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GateWorld
September 20th, 2005, 08:42 PM
<DIV ALIGN=CENTER><TABLE WIDTH=450 BORDER=0 CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=7><TR><TD><DIV ALIGN=LEFT><FONT FACE="Arial" SIZE=2 COLOR="#000000"><A HREF="http://www.scifistream.com/lost/s2/index.shtml"><IMG SRC="http://www.scifistream.com/lost/graphics/201.jpg" WIDTH=160 HEIGHT=120 ALIGN=RIGHT HSPACE=10 VSPACE=2 BORDER=0 STYLE="border: 1px solid black" ALT="Visit the Episode Guide"></A><FONT SIZE=1 COLOR="#888888">LOST SEASON TWO</FONT>
<FONT SIZE=4><A HREF="http://www.scifistream.com/lost/s2/index.shtml" STYLE="text-decoration: none">MAN OF SCIENCE,<BR> MAN OF FAITH</A></FONT>
<FONT SIZE=1>EPISODE NUMBER - 201</FONT>
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Locke persists in his obsession with exploring the cavern below the hatch, despite the fact that it cannot provide everyone with shelter for the night -- and Kate agrees to descend into the hole.

<FONT SIZE=1><B><A HREF="http://www.scifistream.com/lost/s2/index.shtml">VISIT THE EPISODE GUIDE >></A></B></FONT></FONT></DIV></TD></TR></TABLE></DIV>

spg_1983
September 21st, 2005, 06:05 PM
WOW! that was fracking awesome, answered one question and raised a hundred more! i fracking LOVE this show!

Vyse
September 21st, 2005, 06:10 PM
While I thought they picked the wrong idea to start the episode, I was very impressed by it. Every time commercials started I screamed out in disgust that I would have to sit through them! Didn't see that twist coming at the end, very surprised by that. I was just like "holy ****" when he said "brother" and realized who it was. Annoyed that we didn't get to see what happened to the raft crew, but we will find out next week. Only one flaw, like I said before was the beginning. For me it lowered the suspense as to what was down the hatch. Also, was that computer an old Apple II, it kinda looked like it to me? In all I absolutely CAN'T wait for next week!

twiggy
September 21st, 2005, 06:59 PM
i really liked it. was anyone else bothered by Jack's hair?!

FoolishPleasure
September 21st, 2005, 07:27 PM
That beginning was frackin' cool! Kept trying to figure out which character it was. . but it wasn't any of 'em.

We have the "voices" again. .and what the heck did Walt say to Shannon????

Wait a week??? BAAAHHHH!!!!

ShadowMaat
September 21st, 2005, 07:41 PM
It's times like this I wish I knew how to lip read. *sigh*

Interesting about Hatch Dude. The set-up of the place is very sixties in terms of tech and accoutrements, but now we know the guy has only been down there for a couple of years at most. The hypospray thing was rather more modern, though. Or did they have those back then? Anyone know what he was injecting?

Granted, he could simply be the latest in a long line of inhabitants, but I guess the big question is WHY? And how do they switch out staffers? And how often?

I'm guessing that "around the world race" was a lie. ;)

Locke's gotta be pretty crushed by the reality of the hatch. Not exactly the key to his destiny, was it? :D

spg_1983
September 21st, 2005, 07:45 PM
It's times like this I wish I knew how to lip read. *sigh*

Interesting about Hatch Dude. The set-up of the place is very sixties in terms of tech and accoutrements, but now we know the guy has only been down there for a couple of years at most. The hypospray thing was rather more modern, though. Or did they have those back then? Anyone know what he was injecting?

Granted, he could simply be the latest in a long line of inhabitants, but I guess the big question is WHY? And how do they switch out staffers? And how often?

I'm guessing that "around the world race" was a lie. ;)

Locke's gotta be pretty crushed by the reality of the hatch. Not exactly the key to his destiny, was it? :Di cant remember exactly what it said because it flashed by fast, but i think it said like vaccine or anti- something or other, but im not sure. and yes they did have those injectors back then and the look of that one is one that would have been in use in the late seventies early eighties, the ones from the sixties were bigger, the modern ones use compressed gas.

ShadowMaat
September 21st, 2005, 07:47 PM
I was thinking it was anti-radiation meds. Kinda like Helo. ;) The whole thing just screamed "fallout shelter" to me. Well... the bits that didn't scream "biospehere habitat". Maybe he's in training to help colonize the moon or Mars or something.

Or re-colonize Earth after a devastating something-or-other.

But it only being one person... that kinda throws off the calculations. Unless, as with stories possessing similar storylines, the people went mad and killed themselves/each other and Marathon Man is the sole survivor.

tomduo
September 21st, 2005, 07:48 PM
108, written all over the walls, has ALOT of religious connotations throughout the east. It is also 4 + 8 + 15 + 16 + 23 + 42.

The magnetic source in the hatch could be a nuclear reactor, or something else. It could be why the compasses are off upon the Island.

What if Desmond was placed there to study the smoke? What if the injections kept him sane from the disease that afflicted the 'Others', Rosseau's crew, and perhaps Boone and Locke..?

What is the significance of 4,8,15,16,23,42? Demond entered it within the comp in the begining? What did the patches on the jumpsuits say/mean? What did Desmond inject himself with? How did he go from racing around the world to being in that ****hole (or did he lie to Jack)?

