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GateWorld
April 30th, 2004, 11:11 AM
<DIV ALIGN=CENTER><TABLE WIDTH=450 BORDER=0 CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=7><TR><TD><DIV ALIGN=LEFT><FONT FACE="Arial" SIZE=2 COLOR="#000000"><A HREF="http://www.gateworld.net/sg1/s6/604.shtml"><IMG SRC="http://www.gateworld.net/sg1/graphics/604.jpg" WIDTH=160 HEIGHT=120 ALIGN=RIGHT HSPACE=10 VSPACE=2 BORDER=0 STYLE="border: 1px black solid" ALT="Visit the Episode Guide"></A><FONT SIZE=1 COLOR="#666666">DISCUSS ...</FONT>
<FONT SIZE=4 COLOR="#0066BF"><B>FROZEN</B></FONT>
<FONT SIZE=1>EPISODE NUMBER - 604</FONT>
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A team of scientists uncover a woman frozen in Antarctica, where the second Stargate was found. SG-1 investigates, and is infected with a mysterious disease.

<B><A HREF="http://www.gateworld.net/sg1/s6/604.shtml">Visit the Episode Guide >></A></B></FONT></DIV></TD></TR></TABLE></DIV>

SG_Mike
June 17th, 2004, 11:58 AM
I was so hoping that she would ahve lived!! But now that Atlantis is coming, I hope to see some interesting aspects about these people.

KorbenDirewolf
June 17th, 2004, 12:07 PM
Yeah.. It'd be nice to finally get an official story of what went on, rather than the speculation and theories.

SG_Mike
June 17th, 2004, 12:21 PM
No kidding. I love a good debat just as much as anyone else, but TPTB need to release some more intel this year!!

omnian
June 21st, 2004, 04:54 AM
This was a surprisingly good episode. Ayiana was an intriguing discovery, shame she wasn't around for long though!

Haha, Jack saying how he forgot to tape The Simpsons.....ooh, and the deleted scenes on the Directors Series on the DVD. They are funny :D

bcmilco
June 21st, 2004, 05:08 PM
ooh, and the deleted scenes on the Directors Series on the DVD. They are funny :D

Yes those were very funny I was LMAO when I watched them. :D

Overall I thought the episode was ok.

KorbenDirewolf
June 22nd, 2004, 10:55 AM
Plus they managed to create a reason to put a snake in Jack. ;)

sgeureka
June 23rd, 2004, 05:59 AM
This episode gives you many clues for what's been going on the past million years; you just have to know that you have to look for clues.

When I watched this episode for the first time, I considered it to be one of the worst eps. I really did not like it. Especially since this ep is not really funny, doesn't really tell a story, and I had a real problem with the Darwin's-theory-of-evolution-is-wrong bit.

The audio commentary really helped, and they even give you more clues of what's to come in Lost City. I like the ep more each time I watch it, especially with the knowledge of S7. I hope that there are still many hints in the ep that I have missed and will probably notice only after watching Atlantis or S8. :)

SGSlugger
June 23rd, 2004, 07:32 AM
I enjoyed it. I liked how they had Jonas trying to communicate with her, and her response. At the time though, when the idea of an Ancient was sketchy, I thought Aiyanna was a bit...strange. ;)

Anubis
June 23rd, 2004, 07:33 AM
You are right, it gives you a lot of info on the Ancients and about what may have possible happened. Cool stuff

Selmak
July 11th, 2004, 07:50 AM
We got a better idea of the Ancients... they have a connection to humans.

Anubis
July 11th, 2004, 07:50 AM
Yeah, and they're around 100 million years old

Selmak
July 15th, 2004, 09:25 PM
Was the disease she had from the Wraith?

DownFallAngel
July 16th, 2004, 06:43 AM
Most likely.

aAnubiSs
July 16th, 2004, 08:01 AM
We got a better idea of the Ancients... they have a connection to humans.

Actually it's the other way around. We have a connection to the Ancients.

Lugal
July 25th, 2004, 09:39 PM
One thing I was curious about was why didn't Jonas try to speak Ancient to her? He read all of Daniel's notes so he must be familiar with the language. Other than that I thought it was a good ep.

I loved the DVD director's feature, especially the part at the end.

MARTIN WOOD: I love working with Amanda and hate working with everyone else. (laughter off camera) Don't laugh, you're giving it away.

Metonic
July 25th, 2004, 10:08 PM
Daniel might of not had translated it that well after all how many ancients he meet until after hsi acension?

Also.. Darwin wrong..

And Wraith plague is only a guess and is most likely not true as Ayaiana had the plague before the wraith.

Anubis
July 26th, 2004, 12:48 AM
*Spoilers, Full Circle*



Daniel finds a tablet with the oldest dialect of Ancient writing on. It said that all the Ancient's got wiped out by a plague. Some ascended, and the rest died

Selmak
July 26th, 2004, 08:15 PM
I'm glad the ancient lady was brought back for the Atlantis premiere.

Metonic
July 26th, 2004, 09:23 PM
she was brought back to show that the plague was the reason they left.

Mio
August 3rd, 2004, 08:45 AM
You know, I didn't like this episode until Atlantis started, and the Ancient storylines reached an alltime high.

DownFallAngel
August 3rd, 2004, 10:43 AM
You know, I didn't like this episode until Atlantis started, and the Ancient storylines reached an alltime high.

Same, I thought Season 6 was a complete let down. I liked Jonas and everyone, but until season 7 and 8 picked up the slack, I thought season 6 was a blunder. But now it all ties in. Its cool.

Anubis
August 3rd, 2004, 10:56 AM
I think season six was just trying to explain a few more things and set up season seven's big finale plot. Glad they're finally dealing with the ascension business in S8

DownFallAngel
August 3rd, 2004, 11:05 AM
I think season six was just trying to explain a few more things and set up season seven's big finale plot. Glad they're finally dealing with the ascension business in S8

As our good friend Teal'c would say: "Indeed."

Anubis
August 3rd, 2004, 11:10 AM
Hehehe. I liked Full Circle and Frozen, they were about my fav eps.

SeaBee
September 19th, 2004, 08:53 AM
I liked this episode. Lots of things happening, and it was good to see Dr. Frazier getting out for some fresh air. :)

Major Fischer
November 15th, 2004, 04:50 PM
I'm really enjoying this episode a great deal, but I could see how it might not have seemed as good as it does now back when it first aired. It's almost like it is the prequil to Atlantis. If I were to talk to an Atlantis fan who asked which episodes were most relevent from SG1, this would be one of the tops on my list.

I really liked Aiyanna. First time I haven't loathed an Ancient to be honest. I hope Atlantis finds (another) reason to return to her. The actress was quite good.

Janet Fraiser proved how she really was one of the most brilliant doctors on the planet. Makes me wonder what she did before the SGC. She can really make "I didn't save her" sound brilliant.

The Tok'ra element I thought was the weakest part. It seemed really forced and I kind of wished they hadn't used it at all. Really. It just adds unanswered questions and posibilities to the series that just didn't fall into line. They could have found another reason or way to get Abyss done.

keshou
November 15th, 2004, 05:27 PM
Frozen to me was like half of a good episode. Such potential. Aiyanna was such a great find and then it just kind of all fizzled out without going anywhere. Just became a set-up for Jack to get snaked by a Tok'ra.

