Was Merlin Hypocritical? ('Arthur's Mantle' SPOILERS)

[mahram]

Doesnt anybody find it hypocritical that merlin the leader of the ancients, and the one who sanctioned jonas for tempering with time, for defying ancient laws. I mean, he was all greater then though in before i sleep, giving jonas the riot act about messing with time, and treating causaulty with no respect. And he developing a weopen that can commit genocide.

[prion]

Doesnt anybody find it hypocritical that merlin the leader of the ancients, and the one who sanctioned jonas for tempering with time, for defying ancient laws. I mean, he was all greater then though in before i sleep, giving jonas the riot act about messing with time, and treating causaulty with no respect. And he developing a weopen that can commit genocide.

My mind is fuddled. In which episode with an Ancient leader read Jonas (Corin Nemec's character) the riot act?

Are you talking about the human-like replicators in that SG-1 episode?

But the Ancients are pretty much on their high horse, and well, pride goeth before the fall. Happens in every civilization.

[Arative]

Doesnt anybody find it hypocritical that merlin the leader of the ancients, and the one who sanctioned jonas for tempering with time, for defying ancient laws. I mean, he was all greater then though in before i sleep, giving jonas the riot act about messing with time, and treating causaulty with no respect. And he developing a weopen that can commit genocide.

Merlin was never stated as the leader of the Ancients nor is it ever shown that Merlin was the same person as the leader of the Ancient Council in Before I sleep.

[metroid]

What they said, and it's Janus, not Jonas.
You should get these names right or you'll confuse alot of people

It is not (yet?) proven that Merlin and the head of the council are the same person. Also, the head of the council was telling him that tampering with the timeline is dangerous, because anything that happens in the past could alter the future. Merlin making a weapon to kill ascended beings (intended for use on Ori) is a whole different story so i'm not sure why your comparing them.

[spg_1983]

Doesnt anybody find it hypocritical that merlin the leader of the ancients, and the one who sanctioned jonas for tempering with time, for defying ancient laws. I mean, he was all greater then though in before i sleep, giving jonas the riot act about messing with time, and treating causaulty with no respect. And he developing a weopen that can commit genocide.

Assuming that Merlin and the Ancient that was the head of the Atlantis Council are the same, which has never been stated, you are still wrong on several things:
-When was it ever said that the council that was in charge of Atlantis the governing body of the entire Ancient civilization in both galaxies?
-They sanctioned Janus because he was tampering with time and could affect the future, which the Ancients believed should be allowed to happen in its own due course. Merlin was an Ascended Ancient that recognized a threat and felt it needed to be dealt with and couldn't do so as an Ascended it. So he descended and researched and developed a device to deal with the threat. It had nothing to do with time travel or changing the future based on fore knowledge. So how exactly is he hypocritical?
-The device does not commit genocide because it does not kill the Ori. It neutralizes them by broadcasting an interference wave that prevents them from exerting power or prescence on our plane of existance. It is basically a device that artificially produces the same effect as Oma on Anubis. Niether can ever actually kill each other, but they cancel each other out.

[metroid]

Your post is basically a longer version of mine

(but i assume you just took longer writing it which is why my post was earlier )

[Prior_of_the_Ori]

-They sanctioned Janus because he was tampering with time and could affect the future, which the Ancients believed should be allowed to happen in its own due course. Merlin was an Ascended Ancient that recognized a threat and felt it needed to be dealt with and couldn't do so as an Ascended it. So he descended and researched and developed a device to deal with the threat. It had nothing to do with time travel or changing the future based on fore knowledge. So how exactly is he hypocritical?

I would agree with that to an extent. In terms of non-intervention then yes he is kind of a hypocrit but you have to remember that time travel is very tricky business as SG-1 learnt. One wrong move and everything could be changed. I mean say someone went back in time to the time of the Ancients and did something then returned. Life could completely change. There might not be a second evolution of the human form or maybe the ancients become dictators worsethen the Goa'uld. Or maybe the Ori learn of the MW galaxy earlier then it was in the show. So many possibilities. Time travel compared to anti-ascended weapon are completely different from one another.

