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Thread: how would a person really react if they found out about the stargate program?

  1. #21
    Second Lieutenant McAvoy's Avatar
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    Default Re: how would a person really react if they found out about the stargate program?

    I think it has more to do with protesting and all of that. We have seen how bad protests can get.

  2. #22
    Lieutenant Colonel Rise Of The Phoenix's Avatar
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    Default Re: how would a person really react if they found out about the stargate program?

    Quote Originally Posted by KEK View Post
    I really don't buy the mass hysteria theory. I mean, how would that even manifest itself? What, so people would see the revelation on the news an immediately take to the streets? I really don't see that happening.
    Agreed, especially in peace time.

    It's not like people don't already know we're studying space and that other solar systems and planets are out there.
    Going by the numbers alone it's obvious to most people that life has to exist out there in the universe.
    Even amongst religous people the fanatical, kill everything that's different from you attitude is only present in a small few.

    If it can be physically proven to people then you can't deny it and denying doesn't make it go away.

    Different religous people don't deny that different species and nationalities exist.
    They don't deny that a rocket can send a person into space.
    The majority of religous people don't deny that technology exists, hell even the amish don't do that, they just don't use it unless on Rumspringa.

    Your average modern person probably wouldn't let the news effect their daily life, until advanced technologies filter into the world.
    Last edited by Rise Of The Phoenix; April 25th, 2012 at 12:25 AM.

  3. #23
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    Default Re: how would a person really react if they found out about the stargate program?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rise Of The Phoenix View Post
    Going by the numbers alone it's obvious to most people that life has to exist out there in the universe.
    when ever I hear calculations and arguments in favour of that they all seem to be based on the assumption that life is inevitable given earth like conditions. I don't understand what the basis for that assumption is when surly all the evidence shows is that life is merely possible given earth like conditions,...... I mean for all we know maybe only 1 in 99999999999 planets like earth ever develop life
    Last edited by slimjim; April 25th, 2012 at 07:42 AM.

  4. #24
    Lieutenant Colonel Rise Of The Phoenix's Avatar
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    Default Re: how would a person really react if they found out about the stargate program?

    Quote Originally Posted by slimjim View Post
    when ever I hear calculations and arguments in favour of that they all seem to be based on the assumption that life is inevitable given earth like conditions. I don't understand what the basis for that assumption is when surly all the evidence shows is that life is merely possible given earth like conditions,...... I mean for all we know maybe only 1 in 99999999999 planets like earth ever develop life
    Hasn't it been proven that the right temperature and presence of liquid water will allow for microbial life to form?
    Even if 1 in 99999999999 planets have life similar to our's on them that still leaves potentially billions of galaxies out there that can each have a planet like Earth on them, depending on how old those galaxies are.

    We have discovered planets orbiting in the habitibal zone of other Sol like Stars, of course if and when we get out there nothings for certain, but we can make educated guesses.

    We don't have to just assume that our conditions are the only ones that will allow for life of some kind, there could be a whole bunch of different conditions that can allow for different types of life to form.

    I know it's all hypothical at the moment, but we'd have to be pretty arrogant or ignorant to not entertain the possibility that we're not and IMO it's that possibility, because of the vastness of the universe that there will be a number of different species out there, that communicates and likely has technology far more advanced than our's.

    I have to say, this is just my point of view, I know it's not fact, but I know there are people that share my views and that open mindedness means I wouldn't be one of the few that would go crazy if the news was broken of some other species, technologies or knowledge existing that is foreign to this planet.

  5. #25
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    Default Re: how would a person really react if they found out about the stargate program?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rise Of The Phoenix View Post
    Hasn't it been proven that the right temperature and presence of liquid water will allow for microbial life to form?
    no, I'm pretty sure it hasn't been proven that life can spontaneously generate in water

  6. #26
    Lieutenant Colonel Rise Of The Phoenix's Avatar
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    Default Re: how would a person really react if they found out about the stargate program?

    Quote Originally Posted by slimjim View Post
    no, I'm pretty sure it hasn't been proven that life can spontaneously generate in water
    How did you get to "spontaneously generate in water" from what I wrote?
    I said with the right temperature and if liquid water's there it will allow for microbial life to form.

    I didn't say other things weren't needed, but if the building blocks of life are here then why should Earth be so special as to be the only place in the universe to have those ingredients and if life started here through some random convergence of events then why can't the same things happen elsewher, basically because of the vaste number of stars, planets and solar systems probability dictates that it should happen elsewhere.

