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aussie
May 1st, 2006, 12:33 AM
Something that has bugged me since the dawning of the s01ep01-02 that it says about the great enemy that slept and attacked atlantis, but the hologram does not mention anything about the wraith, is it possible that the great enemy was the wraith?
They only mention about battles against the wraith. Just wanted to know where we stand on the issue.

mentalmichael
May 1st, 2006, 12:46 AM
The great enemy was the Wraith. Well, to be more precise all the characters think it was the Wraith - Dr Weir in Rising II - "Come on, what do we really know about the Wraith? One of the few things we do know is that they are the enemy who defeated the ancients" - and we can therefore comfortably say that the Ancient's great enemy was the Wraith.

aussie
May 1st, 2006, 12:57 AM
i know she says it alot but what proof does she have it is the wraith?

they are just assuming this?

Chutzpah
May 1st, 2006, 01:34 AM
- The Wraith sleep for hundreds of years at a time.

- They are the main enemy in the Pegasus Galaxy

- They have fought and defeated the Ancients

These all point to the enemy being the Wraith, though i don't think that the hologram ever actually made specific reference to the Wraith.

ascott08
May 1st, 2006, 01:59 AM
in before i sleep the timejumper was actually shot down by the wraith, and old weir saw and told the new team

RoMUS
May 1st, 2006, 04:18 AM
Well the great enemy could be the new enemy(nano bots??)and the ancients tried been allies with the wraith to fight them but got eaten and the wraith just picked up the tech the ancients left behind

ste
May 1st, 2006, 09:26 AM
well it cant be the wraith, because the wraith evolved from those bugs AFTER the ancients got there.

doubt its the new guys cause we know from the spoilers that they were CREATED by the ancients, so there could be a third and very bad ass alien race out there waiting.

or maybe the wraith got them and stole their technology, i dunno

The Prophet
May 1st, 2006, 09:31 AM
well it cant be the wraith, because the wraith evolved from those bugs AFTER the ancients got there.

doubt its the new guys cause we know from the spoilers that they were CREATED by the ancients, so there could be a third and very bad ass alien race out there waiting.

or maybe the wraith got them and stole their technology, i dunno

Well, The Lantiens seeded life on the Iratus's Planet, the bugs ate the Humans & evolved Unbeknownst to the Lantiens. The Wraith hibernated on the Planet until the Lantiens visited the Planet with their tech & woke the Wraith. The Wraith ambushed them, probed their minds & stole there tech & declared Open Hunting Season of the Lantiens. (Most likely).

The Ori
May 1st, 2006, 09:43 AM
Ah this new enemy the Asurans sound sooooooooooo, cool.

Alllll Right. Oh!

Chutzpah
May 1st, 2006, 02:10 PM
I dunno, had the writers even though about the Asurans when the made Rising Part 2?

The simplest explanation is usually the correct one.

konartis
May 1st, 2006, 03:09 PM
its gotta be the wraith all evidence points towards them

The Ori
May 1st, 2006, 03:58 PM
It definately is the Wraith but in general the Asuran story line sounds very cool.

NakedJehutyV2
May 1st, 2006, 06:04 PM
they are not the SLEEPING enemy. they are the ones who ownd the alterrans

Tain
May 1st, 2006, 09:25 PM
Well, considering Bizzarro Weir went back in time to the fall of Atlantis, was shot down by a Wraith Dart, and was witness to the destruction of an Ancient transport ship by the besieging Wraith fleet, i think there should be no doubt that it was the Wraith that kicked the Ancients out of Pegasus.


Also, the "sleeping enemy" is the Wraith. To be exact, the Ancient hologram referred to a world were a dark and terrible power "slept", past tense. They woke up, and owned the Ancients. The sleeping enemy you refer to is no longer asleep, and has not been for over 10 thousand years.

aussie
May 2nd, 2006, 01:00 AM
Well, considering Bizzarro Weir went back in time to the fall of Atlantis, was shot down by a Wraith Dart, and was witness to the destruction of an Ancient transport ship by the besieging Wraith fleet, i think there should be no doubt that it was the Wraith that kicked the Ancients out of Pegasus.


Also, the "sleeping enemy" is the Wraith. To be exact, the Ancient hologram referred to a world were a dark and terrible power "slept", past tense. They woke up, and owned the Ancients. The sleeping enemy you refer to is no longer asleep, and has not been for over 10 thousand years.

true but its has not been offically said that it is the wraith. it could of been a planet where everyone was in hybernation and everyone from atlantis really pissed them off so forth.

i just would like to see something put together to show us "YES They can kicked atlantians butt. however there is the bigger bader wolf out there"

Off topic of my own thread i would like to see a KING wraith. or some baby wraith being born. IMAGINE THE UGLYNESS! YAY! maybe the king can be like elvis and sing???? or super mind control which he can blow ur head up by looking at u!!! where am i going with this.. but anyway bigger the bader the better :) i think

anyway back to topic ;)

TPL2005
May 2nd, 2006, 02:41 PM
How do the wraith reproduce? Do they give birth to live young or do they lay eggs like an insect?

