PDA

View Full Version : Wraith Castes



Prior_of_the_Ori
April 18th, 2006, 06:19 PM
Thought I would make a thread about whats been learnt of the Wraith in these last two seasons. From what we have seen the Wraith have the human elements of society mixed with an insect heirarchy with different Wraiths having set roles almost.

From the show we can gather (and comments from TPTB on GW site) say there are four main castes of Wraith namely:
Hive Queens, who run the Wraith Hive
Keepers, who take the role of scientists
Commanders, male leaders who command the troops
Drones, the faceless footsoldiers who fight

So do you think we might see other castes or thats it? Do the drones double as workers as well?

On GW its mentioned that Michael is seen as somewhat as a 'fifth' caste bridging between humanity and the Wraith. So does this mean Ellia would have been a 'sixth' caste? I mean she was almost a giant Iratus bug rather then a Wraith or human.

Happy_Gate
April 18th, 2006, 07:14 PM
You know, I have this odd feeling that the we'll find out that the workers for the wraiths a slave humans.

rarocks24
April 18th, 2006, 07:17 PM
On GW its mentioned that Michael is seen as somewhat as a 'fifth' caste bridging between humanity and the Wraith.

No!!! Why? Where is this said? As if the Wraith could get any more Borg-ish.

TechnoWraith
April 18th, 2006, 07:47 PM
Thought I would make a thread about whats been learnt of the Wraith in these last two seasons. From what we have seen the Wraith have the human elements of society mixed with an insect heirarchy with different Wraiths having set roles almost.

From the show we can gather (and comments from TPTB on GW site) say there are four main castes of Wraith namely:
Hive Queens, who run the Wraith Hive
Keepers, who take the role of scientists
Commanders, male leaders who command the troops
Drones, the faceless footsoldiers who fight

So do you think we might see other castes or thats it? Do the drones double as workers as well?

On GW its mentioned that Michael is seen as somewhat as a 'fifth' caste bridging between humanity and the Wraith. So does this mean Ellia would have been a 'sixth' caste? I mean she was almost a giant Iratus bug rather then a Wraith or human.

Actually, the Keepers are in charge of the hive while it hibernates (or otherwise). (Rising, Atlantis:Season 1). ;)

Unless Keepers also take on a scientific role, too. but i don't really see that happening for some reason. :rolleyes:

Ouroboros
April 18th, 2006, 09:35 PM
Keepers are more important than hivequeens.

Queens just run single ships.

Keepers hold onto ancient knowledge necessary to build and maintain certain facets of Wraith technology. This is probably why they oversee the sleeping Wraith. In case anything goes wrong with the hibernation they want someone who knows what they're doing to prevent them all from dieing in their sleep.

Allies also implies that Keepers are valued among the Wraith to such an extent that who they make their alliances with affects the balance of power in the various Wraith tribes.

Blue Banrigh
April 19th, 2006, 01:17 AM
Are there any physical distinction between the hivequeens and the keepers?

TechnoWraith
April 19th, 2006, 05:46 AM
Keepers are more important than hivequeens.

Queens just run single ships.

Keepers hold onto ancient knowledge necessary to build and maintain certain facets of Wraith technology. This is probably why they oversee the sleeping Wraith. In case anything goes wrong with the hibernation they want someone who knows what they're doing to prevent them all from dieing in their sleep.

Allies also implies that Keepers are valued among the Wraith to such an extent that who they make their alliances with affects the balance of power in the various Wraith tribes.

Oh, okies. I must not have been paying attention to those parts. ;)

Prior_of_the_Ori
April 19th, 2006, 06:24 AM
Are there any physical distinction between the hivequeens and the keepers?

Don't believe so as we have only seen one keeper so far namely the one in Rising.

As for where the Michael Fifth caste thing is written, its on Gateworld and was written by Brad Wright.

Also since Wraith tech is organic to some extent would this mean the Wraith don't require labour to produce their ships? Say perhaps only the Keepers are needed to shape the ship into its form while it grows on its own as long as their is sustenance to draw upon.

