Painted into a corner [Spoilers for everything]

[davsoft]

Anyone think the Stargate team has really painted themselves into a corner with the Ancients? 3 Million years ago the ancients built Atlantis, had a healing ability and more. Now in Epiphany the healing power is going to be something one gains on the path to ascension. But what about all the ancients 3 million years ago when they probably had even started on ascension. Even O'neill was able to using Ancient healing powers, with no modification, it was just knowledge that allowed him to do it.

Plus then there's the weapon at Dakara that the ancients used to reseed life. Why didn't they just build another one like that in pegasus, destory the galaxy's life, then reseed it like they did here? This whole thing would probably have worked lots better and been more consistant if from day one of Stargate SG1 they had a definate plan of who the ancients were and what they did.

David

[SmallTimePerson]

Anyone think the Stargate team has really painted themselves into a corner with the Ancients? 3 Million years ago the ancients built Atlantis, had a healing ability and more. Now in Epiphany the healing power is going to be something one gains on the path to ascension. But what about all the ancients 3 million years ago when they probably had even started on ascension.

im pretty sure the ancients three million years ago were on the path to ascension. I have never seen SG-1. but i am sure o'niel gets the healing power from becoming mentally advanced and stuff, which is part of ascension.

[Eoin]

Aiyana(Frozen) was 50 million years(or somthing like that) old and she had healing powers....
I agree with you davsoft, they should of had a definate plan about the ancients on day 1

[NowIWillDestroyAbydos]

I have never seen SG-1. but i am sure o'niel gets the healing power from becoming mentally advanced and stuff, which is part of ascension.

you've never seen SG-1. you don't know what your missing

[SmallTimePerson]

you've never seen SG-1. you don't know what your missing

ive seen the movie. I was trying to hire out the dvds from the video library up the road. but they didn't have them all. Im proably just gona borrow it off my friend

[GatetheWay]

Plus then there's the weapon at Dakara that the ancients used to reseed life. Why didn't they just build another one like that in pegasus, destory the galaxy's life, then reseed it like they did here? This whole thing would probably have worked lots better and been more consistant if from day one of Stargate SG1 they had a definate plan of who the ancients were and what they did.

David

Oh yeah, why didn't the Ancients just DESTROY all life in the Pegasus Galaxy and start over? They after all had every right to do so. They were the ones who created it so why not destroy it.

The Wraith only destroy little bits of the galaxy's life at a time but the Ancients should of just finished the job and gotten rid of EVERYONE then they wouldn't have the pescy Wraith around, oh yeah, and people too.

I know, why not just destroy all life the Milky Way as well that would of left everything peacful. Wouldn't of had the Goauld or the Replicators to worry about. Maybe Anubis had the right idea.

[SmallTimePerson]

Oh yeah, why didn't the Ancients just DESTROY all life in the Pegasus Galaxy and start over? They after all had every right to do so. They were the ones who created it so why not destroy it.

They didn't feel like it???

[MarshAngel]

Anyone think the Stargate team has really painted themselves into a corner with the Ancients? 3 Million years ago the ancients built Atlantis, had a healing ability and more. Now in Epiphany the healing power is going to be something one gains on the path to ascension. But what about all the ancients 3 million years ago when they probably had even started on ascension. Even O'neill was able to using Ancient healing powers, with no modification, it was just knowledge that allowed him to do it.

Plus then there's the weapon at Dakara that the ancients used to reseed life. Why didn't they just build another one like that in pegasus, destory the galaxy's life, then reseed it like they did here? This whole thing would probably have worked lots better and been more consistant if from day one of Stargate SG1 they had a definate plan of who the ancients were and what they did.

David

I absolutely agree with you. They are very inconsistent. 50+ million years ago when they left their own galaxy they were already on a path to ascension. the methods of which fractured their society. Either they're very slow learners or they're evolutionally stuck. It's also been noted that their special abilities are the result of physical evolution (manipulated or natural)... which makes Oneill's ability to use them kind of inconsistent as well.

I know the whole show requires a leap of faith but basically we're expected to believe that it took them over 50 million years to evolve to the point that they could ascend and yet many of them still didn't or couldn't but O'neill, an ape by comparison, gets a database downloaded into his brain and he could do the tricks that took them millions of years of evolution. Unless the ancients have spent millions of years in stasis, why did it take them so long?


Now I feel like they're trying to dumb them down to make them easier to write but that's inconsistent and problematic. The human race as we know it is young but we're already smart enough to use their tech. Unless evolution slows to a crawl in a few years or we're more advanced than the ancients were at our age, then there's no way I can buy that after 50 million years they're still so Joe Schmo average as they appeared to be in Aurora.

