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Thoth
July 22nd, 2004, 03:00 PM
In my time Ive seen a lot of science fiction shows. Thousands of ideas pop up in people's brains every year. Most of them never make it past that person's mind, but some do manage to make it to production and past the scrutinised pilot.
Only some become huge shows, with forums, followers, even sister-shows. This is because of the ravenous post-production chats.
Many shows are cancelled after the first season, and for good reason. They aren't raking in enough money because of poor ratings. It would be nice if these shows deserved it. Poor acting, plot-lines, characters or, in sci-fi, costumes and special effects would be admirable reasons. But in many cases this, quite frankly, isn't so.
Many of these shows go down the drain because of poor advertising, slots or a variety of other problems. The notorious Friday night slot is a prime example of this. Most shows placed here are abandonned by viewers and so, by networks.
These reasons, to be honest, seem unfair. These shows may have thrived if they had been given the proper chance, but they weren't, so they didn't.
I have made this thread to ask your views on the matter. And to ask you if you know of any examples. Do you know of any shows which you feel were good enough to be successful but were 'victimised'. Some of the more recent ones that spring to my mind are Odyssey (sp?) 5 and Dark Angel, both of which were IMHO excellent shows, but were cancelled prematurely. Also any shows which, at first, were exciting and wonderful but, after a couple of seasons, turned rather bland.

ShadowMaat
July 22nd, 2004, 03:58 PM
Space: Above & Beyond springs immediately to mind. It was a great, gritty war drama set in space and it had good, believable characters and great FX that didn't overshadow the stories. The series finale was one of the most traumatic finales of TV I've ever watched, but it was also amazing. It set the bar for how I measure everything else.

Now & Again. Much lighter in scope, but the characters all had great chemistry and I loved the snappy dialogue and somewhat "out there" stories.

Cupid. It was more light-hearted fantasy than serious sci-fi, but I loved it and still miss it (as I do the other two). Jeremy Piven was most excellent and again, it was a great cast with deliciously snappy dialogue. It's also one of the few shows that has ever actually given me hope...

Ugly Pig
July 22nd, 2004, 04:07 PM
Now & Again. Much lighter in scope, but the characters all had great chemistry and I loved the snappy dialogue and somewhat "out there" stories.
Was that the show with the guy whose wife and daughter believed him to be dead, but he was secretly alive in a new body or something like that (but with more of an actual plot)?

If so, they showed that on TV here in Norway but I only caught one episode or so (which is why my memory of it is somewhat fuzzy). I do remember taking a liking to it. Guess I should have watched it more when I had the chance... :rolleyes:

ShadowMaat
July 22nd, 2004, 04:15 PM
Was that the show with the guy whose wife and daughter believed him to be dead, but he was secretly alive in a new body or something like that (but with more of an actual plot)?
That would be the one. :) A "secret branch of the US government" transplanted his brain into the body of a much younger, much buffer superhuman-type gengineering marvel played by Eric Close. A lot of the show revolved around "Michael" trying to stay in his family's life without telling them exactly who he was... because if he did, he could get them ALL killed.

The doctor in charge of him was played by... er... wossname, who I think plays the president in 24.

Anthro Girl
July 22nd, 2004, 04:24 PM
Except for Stargate, I don't follow commercial television series. I only watch Stargate on SciFi because it was originally on Showtime without commercials. I've missed a lot of TV series(es?)...good or bad. ;)

I really liked Odyssey 5. It had a limited shelf-life anyway (5 years...then what?), but it was canceled after the 1st season. I've never even seen the last episodes, which were filmed but never broadcast. :( It had Peter Weller and Christopher Gorham, even John Neville was in the pilot! It pretty good premise upon which to build, although some of the FX were a little...um...Cronenberg-esque. ;)

It was a shame, but maybe in that case being on Showtime was not the best idea. I wonder if it would have been better off on SciFi. Same could be said of Jeremiah, although that appears to have been more of a production-relations breakdown rather than poor ratings.

Neither O5 or Jeremiah had anywhere near the advertising push as Stargate Atlantis...an advertising blitz that simply could not be ignored. Not even Stargate SG-1 ever got that kind of treatment! I'm sure it is partly - if not mostly - responsible for the high ratings on the premiere.

