My Journey through Babylon 5

[12OzMouse]

It's interesting to read along as you chronicle your first trip through the B5 Universe. I've been considering a re-watch, but it's a huge commitment if you think of how much total content is out there. You might find this site to be helpful as your watching, I did anyway. "The Lurkers Guide to Babylon Five"

http://www.midwinter.com/lurk/lurker.html

The reference material is very complete. Pretty much anything you've ever wondered about the show is in this site. Good luck!

[Missster.Freeman]

The Lurkers Guide is just about the best reference site out there for B5. It's been running for years and years. The first time I browsed the site I didn't even have an internet connection at home. It was in college on their 256k leased line back in the mid 90s. Good times.

Beware of spoilers, though!

[12OzMouse]

Yes indeed! It was always a tradeoff though.... I knew I could always find the answers to my questions at the Lurkers Guide, but even with my 14.4 modem running flat out, it took forever!

Here's one you might remember or really anyone that was watching B5, "live" when it was first telecast. Remember this <*> ? I recall getting emails and even snail-mail letters with <*> typed somewhere on the page. It was quite a mystery to me, and a whole lot of other people, too! Turns out those symbols signified a secret B5, hand shake, for lack of a better word. <*> is the master jump-gate symbol! Fans would identify themselves to other fans using the jump gate logo. By the time I figured out what it was all about, it had ceased to be a secret anymore!

In fact, there is still a woman in Arizona or New Mexico that makes these jump gate pins.

http://www.jumpgatepins.com/index.html

I just looked and I see she's still in business, but from the looks of it, she's just selling off what she has left. Just thought I'd throw a little trivia into this B5 thread!

[magictrick]

The Lurkers Guide is just about the best reference site out there for B5. It's been running for years and years. The first time I browsed the site I didn't even have an internet connection at home. It was in college on their 256k leased line back in the mid 90s. Good times.

Beware of spoilers, though!

Yes that is why I'm hesitant to click the link! The site does sound like something I would definitely check out after I've finished the series though.

[magictrick]

1x14 - TKO

I think it would have been fun if this episode was renamed Rabbis in Space!

Overall this was a fun filler episode. I liked the major contrast between the two story lines - one about violence and the other about peace and accepting loss. Did the producers realize Muay Thai is a really popular fighting style that humans engage in every day though I maybe would have called it something else but either way it was entertaining to watch.

Really nice to see Susan's character developing in this episode. The rabbi was a good character and fun to watch, really believable in his role.

[magictrick]

1x15 - Grail

I really didn't get this episode and what the point was. I understand there are fillers but this one missed the mark for me. Londo had some good moments but that is about it. The only other upside is that I got some information about the previous four Babylon stations and how they met their demise. Also not sure what the reason was for not contacting G'kar as the Grail guy said he contacted all ambassadors.

Another gripe I have is the guns on this show. I'm not a fan of the small fit in your pocket guns that I see used most of the time. I get that they pack a punch and are easy to carry but I like to see fancy, big guns . These just remind me of the Men In Black gun that Will Smith is stuck with in the first movie. Although that one was a lot more entertaining to watch.

I did watch this right after the Entourage series finale so that may have had something to do with it. I was bummed that the series is over and so many questions left to be answered.

[magictrick]

1x16 - Eyes

This was a refreshing episode. Good to see more of Lennier, really liked his role in this one and his interactions with Garibaldi.

We found out more about Ivanova and how the condition of her mother affected her. It was also good to see that at least some psycore folks are fairly normal people who are not ego-driven and choose to the right thing when necessary.

I see there was also more mention of Sinclair and the Menbari. I like that they brought up again, even though it was indirectly, just to show that the plot line has not been forgotten.

On a side note, in the opening credits, I find it different that they show a lot of characters under the "also starring" section who at most can be considered recurring characters. For example, I think I've seen Na'toth in maybe 3 episodes out of 16 so far.

[Cold Fuzz]

My computer died 5 days ago and I'm having to post from my phone. I'll be receiving a new computer--a laptop this time--sometime next week. I'll be commenting a bit on these 3 episodes.

[magictrick]

My computer died 5 days ago and I'm having to post from my phone. I'll be receiving a new computer--a laptop this time--sometime next week. I'll be commenting a bit on these 3 episodes.

Great news, about the new laptop of course

[maneth]

Glad you're still enjoying the show. Glad you liked TKO, it's the least favorite episode of many people. I must admit I preferred the Ivanova storyline though.

[magictrick]

Glad you're still enjoying the show. Glad you liked TKO, it's the least favorite episode of many people. I must admit I preferred the Ivanova storyline though.

I can see why that would be the case. It was far from the best but I enjoyed it more than Grail though.

[magictrick]

1x17 - Legacies

Do we find out what the cause of the Earth-Menbari war was?

