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veneticuss
July 18th, 2004, 02:46 AM
Well i wonder if in SGA they gonna find some Ascended Ancient, who would be able to provide them more infos

What you think?

Hellcat
July 18th, 2004, 04:16 AM
Hmm.... if, then only by accident.

The (now ascended) ancients like to stay out of everything as we know.
Yeah, there are exceptions, like Oma(r?), but we already meat that one.

I'd like to meet an ascended Daniell :D

veneticuss
July 18th, 2004, 05:06 AM
Well i'm pretty sure there must be some ascended around there in Pegasus Galaxy

SaberBlade
July 18th, 2004, 05:18 AM
i was kind off surprised we didn't meet any in Rising. if you take SG1's episode Ascension (S5) i expected them to show up but i think we will meet more ascended ancients or even normal ancients (probably those who didn't ascended or descended). i wouldn't be surprised if they played a big part at the end of Atlantis' first season

veneticuss
July 18th, 2004, 05:54 AM
i was kind off surprised we didn't meet any in Rising. if you take SG1's episode Ascension (S5) i expected them to show up but i think we will meet more ascended ancients or even normal ancients (probably those who didn't ascended or descended). i wouldn't be surprised if they played a big part at the end of Atlantis' first season

I agree, i was also surprised. When first i saw the picture of the hologram in spoilers, i thought it was an ascended, but obviously i was worng.

If you want to know more about this Topic here's the link:

http://forum.gateworld.net/showthread.php?t=760

You can discuss it here and also find a couple of really good explanations
so go ahead!!! :)

Andy867
July 18th, 2004, 07:55 AM
One thing I have always wondered about is if the ascended are as powerful as they are, why not wipe out the Wraith, unless the Ancients have a good reason for keeping them around, like say preventing an even MORE threatening species from becoming SG-A's new nemesis.

And is there any particular "place" that The Others hang out at, like maybe hang out in Atlantis perhaps.?:)

SBacklin
July 18th, 2004, 07:58 AM
One thing I have always wondered about is if the ascended are as powerful as they are, why not wipe out the Wraith, unless the Ancients have a good reason for keeping them around, like say preventing an even MORE threatening species from becoming SG-A's new nemesis.

And is there any particular "place" that The Others hang out at, like maybe hang out in Atlantis perhaps.?:)


Because the Wraith's power matched the power of the Ancients. The Ancients did not expect that and were not prepared for it. It is mentioned in the S8 opener.

veneticuss
July 18th, 2004, 08:06 AM
One thing I have always wondered about is if the ascended are as powerful as they are, why not wipe out the Wraith, unless the Ancients have a good reason for keeping them around, like say preventing an even MORE threatening species from becoming SG-A's new nemesis.

And is there any particular "place" that The Others hang out at, like maybe hang out in Atlantis perhaps.?:)

If you want to know more about that topic here's the link:

http://forum.gateworld.net/showthread.php?t=760

You can discuss it there and you will also find some really good explanations there
So go ahead!!!

veneticuss
July 18th, 2004, 08:08 AM
Because the Wraith's power matched the power of the Ancients. The Ancients did not expect that and were not prepared for it. It is mentioned in the S8 opener.

The ancients are and were far more better with the Techonlogie and stuff comparing the Wraith. It is al mentioned in the Pilot

Mio
July 18th, 2004, 08:53 AM
Because the Wraith's power matched the power of the Ancients. The Ancients did not expect that and were not prepared for it. It is mentioned in the S8 opener.
Atlantis Openner, not S8.

Lugal
July 18th, 2004, 08:55 AM
I think there's probably a few lurking around somewhere, and it's not like they need to travel by gate or ship, (since Daniel just appeared in Abyss and Changeling). I doubt the Ascended would help them, though.

Maybe they could meet a Descended Ancient who could help them figure out the technology.

aeroe
July 18th, 2004, 09:13 AM
Because the Wraith's power matched the power of the Ancients. The Ancients did not expect that and were not prepared for it. It is mentioned in the S8 opener.

The Ascended Ancients have god-like powers on top of their technology, and didn't use it to enact revenge upon the Wraith.

To answer the original question...
I assume the Ascended just left the Wraith alone. It doesn't seem like it was in their nature to wipe out another (evil) race in either their human or ascended form.
Besides it doesn't appear as the Wraith would or could follow the Ancients when they left our plane of existance. There was nothing for the Wraith to feed on.

