PDA

View Full Version : Home (109)



Pages : [1] 2

GateWorld
August 5th, 2004, 08:37 PM
<DIV ALIGN=CENTER><TABLE WIDTH=450 BORDER=0 CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=7><TR><TD><DIV ALIGN=LEFT><FONT FACE="Arial" SIZE=2 COLOR="#000000"><A HREF="http://www.gateworld.net/atlantis/s1/109.shtml"><IMG SRC="http://www.gateworld.net/atlantis/graphics/109.jpg" WIDTH=160 HEIGHT=120 ALIGN=RIGHT HSPACE=10 VSPACE=2 BORDER=0 STYLE="border: 1px black solid" ALT="Visit the Episode Guide"></A><FONT SIZE=1 COLOR="#666666">DISCUSS ...</FONT>
<FONT SIZE=4 COLOR="#0066BF"><B>HOME</B></FONT>
<FONT SIZE=1>EPISODE NUMBER - 109</FONT>
<IMG SRC="/images/clear.gif" WIDTH=1 HEIGHT=10 ALT="">
McKay's efforts to harness the energy of an alien planet's atmosphere allows for a return trip to Earth -- but the team may not be able to return to Atlantis.

<B><A HREF="http://www.gateworld.net/atlantis/s1/109.shtml">Visit the Episode Guide >></A></B></FONT></DIV></TD></TR></TABLE></DIV>

Excali5033
September 10th, 2004, 07:03 PM
Best ep yet, IMO. The idea's been done, but rarely as well as this. And man, it was good to see Don in uniform again. Seeing Teyla act so giddy about the mall was funny, if a little strange.

Mio
September 10th, 2004, 07:06 PM
Overall It was a good episode. It's good to know that we can destroy the Wraith's ability to get to Earth by just dropping that control crystal, instead of blowing up the gate.

cdcarter
September 10th, 2004, 07:06 PM
It was beautifly done. I like how we saw the inside of a semi-charged ZPM. Shouldn't a vacuum have been created though?

Mio
September 10th, 2004, 07:08 PM
It was beautifly done. I like how we saw the inside of a semi-charged ZPM. Shouldn't a vacuum have been created though?
I think that was McKay's point for dropping it. It didn't cause a huge accident, so it wasn't real.

Calicto
September 10th, 2004, 07:10 PM
It was definitely a good episode. But probably not that great. *sad*

If they gave more information about the aliens and their history, then it would have been a 10/10... but it was predictable... but still cool... 7/10

chris_h
September 10th, 2004, 07:10 PM
VERY good. Kept me guessing. I almost thought it was some sort of twisted AU ep.

Grumpyguy
September 10th, 2004, 07:12 PM
Seemed more like a filler episode here. Basically, once again, we didn't explore Atlantis, we didn't find any new technology, we didn't learn any more about the Wraith.

When Hammond morphed into the mist being, I thought, cool, maybe these are Ancients that stayed behind, maybe they stayed hoping that humanity would progress to the point where they could assist them defeat the Wraith.

Major Fischer
September 10th, 2004, 07:15 PM
I'm really finding myself enjoying this episode a lot, on a number of different levels. Probably one of my favorites of the entire series ...

A) Primarily because of the character developement. Weir, Sheppard and McKay got the most here IMO. Though Ford, and Teyla got a fair amount as well. Getting to see where some of the major characters lived gives a great feal for their personalities. I think the best aspects though, were how well the script explored each of their feelings about Atlantis, about Earth, and more importantly, about the people they have taken the expedition with. They wanted very badly to go home, but only with the idea that they might be able to come back.

Each wants to go home, but not blindly. Each has, in their heart, the adventure, the idea of Atlantis. Of the possibilities which... seems to be so much more real than many sci fi series which are about supposed to be about exploring the unknown. It's a light in their eyes, and all I can think of is that it's a combination of very good writing and very good actors who can crawl far enough into their characters heads to absolutely be there.

You know that Weir does love Simon, and she's sorry for hurting him, but she really isn't in love with him enough to give up what is deeper in her soul. You know that despite Sheppard's flippant attitude occasionally, she trusts him. Absolutely. Things had bothered her before, but the idea that Sheppard had betrayed her trust was the moment that she knew it wasn't real.

Sheppard we learned, I think, the most interesting things about. It was his imagination we were seeing more than his longing. It gives a hint of so many possibilities that seem almost deeper than the idea that Jack is the next step in human evolution. On a less deep level (for lack of a better term), the book seen is telling. It was about how he was a very smart man, who wants to learn something, but when someone comes to close to asking him about that, of discovering that part of himself, he covers it up with snark. And I think Elizabeth saw through it.

McKay was much more subtle. Sure, we saw his appartment, and watched him eat months old snack food. That was McKay. But I think the truely important thing we learned was that when the myst beings could read their minds, even he was not selfish enough to want home at the expense of millions of intelligent beings. Rodney as hero, much like Hide and Seek Atlantis is his place to be a hero. He would never have a chance to show those qualities at home. And I think personally, that he knows it.

B) The plot. So there had been a great many discussions before this episode aired about how it had been overly spoiled. How even SciFi had given too much away in the promos. It wasn't all that long into the episode that I realized that the information that they weren't really back on earth wasn't a spoiler at all. Or at least not an important thing. As things started to be 'off' it became about trying to figure out with the characters what was really going on. We all know there will be an episode next week. If we're watching SG1 we know that there are things wrong with the world anyway (Hammond, the lack of O'Neil, or any of SG1 for example) The threat that they could never return to Atlantis wouldn't have worked for real tension. How they were going to get out though. That's where the tension was.

C) Production things... I liked the CGI on the planet. Thought it was a nifty image, nicely done. Was I the only one who felt like they had shot the epsiode in a way so that the scenes on earth were more vivid, more bright than they were in the Atlantis shots. Like a visual clue that this isn't real?

So things I think would have made the episode tad better... Could they have possibly gotten some of the SG1 people to ... just walk though a scene? Even if they weren't part of the episode. I for one felt like the biggest missing element though was Carter. I have difficulty with the idea that McKay wouldn't have wanted Carter there to work on the problem.

Or that McKay wouldn't have dreamed about Carter.

--

Best line of the epsiode. Most definately the bit about looking through a microscope and seeing dancing hampsters.

puddlejumper747
September 10th, 2004, 07:16 PM
Someone answer this PLEASE:
Why did Weir say that they could "go home and brief Gen. Hammond"? She knew he wasn't in charge of the SGC anymore. I mean she took over because he left! And Jack sent her off! So why didn't she (or any other member of the team) question the presence of Gen. Hammond and the lack of General O'Neill????

Calicto
September 10th, 2004, 07:17 PM
It had a few plotholes. New Order came before Rising. Therefore, O'Neill was appointed General... Weir didnt ask on screen on what happened to General O'Neill and the rest of Sg-1?

""Yeah, you know, I remember that. I also remember that you were killed two days later just outside of Kabul."

I loved that completely.

buckner
September 10th, 2004, 07:19 PM
Someone answer this PLEASE:
Why did Weir say that they could "go home and brief Gen. Hammond"? She knew he wasn't in charge of the SGC anymore. I mean she took over because he left! And Jack sent her off! So why didn't she (or any other member of the team) question the presence of Gen. Hammond and the lack of General O'Neill????
I was wondering the same exact thing. It did not make sense .

NightGloom
September 10th, 2004, 07:20 PM
Pretty good episode IMO. It was nice seeing Narim... err, Simon again. It got pretty confusing near the end, but that might be due to the acute lack of sleep. Still haven't seen too much in Teyla though- when Shepard said at the end "I thought that was you" I couldn't really figure out how he could even tell.

Excali5033
September 10th, 2004, 07:21 PM
Hammond's in charge of all space defense now, so he'd ultimately be the one to talk to. But I thought it was strange that she question him being there as soon as she stepped through.

Mio
September 10th, 2004, 07:21 PM
I was wondering the same exact thing. It did not make sense .
General Hammond oversees both the SGC and the Prometheus. It would stand to reason that he also Oversees Atlantis as a seperate project related to, but not part of, the SGC. Therefore, O'neill doesn't need to be involved.

ShadowMaat
September 10th, 2004, 07:21 PM
First of all, I just need to say, Sergeant HARRIMAN! HA! Take that Darren! :P:P

Easily the best ep of the series so far, IMO. Great stuff. Loved every reality-shifting minute of it. The denounement at the end seemed a little too easy, but for the moment I'm willing to forgive it. :D

Very interesting the way the realities were structured. If it was supposed to make them happy and content, how come all the bad things kept happening? Weir getting relieved of command, Ford getting reassigned, Rodney being given gobbledegook... Or is that a reflection of the ultimately pessimistic nature of EVERYONE? Is McKay rubbing off on folks? They figure they won't be allowed to get what they want? Or was it all part of the scheme to try and convince them that they could never get back to Atlantis?

One BIG question... why Hammond? Weir had to know that Hammond was off on another assignment and wasn't likely to be brought back to Stargate Command. And has Shep even MET Hammond? Betcha it's those genes of his that let him manipulate things so completely, but borrowing images from other peoples' minds? Or did The Mist just nab Hammond whole cloth and use him as a bridge between them all?

Nothing in this ep really added up. I love that. Although now that I think about it... I wonder if The Mist is any relation to The Water in Watergate? Similar premises. At least as far as wanting to prevent the team from killing millions of their kind, then expressing shock that the team would be willing to let things drop as long as they were returned "home".

Poor McKay. "You have no new messages." hehe. And dammit, we still don't know the name of his cat. Would have liked to have seen the little furball. LOVE the shirt. I have a similar one on order from Cafe Press. :D

Good Ford stuff in this ep, too. Liked the interplay with McKay.

VirtualCLD
September 10th, 2004, 07:22 PM
Hammond is in charge of homeworld security. She knew O'Neill was in charge of SGC, but she wanted to brief Hammond, the head hancho. I don't think any of them were expecting Hammond to be there waiting for them immedeately though.

EDIT: A couple of minutes and my reply gets burried under many other posts.

Major Fischer
September 10th, 2004, 07:22 PM
Someone answer this PLEASE:
Why did Weir say that they could "go home and brief Gen. Hammond"? She knew he wasn't in charge of the SGC anymore. I mean she took over because he left! And Jack sent her off! So why didn't she (or any other member of the team) question the presence of Gen. Hammond and the lack of General O'Neill????

The lack of O'Neill is a plot hole, however, the idea that she would brief Hammond is not. Hammond is in charge of homeworld security, he is the one with authority over the Atlantis expedition (it comes out of the Antartic Outpost not the SGC, New Order told us they were considered seperate projects). O'Neill would have been there for the briefing, but she would have been briefing General Hammond.

chris_h
September 10th, 2004, 07:23 PM
Someone answer this PLEASE:
Why did Weir say that they could "go home and brief Gen. Hammond"? She knew he wasn't in charge of the SGC anymore. I mean she took over because he left! And Jack sent her off! So why didn't she (or any other member of the team) question the presence of Gen. Hammond and the lack of General O'Neill???? General Hammond is the head of "Homeworld Security:" a conglomerate of all the myriad of agencies: the SGC, the 302 and 303 programs, the Antarctic outpost, the Atlantis mission, etc.

Excali5033
September 10th, 2004, 07:25 PM
Heheheh, satisfied now?

ShadowMaat
September 10th, 2004, 07:29 PM
C) Production things... I liked the CGI on the planet. Thought it was a nifty image, nicely done. Was I the only one who felt like they had shot the epsiode in a way so that the scenes on earth were more vivid, more bright than they were in the Atlantis shots. Like a visual clue that this isn't real?
The visuals on The Mist Planet were indeed very cool. I can't say I would have pegged the Earth scenes as being more "vivid" but there did seem to be something a little off about them.




Or that McKay wouldn't have dreamed about Carter.
YES!! Absolutely! All they needed to do was get Amanda's double to stand in for her. McKay opens the door, we get a shot from outside of "Sam's" back and witness McKay's reaction. He says, "Colonel Carter!" and she moves in towards him, taking him into the room as the door closes. :D Nice, simple... but probably far too obvious a clue that all is not as it seems. ;)

I liked the line about "It may as well say..." and then I've already forgotten the words... There was another good line, too. Curse my bad memory...

NightGloom
September 10th, 2004, 07:31 PM
Yup, General Hammond would have obviously just hanging out at the SGC waiting for Atlantis to make contact with Earth... yup. Another thing that I liked was Sheppard's random "reality" including his dead friends and his 6th grade teacher. The only thing that could have made it better would be if Steve was there.

I was wondering if anyone's opinion on Weir would change after this ep- we did get to see a lot more of her and her personality.

puddlejumper747
September 10th, 2004, 07:32 PM
General Hammond is the head of "Homeworld Security:" a conglomerate of all the myriad of agencies: the SGC, the 302 and 303 programs, the Antarctic outpost, the Atlantis mission, etc.
OK, but that still doesn't explain why no one questioned his presence. It only explains why she didn't personally mention O'Neill before "returning" home. But surely she would have noticed that immediately when she arrived? Why not just have Jack there as he should be, and Hammond just visiting? I mean, it seemed like Hammond was running the entire SGC, and no one cared. At least Weir could have asked Hammond "where's Gen. O'Neill?" or something like that when they stepped through... :rolleyes:

Excali5033
September 10th, 2004, 07:34 PM
Hah, Steve in the background with a brewski, that would have been great.

Major Fischer
September 10th, 2004, 07:35 PM
Another thing that I liked was Sheppard's random "reality" including his dead friends and his 6th grade teacher.

I cracked up when his 6th grade teacher was there. It was so a sheppard moment. Even better than the fact that Rodney had no new messages.

Anyone else wondering about why the power would have still been on in people's houses, or the gas in Weir's car. You'd think they'd have settled affairs for 'long term' storage sorts. After all, you leave a car standing in the Cheyenne Mountain parking lot in colorado for half a year and it's going to have a problem or two.

major al
September 10th, 2004, 07:37 PM
Someone answer this PLEASE:
Why did Weir say that they could "go home and brief Gen. Hammond"? She knew he wasn't in charge of the SGC anymore. I mean she took over because he left! And Jack sent her off! So why didn't she (or any other member of the team) question the presence of Gen. Hammond and the lack of General O'Neill????

Wow, i was asking the same thing.. terrible plothole? That was the worst part. Even during the commercials it showed Gen Hammond so I knew something was wrong. I was thinking something about an alternate reality, but eeeeeeeeeeek.

In every other sense, this was the best episode.. ever.

zats
September 10th, 2004, 07:37 PM
This one was cool. It was great to see Hammond back, although I wish we could have seen other SGC guys there as well. McKay and Sam interaction could have been fun. I miss those two being at each other's throats.

Anyone know where I can get one of McKay's "I'm with Genius" shirts? It rocked!

The Atlantis team does really lousy when it comes to going home, don't they? First the ZPM from Childhood's End, this...and I'm sure there was another one and we're only halfway through the season. Ouch.

I thought everyone could only bring one personal item from Earth. Earlier we saw that Sheppard had a football tape. Where'd War and Peace come from?

Camera angles were good, especially the scene with Weir and McKay in the lab. The panning back and forth was an excellent tool to enhance the wrongness of the whole situation, even if it did give me a headache. Although that could have simply been a byproduct of sitting with my nose a bare two inches away from the TV screen. Double ouch.

I like Sheppard's house...and Weir's garden. Nice car she had, too.

No Beckett. Bummer. Any episode with him is automatically good (okay, fine. I'm a sucker for Scottish accents. Get over it. :rolleyes: )

chiefchucky
September 10th, 2004, 07:37 PM
I was acctually disappointed in this episode. The reason why I was dissappointed was that we should not have seen a single image of General Hammond and we should not have heard a single thing about the Prometheus because both the General and The BC-303 have not even been mentioned in Stargate Atlantis and probably left veiwers who have watched Atlantis but not even seen a whole SG-1 episode greatly confused. They practically wrote Hammond in as the current commander of the SGC and completely disregarded the fact that O'Neill was established to be the Commander of the SGC in Rising. Also how are people who watch atlantis and haven't seen any sg-1 episodes supposed to know that the Prometheus is a spaceship and how are they supposed to know who the Asgard are? Now I should admit that everyone who watches Atlantis probably is already a SG-1 fan but I thought the writers were trying to keep the two shows apart from each other thus I am dissapointed. For the first time since SGA and SG-1 have been airing side by side has sg-1 been better than SGA. Oh well every season is allowed a bad episode (hopefully this will be the only one).

keshou
September 10th, 2004, 07:39 PM
Yep, good episode. Intriguing way to let us learn more about the team and their backgrounds. I found it interesting that they all so passionately wanted to go back to Atlantis. Up until this episode I've never seen Weir as having that much of a passion for the exploration part of their trip and for the people of the Pegasus galaxy. I feel much better about her character after this episode.

Shep figured it out pretty quickly didn't he? And immediately started testing his theory by thinking about people he knew shouldn't be around. I love that about him, he's got basic common sense smarts. I was convinced Teyla was an alien the whole time and yet it appears she was actually sharing Shep's little virtual reality trip?? Maybe Teyla just comes across as fake to me. ;) I like that they're calling Sheppard "Shep".

McKay was great, both in his guise as real McKay, reacting to the incompetence of the SGC staff and in his guise as fake!McKay. It was unfortunate that AT couldn't play Carter in this episode because surely McKay would have imagined her into his little reality.