[spg_1983]

I would agree with that to an extent. In terms of non-intervention then yes he is kind of a hypocrit but you have to remember that time travel is very tricky business as SG-1 learnt. One wrong move and everything could be changed. I mean say someone went back in time to the time of the Ancients and did something then returned. Life could completely change. There might not be a second evolution of the human form or maybe the ancients become dictators worsethen the Goa'uld. Or maybe the Ori learn of the MW galaxy earlier then it was in the show. So many possibilities. Time travel compared to anti-ascended weapon are completely different from one another.

He's not a hypocrite at all because they arent remotely the same actions. Janus was condemed for messing with the timeline, but when have the Ancients ever showed any practice of a non interferance policy? The Ascended have a policy of non interference, but its also important that we don't even know for sure that that was the Ancients idea when they Ascended. Oma revealed that there were "Others" as well as Ascended Ancients. But all of that is inconsequential. When Merlin descended he was no longer and Ascended, so he was no longer under their rules, he was and Ancient again. So there is no hypocrisy. We also dont have any information that Merlin retained any special knowledge when he Descended, and judging by what happend to Orlin, it is highly unlikely that he did. SO Merlin was just his regular old Ancient self with just confirmation that Ascension is for real and they do exist.

[generaloneill]

Doesnt anybody find it hypocritical that merlin the leader of the ancients, and the one who sanctioned jonas for tempering with time, for defying ancient laws. I mean, he was all greater then though in before i sleep, giving jonas the riot act about messing with time, and treating causaulty with no respect. And he developing a weopen that can commit genocide.

i don't think merlin was a hypocrite at all he was willing to do whatever it takes to protect the milky way from the ori and if building a weapon is the only way to achieve that goal then so be it by the way merlin deciding to interfere was nothing like janus's building a time machine and tampering with time.

[mahram]

mea culpa janus ....I thought it was stated in a spoiler by Joe that it was head of the council seen in Before I sleep. And that lady we saw as a hologram in the beginning of atlantis, and in before I sleep, is morgan le fey. But my point was that the atlantean have a non interference law, and merlin was all self rightous about obeying atlatean laws. But when those laws didnt suit merlin, he decides to break them.

What they said, and it's Janus, not Jonas.
You should get these names right or you'll confuse alot of people

It is not (yet?) proven that Merlin and the head of the council are the same person. Also, the head of the council was telling him that tampering with the timeline is dangerous, because anything that happens in the past could alter the future. Merlin making a weapon to kill ascended beings (intended for use on Ori) is a whole different story so i'm not sure why your comparing them.

[ShadowMaat]

Please try to make shorter subject lines. "Is Merlin being a hypocrite?" is SO much easier and explains more than trying to type out an entire paragraph, especially when you repeat it all anyway in the inside message.

And what does Merlin have to do with ANYTHING? Is that a spoiler? If so, try including spoiler warnings for the ep in your subject line was well. If you're more concise in your description, it will fit.

[Happy_Gate]

Well, when he opposed Janus' experiments, it was because the council felt time travel would distrupt the timeline unpredictably, which could affect whole galaxies.
But, what Merlin is guilty of is de-ascending to create the weapon and not meddle too much in mortal affairs. Since he had ascended, he might have been able to see things differently than when he was a mortal.

[metroid]

mea culpa janus ....I thought it was stated in a spoiler by Joe that it was head of the council seen in Before I sleep. And that lady we saw as a hologram in the beginning of atlantis, and in before I sleep, is morgan le fey. But my point was that the atlantean have a non interference law, and merlin was all self rightous about obeying atlatean laws. But when those laws didnt suit merlin, he decides to break them.

Actually, when have you heard the Ancients say they have a non interference law? Sure, as an ascended being they don't interfere with our plain of existense, but we know for a fact that the Atlantians infact did interfere with the other cultures and species in Pegasus, after all, remember in Trinity they had a very powerfull weapon built to fend off the coming Wraith attack.

They infact very likely lived with the normal humans in Pegasus spreading their gene to some of the populations ("The Tower", where the king has the gene).

You shouldn't confused ancients for ascended beings

[overtherainbowe]

Well the Atlantians had no problem butting into other peoples business. I think the "non interference" thing came into play once they asended.

[Heaven]

but the head of the council was called Moros