'Seizure' (215) General Discussion

[maneth]

I liked this ep too, although for some weird reason I seem to remember Langara should've been blown up in a Goa'uld attack... Fun to hear the SGA theme playing in the background when McKay first appeared.

Poor Rush & Amanda, although I admit the consciousness transfer thing is a bit creepy.

[Zombies Rise from the Sea]

I made a reference to "Babar and the Adventures of Badou" in my review of this episode. Both shows do share similarities in that they are spinoffs of far superior shows with radically different styles and new cast members but with much of the original cast onboard. Both shows also shared similar mixed criticism and both shows would not last past their respective 40 and 26 episodes.

That reference was made in relation Mr. David Hewlett aka (Dr. Rodney McKay) known for his acting career, "A Dogs Breakfast" and immense knowledge and passion for technology which has made him a staple in the geek culture world. Very few people know this but the person he's friends with, "Vincenzo Natali" worked for Nelvana and had a hand in Storyboard Cleanup for "Babar", more specifically Season's 4-5. I am disapointed that he did cleanup but he contributed to the overall beauty of many episodes such as "Alexander the Great", "Object D'Arthur", "The One that Got Away" and "Child in the Snow", without his ability to properly cleanup the drawings, the vision of these episode would probably never be fully realized and thus, his place in that culture is cemented.

There's also something else in mind in that his work in "Babar" would lead to many things, it would lead to the slow growth and realization in his potential of directing and creating horror films; "Cube", "Nothing", "Splice", etc which would therefore cement his position as one of horror's most unique directors. It would lead to the rise of David Hewlett as a hot commodity, a nice commodity but a hot commodity nonetheless. Vincenzo's penchant for putting his friend in roles in his films served as both an example of helping people out and as a chance for David to really strut his skills (I haven't seen the films yet but from the few examples I've seen "Trinity", "Tao of Rodney", "The Shrine". I'm guessing he'll be impressive) and it is because of that which allowed David to garner a fanbase and an appearance on Stargate SG-1 and it is through that appearance that he managed to appear in 100 episodes as the lovable but somewhat annoying at times Dr. Rodney McKay where he would cement his legacy.

I may not be a fan of some of his actions/career choices but his connection to "Babar" manages to give him a special place and as long as he maintains that connection, he's cool.

With that being said; I am amazed by David's ability to retain his composure and independence throughout the proceedings, not succumbing to SGU's need for change. This is basically the same old McKay that you loved throughout SGA; well not exactly, he has some sexist tenancies and he's basically somewhat less egotistical but other than that, he's McKay alright. His performance adds some energy to what would be an otherwise disappointing episode, he just lightens up Destiny's hallways whenever he walks around, showcasing his unique brand of comedy, acting as if the weight of the world was in his hands and that even spreads to the crew on Destiny where Young gets to try on an accent, to delightful results. It pushes the show in a different direction but that different direction is a guilty pleasure.

Until we get to the serious parts of course, both plots of the episode are mediocre. The ideas themselves are good, the opportunity to take a Stargate to supply Destiny and Rush and Perry in a virtual environment but as you'll quickly see, they don't take the time to develop those ideas. I find Rush and Perry sweet but I don't want to see constant sweetness, I want to see a struggle, a bit of something that's provocative in a sociological and character way. I also want to see more than just people walking through hallways with just the slightest hint of morality sparkled throughout, you're in a base, you're actively impersonating people; shouldn't you do something about that? The endings themselves are big and groundshaking, Eli saving the day by placing the AI's in quarantine and the planet taking back it's Stargate by force thus implicating Earth in seedy political dealings but they seem like a desperate attempt to make much of the episode mean something, in my opinion forcing something like this without buildup is not the way to do it, everything can't easily be connected through exciting tension and drama, there has to be some sort of coda to it, a meaning if you will... Without meaning everything rings hollow.

