My Opinion/Feeling on S4 Ratings. Will there be S5?

[Deevil]

Wow! That 2.6 Million per episode really shocks me! I know that all the CGI isn't cheap, but it's also a tradeoff with other areas.

2.6mil an episode is SUPER CHEAP. Now, there were 13 episodes in the last season, that means they had just shy of 34 million to film the entire season. This includes everyones income (from execs to crew). This includes studio space, set building and design, props, make-up, hair, script writing, directing, catering and CGI. You name it, it comes under those $'s. And for a show in its 4th season, cable or not, it's still cheap.

Perhaps with AT (films and directing) and the other exec producers taking other jobs they can afford to lower their own salaries even more and thereby making the costs per episode more appealing to investors?

There are union rules that will govern the minimum amount they can get paid. Irrespective of that, if you were working 2 jobs, would you want to get paid less for one of them just because you have a second job? I know I wouldn't.

[12OzMouse]

Let's look at at this way, Mad Men is budgeted at $2-2.5 Million per episode. Lionsgate has brought it in at under $33 million for 13 episodes. Joe Hamm reportedly makes $250,000 per episode, the rest of the cast, makes less, but probably not a whole bunch.

If you were an investor, where would you put your money? Both cable shows, but just look at the ratings. Your right, $2.5 million is not a lot compared to a network budget, but these are cable shows. Mad Men is shot at cable prices but brings in network ratings. Heap big difference. Plus, last year Mad Men got another $700K per episode from syndication, that's all gravy.

I only use Mad Men as an example of a successful cable show with a similar budget. Also, no offense, but $2.5 million isn't peanuts for a cable show. There are a whole bunch of other shows out there who would love to have that kind of budget.

Just for kicks and giggles, another AMC show, The Walking Dead, brings in 6 million viewers and last year (prior to season 2) had it's budget cut by $675K, down to $2.75 million per episode. AMC is a cash starved network but they manage to put out 3 highly rated shows at around $2.5 mil per episode. The 3 being Walking Dead, Mad Men, and Breaking Bad. When AMC wanted to cut the budgets of all three last year, they quickly changed their tune when they saw how easily these three would be picked up on the open market. My point being, 2.5 million is only small compared to a network show like Terra Nova. But that's just my two cents...

[Deevil]

Mad Men isn't bringing in network ratings. Last week it was a 1.0 demo and just over 2.5mil in total viewers. A show like that stays on the air for critical acclaim, not because of anything else especially considering the stand-off that had it on an extended hiatus.

2.5 mil and episode is peanuts for ANY show. TV is expensive and the $'s don't go as far as people think they do. That's why the writing and acting really has to pull them through. I wasn't comparing the budget to network, or other cable. I am just saying, outright, 2.6mil an episode is NOT a lot of money. If used well, it can work, but it also depends on the kind of show it is. A show that is almost like a bottle show, mainly filming on already built sets can have a significantly lower budget requirement then a show that is all location and needs prosethetics for example.

As for Walking Dead, their budget for the 1st season was a little different. Their pilot budget (pilots are always individually much more expensive and are not included in the seasons budget) was actually included INTO the first season budget. So, over 6 episodes they had a significant bump. This meant in second season the 'pilot bump' disappeared and it looked like there was a significant cut in budget, but there wasn't really. It's one of those tricksy industry things that happen rarely, but still happens.

[EvenstarSRV]

Regarding the $2.6 million per episode budget, I remember AT giving an interview at Comic-con last year where she said Sanctuary's budget was closer to being just under $2 million an episode.

Ah, found the link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UeF5kY25lwk

[RealmOfX]

Regarding the $2.6 million per episode budget, I remember AT giving an interview at Comic-con last year where she said Sanctuary's budget was closer to being just under $2 million an episode.

Ah, found the link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UeF5kY25lwk

I remember Martin also said it too, can't remember where though.

The source of the information is the same place that said Sanctuary's future was tied to BSG: Blood and Chrome which was untrue so I'd take any info from there with a grain of salt

[unknown_k]

The Canadian Dollar to USD changes quite a bit.

1/21/2009 1 CA was .78 USD
4/08/2011 1 CA was 1.05 USD

So just the exchange rate bouncing around will cause problems with a set price in CAD dollars.

[Skydiver]

CAble ratings thresholds are different from Network ones. Cable networks are often thrilled with 1 or 2 ratings and those will get a network show canned.

Also, y es, critical accliam does help. I honestly think an HBO show Rome would have lasted longer had it won awards. BUt all it got were costuming or set decoration (which are really garbage awards in the grand theme of things) so the show died. (did introduce me to the lucious Kevin McKidd so that's good)

Then you get shows like Dexter and Borgias and The Tudors where the actors, writers and directors won awards and they lasted (dex is gearing up for season 7 I think, Tudors lasted 4, Borgias is in the first few episodes of season 2)

A cable show that gets nommed for and wins awards gets a bit more leeway than a non-winner.

[12OzMouse]

I was told once that the amount of money it takes to put a show on the air is a very liquid number. Most of the time, after a certain threshold has been met, the cost per episode is in direct correlation to the amount of money you have left to spend!

I probably used some bad examples, but they were numbers that I could remember off the top of my head. I did just read that the average cost per episode for a show on the SyFy channel is right around 2 million per episode. This from a article in Television Without Pity.

That makes the 2.5 or 2.6 cost per episode of Sanctuary on the high side, FOR SYFY. I standby my statement that I'm still surprised that Sanctuary costs as much as it does.

Deevil, your definitely correct that a couple million per episode is peanuts for TV overall. I'm just talking about the other side of the tracks, where the bean-counters have bigger offices than the producers!

[blueray]

I've been considering that but would have to look more into how it works and if I've got the necessary electronics.

you do, all you need for netflix is a computer or if you have a wii or a game system you can hook up to your tv.

[Skydiver]

Dollars per episode is also little more than the overall budget divided by the number of episodes...and yeah, it can vary

1.5
2.7
2.3
2.7
1.8
2.2

etc

they have an average per show then adjust up and down, if they spend too much on #4 then they cut some from elsewhere (this is where clip shows come from)

[Deevil]

Deevil, your definitely correct that a couple million per episode is peanuts for TV overall. I'm just talking about the other side of the tracks, where the bean-counters have bigger offices than the producers!

That's par for course no matter if you're network, or cable . The money doesn't go into keeping these guys in offices, not at all...

[Deevil]

Dollars per episode is also little more than the overall budget divided by the number of episodes...and yeah, it can vary

1.5
2.7
2.3
2.7
1.8
2.2

etc

they have an average per show then adjust up and down, if they spend too much on #4 then they cut some from elsewhere (this is where clip shows come from)

Exactly! And usually they save the big dollars for season premieres, finales and mid season finales/returns.