot. This episode was doomed to be nothing more than a pedantic picking up of the pieces. There could be no bonafide surprises in the episode, nor any real focus on characters. I found the cut between Camelot and Flesh and Blood to be a bit jarring; I wanted something more to indicate that this great, huge battle had ended. I feel like just cutting to the Ori ships gliding through space and to Vala's pregnancy rather than having an establishing shot of the decimated fleet or even of SG-1 robbed the opening of the episode of the all the drama they attempted to purchase in Camelot. What's the point of pushing that rock all the way up the hill if you're not going to push it over the edge?

Anyway, I thought the opening with Mitchell and Sam was good. As others have mentioned, Carter's rescue was perhaps a bit far fetched, but that's the kind of stuff I'm willing to let slide these days. Low expectations though they might be, I'm just pleased that they didn't beam her back aboard. Clever of the writers to spare that horse until the second act with Teal'c. The visual with the Odyssey enveloping Carter was nice, though it would have been even nicer if the scene with Mitchell was constructed a little more plausibly. The Lucian Alliance bit just sucked all the way around. Their inclusion in Camelot was rather slapdash, and they exited here in a likewise manner. Why they were there at all remains a mystery to me.

The Vala and Adria stuff still raises my hackles. NO demon spawn/space baby story has ever turned out well. I can't see this one being any different. And how Daniel can be presented with this scenario without once mentioning the disturbing parallels to Shifu (you know, the son of his dead wife) is beyond the bounds of believability. I know that's all "Old Stargate" stuff, but it once was a really important thing for him. Speaking of believability, the writers really gave Bra'tac a fine screwing in this one. But there will be more on that later. The removal to Chulak was a really nice touch on the part of Cooper. I feel like having that Ori ship land on Chulak did more to involve the Jaffa in the Ori storyline than anything that happened in season nine with either Gerak or the Sodan. SG-1 has a long and rich history that can provide ample fodder for future stories. The writers insistence on shunning most of that history remains one of the biggest follies of the last two years.

As promised, I still must talk about the ending. The uncanny timing coincidences and magic transporter beam-outs have got to stop. There is absolutely no drama in a show where the audience knows full well that the characters need do nothing in order to save themselves. The ongoing prevalence of this deus ex machina is one of my major complaints with "ship stories". The writers used to be more creative. Now I'm just going to start counting how many times the transporter is used in a given episode. I might need fingers and toes to tally both SG-1's and Atlantis' instances. Please, no more space battles. How about a nice, lush planet with boring old trees and grimy dirt? Maybe even a strikingly familiar stone ring that stands upright? The show needs a new setting besides the bridge of a ship.

Right. Now on to the characters themselves. And I think I'll start with everyone's favorite whipping boy.........Landry. Ah, ah, you thought I was going to say Mitchell, didn't you? Nope, I'll be needing a thicker switch to tan that boy's ass. All joking aside, what was up with Landry? His scene with Woolsey left me scratching my head. Smug much? Arrogant often? What moron finds out that the fleet he sent to defend the galaxy has been entirely wiped out with loss of life totaling in the thousands, only to snidely take a dig at the one sympathetic voice on the IOA? "Stupid Woolsey, quit offering reasonable suggestions. If you'd have thrown more money at the problem I could have fixed it." WTF? Please, tell me if I read the scene wrong. Because right now, I'm thinking that Landry is the biggest tool the SGC has seen since Gen. Bauer.

There wasn't much opportunity for Vala to dominate this story with her inherent silliness. I'm curious to see how she'll be received if this remains the case for the rest of the year. No doubt the character of Vala is destined to be most closely tied to the Ori (at least for the present), so I was a bit surprised to see that the writers didn't go for a stronger maternal bent from her towards Adria. Either Claudia Black is playing it as such, or Vala just is surprisingly detached from her child and much more pragmatic about the whole affair than I expected. I think that's a good thing. Here's hoping she doesn't suddenly become a bit more maudlin over Adria in future stories. Claudia Black was good; I never saw the appeal of the Daniel/Vala dynamic, so I can't say I missed it here. I think both characters are stronger without the other around.

Flesh and Blood was surprisingly Daniel-lite. And when he was in it I don't feel that Daniel contributed very much to the story. I think that's odd, and don't have much else to say about it. I wasn't pleased that Daniel dominated the beginning of season nine so much, but I'd rather the writers didn't go completely in the other direction.

Speaking of character-lite, what's up with Teal'c? Or rather, what's up with the lack of Teal'c? Undeniably he suffered from the poorly done Lucian Alliance bit, but he was also uncharacteristically subdued with Bra'tac. Sam was treated to a fully developed rescue. Teal'c was merely beamed out. Bad form on that one. Again, I don't have much to say about this, except that I sure hope it doesn't continue and that Teal'c gets more than twelve words in edgewise in next week's episode. And while I know it's proabably a futile request, please no more pointless toruturing of Teal'c.