I didn't think it was unusual for Hammond to be around but it was pretty strange that O'Neill never turned up. Weir should have at least asked about O'Neill. Interesting that she noticed that Narim...er...Simon kissed differently. Guess aliens aren't good at faking that kind of stuff.

One of the best episodes to date. Written by Joe and Paul and directed by a lady whose name I can't remember. The effects on the planet were very good, enjoyed all the characters this week. McKay is just too cute. Poor guy, no messages on his machine after being gone for months, leftover food in the couch. Of course I guess that's his little reality. I guess the fantasy part was the cat-sitter having a thing for him. ;)

chris_h
September 10th, 2004, 07:40 PM
OK, but that still doesn't explain why no one questioned his presence. It only explains why she didn't personally mention O'Neill before "returning" home. But surely she would have noticed that immediately when she arrived? Why not just have Jack there as he should be, and Hammond just visiting? I mean, it seemed like Hammond was running the entire SGC, and no one cared. At least Weir could have asked Hammond "where's Gen. O'Neill?" or something like that when they stepped through... :rolleyes: M
I
N
O
R

S
G
1

S
8

S
P
O
I
L
E
R
S

Maybe this takes place during "Good to Be King," when Jack's off-world, and Hammond just "happened" to stop by.

The Mist-Hammond did say that they didn't understand our customs. That'll take care of most of the plot holes. :p

Major Fischer
September 10th, 2004, 07:42 PM
I was acctually disappointed in this episode. The reason why I was dissappointed was that we should not have seen a single image of General Hammond and we should not have heard a single thing about the Prometheus because both the General and The BC-303 have not even been mentioned in Stargate Atlantis and probably left veiwers who have watched Atlantis but not even seen a whole SG-1 episode greatly confused.

The viewers aren't that stupid.

As soon as they talked about the fact that the Prometheus was getting new engines people know it's a ship. Besides, this is a spin off where TPTB have flat out stated that there WILL be crossovers. You can't ignore one half of the universe. It would be silly.

Not addressing the O'Neill thing, it's already being talked about. Yes, it's a plothole.

ShadowMaat
September 10th, 2004, 07:44 PM
You can get an "I'm with Genius" shirt right here (http://www.cafepress.com/cp/browse/y-12_N-20645619_Ntk-All_nr-1_Nao-1_Ntt-with+genius_x-12). It isn't anything like McKay's shirt except for the words and the inclusion of an arrow pointing up, but it's still funny. ;)

DJFavorite
September 10th, 2004, 07:44 PM
Good episode.

Even though I knew from the begining that it had to be an illusion of some sort, I still enjoyed the episode. The trying to figure out the illusion and to see the mistakes in it were cool. Did you notice that Hammond had a Blue jacket on at first but later on it was Black? At first I thought "No, I'm not seeing that right." but it was black later on.

When the alien Hammond turned to mist, I immediatly thought of the 'giant aliens' or the furlings.....and wondered if we would ever find out more about them (these new aliens) or if they would end up just being in passing and 'filler' material.

Major Fischer
September 10th, 2004, 07:47 PM
Did you notice that Hammond had a Blue jacket on at first but later on it was Black? At first I thought "No, I'm not seeing that right." but it was black later on.

Lighting.


When the alien Hammond turned to mist, I immediatly thought of the 'giant aliens' or the furlings.....and wondered if we would ever find out more about them (these new aliens) or if they would end up just being in passing and 'filler' material.

Well, they did promise never to come back, that would make learning more about them difficult.

chiefchucky
September 10th, 2004, 07:49 PM
The viewers aren't that stupid.

As soon as they talked about the fact that the Prometheus was getting new engines people know it's a ship. Besides, this is a spin off where TPTB have flat out stated that there WILL be crossovers. You can't ignore one half of the universe. It would be silly.

Not addressing the O'Neill thing, it's already being talked about. Yes, it's a plothole.
well if they can crossover something as big as the prometheus why couldn't they cross over zats? I was just pointing out that the introduction of hammond and the prometheus should have been more gradual and not so in your face for the benefit of new viewers.

ShadowMaat
September 10th, 2004, 07:51 PM
Well, they did promise never to come back, that would make learning more about them difficult.
They're interesting, but not worth a 480 year trip by puddle jumper. ;)

Icemancmd
September 10th, 2004, 08:07 PM
Best Esp Yet!!!!

NurseRatched
September 10th, 2004, 08:08 PM
Liked it.

Shades of both "Gamekeeper" and "Watergate" (sentient beings existing in the (water) mist)...but with some engaging twists. The duel Weir/McKay sequence was especially effective.

Ford was again relegated to a relatively minor role - in his "reality" we don't see him visiting his family (he just refers to it) - then we see him getting reassignment orders and showing up at Shep's Par-Tay Place delivering pizza. Pity.

Shep's got quite the bachelor pad in his reality - furnished by The Sharper Image, pool, a well-stocked bar...note the pinball machine, golf clubs and large Johnny Cash poster (!) on the wall....

MallRat! Teyla was quite entertaining - and it seems she likes beer, too.

McKay the slob...priceless, I tell you. Priceless.



I'm looking forward to next week's ep, but not the fact that it's the mid-season "finale". It's going to be a looooong fall....thank God for college football to partially fill the void.

Excali5033
September 10th, 2004, 08:12 PM
Shep's got quite the bachelor pad in his reality - furnished by The Sharper Image, pool, a well-stocked bar...note the pinball machine, golf clubs and large Johnny Cash poster (!) on the wall....


Don't forget The Pineapple!

Darren
September 10th, 2004, 08:18 PM
First of all, I just need to say, Sergeant HARRIMAN! HA! Take that Darren! :P:P

Now, now ... GateWorld (especially the Omnipedia) follows strict show canon. We can't go calling a guy "Harriman" just because a few fans want that to be his name, with no on-screen evidence whatsoever.

Despite the fact that he's called "Harriman" here in an alien-induced vision given to people who don't know the good Sergeant very well ...

http://www.gateworld.net/omnipedia/characters/links/harriman.shtml

:)

kiwigater
September 10th, 2004, 08:23 PM
I would have loved to have seen Carter with McKay :P I figured she didn't make an appearance cos of the continuing character copyright thing (not just AT's availability) :rolleyes:

In addition to the things other people have mentioned, what I'm wondering is, it seemed that one of the major tip offs for everyone was that sudden "obstacles" appeared to prevent them returning to Atlantis. Seeing as the whole thing was created by their own minds, why would it make any difference if they are "living" out their lives on Earth, or in Atlantis?? Have I missed some reasonable and obvious answer (it's been known to happen! :o).

I did enjoy it overall tho. Poor McKay :P still weird seeing Narim.....er Simon ;) Guess this puts the kaibosh on any more Tollan arc - talk about confusing!

Major Fischer
September 10th, 2004, 08:24 PM
Anyone else wondering about why McKay went off base in his uniform with patches?

ShadowMaat
September 10th, 2004, 08:27 PM
Don't spoil my moment of gloating, Darren, I've been waiting months for this. :P

Hammond just happening to be there still doesn't sit well with me and the lack of Gen. O'Neill was a bit odd. Perfectly reasonable from an outside viewpoint, but in story it is an awfully big gap. And the first person who says the meetings with Jack took place "off screen" or that Jack was conveniently "away" gets slugged. And I mean the gooey invertebrate kinda slugs. Right in the kisser. :P

Skydiver
September 10th, 2004, 08:28 PM
there were a few niggling things


the atlantis crew just larking off to earth without so much as a 'we're gonna be late' concern expressed????

hammond's presence without explaining jack's absence

ferns in colorado

ooh, and let's not forget that huge honkin lake outside shep's window

the lush foliage around simon's house


ok, so i haven't seen all of colorado springs, but the prop guys need to go see SOME of it.

them running around earth, rod anyway, in his sgc clothing?

and yeah, the aforementioned homes having power, cars starting

they're not really plot holes, and all but the scenery is easily explained as clues to the 'dream'

but the lake still bugs me :)


but, at the end of the hour, it was an intrigueing eps, with plot twists that i didn't see coming a half hour before, unlike stargate lately.

To me, it's clear that most of the attention is being funnelled into atlantis and stargate is being left out to fend for itself.

It only makes sense, atlantis has more of a future going for it than stargate which has been on borrowed time for 3 years now, but it's still sad in a way.

the new toy gets played with while the old one is left in a corner

ShadowMaat
September 10th, 2004, 08:33 PM
Anyone else wondering about why McKay went off base in his uniform with patches?
It's probably meant to emphasize his lack of a life and the fact that for him, his work basically IS his life.

However, Weir was also in her uniform shirt (didn't notice the pants).

The real question would be where would the civvies come from? Would the SGC keep their rooms as is, or would things be packed up and moved to a storage facility? And most of them were stationed in Atlantis for quite a while. McKay, in particular, was never actually a part of Stargate Command (except for a few visits) so it's unlikely he'd have a room there. Er... right? Or is that one of those things that got left out of my memos? ;)

Major Fischer
September 10th, 2004, 08:36 PM
However, Weir was also in her uniform shirt (didn't notice the pants).

Shirt, but no patches. The patches are what bothered me more. I think that at least some of them should have been sporting lovely military surplus, but that's just me. At least Weir had gone to Simon's, I bet she has some clothes still at his house.

puddlejumper747
September 10th, 2004, 08:39 PM
They're interesting, but not worth a 480 year trip by puddle jumper. ;)
So I guess the puddle jumpers don't have hyperspace capability... :(
Or, at least, not that we know of... yet. :P

chiefchucky
September 10th, 2004, 08:40 PM
I think the queston should be is what was he thinking going off base wearing those clothes in public LOL.

Skydiver
September 10th, 2004, 08:41 PM
aah, forgot to mention that the director did one heck of a job keeping it all straight.

given that different characters were dressed differently in the various hallucinations, it had to have been a witch to keep straight and direct

ShadowMaat
September 10th, 2004, 08:44 PM
Kudos to the script whatsit continuity person who made sure everyone was dressed right in the right scenes. Even with the scenes being shot whole and then pieced together, it can get tricky. Didn't notice any overt problems.

What did Ford's tshirt say?

Excali5033
September 10th, 2004, 08:45 PM
I liked the line about "It may as well say..." and then I've already forgotten the words... There was another good line, too. Curse my bad memory...

Caught the re-air; "Bing Tittle Tittle Bong" :) That's our Rodney.

Major Fischer
September 10th, 2004, 08:49 PM
"It's like looking through a microscope at a cell culture and seeing a thousand dancing hampsters!"

Excali5033
September 10th, 2004, 08:50 PM
What did Ford's tshirt say?

That I didn't see clearly...looked like 'The Lost Resort'

Bobthespirit
September 10th, 2004, 09:25 PM
Possibly best episode yet. At least second best (I really liked Suspicions).

It's nice to see some of the characters really come alive like they haven't in the past. I think it's a shame that Ford didn't get his own section though. He's supposed to be the military guy that balances out all the less disciplined people, yet he hardly ever does anything.

Redwall
September 10th, 2004, 09:27 PM
I really liked the use of the Outer Limits. Funny (and so not suprising) that McKay would watch it, and the opening titles act as a metaphor for the episode as a whole. Kind of like the Hail Mary thing in "Hide and Seek". I wonder if this is going to be a recurring thing - using references in the episode to describe the overall plot/theme of the episode?

ShadowMaat
September 10th, 2004, 09:28 PM
Is it just me or has Beckett gotten more lines/screen time than Ford? Probably just seems that way. Still, this continued shafting of Ford is really starting to grate on my nerves. Give him a meaty plotline, already! Beckett had one, and he's only a recurring character, Ford is supposed to be main cast! :P

Dragonlor
September 10th, 2004, 10:08 PM
I thought it was alright. But even without looking at spoilers I found this episode way too predictable. And yeah...poor Ford is hardly even in the show it seems.

Major Tyler
September 10th, 2004, 10:08 PM
I'm very disappointed that we didn't get to see any of Lt. Ford's life...I'm more than disappointed, he gets ignored far too often.

cobraR478
September 10th, 2004, 10:53 PM
OK, but that still doesn't explain why no one questioned his presence. It only explains why she didn't personally mention O'Neill before "returning" home. But surely she would have noticed that immediately when she arrived? Why not just have Jack there as he should be, and Hammond just visiting? I mean, it seemed like Hammond was running the entire SGC, and no one cared. At least Weir could have asked Hammond "where's Gen. O'Neill?" or something like that when they stepped through... :rolleyes:
So commands can't change while they were away? Hammond couldn't have just been there by coincidence? Jack couldn't have been off-world on some business?

It was supposed to seem odd. You didn't find it strange that an air force pilot had a home that awesome? Or that Rodney had a date with that hot woman?

vikingjedi
September 10th, 2004, 11:46 PM
Was anybody here hoping Weir would purpose...er I mean accidently get pushed through the gate to Earth and not be able to come back? :D

KUtrekkie
September 11th, 2004, 12:33 AM
Was anybody here hoping Weir would purpose...er I mean accidently get pushed through the gate to Earth and not be able to come back? :D

I was actually wondering why the heck she was going in the first place. The entire senior staff went on this little field trip, so who's running the base? It's not as if Sheppard or McKay couldn't brief the SGC by themselves. That's just poor judgement on Weir's part, IMO.

Otherwise, I really liked this episode. You can't go wrong with an episode that has Outer Limits and Monty Python references. :p

Allison

TameFarrar
September 11th, 2004, 12:33 AM
Just really enjoyed myself watching this episode :D....was a bit annoyed at Sci-Fi for spoiling it a bit.....still am..I would have liked to have NOT known it wasn't real going in and had more of a tension about that as well...BUT Gads I am enjoying this all the way around Shepperd and McKay just crack me up :D

Z_2
September 11th, 2004, 12:53 AM
I liked this episode, even though it was sorta predictable. They gave us enough to go by so we could figure out that they weren't really home. I guessed they were either getting their brains picked for information about Earth by some advanced lifeform (and I knew the Wraith wouldn't create such lasting illusions to confuse the Atlantis team, so I figured it some another sentient beings), or the 'mist' was affecting them somehow to have "dreams".

When you all are griping about "plotholes" with Gen. Hammond being present, I figured instead that it was a good effect, since, as when you're dreaming, some unrelated scenes or images are "kludged" together and you're none the wiser in the experience. We were shown what they were seeing, but if you are always lucid enough in your own dreams to always be doubting what you're seeing, then more power to ya. ;)

I was wondering about the "War and Peace" book, though, too. It couldn't be Sheppard's personal item, since he had the football game. Maybe they brought a few books for a public library?!?

watcher652
September 11th, 2004, 01:50 AM
Is it just me or has Beckett gotten more lines/screen time than Ford? Probably just seems that way. Still, this continued shafting of Ford is really starting to grate on my nerves. Give him a meaty plotline, already! Beckett had one, and he's only a recurring character, Ford is supposed to be main cast! :P
Ford had quite a lot to do in "38 Minutes". It was his turn to save the day in that episode.

I really enjoyed this episode. As some have already said, it was a good way for us to get to know the characters more.

The Gate in the Mist was very pretty.

Interesting that Ford kept his hazmat gear on when the others took theirs off. Did that show Ford really didn't believe what McKay said?

BTW, 1 joule = 10,000,000 ergs.

I thought maybe the book was part of a larger library that everybody was allowed to contribute to. Yeah, make up a story to explain an inconsistancy. I did it with Trek all the time.

When McKay said he'd be back for supper, Weir smiled. That meant that she knew McKay was fully expecting to be done in that time.

Another vote for wondering why Hammond and no O'Neill. Or at least a one sentence excuse for why he wasn't around. Maybe Hammond would still be doing the debriefing, but O'Neill would have been at the Gate with him.

In Weir's initial debriefing with Hammond, McKay acted like himself. Is that because both Weir and McKay had definite ideas on how the debriefing would go with Hammond since both were familiar with him and the Mist had stronger thoughts to drive the meeting? And that's why Hammond and Sheppard's was shorter than Sheppard expected because he didn't have a strong Hammond for the Mist to draw on? Or did Weir and McKay hava a shared reality?

Did anybody notice that when Hammond and Sheppard got on the elevator, it took a lot longer to go from Level 23 to 21 than it did to go from Level 28 to 23? I also thought that the brief debriefing and the offer of a car was when it crossed Sheppard's mind that things were slightly odd,

Would most men think the first thing to do is get Teyla a new outfit?

I was a little sad to see that McKay thought he wouldn't have any messages. And, he did exactly what I would have done first, turn on the TV. Doesn't the SciFi channel show The Outer Limits? Why would his cable/satellite dish still be on? I actually thought McKay was going to figure it out first because when he was crunching down the snacks, he started to look at the open bag like he was wondering why the food was still crunchy. But then the door bell rang and that girl distracted him. Did the Mist do that on purpose? (And yes, I too was wondering why he was walking around the outside with his SGA uniform on).

Sheppard seemed very comfortable with Teyla. He also didn't seem bothered by her reactions.

Finally a show were somebody kisses a fake and knows it. I don't know how many times I've seen two characters kiss and the fake gets away with it.

If you didn't think something fishy was going on before, having Weir change clothes from when she kissing Simon to when she went to McKay's place should have been a clue.