Also, where is Rosseau? Where is Jin, Mike and Sawyer? What happened to Walt, and is he back on the 'Island'?

spg_1983
September 21st, 2005, 07:52 PM
was it me or did it seem like there was sunlight comming through the windows in the shelter? the shelter that was 40 feet underground?:eek:

tomduo
September 21st, 2005, 08:06 PM
was it me or did it seem like there was sunlight comming through the windows in the shelter? the shelter that was 40 feet underground?:eek:

Could have been from a Nuclear power source.

Also, why was the Quarentine on the inside? Are we infected?

spg_1983
September 21st, 2005, 08:18 PM
Could have been from a Nuclear power source.

Also, why was the Quarentine on the inside? Are we infected?i was wondering that too. what if the island is actually the inside and the hatch is the way out, like a giant biodome, like in "The Truman Show"

tomduo
September 21st, 2005, 08:29 PM
Oh that is beyond creepy.

memnarch
September 21st, 2005, 09:06 PM
JUST SAW IT!!!!!!!!!!!!! :D Opening was jaw-dropping!! Ending was mind-bending!!! I loved almost every minute of it! I could have done with more on the other characters, but I suppose we'll get to them...Now, the question on everyone's minds should be: Why was Desmond quarintined in the Hatch??? Also, where'd he get all those frakkin' guns??? :eek: And who built the radio tower, Desmond or the Others??? *head explodes from overabundance of questions* :S

Osiris-RA
September 21st, 2005, 09:24 PM
The opening was awesome. Sucked me in trite and true. When Desmond showed up in the running up and down stadium stairs part, I knew he was the guy from the running up and down the stadium stairs scene. That was pretty obvious. The doc guy (Cant recall his name at the moment) reminds me of almost every doc I've met. I went *Thhbt!* at him when the girl moved her toes at last. I dunno, it's just with thier loads of pessimism, docs deserve that now and then. :D That was a nice part, I liked that glimmer of hope. Maybe she will dance at her weddin'. I thought it awful crude of the bald guy (can't remember his name either) to send the woman (je nes pa name either :S) down the hatch first. For an adventurer he sure is a sissy. But anyway, it was very cool, the whole hatch scene. I loved the music (Micheal G is awesome) as well as the song they played in that part. Added a creepy, confusing, out of place vibe, wonderful. Ah, there's so many parts I liked in that show. I can't mention 'em all cause I'm sleepy. But hey, I think Lost is my new favorite show.

Invasion, on the other hand, was quite cheesy. Like one of those sillly hurricane shows on the Sci Fi channel. :rolleyes: maybe it'll be cooler. Saun Cassidy's gotta have something up his sleeve.

Congerking
September 21st, 2005, 09:37 PM
I liked this episode immensly. Desmond inside of the hatch in his yuppie 1970s appartment was a shock. With all that stuff there, he must have been there a VERY long time. OR here's a thought, the island is making jack see desmond there. It wouldn't be the first time it happened, jack did think he saw his dad. The whole theme for the episode seemed to focus on jack's ability to lead and to heal. How does desmond fit into that?

NXds
September 21st, 2005, 10:55 PM
So far so good show kept me intrested kept my eyes on TV whole time except during comericals. Shoot i still want to find out what the hell is with the chain thing poor Kate. Cant wait till next week, guess Walt does have ESPn.

tomduo
September 21st, 2005, 11:26 PM
I liked this episode immensly. Desmond inside of the hatch in his yuppie 1970s appartment was a shock. With all that stuff there, he must have been there a VERY long time. OR here's a thought, the island is making jack see desmond there. It wouldn't be the first time it happened, jack did think he saw his dad. The whole theme for the episode seemed to focus on jack's ability to lead and to heal. How does desmond fit into that?

Desmond gave Jack the true inkling that there is hope. Before he met him, Jack had horrible bedside manner, and disliked hope. He was very scientific, though Locke's words rang true; "You believe in Miracles, you just don't know it yet." After meeting Desmond (look up his name's meaning, you'll find it is interesting) Jack is told that he might have cured Sara. Surely enough, when he returns to her, and pours out his failures, she reveals he did not fail afterall. A miracle happened, one Jack forgot about perhaps.

Locke was sort of underplayed in this episode. While I realize this was all about Jack, Locke became weak. The title led me to hope that they would share perspectives in this episode. I hope Ep. 2 shows things from Locke's perspective, including perhaps his meeting with Desmond inside the hatch, and how he knows that Kate is ok.

Naeara
September 21st, 2005, 11:44 PM
Loved this ep. In typical Lost fashion it seems like tons happened when really it was very little. Plus I think I might be even more confused now than before. :p

I had an inkling Desmond was Hatch Guy when he said "See you in another life." That came off mega creepy.

Can't wait for next week! I'm dying to know about Sawyer, Jin and Michael (hopefully we'll get something on Walt too).

ShadowMaat
September 22nd, 2005, 03:25 AM
So do you think that this theoretical second group of survivors will have started off at sixty? Combined with the 48 from "our" camp, that adds up to 108.