As for Mitchell, I will say that his attitude and overall characterization were better in this one. I give most of the credit for this to Rob Cooper. He seemed to be the only writer with a real handle on the character last year, so I'm still worried about future Cambo appearances from Mallozzi and McCollough. Storywise, there were things I liked and some that I very much despised. I had no problems with Mitchell rescuing Carter. Someone had to do it, and the rest of SG-1 were indisposed. That said, Mitchell's demeanor aboard the Odyssey was disappointing. I feel that the character was jarringly thrust forward aboard the ship, clearly and irrationally stepping on the toes of the ship's commander and a superior officer. The "want me to get this one" scene with Netan and Emerson was a clumsy and ungainly way to give Mitchell some "manly" dialogue that would have been more appropriate coming from Emerson. Like it or not, Mitchell is neither the commander of the ship nor a higher ranking officer than Emerson. Likewise, while the beaming a sandwich scene worked, Mitchell just taking control of the ship without a word to Emerson was just wrong. There's nothing demeaning about having Mitchell ask permission or explain his plan.

Now comes my biggest problem with the episode. The whole Mitchell and Bra'tac stuff was awful. I feel like Bra'tac is the latest in a long line of characters that have now been forced to act grossly out of character in order to accomodate Mitchell The Hero. Bra'tac is not a loose cannon or prone to suicidal tendencies. No, he is the character who often espouses wisdom and prudence. He's been known to offer surrender as the wisest course of action. He's the character who spouts dialogue like, "We must fight only those battles we know we can win." Except this time, I guess. It's just absolute crap to do this for what turns out to be nothing more than a lame attempt to portray Mitchell as heroically correct. That aside, having Mitchell slap the homing beacon that he so convienently brought with him on Bra'tac (a character he barely knows) gives the Mitch a foreknowledge of the future that is totally unjustifiable. The way the scene plays, it looks like Mitchell knows how Bra'tac will choose to act before Bra'tac does. Mitchell can't know how the story will end before it happens. That's just bad writing. And the only motivation I can see for it is to further demonstrate Mitchell's innate heroism. Total crap. The character didn't need it. He was, until that point, rather good in the episode.

Finally, there is Carter. I feel like Sam was more involved than Daniel or Teal'c. Her rescue was a nice plot point, and it was through Sam that the only glimpses of "team" came through in Flesh and Blood. The moment between Sam and Teal'c after he's beamed aboard was good. But the best part of the episode for me was her insistance that Daniel was still alive, and that she had to at least find out for herself. Amanda Tapping's reaction to Sam hearing Daniel's voice over the com was brilliant. I wish that Carter had more to actually do in the episode, but I wish that for Daniel and Teal'c too. I do want to say that I'm not getting a real "family" vibe between Carter and Mitchell. We'll see how that goes. The whole symbolic handshake thing between Carter and Mitchell is noteworthy as well. The writers continue to attempt to make the two characters equals and respected comrades rather than teammates. Alas, no amount of such "happy friends" scenes will make the murky structure of the SG-1 team go away.

My final thoughts are that Flesh and Blood was a necessary evil, and that now season ten can actually begin. There needs to be more team, period. Having the characters constantly strewn about the plot, never interacting save for the beginning and end of each episode will do nothing to endear the audience to this new team. I think the show is too fat right now, much like Atlantis. I'm fearful that eventually episodes will simply start exculding characters in order to get the job of telling a story done. And I'm pretty sure that Mitchell is the only one safe from that ignominy. Characters can't be left out or stupidly tacked on. That's no good.

So, that's it. Hopefully Morpheus will be better.

jckfan55
July 15th, 2006, 03:19 PM
I thought the episode was pretty good, but my expectations were quite low given that I wasn't thrilled with most of S9. I agree with those who say too much danged beaming in the nick of time! Also Bra'tac seemed a bit off. It seemed more like the kind of thing he'd advocate in S1.

Vala luckily was toned down. If she stays this way I might be able to deal with her in the long run. I even laughed at one point--I think the stepmother crack. Mitchell was ok.
For this ep, they had a lot of ground to cover so some characters were spread a bit thin--esp. Teal'c. For me, a good balance is key. I did like the concern shown by Sam for Daniel, Sam for Teal'c and Mitchell for Sam. Hints of TEAM feeling.

Nolamom
July 15th, 2006, 03:20 PM
Okay, this is a little beside the point, but I really liked Vala and Adria's costumes. I do costuming for a local theatre group and those were really nice. It's difficult to get the feel of a mediaval period in modern fabrics - they're really just too rich. But the cut and styling was there and CB has such a statuesque body that she carries off the look beautifly.

Lt.Colonel John Sheppard
July 15th, 2006, 03:21 PM
I thought Flesh and Blood awesome. Mitchell was funny when he started to talk uncontrollably fast. i thought that the writers and the directors did a good job at the episode.

jckfan55
July 15th, 2006, 03:27 PM
Okay, this is a little beside the point, but I really liked Vala and Adria's costumes. I do costuming for a local theatre group and those were really nice. It's difficult to get the feel of a mediaval period in modern fabrics - they're really just too rich. But the cut and styling was there and CB has such a statuesque body that she carries off the look beautifly.

