Do we have to have canon ship at all on Atlantis?

[astronomicalchick]

I ask that question because in my mind, although I do ship Sheppard/Weir, I feel quite strongly that I don't need to have canon ship on screen. I'm more than happy with strong team scenes that can be intepreted the way a person likes to see them.

Let's look at the benefits:

1. Non-shippers don't get switched off by the show or feel they have to gouge their eyes out with pot scourers.
2. 'Shippy stories don't get in the way of of stronger stories.
3. No ship wars - even though I think we've managed to avoid that so far on this forum.
4. If your ship doesn't go your way, you don't have to gouge your eyes out with pot scourers, and you can continue your fun in fandom.
5. This PTB have a woeful, woeful record with ship. Why not just leave it be guys? Concentrate on what you're good at - let fandom play with their ships.
6. Resolved ship is boring... zzzzzzzzzzzzz. Half the fun is projecting onto it and doing the over analysing.

ergo, everybody is happy... or are they?

[Willow'sCat]

I ask that question because in my mind, although I do ship Sheppard/Weir, I feel quite strongly that I don't need to have canon ship on screen. I'm more than happy with strong team scenes that can be intepreted the way a person likes to see them.

Not another one, we may have to start a thread about not starting these threads.

I don't think anyone cares anymore do they? What is this "canon" I always thought that was Catholic related?

[FoolishPleasure]

The last thing I want to see in my sci-fi shows are the major characters sucking face and having soap opera "triangles" (Shep/Weir/Teyla, or Shep/Teyla/Dex). It takes so much away from the stories that could be told. The only sci-fi show that had a decent romance was "Babylon 5" but even then it was minimized and we didn't see the characters chewing or sweating all over each other.

Personally, I like Shep/Weir, but I like the "glances" and "hints" that have been going on all along, and I don't really need to get into smoochies and sharing quarters. Nor do I want to see it - with anyone. Fan Fic out there is excellent, for all different ships, and if people want to get hot and heavy with their pairings, you can take whatever path you want.

TPTB need to toss out the "Baywatch" romos and just stick to good sci-fi/adventure. We don't want to be "jumping the shark" just yet.

[astronomicalchick]

Not another one, we may have to start a thread about not starting these threads.

I don't think anyone cares anymore do they? What is this "canon" I always thought that was Catholic related?

What other threads? Explain what you mean.

On the contrary I think people do care a lot about their ship and whether its promoted above another. Witness at least two threads were someone has seen fit to express their desire that a person isn't shipped with another. If we had no canon ship then we could all play in our respective fandom sand pits.

[Lida]

The last thing I want to see in my sci-fi shows are the major characters sucking face and having soap opera "triangles" (Shep/Weir/Teyla, or Shep/Teyla/Dex). It takes so much away from the stories that could be told. The only sci-fi show that had a decent romance was "Babylon 5" but even then it was minimized and we didn't see the characters chewing or sweating all over each other.

Personally, I like Shep/Weir, but I like the "glances" and "hints" that have been going on all along, and I don't really need to get into smoochies and sharing quarters. Nor do I want to see it - with anyone. Fan Fic out there is excellent, for all different ships, and if people want to get hot and heavy with their pairings, you can take whatever path you want.

TPTB need to toss out the "Baywatch" romos and just stick to good sci-fi/adventure. We don't want to be "jumping the shark" just yet.

Excuse me, "Baywatch romos"? I don't remember seeing anything on either SG-1 or SGA that could remotely be called that. And any reason you picked Baywatch?

I agree with everything else you said, especially the remark about "sucking face"....what a picture that conjures.......maybe they could use that idea though, in a completely sci-fi context, of course.

As for a thread on no threads? I thought once the new season started, things would get less "strange", not more. Are we all being affected by some new strain of virus, causing collective silliness and lack of normal judgement? I better check the new journals.....

