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mahram
May 25th, 2005, 06:57 PM
So what year do you think it will be if they discover earth. As in the time in the show. Will it be way in the future 2200's something, or will it be way in the past like 1200's, or in the present. It would be cool if they had it like in the 2100's. You have earth ships intercepting the galactica, or the galactica being chase by cylons and entering earth space and they are saved by earth crusiers that would be sweet. :D

Sci-Fi
May 26th, 2005, 12:32 AM
RDM said they would never find Earth. It is a neverending journey, a case study on how humans organize themselves, what they believe in, and exploring their hopes and dreams. It would be like classic programs of the past, Wagon Train, The Fugitive, etc. You make a few stops but somebody, a guest star(s), is introduced and tells their story along with the main cast. Some may decide to settle at one of the stops, a few may die, while the rest continue on to find a promised land, a new beginning, or rediscover hope and/or religion.

RDM could make BSG even more powerful by adding a "message" or "the moral of the story" into most of the episodes. That is what made "The Twilight Zone", "The Outer Limits", and even "Star Trek" so memorable. As long as it isn't seen as preachy or advocating a certain point of view, it should work out nicely. Sci-Fi should make one think and even ask questions about their own lives. Getting people to converse about the show or a controversial subject is usually a Sci-Fi trademark since it is happening somewhere else in another time and place far, far away.

At least half the cast has been focused on and their characters developed in season 1. Expect to see the other half get the same treatment in season 2.

Reaching or finding "Earth" would be the final episodes of the series, unless there is a spinoff series to explore what happens after contact. How would the Colonials know if they found the real Earth? Or is it just a 13th Tribe settlement? If one was to look at out own local star map just 12.5 light years away from Earth:
http://anzwers.org/free/universe/12lys.html

Look how many star systems the Colonials may have to explore before finding Earth. They could be zig-zagging for years and even then may miss Earth. Using the "Arrow of Apollo" to open the "Tomb/Temple of Athena" (they still have to find the Tomb too) may only give a general direction the 13th tribe took, not the actual coordinates. If they know or find the actual coordinates in the tomb, then that would *suggest* that the Colonials may have originally migrated from Earth. Then one could say the Earth the Colonials find *may* be far advanced or at least equals in technology. It would depend on if the 13th tribe kept records and continued to develop technologically or possibly abandoned technology and is in a more primative state of development. Most fans want to see an Earth society that is space faring and deep space explorers, has settled on other planets, and advanced rather than the BSG1980 version or a replay of "The Day the Earth Stood Still", "War of the Worlds", or "Independence Day". Then you could have that one climatic battle to finally end the Cylon threat or start the "Circle of Life" again with just a few survivors left from the carnage. Then again the 13th tribe may have developed their own version of Cylons and Earth or the planet they settled on is just a dead world now with no survivors from either side or the 13th tribe may have packed up and moved on.

Lots of possibilities for story arcs. Plenty of directions or misdirections the writers can explore. Let's wait and see what happens and hopefully BSG is allowed to tell its full story this time around or at least run for 5-7 years or more.

Dahak
May 26th, 2005, 04:32 AM
Everything Sci-Fi said is correct.
However to answer the question if they find Earth at any time other than "now" I would be annoyed.
The future (which would make everything too easy and if anything is true about BSG (either version) making things easier for the Colonials is not going to happen. Also it's a cop out.
The past would serve no purpose. If the show needs to show primitive humans for whatever reason it would be very easy to show some group of humans who left the 13th tribe before they got to Earth. Earth though should never be reached.

mahram
May 26th, 2005, 03:45 PM
thats what people always say, I remember in smallville when they promise clark would never fly in the show, but they broke that promise. I think somewhere in the end of season 3 they will find earth. I hope they dont do a present time earth, remember battlestargalactica 1980,...yuck


RDM said they would never find Earth. It is a neverending journey, a case study on how humans organize themselves, what they believe in, and exploring their hopes and dreams. It would be like classic programs of the past, Wagon Train, The Fugitive, etc. You make a few stops but somebody, a guest star(s), is introduced and tells their story along with the main cast. Some may decide to settle at one of the stops, a few may die, while the rest continue on to find a promised land, a new beginning, or rediscover hope and/or religion.

RDM could make BSG even more powerful by adding a "message" or "the moral of the story" into most of the episodes. That is what made "The Twilight Zone", "The Outer Limits", and even "Star Trek" so memorable. As long as it isn't seen as preachy or advocating a certain point of view, it should work out nicely. Sci-Fi should make one think and even ask questions about their own lives. Getting people to converse about the show or a controversial subject is usually a Sci-Fi trademark since it is happening somewhere else in another time and place far, far away.

At least half the cast has been focused on and their characters developed in season 1. Expect to see the other half get the same treatment in season 2.

Reaching or finding "Earth" would be the final episodes of the series, unless there is a spinoff series to explore what happens after contact. How would the Colonials know if they found the real Earth? Or is it just a 13th Tribe settlement? If one was to look at out own local star map just 12.5 light years away from Earth:
http://anzwers.org/free/universe/12lys.html

Look how many star systems the Colonials may have to explore before finding Earth. They could be zig-zagging for years and even then may miss Earth. Using the "Arrow of Apollo" to open the "Tomb/Temple of Athena" (they still have to find the Tomb too) may only give a general direction the 13th tribe took, not the actual coordinates. If they know or find the actual coordinates in the tomb, then that would *suggest* that the Colonials may have originally migrated from Earth. Then one could say the Earth the Colonials find *may* be far advanced or at least equals in technology. It would depend on if the 13th tribe kept records and continued to develop technologically or possibly abandoned technology and is in a more primative state of development. Most fans want to see an Earth society that is space faring and deep space explorers, has settled on other planets, and advanced rather than the BSG1980 version or a replay of "The Day the Earth Stood Still", "War of the Worlds", or "Independence Day". Then you could have that one climatic battle to finally end the Cylon threat or start the "Circle of Life" again with just a few survivors left from the carnage. Then again the 13th tribe may have developed their own version of Cylons and Earth or the planet they settled on is just a dead world now with no survivors from either side or the 13th tribe may have packed up and moved on.

Lots of possibilities for story arcs. Plenty of directions or misdirections the writers can explore. Let's wait and see what happens and hopefully BSG is allowed to tell its full story this time around or at least run for 5-7 years or more.

Lexx
May 27th, 2005, 07:12 AM
In my mind, the Colonials will never find Earth. They'll find traces of the 13th Tribe but never Earth itself. So eventually, they settle on a planet and name it Earth after the planet they could never find, and it turns out that our Earth is the one the Colonials colonized.

Dahak
May 27th, 2005, 04:20 PM
While that is possible and anyone known as Dahak has no right to say this but here goes.
It's too complicated.

Mr. Seven
May 27th, 2005, 06:21 PM
I think that if they find Earth it will be very futuristic.

The architecture (From what we know) of Kobol resembles Ancient Greek and Roman buildings. At least that one Coliseum/Opera House thing did.

Unas
May 28th, 2005, 03:38 PM
Here's a possibility: They find earth but learn it is not the 13th tribe but their true ancestral home. Humans left earth and settled on Kolbol before moving on. Our heroes find a prerecorded message, a time capsule, and a clock that tells them it is the year 6000 or something.

This will explain the similarities between us and BSG. If the BSG crew arrived on earth in the present, wouldnt it be awkward that everyone spoke english and dressed in suits and ties?

Unas
May 28th, 2005, 03:44 PM
You make a few stops but somebody, a guest star(s), is introduced and tells their story along with the main cast.

That was true for the original series but would be difficult in the new one. In this show, there are no aliens and all humans encountered would be suspected of being Cylons.

mahram
May 28th, 2005, 04:35 PM
that would be great idea. Or how about them finding an advanced ship in space. Its wierd looking, looks really really old. The bsg guys steal some tech and info from it. Then on the closing scene, they find wierd markings. Like USS entrepid. Or Earth Craft voyager, that would be sweet.



Here's a possibility: They find earth but learn it is not the 13th tribe but their true ancestral home. Humans left earth and settled on Kolbol before moving on. Our heroes find a prerecorded message, a time capsule, and a clock that tells them it is the year 6000 or something.

This will explain the similarities between us and BSG. If the BSG crew arrived on earth in the present, wouldnt it be awkward that everyone spoke english and dressed in suits and ties?

Darth Buddha
May 30th, 2005, 11:41 AM
The anticipation and the mystery are better than any "reality" that the writers could bring to screen. Galactica 1980 was a disappointment to most. Having BSG reach an earth that was like the Star Trek's Federation would satisfy some, and annoy others. Having BSG reach a primitive earth and be the progenitors of all advanced civilization on earth would please a few and piss off more. Even reaching a post apocalyptic earth where there ARE no more humans (or perhaps all of what we now know as humanity are really Cylons?) would suck for some.

As such, having BSG EVER EVER EVER reach earth would be bad storytelling. Great fanwank, bad storytelling.

Ses
May 30th, 2005, 12:08 PM
I'd really prefer they didn't find Earth... they did that with the original and it turned out to be rather lame in my opinion.

Besides... its the journey and not the destination that matters :)

Taonas
May 30th, 2005, 06:02 PM
I'd really prefer they didn't find Earth... they did that with the original and it turned out to be rather lame in my opinion.

Besides... its the journey and not the destination that matters :)

I agree fullheartedly with that (however I would like something implied... IMPLIED, not actually ever shown).

mahram
May 30th, 2005, 11:33 PM
no offence to the writers to the writers of bsg 1980 they went nuts and change the whole premise. That was dealing with the cylon threat. They would veer off into storylines that dealt nothing with the cylons. It was basically a bad version dukes of hazzard, if the dukes were aliens. I think the premise of earth 2100's would be fantastic end. An earth where humans finally get there act together. It would be sweet if they did that. IF they do it right. It would really suck if they did a bsg 2005 type thing. But the possibilties of bsg 2100's where you have a massive massive cylon fleet coming to earth. And you have the humans all paronoid of the battlestar people, b/c there aliens. That would nice. I think during the 3rd or 4th season we will see earth or finality to the situation. Remember bsg is a very expensive show, so during the 3rd or 4th we will get an earth answer :D



I'd really prefer they didn't find Earth... they did that with the original and it turned out to be rather lame in my opinion.

Besides... its the journey and not the destination that matters :)

Unas
May 31st, 2005, 05:50 AM
Besides... its the journey and not the destination that matters :)

Tell that to the Quantum Leap fans. ;)

Darth Buddha
May 31st, 2005, 06:58 AM
I agree fullheartedly with that (however I would like something implied... IMPLIED, not actually ever shown).
Now THAT is showrunner thinking!

Lord Jago
June 2nd, 2005, 03:32 AM
It maybe possible to bring BSG into the Buck Rogers universe. So then the spin off could be Buck Rogers. Just a thought, since all the sounds and special effects from good ole Buck Rogers was a mimic from the original Galactica.
So yes, Galactica could find earth in post Apocalyptic era in the forum of a new series based on a Buck Rogers Series. But hey thats just me.

LtColMcQueen
June 14th, 2005, 05:07 AM
Personally, if Galactica were ever to make it to Earth... I'd prefer if we were finally able to pay homage to the show that kept the OG Galactica on the air in the first place: Space Battlecruiser Yamato, or as it was known here in the states: Starblazers.

Would love to see Galactica jump into our Solar System just after the Bolar wars (which was an alien race with a ship that looked surprisingly like Galactica to begin with) and there sitting in front of them is an old seafaring battleship that has been squared off and retrofitted for space travel with a big honkin' gun in the front of it.

fair_nymph
June 14th, 2005, 05:25 AM
I've thought about this myself. I think they will have to be more advanced than our current state, maybe 2100, 2200, probably not that much more...simply because it wouldn't make sense for the 12 tribes to have advanced as much as they have but for the 13th tribe (earth) to be at our current relatively primative level.

Another related issue I struggle with is -- how does evolution (which we know to have occurred on Earth) factor in to everything? It doesn't make sense for Kobal to be the source of humanity -- it must be Earth. Maybe there is a forgotten story about how they came from earth originally and so the 13th tribe was actually RETURNING to Earth.

the Fifth Race
October 6th, 2005, 10:05 PM
If or when they find Earth, what will BSG find?. . . . . .I am kind of fuzzy about the timeline that BSG is in now compared to our actual timeline today.

Will they find modern day Earth as it is today, or maybe some post acopalyptic Earth or will it be a more modern Earth than what exists today.

Any ideas or theories would be appreciated. :)

hyzmarca
October 6th, 2005, 11:02 PM
They'll probably never find Earth. If they find Earth the show will either end or become worthless crap, from experience.

However, there are some great stories to be told if they ever do reach Earth. I am hoping for a modern or near-future Earth just to simultainously disapoint and frighten them. We're too primitive to oppose the Cylons, which would certainly be disapointing. We have enough nuclear weapons do destroy a planet several times over and no delivery vehicle capible of getting them off the Earth, which would certainly be frightening.

walterIsTheMan
October 6th, 2005, 11:02 PM
If or when they find Earth, what will BSG find?. . . . . .I am kind of fuzzy about the timeline that BSG is in now compared to our actual timeline today.

Will they find modern day Earth as it is today, or maybe some post acopalyptic Earth or will it be a more modern Earth than what exists today.

Any ideas or theories would be appreciated. :)
Hmm its hard to say. To be honest I doubt they'll ever get to Earth. The writers would be between a rock and a hard spot. If they made Earth like it is now, then the Cylons would slaughter us like the Colonies, and so BSG would turn into BSG:1980 which bombed. If they make Earth too advanced, then it loses its down-to-earth feel that has made it so popular. So I really don't think they'll ever go to Earth:S

Aaron Doral
October 7th, 2005, 12:18 AM
My theory is that the original colonials left Earth several thousand years prior to the current timeline (they were a counterculture religious-ish movement mixing elements of Judaisism and several pagan religions). Whether they fled in pursuit of religious freedom or for some other reason is irrelevant. Earth's Humans would be largely monotheistic at this point, and might actually have more in common with the cylons than they do with the colonials (the Cylons and Earthlings would both believe in one god). I'd like it if a highly advanced Earth turned out to be an ally of the Cylons, and either turned the colonials away or attacked them if they found it.

Carbito
October 7th, 2005, 03:23 AM
I have long held the belief that Earth is now the Cylon home planet. We know they the Cylons left the twelve colonies and were not seen for 40 years, in that time they could have found Earth and killed/inslaved its inhabitants and set up thier home base there.

the Fifth Race
October 7th, 2005, 06:13 AM
Interesting takes my fellow BSG brethern, thanx for the very cool responses!....

I find the idea of an Earth that is already taken over by the Cylons as an interesting concept.

How about a story arc where we do eventually find Earth and all we end doing is leading the Cylons to Earth....

Or maybe when they do find Earth (if the ever do) that we are technologically advanced enough to help them destroy the Cylons.....

Or the worst case scenario I can think of is where we find Earth and all there is are humanoid Cylons that have replaced everyone :S :eek:

Frakster
October 7th, 2005, 09:55 AM
i just hope that the series doesn't go the way of so many excellent tv dramas and end up degrading in quality to the point where they do a rushed ending cos the network is cancelling its run.

I hasten to add BSG is the best sci-fi tv i have seen in years, and doesn't look like its heading that way, but then i loved the early x-files series and look what happened there.

I hope finding Earth is an epic climax to season 6 or 7 or whenever.
:)

NowIWillDestroyAbydos
October 7th, 2005, 10:04 AM
I hope finding Earth is an epic climax to season 6 or 7 or whenever.:)
My opinion but I honestly think BSG will only last at least run for 5 Seasons maybe 6. And near the end of that run, they'll find Earth, and soon after that happens, Roslin will die from her cancer.

creed462
October 7th, 2005, 10:47 AM
Maybe a future earth from our time line?

awgneo
October 7th, 2005, 06:06 PM
In the original series they found Earth, right? It turns out that it was not even a big deal as us poor Earthlings had no advanced technology to fight the cylons. The BSG ends up actually protecting Earth for a few episodes and then leaves. So the discovery of Earth could be just a few episodes that would not require the ending of the show.

walterIsTheMan
October 7th, 2005, 06:10 PM
In the original series they found Earth, right? It turns out that it was not even a big deal as us poor Earthlings had no advanced technology to fight the cylons. The BSG ends up actually protecting Earth for a few episodes and then leaves. So the discovery of Earth could be just a few episodes that would not require the ending of the show.

lol but it did result in the end of the show, BSG 1980 was canceled:(. maybe the entire show could just be about cylons and the colonies, but then once its over come back to the Earth idea. like after farscape was canceled, they came back a little while later and did a miniseries to wrap things up. maybe thats what they could do with BSG. have the whole show about the cylons and stuff, but then once the show is over, they could come back and do a closing miniseries where they find earth and earth helps them have their final showdown against the cylons

Dylan Deltoran
October 7th, 2005, 07:01 PM
Well, if they find earth around season (6?) maybe, just maybe they'll meet the Stargate universe...ok...that's completely unrealistic, but it would be cool...Daedalus class ships beating up on Cylon Basestars :p

Excali5033
October 7th, 2005, 07:02 PM
Nah, Moore will do something clever. Like have it turn out to be that the Fleet IS the 13th Tribe and THEY settle Earth. That's if, you know, he touches the whole Earth thing with a ten-foot pole.

Deckker
October 7th, 2005, 09:23 PM
Here is an idea.

The 13th landed on earth and discover the existance of the One god. The tribe was broken into 2 camps, those believing in the false gods and those believeing the One God.

This lead to a great war which destroyed much of the 13th tribe located on earth. Those who believe in the False Gods went to find another planet leaving the believers of the One god to die on earth.

Earth is Earth as we know it, but the "Earth" BSG seeks is nearby, with technology advance enough to rival BSG, and has being watching earth, introducing new technogies and starting events trying to prevent our self destruction.

Carbito
October 7th, 2005, 09:47 PM
Nah, Moore will do something clever.

I am confident that will be the case if they ever decide to involve Earth into the plot line. I can't imagine them just including Earth for the sake of it and doing it in a rush. It will only happen if Moore is able to come up with some sort of really creative and clever way to make it happen that will introduce new elements into the plot that no one could have predicted. He has not let us down so far. :)

hyzmarca
October 7th, 2005, 10:28 PM
Certainly, the Galactica 1980 route is foolish. If they find Earth and make themselves known it will open up entirely new story possibilities of great potential depth. However, the current mood of the series is nowhere near those possibilities. The discovery of Earth would change things far too much to consider anytime soon. It is only when they run out of placs to go with the current plots that they should find Earth.

Of course, there is also the possibility that they'll find Earth cirta 1000 BC. The Tribes only left Cobol 2000 years ago, after all.

USMCgrunt
October 8th, 2005, 01:16 AM
I kind of hope they do find earth and they are advanced but not to the point of the BSG tech. I like the idea of the BSG fleet bringing them up to spec on there technology and then waging a war with the cylons in our galaxy. Then eventually building up a new fleet of battlestar's or other type's of ship's and waging a campagin to take back the 12 conlonies! Imagine seeing masive shipyard's with new battlestar's being constructed. I think this should only happen after season 7 or so though. It could bring about a whole new set of story lines and breath new life into the series. To quote SAAB "Thats when we teach them every human being know's...Payback's a *****!" Semper Fi, John

badblu
October 8th, 2005, 01:57 AM
no they cant find earth until the very end of the show, they should find earth in a movie :)

I would like to see them find a planet that is full of primitive humans and (parts of the 13th tribe) and the glattica crew think that that is earth but after an episode or 2 find some ancient scripts saying that that planet was found by criminals from the 13th tribe.

DarkElfa
October 8th, 2005, 07:56 AM
I think that the Lords of Cobalt came from Earth far in our present future after a great war and founded cobalt, then the 13 tribe returned to rebuild.

DarkElfa
October 8th, 2005, 08:06 AM
I've thought about this myself. I think they will have to be more advanced than our current state, maybe 2100, 2200, probably not that much more...simply because it wouldn't make sense for the 12 tribes to have advanced as much as they have but for the 13th tribe (earth) to be at our current relatively primative level.

Another related issue I struggle with is -- how does evolution (which we know to have occurred on Earth) factor in to everything? It doesn't make sense for Kobal to be the source of humanity -- it must be Earth. Maybe there is a forgotten story about how they came from earth originally and so the 13th tribe was actually RETURNING to Earth.

That's exactly what I thought. It would definately be a last season type of thing and I don't at all think it would ruin the show. what would ruin the show is them forever wandering the stars and never finding earth. This isn't BSG 1980, that show wanked out because of bad writing and worse premise. This is a whole different story here and I think the awsome writers we have now will do something great. 2 things are going to have to happen here, they're going to have to find a way to defeat the cylons and they're going to have to go back and rescue the survivors of the 12 colonies still stranded there. Earth would be the only solution to that.