Not totally beside the point. Without good costuming and set decorating, it's that much harder to sell a story. I think both departments should get some recognition for generally good work week to week. :jack_new_anime07: And I agree that the medieval flair was there.

Konman72
July 15th, 2006, 03:29 PM
Great episode! Can't wait for the rest of Season 10.

McDork
July 15th, 2006, 03:48 PM
Well, we saw the Ori ship fire right through the Korelev, right? :tealcanime49: But if the Ori hadn't gotten us, then that would have. Actually, I don't remember anything about a warhead...but I'm pretty sure I saw the Ori blow up the Korelev.

Yes, i saw that, my fault for not explaining.. but, i meant after the first Ori blast, that maybe.. just maybe the Korelev would of survived, and the nuke contributed to its demise, rather than a 2nd Ori blast. *shrug*

Either way.. impressive fire fight :D

Pocus
July 15th, 2006, 03:52 PM
I thought this was a great episode. I feel that the writers are getting in touch with the new group dynamic and hopefully this season will be a little less *yawn*.

I like the addition of Vala, especially with her connection to Adria. As a regular on the show, her character won't be able to be so flamboyant, but it is nice to know that attribute is there and can be used when needed.

I love the development of Mitchell. He seemed a little flat last season. A few times he seemed to be trying too hard to fit in the group. I hope this year he finds his place.

The last few seasons have been a buildup of a new enemy and a new SG 1. Hopefully this season we will see the fruition of all this buildup. I can't wait to get back to the feeling of "Don't mess with my Friday nights! Hold all calls, and don't ask me to go anywhere. I've got Stargate to watch"

Ziostilon
July 15th, 2006, 03:58 PM
Can anybody tell me if the art on the ORI ships have been discussed. If not, please start. But if it has, can somebody give me a link.

Thanks:cameron:

DEM
July 15th, 2006, 04:22 PM
The whole symbolic handshake thing between Carter and Mitchell is noteworthy as well. The writers continue to attempt to make the two characters equals and respected comrades rather than teammates.Ooooh, is that what that meant? I knew the lingering camera was trying to tell me something, but my brain was well on the way to the checkout by then, so the point was lost on me.

Great review as usual, golfy. Thanks for giving me an excuse to post&subscribe.

L.A. Doyle
July 15th, 2006, 04:30 PM
As for Mitchell, I will say that his attitude and overall characterization were better in this one. I give most of the credit for this to Rob Cooper. He seemed to be the only writer with a real handle on the character last year, so I'm still worried about future Cambo appearances from Mallozzi and McCollough.

:D Now I have a new nickname for him!

L.A. Doyle
July 15th, 2006, 04:31 PM
Okay, this is a little beside the point, but I really liked Vala and Adria's costumes. I do costuming for a local theatre group and those were really nice. It's difficult to get the feel of a mediaval period in modern fabrics - they're really just too rich. But the cut and styling was there and CB has such a statuesque body that she carries off the look beautifly.

I thought Adria looked like an evil version of Little Red Riding Hood. ;)

But nice costumes though. :)

golfbooy
July 15th, 2006, 04:33 PM
Ooooh, is that what that meant? I knew the lingering camera was trying to tell me something, but my brain was well on the way to the checkout by then, so the point was lost on me.

Great review as usual, golfy. Thanks for giving me an excuse to post&subscribe.
Well, I'm open to other interpretations if anyone has any. It was certainly a decision made on the part of TPTB to include it. And a handshake is a far cry from the hugs that Daniel got in The Serpent's Lair, that's for sure. I definitely think they were going for respect and comradeship as opposed to the familial binds between the original team.

Adrius
July 15th, 2006, 04:37 PM
I liked Emerson's line "I'm guessing that's a no," after he sees Teal'c in the scuffle on the other ship. It may seem a bit callous at first, but it just shows how absolutely tired of it all he was and how dire the circumstances were. When you see one of your guys attacked on another ship and can't even spare the energy to be worried, things are bad. Also, I just love dry humour.

I think it was funny too, but I think Emerson was like "oh Teal'c is being attacked, guess he will call back when he's done mopping up." It does take a lot to capture Teal'c IMO.. even though it's happened a couple of times lately :p

scifi woman
July 15th, 2006, 04:44 PM
Can anybody tell me if the art on the ORI ships have been discussed. If not, please start. But if it has, can somebody give me a link.

Thanks:cameron:


Hi! Interesting observation about the art -- I was wondering myself about the large (beautiful) classical mural on the Ori ship myself. As if the Ori raided the Lourve. And, I found myself looking at the architecture and art objects last season well.

And while here, let me put in my 2 cents about the episode. I loved it! Mitchell is a lot more grounded (perhaps because Ben Browder seems more comfortable in the role) and Vala is great (Claudia Black is a great addition to cast, I'm glad she's there for the whole season).

Finally, after months of reruns and boring reality shows, we have new episodes of SG-1 and SG-A to enjoy!.

Adrius
July 15th, 2006, 04:49 PM
Isn't it weird though because Daniel technically is proof that those ships have a weakness. He should not have been able to ring onto that ship because of the sheilds but aparently they do have something funky going on. Weird that they couldn't replicate the results but then again they might have beamed the weapon into the priors room for all we know or it could have just failed.