NakedJehutyV2
May 2nd, 2006, 08:30 PM
Well, considering Bizzarro Weir went back in time to the fall of Atlantis, was shot down by a Wraith Dart, and was witness to the destruction of an Ancient transport ship by the besieging Wraith fleet, i think there should be no doubt that it was the Wraith that kicked the Ancients out of Pegasus.


Also, the "sleeping enemy" is the Wraith. To be exact, the Ancient hologram referred to a world were a dark and terrible power "slept", past tense. They woke up, and owned the Ancients. The sleeping enemy you refer to is no longer asleep, and has not been for over 10 thousand years.


are you dense? i never said the wraith didn't own them just they aren't the sleeping enemy. since they were "created" not awoken. they evolved from the e bug. mutated from humans. humans weren't there till alterrans seeded them

LORD MONK
May 3rd, 2006, 08:55 PM
So far, in the show, the sleep ing enemy is the Wraith. TPTB says so. At anytime TPTB can change their minds and their can be a new sleeping enemy that they were refering to. But until then, it is the Wraiththat is the sleeping enemy and yes they have already stated that. Just becuase they didn't tell you doesn't mean they didn't shoe you with moving pictures.

npattis
May 4th, 2006, 12:19 AM
Nothing has hinted otherwise that it isn't wraith.

lionel_pendergast_rocks
May 4th, 2006, 08:29 AM
Yeah, I agree, I mean unless they talk about the Asurans sleeping in season 3, we can be sure its the wraith.

Chutzpah
May 4th, 2006, 10:01 AM
true but its has not been offically said that it is the wraith. it could of been a planet where everyone was in hybernation and everyone from atlantis really pissed them off so forth.

This is what the Atlantians did to the Wraith. They went to their planet, the Wraith discovered new food and started attempting to consume them.

The reason i don't think it is the Asurans is because spoilers seem to indicate that the Atlantians created them.

After watching "The Defiant One" The lone Wraith cannible metions specificly that it was infact the Wraith who were just about to destroy Atlantis when his ship crashed. I assume that's when they sent the city to the bottom of the ocean and abandoned ship.

Cycrow
May 4th, 2006, 03:18 PM
well it cant be the wraith, because the wraith evolved from those bugs AFTER the ancients got there.

doubt its the new guys cause we know from the spoilers that they were CREATED by the ancients, so there could be a third and very bad ass alien race out there waiting.

or maybe the wraith got them and stole their technology, i dunno

its been proven in a few episodes that the enemy they were talking a bout was the wraith.
most notably in before i sleep, when they are actaully in the finally battle and leave for earth, and it is against the wraith.

just because they evolved after the ancients got there really doesn't mean anything. the ancients left for peague a few million years ago, and the great war with the wraith happened about 10'000 years ago, so if they were created when the anicnets got there, they still havem illions of years to evolve

F302pilot777
May 4th, 2006, 05:45 PM
but michaels queen confired it was the wraith

LORD MONK
May 4th, 2006, 08:49 PM
It's the Wraith.

Snord
May 4th, 2006, 10:03 PM
I really have no idea just how many ships The Wraith had in ratio to one of the Ancients' satelites, ships, or cannons. I still think that the Ancient's power was still WAY MORE to THINK the Wraith out of existence. If a stupid satelite can take out an entire fleet then why the hell are the Wraith still around? Maybe the sleeping enemy should be something else entirely because something doesn't add up. If an Earth ship on SGA can with stand a few hive ships then why couldn't the Ancients? There needs to be an explanation in the form of another enemy that fought the Ancients and weakened them down for the Wraith.

NakedJehutyV2
May 4th, 2006, 10:16 PM
huge contradiction due to established wraith origins

LORD MONK
May 4th, 2006, 10:33 PM
They already say how the Wraith took them by numbers.

aussie
May 5th, 2006, 11:45 PM
OK when starting this discussion not thinking it was the Asurans that slept, but as i read on this is what i now belive could be a great seasonal outtake,
ok their was an alliance many years ago. 4 "people/species ect.)" with the asgard nox furlings alterians....? (think thats the name "atlantians")
a war broke out from the aceints and the ori.
the asgard nox furlings were allies of the acients. where the ori had their allies to. They had insders which turned they replicator buddies against them. and created the wraith genetcally. they trained the wraith to fight their battle along with other races where as the ori continued to breed wraith untill they faught back and fighted aginst the ori, where thenfore beomcing inderpendant. however the wraith and the ori continued to fight the altanitians. (sorry guys for using so many terms for atlantians" ) and with them breeding and being created by the ori they were outnumbered and had to leave the galaxy and the allies of the atlantians followed.
what i am trying to say is i know its not possible but makes abit scence.. well i think it does so what i have summed up is.
- atlantians had an alliance against the ori
- as so did the ori against the atlantians
- the ori with spys sent in to turn they replicator people against them.
- the ori helped genetically alter the wraiths DNA
- the ORI used the Wraith as soldiers who then seeked inderpendance as teal'c once did.
- wraith over populated the the peag galaxy and became stronger with numbers
FAIR ENOUGH GOOD BYE! :D:D:D:D