I wonder how many takes it took to do the technobabble down the corridor scene with McKay and Hammond? That was a little breath taking there. And McKay is the one the Mist should be afraid of since he's the one who thought of the Gate idea in the first place. I'm sure McKay felt really bad there at the end when he found out he must have killed some energy beings when they used the Gate.

(damn, I've always wanted to be able to do that finger snapping fist clapping thing McKay does at the end of the corridor scene. alas, I have no rhythm).

I thought it was interesting that McKay was so abrupt in Ford's version of reality. I knew before the episode aired that it wasn't going to be real (darn that McKay line!) so when McKay almost snapped at Ford, I thought "Is that what Ford really thinks McKay would say?" Maybe that reflects his recent "volunteer" work in helping McKay with the Myst DHD. But then I thought maybe that was Ford's "McKay's stuck here and he's really ticked he can't get back" McKay.

Besides football and ferris wheels, Sheppard likes golf, Johnny Cash, and pinball. Oh, yeah and foosball. BTW, I thought it was really funny that Sheppard would put in a girl that wouldn't even date him. Hey, how hard would it be to make beer in Atlantis?

There was interaction with Weir/McKay, Sheppard/Teyla/Ford and McKay/Ford. Is that the way a team would be sent back to Earth? Weir/McKay and Sheppard/Teyla make sense, but why would Ford go back in either combination?

The Mist isn't an astrophysist or it could have made up some laws of physics that actually made sense. How did McKay see a reality that wasn't real if it was all in his mind?

Interesting how the different characters reacted when realizing something was up. Weir asked for an explanation, Sheppard demanded an explanation and McKay got aggravated and ticked off (don't give him a universe where the laws of physics don't work!)

When the Myst revealed itself, it was to Weir, even though Sheppard was the first to question out loud.

Great line: "You're a pig, but I like your cat."

If the Mist could read their minds, why didn't they know that Sheppard was just leading them on? Was it just going along to see how the others would do? If the Mist could really read their minds, why wouldn't it know that we wouldn't use the Gate if it meant killing anyone? I guess the Mist could "read" their minds, but the Mist didn't understand what it read. Like looking at a book in a foreign language. You can see the pictures, but the finer shades of meaning are lost if you don't know the words. I guess when your not used to humans, it's hard to read them when the overwhelming thought was of going Home.

I liked the jacket thing. Hammond wore his jacket with Weir, he had it off with Sheppard and McKay. Hammond is in direct authority to Weir, but isn't with Sheppard and McKay. Weir had on a jacket with McKay, but in her reality she didn't. McKay respects Weir's authority over him. McKay had on his lab coat with Weir and Ford. Weir and Ford respect McKay's technical authority.

Whoa, I've thought about this episode way too much!

the dancer of spaz
September 11th, 2004, 02:14 AM
Just really enjoyed myself watching this episode :D....was a bit annoyed at Sci-Fi for spoiling it a bit.....still am..I would have liked to have NOT known it wasn't real going in and had more of a tension about that as well...BUT Gads I am enjoying this all the way around Shepperd and McKay just crack me up :D

I'm with you, Tame, on the network-induced spoilage - no good! I thought it was a great ep, though. It seemed so much like "Out of Mind" to me, which is OK, because I'm wanting a crossover of the two series really bad (it's not gonna happen), and any homages would be great. I just think the show's doing really well. They have the Big Brother (or is it Sister) show to help them become really fluid and all of that, and they seem to be pulling it off. I'm very happy for them. They're big shoes to fill, and they got 'em taken care of very nicely.

I think Weir's character is kinda like O'Neill's in the sense that she's out of her element. Both characters are trying to find their footing in unfamiliar territory, and both are dedicated leaders. O'Neill has way more experience in the leadership department, but where Weir lacks in experience, she makes up for with deep insight. O'Neill has experience, but sometimes has to call Daniel, Sam, or Teal'c over for some help... which is OK.

Anyway, back to Atlantis: The story HAS been done before, like someone said, but I think they hooked us in pretty well. And the switching between McKay and Weir in the lab was really cool.

I must say that I agree with what someone else said earlier about Carter being missing. I mean, I know she's a Colonel and all, but wasn't that her lab? Isn't that, like, her second home? And McKay may be "the foremost expert on wormhole theory, yada, yada, yada," but that's only on Atlantis. When he's on Carter's turf, I think he has some catching up to do. And I only say this because she's seen a lot of this firsthand... and because she's smarter than Rodney.

Finally, I really like the chemistry (whether you think it's friendship or otherwise) between Teyla and Sheppard. With the way the show is going in popularity, they could either end up as Daniel/Sam friends or... that other relative combo... :O

That's it. I liked the ep, thought it was good, kept thinking of Creepy, yet Endearing Narim and how he was supposed to be dead, and smiled in a lot of parts.

PS - just a quick question:
AT said once that she and CJ couldn't be on Atlantis because of some legalities concerning original Stargate franchise characters, or whatever. I SORTA get it, but I'm a bit confused, because Hammond isn't an original Stargate character, and he's been on the show now. As well as McKay, Harriman, Siler, etc. Can anyone please explain?

watcher652
September 11th, 2004, 02:25 AM
I was wondering about the "War and Peace" book, though, too. It couldn't be Sheppard's personal item, since he had the football game. Maybe they brought a few books for a public library?!?
That's bizarre, I was typing almost the same thing when you posted yours first.

They reminded us of Sheppard's football tape when Sheppard was talking about football and ferris wheels to Teyla and that they could bring back more popcorn from Earth.

Major Fischer
September 11th, 2004, 02:50 AM
AT said once that she and CJ couldn't be on Atlantis because of some legalities concerning original Stargate franchise characters, or whatever. I SORTA get it, but I'm a bit confused, because Hammond isn't an original Stargate character, and he's been on the show now. As well as McKay, Harriman, Siler, etc. Can anyone please explain?

The interview's I've seen have said that they couldn't be in the pilot, because that would be establishing the series, but that they could appear in later episodes because it could be a guest thing.

Is anyone more familiar with exactly what the legal status is?

NurseRatched
September 11th, 2004, 04:09 AM
Don't forget The Pineapple!

The Jim Menard Pineapple? The one on top of the beer fridge? Yup, noticed that. Amazing how in Shep's illusion all the plants in his apartment/condo were green (unlike McKay's), the place was dust-free and all the fruit was fresh.

To whoever made the comment about the large lake outside Shep's place: I lived in Colorado Springs briefly several years ago; there are a few small-ish lakes in town (ie, parks), and I seem to remember a lake in the Broadmoor resort area right below the mountain, but it's quite small. Certainly no large ones, and nothing large enough to warrant the marina that we can see from Daniel's balcony in "The Light". Adding in a little stock footage of the Garden of the Gods area or maybe even CGI-ing in a few shots of, say, Pikes Peaks would make some of the exterior shots a little more Colorado Springs-y.

Another thought: Weir was working in Washington, D.C. prior to being assigned to the SGC. Was she already in a relationship with Simon? He appears to have a very nice house in Colorado Springs - unless the living-conveniently-in-easy-commuting-distance was all part of Wiers illusions.


What was well done was the gradual way the discrepancies began to creep in: the subtle changes in Weir's outfits, "Hammond"'s inconsitencies, Harriman's flippant attitude towards a commissioned officer (Ford). Just enough to make you say "Wait a minute..." before the "Whoooaaa!" stuff started happening later.

keshou
September 11th, 2004, 04:35 AM
The interview's I've seen have said that they couldn't be in the pilot, because that would be establishing the series, but that they could appear in later episodes because it could be a guest thing.

Is anyone more familiar with exactly what the legal status is?
I don't know the exact legal status but I agree with your quote. AT said they could appear in later episodes but not the pilot. I've also heard that if they use a character that's created by someone else they have to pay royalties. If that's accurate I guess Jonathan Glassner comes back into the picture if an SG-1 character is used on Atlantis. Maybe they could only afford royalties for Hammond. ;)

I'm still guessing they couldn't be sure AT would be available -- what with the convoluted production schedule SG-1 has -- so they chose not to use her. It still would have been nice to hear a mention along the lines of "Carter can't figure it out either" in McKay's little reality.

shockwave
September 11th, 2004, 05:07 AM
I believe they would only have to pay glassner is the character that he created/co-created are used in the pilot.

IWantToBelieve
September 11th, 2004, 06:06 AM
I really really liked this episode also, very well done.

There were lots of subtle things going on that were hard to catch. The biggest problem is that Sheppard thought Weir stayed behind in Atlantis and Weir thought she had left Sheppard behind at Atlantis (remember the conversation with Hammond who said he'd contacted Sheppard). The thing is, remember when they are discussing it at Atlantis, none of them were going to gate through. Then the mists take over their mind and manipulate their thoughts and perceptions.

We all know that we got Hammond because the other characters weren't available to be shown, but they should have included at least a question from one of the Atlantis team about where SG-1 or O'Neill, etc. Some mention was probably in order but the lack of it can be overlooked because from the very beginning the Atlantis members are being manipulated.

The McKay that Ford was talking to wasn't his McKay but a virtual, same with the McKay Weir was talking to at the end (she was in the pink shirt and he was in the lab coat). At the same time that's going on McKay is having a "this isn't real" with his virtual Weir (different outfit clues the viewer in on this).

Sheppard's house wasn't his real house. It was his 'dream' house. He knew it was fake at that point and wanted to prove his theory. He comments that his 'home' had been Antartica before leaving for Atlantis.

My hubby guessed about the friends being dead. I initially didn't think so because if dead friends showed up I would've been freaked out, but his comment later about knowing it was fake early on goes to show that it didn't throw him off that much. Kind of like Crichton in the Farscape episode where he's being subjected to illusions and goes along with it to see what's going to happen next.

There was a lot to take in on this episode. About the Tolstoy book, I don't think books count as a personal item. I get the impression that personal items were something aside from normal personal gear. Everyone takes a book on a trip but not many people take a DVD of their favorite football game and popcorn.

ShadowMaat
September 11th, 2004, 06:06 AM
I missed the rebroadcast (fighting with my comp). In the scene in Shep's Dream House, Shep is looking all reflective and Teyla deduces that he's thinking about Weir "and the rest of the people on Atlantis." Were Shep and Weir ever in a scene together in the Fractured Fairy Tales, or in his reality did he (and Teyla) assume that Weir stayed behind to keep an eye on things in Atlantis? If so, is it possible that Weir assumed the same about Shep? That could explain why all the senior staff went through- they didn't know they were ALL going through, they assumed some stayed behind.




I thought it was interesting that McKay was so abrupt in Ford's version of reality. I knew before the episode aired that it wasn't going to be real (darn that McKay line!) so when McKay almost snapped at Ford, I thought "Is that what Ford really thinks McKay would say?" Maybe that reflects his recent "volunteer" work in helping McKay with the Myst DHD.
Actually, I thought Harriman was really abrupt with him, too. The scene kinda read like Wally was telling Ford "tough s***" and it felt extremely out of character for him. Then to have McKay do basically the same thing... I wonder what that says about Ford's personal self-image that he thinks no one cares about him. Hmmm... maybe even HE is noticing he doesn't get a lot of screen time! ;)





The Mist isn't an astrophysist or it could have made up some laws of physics that actually made sense. How did McKay see a reality that wasn't real if it was all in his mind?
Like you said, it's probably a bit like reading a book in a foreign language- just because the Mist can read minds doesn't mean it understands it. How would it know which pieces to take and how to stitch it together properly? Imagine you've been introduced to McKay as an astrophysicist. You have a cheat sheet of terminology and theories that he can't see. How long do you think it would be before he realises that you flunked high school physics? ;)

FoolishPleasure
September 11th, 2004, 06:30 AM
The O'Neill/Hammond plot hole I can overlook understanding contractual issues and actor availability. Sometimes ya gotta overlook a few holes and just go with the flow. I rate it a high "Good".

I didn't care for Teyla's "Britney" clothes and heavy lip gloss but my husband didn't have a problem with it *shaking head*. She is very pretty and has great heart but she still isn't showing much intelligence. Didn't care much for the "pretty girl, skimpy clothes, chugging beer" scene at all.

Poor Ford didn't get much of a chance for anything. Why he was even in this episode was a mystery. Writers should have just had him stay in Atlantis.

McKay was funny and I'm liking him more and more. Especially enjoyed his viewing of "Outer Limits" and the ". .we are controlling transmission. ." quips.

Sheppard and Weir both had great parts. I've liked Shep from the beginning but wasn't too sure of Weir, but this episode was a good vehicle for the character to show more emotion and internal conflict.

Agree with another poster - would have been cool for a Steve cameo at the party! *LOL*

NurseRatched
September 11th, 2004, 06:36 AM
Were Shep and Weir ever in a scene together in the Fractured Fairy Tales, or in his reality did he (and Teyla) assume that Weir stayed behind to keep an eye on things in Atlantis? If so, is it possible that Weir assumed the same about Shep? That could explain why all the senior staff went through- they didn't know they were ALL going through, they assumed some stayed behind.

Good catch. Weir and Sheppard were never in the same scene together until Not-Hammond assembled them all together in the Not-Gateroom. It was Weir, shown alone, who was greeted by Not-Hammond on the ramp. I'm going to assume that McKay was with her, as both of them were shown with the faux general in the briefing room.

I also noticed that Not-Hammond used the phrase "Major Sheppard dialed in about an hour ago" when he relieved Weir of her command...presumably from the Atlantis base.

puddlejumper747
September 11th, 2004, 07:16 AM
It was supposed to seem odd. You didn't find it strange that an air force pilot had a home that awesome? Or that Rodney had a date with that hot woman?
Oh, I understand that, I just find it a little too odd that no one at all actually questioned Jack's absence when they arrived. Maybe I'll assume that Weir (and a few of the others) did ask the mist-Hammond a little later on, and he just made up an excuse that he knew she would accept... :P

Hellcat
September 11th, 2004, 07:17 AM
Another thing that got on my mind:

On the very beginning they say "Hey, if you break the DVD, blah, belh...."

Why not take a PJ to the planet, and if the DVD is broken, use the PJ's internal DHD to dial back.
Too easy, eh?

Now, if ya say "hey, the PJ needs an external DHD to connect to" - I don't think so.
The PJ dialed the "orbit gate" and well.... HAS a full set of buttons - IMHO it's a fully quallified DHD.

Another lightning just struck my head:
Why not build the control crystal into the PJ's DHD?
So they'd have a "protabal earth-dialer" in case they find an uberly charged gate :D

Major Tyler
September 11th, 2004, 07:29 AM
Why not take a PJ to the planet, and if the DHD is broken, use the PJ's internal DHD to dial back?There might not have been room to maneuver a Puddle Jumper with those rock formations and such around.

Now, if ya say "hey, the PJ needs an external DHD to connect to" - I don't think so. The PJ dialed the "orbit gate" and well.... HAS a full set of buttons - IMHO it's a fully quallified DHD.I think someone said the stabalizing pods on orbital gates also provide power in the absence of a DHD.

Why not build the control crystal into the PJ's DHD?Because they might break/loose it...plus, it's not like they really need to. Why would they need to go to Earth from anywhere but Atlantis except in the very slim chance of finding another Myst-like planet?
"protabal"What?

prion
September 11th, 2004, 07:41 AM
Agree with another poster - would have been cool for a Steve cameo at the party! *LOL*

Yeah, woudl have been neat but far too close to the Farscape episode of similiar style in which SCorpius showed up at the bar next to Crichton, although... if they'd been stuck in that reality a lot longer, who know else might have popped up at the party.

prion
September 11th, 2004, 07:46 AM
Don't spoil my moment of gloating, Darren, I've been waiting months for this. :P

Hammond just happening to be there still doesn't sit well with me and the lack of Gen. O'Neill was a bit odd. Perfectly reasonable from an outside viewpoint, but in story it is an awfully big gap. And the first person who says the meetings with Jack took place "off screen" or that Jack was conveniently "away" gets slugged. And I mean the gooey invertebrate kinda slugs. Right in the kisser. :P

Yeah, Jack missing was odd, but it was nice to see Hammond again. The thing is that Jack's style of managemnt would have fit in perfectly in these realities. But oh well, contracts and shows and stuff.

shockwave
September 11th, 2004, 08:04 AM
Home is yet another great episode of Atlantis. It's really going strong. Good pilot. Then H&S and 38 mins weren't good. Then Suspicion started boring but picked up in the second half. And then Childhood's End, PtW, Underground and now Home are all great.

Vespasianus
September 11th, 2004, 08:08 AM
Well, Home isn't my favourite SGA episode, but I liked it. I think the best thing in it is the music and the new city-view at the beginning.

I think that would have been a much better episode, if we didn't know from the beginning this was not real.

watcher652
September 11th, 2004, 09:02 AM
I missed the rebroadcast (fighting with my comp). In the scene in Shep's Dream House, Shep is looking all reflective and Teyla deduces that he's thinking about Weir "and the rest of the people on Atlantis." Were Shep and Weir ever in a scene together in the Fractured Fairy Tales, or in his reality did he (and Teyla) assume that Weir stayed behind to keep an eye on things in Atlantis? If so, is it possible that Weir assumed the same about Shep? That could explain why all the senior staff went through- they didn't know they were ALL going through, they assumed some stayed behind.
Forgot to mention that myself. I thought that was the "if you didn't know something was wrong before, we're really telling you now" scene since it was apparent that both Weir and Sheppard were on Earth but neither was referencing the other.