Prior probably knew exactly what happened and rendered it inert, the whole "beam a nuke" trick isn't probably going to work with the Ori.

cbrseadude
July 15th, 2006, 05:00 PM
I thought over all it was a pretty good episode. Was it perfect? No, but it had to tie up alot of loose ends so that season ten could begin. i like Cam, i really do, but they do push his character to the fore front more then they should, IMO. Someone commented about the costumes, yea I thought they were very well done, even onboard the Ori ship, everything looked really good. Bratac out of character, yup, I agree. Beam out at the last second is becoming so obvious that its ruining any impending doom feeling that a show needs to keep you on the edge of your seat. How can we beam out of trouble, or ring to a Ori ship but cant beam a bomb abourd? Oh its in the script, thats why. I am glad though that one of my favorite shows is back on!!

L.A. Doyle
July 15th, 2006, 05:06 PM
I thought over all it was a pretty good episode. Was it perfect? No, but it had to tie up alot of loose ends so that season ten could begin. i like Cam, i really do, but they do push his character to the fore front more then they should, IMO. Someone commented about the costumes, yea I thought they were very well done, even onboard the Ori ship, everything looked really good. Bratac out of character, yup, I agree. Beam out at the last second is becoming so obvious that its ruining any impending doom feeling that a show needs to keep you on the edge of your seat. How can we beam out of trouble, or ring to a Ori ship but cant beam a bomb abourd? Oh its in the script, thats why. I am glad though that one of my favorite shows is back on!!

Yep, I agree.

About the ringing out, wasn't it something like when the Ori fired there was a fluctuation in their shields? I don't quite remember. So I'm guessing Daniel ringed out at exactly the right time. But what happened to the bomb we ringed over from Bra'tac's ship? It made it but never exploded? The Ori figured out how to disarm it just like that?

Lord Shiva
July 15th, 2006, 05:08 PM
After reading the thread thus far, I am surprised that so many others seem to share my impression of Flesh and Blood. Honestly, I'm usually much, much harder on episodes than most other posters. As such, I expected to find a much warmer reception of the episode here online. Right now, I'd put most people in the "tepid" camp--right along with me. Flesh and Blood didn't decend to the lowly depths of some of last year's episodes (The Ties That Bind, Off the Grid), but it is by no means the stellar season opener of years gone by. I'm saddened that the likes of New Order or Enemies is unlikely to be seen again.

Way too much to read, sorry... all I have to say is that you must be reading a different forum them I am. Yes, there are posts that are in the 50/50 catagory, but I thought I read a lot of positive posts about Flesh & Blood. Anyway, sorry that you don't think SG-1 makes any good season openers anymore.

binkpmmc
July 15th, 2006, 05:20 PM
Read the whole thread to catch-up and really I have nothing too good to say about this one - boring mitchell fest. This in-your-face-mitchell-as-hewo-please like-him crapola is old, old, old. Let's move on and show the team - all of them -- as the strong characters they used to be - the warrior (reduced to the damsel-in-distress), the leader/soldier/scientist (reduced to wallpaper) and the decent human-being (reduced to vala's sidekick). I really hated what they did to Bra'tac in the name of making mitchell look like he knew what he was doing - more contrived BS that makes a once strong well-written character look impotent (but then again that is what they have done to Carter, Daniel and Teal'c for the sake of mitchell - very sad that a character that is so weakly written literally has to have the strong characters that already existed for so many years literally written as impotent in order for him to look good - and he doesn't so it is all for naught).

The Ori are boring - the spacehips are boring, the beaming out at every difficult situation is old and tiresome. The lazy writing must end (yes Mr. Wright lazy writing in favor of the easy out and the hewo mitchell) - I miss Stargate SG-1.

glennh73
July 15th, 2006, 05:31 PM
Oh and I hate that they can't have some acknowledgement between the shows, in SG-1 they wanted to move the ZPM from Atlantis to earth to defend from the Ori and in Atlantis they wanted it moved because of the Wraith. They didn't even bother to mention about the problem the other series have.



Yeah that is bothering me too. Its like neither show is in the same universe and im still wondering what time during this episode did the Atlantis part happen.


Why is it so hard for the writers to add when Weir was being talked too that ( Since the Ori wiped out a fleet of ships and all that is left is the Oddy and its in real poor shape and that we need the squids we have left in Antarctica to try and defend against the ORI has they are more off a threat at this point than the Wraith.)

Just connect the shows , let it have continuity.

Though if next week Weir somehow is back on Atlantis im going to be pissed, cause the Oddy aint up to snuff to go there and back and also leave earth without any ships to protect or atleast try and protect in case of Ori or some rouge alien.

PG15
July 15th, 2006, 05:40 PM
A slight let down from what I was expecting, but then how can it not after 4 months of agonizing waiting?

Overall a pretty good episode. The Adrias were very creepy, with their orange eyes and...girly voices. I think that Lady in the Water promo with the kid whispering at the end has made me fear children. Damn promos!