I really liked Aiyanna and it was a shame we had to wait so long to see her again. Of course I know TPTB planned on S6 being the last season (ha! if only they'd known), then heading into Lost City movie and spin-off to Atlantis.

Frasier *was* great. Such a fabulous recurring character.

:D

LMichelle
November 16th, 2004, 05:56 AM
This reminded me of X-Files' "Ice." I guess Stargate was on an X-Files-ish episode kick with this one and Nightwalkers. Also, Bruce Harwood was in it, too. :p

I believe the team all went to The North Face to get their gear before they
left. I mean everything said "The North Face" on it. It was a bit much. Did they have The North Face underwear as well? :rolleyes:

Major Fischer
November 16th, 2004, 06:34 AM
I believe the team all went to The North Face to get their gear before they left. I mean everything said "The North Face" on it. It was a bit much. Did they have The North Face underwear as well? :rolleyes:

Product placement. Not only in this episode, but in Rising as well.

blueiris
November 16th, 2004, 07:19 AM
I'm really enjoying this episode a great deal, but I could see how it might not have seemed as good as it does now back when it first aired. It's almost like it is the prequil to Atlantis. If I were to talk to an Atlantis fan who asked which episodes were most relevent from SG1, this would be one of the tops on my list.

I really liked Aiyanna. First time I haven't loathed an Ancient to be honest. I hope Atlantis finds (another) reason to return to her. The actress was quite good.

Janet Fraiser proved how she really was one of the most brilliant doctors on the planet. Makes me wonder what she did before the SGC. She can really make "I didn't save her" sound brilliant.

The Tok'ra element I thought was the weakest part. It seemed really forced and I kind of wished they hadn't used it at all. Really. It just adds unanswered questions and posibilities to the series that just didn't fall into line. They could have found another reason or way to get Abyss done.


This was one episode I never really cared for. But watching last night, I kinda liked it. You made me wonder: is it because of the Atlantis tie in? I'll have to think on that. :S

XToDaZ
November 18th, 2004, 04:25 AM
I find it quite weird that the Tok'ra couldn't have done something earlier, and perhaps blend with Ayana, giving them a significant advantage over the Goa'uld, the replicators and perhaps even reviving the old ancients...

Major Fischer
November 18th, 2004, 05:10 AM
I find it quite weird that the Tok'ra couldn't have done something earlier, and perhaps blend with Ayana, giving them a significant advantage over the Goa'uld, the replicators and perhaps even reviving the old ancients...

There would have been no way for them to ask her, and the Tok'ra do not take unwilling hosts.

XToDaZ
November 18th, 2004, 05:54 AM
There would have been no way for them to ask her, and the Tok'ra do not take unwilling hosts.She understood English and appeared to be very quick study ;) And ofcourse, a temporary agreement to save an ancient, surely a Tok'ra would sacrifice if necessary for such an ally.

Major Fischer
November 18th, 2004, 05:56 AM
She understood English and appeared to be very quick study ;) And ofcourse, a temporary agreement to save an ancient, surely a Tok'ra would sacrifice if necessary for such an ally.

I highly doubt they could have sufficiently explained it, for one thing she seemed to be more empathic, understanding the general idea rather than the details.

Moreover, it's considerably doubtful that an Ancient would have agreed to the arrangement.

XToDaZ
November 18th, 2004, 08:27 AM
I highly doubt they could have sufficiently explained it, for one thing she seemed to be more empathic, understanding the general idea rather than the details.

Moreover, it's considerably doubtful that an Ancient would have agreed to the arrangement.More doubtful than a Jack O'Neill ? Now this is doubtful ;)

Yu`
February 7th, 2005, 04:41 AM
I was very underwhelmed by this one. I was annoyed Aiyanna could not speak. Also diseases and the like really freak me out so thats another reason I didnt think too much of this one.

PugGate
February 13th, 2005, 07:21 PM
Did anyone notice the pineapple that was sitting on the cargo crate in the first scene? :eek:

greytop
February 14th, 2005, 11:00 PM
This was an okay episode in the fact we met our first living ancient and learn that they could heal people and etc.

valaCB
May 14th, 2005, 10:41 AM
This episode was amazing!

This reminded me of X-Files' "Ice."
yes. i thought about it too.

Anubis345
May 14th, 2005, 11:04 AM
it was cool to see the first living Ancient and how they had healing powers

PugGate
May 16th, 2005, 07:01 PM
Did anyone notice the pineapple that was sitting on the cargo crate in the first scene? :eek:

Anyone?

Beatrice Otter
May 17th, 2005, 08:06 PM
Anyone?
I hadn't specifically noticed it, but one of the directors tries to sneak a pineapple in at least once per ep. It's his signature. Usually, it's easy to overlook because it's in the mess hall or an offworld market or someplace like that. But this ep had no mess hall or offworld market scenes. (I forget which director has the pineapple thing, but it'd be easy to figure out since it's the one who did this ep.)

QuiGonJohn
June 8th, 2005, 06:22 PM
This episode was good. But I was a bit disappointed we didn't find out more about Aiyanna, was she really an ancient, why was she buried there, etc.

Acropolis
June 14th, 2005, 06:07 PM
i wish she survived if she survived the trip to the sgc why could she survive and SG1 definately told the Asgard about aiyana so wouldnt they love to see an ancient again and would have but her in stasis and use best tech of the asgard to heal her?

Kevin
July 9th, 2005, 09:27 PM
I loved Frozen. It introduced my second favourite character ever on the show.

My only complaint is that Ayiana didn't survive :(

Out...

KorbenDirewolf
July 11th, 2005, 05:40 PM
There would have been no way for them to ask her, and the Tok'ra do not take unwilling hosts.

They do. Jolinar took Carter. Lantash took Elliot.

zats
July 13th, 2005, 05:08 PM
Theoretically the Tok'ra don't take unwilling hosts. And given how tramautized Sam was after Jolinar took up residence, I can't see the SGC condoning the 'snaking' of unwilling victims. Especially one like Ayiana, who might not know what was going on (unlike Jack, who wasn't crazy about the idea but went along with it, or Elliot, who likely had some inkling).

Stricken
September 8th, 2005, 06:10 AM
I liked Frozen. It was a great episode

My only complaint is that Ayiana didn't survive

Perriman33
September 15th, 2005, 11:57 PM
TPTB like to tease us, look its a real ancient, and just as she's in a state to tell us what happened to them she snuffs it! Harsh,very harsh!
still it was a good episode and the team had some good moments especially jonas. :)

walter_MacChevron
October 31st, 2005, 08:09 PM
Pretty good episode but I did not like how the girl died just as we were about to find out about her

the ancient repli-carter
November 5th, 2005, 03:23 AM
This episode was good. But I was a bit disappointed we didn't find out more about Aiyanna, was she really an ancient, why was she buried there, etc.

I don't know why i always seemed to think that Ayiana was a criminal, just by the way that apophis looking ancient seemed to glare at her and then they left in there city.

it might have been she was infected and to save eberyone else they left her and headed for pegasus.