MASON
October 8th, 2005, 10:40 AM
In my mind, the Colonials will never find Earth. They'll find traces of the 13th Tribe but never Earth itself. So eventually, they settle on a planet and name it Earth after the planet they could never find, and it turns out that our Earth is the one the Colonials colonized.
I have a feeling that they'll come closer than that. That they will find earth, but it will be a ghost colony.

I could see there being a climactic battle shortly after Earth's discovery, where the fleet, in its confused horror and shock, begins to split up, and is suddenly ambushed by the Cylons. Amidst the panic and confusion, the Colonials ward off the attack, with many casualties, but their ships are left unservicealbe and adrift.

Eventually they succumb to deteriorating orbits, or make emergency landings, and settle on Earth. Develop aggrarian societies that rely the auspices of the Gods for fertile land and a plentiful harvests. Then, as their societies evolve, trade will develop, technology will advance, and the Gods will be forgotten.

Never turn your back on the Gods...

'All of this has happened before. All of this will happen again.'

David1984
October 8th, 2005, 04:32 PM
Honestly I have to agree that the journey, not the destination, is the important part of the story, but if they never reach Earth or the journey isn't ended in some way, shape, or form, then you get a TV series that goes on forever without a climax or resolution and it will eventually lose the interest of its viewers

skrip00
October 8th, 2005, 05:07 PM
Wouldnt Earth technically be just as advanced as the other 12 colonies? They all left at the same time.

Also, why the name "Earth"? Is "Earth" a mythological name?

But I agree... Earth will never be found. Or if it is, the fleet will be destroyed or something. Ugh, i cant think of it... let RDM do it.

Id prefer this show to have a definite ending though.

Miroslav
October 8th, 2005, 05:32 PM
Another related issue I struggle with is -- how does evolution (which we know to have occurred on Earth) factor in to everything? It doesn't make sense for Kobal to be the source of humanity -- it must be Earth. Maybe there is a forgotten story about how they came from earth originally and so the 13th tribe was actually RETURNING to Earth.

I completley agree. Humans originated form Earth. In fact, I think that Colonils are descendant so Atlantians. If someone read Plato's works about Atlantis - "Timea" and "Critaee" - you know that Atlantian and Greek Gods are the same. I have theory that Atlantians, which have been highly thehnolocigal evolved, fled after disster od Atlantis, aproxx. 10 000 - 12 000 yrs. B.C. They fled into space, running from devastated Earth (devastated by unknown alien race), with help another alien species, their allies, later named Gods of Kobol. Finaly, they get to the Kobol, and after some time, they founded 12 colonies. But, a part of Colonials come back to the Earth, just before rising first civilizations (Mesophotamia, Egypt, Mayan, India etc.). They help native people to rebuild civilisation, teach them to art and writing.

And about bringing Earth an aliens into the show: I think that they definetly do that, especialy when ratings gone down (in next 2-3 seasons).

Sorry on possible mistakes in my english, it's noth my mother tounge. :)

hyzmarca
October 9th, 2005, 01:44 AM
Wouldnt Earth technically be just as advanced as the other 12 colonies? They all left at the same time.

Also, why the name "Earth"? Is "Earth" a mythological name?

But I agree... Earth will never be found. Or if it is, the fleet will be destroyed or something. Ugh, i cant think of it... let RDM do it.

Id prefer this show to have a definite ending though.

Technological advancement isn't a straight path, it is a winding road that often loops back on itself. Knowledge is lost or forgoten bacause there is a lack of need or a lack of desire to use it. The steam engine was invented before the birth of Christ and yet it didn't spawn an industrial revolution untill it was recreated realitivly recently. Cultural and political realities are very important when it comes to the adoption or abandonment of technologies.
Many technologies originally created in China were lost and forgotten untill Europeans brought there own versions of these devices. The clock is a good example. The Chinese invented the clock long before any European did, that technology was lost in china and only rediscovered when Europeans traders brought their own clocks.

Consider that the technology of Kobol may be on Earth today, lost in the sands of time. The premise of the original series was that we are the decendents of the 13th Tribe. Yet, over time that knowledge was lost and the old society fractured resulting in the world of many nations that we have today.

skrip00
October 9th, 2005, 09:26 AM
But they did have to travel through space to get to earth. So they had to be heavily advanced to do so. And say they landed with nothing but the clothes on their backs, they already know enough to begin the long process of rebuilding civilization.

DigiFluid
October 9th, 2005, 04:45 PM
I would prefer not to know anything about Earth as a resolution to the show. Personally, I think it would be best if the final episode or episodes dealt with the situation in one of two ways:

1) The Colonials deal the Cylons a crippling blow and make a harrowing escape (perhaps by jumping blind). They arrive in a solar system previously unknown and hidden in some way, and approach the only planet capable of sustaining life. We see in the final closing shot Galactica and the fleet approaching a blue world--that matches the geography of Earth that we all know.

or;

2) The Colonials and the human Cylons make peace and found a world together in harmony. Again, one that from orbit looks like Earth. Hell, they could even have the centers of their religions located as they developed here IRL; center of the Colonial religion in Greece or on Crete, and the center of the monotheistic Cylon religion in the Middle East.




...option #2 is probably pushing things a bit ;)

Callsign:Spooky
October 9th, 2005, 06:48 PM
I think they will find Earth eventually. But since this is coming from Ron I'm sure there will be a major twist.
Personally what I would like to see is a dead world. A world that has been trashed. The crew initially thinks the Cylons found Earth first but as they explore they find that, as the Cylons love to keep repeating, we are self destructive and here's the proof....
But leave a bit of hope...set this a few hundred years in the future so Earth may have branched out with our own colonies...Where the Galactica finds the scraps of Earth still fighting one another. The Galactica intervenes and a truce is called as the remaining people of Earth realize that there is a bigger threat out there.

Or maybe they could find the planet inhabited by those damn dirty apes with the Statue of Liberty sticking out of the sand? :eek:

Cyberkada
October 9th, 2005, 09:22 PM
2262 would be a good year.

Bl4de
October 9th, 2005, 09:43 PM
If it's 2006 or 2007 just to save production money I'll lose all faith in humanity... well, I'll lose faith in something peaceful at least lol.

I've tossed around the idea of having peace with the cylons.. but it doesn't pan out because the cylons aren't out for revenge. The plot is more "imperfect beings creating perfect beings which turn on them to cleanse the verse" than "a sentient life form wants the right to life and be recognized and is getting revenge". There can't be peace between them. Although half the time the show makes you think that's what the cylons are aiming for with the human/cylon children.

And I think the whole "finding a miraculous way to defeat the enemy into submission" won't work either. Even if somehow the fleet managed to defeat some basestars and "resurrection ship", the homeworld of the cylons (they probably have more...) will never be touched, and can't.

I'm just wondering what's going to happen if they find Earth... if there is a flourishing civilization that had the same technology the Kobolians had when settling the 12 colonies, then that means they probably have the means to fight the cylons back.

But how will Earth feel? What if you were the president of Earth and your remaining sister tribes came to your doorstep asking for their shelter and help fighting an impossible enemy? I'd be upset.. and reluctant. But then again it's the survival of their species. No matter what, the Cylons will find all humans in the verse and do whatever their plan is with them. Even if the fleet finds Earth... the Cylons will know where they are, if not they'll find out eventually. They have to stop the cycle... so it never happens again.

madk99
October 10th, 2005, 12:51 AM
Honestly I have to agree that the journey, not the destination, is the important part of the story, but if they never reach Earth or the journey isn't ended in some way, shape, or form, then you get a TV series that goes on forever without a climax or resolution and it will eventually lose the interest of its viewers
Oh. You mean like "Dr. Who"?

Callsign:Spooky
October 10th, 2005, 09:27 AM
I've tossed around the idea of having peace with the cylons.. but it doesn't pan out because the cylons aren't out for revenge. The plot is more "imperfect beings creating perfect beings which turn on them to cleanse the verse" than "a sentient life form wants the right to life and be recognized and is getting revenge". There can't be peace between them. Although half the time the show makes you think that's what the cylons are aiming for with the human/cylon children.

And I think the whole "finding a miraculous way to defeat the enemy into submission" won't work either. Even if somehow the fleet managed to defeat some basestars and "resurrection ship", the homeworld of the cylons (they probably have more...) will never be touched, and can't.

I'm just wondering what's going to happen if they find Earth... if there is a flourishing civilization that had the same technology the Kobolians had when settling the 12 colonies, then that means they probably have the means to fight the cylons back.


Probably not. As bad as war is it has a tendency to push technological advances. Don't get me wrong. Civilizations not in the heat of war also progress technologically but not nearly as fast as a Civilization in the middle of a world war. Look at the history of WWI and II and the Cold War as good examples. Now lets consider Earth who has lived in a vacuum from the Human \ Cylon war. The idea of the Battlestar would be foreign to anyone who doesn’t have an interstellar foe. Even the idea of the Viper since space combat wouldn’t be necessary. Such endeavors cost $$$$$$$$$$$ and as such if there isn’t a legit reason to build such powerful platforms..... Yes I’ve spent too much time playing Civilization III. So sue me. :p
That being said having the resources of a planet on hand could lead to a crash program to build new battlestars, Vipers, Raptors, etc.

Also hardly an "impossible" enemy. Colonial technology seems to be pretty well balanced against Cylon technology. Its just the Cylons have used their technology in a smart way rather then a pure, bruit force attack. e.g. The original attack used technology crippling software and apparently the Cylons love their logic bombs coupled with swarm attacks. They never seem to hit you head on. Its always from the side in some sneaky *** manner.

AGateFan
October 10th, 2005, 10:05 AM
Honestly I have to agree that the journey, not the destination, is the important part of the story, but if they never reach Earth or the journey isn't ended in some way, shape, or form, then you get a TV series that goes on forever without a climax or resolution and it will eventually lose the interest of its viewers
That is the essential problem with this show. There can be no resolution. If there is a resolution the show is essentially over. This show is in a box from which it would be difficult if not impossible to escape. This is why I dont think this show is sustainable.

AGateFan
October 10th, 2005, 10:30 AM
Oh. You mean like "Dr. Who"?
I don’t know that much about Dr Who but that strikes me more as designed to be an episodic exploration\adventure and is thus made for the never ending storyline. The fans know from the get go (and 26 years of experience) that it is a never ending journey. It would seem that the fans of the show like it just the way it is and don’t require any major resolutions.

BSG, on the other hand, appears to be designed to "seem" like it’s driving to a resolution, but it’s not really and that will ultimately be unsatisfying to some of the fans. IMHO

the Fifth Race
October 10th, 2005, 10:52 AM
no they cant find earth until the very end of the show, they should find earth in a movie :)

I would like to see them find a planet that is full of primitive humans and (parts of the 13th tribe) and the glattica crew think that that is earth but after an episode or 2 find some ancient scripts saying that that planet was found by criminals from the 13th tribe.


I have a feeling that will also be the end of the series. Making it a feature length film would make it a nice touch also.

I still want to see an Earth that is advanced enough to help defeat the cylons?.

Or does anybody think that all Cylons will become humanoids and make peace?.

lord-anubis
October 10th, 2005, 12:40 PM
Well, if they find earth around season (6?) maybe, just maybe they'll meet the Stargate universe...ok...that's completely unrealistic, but it would be cool...Daedalus class ships beating up on Cylon Basestars :p

lol yes it would it be a short battle thou all the daedalus as to do is talport nukes on the ships

rhade
October 10th, 2005, 06:01 PM
When I think of BSG finding Earth I think they find Earth as it is now not 100 years more advanced. I believe that humans were on Earth before the 13th tribe can to it. I think that if they use the modern Earth as the Earth BSG finds then you can already see elements of the 13th tribe in the religious beliefs of the Ancient Greeks and Romans who could of been the ancestors of the 13th tribe who found a primitive human civilizations and used their knowledge to guide them. I think that it would be better if the Galactica thinks they had struck a deadly blow to the Cylons and were finally able to get to Earth but when they get their Earth had been destroyed by the Cylons after they had found it to hand the Colonies defeat from the jaws of victory. Or if the final battle took place in Earth Orbit with BSG, Cylons and US in a all out fire fight where the Cylons are defeated but due to the damage inflicted by the battle we are unable to trust the fleet for leading an enemy to our doorstep and we tell them to leave. Those are just a couple of ideas that I have on how it would go down. I just can't wait to find out what Moore does with it.

Dylan Deltoran
October 10th, 2005, 07:05 PM
Maybe it'd be short...but then again...the wraith (who never encountered the asgard before?) were able to jamm Asgard transporters, maybe the techy Cylons can too...lol then they'll just have to call Thor to blast the ships away...

Brigadier General Pants
October 10th, 2005, 07:40 PM
Of course, they could find Earth in 1980.

Oh wait, that's been done.

lord-anubis
October 10th, 2005, 08:32 PM
well as far as i can tell the cylons don't have transporters or even shileds. so i dout they could do that and they probly would not be able to take over the daedlus useing a virus ether. sents the tech would be some thing they never incounter before at the very least it would take them a while but by the time they did it be to late. they warth did try to take over the ship with a viurs before and they failed

Bl4de
October 10th, 2005, 10:22 PM
If Earth is anything like our Earth in the sense that humans will inevitably kill each other they'll war with each other and be under those "create new technologies while at war" scenarios.

It might be true you can develop handy technologies to kill people in the middle of a war, but true helpful technology won't come from a war, such as the lightbulb, electricity, phonograph, trains, radio/tv, microwaves etc. Except they'd be building more advanced stuff.

I agree though, you bring up a very interesting point.. if Earth has had no epic war against a race like the Cylons they've probably got 0 point in space fighting, if their wars only occur on Earth they'll have planes and such but no need for giant warships. Good point. Let's hope Earth used some of the time between the rift of the colonies to colonize nearby planets of Earth or at least establish some type of settlements.

Kobolian
October 11th, 2005, 03:55 PM
There seems to be a lot of talk about the Colonials realizing they actually migrated from Earth to kobol. Thats a good theory and all, but it just seems like were trying to fufill an Earth is the center of the universe idea. It would be a twist, but i dont believe it will happen.

Anyway back to the main question. Its hard to say what year the earth would be in i doubt it would be the distant past like the 13 century or anything like that, but you have to factor in the dark age that occured on Earth and in the 12 colonies and then there was the ban on technological advancements with computer sciences in the 12 Colonies, but then again 12 worlds working together would allow them to advance more quickly opposed to one world that itself is divided into countries.

So, I would say Earth is either going to be on about equal scientific terms with the 12 colonies or less advanced. Not so less advanced as to be banging rocks together, but maybe just starting to expand within our own solar system. with ships of our own (not equal to that of battlestars) but can atleast make it in and out of our atomoshpere with ease.

Bast
October 11th, 2005, 10:25 PM
What should happen?

A. Land in modern day times ala campiness

B. Cylons destroyed Earth and ambush them

C. Earthlings are xenophobes with equal level technological advancement launch massive assault on the fleet, Galactica is forced to surrender and be boarded.

D. Earth is inhabaited by pre neolithic savages living in caves batteling sabre tooth tigres, BSG settles what becomes Atlantis and they are responsible for the Earth humans leap to civilization.

hyzmarca
October 11th, 2005, 11:33 PM
E: Modern Earth, Colonial refugees are acceted into coiety and try to integrate themselves Alien Nation style. This is made considerably easier by the facts that they have hair and their males don't become pregnant. At the same time, Earth militaries race to control the Colonial technology knowing that whoever does will control the world while attempting to build a half-decent defense fleet, as well. .

555GATE
October 12th, 2005, 12:38 AM
In the original series, and I only saw the one where they do find earth, the Earth was more like option C. I wonder how close to tradition they'll keep with that part of the show.

I was actually just talking about this the other week. Just watch them find Earth in the Middle Ages. Think about it. The Tribes left Kobol, 3000 years ago (I think that was the number mentioned in one of the episode). Now disregard the fact that a year is different depending on the orbits of each planet around their suns. I think that might be left as a constant, as the familiar Earth year. It could be that each earth type planet has nearly the same orbital path around suns that are around the same age as ours. Perhaps that is a requirement for earth type planets to exist? So where do you start the count? When was 3000 years ago? I'm thinking about the Ancient Greeks, who believed in Gods with the same names as the Gods of the 13 Tribes. The belief in the Olympian Gods has roots all the way back to the Greek Bronze Age, before 1200 BC. Well what about all the other civilizations? Egypt, Babylon, etc. They existed, and some well before the Greeks. Therefore I've figured the 13th Tribe is either of the following:

1. The 13th Tribe is all of those civilizations, who split over the course of time into different civilizations due to being far away from the other Tribes in the Galaxy, so their beliefs in the Gods changed over time. I think this might be valid because most of the Gods of Ancient Times, although they had different names, were connected by what type of God's they were (Sky God, Death God, etc).

2. The 13th Tribe no longer exists as its own entity, they were maybe the lost Atlantis Colony, and their influence affected the development of another human race (our ancient civilizations). They brought the standards for the multi-god structure to us, then were destroyed in the sinking of Atlantis. They could have mated with the indigenous humans, and are still around in some way, but their colony was destroyed.

So what time is it on Earth if either of those are true?

1. This would mean that the 13th Tribe landed around 5000 BC, near the beginning of the first of the ancient civilizations. Add 3000 years, and that would put us at 2000 BC, the beginning of the Greek Bronze Age.

2. Plato was about 50 in 375 BC. Well he wrote wrote of a great place known as Atlantis which was destroyed well before his lifetime. Who knows when it was destroyed, if it even existed, but at the very least it was before 375 BC. Since the Egyptians had known about it, the Greeks had been roaming the seas for some time, and all the other ancient civilizations had a similar god structure I'd put the existance of Atlantis in the 5000 BC to 1000 BC range. Any earlier and I think they would have found it through exploration. Add 3000 years and that puts at the 2000 BC to 2000 AD range. Beginning of the Greek Bronze Age, through the Roman Empire and beginning of Christianity, to the Middle Ages, to Modern Day.

I wouldn't be surprised if we are still in less than Modern times when the fleet arrives on Earth. At the very least the 13th Tribe arrived before the Middle Ages. We Stargate fans understand what the Middle Ages may have done to our advancement. The Tollan didn't have that remember, so that may be why the other tribes might be much more advanced than the Earth Tribe.

Aaron Doral
October 12th, 2005, 12:52 AM
Plato wrote that the war with Atlantis (and the subsequent sinking of Atlantis) took place some 9,000 years prior to his lifetime (around 9500BC). I really, really hope that Moore won't do anything like the 13th tribe finding a planet that just happened to have an identical alien species living on it... That would be much worse than even forehead aliens.

hyzmarca
October 12th, 2005, 01:08 AM
Time wouldn't necessarily translate 1:1 between the Colonies and Earth. It depends on their realitive velocities. If the colonies' system has an absolute velocity that is significantly faster than our solar system's it is quite possible for 2000 years to pass there while 10,000 or more years passes here.

Relativity makes space travel fun.

Frinky
October 12th, 2005, 01:40 AM
I think that they would be of relatively the same technological development. They all left Kobol at the same time and, most likely, the same level of development. However, they may be slightly less advanced, possibly by 50-100yrs or so because of their isolation, while the colonies would have been able to develop faster as they could trade with each other.

Caprice
October 12th, 2005, 04:27 AM
However, they may be slightly less advanced, possibly by 50-100yrs or so because of their isolation,
So basically back up 100 years technologically and you have... today's society plus fake gravity and maybe FTL? I guess I don't percieve that the 12 Colonies are that much more advanced than we are in reality (part of why I really like the show) and that the only thing that really puts them apart is some extreme manufacturing capability to put together such large space ships.

NowIWillDestroyAbydos
October 12th, 2005, 04:32 AM
I'll probably go with B. eh, it's possible.

LCD2YOU
October 12th, 2005, 06:21 AM
Time wouldn't necessarily translate 1:1 between the Colonies and Earth. It depends on their realitive velocities. If the colonies' system has an absolute velocity that is significantly faster than our solar system's it is quite possible for 2000 years to pass there while 10,000 or more years passes here.

Relativity makes space travel fun.5 times the difference in relative time? That's assuming that the planetary systems of the Colonies are moving at about 95% of the speed of light relative to Earth. I'm not so sure that's really doable without the whole thing flinging itself out of the galaxy.

While there is a time differention between two aircraft with atomic clocks travelling at high rates of speed one going west and the other flying east, the difference is so small that it is only an interesting side note. The velocity needed for such an extreme time dilation comes to more problems than it solves.