Andy867
July 18th, 2004, 09:14 AM
Actually, the rule is that they are not allowed to interfere in the natural evolution of human development. However, as a collective, they should be able to come to the conclusion that the Wraith, having wiped them out, do not deserve to co-exist in any part of the universe, and like Ben Parker said in Spider-Man," With great power comes great responsibility." Of course some would argue that he also says just because you can beat someone up, doesnt give you the right to. but my arguement is that the Wraith have been more of a plague than the Goa'uld ever have or will be. The Wraith kill for their own survival, and do so without remorse. The Goa'uld enslave people. The Wraith killed off the Ancients using bio warfare. In retaliation, I believe the Ancients should respond with their full power in either wiping out the Wraith, or diminish their numbers, or hurt them in some way in that they cannot do to others to what they did to the Ancients.

I wonder though if it would be possible if Atlantis Stargate could have some kind of "bio-filter" installed into the even horizon/DHD that would prevent the Wraith from stepping through the Atlantis gate.

EYU86
July 18th, 2004, 09:22 AM
but my arguement is that the Wraith have been more of a plague than the Goa'uld ever have or will be. The Wraith kill for their own survival, and do so without remorse.
Umm... we kill for our own survival, and do so without remorse. Shoot, we wiped some species off the face of the Earth.

Andy867
July 18th, 2004, 10:06 AM
Our survival is only meant for a limited time and then we let ourselves die, the wraith do it so that they can live for all time. Remember, the Caretaker said that they had not had such rich feeding grounds in over 10,000 years, but they have been around for millions, just like the Ancients.

aAnubiSs
July 18th, 2004, 10:09 AM
Guess they're like humans. We can survive without food for ~3 weeks, but we usually eat 2-3 times / day.

EYU86
July 18th, 2004, 11:06 AM
Our survival is only meant for a limited time and then we let ourselves die, the wraith do it so that they can live for all time. Remember, the Caretaker said that they had not had such rich feeding grounds in over 10,000 years, but they have been around for millions, just like the Ancients.
We don't "let ourselves die", we naturally die. And technically we are living for all time through our offspring and through our offsprings offspring. So the killing for our survival is not gonna stop after we the individual die. It'll go on til we find another method to nourish ourselves or til our species is extinct.

veneticuss
July 18th, 2004, 11:59 AM
Are the Ancients actually immortal?

EYU86
July 18th, 2004, 12:02 PM
Dunno, details bout that are fuzzy.
When they Ascend, they are though.

veneticuss
July 19th, 2004, 12:32 AM
And how long is there lifetime?

Andy867
July 19th, 2004, 06:43 AM
Well, if the Wraith hadnt wiped them out or forced them to Ascend, they probably would have never died since they had regenerative capabilities.

hail_jack
July 19th, 2004, 06:51 AM
I'd doubt it...those crackers normally keep to themselves

Andy867
July 19th, 2004, 08:10 AM
Well, the writers already DID expose us to an Ancient.. A few actually... Ayyiana(or however you spell her character name), Oma Desala.

aAnubiSs
July 19th, 2004, 08:12 AM
Orlin.

Andy867
July 19th, 2004, 08:40 AM
Well, there is no for sure saying that Orlin is an actual Ancient. Yes he was ascended, but we do not know for sure that he was an Ancient.

aAnubiSs
July 19th, 2004, 08:44 AM
No, but we know his race used to look like humans. And I don't think anyone could advance so quickly in 10,000 years.

Andy867
July 19th, 2004, 08:47 AM
Well, look at the Tollan and how they were advanced beyond Earth. and Daniel Jackson explained that if we hadn't suffered the Dark Ages where science was regarded as herecy, we might have been just as advanced if not even more so. And the Dark Ages lasted about 800 years according to Jackson, so, give or take 200 years, and throw in that 800 and see where we would be.

100 years ago, we were just learning how to fly, now we have stealth fighter crafts, space shuttles, a space station, etc. Look how quickly our understanding of electronics has advanced. We are a very curious race (as O'neill pointed out) so it is possible for humans on other planet to advance to where they could defeat the Goa'uld. Especially before Aphophis' and Anubis' reign.

aAnubiSs
July 19th, 2004, 08:48 AM
Well I believe more in B5's version(1,000,000 years) then a 1,000 years like you suggested. Although I think it requires much more then 1,000,000.

The Asgard are more advanced then the Tollan, yet they haven't Ascended.

Andy867
July 19th, 2004, 08:50 AM
They havent had the need to with their cloning technology.

aAnubiSs
July 19th, 2004, 08:52 AM
Well before we can start talking about how long it takes we'd have to know how it's done. If it's natural evolution (then why didn't all ascend) or technology. But the Ancients are 50M years old or something like that. So the tollans would have to wait a while :D

EYU86
July 19th, 2004, 08:52 AM
Well I believe more in B5's version(1,000,000 years) then a 1,000 years like you suggested. Although I think it requires much more then 1,000,000.