This episode does mention some information regarding the war but not really what started. I know bits of information have been mentioned up until this point but nothing that reveals the reason. I would be interested to find out since it is mentioned in the intro every time and I still don't know why it happened.

As for the episode itself, I liked the conflict that ensued from the Menbari visit. It was nice to find out about the problems that currently face the Menbari as well. Delenn was really good in this episode, and so was her Menbari counterpart. Pretty much the guy you love to hate in any episode but he did a good job.

I sense the way they removed the body has something to do with Sinclair and that period of time he can't remember.

[12OzMouse]

There is a movie titled, "The Beginning" that chronicles the Earth - Minbari war. It tells Delenn's role and tends to make the whole first couple of series clearer. Viewing The Beginning is now recommended to be the first video that new viewers watch. The Lurkers Guide transcribes a conversation with JMS about what should be viewed when. When I started watching I didn't have the benefit of the movies to supplement the series, but I sure wish that I did!

The only controversy is that in making, "The Beginning" the viewer is going to learn a few pieces of info from the 3rd series that they wouldn't normally be privy to. But, JMS is the architect and he apparently feels that this is a very fair tradeoff...

[magictrick]

There is a movie titled, "The Beginning" that chronicles the Earth - Minbari war. It tells Delenn's role and tends to make the whole first couple of series clearer. Viewing The Beginning is now recommended to be the first video that new viewers watch. The Lurkers Guide transcribes a conversation with JMS about what should be viewed when. When I started watching I didn't have the benefit of the movies to supplement the series, but I sure wish that I did!

The only controversy is that in making, "The Beginning" the viewer is going to learn a few pieces of info from the 3rd series that they wouldn't normally be privy to. But, JMS is the architect and he apparently feels that this is a very fair tradeoff...

That's good to know thanks

What is the viewing order I should be following when it comes to the B5 series and accompanying movies?

[LoneStar1836]

There is a movie titled, "The Beginning" that chronicles the Earth - Minbari war. It tells Delenn's role and tends to make the whole first couple of series clearer. Viewing The Beginning is now recommended to be the first video that new viewers watch. The Lurkers Guide transcribes a conversation with JMS about what should be viewed when. When I started watching I didn't have the benefit of the movies to supplement the series, but I sure wish that I did!

It spoils some of the mystery of the first two seasons though. They didn't make this movie until after season 4. While it does show what initiated the Earth/Mimbari War, I find that not as important. Some where along the way in the series you do learn this before they made the movie.

I'd say skip it. And watch it later and not now.


JMS on the Lurker's Guide:

Will In the Beginning spoil some of season one's mysteries?

That's an interesting question. When I sat down to write In the Beginning, my feeling was that I should look at the long term. Would the hole in Sinclair's mind be the same mystery it was in season one, or would it be kind of known thereafter? If so, then do you want to play with the mystery, or set up what actually happened? I figured, okay, let's go for the latter...let's let the audience know (which will mostly know by now anyway), and set up the background, with the characters not knowing the first season. I took basic greek tragedy as my model, with ItB functioning more or less as a Greek chorus that sets things up.

If you want to play it as a strict mystery, then no, probably don't go near ItB...but frankly, if I were going to start someone off on B5, I'd definitely want to start with ItB, which sort of skims in and out of the overall storyline in a beautiful fashion.

[12OzMouse]

I'm a little pressed for time right now, but honestly, you can go to the Lurkers Guide without fear of having anything spoiled for you. They have a viewing order all mapped out. I can get it for you, I just will be tied up for a couple hours. If I see where you haven't found it in a little while, I'll dig it out for you. The Beginning is the only major change, I believe, in the first couple of series...

[12OzMouse]

Here's the viewing order list as presented by the Lurkers Guide.

Pilot Movies

Babylon 5: In the Beginning
The Gathering

Season One ("Signs and Portents")

Midnight on the Firing Line
Soul Hunter
Born to the Purple
Infection
The Parliament of Dreams
Mind War
The War Prayer
And The Sky Full Of Stars
Deathwalker
Believers
Survivors
By Any Means Necessary
Signs and Portents
Grail
Eyes
A Voice in the Wilderness part 1
A Voice in the Wilderness part 2
Babylon Squared
The Quality of Mercy
TKO
Legacies
Chrysalis

Season Two ("The Coming Of Shadows")

Points of Departure
Revelations
The Geometry of Shadows
A Distant Star
The Long Dark
A Spider in the Web
A Race Through Dark Places
Soul Mates
The Coming of Shadows
GROPOS
All Alone in the Night
Acts of Sacrifice
Hunter, Prey
There All the Honor Lies
And Now For a Word
Knives
In the Shadow of Z'ha'dum
Confessions and Lamentations
Divided Loyalties
The Long, Twilight Struggle
Comes the Inquisitor
The Fall of Night

Season Three ("Point of No Return")