@Li3n
October 12th, 2005, 10:07 AM
Guys didn't Billy say in the ep were they found Kobol that humans left it about 2000 years ago BSG time?
So that would mean that BSG is happening some 2000 years after the first Homo Sapien Sapien appeared! :eek:

IMO the way to end BSG would be them finding Earth but we only get to see the Galactica in space, with the Earth on the horizon(so to speak)!
Leave us all guessing as to how the Earth is like!

LCD2YOU
October 12th, 2005, 11:22 AM
BSG finding Earth what is approximately 7000CE. for those of you who don't know CE is "Common Era, the same as AD but not the overt religious baggage that comes with it.

Here's the thing:

It's 2050 and Earth was dying. What was left of humanity left to go to another world to escape the N-teenth Regoinal Wars that started in 2003CE. Those that led the new "Exodus". The leaders of this escape act used religions to help quell the masses. Eventully they were revered as "Gods" and quickly assumed the title, afterall humans are humans and power is intoxicating. They found a planet and named it Kobol.

There the "Gods", actually children of the original leaders, combined all sorts of world Religions. From mysticism to fundemental religious beliefs, they were all incorperated. Now, from the Season Two episode, "Valley of Darkness", 6 showed Giaus that human sacrifices were the order of the day on Kobol. I do not know if she was playing with him or not, but let's assume that is true.

Ok, well we know why the whole thing collapsed. The only thing the "Gods" were able to do was say some "disaster struck", not their incompetence and brutal regimes, that forced humanity from the Gods. Well, the Gods were human so who cares? I can even see why they had that the "Sacred Scrolls" told them life began on Kobol, the Gods wanted to be worshipped and the reasons for the N-teenth Regonial Wars (IMNSHO - religion) forgotten.

12 Groups went one way looking for a new home. The last group heard of Earth and "went home".

So, humans left Earth in 2050. We found a new planet, Kobol in 2200. This was done with ships using Solar Sails and eventually even Jump Drives.

Kobol colonized in 2320 and everything is wonderful (to be debated) until 5000 when everything hits the fan. As BSG is 2000 years past that, that puts Earth around 7000CE.

So what is it like? Did the 13th tribe go back and find out what happened to people because we were stupid? Did they end up killing themselves off? Did they even survive as Earth went from a "big blue marble" down to a desolate and barren wasteland stripped of an atmosphere? Is the Earth dead along the 13th Tribe because their ancestors couldn't agree on which tribal godhead figure loved who more?

I don't know.

I actually like that one the best.

hyzmarca
October 12th, 2005, 07:44 PM
There is also gravity to consider. areas of space that are more densly populated would also experience time dilation from the gravity. Time on an aircraft actually speeds up realitive to the ground because it is farther from the Earth's gravity. A densly populated solar system in a densly populated area of space with a few black holes and neutron stars just close enough to exert influance without causing catostrophic damage would also experince time more slowly than a solar system is surrounded by less mass.

dec55
October 12th, 2005, 10:20 PM
The will get help from SG1, and shut the Cylon war machine down. I'd like to see
that!!!

Bast
October 13th, 2005, 12:51 AM
Be cool if "earth" was indeed inhabaited by stone age savages, The fleet arrives settles in a isolated unhabaited area "becomes" atlantis , They then defend earth from Cylon Incursions , Cylons manage to destroy and sink atlantis, Galatica does a suicide attack wipes out cylon armada, But the colonials manage to fool the Cylons into believing "earth" has been destroyed with false data sent back to them. Few Survivors of Atlantis scatter and start 'building and developing civilization" on earth with nothing but the clothes on their back, Primitives mistakenly believe Adama is Zeus and Lee Adama well "Apollo".

Starbase
October 13th, 2005, 06:16 AM
I like Fith Rcaes idea of them finding an Earth that is full of humanoid Cylons and they have no idea that they are. :eek:

Caprice
October 13th, 2005, 01:53 PM
I take it there was a merging of threads... :eek: :eek:

Brigadier General Pants
October 13th, 2005, 03:27 PM
There is also gravity to consider. areas of space that are more densly populated would also experience time dilation from the gravity. Time on an aircraft actually speeds up realitive to the ground because it is farther from the Earth's gravity. A densly populated solar system in a densly populated area of space with a few black holes and neutron stars just close enough to exert influance without causing catostrophic damage would also experince time more slowly than a solar system is surrounded by less mass.

Dude, a) the time dilation effect of a planet's gravity well is so slight as to be negligible and b) the only way for a planet to exist, would be for it to be far enough away from a black hole so as not to be affected by it. That is, in order for the planet not to be sucked into the black hole, it would have to be a sufficient distance away to not be affected by it's gravity - hence it would not experience time dilation either.

Dr. Pepper Girl
October 13th, 2005, 06:22 PM
I believe that they will get to earth, but when they do all I can say is that it will be lower in technology then the colonials or as in SG-1 "younger."

LCD2YOU
October 13th, 2005, 06:30 PM
"Younger"?

That's nice. It would be great to have them meet the Asgard.

Better yet, have them meet the wraiths. Yeah, when twoi really evil bad guys go at it, makes one think that maybe, just maybe, the universe ain't so bad.

Have the wraith's start sucking the organic Cylons dry and hopefully it shorts out their "I feel no pain nor fear" software. Let them truly understand the phrase total horror.

the Fifth Race
October 14th, 2005, 04:00 AM
Where did this whole Stargate meet BSG debate begin?....I have no doubt that the Asgard could destroy anything the Cylons would throw at them. If anf when us (the Tauri) build enough Asgard tech BC's and develope our own viable energy weapons, we would destroy the Cylons quite easily. But thats not gonna happen. The real question is if they find Earth and what will they find if they do?.

Chricton
October 14th, 2005, 08:35 AM
It happens to every show, eventually. You get angry fans from popular show #1 getting threatened by fans of popular show #2, and it leads to this kind of stuff. It happened to Farscape and Stargate when SG just started airing of scifi channel. It's starts out harmless fun, but it turns into a real bad thing when fans start posting negative things about a shows certain ________ and how the writers are weak for creating something not as strong as their ________. It's really stupid, childish stuff.

Long after SG1 ends you will have fans feeling animosity towards BSG, only because it was slightly more popular.

Caprice
October 14th, 2005, 12:23 PM
You get angry fans from popular show #1 getting threatened by fans of popular show #2, and it leads to this kind of stuff.
I wouldn't call myself "angry" or "threatened" but I suppose some might feel that way.

skrip00
October 14th, 2005, 01:01 PM
SG-1 will always be a great show... and it had several seasons which had us on the edge of our seats. But years of story slowly repeating upon itself, many just got tired of it. BSG is something new... a breath of fresh air.

I used to be an avid stargate fan, but i can only absorb so much of a show's universe before i get tired of it and look for something new.

Chricton
October 14th, 2005, 01:40 PM
I wouldn't call myself "angry" or "threatened" but I suppose some might feel that way.

Well, to be honest I shouldn't have put angry into the sentence. But, for some reason, people sometimes feel this way. They get a superiority complex about their show. Stargate fans were going wild with anger when Atlantis was just starting, the boards even here were unreadable without getting angry at someone. BSG got ragged on like crazy when it first premiered. Maybe not by Stargate fans, but all scifi fans in general. But for the most part, the show has proven it's quality and all the ranting has subsided.

But you still get the occasional fanboy with the "BSG is like OC in space! OMGLOL" comment.

the fifth man
October 14th, 2005, 07:28 PM
That would be neat if they made it to Earth. But only if the show could continue on from there. If not, I say let it take a very long time. But there's lots of great ideas, I'm sure, for what could transpire once they reach Earth.

the Fifth Race
October 18th, 2005, 09:13 PM
It happens to every show, eventually. You get angry fans from popular show #1 getting threatened by fans of popular show #2, and it leads to this kind of stuff. It happened to Farscape and Stargate when SG just started airing of scifi channel. It's starts out harmless fun, but it turns into a real bad thing when fans start posting negative things about a shows certain ________ and how the writers are weak for creating something not as strong as their ________. It's really stupid, childish stuff.

Long after SG1 ends you will have fans feeling animosity towards BSG, only because it was slightly more popular.

With all due respect Chricton I disagree. For anyone to feel animosity or disdain for a fan of one paticular show over another simply because they may not like the other show is assinine. I won't judge whether I dislike a show becuase there is a blacklash from opposing fans. I would bet most scifi fans are smarter than that.

ArthurKing
October 19th, 2005, 02:53 PM
Howdy, new poster long-lurker.

I don't think the argument for a more traditional ending (yes, ending) to the series has been given enough advocacy here.

On it being the ending: no show is going to last forever, no matter how well it is written/acted/directed, especially when it's premise is 'finding our way home' (one of the archetypal stories of human narrative if there ever was one). I don't think there could be a more appropriate ending than Galactica discovering Earth -- not for a long while :) but, by the 5th or 6th season, it would be fitting.

It would also be largely satisfying for them to encounter an 'Earth' or 'Earth-based' federation which was technologically more advanced (not to the point of ridiculousness, but to the point of being a 'white knight' in the show). Doing something somewhat predictable in no way implies doing something poorly or unstaisfyingly. It's unfortunate that the one has become associated with the other, on account of a plethora of idiotic movie and television 'men' in the last few decades.

Moore could weave a multistory arc of epic battles, fights for survival, the dynamics of long-separated members of the same species being reunited, etc. It wouldn't have to be trite, cliche, or rushed.

Remember, some of the greatest and most enduring works of human creativity (epics, drama, poetry) do, in one way shape or form accept and embrace and make strong the 'good takes the day' theme.

To me, the 'suprise twist ending', while staisfying in a very base way, wouldn't be the way for a series of this caliber to go out.

Edit: And in fact, as I think about it, given the extent of cynicism/jadedness (call it what you will) that exists within so much of the viewing audience these days, the more traditional ending I've described might actually be MORE of a suprise than the 'dark' or 'twist' path, being so overused of late.

Brigadier General Pants
October 19th, 2005, 03:26 PM
Doing something somewhat predictable in no way implies doing something poorly or unstaisfyingly. It's unfortunate that the one has become associated with the other, on account of a plethora of idiotic movie and television 'men' in the last few decades.


Good point(s). Many works of fiction are in fact recyclings of tradition (and in the case of BSG, an actual remake!). I remember before BSG came out, die-hard BSG:TOS fans were already bagging the show: yet look how well it has been done. So I agree finding Earth et al. does not preclude originality. The new BSG is original in many ways, despite being a 'remake'. If RDM went down the path of finding Earth, I'm sure he would do it justice, and give it a fresh twist to boot.

Lexx
October 19th, 2005, 06:43 PM
There are two ideas I'd like to see.

1) They find Earth, and it's incredibly advanced. The Colonials then find out that Kobol was a scientific facility set up by Earth (in our future) to research Artificial Intelligence. And that the lead scientists managed to create robotic lifeforms, but those lifeforms eventually rebelled and wiped out the human colony on Kobol. And somewhere during that time period, the machines took on the look of humans, just like the Cylons have. Then those "new humans" left Kobol to find a new world, and eventually settled the 12 Colonies. The truth of Kobol and Earth, and the true nature of the "humans", get fudged around over time until we have the current state of the Colonies. All of this has happened before, and all of this will happen again, as the saying goes.

2) Years pass by the RTFF still have no idea where Earth is. They eventually decide to call it quits, and find a habitable planet. They start living there, and name the planet Earth after the mysterious planet they never found. The camera pulls back, and we see that the new Earth is actually our Earth, but far in the past.

Brigadier General Pants
October 19th, 2005, 07:16 PM
There are two ideas I'd like to see.

1) They find Earth, and it's incredibly advanced. The Colonials then find out that Kobol was a scientific facility set up by Earth (in our future) to research Artificial Intelligence. And that the lead scientists managed to create robotic lifeforms, but those lifeforms eventually rebelled and wiped out the human colony on Kobol. And somewhere during that time period, the machines took on the look of humans, just like the Cylons have. Then those "new humans" left Kobol to find a new world, and eventually settled the 12 Colonies. The truth of Kobol and Earth, and the true nature of the "humans", get fudged around over time until we have the current state of the Colonies. All of this has happened before, and all of this will happen again, as the saying goes.

2) Years pass by the RTFF still have no idea where Earth is. They eventually decide to call it quits, and find a habitable planet. They start living there, and name the planet Earth after the mysterious planet they never found. The camera pulls back, and we see that the new Earth is actually our Earth, but far in the past.

They are both good ideas.

LCD2YOU
October 20th, 2005, 07:05 AM
Personally, I'd like to see an advanced Earth.

The idea of the Galactica Fleet being our ancestors doesn't appeal to me.

I want to see the Cylons go up against, I dunno, Enterprise-E.

The Cylons would have short but completely outgunned and outclassed fire fights.

Section_One
October 20th, 2005, 11:50 AM
I'd rather see the Cylons go up against the Peacekeepers (back when they were the "good guys", if you guys have seen those episodes) from Farscape) or Earth Force from B5. Now that would be very nice indeed. Great ship to ship combat and massive dogfights.

Caprice
October 20th, 2005, 12:19 PM
Earth Force from B5. Now that would be very nice indeed. Great ship to ship combat and massive dogfights.
Ya know, the Babylon 5 universe would probably mate up a bit better with Battlestar Galactica's than that of Stargate or Trek. At least the ships in Babylon 5 seemed to obey the laws of physics when in space... LOL

SGalisa
October 20th, 2005, 07:49 PM
Originally posted by Caprice:
At least the ships in Babylon 5 seemed to obey the laws of physics when in space...ugh! Of course, that still doesn't explain how precious antiques and delicate loose objects can stay intact and unharmed during a jostling attack while in space flight - if the gravity generators get shut off for any amounts of time... or is that when everything suddenly floats? ;)

I'll probably never understand the obsessive urge to make everything perfect in the laws of science and physics, when applied to a genre that has the ability to suspend reality on a few levels of comprehension...
========
Anyway, finding earth?
If the current BSG stays close to the original series, finding earth is part of the BSG legend... history repeats itself ("what has happened before, will happen again... and again..."). It's just a question of when, not "if". And "how?" If Six hinted that the scriptures lied, then maybe the Cylons have something different up their proverbial sleeves to change history from repeating itself...? just another possibility...and if that happens, it's very possible, that finding earth, etc., is not the end of this BSG version.


Originally posted by the Fifth Race:
Where did this whole Stargate meet BSG debate begin?from within this topic - a few possibilities...


Originally posted by 555GATE:
I wouldn't be surprised if we are still in less than Modern times when the fleet arrives on Earth. At the very least the 13th Tribe arrived before the Middle Ages. We Stargate fans understand what the Middle Ages may have done to our advancement. The Tollan didn't have that remember, so that may be why the other tribes might be much more advanced than the Earth Tribe.next one I think is a joke...


Originally posted by dec55:
The will get help from SG1, and shut the Cylon war machine down. I'd like to see that!!!Actually, there actually is a "Pegasus" ship on BSG (seen in the mid-season cliffhanger). Not sure if the BSG Pegasus is directly connected to a land mass called Atlantis, but it is not the same Atlantis of SGA fame. I'm not even sure if the reference was an indirect tribute to the SG series (that might be too *wishful*), but I think there was a Pegasus ship in the original BSG series that was also part of the fleet.

SGalisa
October 20th, 2005, 08:20 PM
just an observation I noticed from a while back... ;)


Originally posted by the Fifth Race:
Where did this whole Stargate meet BSG debate begin?
Originally posted by Chricton:
It happens to every show, eventually. You get angry fans from popular show #1 getting threatened by fans of popular show #2, and it leads to this kind of stuff. It happened to Farscape and Stargate when SG just started airing of scifi channel....not (totally) where I was reading elsewhere on the internet -both programs had equal value and likability... some Farscape viewers stated they weren't too happy with the direction the show was going, and voiced *concerns*, but they weren't at "war" with Stargate viewers. The first place I ever saw any besieging commentaries was on various (TV related internet) newsgroups.

As for the other web discussion sites, SG-1 was a virtual unknown on Sci-Fi for those not privileged to have Showtime as an extra TV channel; so the series itself was a humble newbie of sorts and stayed that way, mostly up until about 2 or 3 years ago. It was always in the shadow of Star Trek being more prominent, instead. And currently, I think it's still in the shadow of *any* sci-fi. Current BSG popularity sort of reinforces that theory...

Anyway, I'm almost 99% certain most fierce-like hostilities between BSG and SG didn't surface network-wide, until after the Cinescape reviews on SGA's "Siege" eps. Prior to the professional media's highly negative "Siege" reviews (a bit of prophecy here??!), there were rumblings and grumblings on less moderated discussion boards that sort of migrated being heard about around the rest of the internet. I was concerned that the two groups couldn't seem to live in the same galaxy peacefully -or Tv channel, but could never understand the "why?" :(

However, I noticed that here on GW, a lot of support *for* Stargate was coming from a majority of BSG viewers at that time. But a few months later, the pendulum started swinging in opposition against SG than for it. I think that was also due more to viewer preference, re: cast and story changes, and some people just getting generally tired from getting involved in what was becoming a potentially long running series (SG-1) ...which brings up the question of how long can attention spans go for any one (Tv) series?

After a while, it's easy to let our emotions get the best of us, but there's also an old saying:
"You catch more flies with honey, than with vinegar..." ;)

That's something on BSG which some of the Cylons seemed to have learned to do with some of the humans... but in their case, I keep asking "why?" ...They obviously have a motive, and earth might only be a tiny portion of that larger spectrum... Earth is only the beginning. ...yeah, I can see BSG going on for more than the average five years if viewers don't mind how far the storylines stretch... :)

Brigadier General Pants
October 20th, 2005, 09:11 PM
yeah, I can see BSG going on for more than the average five years if viewers don't mind how far the storylines stretch... :)
I hope so, but the sheer intensity of what happens with every episode may limit that. I mean, the plot is already so convoluted after 1 1/2 seasons. That's what I love about the show - but sometimes I think the candle that burns twice as bright...

Giantevilhead
October 20th, 2005, 10:22 PM
1. Earth is a wasteland, it was destroyed by a nuclear war, that's why they left in the first place.

2. Earth is ruled by machines that defeated humans long ago in a devastating war, the survivors fled the earth and founded the colonies.

3. Earth is very advanced, they accept the Cylons as their children and destroy BSG.

4. The humans of earth are dying, they were the ones who called to the Cylons telling them to procreate, the arrival of BSG and the human/Cylon hybrid ensures the survival of the humans of earth.

Brigadier General Pants
October 20th, 2005, 10:34 PM
1. Earth is a wasteland, it was destroyed by a nuclear war, that's why they left in the first place.
Left it? The premise of BSG is that humans left Kobol to go to Earth, not to flee from it. But if they arrived and humanity had simply destroyed itself, that would be an interesting twist - and would kind of validate the Cylons' judgment of humanity.


2. Earth is ruled by machines that defeated humans long ago in a devastating war, the survivors fled the earth and founded the colonies.
Again, humans left Kobol to go to Earth, not the other way around.



3. Earth is very advanced, they accept the Cylons as their children and destroy BSG.
That would be twisted, but interesting.



4. The humans of earth are dying, they were the ones who called to the Cylons telling them to procreate, the arrival of BSG and the human/Cylon hybrid ensures the survival of the humans of earth.
But why wouldn't they just accept the BSG humans, and use them to continue the human race? It would be unnecessary to use the Cylon hybrids.

The above being said, it would be interesting to find out that the truth is the oppostite of what they believe: that the 12 colonies came from Earth, not the other way around.

Giantevilhead
October 21st, 2005, 12:57 PM
Left it? The premise of BSG is that humans left Kobol to go to Earth, not to flee from it. But if they arrived and humanity had simply destroyed itself, that would be an interesting twist - and would kind of validate the Cylons' judgment of humanity.


Again, humans left Kobol to go to Earth, not the other way around.
Well I think that earth was the homeworld but something terrible happened, nuclear war, machine taking over, which forced humanity to flee and settle on Kobol. After many generations, maybe hundreds or thousands of years, history was forgotten, or maybe erased, and they founded the 12 colonies.


But why wouldn't they just accept the BSG humans, and use them to continue the human race? It would be unnecessary to use the Cylon hybrids.

The above being said, it would be interesting to find out that the truth is the oppostite of what they believe: that the 12 colonies came from Earth, not the other way around.
We know the human Cylons can't reproduce, the people of earth could have a similar problem and they need the human/Cylon hybrid to continue their race.

OK, I got another one, assuming that Kobol was the real human homeworld then earth may have been settled by machines. The Cylons said that this has all happened before, so maybe there was a war between humans and sentient machines on Kobol which caused everyone to leave, humans formed the 12 colonies and the machines went to earth and founded the 13th colony.

the Fifth Race
October 21st, 2005, 01:43 PM
3. Earth is very advanced, they accept the Cylons as their children and destroy BSG.

LOL...twisted is right.


