Do you think Teyla would have eventually been written out?

[Lythisrose]

No doubt McKay and Sheppard were used a lot, It was the McKay/Sheppard show.

In the first 4 seasons Teyla was used. She had dialogue, and an arc of sorts. Then BOOM nothing for Teyla to do, cause Keller was there. *shruggs*

The way I see it is that they essentially wrote out or sidelined any strong female character (including Carter) in order to give their favorite character (McKay) a love interest. If she had been utilized better with her own importance to the story rather than being either the damsel or the desired, it might not look so bad. I do blame Gero and Co for this.

[Hagazussa]

The whole Carter on Atlantis thing have always bugged me, the character is so weak compared to how she is portrayed in SG1, and why do she hardly ever actually work alongside McKay in the lab, sure she is the base leader but when there is a crisis everyone chips in where they can and she is as good a scientist as him.

I however do not think that Keller is a weak character, yes she is not a strong fighter, but she have other strengths. As for Teyla I do not think she would have been written out unless the actor left, that have often been the reason for characters leaving the actors leaving the show for whatever reason, but I think she is such a popular character that if they could keep her they would.

[Falcon Horus]

As for Teyla I do not think she would have been written out unless the actor left, that have often been the reason for characters leaving the actors leaving the show for whatever reason...

Neither Paul or Torri wanted to leave of their own free will.

...but I think she is such a popular character that if they could keep her they would.

If that was the case why didn't we see more of her? Why didn't we get more stories centering around her character or the Athosians? Where are all her fans defending her honor?

You might want to rethink that statement if I were you...

[LT. COL. John Sheppard]

Neither Paul or Torri wanted to leave of their own free will.

how sad see even John is upset

[The Lady Blue]

If that was the case why didn't we see more of her? Why didn't we get more stories centering around her character or the Athosians? Where are all her fans defending her honor?

You might want to rethink that statement if I were you...

She's popular in the sense that people like her as a character and as a part of the main team. The writers did a poor job writing for her because one of them explained (I think it was mulkie) that they couldn't identify with the character, a character they created, whatever that means... She's a quiet character like Beckett, and they didn't realize how popular he was until they killed him off.

I don't think too many people are doing too much 'defending' of anyone these days seeing as the series has been off the air for more than 3 years and what's done is done. It would be good not to misread that.

[fumblesmcstupid]

Sometimes when you mess with the way a show works and then start leaving characters out, it leads to people not watching or if you bring in a character that people don't like it really does effect the continuation or cancelation of a show.

[Falcon Horus]

I don't think too many people are doing too much 'defending' of anyone these days seeing as the series has been off the air for more than 3 years and what's done is done. It would be good not to misread that.

That was a poor choice of words on my behalf - my apologies. I actually meant it in the way of how active her thread is in relation to other threads here on GW in the Characters & Relationship part of the forum... There's tumbleweed somewhere on the second page (I think).

[rushy]

Personally, I would've wanted Ford to stay, he was great. One of my fav characters, but obviously the writers disagreed. As for Teyla... the whole baby arc was far too long. And Ronon should've had more Sateda-like eps.

[python490]

I think her role would have diminished even more. I agree with some other posts I have read. John/Rodney show I loved both of those characters.

[Linda06]

I think her role would have diminished even more. I agree with some other posts I have read. John/Rodney show I loved both of those characters.

Uh huh, and that didn't bode at all well for those of us that couldn't stand the sight of one of those characters. mm if I had the gift of foresight I could have saved myself a lot of time.

[Falcon Horus]

Uh huh, and that didn't bode at all well for those of us that couldn't stand the sight of one of those characters. mm if I had the gift of foresight I could have saved myself a lot of time.

What she said...

[maxbo]

So many interesting and on-point comments and not enough room to quote them all.

Although Teyla was a character with great potential, this character was created and written by writers who didn't know how to handle her because they found her too difficult to write for. Instead of stepping up to the plate and using this as a challenge to develop the character more, SG's writers took an easy way out and wall-papered the character.