A million years is a really really long time, 50 of those is hard to grasp. The Grand Canyon wasn't even fully there when they arrived in the Milky Way. All that time and the changes between them and us are so minute. Aren't we supposed to have made the way from ape to man in a fraction of that time?


Also after 50 million years of separation/isolation they should be very different from the Ori.... but thats another story.

[mgbland]

Probably some of this is misdirection on the part of the writers. Unfortunately, the only person that may know the score is Daniel Jackson, and for some reason, he hasn't been able to access many of this memories from the ascended days. Just enough to stop the replicators.

[Gate_traveler]

I agree, before they go much farther, if they havent already then need to set solid perameters of who the ancients were, what they can and cant do and the whole back story. it would help not only the episodes but when writing youd have some sort of an idea about what your writing instead of having ot make it up as you go.

[SmallTimePerson]

I agree, before they go much farther, if they havent already then need to set solid perameters of who the ancients were, what they can and cant do and the whole back story. it would help not only the episodes but when writing youd have some sort of an idea about what your writing instead of having ot make it up as you go.

we will probably learn more about the ancients in

Spoiler:

epiphany, when sheppard is transported to a world full of ancints waiting to ascend

[Hatcheter]

Oh yeah, why didn't the Ancients just DESTROY all life in the Pegasus Galaxy and start over?

Because abandonment is somewhat less cruel than genocide?


I can't decide whether there is over or under analysis going on here. Either way, I don't think TPTB are in any corners. And if they are, it's because they intend to knock down a few walls in the process. They've been chipping away all season at the pedestal that the Ancients have been set upon, revealing them for the fallable, imperfect, and all too human creatures that they are. I think, for a lot of fans, this is like when they were children and learned that Santa Clause wasn't real.

"Oh, sorry kids. The Ancient's weren't really an all-powerful, all-wise race after all. They were weak and arrogant and shortsighted, and screwed up and then ran away from the consequences. Welcome to the grown up world..."

Whoops, sorry, channeled McKay for a moment there.

[MarshAngel]

Yeah that was definitely Mckay snarky but never mind that...

It's not so much that they're stuck in a corner so much as they are guilty of being shortsighted. They introduced the ancients as the gate builders; pretty awe-inspiring given what the gates do. Then they said they were so evolved that they shed their physical bodies and became all powerful. Then they said they built a huge flying city, created and recreated two galaxies of humans, which is pretty god-like but wait... they were defeated by space vampires, despite their super brain power couldn't see their virtual reality wasn't real, had intragalactic space ships so slow that the Goa'uld would scoff at them...

It's almost as if we're talking about two different people. One amazing one for SG1 and another not so great one for Atlantis.

But the biggest problem is the amount of time they've set aside for the span of Ancient civilization. It's such an overwhelmingly long period of time than anything less than near-god-like is hard to accept given what we're already capable of in the short time we've been around. After a mere 10,000 years of human civilization we're smart enough to grasp many of the concepts of a 50 million year old civilization. Does that mean we're smarter than they are or are they just slow?

So now basically they're going to go back and rewrite who the Ancients are. They can do what they want but it's still going to come off as if they're correcting a past mistake.

[CalmStorm]

I don't think they've painted themselves into a corner.

I don't think you can sum up an entire civilization or race of people using generics to apply to the entire race. Perhaps there were some ancients further along the evolutionary path that allowed them to have the abilities they had. Perhaps it was only sect of ancients that developed the gates, but all used. Perhaps they were a more fractured society than we think, but the information we have has not revealed that yet.

It would be no different than our common personal computers....there are those of us out there who understand the complete mechanics of them, some who only know how to use them, and some who do not have a clue, and some that fall in between the categories. So, if we were to say that the computer is the most sophisticated technology there is in the world, and created by those on earth....then all those on earth must be brilliant.

I think this is how some are interpreting the ancients. They have this wonderful technology and we know that they have wonderful abilities, so they must all be great, intelligent and highly advanced. It is quite possible that there were many cultures within the ancient civilization....just as there are many diverse cultures and divisions right here at home. To try and label them or group them into a cingular like-minded civilization with the same goals, level of abilities and intelligence seems to be where the confusion comes into play.

[SmallTimePerson]

I think this is how some are interpreting the ancients. They have this wonderful technology and we know that they have wonderful abilities, so they must all be great, intelligent and highly advanced. It is quite possible that there were many cultures within the ancient civilization....just as there are many diverse cultures and divisions right here at home. To try and label them or group them into a cingular like-minded civilization with the same goals, level of abilities and intelligence seems to be where the confusion comes into play.

I think your last point is true. This can be shown by

Spoiler:

trinity when Dr. Mckay and his team try to use the weapon system on the planet with an ancient outpost. We know that the weapon wasn't ancient, it was the planet's natives weapon, but it was powered by an ancient zpe experiment. Perhaps the ancients were more a Coalition or a group of allies.