4. The humans of earth are dying, they were the ones who called to the Cylons telling them to procreate, the arrival of BSG and the human/Cylon hybrid ensures the survival of the humans of earth.

Sounds like one helluva an episode or maybe a movie?.

Vip3r
October 22nd, 2005, 04:19 AM
It was said at the beginning of the mini-series that the after the first war, the Cylons left for a world to call their own and that no one had heard from them in over 40 years. It is possible that the Cylons had found Earth and took it for themselves, which could explain why there was no sign of them for so long, also, the Colonials would have detected them within the local star systems before long. So if the Cylons did indeed find Earth (depending on the time frame - assuming that we're talking about Earth in the future/post apocalypse), then the Galactica and RTF are unintentionally leading themselves into a trap with Earth being revealed as the Cylons Home world. Again, this all depends on time frames, but it is possible and could be the twist.

Brigadier General Pants
October 23rd, 2005, 03:27 PM
the Cylons did indeed find Earth (depending on the time frame - assuming that we're talking about Earth in the future/post apocalypse), then the Galactica and RTF are unintentionally leading themselves into a trap with Earth being revealed as the Cylons Home world. Again, this all depends on time frames, but it is possible and could be the twist.

Maybe the Cylons are leading them to Earth as part of their desire to continue with the human/Cylon hybrid idea... they wanted humanity gone, but wanted enough humans still in existence for their own ends.

Cathara
October 24th, 2005, 10:29 AM
After reading all these great posts I have had lots of ideas...:)

* The Cylons were gone from Colonial space, etc. for 40 years because they were looking for/had found the planet Kobol. They were discovering its secrets, its history, perhaps even the information/technology that allowed the Cylons to develop their humanoid models.

Perhaps Kobol was also where the Cylons had their religous "awakening" take place.

As I understood from the series, BSG jumped beyond the red line near the start of all these shows. I took that to mean they were in unexplored territory. And they went even farther before stumbling upon Kobol.

So the Cylons - if they really were on Kobol - would have been far enough away to seem to have disappeared to the Colonials.

* Another possible route for the end of the series...BSG and it's fleet find Earth after several seasons have gone by. They find a world crowded with masses of humanity.

Over population is the name of the day - and the planet is getting to the point where it's starting to fail - droughts, low resources, etc. Its also a planet armed to the teeth due to frequent wars and infighting.

Timeline wise - it would be an Earth "in the near future". Close enough to modern day to be recognizable to viewers, with enough futuristic gadgets/weapons thrown in to make it interesting.

The humans of Earth and BSG become allies. BSG offers a deal...help us win the war with the Cylons and we'll solve your over-population problem.

The goal is to exhange information - use the military resources left on Earth to build a fleet of ships (non networked) and lure the Cylons into a trap where they are destroyed...somehow...:S

Then a new fleet would set forth - filled with people/animals/etc. to recolonize the 12 planets left behind.

There would have to be a way to clean the atmosphere of the nuclear radiation but we could have some miraculous discovery of how to do that during the course of the series. Before they even reach Earth - that way it would be a moment of "We could undo the radiation damage of the attacks - but the knowledge is useless to us because as long as the Cylons are there we can't go back."

And finally - the planet Kobol - lets pretend that its roughly midway between Earth and the 12 colonies - becomes a meeting place. A museum, a park, a religous holy place - visited by the peoples of both worlds.

Amanda Eros
October 24th, 2005, 08:47 PM
It was said at the beginning of the mini-series that the after the first war, the Cylons left for a world to call their own and that no one had heard from them in over 40 years. It is possible that the Cylons had found Earth and took it for themselves, which could explain why there was no sign of them for so long, also, the Colonials would have detected them within the local star systems before long. So if the Cylons did indeed find Earth (depending on the time frame - assuming that we're talking about Earth in the future/post apocalypse), then the Galactica and RTF are unintentionally leading themselves into a trap with Earth being revealed as the Cylons Home world. Again, this all depends on time frames, but it is possible and could be the twist.

I was thinking along the same lines.

Another thought that I had about Earth's role in the whole big picture is that perhaps earth was where the lords were created, and they rebelled against their creators and left for Kobal. Also forming some hybrids along the way. Then the same thing happened when they created the current humans, and at the same time they made hybrids - Heracules, and left for the colonies. Next the colonials leave there to go back to earth, and then the cycle repeats itself.

the Fifth Race
October 26th, 2005, 06:58 AM
I like the idea of Earth being the center of the universe for the BSG citizens. A storyline (as long as it does'nt get to religious) of Earth being the starting place sounds very cool.

Render
October 28th, 2005, 06:53 PM
heres a nice simple one, earth is the source of the cylons, they are the ones who introduced monothiastism to the cylons and led their war.

Konrad9
October 28th, 2005, 11:48 PM
So basically back up 100 years technologically and you have... today's society plus fake gravity and maybe FTL? I guess I don't percieve that the 12 Colonies are that much more advanced than we are in reality (part of why I really like the show) and that the only thing that really puts them apart is some extreme manufacturing capability to put together such large space ships.

I would imagine the 12 Colonies didn't have the centuries-long dark ages that we had.
This would put them way, way ahead of us in tech.
See that red-tinted star in the sky? That's Mars. If it weren't for the dark ages, there would be half a billion people up there.

the Fifth Race
October 29th, 2005, 05:29 AM
I would imagine the 12 Colonies didn't have the centuries-long dark ages that we had.
This would put them way, way ahead of us in tech.
See that red-tinted star in the sky? That's Mars. If it weren't for the dark ages, there would be half a billion people up there.


Take away the dark ages and few of the famines over the centuries and we could very well be way ahead of where we are now technologically.

I have heard this theory bandied about on a few different forums and threads, very interesting.

Oreo
October 29th, 2005, 10:37 AM
The Cylon attack came from Earth. They went out and found Earth 40 years ago or whatever, killed everyone there and then went back to the 12 other plantets and killed everyone there too.

Oreo
October 29th, 2005, 10:39 AM
I would imagine the 12 Colonies didn't have the centuries-long dark ages that we had.
This would put them way, way ahead of us in tech.
See that red-tinted star in the sky? That's Mars. If it weren't for the dark ages, there would be half a billion people up there.


yeah 1500 years down the drains because crazy religious freaks were runnnig the show.

Hmmm... seems a little like todays world.......

Caprice
November 2nd, 2005, 07:06 PM
I would imagine the 12 Colonies didn't have the centuries-long dark ages that we had.
This would put them way, way ahead of us in tech.
See that red-tinted star in the sky? That's Mars. If it weren't for the dark ages, there would be half a billion people up there.
That is really a unique perspective. I had never considered just how much damage that particular time period did to our society.

Jarnin
November 2nd, 2005, 11:23 PM
This might be way off, but I think they are the 13th colony.

If the stuff written in their sacred scrolls is supposedly happening over and over, then it's possible the writers of the scrolls misinterpreted some of the prophecies because they didn't understand, or had limited knowledge of how time behaves.
They may have accidentally placed the exodus to Earth in the beginning of the scrolls when the exodus from Kobal to the colonies occured, so they think there were 13 colonies, but in fact, there are only 12.
This would explain why it was a "lost" colony, and why nobody knows how to get to Earth.

The way I see it, the "gods" on Kobol knew the 12 colonies would end up screwing things up, so they made the map room on Kobol in order to lead the 13th colony to Earth.

the Fifth Race
November 3rd, 2005, 05:48 AM
This might be way off, but I think they are the 13th colony.

If the stuff written in their sacred scrolls is supposedly happening over and over, then it's possible the writers of the scrolls misinterpreted some of the prophecies because they didn't understand, or had limited knowledge of how time behaves.
They may have accidentally placed the exodus to Earth in the beginning of the scrolls when the exodus from Kobal to the colonies occured, so they think there were 13 colonies, but in fact, there are only 12.
This would explain why it was a "lost" colony, and why nobody knows how to get to Earth.

The way I see it, the "gods" on Kobol knew the 12 colonies would end up screwing things up, so they made the map room on Kobol in order to lead the 13th colony to Earth.


Excellent theory Jarnin!....I get the feeling if and or when they ever do find Earth that they will find sacred scrolls that are part of the history and lore of the BSG people.

I still get this feeling that when or if they find Earth that everything will not be as it seems. Which is pretty much the norm for the whole series so far.

dec55
November 4th, 2005, 12:15 AM
:lol I brought up the SG1 and BSG angle in this topic because:

1. If the BSG does find Earth, I want it to be within our life times.....not the far future nor the distant past......SG1 just would be a good cross over.....as far as characters......

2. Seeing the SG1 interaction between the BSG world kinda would be cool,
because both deal with old earth mythology......Can you imagine Daniel Jackson
interview Boomer about the Tomb of Athena? General Landry and Adama try to figure out who has top prioreity, the Cylons or the Ori?? Samantha Carter and
Chief Tyrol taking apart a Cylon raider?


Seeing Dr. Lam and Dr Baltar try to figure why Six keeps on popping in his imagination would be neat to see....:)

JanusAncient
November 4th, 2005, 02:12 AM
Here is an idea.

The 13th landed on earth and discover the existance of the One god. The tribe was broken into 2 camps, those believing in the false gods and those believeing the One God.

This lead to a great war which destroyed much of the 13th tribe located on earth. Those who believe in the False Gods went to find another planet leaving the believers of the One god to die on earth.

Earth is Earth as we know it, but the "Earth" BSG seeks is nearby, with technology advance enough to rival BSG, and has being watching earth, introducing new technogies and starting events trying to prevent our self destruction.

I thought this as well, the introduction of ships, previously unseen by the Galactica, or the Cylons, jumping into a fight from a distant part of the galaxy, with advanced technology, moreso than the Cylons, and the Colonials. They don't allow either of the two dualing races, to near Earth's solar system, instead warning the Cylons, and the Colonials, that if their war is to persist, they must remain in a certain part of the galaxy, or else face total annihilation by Earth's protectors. I find this concept so intriguing, the possibility of the ships are enough to satiate.:D :D :)

Chricton
November 4th, 2005, 10:27 AM
2. Seeing the SG1 interaction between the BSG world kinda would be cool,
because both deal with old earth mythology......Can you imagine Daniel Jackson
interview Boomer about the Tomb of Athena? General Landry and Adama try to figure out who has top prioreity, the Cylons or the Ori?? Samantha Carter and
Chief Tyrol taking apart a Cylon raider?


Seeing Dr. Lam and Dr Baltar try to figure why Six keeps on popping in his imagination would be neat to see....

That would be terrible.

MASON
November 4th, 2005, 12:56 PM
Excellent theory Jarnin!....I get the feeling if and or when they ever do find Earth that they will find sacred scrolls that are part of the history and lore of the BSG people.

I still get this feeling that when or if they find Earth that everything will not be as it seems. Which is pretty much the norm for the whole series so far.
Heeheeheee, they reach earth, and they find videocassettes of Battlestar Galactica: the original series. :p

@Li3n
November 5th, 2005, 09:29 AM
Heeheeheee, they reach earth, and they find videocassettes of Battlestar Galactica: the original series. :p

Or of Galactica 1980.:eek: And then they all kill themselves. ;)

the Fifth Race
November 5th, 2005, 10:53 AM
Heeheeheee, they reach earth, and they find videocassettes of Battlestar Galactica: the original series. :p

LOLOL.....I kind of liked the original series!. Red and Gold plated Cylons with cool names like Beelzebub :cool:

SGalisa
November 5th, 2005, 08:20 PM
a very lonnnng time ago, I *really* enjoyed reading most of these BSG conversations (very interesting and educational). The following contains a follow-up to one of those now buried topics... but first:

Originally posted by Giantevilhead:
4. The humans of earth are dying, they were the ones who called to the Cylons telling them to procreate, the arrival of BSG and the human/Cylon hybrid ensures the survival of the humans of earth.that theory sounds interesting! :) ...but it probably won't happen.


Originally posted by Jarnin:
This might be way off, but I think they are the 13th colony.
question: "who" is the 13th colony? The BSG fleet (who mostly came from Caprica) or...? slightly confused there...

When I first discovered Gateworld, the BSG topics were sort of in their infancy and totally fascinating. Most rehashed the legends behind the ideas of the original series. Anyway, among one of those topics was the theory of the colonies possibly being 13, instead of 12.

The only flaw there is when Starbuck, Roslin, Apollo and Adama were transported in the map room on Kobol, they were standing on "it" -i.e.: earth (the lost colony) looking upward at the 12 constellations (apparently representative of and containing 1 colony each).

What was intriguing in the topic that I found (on GW) about the possibility of having 13 colonies, was how unique it was when contrasted to the original 13 colonies of the USA. (I saw that and went "wow! cool!"). So, in retrospect, there was a distinct parallel to the original 13 USA colonies, before the US became the USA and the earlier formation of the 12 colonies, plus 1 lost =13 on an intergalactic scale. Farfetched it may be, but in some ways, it made {perfect} sense. ;)


Originally posted by dec55:
1. If the BSG does find Earth, I want it to be within our life times.....not the far future nor the distant past......SG1 just would be a good cross over.....as far as characters......

2. Seeing the SG1 interaction between the BSG world kinda would be cool,
because both deal with old earth mythology......Can you imagine Daniel Jackson interview Boomer about the Tomb of Athena?
...{etc.}...No. I don't think I'd want to imagine it either, tho I certainly can picture various images. There'd most likely be hissy fits from the (super)devout BSG side. Plus, it might put BSG on par as another SG1 "Wormhole Extreme" type situation. ...not that "Wormhole Extreme" was that all that bad or too off-beat... it had its {quality} *moments*... :D


Originally posted by MASON:
Heeheeheee, they reach earth, and they find videocassettes of Battlestar Galactica: the original series. :pnow *that* would be funny - even if used as a tributary memory... :D Of course, the current BSG folks would have no idea what the tapes were, except maybe to think it was one of their historical cycles from ancient history. It would probably be more realistic (and within realistic reach) than BSG meets SG1 on earth.

Besides, I think I'd prefer Michael Shanks as appearing as some eeeeevil, scheming character on BSG (fits more with the series), than meek and mild Daniel Jackson. Does Baltar have any equals, or near equals?

mmmm... "By your command..." oh imperious one! (I liked that line - sort of miss hearing it in those deep, monotone Cylon voices) ;)

the Fifth Race
November 9th, 2005, 06:26 AM
question: "who" is the 13th colony? The BSG fleet (who mostly came from Caprica) or...? slightly confused there...

When I first discovered Gateworld, the BSG topics were sort of in their infancy and totally fascinating. Most rehashed the legends behind the ideas of the original series. Anyway, among one of those topics was the theory of the colonies possibly being 13, instead of 12.

The only flaw there is when Starbuck, Roslin, Apollo and Adama were transported in the map room on Kobol, they were standing on "it" -i.e.: earth (the lost colony) looking upward at the 12 constellations (apparently representative of and containing 1 colony each).

What was intriguing in the topic that I found (on GW) about the possibility of having 13 colonies, was how unique it was when contrasted to the original 13 colonies of the USA. (I saw that and went "wow! cool!"). So, in retrospect, there was a distinct parallel to the original 13 USA colonies, before the US became the USA and the earlier formation of the 12 colonies, plus 1 lost =13 on an intergalactic scale. Farfetched it may be, but in some ways, it made {perfect} sense. ;)


I kind of thought the samething especially after that episode where they found the map room. I thought to myself there is a parallel with numbers between the original USA colonies and the BSG colonies.

MASON
November 9th, 2005, 06:53 AM
Besides, I think I'd prefer Michael Shanks as appearing as some eeeeevil, scheming character on BSG (fits more with the series), than meek and mild Daniel Jackson. Does Baltar have any equals, or near equals?

mmmm... "By your command..." oh imperious one! (I liked that line - sort of miss hearing it in those deep, monotone Cylon voices) ;)
Well, off-topically (as I tend to go :o ), I think we'll soon be treated to a much more Cylon influenced Baltar. I have a feeling the Colonial fleet will be on to him pretty soon, and he's going to make a run for the nearest Baseship. So, we may, yet again, see Baltar clumsily chew the scenery as he contemplates destroying the Colonial fleet before they destroy him and his favourite Six. But I don't think we're going to see John Colicos' outright evil glee (I hope we don't).

Aaron Doral
November 9th, 2005, 07:02 AM
Baltar arrives on the basestar. When he gets out of his spacecraft, he's greeted by dozens of nude Baltars... :)

It can be the last scene of season two. ;)

MASON
November 9th, 2005, 07:22 AM
Baltar arrives on the basestar. When he gets out of his spacecraft, he's greeted by dozens of nude Baltars... :)

It can be the last scene of season two. ;)
Does anyone want to see that? :eek:

It would be the comedic highlight of the show, though. :p :D

dec55
November 10th, 2005, 11:20 PM
No. I don't think I'd want to imagine it either, tho I certainly can picture various images. There'd most likely be hissy fits from the (super)devout BSG side. Plus, it might put BSG on par as another SG1 "Wormhole Extreme" type situation. ...not that "Wormhole Extreme" was that all that bad or too off-beat... it had its {quality} *moments*... :D



Wormhole had a lot of hilarious inside jokes......and it worked. Seeing the
SG1 and BSG folks intereact may not be as comedic but it would be great to watch it happen. Though seeing so many stars in one show may be overwhelming.

the Fifth Race
November 11th, 2005, 05:48 AM
How about a musical BSG episode :rolleyes: :D like they did for "Buffy the Vampire Slayer". That buffy episode was one the best!.

Darth Buddha
November 11th, 2005, 06:08 AM
Wormhole had a lot of hilarious inside jokes......and it worked. Seeing the
SG1 and BSG folks intereact may not be as comedic but it would be great to watch it happen. Though seeing so many stars in one show may be overwhelming.
Comedic and BSG? Those two don't mix. After Moore has worked so hard at creating a dark atmosphere I don't see him wasting it to get a laugh.

As for finding earth, I think Moore is more creative than that when it comes to finding a completely new direction.

the Fifth Race
November 11th, 2005, 06:38 AM
As for finding earth, I think Moore is more creative than that when it comes to finding a completely new direction.


Where do you think the series might go Darth?...I am interested in any opinion you might have my friend!.

Darth Buddha
November 11th, 2005, 07:01 AM
... near term, not earth.

For one, they might get to the point that the Colonials are no longer being so obviously played by the Cylons. Having every move they make SERVE the Cylon plan rather than stymie it is getting a bit stale. Perhaps Galactica was all they wanted, and the appearance of Pegasus will throw all their plans into disarray? Perhaps TWO Battlestars will actually put them in a position to strike out independently? For once, the Galactica could be a step ahead instead of two steps behind?

Maybe Baltar's descent into the role of WILLING betrayer rather than the pathetic dupe he was in the miniseries will accellerate? I for one am getting tired of his Hamlet act. Too much for too long. He's got to get off the fence.

Perhaps we'll get to see some more of the TOS characters "re-imagined"?

I was thinking that Croft, from "Gun on Ice Planet Zero," would make an interesting addition if they kill off a couple more of their current characters (and they really need to in order to keep it "gritty")... but more along the lines of the character from the Glenn Larson novel (which I'm sure was ghost written by somebody other than Larson, who is pretty much a hack). A condemned Colonial Officer who redeems himself while saving the fleet (not necessarily from a Pulsar weapon) would be an interesting addition.

But my greatest anticipation is for more of the "Lords of Kobol" backstory. The Cylons clearly know a lot about the tale, so how to bring the Colonials up to date? Could Moore do as good a job with a re-invented Count Iblis as he has with his re-invented Battlestar Pegasus and Cain? If he could, then it might even be a season ending cliffhanger to top the midseason cliffhanger we are waiting out now!

Let me play the flip side of long term. If they get five seasons and decide that #5 is it before they start? I see your "finding earth" thread gettting a lot more attractive! The only reason I don't see it sooner rather than later is that it limits his options afterwards. Can you DO a redo of Iblis after they find earth? Could you DO a Baltar fully in the Cylon camp after they find earth? It'd be tough. But if you KNOW you are closing out the series, then why not go for a blowout with all sorts of unexpected story threads coming together a la Deepspace 9, another Moore project? Moore ended the battle between the Dominion and the Federation, between the Pagh Wraith and the Prophets, between Bashir and Section 31, and a variety of other major hanging issues in a whirlwind in the second half of the last season. I could see a man like that ending up BSG75 with them finding earth quite easily.

So I guess I see the guy as too creative to paint himself into a corner at this juncture, more than seeing finding earth as a nadir of creativity... I should have worded my earlier post better.

MASON
November 11th, 2005, 07:54 AM
Comedic and BSG? Those two don't mix. After Moore has worked so hard at creating a dark atmosphere I don't see him wasting it to get a laugh.