GhostPoet
April 19th, 2006, 11:25 AM
The human worshippers could be somewhat considered a caste system...the Wraith may end up using them as more than just food or worshipping servants. They could be experimented on, made into soldiers or weapons.

HirogenGater
April 19th, 2006, 12:56 PM
No!!! Why? Where is this said? As if the Wraith could get any more Borg-ish.

I don't think they are like the Borg.

Ouroboros
April 19th, 2006, 09:11 PM
Are there any physical distinction between the hivequeens and the keepers?

Keepers are blue and have red hair?

So far we've only seen one hivekeeper and at the time we didn't know how important she was. It's impossible to say if all hivekeepers will look sort of like her of if they will also vary like the queens do. Another point of potential variation is the hands. They used prosthetic Wraith hands in Rising but haven't done it since. It's tough to call whether that will become another distinguishing trait of keepers or just something that gets left behind as the makeup techniques evolve though.

Keepers also seem to be better psychics than queens given how the Rising one could make Sumner leak info all over the place just by asking him questions, but the queen in Hive needed a big plot to try and trick Shep into telling her about Earth.

I'd say the red hair is the thing to watch for though. We've never seen another Wraith with red hair or anything even close really.


Oh, okies. I must not have been paying attention to those parts.

This stuff came out in one scene in Allies. If you haven't seen it yet then don't worry, you didn't miss anything.

FallenAngelII
April 20th, 2006, 04:07 AM
Thought I would make a thread about whats been learnt of the Wraith in these last two seasons. From what we have seen the Wraith have the human elements of society mixed with an insect heirarchy with different Wraiths having set roles almost.

From the show we can gather (and comments from TPTB on GW site) say there are four main castes of Wraith namely:
Hive Queens, who run the Wraith Hive
Keepers, who take the role of scientists
Commanders, male leaders who command the troops
Drones, the faceless footsoldiers who fight

So do you think we might see other castes or thats it? Do the drones double as workers as well?

On GW its mentioned that Michael is seen as somewhat as a 'fifth' caste bridging between humanity and the Wraith. So does this mean Ellia would have been a 'sixth' caste? I mean she was almost a giant Iratus bug rather then a Wraith or human.

To me, "Keeper" sounded much more like a Wraith who guards and commands the Hive while the others sleep. I mean, you can't have it like the Aurora crew now, can you? They all went into suspended animation and look where that got them.

TechnoWraith
April 20th, 2006, 09:26 AM
This stuff came out in one scene in Allies. If you haven't seen it yet then don't worry, you didn't miss anything.

I did see Allies, i probably just didn't pay too close attnetion to taht part. ;) i have Allies on the Tivo still, so i can go rewatch it.

FallenAngelII
April 20th, 2006, 10:18 AM
Exactly when in Allies did they even mention keepers?

Anyway, as for the red hair, how many people in real life do you know that have red hair naturally? Not many, I bet.

rarocks24
April 20th, 2006, 10:20 AM
Exactly when in Allies did they even mention keepers?

Anyway, as for the red hair, how many people in real life do you know that have red hair naturally? Not many, I bet.
On the top of my head (no pun intended), I only know one...

And I don't remember them talking about keepers in Allies.

The Prophet
April 20th, 2006, 10:38 AM
Well, so far we've heard of this:

Queen: In Charge of the Hive Ship. There's been 1 per ship so far.

Commanders The Lanky Ones who Command the Soldiers.

Soldiers The Masked Muscle

Keepers The apparant Janitors of the Wraith, they're left to starve & keep the Hive Clean of Intruders. Either that or a Emperess or Wraith, but I for One doubt that, as they wouldn't be left unguarded or used as a Dead-Man Switch if they were important, IMO they're the runt of the litter.

Scientists There were the odd scientists who did the odd experiment- As the one who experimented on Teyla.