    Unless of course there's a god or gods that wished us into existence, but having the universe out there seems like a waste of space for just one semi-intelligent species to form.

  7. #27
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    Default Re: how would a person really react if they found out about the stargate program?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rise Of The Phoenix View Post
    How did you get to "spontaneously generate in water" from what I wrote?
    Quote Originally Posted by Rise Of The Phoenix View Post
    I didn't say other things weren't needed,
    because you didn't mention any thing else, you just said water
    Quote Originally Posted by Rise Of The Phoenix View Post
    if the building blocks of life are here then why should Earth be so special as to be the only place in the universe to have those ingredients and if life started here through some random convergence of events then why can't the same things happen elsewher, basically because of the vaste number of stars, planets and solar systems probability dictates that it should happen elsewhere.
    it might not happen else where because the odds of life forming naturally might be higher then number of earth like planets in this universe.....or not, that's my point WE DON'T KNOW THE ODDS. It's note reasonable to make predictions based on a sampling of one

  8. #28
    Lieutenant Colonel Rise Of The Phoenix's Avatar
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    Default Re: how would a person really react if they found out about the stargate program?

    Quote Originally Posted by slimjim View Post
    because you didn't mention any thing else, you just said water
    We're talking about planets, not just water contained in a vacume with only heat to somehow stimulate.
    Even on a simingly dead hunk of rock you have minerals, different kinds of minerals.
    I didn't think it was necessary to elaborate in major detail to get the point accross that any water will mix with stuff from the environment it's in.

    it might not happen else where because the odds of life forming naturally might be higher then number of earth like planets in this universe.....or not, that's my point
    What you've written here sounds like you're stating there's a better chance of life happening somewhere else, from how it reads at least.
    Obviously that's not in the context of what you've been arguing elsewhere in this thread.

    Basically what I'm saying is if the building blocks are there, the same raw materials and conditions then there's no reason why life shouldn't form.

    WE DON'T KNOW THE ODDS. It's note reasonable to make predictions based on a sampling of one
    We've found life in microbe form in almost every kind of environment on Earth, we have wild temperature differences, yet there's life.
    We can say by studying the variety of conditions on Earth what conditions we know to allow for life.

    The variety of places life connected to our evolution can form in allows us to work out certain perameters that life can exist within, then it's a matter of like I've been saying the building blocks and various conditions, you can use all of those things to work out upper and lower limits.

    I'm not arguing that a lack of minerals needed and the presence of water, heat and light will allow for life, but that in combination and sitting inside that upper and lower limit life has been proven to form, match those conditions and I see no reason life shouldn't form, the other stuff like intelligence and tech development are of course a different thing, but it's not like what I've mentioned here hasn't been put on the news, in papers, books and on the internet.
    People have been made aware of this stuff and I doubt it would come as a massive shock that life is possible on other planets.

  9. #29
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    Default Re: how would a person really react if they found out about the stargate program?

    The chaos and mayhem in mass protest probably wouldn't manifest right away. But if the Stargate Program as it exists in the series is revealed to us in today's society, then it would cause numerous countries to distrust the US. Even the countries who are part of the IOA would face unrest in their own nations.

    Each country would have to justify the spending of millions of dollars to fund the SGC operations without having told the public where their tax dollars are going, and of course there are always those individuals who would resent the funding of such an undertaking when there are so many problems here on Earth that need fixing. Some might ask "why push out into the galaxy when we have genocide and mass starvation happening in our own backyard?"

    Citizens would be distrustful of their governments, and the minute that happens on a massive scale like this would be, the protests and "mass hysteria". Humans often fear what they don't understand, and in times of fear their flight or fight mode kicks in. With a mob mentality, it's often the "fight" that prevails.

    But that's just from my point of view. I'd like to think we're above all that, but in all honesty, we're hardly so academic to appreciate the SGC for what it is: an incredible step into the future for all mankind.
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  10. #30
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    Default Re: how would a person really react if they found out about the stargate program?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rise Of The Phoenix View Post
    We're talking about planets, not just water contained in a vacume with only heat to somehow stimulate.
    Even on a simingly dead hunk of rock you have minerals, different kinds of minerals.
    I didn't think it was necessary to elaborate in major detail to get the point accross that any water will mix with stuff from the environment it's in.