And the switching between McKay and Weir in the lab was really cool.
Yes, that was really great!



My hubby guessed about the friends being dead.
I saw Sheppard get kind of misty eyed there so I knew he knew something was wrong. But, seeing dead people? Very clever, Sheppard.



Like you said, it's probably a bit like reading a book in a foreign language- just because the Mist can read minds doesn't mean it understands it. How would it know which pieces to take and how to stitch it together properly? Imagine you've been introduced to McKay as an astrophysicist. You have a cheat sheet of terminology and theories that he can't see. How long do you think it would be before he realises that you flunked high school physics?
Yeah, McKay knows exactly how the world is supposed to work, but the Mist is running behind him asking "what are you trying to say here?" and trying to throw it up on his computer. It can't keep up. It's not really pictures, after all, is it? The Mist had an easier time with concrete images, like Sheppard's apartment, than with abstractions.

For whoever mentioned the green plants in Sheppard's place vs the dead ones in McKay's: I thought the dead plants at McKay's place were like that before he left! :)

cobraR478
September 11th, 2004, 09:12 AM
Agree with another poster - would have been cool for a Steve cameo at the party! *LOL*
LOL that woulda rocked.
*Shepard looks over at couch.
*Steve raises beer and gives Shepard a head nod.

fifthmember
September 11th, 2004, 09:13 AM
Someone answer this PLEASE:
Why did Weir say that they could "go home and brief Gen. Hammond"? She knew he wasn't in charge of the SGC anymore. I mean she took over because he left! And Jack sent her off! So why didn't she (or any other member of the team) question the presence of Gen. Hammond and the lack of General O'Neill????
THANK YOU! That was the first thing my husband and I thought. Should have been a dead giveaway things were not right. And if they were pulling things from the team's minds, they would have known Sheppard's friends were dead and he would pick up on that. Duh! And Sheppard asking Teyla if things didn't feel right to her -- how would she know? She's never been to Earth before. And at least one, possibly two DeLuise's in the party scene...please!

The bright spot for me was a reappearance of Don S. Davis. We surely do miss him on SG-1.

Nothlit
September 11th, 2004, 09:30 AM
Was it just me, or did it seem like most of the scenes with Don S. Davis were filmed separately and cleverly edited to make it look like he was actually on set with the other actors? For example, when he's walking to the elevator and the camera pans quickly and we see Sheppard coming down the hallway...that seemed quite abrupt -- neither actor was in the shot at the same time as the other. As they enter the elevator, each seems to make a very concerted effort to stand as far against opposite walls as possible (as if it were a composited split-screen shot) and then it's just quick back-and-forth shots of each actor in the elevator. Almost as if they filmed the scene at different times.

Later, when Hammond and Weir are in Rodney's lab near the end of the episode, they are on opposite sides of the screen, again indicating a possible split-screen composite.

Finally, at the end, when alien-Hammond is explaining the illusion to everyone in the gate room, he is distant from the rest of the group, and we see lots of shots of just him. Whenever we see him from the back facing the team, it could easily be a blue-screen shot. Whenever we see the back of an Atlantis team member speaking to him, it could easily be a body double.

I watched carefully and saw very few shots where Davis and another actor actually interacted. Lots of split-screens and quick-reverse shots. Did anyone else get this feeling? Might have something to do with Davis not wanting to commit a whole lot of time to Stargate after leaving the show? They might have had to film a lot of his stuff at once, sometimes without the other actors.

Or I could just be reading way too much into it... :)

ShadowMaat
September 11th, 2004, 09:36 AM
I did get the feeling that Hammond wasn't quite "there", yeah. And in the debrief with Weir and McKay, he isn't quite looking in the directions he should be. Or at least, that's how I felt.

Skydiver
September 11th, 2004, 09:54 AM
Certainly no large ones, and nothing large enough to warrant the marina that we can see from Daniel's balcony in "The Light". Adding in a little stock footage of the Garden of the Gods area or maybe even CGI-ing in a few shots of, say, Pikes Peaks would make some of the exterior shots a little more Colorado Springs-y..



yes, it would. IIRC, there is even a freighter visible through daniel's window. that is one hell of a view! 1000 miles. wow, i need his apartment complex ;)


and yeah, having someone go to colorado and shoot some actual b-roll of garden of the gods, pikes peak, etc would make it a LOT more believable.

Along with little things like the foliage too.



Another thought: Weir was working in Washington, D.C. prior to being assigned to the SGC. Was she already in a relationship with Simon? He appears to have a very nice house in Colorado Springs - unless the living-conveniently-in-easy-commuting-distance was all part of Wiers illusions.





I got the implication that ALL of them went home, but were still going back to the sgc....ok, so rod, who we last knew of was sent off to russia has an apartment in colorado springs? Along with Shep, who was assigned to the antarctic, weir who lived in DC (although i can sorta see her, since she got command of the sgc)

but all in all, the implication was that all of them went home....to thier places in the springs. And, other than weir, none of them had reason to be living in colorado

KorbenDirewolf
September 11th, 2004, 10:09 AM
I missed the rebroadcast (fighting with my comp). In the scene in Shep's Dream House, Shep is looking all reflective and Teyla deduces that he's thinking about Weir "and the rest of the people on Atlantis." Were Shep and Weir ever in a scene together in the Fractured Fairy Tales, or in his reality did he (and Teyla) assume that Weir stayed behind to keep an eye on things in Atlantis? If so, is it possible that Weir assumed the same about Shep? That could explain why all the senior staff went through- they didn't know they were ALL going through, they assumed some stayed behind.

I think it was like this; Weir and McKay were together. Sheppard and Teyla were together. I don't know who Ford thought he was with.

I wonder if that Ancient gene accounts for the Major's unexpected ability to manipulate his reality?

watcher652
September 11th, 2004, 10:27 AM
I think it was like this; Weir and McKay were together. Sheppard and Teyla were together. I don't know who Ford thought he was with.

I wonder if that Ancient gene accounts for the Major's unexpected ability to manipulate his reality?
I thought it had to do more with their individual talents. Weir and McKay deal more with abstractions. Diplomacy and theorethical physics. Sheppard is a pilot. He deals with what he sees, how he reacts to the physical world.

Major Fischer
September 11th, 2004, 10:48 AM
THANK YOU! That was the first thing my husband and I thought. Should have been a dead giveaway things were not right.

This was explained in about ten different posts after the one you quoted. I think it's extremely unlikely that they would have thought about briefing Jack because they aren't under Jack.

Think of the homeworld security stuff this way, Antartic Outpost/Atlantis Expedition (they are related to one another directly), and than the SGC/Alpha Site/Prometheus (the Pommie crew wear SGC patches), and than maybe Nellis and the research programs. They are all under General Hammond (sited by Weir in New Order. But they are not in each others chain of command. Jack does not command Nellis. The Pommie commander isn't in authority over the Antartic Outpost.

It's a bit like the combined combat commands that the US military is divided into. O'Neill is the commander of one element (like, say, Central Command), and Weir is in command of another (like, say, Southern Command). Hammond, in this analogy is the Chairmen of the Joint Chiefs of Staff. You don't expect the CG of Southern Command to brief the CG of central command about problems in the Panama canal. Now, he may get briefed on them by a lower ranking officer (because the canal has an effect on if his troops get to the Middle East), but SouthCom wouldn't answer to him, because it's not his area of authority.

Not sure how much that made sense.

Markey2
September 11th, 2004, 10:49 AM
I thought it had to do more with their individual talents. Weir and McKay deal more with abstractions. Diplomacy and theorethical physics. Sheppard is a pilot. He deals with what he sees, how he reacts to the physical world.

Yeh that's sort of what I figured.

I personally loved the episode. The minor discrepencies were great, and I loved the bit where McKay and Weir kept talking to each other but switching clothes and that was soo cool.

I also liked the way the first major slip that something was wrong was to the audience (Sheppard talks about Weir in Atlantis).

Oh and Sheppards pad!!!! Godda!!!! How cool was that!!!! He has the coolest dream house ever!

ShadowMaat
September 11th, 2004, 11:24 AM
I think it was like this; Weir and McKay were together. Sheppard and Teyla were together. I don't know who Ford thought he was with.
Well, since in the one bit of his reality we got he was talking to McKay, it's safe to assume he thought he went back with McKay and either Weir or Shep. There were no direct references made that I recall, so it's hard to guess.

Do you think that the Ford at Shep's place was the "real" Ford? Shouldn't he have already been shipped back to Antarctica or something? Or wouldn't he at least have complained to Shep about the reassignment?

Mio
September 11th, 2004, 11:25 AM
Oh and Sheppards pad!!!! Godda!!!! How cool was that!!!! He has the coolest dream house ever!
Agreed. :D

chiefchucky
September 11th, 2004, 11:46 AM
Yeah when I saw sheppard walk into that place I was like "Whoa I wish I had that place!"

jckfan55
September 11th, 2004, 11:49 AM
One of the better episodes. The Hammond thing was a glaring plot gap that has been discussed well. Sounds like we all came up with our own explanations for the absence of O'Neill & Hammond's presence to make it work as we watched. :) I figured the Atlantis expedition was one of the programs that would fall under Hammond's new command & SG1 was off world (not that we ever see them off world this year.) :) But shouldn't Gen. H have 3 stars now with his promotion? Or did I just not see them all?

Major Fischer
September 11th, 2004, 11:58 AM
But shouldn't Gen. H have 3 stars now with his promotion? Or did I just not see them all?

It was never established that he got a promotion in grade when he got the new position. I don't think we'll know for sure until we see Prometheus Unbound.

Z_2
September 11th, 2004, 12:07 PM
I did get the feeling that Hammond wasn't quite "there", yeah. And in the debrief with Weir and McKay, he isn't quite looking in the directions he should be. Or at least, that's how I felt.
I at least thought the Hammond character (whether it was Don's acting or scripted that way) seemed a little stiff in the interactions. So it could be because the lifeform character was not supposed to know how to interact with the humans correctly. But the idea that Don wasn't actually there and the editors spliced scenes together sounds plausible, too. It was like the timing/pace of the scenes was off a little, or people's tones or reactions or the directions they looked didn't quite mesh.

And still for those with the insistence that the characters should have raised questions about discrepancies, do you always have an awareness that you're dreaming when scenes or people are put together that don't usually go together? The "Mist" was working with their unconscious selves, so, along with helping them see what's not there, why couldn't they also prevent them from not rejecting what they see? It's all a mental thing, ya know.

And about which characters were together, Weir, McKay, and Ford had their own realities (like Weir and Ford interacted with a lab-coat wearing McKay), but "Hammond" said something about Teyla being put in with Sheppard's reality. Sheppard's facial expressions showed he knew things were up when he'd think of something and it would suddenly appear. That made me think some sentient beings were just trying to learn more about Earth by fabricating the environment. For Sheppard's reality, Teyla said that she was sure Weir and the others were fine back in Atlantis, so it was obvious the information he and Teyla received was false and it means that Weir and him probably weren't in the same reality together (just bringing up that detail for whoever was asking about it). And the same was true for Weir, since "Hammond" told her Sheppard okayed having a new mission and military presence at Atlantis. Additionally, the first scene where Hammond was standing to greet Weir (whether Don actually was in the same room or not) showed Weir on the ramp by herself, so a similar experience probably happened with the others' realities. The camera didn't show all of the Atlantis team going through the gate or all of them at the Cheyenne Complex when they got back to Earth. Teyla was put with Sheppard since she wouldn't have an idea of what Earth was like. Seeing all of them back home wouldn't make sense if it wasn't like a "dream sequence", since they were the main (credited) crew. That would mean Beckett, Peter Grodin, Kavanagh, Halling, and Sgt. Bates would have been left in charge of Atlantis?!?

I think I missed this detail, but Sheppard asked the driver to go to Green Moss Park, and he said things would make more sense when he sees it. Was he talking about an actual park and did they go there (and I missed it while doing other things), or was that the name of the apartment or subdivision he lived in? I like his comment about how he had all of the toys.

Also, if Sheppard and Teyla were sharing a reality, does that mean Sheppard imagined the clothes and the mall experience that Teyla would see (since she wouldn't have anything to base the experience on)? He'd have to imagine all of the places that she shopped at for hours, and he'd have to have stored in his memory all of the shopping items that she saw. Like if she wanted to go to a pet store and Sheppard didn't like pets or have any animal memories, how would the Mist have dealt with that situation? Or, kind of like the blind spot right in front of you that everyone's brains compensate for, did Sheppard and Teyla only receive the feeling that they shopped, but the full details, like in a dream, really weren't there even though your brain accepts it as fact? What if Teyla didn't want to wear the clothes/lip gloss that Sheppard saw her wearing or wanted her to wear? Did he see her one way, but if we saw her perception of herself, she'd have on different clothes? That would have been funny if he only thought of evening gowns, so that was all that she had to choose from when shopping. When thinking about virtual reality scenes for two people, I just wonder how they'd really happen. Like if Teyla and Sheppard went swimming, and he imagined her as a good swimmer, but she was deathly afraid of water, who's thoughts would govern the 'show' if they still were interacting? And if Sheppard had awakened, would the rest of Teyla's experience then gone stagnant, since the Mist wouldn't have much to go on to continue the illusion? Just curious, but mostly just thinking visibly (as opposed to "out loud")...

Anyway, good episode; I think I'll replay it after the Sooners win another game. :cool:

Ramne
September 11th, 2004, 12:15 PM
Was anybody here hoping Weir would purpose...er I mean accidently get pushed through the gate to Earth and not be able to come back? :D

Yes, but not just hoping... I was screaming it at the top of my lungs!! :D

Adamixoye
September 11th, 2004, 12:21 PM
Dancing hamsters!!! Great line.

All the stuff with Sheppard was great. There's a shot where he's pointing the gun and chugging his beer...not exactly something you'll see in a Hunter Safety Course.

As for Ford...I'm going to make a very unpopular suggestion. I think the character is okay, but if we don't get enough exposition/development...is that really a big deal? Is every single person who could be considered a "main character" in your life all that interesting, or do you know everything about them? That's an odd argument, I know. But the point is that I'm enjoying the character development of the other characters, while at the same time Ford doesn't annoy me. I'm okay if he's "just another guy" for now.

Z_2
September 11th, 2004, 12:31 PM
and yeah, having someone go to colorado and shoot some actual b-roll of garden of the gods, pikes peak, etc would make it a LOT more believable.

Along with little things like the foliage too.
That reminds me of an X-Files episode, "E.B.E". They always type out the location of the scene so you know where they supposedly are. Well, in that episode, Mulder and Scully were sitting in a car off the side of the road, and the information stated "near the junction of Highway 283 and I-90" in Washington state. They were in a lush green forested area, and I think it looked overcast and rainy. Well, maybe to people who haven't visited that actual location, they may accept the scene as part of the "Evergreen State". But... you'd be hard-pressed to find that scene among the farms and sagebrush! Sure, western Washington is green, but central Washington- not so much... :D Also, in the same episode, they state that they traveled around a forested Mattawa for an hour and didn't find anything. First off, Mattawa isn't a forest wilderness. And second, after maybe the most about 3 minutes you'd see there isn't much extra-terrestrial activity or even a powerplant in the area! But it was a great example of a show calling for suspension of disbelief, even though the facts they messed up on were easy for some to verify and probably not even picked up by the majority...

Liv
September 11th, 2004, 01:48 PM
I'm very ambivalent about this episode. I liked it well enough, I just didn't love it, like I thought I would. I've watched it four times already to try and figure out all the little things going on in the different scenarios, and each time I discover something I didn't see the first time around.

It was interesting that Sheppard was the one who managed to manipulate his illusion and how he decided to throw things in there to see how far he could take it. Guys (and girls) wearing camouflage clothing at the party, a fresh pineapple (of all the things at his place, that's the thing that stood out the most to me), the sixth grade teacher and Ford-as-Pizza-Figment guy ("I was just thinking about you.").

I found it amusing that he would allow the fake reality to continue even after the dead pals (who I found way over the top, btw) from the past returned.

How much of it did he control and how much of it was Mist-induced? And exactly what was it that tipped him off about things *being* 'off'? Before the dead guys, I mean. Was it the fact that he was offered transportation by Hammond? I really didn't see anything that would suggest to him that anything might be wrong. "I'm starting to wonder about a few things myself?" is what he said to Teyla in the limo. Based on what?

As for the clothing, how much of that was the mist providing and how much of that was in their own perception? General Hammond had on his jacket, his tie and looked very official in all of his scenes with Weir while he was buttoned up, without a tie and jacket in his scenes with Sheppard and McKay. I don't know if that means anything, whatsoever. It could just be a way to seperate the different scenes more easily, like the Weir/McKay one. 'Course, the way those two were dressed could have meant something, as well. I'll let it go, for now. :p

I so loved the "Bing Tiddle Tiddle Bong" line by McKay. That, and the dancing hamsters.

Teyla did the Teal'c eyebrow-thing. That sort of made me laugh.

I liked the fact that they called Atlantis 'home', at the end.

DownFallAngel
September 11th, 2004, 01:52 PM
That was a great line by McKay, actually both of them.