Even though Teyla was severely underdeveloped by the writers, I don't think she would have been written out because she was the only female main character from the original cast left. In addition, I don't think the writers wanted to risk more of the type of backlash the show suffered after Carson and Elizabeth were written out. Although they gave some lame reasons why each character was written out, it was obvious that they were axed because the writers didn't know what to do with them.

The problems that resulted from the writers wall-papering Teyla went far beyond just that one character. Teyla's wallpapering was a symptom of a much larger problem -- the fact that SG's writers had overstayed their welcome. They became so complacent with the job security the SG franchise offered that they caused SGA to become stale before its time. By the end of SGA, they honestly seemed to believe they could do no wrong when it came to writing for SG.

That was a poor choice of words on my behalf - my apologies. I actually meant it in the way of how active her thread is in relation to other threads here on GW in the Characters & Relationship part of the forum... There's tumbleweed somewhere on the second page (I think).

I haven't been on this board in a while, but I think any thread on the second page for a show that's been off the air for years is not bad.

Speaking of Teyla fans in general, one of the first things I noticed when I joined this forum during SGA's 2nd season was that many Teyla fans didn't like this board. Over the years I've read many posts on other sites from Teyla fans who refused to post here. Some have first hand negative experience with the posters on this board and others only know Gateworld by reputation.

I can understand how they feel because when I first joined, some of the negativity was still running rampant. Most of it was ship related and it was fascinating and sad to witness.

[universal_kalle]

I can sense some "hate" coming my way here when I say I didn't care much for Teyla. To me she was always a poor man's Teal'c. She could've become more, but as many have pointed out she didn't really get much to do.

It's 0300 here so excuse me if in the morning this post'll look more like insane ramblings than coherent thoughts..
Touching on other things said in this thread..
The whole Carter "forgetting" how to sense Naquadah. I thought that was pretty natural as the Naquadah in her blood would eventually leave her system. I've got a vague recollection of they even saying as much in an episode or hinting at it.

I love strong female characters. Those ranking highest for me is:
Veronica Mars (Kristen Bell) on Veronica Mars
Alicia Florrick (Julianna Margulies) on The Good Wife
Aeryn Sun (Claudia Black) on Farscape
Olivia Dunham (Anna Torv) on Fringe
Emily Thorne (Emily VanCamp) on Revenge
I'm usually more fond of strong female leads due partly to the fact that I've seen so many male leads that I've become a bit bored of 'em. I would love to see a female soldier leading the SG team in the next series. I can't stand the damsel in distress stereotype.

SG and writing for female characters.. My biggest gripe about this is actually in the "horror" episode (Whispers) of SGA with the female-only-SG-team. They killed Vega (who I liked) but let that idiot GI Jane fracktard live. The enemy hunted by sound and that idiot sits and blows bubbles with her bubblegum making a truckload of noise when they popped. I know I know.. Not really about female characters getting developed but it's still the female-themed thing in all three shows that ticked me off the most.

As for writing any of the females out of SGA. I hated Carter in SGA and was very relieved when she left in favour of Woolsey. It's been a long while since I watched Atlantis but I remember clearly that I felt she was to much of a buddy to the others. There weren't enough conflicts between the characters. Woolsey on the other hand was not their friend, at least initially, and brought a new point of view.
Weir.. Dunno.. Can't really remember how she turned out in the later seasons.
Teyla.. Well.. I hated the whole baby/Michael plotline and view that season as the worst season of any Stargate series. In light of that I wouldn't have minded seeing her being given a recurring role instead. The way the baby was handled even after it was saved was horrible. She seemed to forget she even had a child. That would've been a good point to demote her to recurring and to bring in someone new.
I liked all of the women on SGU though. Especially Tamara Johansen, could have something to do with her Danish last name, me being from Scandinavia as well ^^

Oh and they should've totally shown more of the Swedish blonde from the pilot! I've named her Anna Johansson and in my head she was totally the centre of the entire expedition! Unfortunately they never managed to point the camera in the right direction to show all her heroics

Generally I'm in favour of mixing up the cast a bit from time to time. Be it with a big roster of recurring characters (who all get developed properly) or changing the leads from time to time. One show I think does/did (havn't watched it for years) the recurring characters really well is Bones. They created several well developed characters that they rotated regularly. I'm not a fan of the whole NCIS/CSI/CSILA/NBA/CSINY/NCISLA/NFL/Bones/whatever kind of show in general, but Bones was fun for a while.