Redmen
May 6th, 2006, 12:57 AM
At the time of the war Acients Vs. Wreith there was no Ori. The Ori come in to play after the ascension of the Acients.

knowles2
May 6th, 2006, 02:31 AM
The ancients knew how to ascend in the pegasus, so it could involve the ori. The evidence for this is because the ancients created a sanctury for where people could go and learn to evolve to the next level.

I can imagine the wraith taking few planets of the ancient but conquering antire galexy full of ancient, especialy with the kind of weapons the ancients add, does not seem remotley possible, especially the wraith all seemed more worry about their tummys than actually fighting the enemy. Know I firmly believe their must of been a other unseen enemy out their who weaken the ancients before the wraith propped. The humans so far have been showen the wraith one and only food source and it would of taken millions of humans to freed the vast wraith armies which would of been needed to defeat the ancient, thinking on the line of probably tens of thousands of vessels. Also the ancient women said the enemy awoke from the planet, now why would she awoke instead of evolve.

NakedJehutyV2
May 6th, 2006, 07:34 PM
based on established wraith origin. the wraith may not be the awoken enemy

deltsigpun
May 6th, 2006, 08:15 PM
Has anyone considered it was the Asurans that created the wraith to get back at the ancients and other humans in the galaxy?

Also, do you think the wraith have main planet of operation some where? A massive city where ships are biult and tech developed?

knowles2
May 7th, 2006, 03:22 AM
No because the asurans were created to attack the wraith, as a virus and they evolve beyound that purpose into setient beings. Then they split becaus eof a disagreement, well that what it says in one part of the spoiler.

Tain
May 11th, 2006, 10:54 PM
are you dense? i never said the wraith didn't own them just they aren't the sleeping enemy. since they were "created" not awoken. they evolved from the e bug. mutated from humans. humans weren't there till alterrans seeded them

Except that the Wraith ARE the enemy that slept, and have been stated as being such on several occasions. They never once refer to a "sleeping" enemy. They Woke up the Wraith, and they are still awake.

Also, timeline wise, Atlantis left the milky way to go seed pegasus 5 million years ago give or take. The Wraith war with the Ancients started 10,100 years ago. that leaves the Wraith around 4,990,000 years to evolve, be created or whatever. Plenty of time to go to sleep to be discovered by the Ancients, too. They could have been asleep for millions of years before the Ancients accidentally kicked over their cosmic bee hive.

LORD MONK
May 12th, 2006, 01:22 PM
yup, it was the Wraith.

NakedJehutyV2
May 12th, 2006, 03:47 PM
nope took us some 50+ million years to get where we are and that's not saying much

NakedJehutyV2
May 12th, 2006, 03:52 PM
Except that the Wraith ARE the enemy that slept, and have been stated as being such on several occasions. They never once refer to a "sleeping" enemy. They Woke up the Wraith, and they are still awake.

Also, timeline wise, Atlantis left the milky way to go seed pegasus 5 million years ago give or take. The Wraith war with the Ancients started 10,100 years ago. that leaves the Wraith around 4,990,000 years to evolve, be created or whatever. Plenty of time to go to sleep to be discovered by the Ancients, too. They could have been asleep for millions of years before the Ancients accidentally kicked over their cosmic bee hive.


nope took us 50+ million years to get to our pathetic little exsistence. wraith would need the same or more to evolve and be technically advanced.

you dude got ownd

knowles2
May 13th, 2006, 04:35 AM
nope took us 50+ million years to get to our pathetic little exsistence. wraith would need the same or more to evolve and be technically advanced.

you dude got ownd

Well that part do not to neccessary have be true, we know that the wraith bug incorparated human dna and this apparently speeded up their evolution whether this is would of been enough to catch up to any where near the ancients evolution level and their technology level is doubt full if not impossible. The thing I do not understand is that it would require the bugs to feed of hundred of humans and so why did not the anicent abandon the planet when they first started to get attack from these bugs. And we know that the bugs do not incently start evolving when attach to humans because the bug was attack to shepperd for about forty minutes and bugs did not change at all.

Their to many unanswers questions and I think the writers wanted it like that so they could bring new enemies and slowly reveal the plot and what really happen in the war. I hope we just find some answers in the next season.