KorbenDirewolf
July 23rd, 2004, 08:00 AM
Both Odyssey 5 and Jeremiah had a limited audience to begin with, being on a premuim channel. Can't really say anything else about them since I've never had a chance to view either.

Now & Again and Space:AaB were pretty good shows.

A couple more I can think of are
Earth 2 ABC's footballed space colony.
Space Rangers.. Actually, I can't remember much about this one except that at the time it was on I enjoyed watching it.

Teal'c
July 23rd, 2004, 09:17 AM
FIREFLY!!!!

My second favourite Sci-fi series of all time, and Fox canned it after 13 episodes. I can't wait for the movie to come out, and Fox won't get a penny :D

Anthro Girl
July 23rd, 2004, 09:25 AM
Both Odyssey 5 and Jeremiah had a limited audience to begin with, being on a premium channel. Can't really say anything else about them since I've never had a chance to view either.
That's what I was trying to say. They were both well produced stories that had a lot of potential. I think Showtime was looking for its next "Stargate", but premium cable is risky. Even with Stargate, it is more popular outside the US than within and was the same when it was broadcasting on Showtime.

aschen
July 23rd, 2004, 09:36 AM
I agree with what most of what you said...besides the stuff about Dark Angel and stuff. I wasn't too fond of them. It's really sad that The Simple Life 2 gets more advertising than quality SCIFI shows. Who the hell wants to see a brainless mulatto and a ho bag rich bish pretend to act humble?

Crazedwraith
July 23rd, 2004, 10:47 AM
Jake 2.0

VirtualCLD
July 23rd, 2004, 11:10 AM
I miss Noaw and Again, SeaQuest: DSV, Space AaB looked really good, but I never got to see too many episodes. Quantum Leap had a good run, so I can't complain about that too much.

Matt G
July 23rd, 2004, 11:37 AM
DA got booted too early. S:AAB got booted WAY too early, Odyessy 5 got booted WAY WAY to early.

DownFallAngel
July 23rd, 2004, 01:13 PM
Anyone remeber "strange Luck"? That was a good show. And "The Visitor".

ShadowMaat
July 23rd, 2004, 01:17 PM
Strange Luck was lots of fun. I liked the lead character (and actor) a lot. It was a really weird premise and I remember being upset that we never got to find out just what was up with Chance...

The Visitor I never got into when it originally aired, but I caught the reruns on SCIFI and liked it.

Brimstone, anyone? It sounds like it may have been the precursor to The Collector. I really liked it and to this day I still think of Glover as the Devil. ;) Wossname was pretty hot, too, and not just because of the trenchcoat.

Shipperahoy
July 23rd, 2004, 01:21 PM
i really liked Earth 2. I couldn't believe that it got canned so quickly. I never saw Space Above and Beyond but I'm starting to wish that I had. They had Kindred: The Embraced or something like that on on as a summer series that I wish they had kept going with. I like the vampire shows.

Anthro Girl
July 23rd, 2004, 04:16 PM
I have no idea about most of the shows y'all are mentioning. I don't watch enough TV. I should consider this a good thing, no? :D

I think I agree with the original poster that the problem with these shows may actually be the advertising budget. I often wonder if part of the reason behind the massive Atlantis blitz had to do with the fact that SciFi is now owned by NBC & Co.

DownFallAngel
July 23rd, 2004, 06:52 PM
When did SciFi get bought out?

Anthro Girl
July 23rd, 2004, 07:20 PM
SciFi was/is part of Vivendi, which was purchased by NBC last year and then merged with Universal this year. Hence, SciFi is now owned by NBC Universal...all of which is owned by General Electric. Now I have a headache...

http://www.nbc-universal.com/About_NBC_Universal/In_the_News/

Thoth
July 25th, 2004, 06:39 AM
Jake 2.0

Has Jake 2.0 been cancelled. I thought it was pretty good, although the pilot ep was a bit shoddy and it was a bit corny from time to time. But overall, Id like to see it again. Are you sure it's been cancelled. God that guy that played Jake just cant hold down a job, can he? First O5, now J 2.0. Pity. :p

Pheeww! I thought that this thread wasnt gonna have any responses (sp?) cos it isnt exactly the normal kind of thread we get here, is it?