The Ori ships seems to be better made this time, more textured, so good job SFX department!

The action sequences were better choreographed than the Camelot battle, so that was good, especially the vertical Ori ship shot.

Cam was pretty good in this; you can feel his sadness at loosing Danny at the beginning of the episode. Speaking of characters, Emerson REALLY got better with this episode, especially when he sorta channeled Jack when he was talking to that helmsmen guy.

Ori fighters! Loved the short dog fight over the Chulak forest.

Actually, the SFX in this episode was very much above average, I wonder what happened...oh yeah, except for that one shot when you see the Hataks and the Odyssey, that scale was pretty damn bad.

Vala has been toned down, but still got enough spunk to make it good; especially that scene between Danny and Vala when they "discovered" each other.

Good to see Tomin again.

Overall score: 7.75, not a bad start at all.


How many ships did they have fighting and couldn't do anything? So, why would they assume that Daniel had single handedly found a way (and would destroy it while he was on it?)?



Because he was in it? Seriously, it's pretty much always easier to blow up ships from the inside than from the outside (more ways to do it).

Adrius
July 15th, 2006, 06:23 PM
Now the next big question, what is happening on Chulak? Are the free Jaffa being slaughtered or are they becoming followers of Origin?
Probably both.

captain jake
July 15th, 2006, 06:35 PM
Probably both.

The Jaffa have bee warriors for centuries I believe they will put up quite the fight. What experience do the Ori soldiers have in the field of warfare. What I mean to say is are they going to be able to fight the Jaffa effectively in hand to hand combat? My prediction is that the second they step out from behind those shields and there is a handful of pissed off Jaffa they are going to be in some serious trouble. Unfortunately I think the priors realize this and will probably hide behind there shields for the duration of what I have to call a WAR!.

Cameron Mitchel
July 15th, 2006, 07:08 PM
I loved this episode and felt it was a great way to open season 10. It did, however, leave some unanswered questions...
Who beamed off the Korolev and where? Was Chekov one of them? Why didn't the Jaffa explosive thing go off? What kind of damage did the ship do when it crashed into the Ori shield? What will come of this apparent "weakness" in the Ori shield when they fire their beam weapon?
Did I just miss some of these or were they all left unanswered...:S


Landy said the entire fleet was torn apart including the Odyssey. It's because they had a lack of information and no communication from the fleet. They were all presumed destroyed. This, however, was not the case. The Odyssey and a Lucian Alliance ship survived the battle. The Asgard ship may have been destroyed or it may have fled. We never saw either way. Hey, another question for my unanswered list...
The Asgard arent chickens. Chekov is Dead. A commander will go down with his ship, just like any captain of an Earth Naval ship would. why would Chekov abandon ship when most of his crew still died onboard? wouoldnt make him a real good ship commander, would it? and if they wanted Chekov to survive, they would have said it, but it was disappointing to see that they never metioned the fact that he died, hes the Russian ambassador and liason to the US government.

memnarch
July 15th, 2006, 07:24 PM
I loved Flesh and Blood. It started off a little shaky with the flashing back constantly, but as soon as I saw Claudia Black in the credits, I knew it was going to be awesome. I knew she was going to be on them subconciously, but seeing her there really brought home the newness of season ten I suppose. I loved the feeling of "we are so screwed" that pervaded the whole episode. The Ori threat has really given the team an opportunity to try to find inventive ways of saving the day, particularly Mitchell's rescue of Carter. I loved Vala throughout! Her reaction to being a mother was touching, yet she added that extra Vala twist in her references to her step mother and so on. Also, I really enjoyed the small character moments in the episode particularly in Teal'c's reaction to the Ori attacking Chulak, which for all intensive purposes, is Teal'c's homeworld. Equally, if not more wonderful, was the way it effected Bra'tac. I think we really got an insight into who he is at his core. His almost suicide attack showed to me his fear of helplessness and his fear of his people becoming enslaved once more at the hands of false gods. My only complaint here is that Merlin's weapon wasn't mentioned at all (correct me if I'm wrong). It was a major part of Camelot and will play an important role in the season to come, yet it wasn't mentioned, which bugged me to no end.

Overall I give it 3/4 stars

acdj31
July 15th, 2006, 07:29 PM
About the ringing out, wasn't it something like when the Ori fired there was a fluctuation in their shields? I don't quite remember. So I'm guessing Daniel ringed out at exactly the right time. But what happened to the bomb we ringed over from Bra'tac's ship? It made it but never exploded? The Ori figured out how to disarm it just like that?

Maybe the bomb was not all that powerful. I'll wait to see if they can transport over a nuke, before I give up on that idea.;)

Sheppard
July 15th, 2006, 07:54 PM
Maybe the bomb was not all that powerful. I'll wait to see if they can transport over a nuke, before I give up on that idea.;)

yeah i hope the nuke still works well i hope so atleast because i want to see a ship blow up and i like the new ori ships the small ones i cant wait to see more of them

the fifth man
July 15th, 2006, 08:57 PM
The Asgard arent chickens. Chekov is Dead. A commander will go down with his ship, just like any captain of an Earth Naval ship would. why would Chekov abandon ship when most of his crew still died onboard? wouoldnt make him a real good ship commander, would it? and if they wanted Chekov to survive, they would have said it, but it was disappointing to see that they never metioned the fact that he died, hes the Russian ambassador and liason to the US government.