Anyone have screencaps of the mural? And is there significance to the number being written on a sun or is that too literal an interpretation? :D

Tok'Ra Hostess
September 22nd, 2005, 03:48 AM
About Sara's spinal injuries... I know doctors can be wrong about some things, but Jack acted like he was certain about the extent of the damage, there. Does anyone suppose what happened to Sara is related to what happened to John Locke?

True, Locke didn't start walking til he got to the island, but, consider: Desmond is on the island, and he was in the vicinity of Sara's hospital the day her spine healed.

What did Desmond mean by "I was almost a doctor, once?" Is he an adult version of Walt? Can he make things happen?

All I can say is, I'm glad this is the first ep of the season and not the cliffhanger. :)

KatG
September 22nd, 2005, 03:59 AM
Oh man. This show makes me want to scream sometimes. Just when you think you've figured things out they hit you with 50 other questions.

Isn't Sara the person Jack married in one of the flashbacks last year?

I was very surprised that Locke had Kate go down first. He could have tied the cable to the ladder to begin with, like he did after she disappeared. After all he was the one who was so hyped up to go down there.

The beginning was definitely a surprise. I was trying to figure out who this guy was and was I actually watching Lost or was this an advertisement for a new show.

Didn't get the connection that Desmond was the guy in the hatch until right at the end when he stepped out and called Jack "brother". So that was a shocker.

Can't wait until next week to find out what happened to the raft people.

Vyse
September 22nd, 2005, 04:59 AM
I was so shocked when Desmond was in the hatch, probably because when the show cut to that flashback, I was pissed when it went away from the main story. I don't think that Jack is a pessimist at all, he is a realist. It's just as dangerous to be foolishly optimistic as it is to be foolishly pessimistic. Sometimes miracles happen, but the chances are extremely slim, and 99% of people in similar situations don't have a miracle. If i ever hear that song again that was playing in the hatch I know I am going to get shivers down my spine!

Also, about the numbers I read an interesting post on the ABC message boards.

I recently found an interesting natuarlly occuring thoery found in our world that states everyone has a mirror image somewhere in the world. You may have heard of this. Its called Roussau's genetic mirror theory, and I must say it is very interesting. Roussau's genetic mirror theory says that everyone in the world has an exact twin somewhere, however according to the theory you never encounter this person, by laws of probablitly and other natuaral occuring phemnomen. Its the theory that was devised by a French Mathematician named Marseille Roussau in the year 1988. He used a series of numbers to explain his theory. Now I know you're not going to believe this but here goes.


4 8 15 16 23 42


Let me explain...

The 4 stands for 4 degrees of separation (not 6 or 7 as commonly stated.) Roussau believed that everyone in the world was connected by four different people. So in theory could meet yourself by using four different people connected to you. Example: Your brother's, boss's, neighbor nephew, knows your mirror. Hard to believe, I know but keep reading.

The 8 stands for the eight continent, or the only place in the world where you could meet your mirror. He calculated it to be somewhere in the south pacific. Now we know its not actually as large as the other contintents but its used figurtively because everyone in all 7 continents could meet there mirror on the 8th universal continent.

The 15 stands for the chances of you acually meeting yourself on this place, as in 15 out of 4,815,162,342. Look at the second set "815." Ring any bells? Interesting huh?

The 16 stands for the maximum amount of people that could encounter thier twin all at the same time. Think about the number of main characters.

The 23 is the number of years apart your twin and yourself are. You are not the same age as your twin. By chance and probablity it takes 23 years exactly for the same genes that made you to be connected again to form another you.

The 42 stands for the maximimum number of years your twin and yourself can be alive at the same time. However people do die at diffferent times so thats why everyone isn't dead at 75. For example my twin was born on Sept. 6 2003 b/c i was born on Spet. 6 1980. Now that doesn't mean i will die in the year 2045, I could, but its not set in stone. My twin could die when he is 16, and then the whole thing starts over again.

This is all very complicated and I don't know how well I explained it but the connections with the show are too coinidental to not be real.

Roussau and his team (wife, included) went to the 8th continent. You can figure out how they died and why by the numbers and equations. It also fits with every character. You can predict when they will die. There are others on the island who are twins of the survivors, but have been there 23 years longer.

There is a book Roussau wrote 16 years ago in 1988 when he came up with the theory. Thats where I got it from.

FoolishPleasure
September 22nd, 2005, 05:34 AM
It's times like this I wish I knew how to lip read. *sigh*

Was checking out TheFuselage this morning, but it kept crashing (everyone wants info I guess). I did see a discussion thread on Walt where folks say he is speaking backwards. If you can run the scene backwards, you'll know what he said. ;)

"Don't touch the button. The button is bad"

I dont' have any way to verify, but Desmond does say something to Jack when they meet in the hatch - that is similar. Jack goes to touch a key on the computer, and Desmond says, "I wouldn't do that."

tomduo
September 22nd, 2005, 06:05 AM
I was so shocked when Desmond was in the hatch, probably because when the show cut to that flashback, I was pissed when it went away from the main story. I don't think that Jack is a pessimist at all, he is a realist. It's just as dangerous to be foolishly optimistic as it is to be foolishly pessimistic. Sometimes miracles happen, but the chances are extremely slim, and 99% of people in similar situations don't have a miracle. If i ever hear that song again that was playing in the hatch I know I am going to get shivers down my spine!

Also, about the numbers I read an interesting post on the ABC message boards.