Major Fischer
September 11th, 2004, 01:53 PM
How much of it did he control and how much of it was Mist-induced? And exactly what was it that tipped him off about things *being* 'off'? Before the dead guys, I mean. Was it the fact that he was offered transportation by Hammond? I really didn't see anything that would suggest to him that anything might be wrong. "I'm starting to wonder about a few things myself?" is what he said to Teyla in the limo. Based on what?

Personally, I think it was the way General Hammond was treating him. Sheppard wouldn't have a lot of experiance with Hammond (if he'd ever met the man), but you have to remember that Sheppard left Earth in disgrace. I think that he knew there was something wrong with the idea of a two star general gushing about what hero he was.

Praxus
September 11th, 2004, 02:04 PM
Hammond was no longer at Stargate Command even prior to the time the Atlantis team left for Atlantis. He didn't seem anything like Hammond in the other episodes. I could tell as soon as I saw him.

DownFallAngel
September 11th, 2004, 02:11 PM
Also, the fact that in the preview McKay "THIS IS ALL A LIE!" might have had something to do with it. This is what I mean about SciFi revealing to much in their freaking spoilers/previews for the upcoming episodes.

derrickh
September 11th, 2004, 02:14 PM
Anyone else notice that Weir was a lot 'perkier' in her own dreamworld than she was in everyone elses? (and I don't mean her personality).

D

DownFallAngel
September 11th, 2004, 02:17 PM
Anyone else notice that Weir was a lot 'perkier' in her own dreamworld than she was in everyone elses? (and I don't mean her personality).

D

So you mean her boobs? You couldn't have just said boobs?

Also, Higginson's dog was in this episode. He played himself as Sam.

Major Fischer
September 11th, 2004, 02:20 PM
So you mean her boobs? You couldn't have just said boobs?

Ah, the wonders of the things people will comment on, but not want to admit commenting on. *L*

DownFallAngel
September 11th, 2004, 02:25 PM
I didn't comment on her boobs.

I do comment on how extremly (!!!!!!) attrective she is though. Cause she is.

Major Fischer
September 11th, 2004, 02:31 PM
I didn't comment on her boobs.

I do comment on how extremly (!!!!!!) attrective she is though. Cause she is.

Didn't mean you were, I was agreeing with you ;)

And I agree with you. She is very attractive.

DownFallAngel
September 11th, 2004, 02:33 PM
Of course you're agreeing with me! Am I ever wrong? No.

lol.

Just kdding.

derrickh
September 11th, 2004, 02:34 PM
Ok. Her breasts were a lot more perky and upright when she was in her own little fantasy world than they were in everyone elses. She could've put someones eyes out with those things. But then switch to the way McKay saw her and her breasts were back to thier normal somewhat droopy selves.

D

DownFallAngel
September 11th, 2004, 02:42 PM
You know I really didn't notice that. Then again I'm not obssessed with her breasts. I was watching the show.

Greesha
September 11th, 2004, 03:58 PM
great episode! i especially liked the part where mckay and weir were talking and they kept switching between realities.

about the spoilers in the trailer - i thought it was obvious going in that they weren't really going back home, even without the trailer, just because it's too soon in the show for them to actually get back to earth for real. like that episode of farscape where john goes back to earth - it's pretty obvious that it's fake, because it would ruin the premise of the show if he could go home.

what i did notice in the trailer was - did anyone else think that the guy sheppard shot was mckay? or was that just me?

Major Fischer
September 11th, 2004, 04:36 PM
So, third viewing when I was looking for things...

Putting aside Sheppard's reality because he is special...

I really love how in each different persons fabricated reality the other cast members were flat, in the same way the Myst was flat. The Myst picked the worst elements and amplified them, I would guess, in an effort to drive them away from the project.

For Rodney they made being at home much more appealing (with the neighbor girl), and Weir in his visions is flat, severe, and dismissive. In Weir's reality Simon is appealing, loving and caring, and the chance to make up for something she knows hurt him. Simon was also a chance for her to relax, truely relax, for the first time probably in six months. But in that case, Rodney (and her chance at finding a solution to getting back to Atlantis), is sarcastic, dismissive, and biting. Much the way we remembered him from SG1 in 48 Hours.

But in the end each person (except for Ford apparently), realized that reality was wrong fundamentally when the people they most trusted, their teammates, were betraying them. I thought it was a nice way to talk about the idea of team.

They did a much better job of humanizing Weir. I think just the look on her face when she gets out of the car adds a great deal of depth to her character. And I liked that she knew something was wrong with Simon. Fake people can't kiss ;)

ed233
September 11th, 2004, 05:01 PM
I really think McKay should have figured things out sooner. As soon as he saw the laws of physics weren't working, he should have known it was fake. Like Spock in "Spectre of the Gun". Granted McKay is no Vulcan Logic-Machine but if the laws of physics (one of reality's many attractions) don't apply, then you're not in reality.

AsgardCarnage
September 11th, 2004, 06:11 PM
i liked it, most of the plot holes could have been put to rest with the fact that the mist was manipulating their minds so like a dream they could have just suggested minor things should be that way so the team accepted it. it was the major things they couldn't change their minds about, like their strong desire to go home and then back to atlantis.

It wasn't till the second time around that i realised no one was interacting with anyone else. when they said shepard dialed in i thought he meant by phone.

i loved the hamster and bing tittle tittle bong line by mckay comedy gold!

when they first said shep figured it out earlier and could control it, i thought it was the acient gene but the explination that he deals in tangable physical situations as a pilot taking great detail into account while the others work in politics and physics, mostly intangables. both make sence but then jack has the acient gene and he is a pilot and works well with tabgable things as well, maybe the gene makes u more aware of the evnviroment and your surroundings

also i like who we learned why the atlantis gate is the only one that can connect to earth. but i agree i would have loved to have seen steve at the party, i'm sure shep misses steve and it would have been a great way to know if the reality is real or not

chiefchucky
September 11th, 2004, 06:40 PM
You know I really didn't notice that. Then again I'm not obssessed with her breasts. I was watching the show.
I am and I still didn't notice maybe I should watch it again.

HIj'Qa
September 11th, 2004, 08:50 PM
Also, the fact that in the preview McKay "THIS IS ALL A LIE!" might have had something to do with it. This is what I mean about SciFi revealing to much in their freaking spoilers/previews for the upcoming episodes.

Everytime I saw this I thought it was McKay learning that Sam was engaged!

I liked it a lot, as an episode. I like mind-puzzle mess with reality episodes. The lack of Ford development is the only thing that really bothers me. And Shep imagining Teyla shopping for hours is a bit of a stretch, since he seems to have some trouble getting girls to date him. But once we get moving with the episode, it's ok.

I just wish Shep had tested the illusion by imaging a big ferris wheel in his back yard!

Sy'onei
September 12th, 2004, 01:26 AM
I thought the episode was good. I'm still waiting for the great episode, but pretty cool so far. Now that I watch it over i can see how Shep had his misgivings when Hammond offered the transporation. You could just see it in his face. I have to say that Shep thinking Teyla shopping for hours is a natural male belief that women shop for decades. I would have liked Ford to have had more of a story in it but i'm optomistic about the future.

Liv
September 12th, 2004, 07:43 AM
How much of it did he control and how much of it was Mist-induced? And exactly what was it that tipped him off about things *being* 'off'? Before the dead guys, I mean. Was it the fact that he was offered transportation by Hammond? I really didn't see anything that would suggest to him that anything might be wrong. "I'm starting to wonder about a few things myself?" is what he said to Teyla in the limo. Based on what?



Personally, I think it was the way General Hammond was treating him. Sheppard wouldn't have a lot of experiance with Hammond (if he'd ever met the man), but you have to remember that Sheppard left Earth in disgrace. I think that he knew there was something wrong with the idea of a two star general gushing about what hero he was.
Okay, I can buy that, I guess. :).

It just seemed a bit rushed to me, like there was a scene missing or something. It felt like a bit of a stretch to have him assume something was wrong based on - essentially - one comment. The only other thing that might have tipped him off, would have been the briefing scene, since his next scene is with Teyla. Oh, well. :cool:

Another little thing I noticed after yet *another* rewatching, was that quick double take that Sheppard does in his 'apartment' when he sees the Johnny Cash poster. Sort of a Rising - "Did I do that? - moment. It was something that I didn't even reflect on when I first saw the episode, but once I knew what was going on, all of his different reactions took on a whole other meaning, what with Sheppard manipulating things around him.

Ugly Pig
September 12th, 2004, 07:46 AM
As always, I'm posting this without having read any Atlantis-related comments since the airing of the latest episode. I'm looking forward to going back and reading what everyone else said, but first:


PIGGY'S USELESS OPINION
of 'Home'

First, the good stuff: It felt great seeing General Hammond back, even though it was really just a steam of I Can't Believe It's Not General Hammond. Also, Weirs boyfriend - I've completely gotten over the initially annoying fact that he's Narim's identical twin. I just hope the plot never calls for the two of them to be in the same room! :D

This episode is one of those that will probably be a lot of fun to rewatch. I didn't realize until half-way through (or whenever it was when Weir started talking as if Sheppard stayed behind on Atlantis and vice versa) that the team were all in separate illusions (except Teyla). It will be interesting to go back and this time be able to figure out whose illusion we're seeing at any given moment. What I did know, however, was that they were not really back on Earth. That's because Sci Fi's preview gave it away. I know there's been much talk online about how they wouldn't really get back, but the episode would have been able to fool me had I not seen that way-to-spoilerish preview. Thanks a lot, Sci Fi.

But the episode itself really can't be faulted for that. So here's the bad about the episode: First of all... Wait a minute, there wasn't anything bad about this episode! Cool. Well, I guess I could nitpick that the "fog" entity was able to recreate Earth to such a great detail in their minds to the point where it was able to convice them it was real, yet miss such a basic rule as "If you're dead, you don't throw your buddy a party!". But the impression I got from the episode was that the entity gave the team whatever they wanted at any given moment (except the option to return to Atlantis) to try to keep them content. Sheppard was thinking of his pals, then they immediately showed up - the fog creatures just missed the fact that they were dead.

I wonder, how will the experiences from this episode come into play when the team really do get home? Will we see Weir be reunited with Simon again, for real, or will it be glossed over? Will General Hammond be there to greet them? Will they find a way of travelling back and forth between Atlantis and Earth without having to be concerned with each trip that it might be one-way?

Everybody loves random observations!
- McKay wears a shirt with the text "I'm with genious" and an arrow pointing to his head. Does that mean McKay is somehow with himself, or does he have some sort of sick and wrong relationship with his shirt?
- Lots of references to the Stargate universe outside of Pegasus in this one. The Asgard, the Goa'uld, Prometheus, SG-1, General Hammond, Chevron Guy (who I guess is really officially named Sgt. Harriman now) were all mentioned for the first time on Stargate Atlantis.
- Sheppard's pals called him "Shep". Heh.
- No Wraith. I have a feeling we won't be seeing them for a while now.
- How come General O'Neill was not even mentioned? Something to explain why he appearantly wasn't present?
- As Weir came through the SGC gate, the SG-1 theme was played (not the original David Arnold Stargate theme, but Joel Goldsmith's theme which is played over the SG-1 end credits). Nice.
- Did they break a ZPM prop?
- This would have been the first Earth based Atlantis episode, if it hadn't turned out they were never on Earth after all...
- So, the Atlantis stargate is not the only link back to Earth because it's special - it's actually the DHD which is different. I guess that means no gate connected to a DHD in the Milky Way is able to dial other galaxies either, then. Lucky thing the SGC doesn't use a DHD at all, or we would probably never have found out about intergalactic gate travel.
- Great McKay lines: "Only if I screw up, which is extremely unlikely!" and "How do you go from 'You're a pig but I like your cat' to 'I missed you'?"

And now, to wait for the shocking final episode of Atlantis, hopefully many years from now, when they realize they never got out of that fog and that everything that's happened in the meantime was BS. Aired on the same night as the shocking final episode of SG-1, in which SG-1 realize they're still in the 'Gamekeeper' chairs. That'd be one heck of a reset button, huh? Completely wiping out the entire Stargate universe as we have come to know it! :D

This episode, however, I enjoyed every second of. Therefore, it shall receive a


http://photobucket.com/albums/v413/uglypig/thumbsup.gif

jckfan55
September 12th, 2004, 07:51 AM
It was never established that he got a promotion in grade when he got the new position. I don't think we'll know for sure until we see Prometheus Unbound.

Thanks. I must have been assuming & we all know what that gets you. :)
Still, I hope the AF has promoted him given his added responsibilities.

ShadowMaat
September 12th, 2004, 08:00 AM
McKay wears a shirt with the text "I'm with genious" and an arrow pointing to his head. Does that mean McKay is somehow with himself, or does he have some sort of sick and wrong relationship with his shirt?
Haven't you ever seen the "I'm with stupid" t-shirts? Sure, most of 'em have an arrow pointing sideways to indicate the person next to the wearer, but I think I've seen ones with arrows pointing up (or maybe down, hehe), too. This was just the reverse of that. How on Earth do you get the idea that he's having a "sick and wrong relationship" with the shirt?

ToastBusters
September 12th, 2004, 08:01 AM
haha... I'll second the thumbs up. Great ep. I didn't particularly enjoy the sg-1 ep, but this definitely made up for that.

I just loved all of the twists and turns.

keshou
September 12th, 2004, 08:30 AM
- Sheppard's pals called him "Shep". Heh.
Yes! Has he been called "Shep" before on the show? Whatever, it's canon now! As it should be - Shep's a great nickname. :)


- As Weir came through the SGC gate, the SG-1 theme was played (not the original David Arnold Stargate theme, but Joel Goldsmith's theme which is played over the SG-1 end credits). Nice.
Good catch.


- Did they break a ZPM prop?
Looked like it. I think they can get another one at Radio Shack ;)


And now, to wait for the shocking final episode of Atlantis, hopefully many years from now, when they realize they never got out of that fog and that everything that's happened in the meantime was BS. Aired on the same night as the shocking final episode of SG-1, in which SG-1 realize they're still in the 'Gamekeeper' chairs. That'd be one heck of a reset button, huh? Completely wiping out the entire Stargate universe as we have come to know it! :D
This would be *so* wrong and yet *so* fab at the same time.

Really enjoyed your review this week. :D

Ugly Pig
September 12th, 2004, 08:46 AM
Haven't you ever seen the "I'm with stupid" t-shirts? Sure, most of 'em have an arrow pointing sideways to indicate the person next to the wearer, but I think I've seen ones with arrows pointing up (or maybe down, hehe), too. This was just the reverse of that. How on Earth do you get the idea that he's having a "sick and wrong relationship" with the shirt?
Sure, I've seen the "I'm with stupid" shirts, I've just never seen one with the arrow pointing to the person wearing it. I just mean that since the shirt says that he's with the person it's pointing to, and it points to himself, it doesn't really make sense when you think about it. I mean, how can one "be with" one self?

Or, I'm just goofing around. :D

watcher652
September 12th, 2004, 10:21 AM
As always, I'm posting this without having read any Atlantis-related comments since the airing of the latest episode. I'm looking forward to going back and reading what everyone else said, but first:

Is that the way you do your review? I do that for another show I watch. This episode was the first time I wrote up something, but I snuck a peek at what others wrote since I didn't know if there was any kind of protocol here.

I don't have the SG background, so sometimes things pass right over my head. For example, someone said there should have been an explosion when McKay knocked over the ZPM. McKay was so sure that it was a fake that he didn't hesitate in breaking it. Now the scene where he's picking up the broken pieces makes more sense to me. You didn't really have to know about ZPMs to understand the scene, but it gives more insight into McKay's behavior.

Or sometimes I notice something, but I don't know that it's significant. For example, I noticed the Stargate music when Weir was standing on the ramp, but I didn't think that was unusual.

I really enjoyed your observations. You have a new fan!

watcher652
September 12th, 2004, 10:30 AM
Sure, I've seen the "I'm with stupid" shirts, I've just never seen one with the arrow pointing to the person wearing it. I just mean that since the shirt says that he's with the person it's pointing to, and it points to himself, it doesn't really make sense when you think about it. I mean, how can one "be with" one self?
It's McKay. If he could hold a conversation with himself, he'd be perfectly happy. Or maybe not. He can't really be more impressed with himself than he already is. :D

DarkQuee1
September 12th, 2004, 12:52 PM
I haven't been able yet to read the other posts, so this may have already been mentioned, but I thought that the ep made the main characters look stupid. They should have figured it out a lot sooner. Like, the minute they came through the gate. Hammond was a 2-star, when they knew he'd been promoted to 3-star, and was at the SGC instead of overseeing the entire program. And...where was Gen. O'Neill? Or McKay's fav, Sam Carter? Or any of them?

Not to have any one of the people who came through the gate even ask about this--even if the explanation wasn't the best, it would have been something.

That's stupid in two episodes now for McKay. I couldn't believe his mouth and lack of common sense in Underground. He couldn't say *anything* without saying something he shouldn't. When did he lose all common sense?

I did like the opening shot, which I thought was magnificent, and the way they played the Weir-McKay scene. And I thought Sheppard was *really* channeling Jack O'Neill this time around!


J.

Major Fischer
September 12th, 2004, 01:04 PM
I haven't been able yet to read the other posts, so this may have already been mentioned, but I thought that the ep made the main characters look stupid. They should have figured it out a lot sooner. Like, the minute they came through the gate. Hammond was a 2-star, when they knew he'd been promoted to 3-star, and was at the SGC instead of overseeing the entire program. And...where was Gen. O'Neill? Or McKay's fav, Sam Carter? Or any of them?