I'm sure we'll hear of Chekov's fate at some point this season. They won't just leave us totally hanging. I agree, he probably went down with his ship.:(

Have to say again though, after three viewings already, this episode was so great.:) I love the way it wrapped up last season's finale, and set the tone for this season. Those of us who can appreciate this new direction of this show are going to be in for a real treat this year.

Daniel's_twin
July 15th, 2006, 09:31 PM
I'm sure we'll hear of Chekov's fate at some point this season. They won't just leave us totally hanging. I agree, he probably went down with his ship.:(


I hope he did survive. I think that he was kind of starting to grow on me. But, at this point, I'd say a lot of hope is in vain. Considering the different tone that this season opener has had from just about every other season opener SG-1 has had, I'm not holding out much hope for Chekov. Or anyone down the line. :cool:

the fifth man
July 15th, 2006, 09:34 PM
I hope he did survive. I think that he was kind of starting to grow on me. But, at this point, I'd say a lot of hope is in vain. Considering the different tone that this season opener has had from just about every other season opener SG-1 has had, I'm not holding out much hope for Chekov. Or anyone down the line. :cool:

That, and, since only 6 survivors beamed off the ship, it wouldn't look so good if Chekov was one of the 6. As the ships Commander, he should have gone down with the ship. Just like Pendergast did last season. I'm not saying I like the fact that he's most likely dead, it's just that it wouldn't reflect so well on him if he was alive either.

nyxlily
July 15th, 2006, 09:44 PM
Well, it was very likely it wouldn't be his choice to be beamed off. Didn't the Odyssey beam them off? Can they differentiate who gets picked? Or was it just a mad scramble to even GET any one off of a dying ship?

I, too, was just warming up to the Chekov character :/ and it's so sad that he JUST got the command of the ship..

the fifth man
July 15th, 2006, 09:54 PM
I, too, was just warming up to the Chekov character :/ and it's so sad that he JUST got the command of the ship..

I was really starting to like him too. Had since around Season 6 really. If he is gone, he will be missed.:(

But, a lot of good characters have bit the dust before on this show. And I'm sure a lot more still will.

TechnoBoY
July 15th, 2006, 10:03 PM
I've always liked him! He rocked!

The writers keep killing off guest characters that people like. All the while they make the main characters seem indestructable so we never really are afraid they'll die. Meh.

Sheppard
July 15th, 2006, 10:14 PM
i hope Chekov didnt die he was just starting to become a person on the show alot and i used to hate him but now he has grown on me a bit so i hopefully he didnt die

Korean_Turtle87
July 15th, 2006, 10:37 PM
Daniel always hesitates. That's his job, he is the consience of the show.

That said, I thought it was a pretty good way to start the season.

Too bad about Chekov...I rather liked him.no evidence to support that. they blew up the korolev, but they didn't mention whether Chekov survived or not. they just say they got half a dozen survivors, Chekov could be, and i hope he is, one of them


Glad too see Claudia Black finally getting a ring credit, hopefully they'll make her a bit less silly. I like silly, but she needs to be more than a source of consternation for Daniel. She should have a fairly prominent role this season, being the spawner of evil and all that.

Can't wait for next week.i really like that relationship between daniel and vala. its very amusing. glad she's in full time now. i don't know about less silly, but she shouldn't be TOO silly

Blue Banrigh
July 15th, 2006, 10:53 PM
I, too, was just warming up to the Chekov character :/ and it's so sad that he JUST got the command of the ship..

Tell me about it, The Russians just can't seem to catch a break.

IMHO it would have been much more interesting if the Korolev had survived instead of the Odessey. The idea that SGC would have to depend on the Russians to defend earth would not have gone over well with some people. *coughJackcough*

It would have just been cool if the power balance on Earth evened out a little more.

Did the Russians also get an Asgard technician?

Sheppard
July 15th, 2006, 10:54 PM
no evidence to support that. they blew up the korolev, but they didn't mention whether Chekov survived or not. they just say they got half a dozen survivors, Chekov could be, and i hope he is, one of them

i really like that relationship between daniel and vala. its very amusing. glad she's in full time now. i don't know about less silly, but she shouldn't be TOO silly

yeah in Flesh And Blood she was a little different she wasent her silly self but now we have seen both i recon we should see both of her personalitys

nyxlily
July 15th, 2006, 11:01 PM
IMHO it would have been much more interesting if the Korolev had survived instead of the Odessey. The idea that SGC would have to depend on the Russians to defend earth would not have gone over well with some people. *coughJackcough*

It would have just been cool if the power balance on Earth evened out a little more.

Wow, great insight on the possibility of the shift in power! I never even considered the repercussion of losing the Odyssey vs... um, the Russian one. Can't remember name!