[universal_kalle]

One more thing before I hit the sack..
Great actors can totally turn the tables on the writers. I remember this one scene in Veronica Mars where Kristen Bell and Francis Capra got into a really heavy argument with emotions flying all over. The fans (me included) thought that would have severe repercussions in the later episodes but in the next episode it was like nothing unusual had happened at all. Fans were totally confused until the creator Rob Thomas explained that when they wrote that scene they hadn't seen it so emotionally charged and thus the next episode wasn't written taking that into account. It was the two very good actors who just owned that scene!

Now that show was very well written (contrary to the writing of Teyla) but it goes to show what can be done with a script in the hands of great actors.

*rambling mode off*
*sleep mode on*

[Falcon Horus]

I can sense some "hate" coming my way here when I say I didn't care much for Teyla.

You at least know what's gonna come next... thought hate is such a strong word (when I don't even know who you are yet)...

I love strong female characters.

You won't find them in the SG-series since its PTW had no clue what a female character was, and how they should be developed without lookig remotely like wallpaper or the hot alien princess.

I can't stand the damsel in distress stereotype.

Teyla was the damsel in distress when they needed one to make the male heroes look even more heroic and awesome. Because she wasn't a damsel in distress, especially not one that can kill you with her pinky. Means to a end...

SG and writing for female characters.

PTW didn't know how - see above.

Weir.. Dunno.. Can't really remember how she turned out in the later seasons.

She wasn't in them (season 4 and 5 at least).

She seemed to forget she even had a child. That would've been a good point to demote her to recurring and to bring in someone new.

Please elaborate what you mean? Because I'm fairly certain she didn't seem like she'd forgotten all about Torren. You and me must have been watching a different show.

I liked all of the women on SGU though.

Could it be you simply had no interest in the premise of SGA (and SG1) so you just paid more attention to SGU and thus liked it better, and therefor liked its characters better?

Now that show was very well written (contrary to the writing of Teyla) but it goes to show what can be done with a script in the hands of great actors.

Are you implying that Rachel wasn't a good actor?

[universal_kalle]

I love SG-1! In my mind it is one of the best shows that's ever aired on TV. But you're right that I didn't find SGA as good. The premise was very interesting and I highly enjoyed the first season and a bit more. At the moment they all kinda blend together (hence re-watching 'em) so I can't really pinpoint the exact moment I started losing interest in it. But I do remember that it started somewhere around the whole retro-virus affair and how it turned Wraith into humans and back with a flip of a switch. Ultimately though it shared to much of its concept with SG-1. More on this a bit down..
SGU however was an entirely different beast. It's characters where not cut from the same cardboard they'd been using since SG-1. The show was completely different from SG-1/SGA which I liked. Even though they made some huge errors in writing it I think it was the right choice to not make SG-1 a third time. I can go into great lengths about this but this thread is about Teyla so I'll get back to that.

I have to add to my first statement from the previous reply.. Teyla was more than a poor man's Teal'c. For me she was a cross between Daniel Jackson and Teal'c. She was the motherly/wise/alien-warrior/native-guide character. Her main job was at times to help the audience to understand the workings of the Pegasus galaxy. Much like Teal'c gave us insight into the Goa'uld. But she never evolved beyond that due to the writing. And when Ronon was introduced he took over parts of her role in the series and that left her kinda without a real purpose beyond being a female lead (wallpaper). Again this is the writers screwing up and not being able to adapt.
In fact I'd like to draw a comparison between Teyla and Marina Sirtis' role on Star Trek the Next Generation as the councillor Diana Troi. Whenever they needed a female character to get impregnated by some alien shimmering light or whatnot she was their goto character. Teyla, as you said, was their goto damsel in distress when they needed her to be. Again the writers and producers are responsible.