But Hammond ISN'T a three star general. We have no evidence what so ever that he was promoted in grade. Only in position.

Wyrminarrd
September 12th, 2004, 01:26 PM
And just because we didn´t see any of the others doesn´t mean that they didn´t, it just wasn´t shown in the episode.

As for my oppinion on the show: I thought it was good even though the idea behind it has been used way to often in sci-fi shows.

FieryHands
September 12th, 2004, 03:13 PM
Wow, I'm definitely in the minority here. I strongly disliked this episode. Aside from a few cute things, like say McKay's shirt and the dancing hamsters, hardly anything in this episode stuck out. The lack of mention of O'Neill--who even if isn't Weir's boss would have been there when she/he/whoever came through the gate, and Carter, who should have been imagined there by McKay. Ford's barely there presence also really put me off--it was as though they couldn't write in for more than four cast members plus guest stars.

I suppose what irked me the most is that I HAVE seen this type of episode too many times and I saw too many similiar things from other shows. The scene with Sheppard pointing out random people from his memory was deja vu, as was him shooting his dead pal.

Its good though to see what other people liked though, gives me a different perspective.

Larry
September 12th, 2004, 04:01 PM
Well, everybody has said all the important stuff, so I'll just go with the chauvenistic male comment. I wish Tayla could have taken that mini-skirt back to Atlantis with her. :eek: :D

chiefchucky
September 12th, 2004, 04:21 PM
be carefull about voicing negative opinions on anything you could lose a lot of reputation points.

NightGloom
September 12th, 2004, 04:50 PM
be carefull about voicing negative opinions on anything you could lose a lot of reputation points.

Meh, reputation doesn't matter. Voice your opinion and I'll respect you for your opinion be it positive or negative.

I thought the premise was slightly overused, but I thought they did a pretty good job with it. I do agree with you on the Ford thing, I wish he would get a few more lines or a least some air-time.

And now for something completely different- I want a shirt like McKay! Except mine would definitely have "genius" spelled wrong.

ShadowMaat
September 12th, 2004, 06:11 PM
be carefull about voicing negative opinions on anything you could lose a lot of reputation points.
Oh, please. Just because some people are immature enough to zap you if they disagree with your opinion doesn't mean that EVERYONE abuses the ratings system. Besides, as NG said, ratings don't matter, post content should. FH is hardly the only one to have complaints about the ep and it isn't as if she said "This ep sucked because I hated it!"

Sure, there were things not to like about the ep, but I happened to think the "good" outweighed the "bad" in this case. Not everyone agrees, obviously. It would be a very boring world if everyone had the same opinion. :P At least, that's MY opinion. :P

the dancer of spaz
September 12th, 2004, 06:13 PM
Wow, you guys have been busy!

Sorry for posting so late, and sorry if someone else mentioned this:

But isn't Hammond the one in charge of Planetary Defense or whatever? That would explain why he would be there instead of Jack. Weir knew of General Hammond's promotion, and surely would have told the others, right?

Also, though Teyla's attire was less than... uh, normal (as in, I can't see any other Stargate women wearing it!)... it did show her innocence. Yes, the beer could've been left out, but it was so dang funny! :D

And, concerning legalities and SG-1 actors, I understand now. Thanks to those of you who helped clear that up for me. Now all we have to do is hope that one of the upcoming eps has a crossover, because that would rock. :)

Major Fischer
September 12th, 2004, 06:23 PM
But isn't Hammond the one in charge of Planetary Defense or whatever? That would explain why he would be there instead of Jack. Weir knew of General Hammond's promotion, and surely would have told the others, right?

Rising takes place a fair bit of time after New Order, and I'm fairly certain everyone on the Atlantis expedition knows who Hammond is because he's overseeing all of homeworld security.

It's not particularly strange that he'd be at the SGC, after all, it is an element in his responsibilty, just like in Prometheus Unbound he is on the Promedtheus during it's theft. Generals visit elements of their commands all the time.

The Mist most likely had a sense from Sheppard and Weir's minds that Hammond was someone important, and an authority figure that they were most likely to obey. That would be why it chose to take his form.

watcher652
September 12th, 2004, 11:38 PM
I have a question. When McKay was taking his nap, why did the Mist decide to wake him up to tell him about the Prometheus? The Mist could have let him sleep the day away and McKay would be none the wiser. It was almost like the Mist had linked Weir and McKay together and although they weren't sharing the same reality, they were sharing the same general story line. If anybody was going back, it probably would have been those 2.

And when McKay was asleep, was he really asleep? Could the Mist read his mind even when he was asleep? Then the Mist would be reading his dreams and getting a whole unreal reality.

Livi2Jack
September 13th, 2004, 04:49 AM
Because Gen. Hammond is still Jack's superior except now he is stationed at the Pentagon. He is in charge of "Homeworld Security"

Slainey
September 13th, 2004, 05:41 AM
snipped
Also, though Teyla's attire was less than... uh, normal (as in, I can't see any other Stargate women wearing it!)... it did show her innocence. Yes, the beer could've been left out, but it was so dang funny! :D



I wonder if Teyla's attire was Shepard's first clue that something was wrong. It was almost as if he chose what she ended up with. Perhaps he had unconsciously manipulated the selection.

prion
September 13th, 2004, 06:06 AM
I wonder if Teyla's attire was Shepard's first clue that something was wrong. It was almost as if he chose what she ended up with. Perhaps he had unconsciously manipulated the selection.

I think General Hamond getting him a car to take him anywhere was the first clue. No wait, it was the very short briefing which Shepaprd commented about. I think that was the first clue, but it was a culmination of clues - that, the car, just going out into the world without any real bother - that nagged him. After all, if he and Teyla were the only people back from Atlantis, the briefing would last more like days than probably an hour or less than it did.

As for Teyla's outfit, I think that was drawn from Sheppard's own mind, because Teyla had no earth memories to drawn upon, unlesss at some point in time Sheppard explained how Earth women dressed.

Just wanna know how she managed to walk in heels if she'd never worn them before (just assuming she's never worn heels as they'd be impractical on her world).

FieryHands
September 13th, 2004, 06:56 AM
Just wanna know how she managed to walk in heels if she'd never worn them before (just assuming she's never worn heels as they'd be impractical on her world).

Yeah, I noticed. What's up with that? Saw a highlander ep where an Egyptian Immortal who'd been dead for some thousands of years learned how to walk in heels clumsily. But of course, like all people from another time/planet, she magically knew modern english.

I agree, I Sheppard probably picked that outfit out for Teyla, or imagined the sales person going, "oh, you have to try THIS one, you'll look so cute!"

FoolishPleasure
September 13th, 2004, 07:24 AM
As far as Teyla's attire. . .Carter has always been attractive and sexy. . with no fancy hair-doo, no heavy lip gloss, and no skimpy clothes. Hoping Teyla doesn't turn into the resident "jiggle girl" and that someone puts some interesting words in her mouth soon.

Z_2
September 13th, 2004, 08:44 AM
Just wanna know how she managed to walk in heels if she'd never worn them before (just assuming she's never worn heels as they'd be impractical on her world).
Well, if you go with the concept that the Mist was manipulating the scenes, they could make her walk without any trouble. If they were using Sheppard's experiences, then he might not have thought about the fact that she wouldn't know how to walk in heels, or he didn't want to have her portrayed that way. Or since Teyla and Sheppard shared the reality, she might not have wanted to look awkward, so the Mist didn't let her.

But still, it's a manipulated reality of fictional characters, so it makes sense that it wasn't part of the story to spend time having Teyla look awkward. ;)

Livi2Jack
September 13th, 2004, 10:16 AM
I was thinking the same thing about walking in heels...and I kept noticing she was wearing a nearly identically cut top to the style before, kinda lace it up skimpy open front sleeveless thing. Same taste actually. Thought it was funny.

Thought they should have played the music for "It's in his kiss" with the Cher version when Weir was kissing Narim.

rihannsu
September 13th, 2004, 11:50 AM
I so loved the "Bing Tiddle Tiddle Bong" line by McKay. That, and the dancing hamsters.


Having never watched a second of Monty Python, I had to Google to see where the heck he came up with it.
:eek:

DarkQuee1
September 13th, 2004, 03:26 PM
But Hammond ISN'T a three star general. We have no evidence what so ever that he was promoted in grade. Only in position.

Yes, we were. We were told that Hammond was promoted to Lt. General. That's a three-star.


J.

Major Fischer
September 13th, 2004, 03:27 PM
Exactly when do you think we were told that, I'll be glad to pop in a tape and check, but I an 99% sure you are wrong.

DarkQuee1
September 13th, 2004, 03:29 PM
And just because we didn´t see any of the others doesn´t mean that they didn´t, it just wasn´t shown in the episode.

Sorry, I can't agree. Jack is now the general in command of the SGC, and he should have been there for such an importatn event--or at least, there should have been an explanation offered to allay suspicions. And McKay, the way he feels about Carter, would have gone looking for her.

The fact that none of the Atlantis team seemed to *have* any suspicions at all--so no explanations were offered--just made them look stupid. There should have been bells going off from the first minute they arrived at the gateroom.


J.

Major Fischer
September 13th, 2004, 03:49 PM
SG1: New Order
Weir's exact words about Hammond:

"No... General Hammond is being promoted. He'll be overseeing all things relating to the earth's defense on behalf of the Pentagon and Washington. The SGC, the 303 Project, the Antartic Site. Unofficially it's being called 'Homeworld Security.'"

The words lieutenant general are no where in there, and before you say that it can be assumed that responsibilty comes with a higher rank, Stargate has never been logical about that. Stargate Command itself should be under a four star general on the basis that it is a 'Command'.

SG1: Zero Hour
Jack's letter to Hammond we never see the first page and how it is addressed.

Have I missed another mention of Hammond?

gwangung
September 13th, 2004, 07:02 PM
I think the complaints about O'Neill's absence are a bit on the nitpicky side.

Think much of this has to do with the availability of Richard Dean Anderson; if he was up in Vancouver full time, it'd be easier to arrange the shooting.

As well, he doesn't serve much of an internal, story-based function, as his only reason to appear is to...show he's there (he would not serve in the debriefing process and would pop in for social/morale purposes and to show continuity with SG-1; not worth the logistical problems and expense for that kind of payoff....).

Major Fischer
September 13th, 2004, 07:07 PM
I wonder how they handled the shooting of Atlantis on the SG1 sets so as not to get in the way of SG1's shooting schedual...

ShadowMaat
September 13th, 2004, 07:10 PM
Just film in the parts not being used. ;)

I wonder if McKay's lab is also Carter's lab (which is also the infirmary, I think... or Daniel's lab... or both). And I mean that in a strictly locational sort of way and by no means am trying to imply that McKay and Carter share a lab. :D

gwangung
September 13th, 2004, 09:11 PM
I wonder how they handled the shooting of Atlantis on the SG1 sets so as not to get in the way of SG1's shooting schedual...

That's called production management..... :D

On the days that SG-1 is set for location shoots, just swoop on in to the SGC set and film...Needs a little organization, that's all....

Hellcat
September 13th, 2004, 10:56 PM
[...] and by no means am trying to imply that McKay and Carter share a lab. :D
However that would be fun to watch.... at least for the audience (a.k.a. us) :D:cool:

prion
September 14th, 2004, 08:43 AM
Yeah, I noticed. What's up with that? Saw a highlander ep where an Egyptian Immortal who'd been dead for some thousands of years learned how to walk in heels clumsily. But of course, like all people from another time/planet, she magically knew modern english.

I agree, I Sheppard probably picked that outfit out for Teyla, or imagined the sales person going, "oh, you have to try THIS one, you'll look so cute!"

Oh lord, yes, the sales person. NO doubt about that, especially if it cost a lot, and WHO paid for it? I suspsect Sheppard went in with her for a while but after an hour or two couldn't take it anymore, and gave her the credit card and went back to ponder all the weirdness he was observing.

Mr. Seven
September 14th, 2004, 07:37 PM
I want to know who paid for the pizza's?

Ford said he caught the pizza guy and just brought them up? Did he mug him?

I liked this episode a lot, but it would have been better if they played it up like they really went home and then tricked us at the end.

It was kind of a waste since we already knew they weren't really home.

Hellcat
September 14th, 2004, 08:29 PM
It was kind of a waste since we already knew they weren't really home.
I think if we had not been spoiled by trailers and other spoily stuff we actually aould have been tricked in thinking they are home.

Well, I really enjoyed it anyway - since I'm used to catch up any spoiler I can get :D

ShadowMaat
September 14th, 2004, 08:34 PM
I think the summary of the ep itself made it obvious they weren't really home. "The crew finds a way back to Earth then learns they may not get back to Atlantis." That smacks heavily of set-up right there. But yes, SCIFI does have a long history of screwing up the suspense...

DarkQuee1
September 14th, 2004, 10:14 PM
SG1: New Order
Weir's exact words about Hammond:

"No... General Hammond is being promoted. He'll be overseeing all things relating to the earth's defense on behalf of the Pentagon and Washington. The SGC, the 303 Project, the Antartic Site. Unofficially it's being called 'Homeworld Security.'"

The words lieutenant general are no where in there, and before you say that it can be assumed that responsibilty comes with a higher rank, Stargate has never been logical about that. Stargate Command itself should be under a four star general on the basis that it is a 'Command'.

SG1: Zero Hour
Jack's letter to Hammond we never see the first page and how it is addressed.

Have I missed another mention of Hammond?


Sorry, but "promoted" means exactly that. Not simply a lateral move to another command, even if that command covered a wider area. Especially in the military. When they said that Hammond was promoted, they were telling us that he had gone up in rank. That would move him to a three-star. There's nothing equivocal about it.

J.

DarkQuee1
September 14th, 2004, 10:18 PM
This was explained in about ten different posts after the one you quoted. I think it's extremely unlikely that they would have thought about briefing Jack because they aren't under Jack.

Think of the homeworld security stuff this way, Antartic Outpost/Atlantis Expedition (they are related to one another directly), and than the SGC/Alpha Site/Prometheus (the Pommie crew wear SGC patches), and than maybe Nellis and the research programs. They are all under General Hammond (sited by Weir in New Order. But they are not in each others chain of command. Jack does not command Nellis. The Pommie commander isn't in authority over the Antartic Outpost.

It's a bit like the combined combat commands that the US military is divided into. O'Neill is the commander of one element (like, say, Central Command), and Weir is in command of another (like, say, Southern Command). Hammond, in this analogy is the Chairmen of the Joint Chiefs of Staff. You don't expect the CG of Southern Command to brief the CG of central command about problems in the Panama canal. Now, he may get briefed on them by a lower ranking officer (because the canal has an effect on if his troops get to the Middle East), but SouthCom wouldn't answer to him, because it's not his area of authority.

Not sure how much that made sense.

But they were at the SGC, which *is* Gen. O'Neill's base and area of command. Hammond may outrank him, but they should expect to see O'Neill on the base and certainly on any key briefings that take place on his base, especially as the stargate may be involved in maintaining contact with Atlantis.

J.

watcher652
September 14th, 2004, 10:32 PM
Excuse me for interrupting the conversation about Hammond's rank. On a different topic...

If you look at the GateWorld images for "Home", there is an episode photo that shows McKay on the couch sleeping in a different posture than the one that finally made it into the episode.

In the photo, he looks much more natural sleeping with his head turned to his left, his right arm bent up above his head and his left arm lying bent across over his stomach. In the actual episode, he's lying on the couch with his head turned to his left and both arms straight down against his sides. I noticed it for 2 reasons. One, I had already seen the photo, so I was expecting McKay to look like the photo. Two, it was kind of an odd sleeping posture, at first it almost looked like he was tied up.

But then, at the end when we see the team unconscious on the surface of the planet, McKay was lying face down with his head turned to his left and with his arms at his side. So his "nap" posture was reflecting his real unconscious posture.

I thought that was pretty cool.

In the stray thought category, since they also have a "behind the scenes" photo of McKay on the couch, I kinda thought that first photo caught David actually napping!

vikingjedi
September 14th, 2004, 10:43 PM
I just realized that this episode was almost an exact duplicate of an earlier SG-1 episode.

If you remember back a few years ago SG-1 went to the gate in Russia because the Russians had found an amazing water sample that contained energy. When SG-1 got there they found all the scientists dead. So they took a sub through the gate (it was a water planet) and eventually couldnt leave. It was revealed at the end that the water contained life forms and we were accidently killing them. The "water beings" even talked to them.

ShadowMaat
September 15th, 2004, 03:30 AM
I just realized that this episode was almost an exact duplicate of an earlier SG-1 episode.
Yeah, I asked about that in an earlier post. Think the two entities are related? ;) Water, mist, they're very close...

Major Fischer
September 15th, 2004, 05:18 AM
Sorry, but "promoted" means exactly that. Not simply a lateral move to another command, even if that command covered a wider area. Especially in the military.

No, that doesn't nessecarily mean that. Especially in the military.

keshou
September 15th, 2004, 05:29 AM
I just realized that this episode was almost an exact duplicate of an earlier SG-1 episode.