As for finding earth, I think Moore is more creative than that when it comes to finding a completely new direction.
I'm fond of the idea that the RTF will get wise to the Cylons following them to Earth and then stop running, turn, and go on the offensive until they can be sure they've crippled the Cylons and are sure that they can't be followed to earth. However, with complications like Boomer and Six aboard the fleet, I think we might see several characters being marooned, and they'll have to purge the RTF of Cylon agents before they can start deciphering the Kobolian star map to earth. So RDM's going to have to reveal all the 12 Cylon models before Adama makes an all out run for earth.

the Fifth Race
November 11th, 2005, 08:36 AM
... near term, not earth.

For one, they might get to the point that the Colonials are no longer being so obviously played by the Cylons. Having every move they make SERVE the Cylon plan rather than stymie it is getting a bit stale. Perhaps Galactica was all they wanted, and the appearance of Pegasus will throw all their plans into disarray? Perhaps TWO Battlestars will actually put them in a position to strike out independently? For once, the Galactica could be a step ahead instead of two steps behind?

Maybe Baltar's descent into the role of WILLING betrayer rather than the pathetic dupe he was in the miniseries will accellerate? I for one am getting tired of his Hamlet act. Too much for too long. He's got to get off the fence.

Perhaps we'll get to see some more of the TOS characters "re-imagined"?

I was thinking that Croft, from "Gun on Ice Planet Zero," would make an interesting addition if they kill off a couple more of their current characters (and they really need to in order to keep it "gritty")... but more along the lines of the character from the Glenn Larson novel (which I'm sure was ghost written by somebody other than Larson, who is pretty much a hack). A condemned Colonial Officer who redeems himself while saving the fleet (not necessarily from a Pulsar weapon) would be an interesting addition.

But my greatest anticipation is for more of the "Lords of Kobol" backstory. The Cylons clearly know a lot about the tale, so how to bring the Colonials up to date? Could Moore do as good a job with a re-invented Count Iblis as he has with his re-invented Battlestar Pegasus and Cain? If he could, then it might even be a season ending cliffhanger to top the midseason cliffhanger we are waiting out now!

Let me play the flip side of long term. If they get five seasons and decide that #5 is it before they start? I see your "finding earth" thread gettting a lot more attractive! The only reason I don't see it sooner rather than later is that it limits his options afterwards. Can you DO a redo of Iblis after they find earth? Could you DO a Baltar fully in the Cylon camp after they find earth? It'd be tough. But if you KNOW you are closing out the series, then why not go for a blowout with all sorts of unexpected story threads coming together a la Deepspace 9, another Moore project? Moore ended the battle between the Dominion and the Federation, between the Pagh Wraith and the Prophets, between Bashir and Section 31, and a variety of other major hanging issues in a whirlwind in the second half of the last season. I could see a man like that ending up BSG75 with them finding earth quite easily.

So I guess I see the guy as too creative to paint himself into a corner at this juncture, more than seeing finding earth as a nadir of creativity... I should have worded my earlier post better.


Ask and you shall recieve...great post as usual Darth!...thanx for taking the time to explain your theory on where the story might go. I like alot of what you suggest here.

I to, want to see more on a back story about the "Lords of Kobol".

I am enjoying season II alot more than season I.

Lt.Col. Moore (Icarus)
November 11th, 2005, 09:27 AM
C'mon people what was so wrong about Galctica 1980, it wasn't all that bad. I think if they'll get to Earth twice in the series, once for the Terra thing and the second time for the real Earth. I have long felt that if they do come by Earth in the present day, they would have absolutely no choice but to either stay in orbit behind the moon or time travel to a point in the future where we would have technology to take the Cylons. But when they get there they find out we were wiped out by our own Cylons, therefore making that one thing BS stands for history repeating itself.

MASON
November 11th, 2005, 09:30 AM
Perhaps we'll get to see some more of the TOS characters "re-imagined"?

I was thinking that Croft, from "Gun on Ice Planet Zero," would make an interesting addition if they kill off a couple more of their current characters (and they really need to in order to keep it "gritty")... but more along the lines of the character from the Glenn Larson novel (which I'm sure was ghost written by somebody other than Larson, who is pretty much a hack). A condemned Colonial Officer who redeems himself while saving the fleet (not necessarily from a Pulsar weapon) would be an interesting addition.
Croft (http://battlestarwiki.org/index.php?title=Croft) sounds like an interesting character, and with his background, I'm surprised Zarek isn't supposed to represent him. Croft seems, from what I've read, like a cross between Helo and Zarek. And with the Pegasus crew attached to the show, now, perhaps a Croft will rise out of their ranks. From the connotations of Black Market and The Captain's Hand, it sounds like several of the Pegasus crew could be up for dishonourable discharge.

Lt.Col. Moore (Icarus)
November 11th, 2005, 09:45 AM
Croft (http://battlestarwiki.org/index.php?title=Croft) sounds like an interesting character, and with his background, I'm surprised Zarek isn't supposed to represent him. Croft seems, from what I've read, like a cross between Helo and Zarek. And with the Pegasus crew attached to the show, now, perhaps a Croft will rise out of their ranks. From the connotations of Black Market and The Captain's Hand, it sounds like several of the Pegasus crew could be up for dishonourable discharge.

Thats brings in a possibility for a remake of that episode.

Darth Buddha
November 12th, 2005, 07:36 AM
...great post as usual Darth!...thanx for taking the time to explain your theory on where the story might go. I like alot of what you suggest here.
The credit goes to your questions: great threads arise from great questions, as I've been learning from trying to start my own forum. I honestly hadn't THOUGHT about where it would go, but as soon as you put up the issue of earth, I thought about all the things that couldn't happen once they find earth.

Good questions lead to more good questions, to paraphrase Frank Herbert.


C'mon people what was so wrong about Galctica 1980, it wasn't all that bad.
Oh yes it was that bad!


I think if they'll get to Earth twice in the series, once for the Terra thing and the second time for the real Earth. I have long felt that if they do come by Earth in the present day, they would have absolutely no choice but to either stay in orbit behind the moon or time travel to a point in the future where we would have technology to take the Cylons. But when they get there they find out we were wiped out by our own Cylons, therefore making that one thing BS stands for history repeating itself.
Adding time travel to the capabilities of the Galactica crew was one of the worst abuses of a science fiction concept I'd ever seen, and a massive slap in the face to cohesiveness and continuity. If they had time travel and could use it that easily, there were many instances before where they would have been able to use it as well (Gun on Ice Planet Zero for one, but I'll leave it to the reader to assemble their own list).

Worse, if the colonials have it and the Cylons have become far more advanced than they are during their exodus, then why don't the Cylons use time travel to wipe out humanity earlier, perhaps even on Kobol itself? This is yet another example of how Galactica 1980 was a throwaway show more along the lines of Sidd & Marty Kroft Saturday morning variety program.


Croft (http://battlestarwiki.org/index.php?title=Croft) sounds like an interesting character, and with his background, I'm surprised Zarek isn't supposed to represent him. Croft seems, from what I've read, like a cross between Helo and Zarek. And with the Pegasus crew attached to the show, now, perhaps a Croft will rise out of their ranks. From the connotations of Black Market and The Captain's Hand, it sounds like several of the Pegasus crew could be up for dishonourable discharge.
That's capital thinking... I hadn't considered just how rich a character pool the Pegasus could represent. I DID notice Sebastian Spence (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0817819/) as one of the Pegasus pilots, and given his lead role in First Wave (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0160277/) I suspect that he's there for use in a major supporting role down the road. I sincerely hope they don't mine the First Wave talent pool too much further, while I didn't mind Rob LaBelle (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0005588/) as Crazy Eddie, I wouldn't want to see former adult star Traci Lords (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0005588/) on Galactica anytime soon. Unless of course they want to revisit the character of Cassiopea with more grittiness than Laurette Spang (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0816783/) brought to the role (I kid, I kid)!


Thats brings in a possibility for a remake of that episode.
Nah, they've already done a group of prisoners on an "ice planet" to get water for the Galactica, even though it happened off screen, so I think a literal "Gun on Ice Planet Zero" remake is a bust. Now if the Cylons start using a pulsar weapon, maybe, but given the realism of BSG75, and the fact that no planet bound weapon is going to be able to be much of a threat to a fleet as clearly mobile as the colonials are, it's just hard to see.

Lt.Col. Moore (Icarus)
November 12th, 2005, 08:37 AM
Adding time travel to the capabilities of the Galactica crew was one of the worst abuses of a science fiction concept I'd ever seen, and a massive slap in the face to cohesiveness and continuity. If they had time travel and could use it that easily, there were many instances before where they would have been able to use it as well (Gun on Ice Planet Zero for one, but I'll leave it to the reader to assemble their own list).

Worse, if the colonials have it and the Cylons have become far more advanced than they are during their exodus, then why don't the Cylons use time travel to wipe out humanity earlier, perhaps even on Kobol itself? This is yet another example of how Galactica 1980 was a throwaway show more along the lines of Sidd & Marty Kroft Saturday morning variety program.

Well, they have smart scientists so why couldn't they create time travel, and just because the Cylons could if they were clever enough, create it. But remember in G1980 they had humanoid Cylons so they were advanced enough. What about this if the Cylons became human than why would they loose some of their own people, when the colonials can screw up and they all die. The Cylons win. If you look at it like that.

Darth Buddha
November 12th, 2005, 12:33 PM
Well, they have smart scientists so why couldn't they create time travel, and just because the Cylons could if they were clever enough, create it. But remember in G1980 they had humanoid Cylons so they were advanced enough. What about this if the Cylons became human than why would they loose some of their own people, when the colonials can screw up and they all die. The Cylons win. If you look at it like that.
That's not my point... either time travel was beyond the Galactica's capabilities or it would have been used to solve their BIG problems, like the attack on the Colonies. If you can use time travel without causality loops and other issues (as they apparently COULD) then the whole premise of Galactica FROM THE GET-GO is shot to hell. See what I'm saying? It's like going through all the drama to destroy the Death Star, only to find out in the next film that the Rebels had a weapon that could vaporize the Death Star without any trouble at all: the story that has gone before doesn't make any sense.

If you can do time travel like that, go back and defeat the Cylons before they were even created. End of show.

Lt.Col. Moore (Icarus)
November 12th, 2005, 01:22 PM
Okay, that makes sense. But also if you look at humanity we've discovered many things by accident, I may be saying a pitch of an episode or something so forgive me. If you look at let's say the A-Bomb we had no idea what it would do. Now, let's say we discover time travel but you only have one chance to go. Now, this is where I agree with you, which one has the better outcome. One, time travel to the future of Earth or Two, time travel to the past and eliminate the Cylons. I would probably choose two because that will emit the defeat the Cylons and the future salvation of the Colonies. Hence the end of show, there would be NO point in traveling to Earth's future if the colonies weren't destroyed, if that makes sense, right?

MASON
November 12th, 2005, 08:20 PM
One, time travel to the future of Earth or Two, time travel to the past and eliminate the Cylons. I would probably choose two because that will emit the defeat the Cylons and the future salvation of the Colonies. Hence the end of show, there would be NO point in traveling to Earth's future if the colonies weren't destroyed, if that makes sense, right?
So, we're putting the Colonial Fleet in the role of the Borg, in First Contact (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0117731/), which Ronald D. Moore (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0601822/) happened to pen. I have a feeling that he doesn't particularly like revisiting what's already been done, and a self-homage seems far too conceited for RDM, anyway.

[EDIT] And while we're revisiting Trek, Michelle Forbes (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000405/) having made an appearance as Cain (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000978/), why not have Alice Krige (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000481/) play another Cylon agent? Honestly, no sarcasm, I think she could pull it off, she was pretty good in Children of Dune.

Darth Buddha
November 13th, 2005, 07:22 AM
Okay, that makes sense. But also if you look at humanity we've discovered many things by accident, I may be saying a pitch of an episode or something so forgive me. If you look at let's say the A-Bomb we had no idea what it would do.
You need to do some serious history refreshing, lad. First, it wasn't discovered by accident, it was discovered as the result of the largest single public expenditure on a project EVER to that date. Second, they knew almost exactly what it would "do" in terms of releasing energy, what they DIDN'T know was how hot did something have to get before it would ignite the atmosphere and burn the planet to a cinder (fans of the "Planet of the Apes" movies might remember the end of "Return to the Planet of the Apes"). Saccharin? Now that was discovered by accident. A-bombs on up? No way in hell.


Now, let's say we discover time travel but you only have one chance to go.
Why? Why would there be such a silly limitation outside of a children's Saturday morning program? What technology is one shot and then you never get another chance? It's a silly limitation: when you have to start making up silly limitations and hand waving, you know you've got a rather weak plot idea.


Now, this is where I agree with you, which one has the better outcome. One, time travel to the future of Earth or Two, time travel to the past and eliminate the Cylons. I would probably choose two because that will emit the defeat the Cylons and the future salvation of the Colonies. Hence the end of show, there would be NO point in traveling to Earth's future if the colonies weren't destroyed, if that makes sense, right?
Right. Assuming of course that when you go back in time and change history the Colonies even exist when you get back... if causality follows THROUGH time travel, the moment you changed history you'd disappear like a soap bubble. If it doesn't, then you could come back to a Colonial Third Reich or worse. Treating time travel intelligently is almost never done.

It's also not very dramatic: PING! Travel back in time and fix everything. PING! Travel back and everything is hunky dory. How boring is that? Why should I watch such a lame plot? Why should I CARE about what happens if they can always "go back in time" and fix things?

Bottom line is, time travel as a plot device should be rare, difficult AND OR only possible through accident. It should be a problem in and of itself, not a solution to a problem. As soon as you've got time travel along the lines of what you are describing you end up with the basis for nothing short of the abysmal "Temporal Cold War" that bombed big time on Star Trek: Enterprise. The humans change history, the Cylons change history, back and forth, in a conflict so completely without rules that any viewer can follow that it all becomes completely and utterly uninteresting.

If you back away from the fandom "Gee, wouldn't it be cool if Earth had a fleet of battlecruisers to destroy the Ori in one big battle?" or "Gee, wouldn't it be cool if they find Earth and then use time travel to change Earth's history so that Earth can kick the Cylon's butts or travel to the future where Earth will be a technologically advanced safe haven?" you might see some other questions. "Gee, would this story be worth watching?" "Gee, would this be exciting or dramatic?" "Gee, would there be much point to the program after you introduce that kind of technology?"

A lot of fanfic bombs because they can't understand that once the romance is consummated, once one side develops the overwhelming superior technology or force, once you've violated a premise that makes the hereos STRUGGLE, the lovers NOT QUITE GET TOGETHER, the enemy NOT QUITE BE DEFEATED, you've ended the story. Do so with a technology like time travel required at the start of the story, and the story is "over" in terms of drama and interest in the very first scene.

So accidental time travel where you have to be sure you DON'T change history? That's cool. Intentional time travel where you have to go back and stop somebody ELSE who WANTS to change history and at the same time not undo your own history? That's O.K. Time travel where you can go back and change history to your own liking and get away with it? BORING!

madk99
November 13th, 2005, 10:35 AM
Right. Assuming of course that when you go back in time and change history the Colonies even exist when you get back... if causality follows THROUGH time travel, the moment you changed history you'd disappear like a soap bubble. If it doesn't, then you could come back to a Colonial Third Reich or worse. Treating time travel intelligently is almost never done.

One exception is "The End of Eternity" by none other than Isaac Asimov. It deals with time travel in a highly intersting and quite clever way. I

For some reason this book seems to have been overlooked by most SF readers. It's not part of the 'robots' or the 'foundation' so I think many people have not connected with it. But it is most definately worth it. :)

Darth Buddha
November 14th, 2005, 09:26 AM
One exception is "The End of Eternity" by none other than Isaac Asimov. It deals with time travel in a highly intersting and quite clever way.

For some reason this book seems to have been overlooked by most SF readers. It's not part of the 'robots' or the 'foundation' so I think many people have not connected with it. But it is most definately worth it. :)
I missed that one, but if it is a good take on time travel, it will certainly be worth checking out. Thanks for the lead!


[EDIT] And while we're revisiting Trek, Michelle Forbes (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000405/) having made an appearance as Cain (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000978/), why not have Alice Krige (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000481/) play another Cylon agent? Honestly, no sarcasm, I think she could pull it off, she was pretty good in Children of Dune.
I'll watch Alice Krige in just about anything. She seems a little old for a Cylon, but it could indeed work. Or perhaps Countess Iblis? Starbuck beomes a woman, Cain becomes a woman, so why not Iblis?

apollo123
November 14th, 2005, 04:44 PM
My theory (although kind of a knock off of Asimov's Foundation series):

They've already found Earth. It could be Kobol, or Caprica, or some other planet that they already know about. So far, they've been vague (I think?) about the Colonists' solar system. I think it'll turn out to be exactly like our solar system and that Earth has been right under their noses the entire time.

Caprice
November 14th, 2005, 04:48 PM
They'll find Earth - it will have been nuked - by it's own weapons, not by the Cylons.

I'd find that somewhat humorous, albeit dark and dreary...

MASON
November 14th, 2005, 08:50 PM
I'll watch Alice Krige in just about anything. She seems a little old for a Cylon, but it could indeed work. Or perhaps Countess Iblis? Starbuck beomes a woman, Cain becomes a woman, so why not Iblis?
I just borrowed BSG TOS from a friend tonight, so I've still to figure out who Count Iblis is, but I like the idea that Krige could be more than your average Cylon.

Darth Buddha
November 15th, 2005, 08:03 AM
Count Iblis is the Devil, literally, with the same root etymology as diabolical.. and it is one of the weirder TOS story arcs. Only the charm of Patrck MacNee made it even halfway believable.

madk99
November 15th, 2005, 10:51 AM
I'll watch Alice Krige in just about anything. She seems a little old for a Cylon, but it could indeed work. Or perhaps Countess Iblis? Starbuck beomes a woman, Cain becomes a woman, so why not Iblis?
I agree. After all
COUNT IBLIS = BIONIC SLUT ;)

(Here we go again!!)

Darth Buddha
November 15th, 2005, 05:41 PM
COUNT IBLIS = BIONIC SLUT ;)
Good grief!http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b162/Darth_Buddha/icon_romshocked.gif

MASON
November 16th, 2005, 05:58 AM
I agree. After all
COUNT IBLIS = BIONIC SLUT ;)

(Here we go again!!)
ROFLMAO :D

MASON
November 16th, 2005, 07:32 AM
Count Iblis is the Devil, literally, with the same root etymology as diabolical.. and it is one of the weirder TOS story arcs. Only the charm of Patrck MacNee made it even halfway believable.
Hey, Darth, how come you never mentioned Iblis in our little rant on the Cylon Devil in the Pegasus thread? ;)

Very interesting description in the Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iblis):


"[S]he tempts humans through [her] whisper (waswas, "[s]he whispered") of sinful ideas in their head and false suggestion (haiif). In the end, it is believed, he will be cast into Jahannam (Hell in Islam) along with those who give into his temptation of sinful ideas and disobeyed God's true message to mankind (Islam), while those who successfully try to follow a righteous path will be rewarded with the pleasures of Jannah (Paradise or Heaven in Islam)."

I know this refers back to the Six thread, but some were surmising that Six was God, but with the aforementioned character description of Iblis, I find it highly unlikely.

the Fifth Race
November 17th, 2005, 05:31 AM
Count Iblis is the Devil, literally, with the same root etymology as diabolical.. and it is one of the weirder TOS story arcs. Only the charm of Patrck MacNee made it even halfway believable.


In the original BSG there were alot of Devil references and my favorite cylons were named Satan, Lucifer and best one was shiny red cylon Beelzebub. :D

Starbase
November 29th, 2005, 10:46 AM
In the original BSG there were alot of Devil references and my favorite cylons were named Satan, Lucifer and best one was shiny red cylon Beelzebub. :D

LOL Beelzebub!...I remember the red cylon and the gold cylon. They sure did try to emulate evil human folklore.

BubblingOverWithIdeas
November 29th, 2005, 12:41 PM
Baltar's Number Six is Countess Iblis, I think.

the Fifth Race
December 2nd, 2005, 05:59 AM
Baltar's Number Six is Countess Iblis, I think.


I wonder if the demonic mythical characters of Earth (Lucifer, Satan, Beelzebub, Iblis, Sucubus...etc...) are also in part of BSG's biblical past. Makes you wonder and logically deduce that we are connected with the people of BSG.

Starbase
December 12th, 2005, 06:33 AM
I wonder if the demonic mythical characters of Earth (Lucifer, Satan, Beelzebub, Iblis, Sucubus...etc...) are also in part of BSG's biblical past. Makes you wonder and logically deduce that we are connected with the people of BSG.


Makes me wonder whats up with Earth mythological and biblical villains being in the in BSG universe?. Seems like Earth and the BSG people do have past history.