The Asgard are more advanced then the Tollan, yet they haven't Ascended.
I don't think the Asgard can ascend because they have a problem with thinking outside the box. They seem to be very straight-forward.

aAnubiSs
July 19th, 2004, 08:54 AM
Well the Ancients are many million years old, and both their body and technology are much more advanced then the tollans, and they only learned how to ascend when they were dying.

Andy867
July 19th, 2004, 08:58 AM
[Edit: What really makes me wonder is if the Ancients have known how to Ascend through research and experimentation, and enlightenment, and they only then ascended to prevent their demise. But like humans, not every one of them could ascend.


Yea, its kind of scary on HOW advanced they become seeing as how the Asgard said in Season 8 Premiere
SPOILER...
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Thor said that they found an Ancient Repository thousands of years ago, and they have since learned a lot, but they were so advanced that even finding one bit of information would be like looking for a needle in a haystack thats of infinite size... Which makes ya wonder how the Wraith were just as advanced in technology.

aschen
July 19th, 2004, 09:01 AM
Are the Ancients actually immortal?

If you ascend, you become immortal, yes.

When you go from the 3rd to 4th dimension, time and a lot of other various hinderances here in this dimension are no longer applicable. Especially given the fact that when you're in the 3rd dimension and you die the only thing that dies is your meat puppet. However, your [soul, prana, energy, chi whatever else you wanna call it] can never dissapate.

aAnubiSs
July 19th, 2004, 09:08 AM
Actually we don't know if they are immortal. They might be able to be killed or something. They might not die from old age, that's true. And I don't think they live in space/time(4th dimension):P

Andy867
July 19th, 2004, 09:10 AM
A Big question I have is that if the Asgard, Ancients, Nox and Furlings were part of this alliance, why haven't the Asgard had any contact with any ancients, even a rebellious one, such as Orlin or Oma. And what about the Nox and Asgard and their relations?

EYU86
July 19th, 2004, 09:12 AM
The Nox try to keep with themselves. I think they are on the verge of ascension.

aAnubiSs
July 19th, 2004, 09:14 AM
The Nox are the Ancients kid brother, or maybe the very first seed of humans the ancients did. They made the Nox as an experiment, and waited to see how they evolved to make sure they weren't made wrong.

They have limited healing power (don't know if they can do it alone), they are tech. advanced. I think they have a a while left until Ascension(that is if it's natural evolution)

EYU86
July 19th, 2004, 09:20 AM
The Nox are the Ancients kid brother, or maybe the very first seed of humans the ancients did. They made the Nox as an experiment, and waited to see how they evolved to make sure they weren't made wrong.

They have limited healing power (don't know if they can do it alone), they are tech. advanced. I think they have a a while left until Ascension(that is if it's natural evolution)
I'm just saying, with their beliefs and powers, I think they are the closest to becoming the next to ascend.

Funaho
July 19th, 2004, 09:20 AM
SPOILER...
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Thor said that they found an Ancient Repository thousands of years ago, and they have since learned a lot, but they were so advanced that even finding one bit of information would be like looking for a needle in a haystack thats of infinite size... Which makes ya wonder how the Wraith were just as advanced in technology.

I think the hologram actually said only that the Wraith were a civilization that "rivalled their own" and that the Ancients were simply overwhelmed by sheer numbers in the end. A huge advantage in numbers can make up for quite a lot of technological deficiency. This would explain why the Wraith tech we've seen so far seems to be relatively weak (a direct RPG hit totally obliterates a Wraith dart.)

EYU86
July 19th, 2004, 09:28 AM
Well, we haven't seen what the Wraith motherships could do.
Plus, Puddle-Jumpers didn't have shields either.

Andy867
July 19th, 2004, 09:47 AM
SPOILER
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Plus if you remember the drawing depicted, the Wraith bombarded the Ancient world for years, and they do so every hundred of years. and like the guy said, we have yet to say what the rest of the Wraith are capable of, including their ships and true extend of their technology.

veneticuss
July 30th, 2004, 01:37 AM
What guy? Or where do you know it from?

aschen
July 30th, 2004, 04:38 AM
I doubt they'll show themselves. They're creepy like that.

Andy867
July 30th, 2004, 07:16 AM
Makes ya wonder if there is in particular "Ascended" hangout or a place where they meet in the material world.

aschen
July 30th, 2004, 09:05 AM
nah. they can find one another on the 4ht.

VirtualCLD
July 30th, 2004, 09:17 AM
nah. they can find one another on the 4ht.
4ht?

aschen
July 30th, 2004, 09:20 AM
*4th* I was too lazy to change it. We are in the 3rd dimension, if you ascend up a livel, you're in the 4th and so on and so forth.

aAnubiSs
July 30th, 2004, 09:20 AM
I don't think the Ancients are in space/time.