I recently found an interesting natuarlly occuring thoery found in our world that states everyone has a mirror image somewhere in the world. You may have heard of this. Its called Roussau's genetic mirror theory, and I must say it is very interesting. Roussau's genetic mirror theory says that everyone in the world has an exact twin somewhere, however according to the theory you never encounter this person, by laws of probablitly and other natuaral occuring phemnomen. Its the theory that was devised by a French Mathematician named Marseille Roussau in the year 1988. He used a series of numbers to explain his theory. Now I know you're not going to believe this but here goes.


4 8 15 16 23 42


Let me explain...

The 4 stands for 4 degrees of separation (not 6 or 7 as commonly stated.) Roussau believed that everyone in the world was connected by four different people. So in theory could meet yourself by using four different people connected to you. Example: Your brother's, boss's, neighbor nephew, knows your mirror. Hard to believe, I know but keep reading.

The 8 stands for the eight continent, or the only place in the world where you could meet your mirror. He calculated it to be somewhere in the south pacific. Now we know its not actually as large as the other contintents but its used figurtively because everyone in all 7 continents could meet there mirror on the 8th universal continent.

The 15 stands for the chances of you acually meeting yourself on this place, as in 15 out of 4,815,162,342. Look at the second set "815." Ring any bells? Interesting huh?

The 16 stands for the maximum amount of people that could encounter thier twin all at the same time. Think about the number of main characters.

The 23 is the number of years apart your twin and yourself are. You are not the same age as your twin. By chance and probablity it takes 23 years exactly for the same genes that made you to be connected again to form another you.

The 42 stands for the maximimum number of years your twin and yourself can be alive at the same time. However people do die at diffferent times so thats why everyone isn't dead at 75. For example my twin was born on Sept. 6 2003 b/c i was born on Spet. 6 1980. Now that doesn't mean i will die in the year 2045, I could, but its not set in stone. My twin could die when he is 16, and then the whole thing starts over again.

This is all very complicated and I don't know how well I explained it but the connections with the show are too coinidental to not be real.

Roussau and his team (wife, included) went to the 8th continent. You can figure out how they died and why by the numbers and equations. It also fits with every character. You can predict when they will die. There are others on the island who are twins of the survivors, but have been there 23 years longer.

There is a book Roussau wrote 16 years ago in 1988 when he came up with the theory. Thats where I got it from.

I've seen that, but overall I haven't seen anything to prove any of that is true. Have you found a proper source for that information?

Tok'Ra Hostess
September 22nd, 2005, 06:15 AM
I've seen that, but overall I haven't seen anything to prove any of that is true. Have you found a proper source for that information?

It doesn't matter whether it's true of false; it's still really cool that Rousseau's theories are being used in the show. :cool:

Now that's true science fiction! <applause!>

manybleemsago
September 22nd, 2005, 06:28 AM
Locke's gotta be pretty crushed by the reality of the hatch. Not exactly the key to his destiny, was it? :D

Unless his destiny is to become the next Hatch Guy? <shivers>

This show is so incredible. We almost didn't get to see it here because of tornado/severe thunderstorm weather. They completely pre-empted the hour long special that ran before the season premiere. Was that any good?

FeloniousMonk
September 22nd, 2005, 06:54 AM
It doesn't matter whether it's true of false; it's still really cool that Rousseau's theories are being used in the show. :cool:

Now that's true science fiction! <applause!>
The problem is that I'm not finding any information relating to this theory or even the aforementioned scientist. :confused: Maybe a spelling error is keeping me from finding anything but so far google and wiki have turned up nothing.

twiggy
September 22nd, 2005, 07:48 AM
well, i think that last night was a big blow to Jaters. (i'm actually a skater). but i think that it's setting up for a blowout between kate and jack. considering that kate went with jack instead of having "jack's back"

Sgt.Pepper
September 22nd, 2005, 07:53 AM
I DESPISE WORK WITH A FIREY PASSION
i had to work during it and know I know i missed a lot

prion
September 22nd, 2005, 08:33 AM
I'm a casual viewer of the show - I watch, but am obviously out of touch as I'm like Jater? What's that?

Anyway, was watching it while watching CSI's wonderful two hour episode, and was sorta annoyed that the end of the LOST episode was sooo predictable. Did anybody NOT guess that the guy Jack ran into on the bleachers would be the guy in the bomb shelter place? ;)

tomduo
September 22nd, 2005, 08:42 AM
It doesn't matter whether it's true of false; it's still really cool that Rousseau's theories are being used in the show. :cool:

Now that's true science fiction! <applause!>

What I mean is, is it from the show, or pure fan-created mumbo jumbo? :p

GateGeak
September 22nd, 2005, 08:45 AM
Didn't see that twist coming at the end, very surprised by that. I was just like "holy ****" when he said "brother" and realized who it was.

As soon as I saw him in the stadium with jack and the length of his hair, and that he was training to go around the world, I turned to my wife and "jokingly" said; "that's the guy in the hatch!" Holy sh*t was I surprised!!!

I love the show, and this ep was great. I am glad the writers answered the question of "what" was in the hatch early, and not let it hang in the end.

I still say to myself, I don't see how this can be a show that lasts for several seasons though.