Blitz
December 14th, 2005, 03:39 AM
Ok...no idea what you lot are on about..never saw the original...Only young :) BUT...If the RTF do find Earth....I'd like to see Earth as advanced...but not actually helpfull.....actually the complete opposite.

RTF arrive, Earth sais go away...we dont want you or your problems....

I don't know why but it would be a big kick in their face. like 'Oh you never came look for us until you needed us...**** off!'

thoughts

the Fifth Race
December 14th, 2005, 07:08 AM
Ok...no idea what you lot are on about..never saw the original...Only young :) BUT...If the RTF do find Earth....I'd like to see Earth as advanced...but not actually helpfull.....actually the complete opposite.

RTF arrive, Earth sais go away...we dont want you or your problems....

I don't know why but it would be a big kick in their face. like 'Oh you never came look for us until you needed us...**** off!'

thoughts


Well that would'nt be very 'Earth like' to say go away, maybe if they landed in China, North Korea or some other communist county they would get the cold shoulder :o

I too, would want to see an advanced Earth if they ever find it. IMHO it would make for a much better and more interesting storyline. The BSG crew would have a place to settle and a very good allie, although I'm not sure how happy we would be if the Cylons are still hot on there tails when they do make into our galaxy.

The stroyline is wide open right now, they could literally go in so many different directions with a 'found Earth' story arc.

Blitz
December 14th, 2005, 08:07 AM
Thats what I mean...Its not what you think - its complete opposite. They could be turned away for bringing their problems....

were always shown in all Tv to be such goody 2shoes its so cliche and gag wrenching its annoying, were not good....I'd like to see Earth be kinda dark and naughty....theres nothing saying some Earthly people wouldnt help us....even add to the RTF, but not all of Earth - sumert new and unexpected :D

the Fifth Race
December 16th, 2005, 06:01 AM
Thats what I mean...Its not what you think - its complete opposite. They could be turned away for bringing their problems....

were always shown in all Tv to be such goody 2shoes its so cliche and gag wrenching its annoying, were not good....I'd like to see Earth be kinda dark and naughty....theres nothing saying some Earthly people wouldnt help us....even add to the RTF, but not all of Earth - sumert new and unexpected :D


The only problem I see with us not accepting or welcoming the BSG survivors is that they are exactly like us (humanoid) and us exactly like them. Maybe if we some 4 headed, green skinned, horned alien race wanting sanctuary we might tell them thanx but no thanx. The only way I can see them turning the BSG people away is if some totalitarian dictatorship is ruling Earth.

Blitz
December 16th, 2005, 07:02 AM
Every country has the same species....we still go to war over stupid things like religion and bull**** like that. Who's not to say the Earth the RTF find isnt MAJOR one god religious, or dictatorship.

LoneStar1836
December 16th, 2005, 07:07 PM
The only way I can see them turning the BSG people away is if some totalitarian dictatorship is ruling Earth.I wouldn’t even see one of those turning them away. If the level of Earth technology was below that of the Colonials, I wouldn’t see anyone turning them away, especially some dictator who has everything to gain if they can come into possession of BSG technology.

Only the arrogant Tollans would tell the Colonials to take a hike. :D

skull24
December 16th, 2005, 07:10 PM
What about this idea? The Cylons are from the furture and thats why they always seems to be a step ahead.

Back to the subject at hand. If they find the Earth. I feel that the Earth will be advance enough. To defend them sevles from the Cylons and other theaths. We all live on the planet Earth and yes we can be idots at times. But if the BSG came to Earth out of the blue we would band togetter to defend our planet. Atleast I hope so.

the fifth man
December 18th, 2005, 05:52 PM
Personally, I hope it's a long quest to find Earth. I mean, so much can happen along the way. The possibilities for storylines are endless. The BSG finds Earth, we know the Cylons will follow.

phoenixangell
December 19th, 2005, 06:43 PM
It does seem as if the 12 colonies, as is known in BSG, are not that far from Kobol, in relative galactic or inter-galactic terms. Figure that it only took months to get there [to Kobol from the colonies, per BSG story timeline]. However, while on Kobol and "standing on the map," it was from Earth's perspective. (But, for this post, we will assume that (1) Kobol is the birthplace of mankind and (2) Kobol is not Earth. I can explore alterations of those later.)

This means one of two things: (1) that before the Galleon left Kobol with the 12 tribes, at least one traveler had been to Earth and back, or (2) that an agreement was made between the 12 tribes and the 13th that they would again meet on Kobol after they found their new homes to make a map so that they may one day find their brothers someday.

While standing on the map, Earth seemed to be significantly further from Kobol than the 12 colonies were. There are most likely limitations to FTL for distance. They were still close enough at Kobol to be within that distance with the Starbuck jump to Caprica, and then back again. Earth seemed to be outside of whatever range with the comments made, and seemingly most likely significantly outside of that range as no one made the move to just jump to the area that the map had shown.

The key to unlocking that map was the Arrow of Apollo, which was on Caprica. This also means that when the map was created, not only would Earth have been known as to where the 13th tribe was to settle, but the 12 planets for each of the colonies would have been known. It is possible that with Kobol having been traveling in space before the exodus that the sites of the 12 colonies have been known before the Galleon left.

However, Earth was most likely too far to know where the 13th would settle before they left Kobol, thus the location would be unknown until someone returned to Kobol from Earth. Was Earth discovered before or after the Galleon left?

Now, did the 13th tribe leave Kobol first, or did they leave last? And, what was the timing with the conflict on Kobol? Was the 13th tribe one that worshipped the one god who attempted to rise above the others, or were they polytheistic as well?

If Earth was settled by people from Kobol, there would likely have been a mix of monotheistic and polytheistic people, as Earth is mixed in beliefs. At the current time, we have three major religions on Earth (Christianity, Islam, and Judiasm) that are monotheistic. However, 2000 years ago, a major change occurred from polytheism to monotheism. Given the the polytheistic tendancies of 2000 years ago and prior, I would say that the 13th tribe that settled Earth were mainly polytheistic, but there was a monotheistic segment that was tolerated as they sought peace, as well. The 13th tribe could have been one to better accept the "innocents" of the war on Kobol who did not believe as they did. (Better religious tolerance, which would be interesting with our own history of religious wars, persecution, etc.)

If the fleet does make it to Earth, how will they be accepted? How will their religious beliefs clash with ours? How will the Cylon's believe clash with ours?

Did the Cylons already find Earth? Maybe the Cylon's discovered Earth and actually started the monotheistic movement, which would place the timeline 2000 years or so ago. Maybe the Cylons are looking to find how to make a human-Cylon hybrid because they are actually planning an "immaculate conception" and just need the technical know-how to do so, but have the child be Cylon, thus leading toward a major monotheistic movement toward their one true god on Earth.

Did the Cylons find Kobol before the Colonials, or did they find Kobol after, with one of the Cylons in the fleet getting information to a base star before the raptors were sent for exploration? If they found it before the Colonials, was it on Kobol where they found their religion, or did they find religion before turning on the humans in the first place?

If they found Kobol first, they may have already deciphered the location of Earth. If not, then they are using the Galactica to find Earth.

the Fifth Race
December 20th, 2005, 05:52 AM
What about this idea? The Cylons are from the furture and thats why they always seems to be a step ahead.

Back to the subject at hand. If they find the Earth. I feel that the Earth will be advance enough. To defend them sevles from the Cylons and other theaths. We all live on the planet Earth and yes we can be idots at times. But if the BSG came to Earth out of the blue we would band togetter to defend our planet. Atleast I hope so.


Interesting concept on the Cylons being from the future, although I doubt seriously if the writers will delve into time travel, but I could be wrong.

I agree with you skull, I believe Earth, whether advanced or not would try and help the BSG refugees whether its to help settle them or to defend against those pesky Cylons.

Starbase
December 25th, 2005, 06:14 AM
Its just human nature that we want to help people in distress, I can see if a big contigent of green skinned, horned aliens showed up looking for a place to settle and protection from a very powerful enemy, we then might say take a hike :S But if a bunch of humanoids that could very well be from Earth originally showed up (no matter the circumstances) we would offer as much help as humanly possible!.

Dutch_Razor
December 26th, 2005, 11:41 AM
Well, if they find earth around season (6?) maybe, just maybe they'll meet the Stargate universe...ok...that's completely unrealistic, but it would be cool...Daedalus class ships beating up on Cylon Basestars :p

Ooh that'd be fun for a crossover:

*BSG jumps into the solar system*
*Daedalus: This is USS Daedalus calling unidentified ship, identify yourselves*

And then Adama, Apollo and Starbuck go on board the Daedalus and they see Hermoid sitting there ! lol :p

the Fifth Race
December 27th, 2005, 04:41 AM
Ooh that'd be fun for a crossover:

*BSG jumps into the solar system*
*Daedalus: This is USS Daedalus calling unidentified ship, identify yourselves*

And then Adama, Apollo and Starbuck go on board the Daedalus and they see Hermoid sitting there ! lol :p

A crossover of BSG finding Earth with the SGC and crew there in the current timeline would be over the top!. Personally I would love it, but we will never see that :D ;)

Indum'kra
December 28th, 2005, 04:51 AM
They arrive and find Earth is gone, replaced by an interstellar bypass. The last human is some bloke in his pyjamas and a woman travelling on a ship with an improbability drive, and it turns out the 13th tribe was the useless third of the population, calling their home world Golgafrinchan.

MASON
December 28th, 2005, 08:09 AM
They arrive and find Earth is gone, replaced by an interstellar bypass. The last human is some bloke in his pyjamas and a woman travelling on a ship with an improbability drive, and it turns out the 13th tribe was the useless third of the population, calling their home world Golgafrinchan.
And the Cylon God just turns out to be a dope who forgot to pack his towel. :p

jimmus
December 29th, 2005, 12:17 PM
I can't see the Cylons ever making peace, if they follow the same kind of history that we did they have a lot to learn. As for wheather Earth is advanced enough to defeat the Cylons is an interesting point. Hopefully the thirteenth colony has evolved along similar lines to the other twelve, and actually may be more advanced due to being the original homeworld.
One would hope we have advanced far enough not to have destroyed ourselves.

maxpublic
December 31st, 2005, 03:30 AM
There are several indications within the series that the human race in the BSG universe originated on Earth:

- during the mini or first season, there's a conversation which states that twelve of the tribes settled the Colonies, while the 13th decided to *return* to Earth. That could be a slip of the writers pen, but I very much doubt it.

- how the hell would the colonists know about Earth? They've never been there. And yet Earth is mentioned repeatedly, and (again) we know that the 13th tribe decided to go there instead of search for a new home. The only rational explanation is that the people of Kobol *already knew* where Earth was because they orginally came from there. After they settled the Colonies they either lost the location of Earth or (more likely) deliberately expunged the knowledge for reasons unknown.

- Athena's Tomb on Kobol clearly outlines Earth's location. Also note that the Twelve Colonies are named after constellations *specifically seen from Earth, and only Earth*. All twelve constellations are precisely outlined as if you were standing on Earth and nowhere else. Kara belabors the point for viewers who don't quite catch on, and the President drives the point home by naming the constellations and stating that those were the "original names" of the Twelve Colonies.

The only explanation for all of this is that the people of Kobol already knew about Earth, and knew it's location. The 13th tribe didn't "discover" Earth; they went back to Earth. There was no slip of the pen - it was deliberate.

The question that remains is: why did humanity leave Earth for Kobol to begin with? And why did they leave Kobol, when it was clearly habitable? Tigh and others tell us that the universe is an incredibly harsh place, almost entirely unsuited for life. That means that planets like Earth, Kobol and the Colonies must be very few and very far apart. So why abandon perfectly good worlds in search of new ones? And note that the *completely* abandoned Kobol; nobody stayed behind. It follows that they did the same thing where Earth was concerned as well.

I have a theory, and it involves a statement that they go to great lengths to repeat (again and again and again...) in the series: "all this has happened before, and all of it will happen again". Essentially both the colonists and the cylons believe that history repeats itself, and that it has done so in the past. So here's an idea:

- civilization on Earth advances to the point where humans create self-aware mechanicals (cylons). Being human, the Earthers enslave their mechanicals because, well, the human race is essentially a bunch of *******s. Any race that claims that others of its own kind are inferior based on trivialities like *skin color* isn't going to accept a machine intelligence as an equal, or even as self-aware. Our colonists certainly maintain this viewpoint, with a few notable exceptions.

- the cylons of Earth decide they don't like being enslaved, so the Earthers decide to commit genocide against their mechanical children. They lose and are wiped out. Cylons win - yay! Unfortunately (BSG essentially being a Greek tragedy set in a scifi background) they're consumed with guilt over the wholesale slaughter of their 'parents' and can't take living amidst the constant reminder of their crime. So they search for a new world and find Kobol, which they relocate to, abandoning Earth.

- relocation proves to be insufficient to wipe away the blood debt, so our first-round cylons decide to atone for their crimes by recreating the human race. They eventually succeed, and for a time humans and cylons live in peaceful coexistence on Kobol. Alas, in Greek tragedies nothing good can ever last, and somehow these new humans learn of what their cylon buddies did to the humans of Earth (they must have, since they know the location of Earth). Being humans, they use this as an excuse to exterminate their own creators (cylons).

- But history repeats itself. The human race finds it impossible to live on Kobol amongst the reminders of what it did to its parents (the cylons) and so the tribes decide to leave their guilt behind and go settle new worlds. One tribe doesn't buy into the whole guilt thing and tells the other 12 to shove it - they're heading back to the homeworld, Earth, to reclaim their lost heritage.

- And everything that has happened before, happens again. The human colonists bury the crimes of their past by simply not recording them, and future generations completely forget the truth of Kobol. All that remains is a bunch of religious hogwash about the 'gods' (cylons; they created the new humans, remember?) and their ancestors living together in bliss. The colonists, unaware that the whole cylon drama was repeated already, themselves build their own version of the cylons. And enslave them. And try to wipe them out when the cylons say "hey, we don't much care for this whole slavery thing". And eventually lose the war to cylons, excepting the ragtag fleet following the Galactica around.

What has happened before will happen again. And again. And again, apparently. After all, what are the cylons trying to do? Create human-cylon hybrids. Apparently in the BSG universe no one ever learns from past mistakes, mainly because people go to such great pains to hide them from their descendents.

Anyway, that's my guess. I'm willing to bet that the 13th tribe failed in some fashion, and when the Galactica gets to Earth what they'll find is a repeat of Kobol: ruins, along with a lot of unburied skeletons. After all, the Earth of the BSG universe isn't OUR Earth.

Max

scifi maniac
January 1st, 2006, 08:47 AM
- relocation proves to be insufficient to wipe away the blood debt, so our first-round cylons decide to atone for their crimes by recreating the human race. They eventually succeed, and for a time humans and cylons live in peaceful coexistence on Kobol. Alas, in Greek tragedies nothing good can ever last, and somehow these new humans learn of what their cylon buddies did to the humans of Earth (they must have, since they know the location of Earth). Being humans, they use this as an excuse to exterminate their own creators (cylons).

Very interesting theory. Fun to read and have had some similar thoughts. I Like the thing about cylons were created by earth humans with the exception they would have wiped out every human. I see more in the thing that they left the "exceptions" alive, relocated them and lived in peace.

I do hope we will be given an explanation when the series ends and that they don't leave us hanging out to dry.

Snork
January 16th, 2006, 10:07 AM
I missed most of the mini-series, so let me get this straight.

I was always under the impression that the 12 colonies were colonised by people FROM Earth, and that Earth was the real home planet.
Now, from what I've read here, Kobol was the real home planet where humans first evolved, then they left and colonised 13 other worlds, the last of which was Earth?
That's much cooler than what I thought.

But what doesn't make any sense is that if the Lords of Kobol left about 2-3000 years ago and colonised Earth, how did they lose their civilisation so quickly? It best matches up if you theorise that the Ancient Greeks were descendants of the Kobol colonists, but what happened to wipe out all that advanced technology so quickly? It just doesn't really make sense.
The only way it could possibly work (and this isn't as awesome sounding as the whole Kobol becomes Greece thing) is if this all takes place in the far future (as opposed to the past) where human civilisation on Earth (as we know it) has already ended. Humans evolve on another planet in a distant galaxy or solar system or whatever (Kobol) and repopulate Earth.

Vyrsace
January 18th, 2006, 09:54 PM
This is a very interesting thread with alot of valid view points, perspectives, and paths that Battlestar Galactica may choose. Will they find Earth at all? Will they find it at the very end? Will it be the beginning of, yet, another storyline?

Personally, I would hate for it to begin a whole new series and then go on and on and on, then at Season 16 we realize that humans and cylons are better off at peace than war (or whatever the hidden message may be). The dramatic factor that makes Battlestar Galactica most apparent is that of hope and hopelessness (if that's even a word). If the storyline continues long after Earth is discovered and the immediate dramas are solved then it will have to be a total change of focus and therefore our focus of what we love about this series will change as well, chances are for the worse.

I agree that there is a chance that the Cylons know of Earth's location/found Earth in that 40 years of silence along side planning the destruction of the twelve colonies and/or the Cylons might already inhabit Earth. I don't think it's fair, though, to say that the Cylons had everything in the bag and they just uncovered every single secret in that 40 years. It just seems to easy, but never know until it happens/doesn't happen right?

I think the best plan of action and the most probable one is that Earth will be found. I know this series doesn't follow its predecessor series (Battlestar Galactica: 1980) but there are some generalized consistancies: characters, worlds, the discovery of Kobol. The older series was very directed to the actual discovery of Earth, if it was not cancelled that is. I think that the next step in the grand scheme is that. I just don't know what is, yet, holding the Galactica and such to find Earth because they alreayd have a map. How long does a FTL jump take if planned correctly? They make it seem instant (or maybe they skip that waiting process?). Maybe the Febuary season finale will reveal this.

If it turns out that Galactica finds Earth I think the civilization will be advanced, but only to the same extent that the twelve colonies have reached, no greater. This would be what would turn the balance for the humans and what would give them true salvation. I can predict that the explanation and the salvation isn't going to be instant. If planned correctly I think we can expect a season or atleast a half a season where the colonial fleet adapts to Earth ways and protocol and explains why they need the help of Earth and why they all should risk everything they have to save them from the cylons. Okay... maybe that would take a whole season, but the writers for Battlestar Galactica like to skip alot of the mushy predictable stuff ;) After of which Earth agrees to help and they either have an epic battle versus the cylons or retake the colonies and the cylons do some last action to save themselves from extinction (which would pribably be the child Boomer and other human females are carrying).

But what if the civilization is advanced and they have their own fleet and their own protocol and their own way of life and everything is just so different? What happens to the colonial fleet? Do they disband and bond with Earth and just relearn everything, military and political alike? I don't think it's possible to convince a few billion people who already have a way of life to just say that they will be becoming part of the colonial fleet, that's a bit too much. Which makes me think that it will stop at Earth and leave these questions in the open so that we want more but don't get it, leaving this series's mark in cinematic history. Maybe.

Thanks everyone for listening, feel free to rip my comments and questions apart, constructively ;)

beale947
January 19th, 2006, 01:56 PM
I hope that when they find earth, it doesn't end up like on the original, just 4 people aways evading the army or FBI all the time, i hope they actually do something. And the thing is how is One Battlestar, going to hold off the entire Cylon fleet. When the Cylons find earth, they are going to throw everything they have at us.

And what about when they find earth, we have powerful spaceships, but we don't have FTL drives, which is why earth ships havn't been found

Dr_Baltar
April 18th, 2006, 07:35 AM
I agree that the journey is often more interesting than the destination.

However...

anyone who knows anything about entertainment (movies, books, TV etc...) knows that there has to be a pay-off, a climax for every plant/foreshadowing or else the audience go nuts and feel short changed.

Therefore two things have to happen in Battlestar Galactica or else it will have failed:

1. The Cylons must be defeated.
2. Galactica must find Earth.

These are the two central premises of the show and everyone knows how crap it is to let something ramble on without a climax (look at the mess the X-Files was left in).

I like the idea of finishing with Galactica in Earth orbit (that leaves it open a bit)

also I like the idea of the Colonials landing on a planet and ending up calling it Earth (that gets everyone out of jail also)

But I do think they will find Earth. But what will it be like? I think there will be a major twist that ties it all in to our history.

warpenginebreach
June 9th, 2006, 03:58 AM
Well, New Caprica in a few scenes sure looks a lot like Vancouver (even has the ScotiaBank building and logo >;')). They even had a Hummer on Caprica!

Anywho, if the prophecy's right (and it's been 100% so far), Rosalind gets the colonials to Earth but dies before she can set foot on the planet. I reckon they'll get to Earth near the end of the show (say, the end of the fifth season).

Alpha17X
June 9th, 2006, 05:05 AM
Reading up on BSG Lore and History, supposedly the 13th tribe did not destroy their technology when they left Kobol. they kept it, so they'ld be considerably more advanced than the colonials.