VirtualCLD
July 30th, 2004, 09:25 AM
I'm confused, I thought we do live in 4 dimensions.

veneticuss
July 30th, 2004, 01:11 PM
4 dimensions? i thought just three. :)

Andy867
July 30th, 2004, 05:06 PM
Well, according to Carter in Prodigy, I am sure she said there are 9 or 10 dimensions, which allows for those dimensions unknow to us, as seen in Sight Unseen.

TheChronoTrigger
July 31st, 2004, 12:21 AM
Wraith suck energy right? Ascended are pure energy... maybe the Ascended are still vulnerable to the wraith.

Personally I think the Ascended hang out on Earth, we just don't see them most of the time. I think they've been for the most part letting us fight our own battles but they sometimes tip the scales in our favor when things get really bleak. Maybe nudging an planet killing asteroid off course when we still didn't have space flight and stuff.

They don't interfere much because they don't want us to become weak and dependent on them. They want us to grow up strong. Like a parent.

Jarnin
July 31st, 2004, 03:24 AM
We are in the 3rd dimension, if you ascend up a livel, you're in the 4th and so on and so forth.
What are they teaching you in school these days?

We live in 4 dimensions. Up/Down, Left/Right, Forward/Backwards (X,Y,Z) plus Time. Without time, nothing would ever happen, and our universe wouldn't exist.


Well, according to Carter in Prodigy, I am sure she said there are 9 or 10 dimensions, which allows for those dimensions unknow to us, as seen in Sight Unseen.
String Theory (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/String_theory) is what she was talking about. The problem is that String Theory is untestable at our current level of technology, thus it cannot be proven correct or incorrect. That would put it in the philosophy section, not the science section.


Wraith suck energy right? Ascended are pure energy... maybe the Ascended are still vulnerable to the wraith.
Actually, we really don't have any idea what the Wraith get from the people they "feed" apon. The producers called it "bio-energy" or "lifeforce", which is metaphysical, and doesn't really exist in a physical sense.
I suppose they could be sucking the electricity produced by cells, but that is such a small amount of energy, it wouldn't do them much good. They'd be better off sucking on a 9 volt battery.
I suppose it's better if we just don't worry about it.

Also, you're underestimating how much more advanced an ascended being is compared to a Wraith. An ascended being could easily destroy the entire Pegasus galaxy if they chose to do so. That's why they have rules about non-interference.
They're so far above us, that it'd be like us going out of our way to save a colony of ants in Brazil from a termite invasion.


Personally I think the Ascended hang out on Earth, we just don't see them most of the time. I think they've been for the most part letting us fight our own battles but they sometimes tip the scales in our favor when things get really bleak. Maybe nudging an planet killing asteroid off course when we still didn't have space flight and stuff.
I don't think you understand. The ascended beings would never interfere with us. Not even if it meant we'd be wiped out. Daniel tried to interfere and look what happened to him.
Oma Desala is a rogue ascended being, she bends the rules the others have defined, and thus is banished from the ascended club. But her interference is pretty mundane compared to what Daniel was going to do to Anubis.
Anubis never broke any rules of the ascended beings, that's why he was able to romp around the galaxy blowing up planets and generally being a bad dude. He never used his ascended powers, he simply used the knowledge he gained from being ascended to find a bunch of ancient toys that would allow him to be top dog without breaking the rules.

Personally, I hope they keep the ascended ancients out of Atlantis. They can reveal as much about them as they want, but I'd just rather they didn't put them in simply because the fans want to see the ascended beings kick some butt.

veneticuss
August 6th, 2004, 02:03 AM
HUGE Spoilers!



(Spoiler space especially for member of SFA)






SO guys, just found out that we gonna meet at least one Ascended Ancient.
Isn't that good?

Ugly Pig
August 6th, 2004, 01:16 PM
Isn't that good?
Yes. Yes it is. I, for one, am excited about that episode for that reason. :D

Ancient 1
August 8th, 2004, 12:18 AM
They havent had the need to with their cloning technology.
According to what I've seen the Asgard are dying race. They clone bodies and transfer minds in order to remain a sentient force in the universe, therefore "0 population growth," and many must have perished in war with the replicators. Perhaps they will on day ascend.

veneticuss
August 8th, 2004, 12:36 AM
According to what I've seen the Asgard are dying race. They clone bodies and transfer minds in order to remain a sentient force in the universe, therefore "0 population growth," and many must have perished in war with the replicators. Perhaps they will on day ascend.

Perhaps they are still not that high advanced enough to do so. They are still far behind Ancient.