Matters of Honor
Convictions
A Day in the Strife
Passing Through Gethsemane
Voices of Authority (this was originally meant to air before "Passing Through Gethsemane," but since the events of this episode tie into the beginning of "Dust to Dust," and aren't mentioned at all in "Gethsemane," the initial airing order is actually an improvement)
Dust to Dust
Exogenesis
Messages from Earth
Point of No Return
Severed Dreams
Ceremonies of Light and Dark
A Late Delivery From Avalon
Sic Transit Vir
Ship of Tears
Interludes and Examinations
Walkabout
War Without End, Part One
War Without End, Part Two
Grey 17 Is Missing
And the Rock Cried Out, No Hiding Place
Shadow Dancing
Z'ha'dum

Season Four ("No Surrender, No Retreat")

The Hour of the Wolf
Whatever Happened to Mr. Garibaldi?
The Summoning
Falling Toward Apotheosis
The Long Night
Into the Fire
Epiphanies
The Illusion of Truth
Thirdspace
Atonement
Racing Mars
Lines of Communication
Conflicts of Interest
Rumors, Bargains and Lies
Moments of Transition
No Surrender, No Retreat
The Exercise of Vital Powers
The Face of the Enemy
Intersections in Real Time
Between the Darkness and the Light
Endgame
Rising Star
The Deconstruction of Falling Stars

Season Five

No Compromises
The Very Long Night of Londo Mollari
The Paragon of Animals
A View from the Gallery
Learning Curve
Strange Relations
Secrets of the Soul
In the Kingdom of the Blind
A Tragedy of Telepaths
Phoenix Rising
The Ragged Edge
Day of the Dead
The Corps is Mother, The Corps is Father
Meditations on the Abyss
Darkness Ascending
And All My Dreams, Torn Asunder
Movements of Fire and Shadow
The Fall of Centauri Prime
Wheel of Fire
Objects in Motion
Objects at Rest
River of Souls
The Legend of the Rangers
Sleeping in Light

Or, here's the link that also includes episode numbers, which didn't survive the C & P!

http://www.midwinter.com/lurk/countr...er/eplist.html

I would say that if you have the DVD of, "In the Beginning" sitting in front of you, I'd watch it. As JMS said, it fits in beautifully. But, either way, it is really not that big of a deal.

[magictrick]

Awesome thanks for the list!

I think I will hold off on watching The Beginning for now. I am fine with it being a mystery, and knowing there is an entire movie dedicated to it is even better.

I notice the viewing order is even different in Season 1. I've already watched TKO but it is listed on that list much further down. I guess because it was more of a filler episode than anything.

[magictrick]

1x18 - A Voice in the Wilderness: Part 1

Lots of mystery from the start here with the planet. And the holographic appearance of the alien, which I assumed from the start is the only one left on the planet. I think this episode did a good job building up the story which will likely reach the peak in part 2.

Despite everything that was going on this episode, my favourite scene was still the one with Londo, Delenn and Draal. I enjoy the comic relief that Londo provides at times and this scene was one of my favourites so far. As in Farscape I like how they have scenes that poke fun at certain human things by using an alien perspective. More of these please!

1x19 - A Voice in the Wilderness: Part 2

So everything from part one comes to a head in this episode. The build up was good and now the exciting stuff happens. I liked almost everything about this episode.

The space battle was great, Londo was great and somewhere in all the craziness we got some great Garibaldi moments.

I think B5 does a pretty good job showing how petty and manipulative politics can be. The senator that Sinclair always contacts always seems to want to help but in the end never really does anything because he doesn't want to stick his neck out too far. The Earth Central captain comes off as typically arrogant straight off the bat too. They really don't like depicting Earth Central in a good light in this series

I'm assuming this is not the last we'll see of the planet and the technology that exists there. I was expecting Kosh to make some sort of appearance in this episode as this type of stuff seems to be right up the Vorlons alley (i.e. advanced tech). Also noticed that G'kar hasn't made an appearance for several episode. I figured in such a crisis situation that he would also have some role to play.

[magictrick]

1x20 - Babylon Squared

I think I need to rewatch this episode because I was fighting to stay awake from about halfway through. Nothing against the episode I was just really tired from the weekend.

I actually thought the episode was great. It is always fun to see how time travel or time dilation episodes are handled in different series. Instead of answering questions this episode just resulted in more mysteries. I think the questions that I have at this point are obvious, regarding both Delenn and the Commander.

One thing that I'm curious about is the prophecy the Grey Council was talking about. They said they ended the war because of the prophecy, do they really have the power to do that? End such a massive war based on a prophecy that is.

Whatever the reason for the time troubles of Babylon 4 and the Grey Council's decision to end the war, I'm sure the Commander is in the middle of it and so is Delenn. They seem to be two of the key characters in this whole saga.

To end things off: wars, prophecies, time travel, recurring mistakes, etc...sounds a lot like this other show that starts with a B