ShadowMaat
September 22nd, 2005, 09:08 AM
As soon as I saw him in the stadium with jack and the length of his hair, and that he was training to go around the world, I turned to my wife and "jokingly" said; "that's the guy in the hatch!" Holy sh*t was I surprised!!!
I was thinking he'd be one of the survivors from another part of the plane. ;)

So do you think Hatch Guy is the same guy Jack met in the stadium? Or is it some kind of cloning project? ;)

VirtualCLD
September 22nd, 2005, 09:18 AM
I'm guessing it is because I haven't found anything about a real-life Marseille Roussau. A Jater is someone show is a Jack/Kate Shipper, or someone who wants to see Jack and Kate get into a relationship. Skater is someone who supports a Swayer and Kate pairing.

GateGeak
September 22nd, 2005, 09:28 AM
So do you think Hatch Guy is the same guy Jack met in the stadium? Or is it some kind of cloning project? ;)

I never gave cloning a thought, but it could make sense. If he "stadium guy" was some intense training athelete, then he could have been selected for a cloning project by the military. OR, he is the same guy and he was training for some project which brought him to the island.

The question that I keep asking myself is what is the hatch part of:

A bunker deliberately built underground for some project?
A "craft" of some kind that crashed and was salvaged to created a bunker? (The room with the computers seemed "helm like")

And lastly, where is it getting power from?

Congerking
September 22nd, 2005, 10:43 AM
Thought I would just throw this out. But DESMOND means:

Desmond
Name Gender: Male
Name Meaning: Gracious Protector
Name Origin: Anglo Saxon

Gracious Protector, interesting, yes interesting indeed......

KatG
September 22nd, 2005, 11:17 AM
Unless his destiny is to become the next Hatch Guy? <shivers>

This show is so incredible. We almost didn't get to see it here because of tornado/severe thunderstorm weather. They completely pre-empted the hour long special that ran before the season premiere. Was that any good?

The hour before the premiere was basically a recap of the highlights of Season 1. A little boring if you watched the eps several times already or have been watching the DVDs, but it was detailed enough for someone who hadn't watched S1 to understand what was going on.

VirtualCLD
September 22nd, 2005, 11:18 AM
Based on what other people have said on what they think the bunker is used for, I can't wait to see how this pans out. I'm guessing Danielle is not as crazy as she first sounded. In some sense, we're sort of made to believe she killed her fellow crew members because she thought they had become infected by some imaginary illness that was all in her head. As some other people have said, the word quarintine was on the inside of the hatch, not the outside, which may mean that anyone on the island was quarantined and not the contents of the bunker itself.

Dresdon mentioned he almost became a doctor. I'm guessing it may have somthing to do with this, whatever this is. At first I was thinking that maybe he was placed there to monitor this disease or plague that was quarantined on the island, but that seems kind of silly. He seems to be a very adament about excercise and training, which I guess is something more than just wanting to keep in shape (though I guess locked up in an underground bunker makes it difficult to get outdoor excercise). As soon as Dresdon said the line "See you in another life time" during the flashback, I knew he was the bunker guy. I'm still confuse on the whole time concept. When we saw the flashbacks to when Jack was treating his future ex-wife, he was made to look much younger. Now we know a year later he eventually marries her and they sepperate/ get divorced, but how much time was that? Was it about 16 years, or less?


The magnetic source in the hatch could be a nuclear reactor, or something else. It could be why the compasses are off upon the Island.
You know I completely forgot about that. When I went to bed later after watching Lost, I had a dream about this strong magnetic field inside an underground tunnel that was used as a security system. I completely forgot about that scene and the dream untill I read your post. :D

FoolishPleasure
September 22nd, 2005, 11:40 AM
There has been speculation that the island is more like "Island of Dr. Moreau". Scientist tinkering with DNA/nature, with disasterous results.

Wonder if Desmond is living alone underground, or if he has pals around somewhere (the "others"?). Is there another exit to the surface? Is he "observing" our survivors? What's in Desmond's drug stash and what happens when he runs out of it? How extensive is that bunker? What is the magnetic catch? Is there nuclear power? What other record albums does Desmond have? ;)

Dang. .I want answers, dammit! This show drives ya nuts. :D

SG1Atlantis
September 22nd, 2005, 12:56 PM
Desmond could have ended up on the Island on his "race around the world" and been infected with the same disease or maybe brought the disease to Rossauo(thats not spelled right but o well, u know wat i mean) and the other people on the Black Rock. Maybe what he injected himself with was a cure for the disease. Still so many questions though ahhhhhhhhh

Spimman
September 22nd, 2005, 04:17 PM
The set-up of the place is very sixties in terms of tech and accoutrements, but now we know the guy has only been down there for a couple of years at most. The hypospray thing was rather more modern, though. Or did they have those back then?

I wouldn't say a couple of years at most. If he met Jack about 3-6 years before Jack was married. The marriage lasted for 3-6 years and jack was divorced for 3-6 years it could have been much longer...I would say he met jack atleast 10 years prior to this. Possibly more...also...both of the characters look much older now than they did then.

I'm very anxious to learn more about what is down there!

Darren
September 22nd, 2005, 11:06 PM
Really fantastic episode. The Lost writers have a great talent for finally answering questions and revealing mysteries in a way that only prompts 10 more questions and deepens the same mysteries. We're left satisfied yet desperate for more!