You can see the despair in her eyes as they leave though, she knows she is screwed

artemis_chosen
December 15th, 2005, 05:05 PM
I like any episode Janet is in simply because she's in it. It was nice to see her get out from under the mountain.

Aside from that I did like this episode for what it was, an ancient storyline. I hadn't realised Ayiana was in Rising until I saw a pic posted here. I need to go back and rewatch a few eps and I think Frozen is one of them.

Major Clanger
December 18th, 2005, 08:06 AM
It was nice to see Jonas doing so well in this one, part of the team.

And it's always nice to see Janet doing field work.

(but the best thing about the ep is that when they went outside, they all wore hats. Sam & Jack obviously learned something the last time they were there!)

James_the_Wraith_Sympathiser
January 4th, 2006, 03:59 AM
Definately one of my favourite episodes. The Ancients stuff is what I'm most interested in...and it's good to go back and watch it now that we know that we are just another evolution of humans, and they were the first (that we know of :P). Also makes me wonder whether, in a few million years, we could be just as intelligent and evolved as the Ancients...at least in the Stargate Universe that is :P

I think Aiyanna's ability to understand Jonas came more from a telepathic ability rather than an ability to understand the English language. We know that Jonas is further along in evolution than the rest of us (though probably not by much) from the episode where they found the planet where Nyrti did the experiments. In which case, it wouldn't of mattered even if he did speak in the Ancient dialect, she knew what he was saying anyway.

AKnightWhoSaysNi
January 11th, 2006, 12:57 PM
I liked this episode, its great how jonas takes on daniels role and tries to communicate with Ayiana, and I love how they are just begenning to understand what happened to the gate builders. It is sad that Ayiana died but I look at it this way, she was an acient right? so even if she was frozen before they learned to willfully ascend wouldnt the other ascended acients pitch in for her? hell if theyd do it for a tau'ris (a very good one mind you) theyd do it for their own. Plus she did drain what time she had saving everyone who was sick, so that should put her in the good books! I believe she is ascended, and I would love to see her come back in season 10 as an acient representative to help the people of the milky way fight the ori!!!

cafine_us
January 11th, 2006, 03:12 PM
We'd all love to see Ayiana back, but without the brilliant flash of light, I don't think she did ascend.

AKnightWhoSaysNi
January 11th, 2006, 05:01 PM
we diddnt see the light, but it just cut away before it happened! like when replicarter kills daniel, it cuts away with the ship exploding and we dont get to see the flash, but he wasnt dead!!! and she may have just been taken to a "holding area" while the ascended committie explained the rules and got her ready!

cafine_us
January 12th, 2006, 02:27 PM
In Reckoning, no one would have been around to see a brilliant flash of light, but I think Jonas would have mentioned it if he saw it. People don't typically die and then turn into white glowing balls.

Thor of The Asgard
January 17th, 2006, 12:14 AM
its was a nice episode....maybe even more but only because ayiana was there...she was a nice ancient...and seemed smart...how kind of her to heal them in the expance of her own life...

AKnightWhoSaysNi
January 17th, 2006, 02:28 PM
Ayiana was such a good character, one of the best one-time-appearance characters ive ever seen. It seems like such a waste to never see her again (excluding SGA... which doesent really count). Heck she made a better one episode impression on me then Vala did. Bring her to SG1 instead.

Thor of The Asgard
January 19th, 2006, 07:50 AM
too bad she is dead now...she as nice, kind, and good...i thought jonas was falling in love with her...too bad...a sad story of an ancient who survived only to die in modern times...

captain jake
April 18th, 2006, 07:43 AM
There never could have been a relationship between them she was from a total different time. Making there customs totaly different.

Admiral Mappalazarou
August 8th, 2006, 05:39 PM
In the beginning of Atlantis: Rising isn't that her??? Y'know, just before Atlantis takes off 10,000 years before Daniel figures out it's location?

That's Ayiana isnt it!!!!?!!?

the_dark_light
February 2nd, 2007, 02:28 PM
I've just noticed on http://rdanderson.com/stargate/episode/episode6.htm that (in Frozen) there is a character, played by Peter DeLuise called "Lt. Dagwood", a reference to Seaquest maybe? :confused: (since he plays Dagwood in seaquest S2)

nothing croovus
February 26th, 2007, 01:21 PM
Cool, another Kotor fan! Something I don't understand, are super powers the result of being an Ancient or being on the path to ascension? "Epiphany" and "Tao of Rodney" seem to suggest that it comes from being on the path. As in ascending naturally, but if that be so how come Aiyana didn't ascend?

P-90_177
February 26th, 2007, 01:36 PM
possibly because she didn't know she could.

smurf
February 26th, 2007, 03:41 PM
I've just noticed on http://rdanderson.com/stargate/episode/episode6.htm that (in Frozen) there is a character, played by Peter DeLuise called "Lt. Dagwood", a reference to Seaquest maybe? :confused: (since he plays Dagwood in seaquest S2)
Not in Frozen. I think there is a character on the bridge of the Prometheus in Memento with a Dagwood nametag. Or it could be Descent, PDL was in that as a military character but I'm not sure on the name.
And, yes, it is a Seaquest reference. :)

Cool, another Kotor fan! Something I don't understand, are super powers the result of being an Ancient or being on the path to ascension? "Epiphany" and "Tao of Rodney" seem to suggest that it comes from being on the path. As in ascending naturally, but if that be so how come Aiyana didn't ascend?
The suggestion in seasons 6 (Frozen, Metamorphosis, Prophecy), 7 (The Lost City, Homecoming(?)), and whichever episode it was where Cassie gets telekenesis, was that the super powers came through genetic advancement, and/or advancement in the ability of the brain.
I thought ascension was just a matter of learning how, and not bound to genetics or having special powers - see Daniel & Anubis.

Unless they've changed the canon.

Callista
February 26th, 2007, 06:31 PM
The suggestion in seasons 6 (Frozen, Metamorphosis, Prophecy), 7 (The Lost City, Homecoming(?)), and whichever episode it was where Cassie gets telekenesis, was that the super powers came through genetic advancement, and/or advancement in the ability of the brain.
I thought ascension was just a matter of learning how, and not bound to genetics or having special powers - see Daniel & Anubis.

Unless they've changed the canon.

I think ascension can be achieved through genetic advancement (Kalek, most of the ancients) or being helped on the way by someone who is already ascended (Daniel, Anubis, every schmo on Abydos). It may also be possible to ascend just out of one's own "goodness" or "enlightenment", but I don't think that's how the majority of the ancients did it.

nothing croovus
February 27th, 2007, 10:43 AM
If I'm correct didn't the Ancients discover acsnsion in order to save themselves from the plague? And if their dissagreement with the Ori happened before they came to earth, then they already knew about ascension prior to (no pun intended) leaving for Pegasus. Which makes it hard to believe that Aiyana didn't know about ascension, unless they kept the secrets from her, but why would they do that?:confused:

JoNzA
June 30th, 2007, 03:21 PM
I think that Ayiana reminds me of the woman you see in rising (SGA) in the beggening of the show when Atlantis leave earth and go to Peagsus :P

garhkal
July 1st, 2007, 02:09 PM
She should remind you.. she is the same person.