    Quote Originally Posted by Rise Of The Phoenix View Post
    What you've written here sounds like you're stating there's a better chance of life happening somewhere else, from how it reads at least.
    Obviously that's not in the context of what you've been arguing elsewhere in this thread.
    well I was trying to say the opposite

    Quote Originally Posted by Rise Of The Phoenix View Post
    Basically what I'm saying is if the building blocks are there, the same raw materials and conditions then there's no reason why life shouldn't form.
    there's no reason to think it should



    Quote Originally Posted by Rise Of The Phoenix View Post
    We've found life in microbe form in almost every kind of environment on Earth, we have wild temperature differences, yet there's life.
    We can say by studying the variety of conditions on Earth what conditions we know to allow for life.

    The variety of places life connected to our evolution can form in allows us to work out certain perameters that life can exist within, then it's a matter of like I've been saying the building blocks and various conditions, you can use all of those things to work out upper and lower limits.
    earth is still only one sampling because all the life in our different habitats are related

  11. #31
    Lieutenant Colonel Rise Of The Phoenix's Avatar
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    Default Re: how would a person really react if they found out about the stargate program?

    Quote Originally Posted by slimjim View Post
    well I was trying to say the opposite
    That's why I said I understood what you were getting from reading the rest of that and your other posts

    there's no reason to think it should
    Life's formed in a multitude of different conditions here, there's no reason to think it shouldn't form elsewhere and frankly it's arrogant to do so when it comes down to certain elements and events coming together, a bunch of basic processes and stages make life happen.

    earth is still only one sampling because all the life in our different habitats are related
    The Earth is a planetary body with minerals, an atmosphere, water, that's bombarded by the Sun's rays.
    Unless there's something special about our planet there's no reason to believe life won't form on a similar planetary body.

    Basically unless this planet was intelligently designed by beings more advanced than us the numbers make it impossible that life hasn't formed elsewhere in this universe or others if multiverse theory is right.
    Either way some other kind of life has to exist.

  12. #32
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    Default Re: how would a person really react if they found out about the stargate program?

    Quote Originally Posted by slimjim View Post
    when Carter was considering telling Pete Shanahan about the stargate program and it's exploits she said something to the effect of
    "you justify it to your self by telling your self they couldn't handle it....but the thing is I think he could"
    what does she mean by "couldn't handle it"? what do they think would happen to a normal person if they found out about the SGC?
    Flip out.. Notice how many of the tv shows/films that HAVE shown aliens to us humans had mass riots and panic.. That's cause they couldn't handle it.

    Watch Season 10, "The Road Not Taken" to find out one possible scenario. It was also stated that on a few other planets, the public finding out about their stargate lead to the destruction of the world - by its inhabitants. Too many sides being taken that led to war and armageddon.
    Yup, take a look at Tegalus.. Brought to the bring of annihilation cause of the revealing of the SG existence..

    Actually, asking folks *here* is not a very good cross-section of the population. Folks here tend to be open to new ideas and are eager to explore - the universe if possible, their own existence at the very least. Not so with the general population. A great many people are closed-minded, with a center-of-the-universe attitude. Many others are so wrapped up in their day-to-day world, that it would make little, if any, difference whatsoever. Face it, if the mass of the general public were truly *interested* in what's out there, NASA's funding would never be cut, and exploration would be a priority rather than constantly expanding the defense budget.
    Yup. Take a look at how many religions we have, that are all about themselves and not really open to the ideas of others.. Multiply that world wide, and you have a big chunk of the population who would not just be hesitant about the info released we are truely not the center of the universe, but that we are insignificant.

    I don't think mass panic would be an issue, unless aliens are baring down on the planet and they are capable of making every species on the planet exitinct when a reveal happens.
    Look at the ep, "The road not taken". YES it came about cause of the Ori, but they did have mass panic. Also Icon, and that ep where Te'alc got almost blinded.

    People would be outraged that specific technology could have been used to save their husband/wife/child and would call for the entire program to be restaffed. There would be people who would demand the right to use the gate, probably being captured and killed by others out there. Groups and corporations would want their own planet to gather resources and trade with the galaxy.
    Oh most definitely. Heck i could even see a new business forming.. Lawyers taking on lawsuits from those who want to sue the SGC for NOT releasing that tech that could have saved their loved one (such as tretonin helping those with say HIV, or better armor for cops, or stunners for people gunned down by cops accidently)..