The title really set us up for a Jack vs. Locke story, or at least a contrast. Season One ended with Locke observing that Jack is a "man of science," while he himself is a "man of faith." Jack ends with the ominous note to Kate that, if they survive the night, "We're going to have a Locke problem." Yet the episode isn't about that -- it's entirely about Jack. Maybe Jack is the man of science and the man of faith, as he is prompted by his father, his encounter with Desmond, and his entire experience with the paralyzed Sarah to look for hope in the midst of hopelessness -- to look for the miraculous and unexplainable.

The teaser blew me away. What a brilliant and brash way to show that there really is some sort of secret installation buried on the island, with at least one guy living down there. It's obviously run-down and virtually abandoned, filled with 60s-level tech -- except the stash of high-powered weapons. There is a powerful magnetic source -- is this what brought the plane down? Is it part of the defense system?

Who the heck is Desmond? Why is he living down there? Is he alone? Is he one of "the Others?" Is he really the same guy that Jack met years earlier? How long has he been there? Does he even know the island is recently populated with plane crash survivors? Is it yet another giant coincidence, or is it evidence that someone(s) deliberately brought these people here to the island for some unknown purpose(s)?

It's interesting that the word "QUARANTINE" is on the inside of the hatch. What that implies is that the island, and not the underground facility, was at one point under quarantine. Rousseau spoke of a sickness that took the members of her expedition. Could the facility have been built as a protected research station to study the illness? Perhaps the drug he is taking is a daily treatment to boost his immunity to it, a la radiation meds.

Me -- I'm convinced now that someone has deliberately worked in the pre-crash lives of our heroes in order to orchestrate their being on Flight 815, to bring them there for something. But I don't think Desmond is one of "the Others." I'm sticking with my "secret black ops military installation" theory for the island and the Others.

Oblivion147
September 23rd, 2005, 12:16 AM
Hi guys, my first post go easy.

After getting over the excitement of watching a brand new episode of Lost last night something occurred to me. During Jack’s first flashback when the two crash victims are brought into hospital, the male patients surname (who immediately dies) is Rutherford. Isn’t Shannon’s surname Rutherford? Could this be her Father, after all we know very little about her, other than her and Boone had different Dad’s!

May be nothing, but knowing this program....

Also, did anyone else find it funny how different Shannon’s hair was since the end of Season one, it seems to be twice as long.

Brilliant episode, awesome television, how I am supposed to wait a week for the next one.

ShadowMaat
September 23rd, 2005, 03:38 AM
If the crash victim's surname was the same as Shannon's, I'd say it definitely wasn't a coincidence.

Does anyone have good screencaps of the twins from the raft? The ones who took Walt? All I remember is that they were shaggy-headed like Desmond, but I think their hair was in worse condition.


Jack ends with the ominous note to Kate that, if they survive the night, "We're going to have a Locke problem."
Good catch, Darren. So does that mean there's going to be a Locke problem or a faith problem? ;) Probably both, knowing this show.

Tok'Ra Hostess
September 23rd, 2005, 05:27 AM
Here's a pic of the meds Desmond was injecting into himself. Take note of the numbers....

http://www.jenniferwheeler.com/images/Lost/vial.jpg

Also, what would the shelf life of liquid injection meds? Surely not decades?

FoolishPleasure
September 23rd, 2005, 05:31 AM
Here's a pic of the meds Desmond was injecting into himself. Take note of the numbers....

http://www.jenniferwheeler.com/images/Lost/vial.jpg

Also, what would the shelf life of liquid injection meds? Surely not decades?
TH - do you have a cap of the mural on the wall that Jack saw? My husband thinks the woman in the mural is the crazy French chick.

Scoobing
September 23rd, 2005, 06:01 AM
So could the magnetic field possibly produced by a nuclear reactor have caused the plan crash?

Also, with regards to the number 108 in the sun on the mural, the sun is 108 times bigger than the Earth.

Tok'Ra Hostess
September 23rd, 2005, 06:09 AM
TH - do you have a cap of the mural on the wall that Jack saw? My husband thinks the woman in the mural is the crazy French chick.

Here's a screencaps place for the ep.

http://www.lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&cat=40

Click on the second set on the bottom row for a series of hatch pics. Click on the individual pics to enlarge.

Enjoy. :D

FoolishPleasure
September 23rd, 2005, 06:20 AM
Here's a screencaps place for the ep.

http://www.lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&cat=40

Click on the second set on the bottom row for a series of hatch pics. Click on the individual pics to enlarge.

Enjoy. :D
OMG. . just gives me a headache. .and more questions! *LOL*

So the mural has the word "sick". .some words I can't really make out, hash marks like someone keeping track of days, stick figures, the sun w/108 inside (as mentioned above).

The kitchen pics - looks like several plates with food, unless Desmond doesn't clean up after himself. Puzzling though - the washer/dryer in the background look like new models (like the one I just bought, btw).

Desmond has a lava lamp too.

Qtyled
September 23rd, 2005, 07:11 AM
Great episode. The whole first segment i was thinking we were looking at a flashback and then... brilliant.

Regarding the 60's computers, Desmond types only numbers and spaces - no letters - into the keyboard before pressing execute. The numbers?