About her forgetting her child.. I remember clearly that Sheppard was all like "No you can't come 'cause you've got a kid now" and she was "I can still fight! And I want to fight to make the world a better place for my child!". So in that respect she didn't forget her child. What I'm trying to say is that the writers weren't interested in showing her as a mother and thus they didn't much.
It is my firm belief that they should never had made her pregnant on the show in the first place. Generally babies don't make for interesting plotlines in television. Actresses getting pregnant while staring in shows is not that uncommon. Some shows handles it well (SGU, SG-1 and Charmed come to mind) while others don't (SGA and Life).

Back to the original topic of this thread.. No I don't think she'd be written out. Not completely at least. I'd have supported given her a recurring role and maybe giving a medical professional/medic a permanent position on the flagship team. Considering how much the show relied on medicine and biology it could've been a decent fit. This character would also take over the role of being the diplomat (Daniel Jackson) of the team. No need to scream Keller at me But she was never a permanent member.
No doubt there would be better characters as I "came up" with that as I was writing it..

About Rachel Lutrell as an actor. Having only seen her on SGA I can't really make any conclusions. But what I can say is that I didn't find her particularly good in SGA. She wasn't bad though. Again I feel the need to point out that this could very well be the writers who didn't give her anything to work with and that she could really be the best actor to ever walk the Earth

[The Lady Blue]

Hi, universal_kalle,

I wouldn't call people possibly challenging some of what you've said "hate," just disagreement or debate. Why would you think anyone here would target you with "hate"?

I'm not trying to question your motives because you can obviously post wherever you like, but for someone that says they "Love SG-1!" as well as SGU, I find it interesting that you'd make all of your posts in the SGA section about a character you say you didn't care much for.

While I agree that the writers completely missed almost every possible opportunity for and with the character, it was Rachel's abilities as a great actress that made me love Teyla Emmagan nonetheless. I didn't care for the other 2 series, so I almost never go to those sections when I'm here. Different strokes for different folks.

[universal_kalle]

Maybe I should've used "flame" instead? I put "hate" in quotations just for that reason
When reading the thread I got the feeling many are very defensive about SGA and thought that if I pointed out that my views might not be shared.. I don't know.. Calm people? It was 0300 when I wrote it and I'd had a couple of ciders
I've only been on these forums for two days and this was the first thread I read as the title tickled my interest. And the re-watch is currently on SGA so I figured I'd start there

[Falcon Horus]

Maybe I should've used "flame" instead? I put "hate" in quotations just for that reason

Since the big rules change on GW after the great SGA/SGU wars, I'd say there's less chance of being flamed to death. I would get suspicious though if people started to ignore you...

[maxbo]

Personally, I would've wanted Ford to stay, he was great. One of my fav characters, but obviously the writers disagreed. As for Teyla... the whole baby arc was far too long. And Ronon should've had more Sateda-like eps.

I wish we would have had more Ford too. There is so much that could have been done with that character. I would love to have had both Ford and Ronon on the show. As for Teyla's baby arc, it should never have happened. The writers could have written around Rachel's pregnancy with much better results than what we got.

I can sense some "hate" coming my way here when I say I didn't care much for Teyla.

Looking over the posts in this thread, I'm puzzled by why you thought you would receive "hate". There's nothing in this thread that gives me the impression its posters would descend on you like a pack of wild dogs.

As for writing any of the females out of SGA. I hated Carter in SGA and was very relieved when she left in favour of Woolsey. It's been a long while since I watched Atlantis but I remember clearly that I felt she was to much of a buddy to the others. There weren't enough conflicts between the characters. Woolsey on the other hand was not their friend, at least initially, and brought a new point of view.

Weir.. Dunno.. Can't really remember how she turned out in the later seasons.

Samantha was written pretty much as Elizabeth, which pissed off both groups of fans.