The original plan for Earh in the original series was that they would be on par with the colonials or slightly more advanced.

Facing cancellation due to massive production costs the network airing the show noted that it made a lot of money so they introduced galactica 1980, who's primary purpose was to cut production costs, no more space battle or.. space.


Anyway the journey doesn't have to end when they find earth.

I mean lets say we were in a bsg like era of technology and a group of 45,000 refugees came in on a small fleet of battered ships and started asking us to let them live here.

We'd definately make them wait in space for a while, we'd most definately board their ships with armed troops, and if we did eventually let them land on earth and not tell them to bugger off, we'd probably keep them in gated refugee communities for a few years, if not the rest of their lives.

I'd personally like to see the galactica run into earth, an advanced earth, long before the series ends, and I want Earth to be full of jerks.

warpenginebreach
June 9th, 2006, 05:13 AM
Alpha, the whole premise is Earth (the one we live on) was populated by people from Kobol. Since we obviously don't have starships, lazer cannons, of FTL drives at present, we obviously lost high technology along the way.

The colonials "hope" Earth has technology and ships to help defend against the cylons. They never said Earth would be more advanced.

warpenginebreach
June 9th, 2006, 05:17 AM
Reading up on BSG Lore and History, supposedly the 13th tribe did not destroy their technology when they left Kobol. they kept it, so they'ld be considerably more advanced than the colonials.



Alpha, the whole premise is Earth (the one we live on) was populated by people from Kobol. Since we obviously don't have starships, lazer cannons, of FTL drives at present, we obviously lost high technology along the way.

The colonials "hope" Earth has technology and ships to help defend against the cylons. They never said Earth would be more advanced.

We sure could arm the Galactica with a few thousand nukes though, eh?

the fifth man
June 9th, 2006, 08:19 PM
Man, if the Colonials reach Earth in "our" present day, boy will they be let down. No way we'd be able to help them defeat the Cylons. If anything, they'd find themselves trying to protect us.

I can almost hear Starbuck's response to our technological state now - "You've got to be fraking kidding me."

Trek_Girl42
June 10th, 2006, 08:57 AM
Man, if the Colonials reach Earth in "our" present day, boy will they be let down. No way we'd be able to help them defeat the Cylons. If anything, they'd find themselves trying to protect us.

I can almost hear Starbuck's response to our technological state now - "You've got to be fraking kidding me."
After we've shot a few of our own nukes at them.:S

Roslin would then march up to the white house and demand explanations. *imagines the look on Bush's face*

Aussie_86
June 10th, 2006, 03:57 PM
I agree that the journey is often more interesting than the destination.

However...

anyone who knows anything about entertainment (movies, books, TV etc...) knows that there has to be a pay-off, a climax for every plant/foreshadowing or else the audience go nuts and feel short changed.

Therefore two things have to happen in Battlestar Galactica or else it will have failed:

1. The Cylons must be defeated.
2. Galactica must find Earth.

These are the two central premises of the show and everyone knows how crap it is to let something ramble on without a climax (look at the mess the X-Files was left in).

I like the idea of finishing with Galactica in Earth orbit (that leaves it open a bit)

also I like the idea of the Colonials landing on a planet and ending up calling it Earth (that gets everyone out of jail also)

But I do think they will find Earth. But what will it be like? I think there will be a major twist that ties it all in to our history.


... or the Colonials all die at the hands of the Cylons... still shows one of the purposes of the show... you have to be worthy of survival. And if the Cylons are acting more 'humane' than the humans, then, with the death of the colonials, this point is shown very well.

mahram
July 1st, 2006, 09:51 AM
I think they will reach earth before the series ends. look at voyager. i wish they did at least 2 seasons with them being back on earth. And looking at the repercussions.

Man, if the Colonials reach Earth in "our" present day, boy will they be let down. No way we'd be able to help them defeat the Cylons. If anything, they'd find themselves trying to protect us.

I can almost hear Starbuck's response to our technological state now - "You've got to be fraking kidding me."

trinity1
July 10th, 2006, 07:46 PM
I think they should blend SG-1 with BSG. They reach earth just in time to help us with some "new technology" to fight the Ori. This way, they arrive in the present, yet it's sort of future. Of corse this will never happen, but it would be cool.

Trek_Girl42
July 10th, 2006, 08:38 PM
I think they should blend SG-1 with BSG. They reach earth just in time to help us with some "new technology" to fight the Ori. This way, they arrive in the present, yet it's sort of future. Of corse this will never happen, but it would be cool.
Uhhh.....no, not really.....as some sort of sci-fi parody maybe. :)

Megatron007
July 11th, 2006, 11:11 PM
Here is what I think would be interesting...

A) They make it to Earth and discover that Earth is the Cylon Homeworld! That would be kind of a shake-up.

--or--

B) The Fleet encounters a Fleet of humans coming in the opposite direction. They exchange greetings, blah, blah... and after talking discover that these are the decendants of the 13th colony who are trying to rejoin the 12 colonies because Earth has been concured by T1000s or similar group of evil cyborgs who are actually chasing them down as well.

dryvern
July 13th, 2006, 07:41 PM
Hi (always a good starter to a forum newbie, heh), anyway to the point:

I always felt that although the story is in the journey, it was a little bad the origional series never actually got to earth (don't mention the spin off - though the final hint in the origional seemed as much a placation as a cop out). But does the story have to end?.........Not here!

I just read the first page here before I got my notepad out & scrawled. Read pages 3 & 4 then decided to post. Here's my scrawl:

Do they ever reach earth?

Here is a script idea, yes i'm full of them - full of script!

Anyways....Let's say they do reach Earth. Now following our history/future & the colonial inestimate of their creation:

Earth is (200 years in the future - don't groan) in conflict with Mars (colony).
X. This enables a Tech level similiar to the colonials (perhaps different weapons) as reached quicker than the revertion from migration (ancient myths on Earth: Gods from the skys). The tech (nuke based) is not too advanced (keeping with Battlestars new reality & done extreemly well - keep similar), more changed in usage & computer tech.

NOW WHY AT WAR?
To beautifully parallel (evolution/life), servitude gained by Earth from robotic form & intelligent evolution from A.I. (parallels Ghost in the shell series idea & colonials) ends up arising in a similiar but more agressive & independant form of intelligent life, now adverse to human control.
Currently not worried to blend in (as new Cylons do with colonials) they have enhanced themselves for pleasure, War, Tech, communication, Etc.

ANSWER:
Two evolving Races are at differences for domination/survival, as past with Colonial/Cylon.

SO ENTER THE COLONIALS & CYLONS:
"God Has Bigger Plans"
The colonials obviously join the similiar tech & form/nature of Earth as the 13th Tribe (minus some believers in the Cylon/Colonial God).

THE END?...NO WAY!
Q1a. Do the old Cylons decide to join Earth's artificial forms to rid the Earth/Colonial alliance?
Q1b. Or do they split up between, the agressors for Cylon glory or the peacefull followers of the one Cylon/Human God?
Q2a. Do the Cylons see a bigger threat, in the new artificial life controlling Mars so withdrawn from mimiking human form, & join Earth/Colonials to fight as one (perhaps under one God, heh)?
Q2b. Will the Cylons survive if Earth/Colonials do not support them?
Q3. Or will the Cylons submit to/join with, the change allowed by the new Artificial life & revel in the chaotic destruction of Earth/Colonials?

THEN:
Of the hybrid/s - human/Cylon, which side will they choose to influence? Cylon - Human - Both?!(will they join them?)

ANSWER:
Factions will split, but whatever, the story continues & the outcomes are astronomical.

Hope this entertains thought (also hope this sends as so close to season 3, I have read the Skydiver Goddess's note that some acesess is disabled - nice site by the way, busy, busy... oh my!)

Guess i'll check back later, oh only 04:30....back to X3 then! Lol

Trek_Girl42
July 13th, 2006, 09:16 PM
I think it would be appropriately ironic for the fleet to sort out their problems, arrive at Earth, and find the people at war amongst themselves (rather then with machines).....

Giantevilhead
July 21st, 2006, 12:47 PM
I don't think earth exists. It's an ancient myth. No one believed it before the Cylons destroyed the 12 colonies. They only believe it now because it gives them hope.

Oreo
July 21st, 2006, 05:47 PM
^ Well the same thing can be said about EVERY religion on Earth, the real Earth. So 5.5+ billion people are wrong?

Plus some have probably believed in it, just not as many.

Giantevilhead
July 21st, 2006, 06:05 PM
The number of people who believe in something has no effect on whether or not it's true. Reality is not contingent upon belief. Everyone who has ever believed or still believes that the earth was flat is wrong. The majority of all religions that have ever existed are all wrong, there's no Zeus, no Thor, no Anu, no Ra, etc., and everyone who believed in them were wrong. Every soldier who believed that their god(s) would protect them from harm but ended up getting killed by the enemy was wrong. Every losing sports team that believed god was going to guide them to victory was wrong. Reality doesn’t care what you believe. If you're right, you're right, if you're wrong, you're wrong. Whether you believe you're right or wrong matters only to yourself and those who believe in you.

Gilgamesh
July 23rd, 2006, 10:15 AM
Ignoring the digression, here are some random thoughts on what Earth could be like.

I've had different scenarios play out in my head, and I haven't really settled on any one thing.

1. Earth in the future. This idea has fanboy appeal. Imagine the Colonial fleet, in a final jump, arriving in the vicinity of Earth/Moon, and viewing a scene like something out of Starship Troopers with hundreds of huge battleships parked at an orbital docking ring circling the Moon. The show could simply end with the arrival scene. We know the surviving Colonials are safe because Earth is more than capable of fending off any Cylon attack. This option is probably too much of an Ex Deus Machina for the writers to consider, unless plans are afoot for a nasty plot twist. Example: The people of the future Earth live under a brutal dictatorship. An attack is ordered against both the Colonial fleet and the pursuing Cylon fleet, assuming all of the strange ships are part of a plot to overthrow Our Leader.

2. Earth in the present. This idea is the least appealing to me, and not just because it smacks of Battlestar 1980. If the Colonials arrive in the present, then clearly we cannot provide safe harbor. The disappointed Colonials might leave and continue their journey—perhaps even with the lie being told to the people, “Sorry, this isn’t Earth. We have to move on.” If the Colonials decide to stay, then we have a Stargate situation, where it becomes increasingly difficult to believe the arrival of a technologically advanced spacefaring people can be kept secret. Either way, with our discovery, we are now open to Cylon attack or exploitation.

3. Earth of thousands of years ago. This idea has many possibilities. Who says a colony will always succeed? The 13th colony could have been a failure, in that all advanced technology was lost long ago, and what the Colonial fleet finds are primitive hunting/gathering tribes. The Colonials decide to settle anyway, and begin to teach the descendents of the lost 13th colony concepts like agriculture. Or, we of present-day Earth could by the descendents of human/Cylon hybrids. :)

hyzmarca
July 24th, 2006, 11:11 PM
Earth in the present. This idea is the least appealing to me, and not just because it smacks of Battlestar 1980. If the Colonials arrive in the present, then clearly we cannot provide safe harbor. The disappointed Colonials might leave and continue their journey—perhaps even with the lie being told to the people, “Sorry, this isn’t Earth. We have to move on.” If the Colonials decide to stay, then we have a Stargate situation, where it becomes increasingly difficult to believe the arrival of a technologically advanced spacefaring people can be kept secret. Either way, with our discovery, we are now open to Cylon attack or exploitation.


They don't need a Stargate situation. In fact, a Stargate situation is the worst direction one could go with it. That's why Galactica 1980 sucked so badly. They don't need to keep the Galactica secret from the people of Earth just so long as they are willing to deal with the political and social repercussions. It can be done. Alien Nation did it best.

Personally, I like the idea of a present day Alien Nation ending far better then the other possibilities. The 'they're our ancestors' ending is corny and cliché. The 'Earth to the Rescue' ending is too deus ex machina, corny, and cliche.

The only problem with be the Cylons. They would certainly be able to destroy the present day Earth. There are many ways to deal with that story line, some are more satisfactory than others. It is not impossible that the Colonials will have made peace with the Cylons by the time they rediscover Earth.
Likewise, it is not impossible for Earth's impressive manufacturing capibilities to be put to work creating ships and weapons based on Colonial technology. During WWII US shipards were churning out five ships per day. Now, imagine if those five ships per day are all battlestars. If it could be done in 1943 then certain it can be done today. This can be cheesy is it isn't done right but it is far less cheesy than an advanced Earth.

Darkstar
July 25th, 2006, 01:01 AM
Ok so I don't usually come by here and post about BSG, but after being away and watching it I came home and bought the first season on DVD which I thought was great, i loved it all and can't wait to catch up on the 2nd season soon, but anyway after watching i came here and just want to express my opinion on this matter.

I agree they should not find Earth untill the final episode, when that happens then i did have a thought that (since never seeing the original) that they would arrive sometime in the so called present, eek what a disaster that would be if that happened?
If they ever did reach earth then my idea is that they should be equally advanced, but with the threat of Cylons still out there or even near earth then the two put aside some very different beliefs and work to destroy them together, after that well that could be a spin off so i will wait untill the end of BSG :D

Gilgamesh
July 25th, 2006, 07:11 AM
They don't need a Stargate situation. In fact, a Stargate situation is the worst direction one could go with it. That's why Galactica 1980 sucked so badly. They don't need to keep the Galactica secret from the people of Earth just so long as they are willing to deal with the political and social repercussions. It can be done. Alien Nation did it best.

Personally, I like the idea of a present day Alien Nation ending far better then the other possibilities. The 'they're our ancestors' ending is corny and cliché. The 'Earth to the Rescue' ending is too deus ex machina, corny, and cliche.

The only problem with be the Cylons. They would certainly be able to destroy the present day Earth. There are many ways to deal with that story line, some are more satisfactory than others. It is not impossible that the Colonials will have made peace with the Cylons by the time they rediscover Earth.
Likewise, it is not impossible for Earth's impressive manufacturing capibilities to be put to work creating ships and weapons based on Colonial technology. During WWII US shipards were churning out five ships per day. Now, imagine if those five ships per day are all battlestars. If it could be done in 1943 then certain it can be done today. This can be cheesy is it isn't done right but it is far less cheesy than an advanced Earth.

Excellent! An Alien Nation approach would be much better than trying to keep things secret. And I like the WWII analogy of Earth tooling up to produce battlestars, vipers, etc. We may be relatively primitive, but I suspect our computer tech is already “good enough” for the colonists, and as you say, one shouldn’t discount the sheer manpower and resources available.

The iffy part is how to keep the Cylons at bay for the minimum 4-5 years it would probably take produce the first new battlestar. A big priority would be to manufacture replacement munitions, vipers, and train pilots to keep the existing battlestars operational. And perhaps a few crude, rough and ready orbital defense platforms could be put in place during the buildup. Not that great at first, but at least better than nothing. Think the barrage balloons over London. :)

We (Earth and the colonists) would have the advantage of a short supply line, whereas the Cylons would have an unmanageably long supply line. That would limit the Cylon ability to attack. A race would be on to build facilities on Earth, vs the Cylons building temporary “local” mining operations, and bringing in a resurrection ship.

Darkstar
July 26th, 2006, 12:54 AM
Where would the Rosswell space ship come into it all?

Only kidding but an idea like that could be written into a spin off or new season when they reach earth, that we the lowly and pathetic peoples of terra firma are capable of creating spaceships but due to econamy problems and the cost that would be orbit high we never got around to it.

Any present spaceship with an FTL drive could go off to another planet to collect resources and then earth could build the ships and so on, just a though but as the series gets dire as each episode goes on it seems to me that they could use any help and allies no matter what backwater planet they land on, and besides this could usher a new era in space travel for ppl of earth and finaly uncover a few things that had been kept secret.

As far as the possibilities, well thay are pretty much endless, aside from silly ideas i like this "alien nation" idea and it would be good to see how the human race no matter what planet survives or falls in the face of evil, and to see just how different we both differ from each other with all the war going on here on earth. :)

Giantevilhead
July 26th, 2006, 07:28 PM
The Cylons keep talking about how this has happened before so for all we know, the 12 Colonies descended from artificial humans and the 13th Tribe was the true humans or it could be the other way around and that's why the 12 Tribes destroyed all their tech after they arrived at the colonies.

Darkstar
July 27th, 2006, 03:54 AM
They created the Cylon's didn't they, in the original the Cylon's were created by oh well the Cylon's themselves, they were a race who were destroyed by their toasters and the robots assumed the title Cylon, how this works in the remake i don't know if the technology present resembles a few ships with FTL drive and a series of colonies that parralel earth somewhat?

apollo123
July 29th, 2006, 09:39 AM
In my mind, the Colonials will never find Earth. They'll find traces of the 13th Tribe but never Earth itself. So eventually, they settle on a planet and name it Earth after the planet they could never find, and it turns out that our Earth is the one the Colonials colonized.

That won't make sense if you wanted to work BSG into our Earth history. Would the BSG crew degenerate into cavemen and early homo sapiens?

Gilgamesh
July 29th, 2006, 01:24 PM
That won't make sense if you wanted to work BSG into our Earth history. Would the BSG crew degenerate into cavemen and early homo sapiens?

What if the planet the Colonials settle on (the one we eventually call Earth) already has a hominid species similar in appearance to us? The native hominids cannot compete, are displaced from their habitat, and eventually die out. Thousands of years later, we come along, dig through fossils, and simply draw the incorrect conclusion we evolved here.

Bit_Wizard
August 4th, 2006, 12:01 AM
Whenever they find Earth, it should be soon just for credibility. Which is waning.

With the constellation map they got from the Arrow of Apollo, pretty much anyone with decent programming skills and a 3-D database of stellar positions (which they pretty much have to have to be jumping around in starships) could write a program to step through the galaxy and find the location from which those 12 patterns of brighter stars would exist.

7 days to write the code from scratch, with maybe 10 minutes to execute and complete ... on an iMac G5 ?

They should have already found Earth long ago in the series. But after they got the map, the issue was dropped. All that highly detailed positional info apparently flumoxed them.

If they want to keep the show "real", Kobol would have to be a colony of Earth, hundreds if not thousands of years from now and we would be talking thousands of years in the future when they find it again.

It needn't be an end. A whole new set of mysteries could open up, thousands of years of unknown history to be discovered.

Bit_Wizard
August 4th, 2006, 12:11 AM
Personally, I think the Cylons have already found Earth ... they initially seemed familiar with monotheism and even quoted certain concepts using language specifically from the Bible ("be fruitful and multiply"). Although that has been downplayed and muddied lately.

If not Earth itself, they have sources of information that lead back to Earth, not to Kobol. It seems unlikely they would be recipients of their own independent special revelation ...

ykickamoocow
October 20th, 2006, 10:51 AM
Personally, I like the idea of a present day Alien Nation ending far better then the other possibilities. The 'they're our ancestors' ending is corny and cliché. The 'Earth to the Rescue' ending is too deus ex machina, corny, and cliche.

The only problem with be the Cylons. They would certainly be able to destroy the present day Earth. There are many ways to deal with that story line, some are more satisfactory than others. It is not impossible that the Colonials will have made peace with the Cylons by the time they rediscover Earth.
Likewise, it is not impossible for Earth's impressive manufacturing capibilities to be put to work creating ships and weapons based on Colonial technology. During WWII US shipards were churning out five ships per day. Now, imagine if those five ships per day are all battlestars. If it could be done in 1943 then certain it can be done today. This can be cheesy is it isn't done right but it is far less cheesy than an advanced Earth.

I love this idea of BSG finding Earth in our time and there is a mad rush to make enough ships and weapons to repel a Cylon invasion. If countries like China, Japan, and other big manufacturing countries work together i could see Earth creating Vipers and even Battlestars very quickly. This idea could work but it would have to be well thought out as the writers could easily make a mess of it and turn this battlestar galactica into the original version.

wontgetfooledagain
October 20th, 2006, 11:09 AM
If Earth were to attempt the creation of Battlestars, we would have to create orbiting shipyards. Judging by the way the ISS is going, I don't think that would work too well.

ykickamoocow
October 21st, 2006, 12:39 AM
If Earth were to attempt the creation of Battlestars, we would have to create orbiting shipyards. Judging by the way the ISS is going, I don't think that would work too well.

Thats why Earth should get some help designing these ships by the engineers on Battlestar Galactica. From what ive seen the technology on Earth isnt that much less advanced than the technology of the 12 colonies.

Amanda Eros
October 21st, 2006, 07:28 AM
I don't know if anyone else mentioned this or not, but before I go and read everyone else's ideas, I'm posting my own.