Tok'Ra Hostess
September 23rd, 2005, 07:38 AM
Great episode. The whole first segment i was thinking we were looking at a flashback and then... brilliant.

Regarding the 60's computers, Desmond types only numbers and spaces - no letters - into the keyboard before pressing execute. The numbers?

I'm thinking you must be right about it being a sixties computer keyboard, as i can't think of a single 70 keyboard that uses the command "execute."

Something from NASA, perhaps? Or, with a command like "execute," the cold war military?

Actually there's a screencap at Lost-media.com that shows Desmond typing and his fingers look to be in the alphabet part of the keyboard, which... may or may not mean anything. <shrugs>

About the wall drawings; the houses and stick people look like the artwork of a very young child, wouldn't you say?

Lots of contradictory stuff in that place: modern washing machine and ancient LP player, fresh meds and ancient injection system, old computers and modern weapons. Wierd.

Looks like Desmond's day is the island's night. Makes me wonder what he gets up to while the Lostaways are trying to sleep....

VirtualCLD
September 23rd, 2005, 07:48 AM
Looking at the furnishings of the "apartment" in the bunker, it looks like a 60s-70s style, especially having a turntable/vinyl record player instead of a tape player. However, the picture of that terminal computer definately looks like late 70s to mid 80s technology. In fact, I'd lean towards mid-to-late 80's. In which case, maybe that was put in place 16 years ago.

Scoobing
September 23rd, 2005, 01:21 PM
Desmond seemed to be typing in the numbers. I had a good look a few times and he is using the number row above all the letters with the space bar.

The question is, how many times are these numbers significant? I mean I know there will be some reason for them being on the side of the hatch, and what he was typing. But as for the numbers being on the vials of fluid that he injected, I think that one is a red herring.

Spimman
September 23rd, 2005, 02:35 PM
What about Desmond's bunk bed, he was on the top bunk. If I were alone I would sleep on the bottem bunk, and I wouldn't have a bunk bed at all.

RaIsMyHomeboy
September 24th, 2005, 07:51 AM
The number of keys (numbers and spaces) Desmond types corresponds to the 4 8 15 16 23 42 sequence.

Nyarlathotep
September 24th, 2005, 10:00 AM
Couple of things struck me about this episode (of which I think most have been mentioned!).

1) Desmond's 'See you in another life' comment - leading me to believe that where they are now is not 'real life', but something else.

2) The word Quarantine was on the inside of the hatch - suggesting that the islands is/was under quarantine (and perhaps that there are other entrances/exits that lead to other areas of the island or perhaps other places entirely?

3) The fact that Sarah could move her toes even though Jack was certain she would be paralysed from the waist down forever more - this suggested to me that maybe they were already in some sort of alternate reality before they even arrived on the island (or at least the weird stuff had started happening to them before then).

As ever though, I guess all my ideas will be totally blown out of the water by the rest of the season, but that's one of the things I love about this show!

Redwall
September 24th, 2005, 04:17 PM
Also, with regards to the number 108 in the sun on the mural, the sun is 108 times bigger than the Earth.

Uh, no, it isn't, (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sun) at least by volume. However, the diameter is close to 108 earths.

Qtyled
September 24th, 2005, 08:52 PM
Yes. Check it out here:

http://www.losthatch.com/images/screen_captures/S2E1_Desmond_Keyboard.gif

GateGeak
September 27th, 2005, 12:33 PM
I know this was mentioned before, but I don't think anyone really discussed it.

In the opening scenes, Desmond's bunker appeared to have windows, although partially covered with blinds, with daylight coming though them. I think it's safe to presume that the hatch is blown open in the same scenes when he suddenly dims the lights in the bunker, gets some weapons, and fine tunes his mirrors to see who's at his door. The only thing is the hatch is blown open at night on the island.

Anyone think this is a continuity eror? I doubt the writers would make such a blunder. Or, are we made to ponder if that really is sun light coming through those "windows"?

Spimman
September 27th, 2005, 07:43 PM
Well he is atleast 50 feet underground, so I would say it is a light source that has been placed behind a windows to make the bunker feel more like a home. The fact that it happened at night backs up that facor even more.

Spimman
September 27th, 2005, 07:46 PM
[QUOTE=Nyarlathotep]1) Desmond's 'See you in another life' comment - leading me to believe that where they are now is not 'real life', but something else.I'm interested to see how this plays out, I can't wait until Wednesday. I made a thread about Desmond so we can exclusivly discuss these issues.

ShadowMaat
September 28th, 2005, 04:13 PM
Hmm... I'm rewatching the premiere. I caught a few things I missed the first time around. Or missed the possible significance of things.

Like Desmond entering the code into the computer. My guess is that he HAS to enter that code once every enter-timeframe-here or else it triggers a response program which unleashes... whatever.

I wonder if this means that the invisible mechasaur "leaked out" or if it's part of something else. The outside security force some have suggested. Or a side effect, like cumulative radiation affecting the local wildlife.

EDIT: And bunk beds. Or at least on extra, unoccupied bed. Hmmm...

Anubis
September 30th, 2005, 10:51 AM
Sweet episode, that's for sure. Certainly answers some questions, but gives us a load more to think about. "See you in another life," when I saw the side of his face, I instantly thought, 'hey, that's Desmond.' ;)

Sweet episode, for sure.