If you remember back a few years ago SG-1 went to the gate in Russia because the Russians had found an amazing water sample that contained energy. When SG-1 got there they found all the scientists dead. So they took a sub through the gate (it was a water planet) and eventually couldnt leave. It was revealed at the end that the water contained life forms and we were accidently killing them. The "water beings" even talked to them.
It reminded me of that episode ("Watergate") as well as a Farscape episode - "A Human Reaction" where the wormhole aliens maniupulated Crichton to make him think he was back on earth.

Shep's reactions were very similar to Crichton and Teyla was reacting a lot like Aeryn. New clothes, the beer. Except they didn't sleep together in Shep's little reality like John and Aeryn did. ;)

prion
September 15th, 2004, 05:34 AM
I want to know who paid for the pizza's?

Ford said he caught the pizza guy and just brought them up? Did he mug him?



Just like who paid for Teyla's shopping spree? Of course, since there were dead people at Sheppard's party, who paid for the pizza was the least of his problems. :D

Lt. Aiden Ford
September 15th, 2004, 06:47 AM
Since this was essentially Sheppard's reality, and his impressions of people would be how their characters would act, does that mean that Sheppard only sees Ford in the role of "pizza delivery boy?" Behind the scenes, but not taking a particularly important role.

Major Fischer
September 15th, 2004, 07:07 AM
Actually, because it was Sheppard's reality, and he was deliberately making things not right, I think it's more reasonable to say that he put Ford in a position that he didn't think the lieutenant would be.

FieryHands
September 15th, 2004, 11:14 AM
Shep's reactions were very similar to Crichton and Teyla was reacting a lot like Aeryn. New clothes, the beer. Except they didn't sleep together in Shep's little reality like John and Aeryn did. ;)

Yeah, I wasn't going to say it but "A Human Reaction" definitely sprung to mind watching this episode, as well as "Won't Get Fooled Again"--Sheppard's moment of informing the random people from his memory who they were/Crichton waving a gun around while doing the exact same thing as he figures out the reality is fake. Dead people thing--John's moment with his dead mother, shooting his dad and best friend, people acting not themselves with the worse possible scenario playing out (government killing the aliens/Weir being relieved of command and not allowed to return to Atlantis). Beer, tasting and taking another gulp--aliens love beer. Teyla better appreciated wearing human clothes than Aeryn though. Very similiar themes, like I said, seen too many of this type of episode. Everything turns out fake and they go back to their adopted home.

I thought maybe the military picked up the tab on the clothes, but that doesn't make sense. The fact though they were riding around in a limo though does seem like a big tipoff for Sheppard.

The water/mist aliens sounds so trek. :p They wouldn't be related I don't think but they are awfully similiar types of lifeforms. Given they live in different galaxies its unlikely they could be.

HIj'Qa
September 16th, 2004, 07:29 AM
I was thinking maybe the Mist aliens' ability to make people see what isn't there might be mentioned as being a Wraith quality. Maybe there might be some relevance to the whole concept of the show. But, no.

Maybe it will come up later, and Weir will have to break her promise and go back.

And, really, if McKay is gonna dream about any female, it would be Sam! He was just chatting about her in the puddlejumper! Even if they couldn't have AT, they should have had him mention her!

Unless I have the concept of the show, Us vs Wraith, wrong, time to bring on hte Wraith! More Steve! Siege looks actiony, but it is still two anti-Wraith factions battling each other, instead of the Wraith!

greytop
September 16th, 2004, 11:53 AM
The show sort of reminded me of SG-1's show, The Gamekeeper. Instead of a machine, real aliens messing with their minds.

I'm glad they promised not to go back to that planet.

ShadowMaat
September 16th, 2004, 01:21 PM
I just read Taylor's review of Home (http://www.gateworld.net/atlantis/s1/reviews/109.shtml) and it got me thinking... I wonder if McKay's first clue that things were wrong was the Outer Limits ep. We only hear the theme, but McKay comments that it was a "really weird" ep- maybe it was the one that mimics/echoes/whatever the situation in Home... Unfortunately, it took him a while longer to actually piece it all together. ;)

watcher652
September 16th, 2004, 02:13 PM
I just read Taylor's review of Home (http://www.gateworld.net/atlantis/s1/reviews/109.shtml) and it got me thinking... I wonder if McKay's first clue that things were wrong was the Outer Limits ep. We only hear the theme, but McKay comments that it was a "really weird" ep- maybe it was the one that mimics/echoes/whatever the situation in Home... Unfortunately, it took him a while longer to actually piece it all together. ;)
He turned on the TV before he started to eat those snack things (what the heck were those things?) so maybe you have something there. I still think it was the snacks, because as soon as he started looking at them the doorbell rang with the now-friendly, cat-sitting neighbor.

I was sitting here with a silly grin on my face when I read the review. The jackets got a big mention and I was quite proud of myself when I saw that detail AND its significance in the show. And like me, the reviewer thinks Weir and McKay shared a reality. I thought the conference with Hammond was with both of them, not just Weir or McKay. And how so certain McKay was that things were bogus when his tests made no sense, he breaks the ZPM.

But the reviewer didn't cite how the way McKay was sleeping was really the way he was lying on the surface of the planet. Was that just me seeing things?

I think the reviewer should have said that Sheppard first starts to realize something is wrong and then he creates that bachelor pad to test his theory. I think Sheppard knew something was wrong way back at the SGC debriefing.

Not about the review, and I realize there wasn't enough time, but I wonder if Ford was ever clued in and what would tip him off?

Major Fischer
September 16th, 2004, 02:19 PM
He turned on the TV before he started to eat those snack things (what the heck were those things?) so maybe you have something there. I still think it was the snacks, because as soon as he started looking at them the doorbell rang with the now-friendly, cat-sitting neighbor.

I viewed the snacks as more of an indication that, yes, Rodney will eat ANYTHING. I really don't think he had a clue until he got into the labs and saw that science was abandoning him.


Not about the review, and I realize there wasn't enough time, but I wonder if Ford was ever clued in and what would tip him off?

Probably a good fanfic idea. Before anyone decides I should write it like they did last time with the land of Daniel's girlfriends, not me. ;)

watcher652
September 16th, 2004, 03:11 PM
He turned on the TV before he started to eat those snack things (what the heck were those things?) so maybe you have something there. I still think it was the snacks, because as soon as he started looking at them the doorbell rang with the now-friendly, cat-sitting neighbor.
I viewed the snacks as more of an indication that, yes, Rodney will eat ANYTHING. I really don't think he had a clue until he got into the labs and saw that science was abandoning him.
Yeah, but look at the scene. He powers on the TV before he even sits down on the couch. Then he realizes he's sitting on something and pulls out that bag of snacks. He starts eating them, then looks at one and twirls it. Then, he looks at the bag and turns it over to read the ingredients (I think he turned the bag over, I'm doing this from memory). I really feel he was wondering, "what the heck is this that's still crunchy in an opened bag all this time?" Then Miss Cat Sitter rang the doorbell and all coherent thought went out the door.

The Mist-induced reality would put the snacks on the couch for McKay to find. It knew that's what McKay would want when he sat down to watch TV. But it wouldn't have thought if the snacks were stale or not. When it realized that McKay was started to think something was strange, what would distract McKay more than to have his cat sitter actually like him?

Major Fischer
September 16th, 2004, 03:19 PM
...what would distract McKay more than to have his cat sitter actually like him?

Lieutenant Colonel Samantha Carter ;)

But I do take your meaning. :D

watcher652
September 16th, 2004, 03:38 PM
...what would distract McKay more than to have his cat sitter actually like him?
Lieutenant Colonel Samantha Carter ;)

But I do take your meaning. :D
Ah, yes, that would distract him for a moment (maybe more than one moment), but don't you think he would soon realize that any attention from her was really strange? That would almost be as stange as the science being all messed up.

Thinking about it, the science being messed up was subtle. Because if the Mist was really "reading" their minds, then it would know exactly what McKay was expecting to see and put it on his computer. But McKay deals with abstractions, and that would be almost impossible for the non-corporeal beings to comprehend. McKay knew what to expect, but the Mist didn't, like it didn't know Sheppard was making dead people alive.

watcher652
September 16th, 2004, 10:43 PM
Speaking of Sheppard, I re-read the review and noticed this observation:

Again, John Sheppard has a natural ability to take control of alien technology without knowing it.
What alien technology? There was no tech, it was all mind games. I still think it has to do with Sheppard's way of dealing with the world. He deals with what he sees and how he reacts to the physical world. He goes with his gut and has to know in an instant when something doesn't feel right. It's what makes him a great pilot.

Tok'Ra Hostess
September 17th, 2004, 05:21 AM
Just saw Home last nite. It was far too predictable. The first "rushed" plot of the Atlantis series, IMO.

Why did Sheppard "know" something was not right?

Why didn't he show some emotion when his two dead buddies showed up? Just telling us they were dead was weak.

I did like how excited Teyla was at the human markets! It made sense that she would not have noticed anything wrong with their situation.

I did like how Weir and MacKay kept changing in order to show each character's POV, and I appreciated the fact that their fantasy was full of flaws. That makes much more sense than, for instance, the almost flawless fantasy that Hathor set up for SG-1 in Out of Mind(although I have a theory about why that was).

I liked how the aliens tried to defend themselves and how unprepared they were for the possibility that others would come looking for the SG-A team. It gave them a more alien feel than their "appearance." I also liked how General Hammond stayed in (alien) character for the entire show. Well played, DSD. :)

I would have liked a little more interaction between Weir and the alien, since she is the leader and diplomat. This is a whole new life form, and SG-A killed many of them when they first opened the Gate; there should have been... I dunno, something more. :(

The ep had great moments, making up for a weak plot, so I'd rate it, "good." :p

watcher652
September 17th, 2004, 09:10 AM
Just saw Home last nite. It was far too predictable. The first "rushed" plot of the Atlantis series, IMO.
I always find it interesting how people feel about the same thing. I loved this episode. So much to discuss about.



Why did Sheppard "know" something was not right?
See my views in the post right above yours. Haven't you ever been in a situation that just didn't "feel" right? Sheppard is like O'Neill is that respect.



Why didn't he show some emotion when his two dead buddies showed up? Just telling us they were dead was weak.
Didn't you see Sheppard's eyes after he invited his friends in, closed the door and leaned up against the door? That flicker of pain and loss? The set of his mouth? The look of a man who had just swallowed hard? That was when I knew he knew something was wrong.

Joe Flanigan was incredible in that one shot. I liked him before, but that one look has won me over.

ShadowMaat
September 17th, 2004, 09:13 AM
I picked up on his shock and his kinda wincing when he saw who it was, so I knew he wasn't happy to see them, but I never guessed why until he said something. I just figured they weren't friends anymore. Which, technically, is true. ;)

Major Fischer
September 17th, 2004, 11:33 AM
I just figured they weren't friends anymore. Which, technically, is true. ;)

Or that he doesn't like the nickname "Shep" and thought of them as overloud annoyances. At least that's how i (mis)interpeted his reaction. :)

Tok'Ra Hostess
September 18th, 2004, 08:35 AM
See my views in the post right above yours. Haven't you ever been in a situation that just didn't "feel" right? Sheppard is like O'Neill is that respect.

<G> I stll haven't read down that far!

I just didn't see enough wierdness at that point to establish that anything was amiss. I was told so, not shown.


Didn't you see Sheppard's eyes after he invited his friends in, closed the door and leaned up against the door? That flicker of pain and loss? The set of his mouth? The look of a man who had just swallowed hard? That was when I knew he knew something was wrong.

Joe Flanigan was incredible in that one shot. I liked him before, but that one look has won me over.

Nope, didn't see it. In my defense, I watched the ep on squinty; I'm happy if I can actually tell what character I'm looking at.
:o

Okay, so I'll have to reserve judgement on that scene. :)

watcher652
September 18th, 2004, 08:58 AM
See my views in the post right above yours. Haven't you ever been in a situation that just didn't "feel" right? Sheppard is like O'Neill is that respect.
<G> I stll haven't read down that far!
Well, hop to it! There's a whole 'nother episode to discuss! ;)

I love this episode so much, I'm sure I'll be discussing it again when it repeats.

zats
September 18th, 2004, 06:50 PM
You can get an "I'm with Genius" shirt right here (http://www.cafepress.com/cp/browse/y-12_N-20645619_Ntk-All_nr-1_Nao-1_Ntt-with+genius_x-12). It isn't anything like McKay's shirt except for the words and the inclusion of an arrow pointing up, but it's still funny. ;)

BRILLIANT. Thank you!!

Excali5033
September 20th, 2004, 02:11 PM
I was just thinking that, well, technically, they were dreaming. Personally, I don't question strange little things in dreams, because your mind just accepts it. Sure, if it starts getting really weird, maybe (never had a lucid dream though, blah), but otherwise you don't really notice.

Mr. Seven
September 20th, 2004, 04:23 PM
Sorry if this has been asked already..but I thought that the Atlantis Stargate was the only one able to return home to Earth. I take it that it had the proper Chevron symbol(s) to do it..

How did McCay hook up the other gate to do it?

Major Fischer
September 20th, 2004, 04:36 PM
It's explained in the episode that it's not the gate itself that is the only one capable of reacing earth, but it's the Atlantis DHD's control crystal that allows it. That's why McKay has to mess with the DHD during the episode.

Mr. Seven
September 20th, 2004, 04:38 PM
Oh ok thanks. I'll have to watch for that closer the second time around ;)

watcher652
September 21st, 2004, 01:02 PM
Oh ok thanks. I'll have to watch for that closer the second time around ;)
It's the scene in the conference room right after the first commercial break.

Standback
October 7th, 2004, 11:47 PM
Interesting episode... I left it with a slightly disappointed feeling, mainly because it hadn't been quite what I expected. I had no spoilers beyond the name of the episode and a pic of Weir with Simon, so I was looking forward to an episode actually connecting Atlantis to the SGC, however briefly. We know there's going to be contact between them throughout the shows, and I had been thinking, "Wow! Great job tying that in so early!" So much for that.

Other than "not being exactly what Standback wanted", though, good episode. I've really enjoyed pretty much everything so far.

Just one question, though: how does the team get back to Atlantis from the Mist Planet? Gating would presumably kill at least a few of those energy creatures, and Shep specifically said that puddlejumping would take, what was it, 408 years? What's the deal - it's OK to kill a few mistbeingthingies?

Major Tyler
October 8th, 2004, 07:14 AM
Just one question, though: how does the team get back to Atlantis from the Mist Planet? Gating would presumably kill at least a few of those energy creatures, and Shep specifically said that puddlejumping would take, what was it, 408 years? What's the deal - it's OK to kill a few mistbeingthingies?They probably reasoned that if they didn't report back Atlantis would dial in looking for them. Since they couldn't contact Atlantis and tell them not to dial in, they figured that the Myst creatures would have to suffer at least one more Stargate activation, so they might as well use it to get home (to Atlantis).

Major Fischer
October 8th, 2004, 07:15 AM
They probably reasoned that if they didn't report back Atlantis would dial in looking for them. Since they couldn't contact Atlantis and tell them not to dial in, they figured that the Myst creatures would have to suffer at least one more Stargate activation, so they might as well use it to get home (to Altantis).

This was my assumption as well. They promised never to come back, not never to leave ;)

Standback
October 9th, 2004, 09:02 AM
Ouch. Oh, well. "Listen, we're really sorry; we didn't know what we were doing, and we certainly didn't intend to kill any of you, let alone millions. So we'll only ice a dozen or so more, OK?" ;)

Other than that, though, definitely a fun episode.

watcher652
October 9th, 2004, 10:03 AM
Just one question, though: how does the team get back to Atlantis from the Mist Planet? Gating would presumably kill at least a few of those energy creatures, and Shep specifically said that puddlejumping would take, what was it, 408 years? What's the deal - it's OK to kill a few mistbeingthingies?Yes, Gating would kill a few more of the Mist. It's not OK. But as "Hammond" said, when other beings visited their world, there were those who made the sacrifice for the greater good, knowing that the offworlders would never return. It was only because the Mist knew that the Atlantis expedition was going to use the Gate repeatedly that they tried to stop them.

I'm sure all of the team was dismayed to find out that they had unwittingly killed anyone/anything. Especially McKay, since it was all his idea in the first place.

Non-corporeal life forms are pretty common, it seems.

Harlan
November 6th, 2004, 01:48 PM
I don't know if anyone has noticed it before me - In 'Home', the Wormhole sequences are not the same that in the other episodes. I mean, the wormhole itself is different only in 'Home' ... you can see it on the Attached Picture of this message.

I assume this is a preliminary version of the wormhole, because last time I saw this different wormhole was in an early SciFi teaser for 'Rising' (http://www.sg1archive.com/teasers/atlantis_trailer.html) ... and in the complete version of 'Rising' we have the 'real wormhole' (this one (http://perso.wanadoo.fr/mg-web/sg_ljicons/atlantis.gif)).

So ? Is this a news for you, or have you already noticed the thing ?

;)

watcher652
November 6th, 2004, 07:43 PM
I don't know if anyone has noticed it before me - In 'Home', the Wormhole sequences are not the same that in the other episodes. I mean, the wormhole itself is different only in 'Home' ... you can see it on the Attached Picture of this message.

<snip>

So ? Is this a news for you, or have you already noticed the thing
Yes, I noticed it the first time. The Wormhole effect is different because they're Gating all the way back to Earth instead of just Gating around the Pegasus Galaxy. Or at least they think they are. The Wormhole effect was longer than usually, implying a longer trip. It was sneaky of the show to imply that the team was Gating home when they were actually still on the planet. But that's what the team were expecting, so that's what we saw.