Worshippers The Human Worshippers who Serve the Wraith to gather Info & possibly to Lure prey, like some sort of Angel Fish.

Michael The Human/Wraith Hybrid, Understands Both races. Isn't the leader, but an aparant side-man who has higher privligdes than the average Commander.

The Muscle/Commander There was the Wraith in Allies who was showing McKay & Ronan around the Hive Ship & tried to "Suck the Life Out of McKays Shoulders." he appeared to be a Diplomat, an Unmasked Soldier or a Muscled-Up Commander.

The Defient One Probably was a Soldier, a "Diplomat" or a Commander.

So That's 9 comparitivly Different Wraith Types We've seen, with possibly a Interlap or One Typer of Wraith doing Multiple Duties, such as a "Diplomat."

rarocks24
April 20th, 2006, 10:47 AM
Well, so far we've heard of this:

Queen: In Charge of the Hive Ship. There's been 1 per ship so far.

Commanders The Lanky Ones who Command the Soldiers.

Soldiers The Masked Muscle

Keepers The apparant Janitors of the Wraith, they're left to starve & keep the Hive Clean of Intruders. Either that or a Emperess or Wraith, but I for One doubt that, as they wouldn't be left unguarded or used as a Dead-Man Switch if they were important, IMO they're the runt of the litter.

Scientists There were the odd scientists who did the odd experiment- As the one who experimented on Teyla.

Worshippers The Human Worshippers who Serve the Wraith to gather Info & possibly to Lure prey, like some sort of Angel Fish.

Michael The Human/Wraith Hybrid, Understands Both races. Isn't the leader, but an aparant side-man who has higher privligdes than the average Commander.

The Muscle/Commander There was the Wraith in Allies who was showing McKay & Ronan around the Hive Ship & tried to "Suck the Life Out of McKays Shoulders." he appeared to be a Diplomat, an Unmasked Soldier or a Muscled-Up Commander.

The Defient One Probably was a Soldier, a "Diplomat" or a Commander.

So That's 9 comparitivly Different Wraith Types We've seen, with possibly a Interlap or One Typer of Wraith doing Multiple Duties, such as a "Diplomat."
Actually, that's slightly incorrect.

Keeper:I don't think she wasn't being well fed when Col. Sumner got fed on. (there was that rotting corpse after all)

Commander:The basic higher ups in the Wraith hierarchy. Serve as Scientists, military commanders, ship officers, diplomats, etc. (Condemned, Allies)

Soldier:Grunt man of the Wraith hierarchy, and the most expendable. Truly the grunt of the litter. Preserved only for defensive and offensive reasons.

immhotep
April 20th, 2006, 10:54 AM
Yeah they were mentioned; they were talking about food shortages since the rise of the whole species and that the keepers had made thier own alliences.

The Prophet
April 20th, 2006, 10:55 AM
Actually, that's slightly incorrect.

Keeper:I don't think she wasn't being well fed when Col. Sumner got fed on. (there was that rotting corpse after all)


Well, I was thinking about how she was left alone on a planet that appeared to have no Civilisation on it & how she was left to find her own food by herself or any visistors who came along. With the aparant lack of Gate Travel in Pegasus & the lack of human life on the Planet, I'd think that was very unlikely- Would you want to spend ages with only the occasional visitor as suppliment & having to hunt for your own food in an entire Galaxy alone with enemies all around yo inent on getting revenge & killing you, or spend ages asleep in a nice cosy bed with the thought of a gigantic feast when you woke up? Also, the fact that it was rotting probably ment it'd been there for a while...

rarocks24
April 20th, 2006, 12:13 PM
Well, I was thinking about how she was left alone on a planet that appeared to have no Civilisation on it & how she was left to find her own food by herself or any visistors who came along.

Actually, she had minions. Please, don't forget about the minions. Remember, she sent a dart to Athos for culling.

The Prophet
April 20th, 2006, 12:18 PM
Actually, she had minions. Please, don't forget about the minions. Remember, she sent a dart to Athos for culling.