JoNzA
July 3rd, 2007, 04:02 AM
LOL that explains it :P

Gabriel_Lecter
November 20th, 2007, 09:16 PM
I dont know if this has been asked before, but why didnt Ayiana Ascend?
From what we know, before the Ancients left for the Pegasus Galaxy, they were attacked by a plague and either died, ascended or left on Atlantis...

We know that she was very genetically advanced as she was able to heal people amongst other things, and in Atlantis we know when Mckay was genetically advanced and possessed those abilities, he had the ability and knowledge of Ascending.

So why didnt she?

garhkal
November 21st, 2007, 01:35 PM
Probabily cause she got frozen when atlantis left and that massive snow storm flew out from the pedistal area.

Integrabyte
December 30th, 2007, 04:34 AM
Probabily cause she got frozen when atlantis left and that massive snow storm flew out from the pedistal area.


Never understood why she was left behind. You see her in The Rising in SGA S1 when Atlantis leaves Earth :P. She did seem upset but I don't think her soul mate left her to freeze :P.

garhkal
December 30th, 2007, 08:31 PM
Maybe she was left behind to run the outpost, but they did not realise the 'snow wave' would bury her.

Chezlee
January 20th, 2008, 12:37 PM
Maybe she was left behind to run the outpost, but they did not realise the 'snow wave' would bury her.

I agree she was probably left behind to be some sort of caretaker and she contracted the plague later on (because we have no idea if she was frozen from the ice wave created by Atlantis departure or if it happened a little later, or even if she purposefully did it herself, afterall they were the ancients and if it happened to her accidentally how was she able to revive after unfreezing unless she enacted some sort of stasis like thing to keep her from dieing completely?

The guy glaring at her, i think because he wanted her to leave and she wouldnt because she wanted to stay to take care of the outpost or she did have the plague. And In the Atlantis s1 official companion it does say that aiyanna is the girl in rising :)

I like Jonas, and though I would prefer Daniel for character purposes, and though they are both eye candy I have a soft spot for cutie Jonas and his rather attractive rear end ;)

Oh yeah, saw the pineapple :) is it like a graphics thing or a real one???

P014K
June 24th, 2008, 10:29 PM
Did anyone notice the pineapple that was sitting on the cargo crate in the first scene? :eek:

I loved that. I was like wtf is a pineapple doing in Antarctica...outside!?

captain jake
July 4th, 2008, 06:41 PM
The first look at the humans who evolved into ascended beings that we call the Ancients. I do have some questions about how she survived the cryogenic freeze for so many years. I know that the ancients especially evolved ones such as Ayianna could probably stay alive longer than a normal human. However, I got the feeling that she was in there from around the time the ancients left for Pegasus. Does anybody have any theories of when she was frozen and how she survived for so long?

TwiceBorn
October 3rd, 2008, 11:26 AM
Did anyone notice the huge product advertisement for NorthFace in this episode? It was like WOW in your face. You couldn't go for a minute without four or five NorthFace logos flashing on the screen. I thought it was kinda cool since i'm a bit of a NorthFace fan and have a few products, but it was also a bit distracting. Do you think they went too far? Was there some sort of deal they signed with NorthFace? I see the crew wearing it all the time behind the sceens. How many fans do you think have been tempted to buy NorthFace after watching this or how many actually have? I dunno, Jonas in a NorthFace jacket looks really tempting. They all looked pretty cool. I wonder if this was Northface's new fall line for 2001 or whenever this ep played. Just wondering, great ep anyway.

Butlersgate
March 14th, 2009, 08:06 AM
Did anyone notice the huge product advertisement for NorthFace in this episode? It was like WOW in your face. You couldn't go for a minute without four or five NorthFace logos flashing on the screen. I thought it was kinda cool since i'm a bit of a NorthFace fan and have a few products, but it was also a bit distracting. Do you think they went too far? Was there some sort of deal they signed with NorthFace? I see the crew wearing it all the time behind the sceens. How many fans do you think have been tempted to buy NorthFace after watching this or how many actually have? I dunno, Jonas in a NorthFace jacket looks really tempting. They all looked pretty cool. I wonder if this was Northface's new fall line for 2001 or whenever this ep played. Just wondering, great ep anyway.

i didn't notice because i generally don't notice brands of things, but it is a great episode regardless :D

Dinoman
March 22nd, 2009, 07:34 AM
Did anyone notice the huge product advertisement for NorthFace in this episode?

I noticed that but I don't think it's too 'hard-sell'. If SG1 are not wearing uniforms it is normal to have logos on their civilian clothes, and this time it happens to be the NF jackets.

And for Jack's choice of blending with a symbiote, I wonder how long did he live as a Tokra before the symbiote leave him and what would his life would be living as a Tokra and with the Tokra.

Anda
March 22nd, 2009, 07:39 AM
The end was a little dramatic,don't you think?

gateship15
March 23rd, 2009, 05:18 AM
this is a fantastic episode and one i have watched a few times i liked sg1 the scientists and the frozen women in this episode (sorry i have forgotten her name)

ZanderJ
March 23rd, 2009, 07:15 AM
I agree. It even had a "Luke is lost with his Tantan" feel to it..

Detritus
April 22nd, 2009, 04:57 PM
And for Jack's choice of blending with a symbiote, I wonder how long did he live as a Tokra before the symbiote leave him and what would his life would be living as a Tokra and with the Tokra.

I noticed that there is never a situation since this story that comes up in which Jack or Sam are in a position to detect the presence of a hidden goa'uld or use goa'uld technology like the healing device. In theory Jack should now be able to do these things just like Sam can since they both have been blended with a sumbiote.

balo
May 8th, 2009, 07:48 AM
I really enjoyed this episode!

We start to learn more about the ancients.
Ayiana I really liked her, I wish we could see more of her later.

And poor Jack, he really hate snakes.....

:jack_new_anime25:

Rating : 7 / 10

gateship15
May 9th, 2009, 02:58 AM
lol fantastic episode it was great that we found out about the ancients

The Stig
May 11th, 2009, 11:02 PM
This episode shows clearly who Jonas is replacing by the fact Jonas has started to go down Daniels path of dating which involves the girl dying. Unlucky.

jelgate
May 12th, 2009, 07:04 AM
This episode shows clearly who Jonas is replacing by the fact Jonas has started to go down Daniels path of dating which involves the girl dying. Unlucky.

How in the world did you come to that conclusion?

rushy
November 25th, 2009, 12:23 PM
This episode was kinda boring.Hope Jack gets okay

mrscopterdoc
March 21st, 2010, 07:10 PM
Not a bad episode. I wonder if we will ever learn more about the ancient girl.

Martina Magnus
July 11th, 2010, 12:58 AM
This ep was kinda strange to me .... :)

maneth
October 6th, 2010, 10:51 AM
A bit of a disappointment to be quite frank. The only interesting thing was O'Neill getting a tok'ra symbiote, but even that was just an excuse to make sure of his absence for the following episode.

escyos
August 13th, 2011, 10:37 PM
Anybody else see that pineapple after the credits?

Seaboe Muffinchucker
December 18th, 2011, 06:25 PM
Another episode I really like, for no well-defined reason. Well, except for the fact that it's a "torture Jack" episode, and I tend to like those.