It would certainly add more tension on the political front.. plus what it'd mean for the SGC.

It hails back to the days when the Russians had the DHD.. before we blew it up :P

Sheppard
July 16th, 2006, 12:08 AM
Wow, great insight on the possibility of the shift in power! I never even considered the repercussion of losing the Odyssey vs... um, the Russian one. Can't remember name!

It would certainly add more tension on the political front.. plus what it'd mean for the SGC.

It hails back to the days when the Russians had the DHD.. before we blew it up :P

The name of the russian one is the Korlaf

Blue Banrigh
July 16th, 2006, 12:25 AM
The name of the russian one is the Korlaf
It's spelt Korolev (http://www.gateworld.net/omnipedia/ships/links/korolev.shtml). :)

majorsal
July 16th, 2006, 12:49 AM
Teal'c and the Jaffa story-I like that. I just want more screentime for the original three. Not asking for the Sam, Daniel, and Teal'c Show, but let's not make wallpaper here. And more TEAM interaction please.



i am. with a smattering of sam/jack on the side. ;)





sally :)

Sheppard
July 16th, 2006, 12:54 AM
It's spelt Korolev (http://www.gateworld.net/omnipedia/ships/links/korolev.shtml). :)


thanks

JanusAncient
July 16th, 2006, 01:19 AM
It didn't really make any sense, Daniel saying at the end that he should've shot Adria. It most likely would not have made any difference, the Prior would have revived her, or she would have healed on her own, or worse she could have ascended, with the knowledge of the Ori in her mind, ascension is definitely a possibility for her. And, what's with Vala, would she really let Daniel kill her child. She stopped him from pointing his gun, which I approved of, but I would like to see this explored more. Adria isn't going to switch sides, but Vala just might, especially if they learn more about the Ancient/Ori conflict.

Sheppard
July 16th, 2006, 02:34 AM
vala wont switch sides and adrail wont switch sides either and as people have said vala wont let daniel kill her

dosed150
July 16th, 2006, 03:49 AM
i think the reason daniel was able to beam on but that bomb didnt go off i think ori ships have dampening fields remember in nemesis thor said asgard ships had dampening fiels that stop explosives destroying the ship from the inside its quite likely the ori have something similar so the bomb got through but didnt do any damagee, maybe a nuke would still work because of the emp

Sheppard
July 16th, 2006, 03:51 AM
true

Daniel's_twin
July 16th, 2006, 07:16 AM
Makes sense. From what I remember, Thor once said that the Asgard had found an Ancient repository and learned much from it. It's possible that those dampening fields were part of it. If so, then it makes sense that the Ori also knew about those fields. :cool:

Sheppard
July 16th, 2006, 07:49 AM
Makes sense. From what I remember, Thor once said that the Asgard had found an Ancient repository and learned much from it. It's possible that those dampening fields were part of it. If so, then it makes sense that the Ori also knew about those fields. :cool:

true

tony
July 16th, 2006, 08:09 AM
I thought those Ori fighters where pritty cool they tore up the deathgliders. anyone get a shot of them?

Sheppard
July 16th, 2006, 08:12 AM
yeah those fighters are cool i cant wait for them to be added to the Omnipedia

memnarch
July 16th, 2006, 08:31 AM
As far as the Jaffa bomb not working, I've just remembered that Thor said in Nemesis that Asgard had shields in place in case of an explosion on board. It's possible that the Ancients and/or the Ori would have these in place too, thus making the detonation of the Jaffa bomb null.

tony
July 16th, 2006, 08:45 AM
yah i was thinking of that aswell. more than likely thats what happend... it would have been a interesting thing to see though if that stratigy worked :)

Sheppard
July 16th, 2006, 08:55 AM
i want the nukes to work

Oranos
July 16th, 2006, 10:42 AM
The Asgard arent chickens. Chekov is Dead. A commander will go down with his ship, just like any captain of an Earth Naval ship would. why would Chekov abandon ship when most of his crew still died onboard? wouoldnt make him a real good ship commander, would it? and if they wanted Chekov to survive, they would have said it, but it was disappointing to see that they never metioned the fact that he died, hes the Russian ambassador and liason to the US government.

I never said that they were chicken. You do, however, have to keep the situation in mind. They may have simply left to report the situation to Thor. Information is valuable. If they had the choice between fighting and dying needlessly or reporting back to give out information, I'm sure they'd choose the second option. At least with that choice, the odds would improve in the next battle with the Ori forces.

We don't know that Chekov is dead. That, along with the Asgard ship being destroyed, is another assumption. I don't recall him being shown as dead or dying on screen. Six people were also beamed off. We don't even know if it was a willing choice to leave the Korolev. It is possible that another ship beamed as many people off as possible in a mad rush to collect as many people as they could. I can recall several instances of situations where it looked like characters had died or did but they were brought back... Anubis anyone? Apophis? Lantash?

Adrius
July 16th, 2006, 10:46 AM
are we supposed to believe that giving Teal'c a weird haircut was part of the torture process by the Lucian Alliance?
I was thinking the same thing lol.