Minions can be forgotten about, who's ever heard of Napoleon's Minions or Caeser's Minions? Nobody That's who! All the Minions of the Past have been forgotten & will remain that way! So we can surely forget about Wraith Minions! :P

Yeah, I was wrong. :D But we were tought a valuable lesson today, remember what rarocks24 said Kids:
Don't Forget Minions!

Prior_of_the_Ori
April 20th, 2006, 05:33 PM
And I don't remember them talking about keepers in Allies.

From Allies Transcript:
WRAITH: Before the civil war, there were Keepers who maintained the entire fleet, but they have made their own alliances.

Plus Brad Wright has more or less classified them as a caste.

rarocks24
April 20th, 2006, 05:41 PM
From Allies Transcript:
WRAITH: Before the civil war, there were Keepers who maintained the entire fleet, but they have made their own alliances.

Plus Brad Wright has more or less classified them as a caste.
Thanks. I honestly didn't remember that part.

Prior_of_the_Ori
April 21st, 2006, 05:26 AM
Thanks. I honestly didn't remember that part.

No problem. Plus this way it makes it easier.

Anyway would anyone class Ellia as another caste of Wraith if they call Michael a new caste? I mean he is more human then Wraith while Ellia was Iratus bug. I wonder how different she would have been had she been allowed to continue changing. I mean it looked like she was growing a chitinous armour and she was developing three taloned fingers almost. Plus what would there relationship be with the Wraith? Sure Ellia attacked the Wraith there but that could be a hunger craze.

Wraith Scientist
April 21st, 2006, 07:25 AM
Anyway would anyone class Ellia as another caste of Wraith if they call Michael a new caste? I mean he is more human then Wraith while Ellia was Iratus bug. I wonder how different she would have been had she been allowed to continue changing. I mean it looked like she was growing a chitinous armour and she was developing three taloned fingers almost. Plus what would there relationship be with the Wraith? Sure Ellia attacked the Wraith there but that could be a hunger craze.

Pre-retrovirus, Ellia was like Michael - between Wraith and human, but probably more human than Michael since she was raised as one. She would probably fit into Michael's 'flying duchman' caste, if not side fully with the humans. It would be good if Michael found her alive (incredible healing ability, retrovirus wears off) and formed a new Wraith faction.

Post-retrovirus, that creature was like a Wraith but with more Iratus bug. The retrovirus was stripping the human elements from here DNA, leaving the Iratus bug elements behind.

The Iratus-Ellia was more of an animal than a sentient being - little intelligence at all, driven solely by instinct. If the Wraith found a way to produce them they might use them as shock-troops: beaming them into enemy territory and watching them wreak havok. It would be like the film Alien - ultra-powerful creatures wandering around stalking and killing people.

FallenAngelII
April 21st, 2006, 08:49 AM
Actually, that's slightly incorrect.

Keeper:I don't think she wasn't being well fed when Col. Sumner got fed on. (there was that rotting corpse after all)

Commander:The basic higher ups in the Wraith hierarchy. Serve as Scientists, military commanders, ship officers, diplomats, etc. (Condemned, Allies)

Soldier:Grunt man of the Wraith hierarchy, and the most expendable. Truly the grunt of the litter. Preserved only for defensive and offensive reasons.

I too doubt she was starving. After all, each hive ship has... preserved foods on it. Also, they'd just culled a planet even though the others were still hibernating.

However, that rotting corpse was the Athosian guy they took right before Sumner (the one Sumner volunteered to be a substitute for).

Ouroboros
April 21st, 2006, 07:24 PM
Exactly when in Allies did they even mention keepers?

Anyway, as for the red hair, how many people in real life do you know that have red hair naturally? Not many, I bet.

It was toward the end when McKay was helping the Wraith fix their hive. The Wraith scientist guy tells him how they mostly just let the ships fix/heal themselves but only the keepers know how to fix certain things.