There's also an odd portion of the episode where the actors act like as if a star had walked onto the set, regressing into people who believe this is their first day in acting; the way they stumble their lines, forcibly inflict their dialog, it was stunning. It must of been really fun for McKay to bask in the spotlight but it also must of been hard for these actors to effectively portray their characters around them, especially Eli who's conversation/argument scene was unnatural; while having the makings of a classic Stargate moment, this isn't exactly the Stargate of old which is why it's so out of place; but aside from that portion most of them were excellent, Rush and Eli's exceptional acting proves that even if they're in an episode that is below par, they can still be better than it. I am amazed at how they can elevate even bad episodes; it just goes to show that the power of acting is a mysterious thing, one who's appeal to captivate the audience is a science in itself. Young's acting was not as exceptional but he proved he could hold it down when required and Woosley, he has regressed to his IOA self, shedding off any character development that he may have grown; compare this Woosley to any episode in Season 5 and you'll know what I mean.

Come to think of it, has anybody notice that Season 5 of Atlantis was basically the prototype season for Universe? They seemed to have made many character changes here, Sheppard being the type of person with a twisted mindstate who can't seem to let people go and can't seem to face his issues. Keller being the type of person with an unnerving feeling that she can't save anybody yet at the same time feels like a part of the team and McKay with a neverending need to prove himself; let's not forget the attempts at moral ambiguity ("Outsiders"), the retconning of the stones ("Identity") and the various attempts to provide an emotional connection. ("Tracker", "Remnants", "Broken Ties"). Everything felt like they were trying to transition it to a more serious character based drama (since SGA had some of the groundwork laid already) which would explain the lack of any progression and the many episodes that don't have much to do with each other; they even had their character study episode "Vegas". While some of the elements worked (the grey area for example), they realize that they couldn't fully transition it without losing many elements and alienating it's fanbase; hence the show Universe was born where the character drama could thrive. With Sheppard becoming Young, Keller becoming TJ (with the emotional side going to Claire) and McKay becoming Eli and the stones, grey area and everything else came along for the ride.

[NowIWillDestroyAbydos]

I have mixed feelings about this episode.

Honestly, I wanted more A-Plot (Atlantis crossover). The B-Plot, just made Rush look more like a jerk.

Now to Langara, I hate the writers for not including Jonas. Also, the Langara Gate was just a mess, who the hell designed it (it's suppose to have 36 (38?) glyphs, not 64), I blame Mark.

Monday, the crew goes on a hunt.

[Krisz]

I still don't really know what to make of this episode. It wasn't a good crossover episode, I was left feeling a bit disappointed because things seemed to go really fast, I felt I didn't really have much time to see McKay's impact on things.

The sneaky use of the stones was surprising to say the least, I know this is SGU, but has Earth really become so desperate to get to Destiny that they would hijack the Langaran Stargate and risk destroying an inhabited planet?! Jonas being put in the middle would have been an interesting addition, giving another great dramatic dilemma, as good as his first encounter with the people from Earth I'm certain! Jonas was for me a lamentable omission from this episode.

Watching Young fall into this deceitful role was weird, given that he seems to be a pretty straight and up front leader, expecting the same from those around him, it just seemed so out of character for him, and awkward! Perhaps this was the idea, it was Young feeling uncomfortable doing it.

Zombies... Your observations about SGA's season 5 being the trial run are interesting and I tend to agree! Probably explains why I must be one of the very few who seem to like season 5 of SGA (and SGA wasn't my favourite series)! 'Vegas' was my favourite SGA episode, McKay in that was very much like the McKay we see in this SGU episode to me!

[Matt G]

Midweek, another ep of SGU.

1. Don't think McKay was that much different here compared to SGA.

2. Liked Eli and McKay together. They and Rush would have been one hell of a science team!

3. This op was fair enough game.

4. Very surprised they couldn't/didn't get Jonas involved though. Apparantly Corin never heard that SGU went to Langara!

Fun ep though!

[garhkal]

Well, being they never mentioned Jonas in SG1's season 9 when they were on about Langaran falling to the ori, its not surprising they didn't mention him here.

[Lieutenant Sparrow]

McKay alone made this a good ep

Seeing Eli and McKay arguing over algorithms was a great moment. They're both very similar in some ways.

Earth was very naughty in this ep. The way they betrayed the Langaran's trust. A bit let down we didn't get to see Jonas in this ep.

Perry was a bit possessive and stubborn. Oh well her and Gin are in quarantine now.

[garhkal]

Earth was very naughty in this ep. The way they betrayed the Langaran's trust. A bit let down we didn't get to see Jonas in this ep..