Qasim
November 20th, 2005, 09:58 AM
I was like OMG OMG all the way through just amazing

Resident-Seven
February 5th, 2006, 06:40 AM
I was so shocked when Desmond was in the hatch, probably because when the show cut to that flashback, I was pissed when it went away from the main story. I don't think that Jack is a pessimist at all, he is a realist. It's just as dangerous to be foolishly optimistic as it is to be foolishly pessimistic. Sometimes miracles happen, but the chances are extremely slim, and 99% of people in similar situations don't have a miracle. If i ever hear that song again that was playing in the hatch I know I am going to get shivers down my spine!

Also, about the numbers I read an interesting post on the ABC message boards.

I recently found an interesting natuarlly occuring thoery found in our world that states everyone has a mirror image somewhere in the world. You may have heard of this. Its called Roussau's genetic mirror theory, and I must say it is very interesting. Roussau's genetic mirror theory says that everyone in the world has an exact twin somewhere, however according to the theory you never encounter this person, by laws of probablitly and other natuaral occuring phemnomen. Its the theory that was devised by a French Mathematician named Marseille Roussau in the year 1988. He used a series of numbers to explain his theory. Now I know you're not going to believe this but here goes.


4 8 15 16 23 42


Let me explain...

The 4 stands for 4 degrees of separation (not 6 or 7 as commonly stated.) Roussau believed that everyone in the world was connected by four different people. So in theory could meet yourself by using four different people connected to you. Example: Your brother's, boss's, neighbor nephew, knows your mirror. Hard to believe, I know but keep reading.

The 8 stands for the eight continent, or the only place in the world where you could meet your mirror. He calculated it to be somewhere in the south pacific. Now we know its not actually as large as the other contintents but its used figurtively because everyone in all 7 continents could meet there mirror on the 8th universal continent.

The 15 stands for the chances of you acually meeting yourself on this place, as in 15 out of 4,815,162,342. Look at the second set "815." Ring any bells? Interesting huh?

The 16 stands for the maximum amount of people that could encounter thier twin all at the same time. Think about the number of main characters.

The 23 is the number of years apart your twin and yourself are. You are not the same age as your twin. By chance and probablity it takes 23 years exactly for the same genes that made you to be connected again to form another you.

The 42 stands for the maximimum number of years your twin and yourself can be alive at the same time. However people do die at diffferent times so thats why everyone isn't dead at 75. For example my twin was born on Sept. 6 2003 b/c i was born on Spet. 6 1980. Now that doesn't mean i will die in the year 2045, I could, but its not set in stone. My twin could die when he is 16, and then the whole thing starts over again.

This is all very complicated and I don't know how well I explained it but the connections with the show are too coinidental to not be real.

Roussau and his team (wife, included) went to the 8th continent. You can figure out how they died and why by the numbers and equations. It also fits with every character. You can predict when they will die. There are others on the island who are twins of the survivors, but have been there 23 years longer.

There is a book Roussau wrote 16 years ago in 1988 when he came up with the theory. Thats where I got it from.
The only problem with that theory is that its complete jiberish. Not mention that it doesn't take into account that "exactly" every 23 years your dna is procuded again, and you and your twin can be alive at the same time for 42 years, meaning that when the younger one is 23, another one will be made, making 3 of the same person, which would increase the chances of meeting at least one of your "twins". So not only did this Rousseau guy pull numbers from nowhere, he didn't even go into detail and all the possabilities of more than just 2 "twins" at a time.

ItsDan
February 5th, 2006, 06:27 PM
That theory has long be reduced to nothing but made up garbage :)

Naonak
May 3rd, 2006, 09:21 AM
Man, the makers of Lost are elaborate.

Spoilers for people who haven't seen episode 2.03 - Orientation:
In the first advert break in England there was an advert for the Hanso Foundation. When I saw that I went nuts.

Metarock Sam
May 3rd, 2006, 09:50 AM
I saw that too. Im sure it was also on one of the breaks in channel 4 aswell.

RuleBritannia
May 3rd, 2006, 12:01 PM
Maybe the hatch wasn't locked from the inside and maybe Quarentine wasn't written on the inside.

Metarock Sam
May 3rd, 2006, 01:06 PM
The only problem I had with this eppy is the plotholes like what happens to Locke when Kate was dragged down. Luckily much of this is resolved in episode two.

NowIWillDestroyAbydos
June 1st, 2006, 04:41 AM
Well, I watched the repeat of this episode last night (it was my first time watching it). I thought it was pretty interesting, I like that music playing at the beginning of the episode while what's his face was in the hatch (before the Blast happened, and the music ended). I give it a ***.

rushy
July 16th, 2011, 08:39 AM
i was wondering that too. what if the island is actually the inside and the hatch is the way out, like a giant biodome, like in "The Truman Show"
The Truman Show? What Truman Show? Is there a show called Truman Show?

the-nothing
October 1st, 2011, 12:37 AM
yeah definitely but it in no way compares to LOST or Series 2 (which is the best series of LOST)

this whole thing with THE HATCH was awesome

I have recorded the part in "LOST ON PC" where you get to the HATCH but I can't find it now, here is me on the beach http://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/5843482480/in/photostream but THE HATCH was so awesome, I realy loved getting to there in the game