ETA: They're so proud of their 'quarantine' lab, and then they never actually quarantine the specimen. No wonder they all got sick.

Seaboe

Matt G
January 4th, 2012, 03:00 PM
I was back in my Halls of Res watching this on VHS by this point...

1. Didn't think the show would ever get back to Antarctica.

2. Ancient woman, first time we really saw Jonas in a Daniel-type role.

3. Ayanna worked pretty well as a character.

4. By this point we knew that Jack would be temporarilly written out so...that part was a bit meh.

A step down from Descent though.

NowIWillDestroyAbydos
January 5th, 2012, 06:53 PM
Great Episode. This was an important episode for the Ancient arc of the series (and Franchise).

So Jack is now going to become a Tok'ra. He must love that.

Ayiana will appear during the first scene of the first episode Stargate Atlantis.

Tomorrow, a city full of Goa'uld.

Jae'a
January 6th, 2012, 08:34 AM
Anybody else see that pineapple after the credits?
I thought I was seeing things! (Again) :lol:

My LiveJournal post (http://jo-r-lee.livejournal.com/30724.html)

Krisz
January 7th, 2012, 01:56 PM
This is one episode that I've watched quite a few times. A woman who goes into hibernation when trapped by ice, and recovers without any ill effects, weird idea but it worked, mainly as it's surmised that she's possibly an Ancient. Also gives an idea that present day humans are possibly the second evolution of the Ancients, given that Jack's brain waves were the same when he had the knowledge of the Ancients. It gives more ideas about what the Ancients can do in their human form, hibernate for one, heal and put people to sleep by thought or whatever, and can learn quickly.

It's these types of revelations about the links of Earth to other older alien cultures that I love about Stargate and this episode was a good one for that.

The disease she was carrying was an interesting reference back to the 'plague' mentioned in WoO, which wiped out the Ancient civilisation that built the time machine.

Jack being left as the only one not healed of the fatal disease, then given becoming a host to a Tok'ra as his only hope of surviving, what a choice! :( However, being the selfless character that he is, learning that the knowledge the symbiote had could save lives he agrees.....my hero!!!! :D

jelgate
January 8th, 2012, 02:35 PM
This episode develops so much of the Ancient storyline. I find its an episode that ages well after hindsight of what develops and grows as we learn about the Ancients like how we evolved from the Ancients not to mention the origin of the plague that struck the Ancients. Thier are so many new information learned from Ayiania how the Ancients went through their life cycle. Although I kind of felt they dropped the healing ability of Ancients in later episodes. Makes me wonder how close Ayiania was to ascension. It was a nice episode to explore Jonas linguist abilities versus Daniel. He seemed to be a more close and personal with the natives then Daniel.

Lieutenant Sparrow
February 2nd, 2012, 02:27 AM
Not really an ep that I enjoy.

Starting to really miss Daniel.

tlw
October 22nd, 2012, 06:03 AM
This episode develops so much of the Ancient storyline. I find its an episode that ages well after hindsight of what develops and grows as we learn about the Ancients like how we evolved from the Ancients not to mention the origin of the plague that struck the Ancients. Thier are so many new information learned from Ayiania how the Ancients went through their life cycle. Although I kind of felt they dropped the healing ability of Ancients in later episodes. Makes me wonder how close Ayiania was to ascension. It was a nice episode to explore Jonas linguist abilities versus Daniel. He seemed to be a more close and personal with the natives then Daniel.

I always thought she should have been able to ascend. Or been helped to. I believe if anyone deserved it, she did.

garhkal
October 28th, 2012, 10:59 AM
Perhaps she was one of the few who had not advanced sufficiently for that. Maybe that is why she chose to be left behind.

Cluas
January 28th, 2013, 06:59 AM
This episode must have been sponsored by "North State"

Good to see Frasier again.

Felt sorry for Airana, she was sweet, reminded me of Lulu in "The Fifth Element"

Felt bad they got no answers, only more questions, and this was a strange ending. So now Jack is a Tok'ra ??
Oh I get it. RDA needed some time off the set.

Simply just too many questions in my head right now - Luckily I know there will be answers later.
I'm on to the next one, perhaps it will be even better?

Jolinar_of_Malkshur
February 3rd, 2013, 05:56 AM
Felt sorry for Airana, she was sweet, reminded me of Lulu in "The Fifth Element"

Yes, she reminded me of her as well!

garhkal
February 10th, 2013, 01:44 PM
The only aspect of her that reminded me of "lulu" was her lack of capacity to communicate...

Cluas
February 11th, 2013, 12:45 AM
The only aspect of her that reminded me of "lulu" was her lack of capacity to communicate...

Really?

36962

Brother Freyr
February 13th, 2013, 03:54 PM
I always think of The Fifth Element, too, when watching this episode.

Falcon Horus
June 30th, 2013, 02:46 PM
Another one of those episode I like to watch over and over again, and keep enjoying watching it every single viewing.
We go back to Antarctica and learn more about the gate site, and that it might very well be the oldest one they know off. The discovery of Aiyana in the ice... and we all know this will eventually lead to the Atlantis adventures. But we're not there yet...

Aiyana -- I really enjoy this character, and I'm always sad to see her die. She and Jonas had such great chemistry together.

Jonas the weather nut... :p

So, we are the second evolution... although still far away from becoming an advanced enough version to be close to what Aiyana is.

And of course, at the end we have O'Neill choosing life over death... albeit reluctantly accepting to blend with Kanan which he'll come to regret soon enough.

garhkal
July 3rd, 2013, 01:26 PM
Ba'al certainly does make him regret it.

Falcon Horus
July 3rd, 2013, 01:53 PM
Ba'al certainly does make him regret it.

He'll definitely think twice next time. :p

Baron Of Hell
July 4th, 2013, 11:04 AM
I kind of liked this episode for the lack of answers. Every episode need a nice bow on it at the end.

garhkal
July 4th, 2013, 08:59 PM
He'll definitely think twice next time. :p

Which he more than likely will refuse if it ever happened.

Falcon Horus
July 5th, 2013, 12:45 AM
Which he more than likely will refuse if it ever happened.

Definitely. :p

garhkal
July 5th, 2013, 01:41 PM
Who here thinks daniel would accept that offer if it was him needing the Symbiot? Or carter?

Brother Freyr
July 5th, 2013, 06:03 PM
If the alternative was death? Both of them would do what's necessary to survive.

hedwig
July 5th, 2013, 08:31 PM
Who here thinks daniel would accept that offer if it was him needing the Symbiot? Or carter?


Given what's happened to both of them because of the goa'uld, I don't think either one of them would choose to be a host.

Falcon Horus
July 6th, 2013, 02:27 AM
But why did O'Neill say yes in the first place, because of the information Kanan possessed? Or because he really didn't want to die?

I choose option number 1 - cause of the information. Although, he knows the Tok'ra are reluctant to share, so perhaps he hoped he'd retain the knowledge and share with the rest of the group after Kanan left him.

Brother Freyr
July 8th, 2013, 02:51 AM
Who here thinks daniel would accept that offer if it was him needing the Symbiot? Or carter?