Tell us what you know or ... or... we'll cut your hair!

Noooo!!!

Mattathias2.0
July 16th, 2006, 10:56 AM
I loved this episode from beginning to end. It appears the ship have hyperspace capabilities, but must be limited.

Those fighters looked cool. It looks like Chu'lak will become their base of operations.

I liked the scenes between Vala and Adria. I also loved why Vala named her that.

We are in trouble.

Next weeks episode looks... eh.

Mattathias

the fifth man
July 16th, 2006, 12:56 PM
I loved this episode from beginning to end. It appears the ship have hyperspace capabilities, but must be limited.

Those fighters looked cool. It looks like Chu'lak will become their base of operations.

I liked the scenes between Vala and Adria. I also loved why Vala named her that.

We are in trouble.

Next weeks episode looks... eh.

Mattathias

Oh, we're definitely in trouble. Back to square-one, where I like it.:) Sooner or later, we'll find a way to at least blow up one of their ships, but for now, I enjoy seeing the team struggle to get things done. Makes for very interesting viewing IMO.

Actually, I'm looking forward to "Morpheus". I think it could turn out to be a really good episode.:)

Adrius
July 16th, 2006, 01:03 PM
Yep, I agree.

About the ringing out, wasn't it something like when the Ori fired there was a fluctuation in their shields? I don't quite remember. So I'm guessing Daniel ringed out at exactly the right time. But what happened to the bomb we ringed over from Bra'tac's ship? It made it but never exploded? The Ori figured out how to disarm it just like that?Priors don't need to figure anything out, just render it inert with their powers.

Mattathias2.0
July 16th, 2006, 01:04 PM
I think with the high powered weapons the Ori ships have, it takes a toll on their hyperspace engines, which is why it took them so long to arrive at Chul'lak, which they did know where it was (see, Avalon I & II, Origin, and The Fourth Horseman II) because they got it from Daniel's mind.

Mattathias

the fifth man
July 16th, 2006, 01:06 PM
Priors don't need to figure anything out, just render it inert with their powers.

Yep! Yet another reason why we are soooo screwed at the moment.

Gate gal
July 16th, 2006, 01:17 PM
It's interesting but not unsurprising that Daniel would feel that way about Adria. In addition to the experiences with Anubis' clone, Daniel is the only one who experienced the "vision" given to him by the Harsesis. He learned already that the only way to defeat that kind of inbred evil is to deny it completely, and it's pretty clear that Adria has already given into her inbred evil.

I also thought it was very cool that Daniel pulled Vala to safety, rather than grabbing Adria at that moment. However, his motivations were probably equal parts unwitting protectiveness of someone who is a friend (well, almost!) and saving the one person who might be able to get through to Adria.



I think Sam is being set up in this episode to be the voice of hope for this season. As nyxlily pointed out in the post above, at the beginning of the episode, alone in space, calling for help, she stayed calm and trusted that help would come. She is the one who doesn't seem to doubt that Daniel is still alive, and goes with Bratac on what seems like a suicide mission. Then, like a bookend, at the end of the episode when Daniel and Cam are saying how dire the situation is, she is the one pointing out how at the beginning of the Stargate program, the Gouald seemed undefeatable, expressing optimism that this situation will look the same in retrospect.

For much of the series, Daniel has been the optimist on the team, but it's fairly clear that he has lost much of that optimism. I think Sam is now taking on that role and I expect that throughout the season, she will be the one who keeps the rest of the team going through dark times.

Edited to try to make coherent sentences.
I hadn't really thought about that subtle change in Sam as the new team optimist, but I had noticed that Daniel had hardened. The two characters have been through a lot in 9 years, and it is intresting to see how they have changed. I would have liked to see a little more Teal'c in the scene on Bratac's ship. He should have had some of Cameron's lines. (Not all since he has never been a big talker.) I like the new improved Vala, and I am glad she seems to care about her husband. Maybe that will tone her down a little.

Overall, the episode was really good. It was SG1 again. I understand that the PTB were in between a rock and a hard place with season 9, and I know they were trying to get the show moving in another direction so it wasn't great. But, I think they are on to something this season. I think they have taken the fan's reactions to season 9 into account, and I appreciate that. I hope we see some good interaction between the original three, but I also want to see how the new improved Cam and Vala will fit into the team. I especially want to see a friendship develop between Sam and Vala (please no major rivalry). Can't wait until next week!

25SG-1fan
July 16th, 2006, 01:32 PM
:sam: Loved the premier from Friday, Good storys, got the team working together, for each other and for the galaxy, Great action sequences, eye candy (including Micheal, Chris and Ben of course!) but agree with an earlier post of not appreciating the way Mitchell spoke to Bratac'. My only other problem with the whole thing was that Col. Emerson called Marks (the helmsman) a Major!! He was a Lieutant at the beginning of last year, there is NO WAY he can be a MAJOR by this time!!!!!

Nolamom
July 16th, 2006, 02:31 PM
Faced with the evil one, what can the Fluffster do???
http://i77.photobucket.com/albums/j55/Nolamom/FluffyfacesAdria.jpg