[astronomicalchick]

Excuse me, "Baywatch romos"? I don't remember seeing anything on either SG-1 or SGA that could remotely be called that. And any reason you picked Baywatch?

I agree with everything else you said, especially the remark about "sucking face"....what a picture that conjures.......maybe they could use that idea though, in a completely sci-fi context, of course.

As for a thread on no threads? I thought once the new season started, things would get less "strange", not more. Are we all being affected by some new strain of virus, causing collective silliness and lack of normal judgement? I better check the new journals.....

It's not a thread on no thread,I'm not suggesting we stop shipper threads, far from it! But if we had no canon ship on Atlantis we'd be free to play in our own ships and there would be less opportunity for ship wars.

And don't call me silly.

[T_S]

I ask that question because in my mind, although I do ship Sheppard/Weir, I feel quite strongly that I don't need to have canon ship on screen. I'm more than happy with strong team scenes that can be intepreted the way a person likes to see them.

Let's look at the benefits:

1. Non-shippers don't get switched off by the show or feel they have to gouge their eyes out with pot scourers.
2. 'Shippy stories don't get in the way of of stronger stories.
3. No ship wars - even though I think we've managed to avoid that so far on this forum.
4. If your ship doesn't go your way, you don't have to gouge your eyes out with pot scourers, and you can continue your fun in fandom.
5. This PTB have a woeful, woeful record with ship. Why not just leave it be guys? Concentrate on what you're good at - let fandom play with their ships.
6. Resolved ship is boring... zzzzzzzzzzzzz. Half the fun is projecting onto it and doing the over analysing.

ergo, everybody is happy... or are they?

As a non-shipper I totally with you.

When watching the show, I'm expecting to see science-fiction, action and adventure (point 1); I do enjoy character development, because well, you are seeing those guys do stuff, at some point it gets interresting to know who they are and what their motivations for doing what they do is. What I mean is that I don't mind having a bit of interpersonal relationships thrown in for good measure, however I think it shouldn't take too much screen time (point 2).

Besides, I can understand points 3 to 6 whilst not being a shipper.

[Qasim]

LOL I dont think they will be sharing quarters!

Ship will exist on SGA but they will keep it locked up like SG1 by that I mean the characters will have feelings for each other but wont actually have relationships

[FoolishPleasure]

Excuse me, "Baywatch romos"? I don't remember seeing anything on either SG-1 or SGA that could remotely be called that. And any reason you picked Baywatch?

Baywatch is simply the most awful, stereotypical "jiggly" show ever created. Any time tacky romo or skimpy attire (not pertaining to plot) is suggested or shown we refer to it as, "Baywatching". And none of us wants SG1 or SGA to be another "Baywatch".

[ShadowMaat]

Kudos for astro for starting a thread that's likely to get her crucified by all the people who can't be bothered to see the truth of what she's trying to say and instead condemn her for what they think she's saying.

Personally, Astro, I agree with you. Why do we need canon (factually proven) ship? Atlantis is a scifi action/adventure series. There is human drama, yes, but I don't think that human drama automatically has to translate into "people who want to have sex with each other".

People who want to see shippy moments will see shippy moments regardless of whether or not their chosen characters ever play tonsil hockey. But those who don't see ship and don't want to see ship shouldn't have it forced upon them. At least, not in my opinion.

NO ONE should have to gouge out their eyes to protect themselves from whatever hideous fate lies in store for them on the show, be it the "wrong" people getting together, the "right" people never getting together, or ANY people getting together.

IMO, ship DOES get substituted for plots and it's because (again, IMO) TPTB of the show don't know how to write good ship. They're too heavy and obvious with it, they don't know the difference between subtle and being hit with an elephant and they think that EVERYONE wants it, all the time.

Leave ship for fanfics and internet postings. Let fans draw their OWN conclusions. Contrary to popular belief, some of us DO have brains and DO know how to use them and we can be quite good at figuring things out without having to be told. If only we'd be given the chance.