If the alternative was death? Both of them would do what's necessary to survive.

Given what's happened to both of them because of the goa'uld, I don't think either one of them would choose to be a host.

Either of them would agree to a temporary blending with a Tok'ra, if the only alternative was death. If they didn't do it for themselves, they'd do it for the sake of their teammates. No one's saying they'd want to be a host, but they're survivors, and they're committed to each other. I mean, Jeez, O'Neill agreed to it, and I'd rate him as the most opposed among the group. IMO, he did it for them more than for himself. The others aren't any less dedicated to each other than Jack is.

garhkal
July 16th, 2013, 01:45 PM
Not sure on daniel.. especially seeing what happened with Sha'ire.

Janet Fraiser
July 3rd, 2015, 08:27 PM
For some reason, every time I thought of this episode prior to (re)watching it tonight, I kept thinking of a certain X-Files episode whose name escapes me, so I initially expected the revived subject to spontaneously combust. Glad that didn't happen. :P

I couldn't even remember the connection to Rising until reading some of the responses here, but I definitely liked the episode by itself. Antarctica is a fun setting, and, of course, I love seeing my favorite character back in action.

The NorthFace in every scene was a bit much, tho. Made me feel like I was back in school.

Anja
September 25th, 2015, 11:15 AM
No monster but a woman deep-frozen, something bad had to happen.
Partly boring, partly nice and moving, and an ending that gives O'Neill some time off.
Iris response - creepy!!!

jelgate
September 25th, 2015, 04:28 PM
This episode to me is one of those that is better the second time around because of its impact the second time around

Gifford2006
November 5th, 2016, 10:07 PM
Hope I do the spoiler thing right.
Was re-watching this episode after seeing SGA and did anyone else think wraith when she was healing Dr. Woods? I mean she was using her palm to do this and that is how the wraith take/give life

Bhousden
November 6th, 2016, 01:51 AM
Was the disease she had from the Wraith?

Very unlikely considering that Atlantis several million years prior to any encounters with an iratus bug, much less a wraith.


This episode was good. But I was a bit disappointed we didn't find out more about Ayiana , was she really an ancient, why was she buried there, etc.

She was definitely and Ancient bc she had healing powers of an ancient and it only took her a few hours to pick up English. Remember The Nox, they didn't understand SG-1 any better than Ayiana at first, but after a few hours were speaking English. Though no explanation was given as to why Ayiana could understand English, but not speak it might have something to do with the way the plague was affecting her mind, possibly.


i wish she survived if she survived the trip to the sgc why could she survive and SG1 definitely told the Asgard about aiyana so wouldnt they love to see an ancient again and would have but her in stasis and use best tech of the Asgard to heal her?

If she could have survived and the Asgard took her aboard one on their ships, they could communicate with her in her own language. We know that the Asgard had a bit of Ancient knowledge in their possession when Thor said as much when he was using the information in Jack's brain to find a weapon capable of fighting the replicators. Ayiana could've helped them understand it all, and they may have possibly been able to find a solution to their cloning problems and lived.


Hope I do the spoiler thing right.
Was re-watching this episode after seeing SGA and did anyone else think wraith when she was healing Dr. Woods? I mean she was using her palm to do this and that is how the wraith take/give life

Ummmm, impossible, perhaps you could watch The Lost City pt. II. Jack having the ancient repository in his brain allows him to heal Bra'tac's wounds, or have you not seen that episode?

Gifford2006
November 6th, 2016, 06:40 AM
I don't necessarily think m that she got it from the wrath but that possibly they got the knowhow how to heal from the ancients and twisted that knowledge into a way to feed. If just one wraith came from the bug and an ancient then they would have learned how to use the healing pose and they would have modified it to feed. I just thought wrath because they can use their "ability" to take years as well as heal

garhkal
September 25th, 2017, 08:00 PM
Just got done with a re-watch on this ep, and one thing that still puzzles me..
We see Illyana on several occasions mimicing Jonas with Amazing and a few other words.
SO we know she can speak.
THEN later on we see her reacting showing she Understands what Jonas is saying..
SO WHY IS it she couldn't speak to communicate??

Falcon Horus
September 26th, 2017, 12:16 AM
Possibly because speech is much harder to learn than just learning the words by listening.

Also, she'd been in stasis for millions of years -- give her some slack. :p

Seaboe Muffinchucker
September 26th, 2017, 07:22 AM
I'm thinking there may have been some physical difficulties with communications. I mean, think how strange it feels to use your arm, for instance, after having it in a cast for six weeks. Being frozen, her muscles wouldn't atrophy, but that doesn't mean they wouldn't be hard to use (and the tongue is a muscle).

Seaboe

Anja
October 2nd, 2017, 01:43 AM
It made her character more interesting - would have been strange if she had been able to communicate just like that!

garhkal
October 2nd, 2017, 11:43 AM
Or if she could write!

Falcon Horus
October 2nd, 2017, 12:31 PM
Or if she could write!

Actually, it's much easier to understand a new language by listening to it, than to learn how to write or speak it.

BethHG
July 9th, 2018, 03:13 PM
I really liked this episode! I liked that it was based in Antarctica, and that we got to meet Ayaina. Jonas was fabulous with her.

Too bad that Jack had to depend on the Tok'ra for help, since Ayaina didn't have it within her to heal him as well. :(

Falcon Horus
August 9th, 2018, 02:56 PM
I absolutely LOVE this episode so much.

I love the discovery the trio does in the ice --> Ayiana.
I love that they are still going after 4 years and that it will eventually lead to Atlantis -- just not yet.

I love Jonas and Ayiana together. Their interaction is fabulous. Their chemistry off the charts. (Yes, I ship it.)

I love that Fraiser gets to go on a field trip with them, and how she's super excited discovering all the things that they do about Ayiana and who she might be. I especially love the dialogue with Carter when she's explaining about the Antarctic Cod's ability to not freeze in icy waters, and Carter's very O'Neill-like reply "It's a fish.".

Teal'c's reaction to O'Neill having forgotten to tape The Simpsons is priceless. :lol: It's important. :p

Sad that Ayiana dies in the end, and of course, the all important O'Neill agreeing to blend with the Tok'ra and getting in trouble for it too, but that doesn't happen until Abyss.

How would you rate SG-1's "Frozen?"

Excellent
Good
Fair
Poor
Terrible

altair
August 13th, 2018, 07:42 AM
I never saw Stargate after season five because I didn't have cable, so remember I'm watching a fifteen year old episode, but I enjoyed Frozen, and the interaction mixed with danger. Jonas is especially likable, as in previous episodes. He has a genuine curiosity and can relate to other peoples, and Ayiana was always intriguing.
A friend of mine wrote a screenplay about ghosts in the Antarctic, I had just finished reading it, so this was
fun with all the snow and ice. There was a good balance of all the characters. They all had something to do. Even when O'Neill is in the background, he's always good.

I noticed in season six, the cameras are different, and the series looks more cinematic then the earlier seasons.

Falcon Horus
August 14th, 2018, 02:39 AM
I never saw Stargate after season five because I didn't have cable, so remember I'm watching a fifteen year old episode...