I liked all of the women on SGU though. Especially Tamara Johansen, could have something to do with her Danish last name, me being from Scandinavia as well ^^

Oh and they should've totally shown more of the Swedish blonde from the pilot! I've named her Anna Johansson and in my head she was totally the centre of the entire expedition! Unfortunately they never managed to point the camera in the right direction to show all her heroics

You liked all the women on SGU? That's interesting because the writing for those female characters received even more criticism than the bad writing for the SG-1 and SGA female characters. In addition to suffering from the usual bad writing by the Stargate writing team, the SGU female characters were often too heavily defined by their relationships with the male characters. As bad as the writing was for the SG-1/SGA females, at least they were usually spared that fate.

You won't find them in the SG-series since its PTW had no clue what a female character was, and how they should be developed without lookig remotely like wallpaper or the hot alien princess.

True. The Stargate writers never had any idea how to write a strong female character. That became even more apparent when they started actively trying to write them in SGU. I remember reading some of Brad Wright's comments about how Camille showed her strength in certain scenes and realizing that the man was absolutely clueless. When I read other comments about the other female SGU characters, they confirmed they were just as out of touch as ever. Although I never became a fan of SGU, in the beginning, I thought those female characters had as much potential to be interesting as the SG-1/SGA female characters. However, that was never going to happen under BW's creative team.

Teyla was the damsel in distress when they needed one to make the male heroes look even more heroic and awesome. Because she wasn't a damsel in distress, especially not one that can kill you with her pinky. Means to a end...

That's true, Teyla was never a damsel in distress. I think that's when they realized they needed a character like Keller because that was the type of female character they were most comfortable writing. Despite this, even Keller could have been an interesting character if only SGA had better writers.

Please elaborate what you mean? Because I'm fairly certain she didn't seem like she'd forgotten all about Torren. You and me must have been watching a different show.

Could it be you simply had no interest in the premise of SGA (and SG1) so you just paid more attention to SGU and thus liked it better, and therefor liked its characters better?

This is the impression I get from reading universal_kalle's posts. This poster is clearly not a fan of SGA and its characters, so it's hard to give much weight to some of these comments and have a discussion.

Hi, universal_kalle,

I wouldn't call people possibly challenging some of what you've said "hate," just disagreement or debate. Why would you think anyone here would target you with "hate"?

I'm not trying to question your motives because you can obviously post wherever you like, but for someone that says they "Love SG-1!" as well as SGU, I find it interesting that you'd make all of your posts in the SGA section about a character you say you didn't care much for.

While I agree that the writers completely missed almost every possible opportunity for and with the character, it was Rachel's abilities as a great actress that made me love Teyla Emmagan nonetheless. I didn't care for the other 2 series, so I almost never go to those sections when I'm here. Different strokes for different folks.

I was wondering what "hate" universal_kalle had expected too because there is nothing in this thread to indicate that type of response.

I'm with you on being impressed by Rachel's abilities as an actor. Her interpretation of the character is what to drew me to Teyla, even though the writing for the character often sucked. Whatever depth I got from Teyla mostly came from Rachel's portrayal of the character, especially after Season 1 when it became clear the writers had no idea what to do with the character.

That's why I had to chuckle when universal_kalle said the writers should have written Teyla out and brought in another character because the baby arc was so badly written. New characters are meaningless if the same bad writers are going to write for them. Look at what happened to Keller.

Maybe I should've used "flame" instead? I put "hate" in quotations just for that reason
When reading the thread I got the feeling many are very defensive about SGA and thought that if I pointed out that my views might not be shared.. I don't know.. Calm people? It was 0300 when I wrote it and I'd had a couple of ciders
I've only been on these forums for two days and this was the first thread I read as the title tickled my interest. And the re-watch is currently on SGA so I figured I'd start there

Ah, the dangers of posting while a bit tipsy. I hope you were able to get some rest. When they get to the SGU re-watch I would be curious to read your thoughts because you considering the SGU women strong when you see the SGA women as weak is baffling to me.

Since the big rules change on GW after the great SGA/SGU wars, I'd say there's less chance of being flamed to death. I would get suspicious though if people started to ignore you...

Yep, ever since the big you better be polite or else smack-down before the launch of SGU and especially since the end of SGU, there's not much chance of being spectacularly flamed on GW anymore.