And its a pity that cause of the cancellation of the show, we never see what ramifications this brings down.

[Lieutenant Sparrow]

Yeah that would be interesting. Maybe a faction of the Langaran's team up with the Lucian Alliance. And Jonas warns Earth about it. (Wishful thinking)

[jelgate]

Jonas not appearing or mentioned in this episode did not really bothered me. I had accepted a long time ago that the writers would like to pretend that Jonas never existed. Think about ever since the SG1 episode Fallout the character has not been seen or mentioned. To me that suggests the writers would like to pretend he didn't exist so I had never gotten my hopes up. As for the story at hand I could tell from the beginning that what Homeworld Command was going to do was a bad idea. Thier was no good solution to impersonating high level officals of the Langarian government. Even if the Langarians had been guilty of aiding a Tauri enemey, don't you think said government would be ticked off we kidnapped people? Or you have even the worse situation of what happened in this episode of the Langarians doing nothing wrong but safeguarding their own people. I also find that McKay added very little episode. He served no purpose except to be "head scientist." It screamed nothing but a rating ploy.

The Rush and Perry story I found a lot more interesting. It once again explored more about Destiny and expanded more of the artifical intelligence nature of Destiny. We saw the range and limit to what these AR programs could do. Interesting how Perry is similiar to Rush. Her arrogance and ego got in the way that she created a problem that she could not handle which led to circumstances making the ship far off before they got started. Because of Perry, she and Ginn are trapped in a quarntine. I wonder if the writers ever intended to continue that story arc because it was an interesting idea

[garhkal]

Who knows.. Had the show not been canned, maybe we would have eventually gotten back to them.

[Zombies Rise from the Sea]

As for the story at hand I could tell from the beginning that what Homeworld Command was going to do was a bad idea. Thier was no good solution to impersonating high level officals of the Langarian government. Even if the Langarians had been guilty of aiding a Tauri enemey, don't you think said government would be ticked off we kidnapped people? Or you have even the worse situation of what happened in this episode of the Langarians doing nothing wrong but safeguarding their own people.

Who could blame them? They needed the gate, those people were out there in space stranded without supplies, McKay needed revenge for being snubbed after the first PowerPoint screen.

I agree that it wasn't going to work though; while they could of pulled it off, there was no way they could truly have the candor of the Langarians. They were just too aggressive.

[Cluas]

Good episode...

What's up with Langara? Isn't that the planet Jonas came from. I thought it had already exploded in the Goa'uld attack...

This is one of the episode I will have to re-watch soon. It's very blurry in my mind. The sub-plot with Rush and Amanda was kind of cool.

I was pretty sure Destiny would get new supplies and a few new soldiers on board. That was the whole idea of going to Langara, to get supplies to Destiny. But I got disappointed.

It was certainly awkward to see Woolsey and especially McKay in SGU, still don't know what to think about it. McKay was kind of ignored by everyone except Woolsey, it was like they didn't fit in at all...

[garhkal]

That was the idea, but i think that cause the designers knew they were close to the end, resupplying the ship would reduce some of the tension.
at least with this being done as it was, we are left with several questions..
such as what is the fall out from what we did? Is langaran going to ever trust us again?
Does the LA know about it/?

[Cluas]

That was the idea, but i think that cause the designers knew they were close to the end, resupplying the ship would reduce some of the tension.

Never thought about that, but I guess you're right.

at least with this being done as it was, we are left with several questions..
such as what is the fall out from what we did? Is langaran going to ever trust us again?
Does the LA know about it/?

Yes I thought it was strange, the last thing we saw, was the team surrendering. But what happened after?
This must also have been because of the cancellation, I think we would have known in S3 ...

[garhkal]

And the biggest plot hole of all from going back to that planet..


WHERE WAS JOHNAS QUIN

[jelgate]

Thats not a plot hole. Jonas presence or lack of is not crucial to the story

[Snowman37]

And the biggest plot hole of all from going back to that planet..

WHERE WAS JOHNAS QUIN

As jelgate said, the story was about Langara, not Jonas Quinn.

[Cluas]

He was never even mentioned in season 9 of SG1 - Guess the writers wanted us to forget he ever existed...