Harlan
November 7th, 2004, 01:51 AM
OK ... but ... I don't know ... in 'Rising' ... the wormhole between two galaxies (Earth > Atlantis or Milky Way > Pegasus) is exactly the same we see in the following episodes when they travel between two Pegasus planets :S => this one (http://perso.wanadoo.fr/mg-web/sg_ljicons/atlantis.gif).

And the wormhole we see in 'Home' is ONLY in 'Home' ... we don't see it in 'Rising' ... in my opinion this special wormhole isn't an 'intergalactic wormhole' ... as I said, I really think it was a preliminary version ... and the fact that it is in 'Home' is maybe an error ... they forgot they had the definitive wormhole, the one we see in all the other episodes :rolleyes: ...

Well actually I don't know and I need help :D ...

Major Fischer
November 7th, 2004, 10:52 AM
And the wormhole we see in 'Home' is ONLY in 'Home' ... we don't see it in 'Rising' ... in my opinion this special wormhole isn't an 'intergalactic wormhole' ... as I said, I really think it was a preliminary version ... and the fact that it is in 'Home' is maybe an error ... they forgot they had the definitive wormhole, the one we see in all the other episodes :rolleyes: ...

I think a more logical explaination is that it's a visual cue that it's not a real wormhole. Sort of like how Hammond is in different clothing based on who is talking to him.

Harlan
November 7th, 2004, 11:52 AM
I think a more logical explaination is that it's a visual cue that it's not a real wormhole. Sort of like how Hammond is in different clothing based on who is talking to him.
I'm OK with this explanation ;) .

But ... (yes ! 'but' again :D ) in 'Home', we see the special wormhole 2 times.
You're explanation works with the second time we see the wormhole in the episode -> when they travel from M4X-224 to Earth -> OK, this trip trought the wormhole is part of the 'mist illusion' ;).

-> But the first time we see this special wormhole (in the 9th minute of the episode) -> when they travel from Atlantis to M4X-224 -> at this point of the story, they aren't in the 'mist illusion' yet.
You know, when McKay contacts Atlantis to tell them he has successfully modified the M4X-224 DHD, they travel to M4X-224 to rejoin Rodney, and we see the weird wormhole ... but that's not part of the illusion ... How could the illusion begin for Shep/Weir/Teyla if they are still in the wormhole ? ... the illusion maybe begins a few seconds after they come out from the Gate ... but not when we see the first wormhole ;) .

watcher652
November 8th, 2004, 01:57 PM
Well, that's a pretty nit-picky observation (and I mean that in a good way, like, wow, you saw all that?). All I noticed was that the wormhole effect was longer than normal, which to me just implied a longer trip. By Puddle Jumper it would take 840 years (I think that's the time) to get there. Of course, I don't know the speed of a Puddle Jumper, but that still sounds like a far piece to go. So maybe we were on the far edge of our normal range in the Pegasus galaxy, and after a certain point, all long trips look alike. Like taking city roads versus the interstate. The Myst planet is probably off the beaten path, as well as looking useless for anything worthwhile.

blueiris
November 13th, 2004, 07:40 PM
Question. I watched this episode twice last night, the second time with my son. After it was over he asked a question which I couldn't answer and couldn't remember if it was addressed in the episode. But here goes. The power source at the gate on the planet they were on. Could that not have been taken back to Atlantis to use on the gate there?

greytop
November 13th, 2004, 07:45 PM
Question. I watched this episode twice last night, the second time with my son. After it was over he asked a question which I couldn't answer and couldn't remember if it was addressed in the episode. But here goes. The power source at the gate on the planet they were on. Could that not have been taken back to Atlantis to use on the gate there?
No the power source of the planet the sentient beings of the planet. Every time the gate was actived some were killed. It was explained near the end of the show when they figured something was wrong with things at home.

Hope this helps.

Major Fischer
November 13th, 2004, 07:46 PM
Question. I watched this episode twice last night, the second time with my son. After it was over he asked a question which I couldn't answer and couldn't remember if it was addressed in the episode. But here goes. The power source at the gate on the planet they were on. Could that not have been taken back to Atlantis to use on the gate there?

The extra power that would allow intergalactic travel was the Myst. Taking it back would have meant kidnapping intelligent life and massacring it.

greytop
November 13th, 2004, 07:51 PM
The extra power that would allow intergalactic travel was the Myst. Taking it back would have meant kidnapping intelligent life and massacring it.
You said it better than I, MF. :)

blueiris
November 13th, 2004, 07:56 PM
The extra power that would allow intergalactic travel was the Myst. Taking it back would have meant kidnapping intelligent life and massacring it.

I remember that now. Thanks to all for your help. :)

Crazedwraith
December 7th, 2004, 01:03 PM
Very good episode. Liked McKay's "how do you go from.." bits and his reactio getting to his appartment, find some food put the telly on. And the no messages bit. :D

Shep was good to. And I wished we'd seen more of Fords other than I'm being re-assigned.

Anubis
December 7th, 2004, 01:18 PM
I agree with everything Crazed. :) The answer machine scene was great. Couldn't help but laugh. :D


It was good to see how they all figured out that it was just an illusion, if I hadn't read episode info, then I would have been fooled. Silly me! :D Generally, a good show. I can't wait 'till next weeks episode though. It sounds really, really cool. :)

astronomicalchick
December 7th, 2004, 01:25 PM
Very good episode. Liked McKay's "how do you go from.." bits and his reactio getting to his appartment, find some food put the telly on. And the no messages bit. :D

Shep was good to. And I wished we'd seen more of Fords other than I'm being re-assigned.

I loved Rodney in this episode! I loved that scene of him in his apartment when he sat on his sofa and discovered the chips underneath them and ate them... .eeeuuuuwww!!! but great moment.

And it was lovely to see Hammond again...

astronomicalchick
December 7th, 2004, 01:34 PM
--

Best line of the epsiode. Most definately the bit about looking through a microscope and seeing dancing hampsters.

Yes, it was my favourite too!

Ancients Rising
December 7th, 2004, 02:02 PM
I took much pleasure from this episode

That is all.

Madeleine
December 7th, 2004, 02:44 PM
I liked Shepherd's comment that he could have done a lot more with his simulation :D

Ancients Rising
December 7th, 2004, 02:54 PM
I liked Shepherd's comment that he could have done a lot more with his simulation :D

Yeah :D

He also seemed like a top class schizophrenic when he told his friends that they are dead and started waving his gun around :D

Matt G
December 7th, 2004, 03:32 PM
1. Wierd ep with a lot of intangiable off notes as soon as they returned to Earth(might be the effects of spoilers but...) didn't expect the aliens to put them in alternate realities though.

2. OK...Sheppard's stuff is pretty easy to work out. He'd worked out the show was a fake early doors, did some testing...then decided to have some fun. Hang out with dead mates in a classy pad(and got freaked out by their appearance more than expected) had various females that messed up with turn up, order up pizza, then say 'sod this, I'm gonna blow the whole show'(why he blew the whistle before shagging any of the babes is anyone's guess);).

3. Even I noticed the lack of Ford in this ep!

.:Lemon:.
December 8th, 2004, 12:35 PM
I really liked this episode, and it was nice to see Hammond again. I thought Mckay was very funny in this ep :D I'm actually starting to warm up to Teyla. I used to dislike her but I'm okay with her now. I'm starting to like Sheppard better aswell :p

Lt. Aiden Ford
December 8th, 2004, 07:30 PM
1. Wierd ep with a lot of intangiable off notes as soon as they returned to Earth(might be the effects of spoilers but...) didn't expect the aliens to put them in alternate realities though.

2. OK...Sheppard's stuff is pretty easy to work out. He'd worked out the show was a fake early doors, did some testing...then decided to have some fun. Hang out with dead mates in a classy pad(and got freaked out by their appearance more than expected) had various females that messed up with turn up, order up pizza, then say 'sod this, I'm gonna blow the whole show'(why he blew the whistle before shagging any of the babes is anyone's guess);).

3. Even I noticed the lack of Ford in this ep!Wow, that the most English slang I've seen in one post. I understood about half of it. :rolleyes:

Erik Pasternak
December 8th, 2004, 07:49 PM
Wow, that the most English slang I've seen in one post. I understood about half of it. :rolleyes:
You understood that much?? More than I ever will, that's for sure. :D

Madeleine
December 9th, 2004, 05:01 AM
What Matt's saying (and it's dead obvious! don't you people speak the Queen's English?) is

Shep got cracking pretty sharpish with sussing that something well dodgy was afoot, and decided to lark about for a spell. He spent a while in his swanky new place with his dead friends and with some ex-girlfriends with whom things had gone pear-shaped. Then he said 'bugger this for a game of soldiers, I'm off' (though Matt's stumped as to why Shep didn't have a bit of nookie before he blew the gaff.)

What's not to understand? :p;)

ShadowMaat
December 9th, 2004, 05:39 AM
The sad thing is, I actually understood that better than what Matt said. :P

Madeleine
December 9th, 2004, 05:52 AM
Oh :(

Still, as long as it confuses Feli I'll be satisfied :D

CultTVGirl
December 9th, 2004, 07:22 AM
Loved this episode, though I did find it confusing in places. And I couldn't quite believe nobody was wondering where Jack and SG-1 were when they got back to "Earth" - did Weir forget that Jack had been left in charge of the SGC?

I think maybe they could've made a two-parter out of the idea, brought in some of the other SG-1 actors, and made it a more developed and mysterious story. Also, they could've shown some of Ford's homecoming. It would've been nice to see Ford reunited with his grandma!

And I'm very disappointed that they didn't take Dr Beckett "home" with them to see his mum! :(

Still, it was a very enjoyable episode. I especially loved Teyla's reaction to shopping on Earth - and poor Rodney not finding any messages on his answerphone! Bless!

But Weir's boyfriend is completely dull! No wonder she wanted to get back to Atlantis so badly! :D

.:Lemon:.
December 9th, 2004, 07:35 AM
What Matt's saying (and it's dead obvious! don't you people speak the Queen's English?) is

Shep got cracking pretty sharpish with sussing that something well dodgy was afoot, and decided to lark about for a spell. He spent a while in his swanky new place with his dead friends and with some ex-girlfriends with whom things had gone pear-shaped. Then he said 'bugger this for a game of soldiers, I'm off' (though Matt's stumped as to why Shep didn't have a bit of nookie before he blew the gaff.)

What's not to understand? :p;)

Haha! :D That's a great translation :p ;)

Matt G
December 9th, 2004, 07:56 AM
ROFL at the confusion a bit of UK slang can cause!:)

Lt. Aiden Ford
December 9th, 2004, 01:33 PM
LOL, there is a "Talking American" thread, there should be a "Talking British" thread.

Is "British" an okay term for UK-ers?

ShadowMaat
December 9th, 2004, 02:07 PM
LOL, there is a "Talking American" thread, there should be a "Talking British" thread.

Is "British" an okay term for UK-ers?
If you say "Talking English", you'll confuse a LOT of people. ;P

Dazzar
January 1st, 2005, 08:50 AM
Has any one noticed that in Stargate epp "48 Hours" Mckay was calling everyone lunatics because removing the master control crystal from a DHD and activating it would overload the stargate because their would be nothing to regualte the power between the DHD and the Stargate.

So how the Atlantis gate could still dial out "Safely" without a master control crystal in it?

I hope that makes sense :S

Major Tyler
January 1st, 2005, 09:23 AM
So how could the Atlantis gate still dial out "safely" without a master control crystal in it?Maybe they couldn't.

Dazzar
January 1st, 2005, 09:28 AM
Maybe they couldn't.
If they couldnt then how did they get to the planet?

Major Tyler
January 1st, 2005, 09:30 AM
If they couldnt then how did they get to the planet?Touché

Dazzar
January 1st, 2005, 09:31 AM
lol

Major Tyler
January 1st, 2005, 09:37 AM
That's a good question. You might have to catch the ear of one of TPTB to get it answered.

Dazzar
January 1st, 2005, 09:41 AM
TPTB??

Sorry if dumb question

Major Tyler
January 1st, 2005, 09:44 AM
TPTB??It's an acronym for "The Powers That Be" of Stargate, such as the writers, directors, producers, etc.

BTW: (By the way ;)) Welcome to GateWorld!! :)

greytop
January 1st, 2005, 09:44 AM
Has any one noticed that in Stargate epp "48 Hours" Mckay was calling everyone lunatics because removing the master control crystal from a DHD and activating it would overload the stargate because their would be nothing to regualte the power between the DHD and the Stargate.

So how the Atlantis gate could still dial out "Safely" without a master control crystal in it?

I hope that makes sense :S
I believe that the crystal was not the master crystal but a special on that added a long distance factor to the DHD so that they can use the 8th chevron.

Major Tyler
January 1st, 2005, 09:47 AM
I believe that the crystal was not the master crystal but a special on that added a long distance factor to the DHD so that they can use the 8th chevron.I think greytop may have the answer.

Dazzar
January 1st, 2005, 10:22 AM
I believe that the crystal was not the master crystal but a special on that added a long distance factor to the DHD so that they can use the 8th chevron.
ah yes it could be

Whistler
January 1st, 2005, 10:28 AM
Well the only problem with this episode was, as pointed out the fact the people they met. I mean to my knowledge Hammond never met Weir, although she may have known of him, it would have been cool if Weir thought he had a beird, lol. :D But I just think TPTB used this ep to get a cameo with Hammond and Walter, and nothings wrong with that!

It also had a lack of guest actors around in the SGC, the most I ever saw was at Sheppard's "Dead Mates and Girls that turned me down Reunion", which notably had a few product placements.

By far the best scenes and quotes were McKay, though Sheppard and Tayla got a few too. What puzzled me was the fact that Weir came through the Stargate alone, but later met Rodney in a lab coat.

Favourite Line: "Dancing Hamsters"

Na'onac
January 5th, 2005, 06:49 AM
I couldn't get into this episode although it did add a few nice angles on the characters. However it is definately the worst episode in the series so far, mainly because it was stupid, I mean surely they would notice quicker than they did that there was something a little too wrong in the world they were in!

SeaBee
April 8th, 2005, 11:27 PM
Nice episode. It was good to see Weir get out and about for a change.
I liked the touch with McKays answerphone. He's been away for ages, but no-one's tried to call him! And Shep's party scene was really good.
Nice to see that even alien women can be corrupted by western consumerism, too. :)

BruTak
July 25th, 2005, 04:50 AM
Please forgive me if I'm repeating a point someone else has made, but - a big clue that all is not as it seems when Weir and Co. return to "Earth", is that "Hammond" is wearing the two stars of a Major General, rather than the three stars of a Lt. General. He got promoted, remember?

miguelslo
July 25th, 2005, 12:30 PM
Did anyone notice that Weir's husband was the guy who played a Tollan in SG1 ? :S

btw i hate weir

ps: i think this is my first post on gateworld

BruTak
July 28th, 2005, 07:19 AM
Did anyone notice that Weir's husband was the guy who played a Tollan in SG1 ? :S

btw i hate weir

ps: i think this is my first post on gateworld
Welcome to the party. No need to be shy, we're all friends here.

Regarding Dr. Weir - why has no one (O'Neill for example) said: "Didn't you used to be a blonde?" ;)

Lida
July 28th, 2005, 10:20 AM
Did anyone notice that Weir's husband was the guy who played a Tollan in SG1 ? :S

btw i hate weir

ps: i think this is my first post on gateworld

Welcome to the Forum.

Dr. Weir is NOT married, that "Tollan" was Narim (in SG-1). In SGA, in both seasons, he was Simon, her "gentleman" friend, um, ex now, I guess. :( (played by actor Garwin Sanford)

How very nice you "hate" Dr. Weir, I'm certain that was a tough decision for you. :)

Enjoy your time here. :D

wurlitzer153
November 12th, 2005, 12:21 PM
I'm currently rewatching this ep. in syndication and did anyone notice that they used a different gate travel sequence in this one (I think). It has a bunch of colors sweeping by in the tunnel, not just blue. I don't know if this has been mentioned already, but I don't wan't to search through the whole thread.

aaobuttons
November 12th, 2005, 12:31 PM
I'm currently rewatching this ep. in syndication and did anyone notice that they used a different gate travel sequence in this one (I think). It has a bunch of colors sweeping by in the tunnel, not just blue. I don't know if this has been mentioned already, but I don't wan't to search through the whole thread.


Are you comparing it to the SG1 sequence or to other Atlantis ones? I know the SG1 sequences look different than the Atlantis ones, but I've never noticed Home being different than the other Atlantic sequences. And was it when they went to the mist world or when they traveled to Earth?

Athenaktt
November 12th, 2005, 01:13 PM
The wormhole sequence is slightly different but it's still greenish blue. My guess was the difference in the wormhole was kind of a hint to show that the reality wasn't real and different.

I have a couple screen caps if you want to compare.

Regular wormhole:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v371/Athenaktt/normworm.jpg

"Home" wormhole:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v371/Athenaktt/homeworm.jpg

Lt.Col. Moore (Icarus)
November 12th, 2005, 02:03 PM
Yeah, I like "Home's" wormhole. Do you have other pictures of "Home's" wormhole?