Would not it be great the asguard flying blowing the hell out them two hive ships while shepperd escaping with micheal he says something like how the hell did you defeat the anicients, and he says something like we did'nt and then cut to shepperd being beam out and micheal escaping on one of the wraith hyperdrive cappable vessels. And that would be suppense full scene and leave audience with a lot more questions and answers.

Wraith Scientist
May 13th, 2006, 05:02 AM
Here's a theory I was discussing on another thread (this post onwards (http://forum.gateworld.net/showthread.php?p=5262547#post5262547)):

The Iratus bugs are native to Pegausu, over millions of years, before the Ancients arived, they evolved sentience - the Iratus Sapiens. The Iratus Sapiens have a technology focus of biological and genetic technology.

The Iratus Sapiens 'fed' in the same way as the Wraith. They began to consume the life in their galaxy and began to run out of food. They go into hibernation.

The Ancients arive and seed the galaxy with humans. They also seed life on the planet that the Iratus Sapiens, unknown to them, are hibernating on.

The Iratus Sapiens wake from their sleep. They begin a project to reclaim their galaxy, blending human DNA with their own to create the Wraith, a species which can survive by feeding off humans. They arm the Wraith with their advanced technology, using them to conquer the galaxy.

The Wraith cull the galaxy and defeat the Ancients, but with food scarce again, the Iratus Sapiens go back into long hibernation, leaving the Wraith alone, without the advanced technology they once had. The Wraith technology base begins to stagnate.

*Waits for flaming to begin :p *

Ancient 1
May 13th, 2006, 10:24 AM
they are just assuming this?
I think we are ALL supposed to assume this...:daniel:

Peoples_General
May 13th, 2006, 11:32 AM
Considering that the Hologram lady is supposed to be an ascended Ancient posing as a hologram... it's likely she made it up to scare the crew from Earth.

NakedJehutyV2
May 13th, 2006, 01:45 PM
makes sense

oscar_skywalker
May 13th, 2006, 07:47 PM
I think there are some weird thinks going on. Where the Hive ships made it where their mother planet is and where is their scientist? If they advanced the technology by themselves why they still dint figured out hyper drive? And why the rest of bugs didnít evolved? So it means some one modified the bugs with human DNA! So who did it? If ancient did it? Why their technology is far different than ancient? if the ancient used a human to create the Wraith, they must knew all about other galaxyís! So why Wraith didnít make their hyper drive to travel there yet? Also why they donít have shields? Where are their females? If there are only 60 Hive ships around why the ancient didnít take them down what was the think ancient did scared their number? Even the earth ship toke down few of them.. Even they donít have clocking and shields? And why the ancient doesnít have beaming devices? And why the ancientís didnít create biological war heads against to Wraith? As we make one to return them to human?????? So many unknown but I am sure one think some one create them against Atlantians but they didnít give the all technology to Wraith so they can handle the Wraith. So I think they are the one ancient discovered after all fight with Wraith and after that discovery they give up the fight and left the Pegasus.

Regards oscar.

techjunkie
May 15th, 2006, 02:50 PM
Considering that the Hologram lady is supposed to be an ascended Ancient posing as a hologram... it's likely she made it up to scare the crew from Earth.

Actually, I think they left it vague for a reason. The 'great enemy' they awok was spoken of in metaphor. It was done for one reason. An open door for the writers and producers. No grand plan - no hidden future - it was simply a writers tool which for us has worked out into a third season.

We do know this:


At some point, the hologram is replaced, has been or will be an ascended ancient. So the original story she told may just be that - a colorfull story drentched in metaphor.
the darke enemy has been reffered to in a number of ways - including the nanovirus discovered in season 1.
We know the Assurans are essential Pegasus's version of the replicators. This ties into a number of theories that - this has happened once, this has happened before, this will happen again nonesense of the eternal battle between the forces of good and evil. It's nice actually, since humans seems to keep thier genetic characteristics from planet to planet - so does the potential dangers of nanotechnology.


What I surmise is that the wraith are mearly foot soldiers of a past enemy. Perhaps like Sauron is for middleearth, they are the left overs from a past greater war.

It opens up some good poitns to argue.

TechJunkie

Mister Oragahn
May 15th, 2006, 05:57 PM
The Wraith, with their intelligence (...) and level of technology, couldn't win against the Ancients.
No matter the numbers, unless we start to reach astronomical near infinite ones that defy common sense, with shipyards spewing hiveship every second, etc.

However, I hope that we won't be told that the replicators were the super enemy.
See, the Asurans didn't conquer the whole galaxy, while they should have. They didn't have intergalactic hyperdrives, or didn't use them.
It was the Wraith who attacked Atlantis, and were about to capture/destroy it. It's the Wraith who control Pegasus, not the Asurans.

But the Wraith suck.