If they ever find Earth, I think it would be one from far into the future. I feel that there must have been some catastrophe that took place on Earth similar to what is happening to BSG now. Perhaps it has to deal with cloning and a nuclear holocaust, or what not, but that caused people from Earth to leave. They settled on Kobel taking with them technology and history. However since Kobel lacked infrastructure, within a generation or two the society that they once had, fell apart. Text books wear away, technology breaks, human society is thrown back into prehistoric times with a deep sense of oral tradition to educate the people.

Thousands of years pass, the Ancient Greek and Roman stories survive, mainly because they are used as tools to educate. Perhaps the society takes on the form that those who are in control represent the ancient Greek and Roman gods, and are known as The Lords of Kobel. They make the same mistakes as their ancestors, create a class of people to be slaves, and then they rebel. A war takes place, and they decide to leave the world they called home for so long.

The story repeats, man kind finds the twelve colonies, they settle on the different worlds and are thrown back into prehistoric times within a generation or two. Perhaps the thirteenth tribe left to find earth, perhaps not, but it is the idea of returning to their original home that survives. When the colonies reach a space age they reunite though a common oral history. Generations pass, and lessons are failed to be learned. History repeats itself once more.

I really think it would be intresting for them to find Earth as a waist land. Or at least on the rebound of being a waist land. Skeleton steel structures jetting out of the ground, traces of road ways and cities, while the people wonder what happened only to never really find out.

Xenocide
October 21st, 2006, 03:41 PM
Personally, I think the Cylons have already found Earth ...

Maybe the Cylons found Earth while they were away for 40 years...

Fi-not-Fant
October 21st, 2006, 09:32 PM
Well, seeing as TPTB behind the show have repeatedly stressed that it's meant to be science fiction, not science fantasy (for example, in their aversion to bumpy-headed aliens), it seems pretty clear that if Earth is ever found, it will be our Earth, several thousand years in the future. Humans evolved on Earth, and the scientists that have managed to fund Lucy and homo florensis have never stumbled across a massive inter-stellar transport ship, so it's a pretty safe bet that the BSG humans were not "our ancestors". Now, what they would find is an open question. Maybe a post-apocalyptic landscape, with only Jericho thriving?

Maybe an Earth-Cylon world? Most interestingly, maybe they'll find a much more advanced Earth civilization, and that the 13th colony never made it back to Earth?

But please, enough with the "they're the Atlanteans/they're our ancestors" -- that plot twist would really suck and would go against everything that makes the show exceptional.

(As a side note: why do Earthlings always appear to need a "reason" to leave Earth? Simple exploration, maybe? Maybe the colonists are descended from a cult of religious fanatics? It's a big universe out there, maybe there are other Earth colonies?)

Kick-Kinsey
August 2nd, 2007, 06:54 AM
2003 so the can revist Iraqtica with an evil earth alliance of Bush and Blair.....invasion of Iraq....so say we allah akbar

GateMan2000
August 6th, 2007, 03:34 AM
2003 so the can revist Iraqtica with an evil earth alliance of Bush and Blair.....invasion of Iraq....so say we allah akbar

or Aka Laka Jihad!

Oreo
August 6th, 2007, 07:37 AM
I still don't believe they will find the real Earth.

Alexander E. Brent
August 6th, 2007, 09:03 AM
Well, i have a damn stragne feeling that TPTB will make some sort of bad joke on us all...Somethin like: Adama (pick one :P) meets with the obersturmfuhrer of Earth and talks about a enemy of humanity... The prez calls for some tea and a Cylon maid comes in... then some clips of robot (cylon) workers in a factory that meet one of the 12 human models and we hear a screem...and fade to black... Sorry for any gramatical bugs.. English is not my mother tounge or fathers tounge: P

MarshAngel
August 9th, 2007, 07:48 AM
I think it would be interesting if they found Earth only to find the Earth humans have created Cylons of their own who are, at the moment, still loyal. Then the fleet tries to convince them to scrap the whole lot and wind up starting a new Cylon-human war... forcing them to abandon the planet....again.

metabog
August 9th, 2007, 12:01 PM
It would be great either if they find Earth competeley ecologicaly destroyed and there is no one htere, or if it's THOUSANDS of years into the future.

But what if it turns out the people of Earth were originally Cylons?:cameron:

Berg417448
August 9th, 2007, 12:29 PM
It would be great either if they find Earth competeley ecologicaly destroyed and there is no one htere, or if it's THOUSANDS of years into the future.

But what if it turns out the people of Earth were originally Cylons?:cameron:

Given the recent comments during interviews of Aaron Douglas:

That is a very very good possibility! According to him...The 13th tribe were Cylons!

boxvic
August 10th, 2007, 11:16 PM
I gotta go with the idea that they will find Earth around the year 2400. It will be revealed that the 12 colonies were launched from Earth sometime around 2200. After finding suitable planets within the star system they began the process of colonization. But after ecological disasters and countless wars their idea of utopia is destroyed and people begin to socially devolve- which is socially possible. After 200 hundred years of recreating society with the technology that was already there, and convincing the "backwards" people that there are no gods they again reach an advanced stage. The creation of the Cylons was done with knowledge stored from the original settlers and was done in an attempt to free the "backwards" workers from their burdens.

They arrive to find an Earth hundreds of years more advanced than anything they could have imagined. On this Earth the distinction between human and Cylon is negligent. Both the colonists and Cylons must come to grips with the fact that they face a society much more advanced than their own- in which no one is simply human or Cylon. Something along those lines, of everything happening in the future.

The only other plausible option I see is to just ignore the actual Earth and make everything within the BSG universe with no actual traces of the real universe.

gopher65
August 11th, 2007, 10:39 AM
Ummm... well, if they launched in 2200, it would have to be at least... what, 4000 years in the future? Because the 12 colonies themselves have a couple thousand years of recorded history, and who knows how long Kobal was there.

Here's what I think happened:

Earth, sometime between 2100 and 2500, colonized Khobal. There was likely some sort of war or major natural disaster on Earth which killed most, if not all, of the population there (this might have happened either before or after Khobal was colonized). Khobal goes on for a few thousand years, building up its population, technology, and infrastructure. Khobal eventually creates Cylons of some type. This causes a war. The survivors leave Khobal in 12 waves, each going to a different colony. The Khobalian Cylons decide to return to Earth and see what's cooking.

Each of the Twelve colonies settles on a different planet (or system. This makes more sense, but people keep telling me it is the same star system. Right. That's why Athena's tomb showed that each of the colonies was in a different constellation as seen from Earth. Uh huh, cause, like, that would so happen if they were all in the same star system.). Each colony then developed on their own, much as Khobal had thousands of years earlier. Without an infrastructure to support them, their technology collapsed (no farms? No food for miners, so everyone has to become a farmer in the short term. No miners? No mines get dug. No mines? No fuel for the reactors. No reactors? No power. No power? No technology).

Over thousands of they rebuilt their technology (in part from new research, and likely in part from ancient knowledge that had been carefully preserved until such a time as they could make use of it). Eventually they went back into space, and slowly discovered the other colonies. They made an alliance, and the twelve colonies were born. They created Cylons, and then were destroyed by them. The end:).

boxvic
August 11th, 2007, 07:25 PM
Hmm, I didn't realize Kobal had such a long history. In that case I'm going to go with the option that there is no Earth. Humanity originated on Kobal and Earth is just, as has mentioned before, a figment of their imaginations. A never ending quest for no better reason than to give them continued hope.

Iguana775
August 13th, 2007, 11:52 AM
Not sure if this was mentioned since I dont want to read the whole thread but I wonder if they get there and Earth is completely void of Human life.

helio9
August 13th, 2007, 12:04 PM
They'll never find earth, the subject is too big for them the deal with. Its the same reason the stargate program couldn't go public on SG-1. Any way they deal with it, it'll be a joke.

Wicket
August 14th, 2007, 11:38 AM
Hmm, I didn't realize Kobal had such a long history. In that case I'm going to go with the option that there is no Earth. Humanity originated on Kobal and Earth is just, as has mentioned before, a figment of their imaginations. A never ending quest for no better reason than to give them continued hope.


But we see Earth at the end of Season 3. :S

It exists.

ATrain
August 16th, 2007, 08:11 PM
While I'm pretty sure we're only going to get a brief look at earth, like from space or something at the end of S4, how about this.

They find an earth around 6000 BC or so, where all the descendants of the 13th colony have either died or become primitives. The fleet starts an advanced colony (Atlantis to us), and later found early civilization on earth as we know it. Maybe this sounds strange, but somehow I think it works with the way the use Greek mythology in BSG.

Andre The Netherlands
August 17th, 2007, 09:57 AM
Remember some of the crew hearing that song all through the ship ??? That was "all along the watchtower" by U2 !!! So, earth, or rather us humans must atleast be older then that. Porbably even a lot older as it takes some time for even sound to travel that far to where the BS Galactica was when season 3 ended.

André from The Netherlands :sheppard:

Berg417448
August 17th, 2007, 11:22 AM
Remember some of the crew hearing that song all through the ship ??? That was "all along the watchtower" by U2 !!! So, earth, or rather us humans must atleast be older then that. Porbably even a lot older as it takes some time for even sound to travel that far to where the BS Galactica was when season 3 ended.

André from The Netherlands :sheppard:

LOL! U2 didn't write that song! All along the Watchtower is a Bob Dylan song.


and the song was not necessarily meant to be from Earth:

“I happened to catch Ron Moore in the hallway at Universal and, in a brief conversation, got everything I needed to know. I learned that the idea was not that Bob Dylan necessarily exists in the characters' universe, but that an artist on one of the colonies may have recorded a song with the exact same melody and lyrics. Perhaps this unknown performer and Dylan pulled inspiration from a common, ethereal source. Therefore, I was told to make no musical references to any "Earthly" versions, Hendrix, Dylan or any others. The arrangement needed to sound like a pop song that belonged in the Galactica universe, not our own.”

Bear McCreary’s blog

General David Niemi
August 17th, 2007, 06:05 PM
The find it in the year: last year! :D

Andre The Netherlands
August 18th, 2007, 03:47 AM
Yes, I know Bob Dylan wrote it, and that it was also a song by Jimmy Hendrix and lots of various other bands. Listening to it again in Crossroads part 2, I must admid it does not sound like U2. Still, why that song, and why was it that big a deal some of the crew could hear it all through the ship? Or was it just to confuse us?

André :sheppard:

Berg417448
August 18th, 2007, 12:12 PM
It wasn't U2...The song was performed by a band called BT4. Bear McCreary's blog used to contain an explanation of how the song came to be performed and arranged but I can't find it there now.

I think the explanation for using the song and exactly what it means must wait for season 4.


EDIT: Here is the blog about the song:

http://www.bearmccreary.com/html/blog/blog028.htm

Zatarc
August 18th, 2007, 04:34 PM
As this thread is two years long, I don't know if my ideas have been expressed in some form or another, but here it goes anyway:

In BSG they refer to Earth as the 13th colony but thats becuase of their own, very limited knowledge of Earth. I've always thought of it kinda like that we (the viewers) know that Earth was the planet of origin for the homo sapiens sapiens species (numerous archealogical evidence shows that this is so). Anyway, as we know humans originated from Earth im going to say the whole Greek/Roman type society did too. We can see this reflected in BSG as in Season 2 when it was revealed (but we all knew it) that the colony names orignate from ancient, older names (eg. Virgon=Virgo).

So yeah, what I propose is that the Roman society developed on Earth as we know it but actually went further technologically and eventually became space faring and settled Kobol. After this, for one reason or another, there was a period of technological regression (maybe something similar to the Dark Ages) and so when we look back we don't see any evidence of the advance technology. So anyway from Kobol the colonies are settled as we know from the show (that is with the knowledge of each others existance) and the BSG crew are on their merry way to Earth which I'd say will be populated, with humans, but I'd say we'd probably be of similar tech to them, say around 2500 or less.

Just I thought though.......:o

Mirel
August 29th, 2007, 05:44 AM
Look, the show's supposed to be in an ALTERNATE universe. Just because they have Greek gods, doesn't mean it originated from earth, from all we know, Earth has no pyramids, no mayan temples etc

ATrain
August 30th, 2007, 01:11 PM
I still think its possible that in the BSG universe humanity did not originate on earth but on Kobol. The origin of Earth Humans and Greek/Roman culture could have come from the people of the the thirteenth colony.

gopher65
August 31st, 2007, 08:49 AM
I still think its possible that in the BSG universe humanity did not originate on earth but on Kobol. The origin of Earth Humans and Greek/Roman culture could have come from the people of the the thirteenth colony.
Except for the fact that the colonies have been stated to be less than 3000 years old in one of the early episodes. This leaves three possibilities:

1) The writers are morons and don't realize they wrote themselves into a corner, and will ignore their previous statements. Based on their past actions, this seems quite likely. They seem to ignore everything that happened in the first season and the miniseries if it is deemed inconvenient.

2) Life originated on Khobal, and present day earth (on the show) is thousands and thousands of years ago. Like, 100,000 years (when modern humans first appeared on Earth). This doesn't seem likely, but who knows. This would be far in our past.

3) Earth settled Khobal, and then died out. The Khobalian Cylons then resettled Earth as the 13th colony. This would mean everything on the show takes place far in our future. This makes the most sense, but who knows with writers like these, to whom continuity and logic mean nothing.

Zatarc
August 31st, 2007, 04:24 PM
Hmmmm, all good ideas, but I like mine best lol.

At BTW, the first human ancestor is MILLIONS of years old.

Who knows what the writers are thinking? It'll be cool to see how they get round it

Lord batchi ball
September 2nd, 2007, 04:51 PM
Maybe the fleet is destroyed by the Cylons and everyone dies, I mean not everyshow can come to a happy ending.
or
if they get there its the.................Planet of the Apes LOL!!!

Zatarc
September 7th, 2007, 01:10 PM
Now that would be funny. All that struggling and surviving, the build up to Earth and then wham!! They all die...pretty suck way to end it but still entertaining none the less

boxvic
September 7th, 2007, 06:56 PM
I'm a fan of the unhappy ending actually. I mean everything always ends with a happy ending, everything is always tied up, and everyone goes home the better for it. Life isn't that way. How many times does the nerdy guy from high school actually end up marrying the prom queen? How many times does someone with a terminal illness really find a miraculous cure at the last second?

I don't like the idea of the Cylons destroying the fleet... but I like the idea of some sort of accident destroying both fleets. Then end the show with a silent shot of a debris field hanging over an Earth-like planet.

gopher65
September 7th, 2007, 07:14 PM
The only problem with that boxvic is that when the characters are dead in the minds of the audience, no one watches repeats or buys DVDs. They characters are dead, so no one wants to watch them.

This is the honest to goodness reason why hardly any show kills off characters in their last few episodes. To use a personal example, when I watch Enterprise now, every time Trip comes onscreen I'm like "ooh, he's dead". Nothing the character does matters, cause he's dead.

I think the same thing about that what's-his-face character from BSG (the president's assistant in miniseries, season 1). He's dead to me, so his character's plotlines are pointless to me now. I know they will never go anywhere.

boxvic
September 8th, 2007, 04:28 PM
That is a good point actually, I never thought of that. Just one more reason why it is harder to write TV than literature I guess.

AvatarIII
September 10th, 2007, 03:37 AM
i think they should get to earth during the dark ages, initially that may sound stupid but hear me out.

1) they say kobal was left around 2000 years ago, assuming they used FTL ships to escape, and assuming the visitors from kobal started the ancient greek empire around 1400bce or something (perhaps decided to go back to no technology, after a few generations everything was forgotten.)
2) around 2000 years later it would be about the year 600, say it was actually a bit longer than 2000 years, maybe 1200s or something, during which time the primary religions of the world were islam, judaism and christianity, all single God religions.
3) the 12 colonies have a multi god religion and the cylons basically preach a sort of christianity.
4) this would all go to show that the world went to poop when they gave up the lords of kobal.

Erised
September 10th, 2007, 11:43 AM
Don't know if this has been mentioned, so forgive me if it has been...

So the colonists know that the cylons are looking for Earth... They follow BSG all over the universe, attack them, etc etc... Obviously, the cylons want to kill all humans. So, here is my question: WHY is the fleet still looking for Earth? Do they really want to take the cylons to the promised land, and have them truly destroy the human race? Isn't the whole point of finding the Earth and forbidding abortion is to SAVE the human race? I mean, it doesn't make any sense, at all! Even if they were the most selfish civilization of humans, it would make no sense to find a planet and have it destroyed.


I'd love it if they found the Earth in the year 2007/2008, or judging by the latest rumors, 2009... but there is hardly any difference.

AvatarIII, that actually makes sense.. LOL.

Just to add: why do they speak English? Have the same alphabet? The same cars? The same, though more advanced civilization (restaurants)? The same gym, clothes, hair styles, food (remember the spaghetti Adama was eating?) Why do they have a president and call him/her The President? They write on paper, they have CD's (clever shape though), they have the same military ranks... etc etc... Earth can't be that old... UNLESS the colonies are the ones who introduce all this concept into Earth's culture..

gopher65
September 10th, 2007, 02:46 PM
That can't happen though.

If people from Khobal started the ancient greek religion in 1400BC or whenever, why were there people on Earth already when they got here? Where did they come from? Modern humans are *at least* 40,000 years old. Not meaning ape things here, but people that are just like us.

Even if a person is a Young Earth Creationist (ahahahahahahaha) and claims that humans came to Earth 6000 years ago, the timeline *still* wouldn't make sense. Cause then the Khobalians would have had to come to Earth in 4000BC and plant humans here.

gopher65
September 10th, 2007, 02:50 PM
Just to add: why do they speak English? Have the same alphabet? The same cars? The same, though more advanced civilization (restaurants)? The same gym, clothes, hair styles, food (remember the spaghetti Adama was eating?) Why do they have a president and call him/her The President? They write on paper, they have CD's (clever shape though), they have the same military ranks... etc etc... Earth can't be that old... UNLESS the colonies are the ones who introduce all this concept into Earth's culture..
Why do all people speak English on Stargate? Cause you wouldn't want to watch a show where the entire thing was in subtitles, that's why. They don't speak English on BSG, they speak some colony language that is instantly translated to English for Our Viewing Pleasure;).

Culture wise, you can't show any culture that is too alien from our own. Many people in the US don't even like watching British TV because British culture and British humour are "too alien" for them. So all scifi TV shows made in any part of the world use the local culture in place of all alien cultures. It makes for odd, nonsensical science fiction shows, but the audience will accept nothing else unfortunately.

This is the same reason why Captain Kirk was a chauvinist, and why Luke Skywalker's hairdue looks horrible. You pander to the culture of the audience.

Erised
September 10th, 2007, 03:08 PM
ROFL I just find it odd that they have spaceships but everything else is on our level of development.
Maybe they will come to Earth and find the iRobot thing happening.. LOL... And like someone else said, I can hear Starbuck go "You've got to be frakin' kidding me"

Maybe ... you know...their call signs are their "god" names 'cause they would come to Earth when we're very primitive and we would think they're gods.. hence the greek/roman gods.
I mean why else focus on the greek stuff so much?

X-3-0-2
September 11th, 2007, 06:59 AM
2003 so the can revist Iraqtica with an evil earth alliance of Bush and Blair.....invasion of Iraq....so say we allah akbar

They will time travel back to 2001, so Ron Moore can prevent the War in Afghanistan 2001 and tell the USA it was America not the radical muslims that caused the WTC attacks

Humanity = Bad

(You can't hide from the things you've done)

Admiral Mappalazarou
September 11th, 2007, 07:01 AM
Ronald D Moore is not Michael Moore, you twit.:mckay:

Kick-Kinsey
September 11th, 2007, 07:19 AM
Ronald D Moore is not Michael Moore, you twit.:mckay:


Yeah he's so left-leaning that some of RDM's opinions actually make Michael Moore look conservative.

Admiral Mappalazarou
September 11th, 2007, 07:22 AM
Yeah he's so left-leaning that some of RDM's opinions actually make Michael Moore look conservative.

Haha Michael Moore makes me laugh. I watched Farenheight 9/11 last night and LOVED it. :cameron:

Trek_Girl42
September 11th, 2007, 08:27 AM
The only problem with that boxvic is that when the characters are dead in the minds of the audience, no one watches repeats or buys DVDs. They characters are dead, so no one wants to watch them.

This is the honest to goodness reason why hardly any show kills off characters in their last few episodes. To use a personal example, when I watch Enterprise now, every time Trip comes onscreen I'm like "ooh, he's dead". Nothing the character does matters, cause he's dead.

I think the same thing about that what's-his-face character from BSG (the president's assistant in miniseries, season 1). He's dead to me, so his character's plotlines are pointless to me now. I know they will never go anywhere.
I thought the same thing about Billy- but then I rewatched the entire series from the beginning recently, and I found that I still loved his storyline and when he came on screen, despite knowing that his time was nearly up. ;)