First time you watch it then?
I'm a little jealous cause the first watch is always a little more special than any rewatch after. Although, when I make it to season 8, 9 and 10, I'll be seeing those only for the second time ever so that's going to be interesting.


I noticed in season six, the cameras are different, and the series looks more cinematic then the earlier seasons.

I think perhaps they got bigger budgets to play with.

Platschu
August 14th, 2018, 05:39 AM
I believe they have got new equipment as they moved the show with season 6 from Showtime to the SyFy. Or maybe they have hired a different photographer etc. As far as I know the digital recording started with season 8 / Atlantis season 1, so that is the reason why the picture quality has really improved there.

Off. Since they were capable of improving the picture quality of COTG, then it wouldn't be impossible to do with earlier SG-1 seasons. But it is not going to happen.

Aiyana was nice in the Stargate : Universe too. Ona Grauer looks hot. I wish they could make a Stargate Origins: Aiyana story with her... By the way our heroes all have got complicated relationships: Daniel's dad is Seth. Weir had a relationship with a Tollan (Narim). It looks like Young dated an Ancient lady. Why are we surprised that they were in trouble all the time? :)

Falcon Horus
August 14th, 2018, 06:18 AM
I believe they have got new equipment as they moved the show with season 6 from Showtime to the SyFy.

That already happened after season 1. ;)

jelgate
August 14th, 2018, 11:43 AM
Most likely happened again.

What happened to you FH? We used to fight constantly. Now I agree with you. This episode is one that gets better with age. You miss the subtle references of Ona as an Ancient and the history of the Ancients. At least the part they tell us. The thing is relating On to the Ancients and contesting her with the plague are passing references that you can miss them. To me I have enjoyed this more as ive seen the episode more. What used to be a fair is now a good

Falcon Horus
August 14th, 2018, 03:17 PM
What happened to you FH? We used to fight constantly.

This too shall pass. :p

Falcon Horus
August 15th, 2018, 01:35 PM
3-episode quiz: Frozen, Nightwalkers & Abyss (https://goo.gl/forms/oGwquBPkTnwRuWSF3)

Jigsaw puzzle: Frozen (https://www.jigidi.com/solve.php?id=8Z320I31)

BethHG
August 15th, 2018, 03:36 PM
Very slow today, 12:28.

AleksisMi
August 15th, 2018, 10:26 PM
this episode always made me sad, they found and basically caused a angel to die.... well i mean the ancients are comparable to angels due to them being the core founding force to alot of the galaxies life forms as well as the whole ascension gifts powers purposes being etc

Who Knows
August 16th, 2018, 06:52 AM
12.27, I beat BethHG (only just, it was close)

BethHG
August 16th, 2018, 07:53 AM
12.27, I beat BethHG (only just, it was close)

:jack_new_anime07:

Falcon Horus
August 17th, 2018, 03:39 AM
A second ... can make a big difference. :p

Congrats on the solving everyone!

I will follow shortly... :)

jelgate
August 17th, 2018, 08:16 AM
And im after FH. I let everyone go first so they have some joy before I win

Falcon Horus
August 17th, 2018, 10:08 AM
And im after FH. I let everyone go first so they have some joy before I win

:lol:

BethHG
August 17th, 2018, 11:19 AM
And im after FH. I let everyone go first so they have some joy before I win
That is very kind of you. :p

Falcon Horus
August 17th, 2018, 02:42 PM
*snort*

BethHG
August 17th, 2018, 02:45 PM
:lol:

jelgate
August 17th, 2018, 02:53 PM
7 minutes 14 seconds. I made a mistake to give FH a chance to win

Falcon Horus
August 19th, 2018, 02:27 PM
I'm sure to frak it up... :p

ReganX
August 23rd, 2018, 10:54 AM
This one was a bit of a change to the usual episodes, mostly set on Earth but outside the SGC. Nice as an occasional thing, and I like that they followed up on the Jaffa found at Antarctica.

The idea of a living Ancient is intriguing, and it was a good episode for Jonas.

At first, the storyline doesn't seem all that important, and definitely more like a stand-alone plot than part of the wider arc, but that's turned on its head at the end of the episode when Jack becomes a temporary host to a Tok'ra symbiote in order to survive the disease.

That's the kind of thing you wouldn't expect; one would anticipate that the Ancient would die healing them all, and that the ending would be that they had lost out on the knowledge that they could have gained from her.

While it had quite a lot to like about it, this episode didn't grab me in quite the same way as the others, so I'm going to rate it as Good.

Falcon Horus
August 25th, 2018, 08:50 AM
At first, the storyline doesn't seem all that important, and definitely more like a stand-alone plot than part of the wider arc, but that's turned on its head at the end of the episode when Jack becomes a temporary host to a Tok'ra symbiote in order to survive the disease.

The problem arises that the audience knows that the heroes never die, so whether Jack would have been healed was a sure thing. How was the question. The answer: a Tok'ra.

Seaboe Muffinchucker
August 27th, 2018, 12:25 PM
According to the various commentaries, they upgraded their equipment more than once.

Seaboe

Falcon Horus
October 28th, 2018, 02:29 PM
7 minutes 14 seconds. I made a mistake to give FH a chance to win


I'm sure to frak it up... :p

Lo and behold...

...no, I'm kidding...

09:03

Nearly a full 2 minutes slower. :p

donald85
April 9th, 2019, 04:57 PM
you don't like the episode? then just
"let it go"

get it? hehe

Falcon Horus
April 10th, 2019, 12:24 AM
you don't like the episode? then just
"let it go"

get it? hehe

:lol:

Ascended Jonas
January 4th, 2020, 09:41 AM
This is one of the episodes that brakes suspension of disbelief for me.
Assuming there is same there is same fossils record of human evolution in the Stargate universe as the real world how can Janet Fraiser say that humans potentially did not evolve on this earth? And Jack saying that Darwin was wrong?
I personally don't like that the Ancients are basically humans.
In fact I have developed a totally non-canon headcanon that the Alterans are descended from time traveling humans from earth back in time some + 50 millions of years ago across the galaxies.

Xaeden
January 4th, 2020, 11:53 AM
This is one of the episodes that brakes suspension of disbelief for me.
Assuming there is same there is same fossils record of human evolution in the Stargate universe as the real world how can Janet Fraiser say that humans potentially did not evolve on this earth?

All she said in the line you're referencing is that it provided evidence that humans "evolved long before we thought they did," not that humans didn't also evolve on earth.

Later in the episode, Carter and Jonas have an exchange where they're speculating about how there could be a human who predated human evolution on earth, and it's treated as a given that humans evolved on earth:

CARTER
As far as we knew up until now, all human life in the galaxy was transplanted to other planets from Earth by the Goa'uld. Now, the odds of a totally alien life form evolving to look exactly like us are…are astronomical.

JONAS
Actually, if she's as old as we think she is, wouldn't it be us evolving to look like her?

CARTER
True.

What they're trying to figure out is how humans could have evolved on earth and also evolved elsewhere. This is clarified by Fraiser herself even later in the episode:

FRAISER
Yes. We think this woman might predate human evolution on Earth by 50 million years.

CARTER
Yeah, but that would put her behind us on the evolutionary timeline, not way ahead.