Keepers The apparant Janitors of the Wraith, they're left to starve & keep the Hive Clean of Intruders. Either that or a Emperess or Wraith, but I for One doubt that, as they wouldn't be left unguarded or used as a Dead-Man Switch if they were important, IMO they're the runt of the litter.

I kinda doubt their whole civilization would wake up because somebody wacked a janitor.

She also had better psychic powers than any queen has shown so far.

Prior_of_the_Ori
April 22nd, 2006, 09:30 AM
Not sure if the Keeper has better powers then the Hive Queen....they seem somewhat same. I mean the only reason the one in Hive was using a human was because its been said that Wraith telepathy isnt that good outside their species so they need other means to get further information.

Mister Oragahn
April 22nd, 2006, 10:49 AM
Pre-retrovirus, Ellia was like Michael - between Wraith and human, but probably more human than Michael since she was raised as one. She would probably fit into Michael's 'flying duchman' caste, if not side fully with the humans. It would be good if Michael found her alive (incredible healing ability, retrovirus wears off) and formed a new Wraith faction.

Post-retrovirus, that creature was like a Wraith but with more Iratus bug. The retrovirus was stripping the human elements from here DNA, leaving the Iratus bug elements behind.

The Iratus-Ellia was more of an animal than a sentient being - little intelligence at all, driven solely by instinct. If the Wraith found a way to produce them they might use them as shock-troops: beaming them into enemy territory and watching them wreak havok. It would be like the film Alien - ultra-powerful creatures wandering around stalking and killing people.

Berzerkers, but Ellia struggled against Teyla.

Wraith Scientist
April 22nd, 2006, 12:56 PM
Berzerkers, but Ellia struggled against Teyla.

That's the word I was looking for :)

She also snapped a Wraith's neck in seconds. And Teyla lost eventually, but she struggled against Sheppard too ... probably because they were holding her hands. And she was just a child ... think about what an adult version would be like (in fact, Sheppard in Conversion was pretty nasty).

Put a few on an enemy ship/base, maybe give them personal cloaking devices if you're really malicious. They heal really fast and are incredibly hard to kill.

Prior_of_the_Ori
April 22nd, 2006, 06:50 PM
I like the idea. Kind of like the Wraiths version of a super soldier. Though a problem does happen in that these Iratus Bug Berserkers would be feeding on the precious 'food' of the Wraith which they might not like. But in terms of general warfare it would make a good berserker though would possibly be telepathically domianted to ensure cooperation on its part at least.

Ouroboros
April 22nd, 2006, 11:21 PM
Not sure if the Keeper has better powers then the Hive Queen....they seem somewhat same. I mean the only reason the one in Hive was using a human was because its been said that Wraith telepathy isnt that good outside their species so they need other means to get further information.

The allies queen couldn't just probe Shep's mind and make him answer questions the way the rising one did with Sumner though, she had to make up this big complicated plan to try and trick him into telling her spy about Earth.

If I had to pick the guy who'd be harder to mentaly dominate to I'd also tend to say it would be Sumner.

Wraith Scientist
April 23rd, 2006, 03:22 AM
The Keeper was most definitely stronger

KEEPER: What do you call your world?

(Sumner refuses to answer. The keeper repeats the question but this time her mouth doesn't move and the sound of her voice reverberates. She's clearly exerting telepathic force on Sumner, who struggles under the pressure.)

KEEPER (silently): What do you call your world?

SUMNER (struggling not to speak, but unable to resist): Earth.

KEEPER: It is not among our stars.

SUMNER (still struggling): No.

KEEPER: Tell me of Earth. How many more are there of your kind? (Again, Sumner tries not to let her into his mind.) Thousands? Millions? (delighted) More. Our feeding ground has not been so rich in ten thousand years.
Sumner would have been trained to resist physical and mental torture, and definately seemed like the kind of person who could withstand that sort of stuff, but he really struggles against the Keeper.