    Each country would have to justify the spending of millions of dollars to fund the SGC operations without having told the public where their tax dollars are going, and of course there are always those individuals who would resent the funding of such an undertaking when there are so many problems here on Earth that need fixing. Some might ask "why push out into the galaxy when we have genocide and mass starvation happening in our own backyard?"
    Good point Selene.. We would get lots of cries of "Why save other planets when we can't even stop the sudan (or other africian nation) enslaving/killing their own people"..

  13. #33
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    Default Re: how would a person really react if they found out about the stargate program?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rise Of The Phoenix View Post
    That's why I said I understood what you were getting from reading the rest of that and your other posts
    thanks


    Quote Originally Posted by Rise Of The Phoenix View Post
    Life's formed in a multitude of different conditions here, there's no reason to think it shouldn't form elsewhere and frankly it's arrogant to do so when it comes down to certain elements and events coming together, a bunch of basic processes and stages make life happen.
    no life has speared to "multitude of different conditions here"
    "a bunch of basic processes and stages make life happen" which are?


    Quote Originally Posted by Rise Of The Phoenix View Post
    The Earth is a planetary body with minerals, an atmosphere, water, that's bombarded by the Sun's rays.
    Unless there's something special about our planet there's no reason to believe life won't form on a similar planetary body
    we have no reason to think the earth isn't "special"

    Quote Originally Posted by Rise Of The Phoenix View Post
    Basically unless this planet was intelligently designed by beings more advanced than us the numbers make it impossible that life hasn't formed elsewhere in this universe or others if multiverse theory is right.
    Either way some other kind of life has to exist.
    Oh I'm confident there are other planets with life else where in the multiverse.... but then I'm also confident Tutankhamun is having sex with Adolf Hitler right now else where in the multiverse

  14. #34
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    Default Re: how would a person really react if they found out about the stargate program?

    I would be quite thrilled to live in the Stargate universe. I am not known for panic.
    He who controls the spice controls the universe!(And the kitchen.)

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  15. #35
    Lieutenant Colonel Rise Of The Phoenix's Avatar
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    Default Re: how would a person really react if they found out about the stargate program?

    Quote Originally Posted by slimjim View Post
    thanks
    No problem.

    no life has speared to "multitude of different conditions here"
    The Earth is a biosphere with a variety of different environments, contained within this sphere.
    There isn't just one part of the planet where life exists, it exists in the coldest and hottest places on the planet.

    "a bunch of basic processes and stages make life happen" which are?
    There's no one consesus on exactly how all of the basic molecules formed, there are a variety of processess shown in this link, it will lead to information on Abiogenisis: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abiogenesis

    The Miller-Urey Experiment showed that when you combine water, hydrogen, methane and ammonia (all present on the Earth billions of years ago) that an electrical spark would yield between 11 to 20 of the ammino acids required for forming basic molecules.

    I'll quote the wikipedia link:
    There is abundant evidence of major volcanic eruptions 4 billion years ago, which would have released carbon dioxide, nitrogen, hydrogen sulfide (H2S), and sulfur dioxide (SO2) into the atmosphere.

    Experiments using these gases in addition to the ones in the original Miller–Urey experiment have produced more diverse molecules.[8]
    Essentially Volcanoes released important chemicals into the atmosphere, lightning started off chain reactions that went on to form basic molecules fundementally important to forming more complex forms of life, which when combined with other basic elements then went on to evolve into other forms of life, billions of years from the start we have a massive variety of lifeforms that we know of today.

    we have no reason to think the earth isn't "special"
    The Earth is only special because of it's distance from Sol, it's atmosphere and that it has an abundance of ingrediants like water and other chemicals needed for the chemical reactions that are responsible for creating the basic lifeforms that then went on to combine and evolve into more complex lifeforms over billions of years.

    Oh I'm confident there are other planets with life else where in the multiverse.... but then I'm also confident Tutankhamun is having sex with Adolf Hitler right now else where in the multiverse
    Lol anything's possible in the multiverse I guess, but life forming on many other planets and intelligence coming out of that in droves is far more likely given how life is believed to have begun on Earth.
    We can't test multiverse theory though.
    Last edited by Rise Of The Phoenix; April 28th, 2012 at 09:37 PM.

  16. #36
    First Lieutenant Aesop's Avatar
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    Default Re: how would a person really react if they found out about the stargate program?

    I think hedwig has it right, any number of scenarios could and likely would play out. I think as long as our planet's divided the way it is and there's opposing ideals then a Stargate would only be a source of contention and not appreciated for what it is.

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