FRAISER
Unless…

CARTER
Unless…our evolution isn't the first time it's happened. That's not big, Janet, that's huge!

FRAISER
Okay, look, it's just a theory and we certainly don't have any hard evidence, yet.

CARTER
Yeah, yeah, but if you're right! This woman could be part of the race that first invented the Gate.

FRAISER
One stage of their development, anyway.

CARTER
A living Ancient.

FRAISER
And we look just like her.

CARTER
That could mean that…that our evolution wasn't just some biological accident.

Later episodes confirmed her theory that humans were the second evolution of this form and that humans evolved on earth because the Ancients caused it to.


And Jack saying that Darwin was wrong?

Jack said Darwin would be crushed. He was being flip; I wouldn't read too much into it.


I personally don't like that the Ancients are basically humans.

Stargate is usually good about creating believable reasons to use human actors in place of realistic aliens (as required by their budget), but I agree that this was a misstep. Somehow, the Ancients caused humans to evolve within an animal population that was alien to them and although humans are genetically similar to all other animal life on earth, they are also genetically identical to Ancients, minus a single gene. Also, to establish that the Ancient technology caused humans to evolve a second time on earth, this forced them to make the Ancients impossibly old. There's no way humans would look physically the same (while only evolving mentally) for 5-10 million years, let alone 50 million years.

The writers seemed to later regret this, so in Stargate Universe, they referred to the Destiny in terms of "hundreds of thousands of years old" and, at one point, "a" million, but in doing so they forgot the reason why they made them so ancient (as it were), which enabled the Ancients to cause human evolution on earth. And even then, apes and monkeys diverged from a common ancestor 25-30 million years ago, so there's a long fossil record showing the progression to human that predates the activation of the Dakara device 5-10 million years ago.


In fact I have developed a totally non-canon headcanon that the Alterans are descended from time traveling humans from earth back in time some + 50 millions of years ago across the galaxies.

The Ancients still intervened to cause humans to evolve on earth. This has been confirmed by actual Ancients, so if the Ancients were future humans who traveled back in time, human evolution on earth still did not happen naturally.

Ascended Jonas
January 4th, 2020, 02:24 PM
All she said in the line you're referencing is that it provided evidence that humans "evolved long before we thought they did," not that humans didn't also evolve on earth.


Later in the episode, Carter and Jonas have an exchange where they're speculating about how there could be a human who predated human evolution on earth, and it's treated as a given that humans evolved on earth:

CARTER
As far as we knew up until now, all human life in the galaxy was transplanted to other planets from Earth by the Goa'uld. Now, the odds of a totally alien life form evolving to look exactly like us are…are astronomical.

JONAS
Actually, if she's as old as we think she is, wouldn't it be us evolving to look like her?

CARTER
True.

What they're trying to figure out is how humans could have evolved on earth and also evolved elsewhere. This is clarified by Fraiser herself even later in the episode:

FRAISER
Yes. We think this woman might predate human evolution on Earth by 50 million years.

CARTER
Yeah, but that would put her behind us on the evolutionary timeline, not way ahead.

FRAISER
Unless…

CARTER
Unless…our evolution isn't the first time it's happened. That's not big, Janet, that's huge!

FRAISER
Okay, look, it's just a theory and we certainly don't have any hard evidence, yet.

CARTER
Yeah, yeah, but if you're right! This woman could be part of the race that first invented the Gate.

FRAISER
One stage of their development, anyway.

CARTER
A living Ancient.

FRAISER
And we look just like her.

CARTER
That could mean that…that our evolution wasn't just some biological accident.

Later episodes confirmed her theory that humans were the second evolution of this form and that humans evolved on earth because the Ancients caused it to.

Ah! I did not remember that part!


Jack said Darwin would be crushed. He was being flip; I wouldn't read too much into it.

True.


Stargate is usually good about creating believable reasons to use human actors in place of realistic aliens (as required by their budget), but I agree that this was a misstep. Somehow, the Ancients caused humans to evolve within an animal population that was alien to them and although humans are genetically similar to all other animal life on earth, they are also genetically identical to Ancients, minus a single gene. Also, to establish that the Ancient technology caused humans to evolve a second time on earth, this forced them to make the Ancients impossibly old. There's no way humans would look physically the same (while only evolving mentally) for 5-10 million years, let alone 50 million years.

The writers seemed to later regret this, so in Stargate Universe, they referred to the Destiny in terms of "hundreds of thousands of years old" and, at one point, "a" million, but in doing so they forgot the reason why they made them so ancient (as it were), which was enable the Ancients to cause human evolution on earth. And even then, apes and monkeys diverged from a common ancestor 25-30 million years ago, so there's a long fossil record showing the progression to human that predates the activation of the Dakara device 5-10 million years ago.

Are you an evolved Ancient ? because you just did read my mind ;)



The Ancients still intervened to cause humans to evolve on earth. This has been confirmed by actual Ancients, so if the Ancients were future humans who traveled back in time, human evolution on earth still did not happen naturally.

Or you could headcanon that the Dakara device did not reach Earth because of some weird Stargate bug or something.
And the Ancients are mistaken about causing human evolution on Earth not the first time that they made a mistake.

I'm starting to ponder if I should write a totally non-canon fanfiction about a deascended Ancient in modern times. Discovering evidence that the Ancients are somehow descended from modern humans an example is that he discovers same Neanderthals genes in modern human and the Ancients population.

Xaeden
January 5th, 2020, 06:29 PM
Or you could headcanon that the Dakara device did not reach Earth because of some weird Stargate bug or something.
And the Ancients are mistaken about causing human evolution on Earth not the first time that they made a mistake.

Well, this comes from ascended Ancients who, while not all knowing, would, I assume, have the ability to determine the source of human evolution on earth. It's also quite possible that already ascended Ancients were observing those events.

Falcon Horus
January 6th, 2020, 04:10 AM
I'm starting to ponder if I should write a totally non-canon fanfiction about a deascended Ancient in modern times. Discovering evidence that the Ancients are somehow descended from modern humans an example is that he discovers same Neanderthals genes in modern human and the Ancients population.

Should have started already... :p

Ascended Jonas
January 6th, 2020, 06:12 AM
Should have started already... :p

Thank you for the encouragement! If I write this fanfiction my non-canon headcanon is that the Alterans are descended from time traveling humans from earth back in time some + 50 millions of years ago across the galaxies.
What do you think about that premise? that the de-ascended Ancient discovers some intriguing clues that the Ancients/Alterans are somehow descended from modern humans.

Falcon Horus
January 7th, 2020, 01:42 AM
It would be full circle... and also, better have an excellent timeline of that head-canon cause time is wibbly-wobbly. ;)

Ascended Jonas
January 8th, 2020, 06:17 AM
It would be full circle... and also, better have an excellent timeline of that head-canon cause time is wibbly-wobbly. ;)

Currently I'm brainstorming that timeline and trying to answer some questions that rises from that timeline like how to get the original humans communicating in Latin it would be a nice twist of the Ancient language was Latin and later inspired Latin on earth.

And how the Alterans manged to not know that they are descendent from humans from Earth considering they's extensive database and how they got to believe that they evolved on Celestis.