And she also seemed more intelligent and philosophical - "All living things must eat" While the Queen was easily tricked by Sheppard

I wonder if Ellia was either a Queen or a Keeper. Her transport crashed before Sheppard woke the Wraith, so she might have been a new Wraith Keeper. On the other hand she could have been a Queen, but she wasn't hibernating with the others.

All the Wraith females we've seen (with the exception of Ellia) have been in positions of authority.

FallenAngelII
April 23rd, 2006, 03:35 AM
It could just be that some people have stronger mental powers than others. And they aren't automatically crowned Queen.

Ellia was probably not a queen. At most a princess, future queen. But if she were, the Wraith would've avenged her... "death" by scorching Ellia's planet.

Demonique
April 30th, 2006, 03:25 PM
Actually, the Keepers are in charge of the hive while it hibernates (or otherwise). (Rising, Atlantis:Season 1). ;)

Unless Keepers also take on a scientific role, too. but i don't really see that happening for some reason. :rolleyes:

Didn't the scientist in Allies tell Rodney that the Keepers maintained the ships?
I guess this means the Queen is responsible for the political stuff in the Hive and the Keeper is like the Chief Engineer or something, but I can't see the Keeper from Rising actually working on the ship herself, she probably diagnosed problems and delegated the actual physical work to subordinates.

Demonique
April 30th, 2006, 03:36 PM
Are there any physical distinction between the hivequeens and the keepers?

Can't say yet as we've only seen one Keeper and two Queens.
One red-haired Keeper, one white-haired Queen and one dark-haired Queen who looks like she's had had too much plastic surgery.

It's unknown yet whether or not red hair is a trait common only to Keepers.

Queens and Keepers seem more physically similar than drones and the more slender male Wraith commanders/infiltrators/scientists, so there's a chance that Queens and Keepers could be the same sub-species so to speak.

Demonique
April 30th, 2006, 03:42 PM
The Muscle/Commander There was the Wraith in Allies who was showing McKay & Ronan around the Hive Ship & tried to "Suck the Life Out of McKays Shoulders." he appeared to be a Diplomat, an Unmasked Soldier or a Muscled-Up Commander.



He was a scientist as far as I was aware. Probably Chief Scientist on the hive else the Queen wouldn't have brought him to Atlantis

Ouroboros
April 30th, 2006, 11:36 PM
The Keeper was most definitely stronger

And she also seemed more intelligent and philosophical - "All living things must eat" While the Queen was easily tricked by Sheppard

I remember saying sortly after the episode aired that had Shep drawn the Rising queen instead of the short bus cadet he actually got there never would have been a continuation to lost boys.


I wonder if Ellia was either a Queen or a Keeper. Her transport crashed before Sheppard woke the Wraith, so she might have been a new Wraith Keeper. On the other hand she could have been a Queen, but she wasn't hibernating with the others.

Going by her colouring and lack of super psi powers I'd say she was more likely a queen.

I could see one queen being potentially left behind after her ship crashed. If a young keeper had been lost though I get the feeling the Wraith would have torn the hell out of that place looking for her.

Come to think of it could there even be a such thing as a young keeper that wasn't around in the ancient wars?


Didn't the scientist in Allies tell Rodney that the Keepers maintained the ships?
I guess this means the Queen is responsible for the political stuff in the Hive and the Keeper is like the Chief Engineer or something, but I can't see the Keeper from Rising actually working on the ship herself, she probably diagnosed problems and delegated the actual physical work to subordinates.

Not every ship has a Keeper though and getting one on your side apparently shifts the balance of power significantly in your favour.

Killing one also triggers a species wide awakening of the Wraith as opposed to just a localized one limited to the ship or tribe she belonged to.

In my estimation the keepers are the real power behind the Wraith. They decide who to align themselves with and those Wraith then benefit from their unique expertise. Since they can determine who prospers and who fails by who they ally themselves with they become the de-facto rulers of the Wraith as a species. They leverage their unique and necessary skills into political power the other Wraith need to then respect or try to get on without them, which is difficult.