I was thinking of doing this one but I wasnt sure what the response was gonna be if I did. I'll give it a go now anyway. Ill understand if you dont want to answer this one, cos it may just cause some fights...
Shows which continued on, after their 1st season, but really shouldn' have, in your opinion.
And again, Ill stress that Ill understand if you dont to answer that one.

My answer to that question would have to be Mutant X. I didnt like that show from day one, it was corny, a blatent copy of good old X-Men and had about a hundred other things wrong with it which I wont go into. Well, actually, I will.
It was far too passionate, whenever a bad guy kissed one of his little sex slaves it was like a revelation in love. They used to almost eat eachother, they were kissing so intensely.
I can remember in one episode, Shalamar (sp?) managed to have sex, with her pants on. A bad guy came bursting in and she stood up, with pants on. The only conclusion I can get is that they werent having sex, but she sure was sweaty and tired, what else could she be doing to make her like that with her pants on? I know the obvious other answer, but, with her pants on?
Anyway, I cant remember the many other things that were terrible with it. But dont you worry theyll come to me.
Now I realise that many people arent gonna like what I just said and I think it may be against the forum rules (is there something in there about show bashing. It might just be actor bashing). But Id prefer not to get into an fight about it and even if you do start attacking me and my ideas, Ill just ignore you so dont bother. But please, state your views on the matter, try to make a case for MX, if you can, which I doubt. :D And of course, critisise other programs, if you want.

ShadowMaat
July 25th, 2004, 06:47 AM
It might be a good idea to start a separate topic for that one so that we don't get confused as to which category is being discussed.

Thoth
July 25th, 2004, 06:53 AM
It might be a good idea to start a separate topic for that one so that we don't get confused as to which category is being discussed.
is it worth it tho, no one might respond.

Im scared Im walking on some very thin ice here.

Thoth
July 25th, 2004, 06:56 AM
sure I may as well do it. look out for 'The Little Engine That Shouln't Have, But Managed...From the makers of The Little Engine That Could, But Didn't'

Thoth
July 25th, 2004, 09:26 AM
BTW, Im sure that you'll be able to find the thread anyway, but I just thought Id say that 'The Little Engine That Shouldn't Have, But Managed...From the makers of 'The Little Engine That Could, But Didn't'' didnt fit as the thread title, so its now just 'The Little Engine That Shouldn't Have, But Managed'. :( :p

KorbenDirewolf
July 25th, 2004, 01:35 PM
The Visitor was okay. Haven't seen much of the others that were mentioned.

American Gothic was a weird one.

Torley
July 25th, 2004, 04:00 PM
I'll have to give a nod for Sliders: started out with an excellent premise and similarly excellent execution. The united cast was strong, but as the years went on, the show sank. I still watched it because I was such a completist but feel I wasted my time. I knew it had REALLY stunk when John Rhys-Davies left -- the chemistry between him as Professor Arturo and Quinn TOTALLY made the show, and how they'd argue about scientific stuff and come up with various wisecracks and oneliners. I liked Cryin' Man Rembrandt (he stayed until the end) and Wade, but after that . . . ugh. I guess Quinn's bro was okay, but that whole messed-up development with Diana (yuck) and Mallory (yuckier yuck) and how they turned it more into a parody-of-the-week really downed it for me.

*sighs*

KorbenDirewolf
July 27th, 2004, 06:58 PM
Not sure if Sliders really fits in this thread.. It did manage to run for 3 seasons on FOX and then 2 more on SciFi. But otherwise I agree with most of what you say about it. Never really watched it much after it became The Kromag War.

Thoth
August 1st, 2004, 06:59 AM
Not sure if Sliders really fits in this thread.. It did manage to run for 3 seasons on FOX and then 2 more on SciFi. But otherwise I agree with most of what you say about it. Never really watched it much after it became The Kromag War.

Don't worry about it, everything fits this thread! :D