And, of course, we can always ignore the stuff we don't want to see. Selective blindness can be a wonderful thing.

[ToasterOnFire]

I ask that question because in my mind, although I do ship Sheppard/Weir, I feel quite strongly that I don't need to have canon ship on screen. I'm more than happy with strong team scenes that can be intepreted the way a person likes to see them.

Sounds good to me! I'm currently out of pot scourers anyway (damn those pots!).

Whether or not TPTB listens, however, remains to be seen...

[Cory Holmes]

I doubt very much the Powers That Be will listen and keep the romantic relationships off to the side, if only because they have demonstrated a complete lack of true originiality in their shows.

Make no mistake, SG-1 and SGA have some amazingly original plotlines and stories and twists, but the PTBs have always offset that by jumping feet-first into several tired and wrought-out cliches that just demolish what they've already done.

[Col. Newman]

they have hinted at a possible Weir/shep ship and a possible Tayla/Shep ship i would like to see a Weir/Shep ship

[ShadowMaat]

It isn't just a lack of originality, it's the fact that they're giving in to their little fanboy fantasies, and what do most little fanboys want but to get the girl? Or possibly the guy, depending on the nature of the fanboy.

I know that sounds like a horrible generalization, but then again, TPTB are all about horrible generalizations, aren't they? So perhaps, where they're concerned, the generalization is a little more apt. *shrug* At least that's how it looks from my POV. And if you want proof of the fanboy corruption of TPTB, look no further than Vala.

Granted, the taint of SG-1 hasn't contaminated Atlantis... much... but it's still early and I have little doubt that Atlantis will eventually devolve into a shippy little angst-fest as devoid of intelligent storylines as, well, the current season of SG-1. Again, that's my opinion. HOWEVER, I am also hoping, praying, and making daily sacrifices to certain nameless dark gods that the shippy putrefecation of Atlantis won't happen for a good, long time.

Personally, I would be GREATLY reassured if Atlantis had its OWN PTB instead of suffering cross-contamination from SG-1. *sigh* I could name some good showrunners who have years of experience handling complex plots ind intricate characters. They even know a thing or two about adding subtle shadings of ship that don't outrage audiences.

Edit: Don't get me wrong, TPTB are still good at what they do, otherwise SG-1 wouldn't still be on the air and Atlantis would never have happened. It's just that what they're choosing to do now seems to be counter to what they used to do and I get the impression that they're happier resting on their laurels most of the time than in trying to stretch any boundaries- be it ship or other things. And no matter how good TPTB are (or were, or whatever), you will never convince me that ship is something they know how to write.

Not everyone can write everything brilliantly. Each writer has their own strenths and weaknesses. It's just that, to me, TPTB as a group are incompetent in the area of ship. Maybe if they stopped trying to steer everything in that direction they'd be able to concentrate more on their strengths.

[sg-1fanintn]

I firmly believe that to be real, characters should be able to grow, change and react to the people around them and the experiences they have. Without that capacity, they become cardboard cutouts, and less interesting to me.

That being said, I hope we don't have canon ship on SGA. Why? Because TPTB have made no one happy with the way they've handled Jack and Sam on SG-1. They've tried to be purposefully vague in order not to anger any segment of the fan base. But in doing so, they've made things more unpleasant for the shippers (yes, including me), and have created a situation where a segment of fans really hate Sam.

Last Friday, when Shep returned to Atlantis from his presumed kamakaze mission, Elizabeth met him with a spontaneous hug. What transpired after was about 30 seconds of dialogue where both could be interpreted as being interested in each other, but trying to keep from showing it. I thought, "Just don't even go there!" TPTB can play with hooking up various characters if they want to, but I'm going to try my darndest to see them all as just good friends.....because I don't want the wishy-washy ship we've had in SG1. Either make it canon and be upfront about it, or don't do it at all! It's too late for Sam and Jack. But I encourage TPTB to either fish or cut bait on SGA. Do it or don't, but make up your mind and stick with it!