Wray needs to shut up, and Scott needs to man up

[xxxevilgrinxxx]

Oh Jel, that's just ludicrous. Scott is high-ranking enough to be put in charge of the situation, and if he's not then they can stone someone in.



Seriously? OMFG, that's the funniest thing I've read all day! In the real world (you know, that place you so readily refer to when in helps your argument?), Young's very real conflict of interest would preclude him from any involvement whatsoever.

Scott also has a conflict because Young is his superior officer. Who's next? And who can be trusted? Should Wray take over, given her agenda? There's no one here with clean hands so Young brought in someone from Earth.

[Lahela]

Scott also has a conflict because Young is his superior officer. Who's next? And who can be trusted? Should Wray take over, given her agenda? There's no one here with clean hands so Young brought in someone from Earth.

Everybody is somebody's superior or subordinate, so the argument holds no water. Telford never shagged Scott's wife, nor did Scott commit a crime by impersonating someone else and beating Telford up.

[Shai Hulud]

When did Scott beat Telford up? I thought it was Young who did that?

FWIW Scott's probably shagged all the officers wives!

[Lahela]

When did Scott beat Telford up? I thought it was Young who did that?

FWIW Scott's probably shagged all the officers wives!

Note the word "nor" in my post.

[shipper hannah]

This is the point I tried to make a while back. Say what you will about Wray's actual entitlement to know anything in this situation, but it's illogical to say she was being annoying when, in fact, this reaction is perfectly consistent as well as the appropriate one by the character for the situation.

From Wray's POV, she had no reason to trust Young and thus acted the way she did, and our perception of how she was acting should not be contingent on whether Young was right to not tell her anything. These are two very different ideas entirely.

Yup, this is what I think.

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

I just rewatched the episode. In fairness, before the end, Young never laid a hand on Telford. Telford attacked him after he made Telford look at the photo of the firefighters killed on Icarus. Then Greer jumped in and smacked Telford around after pulling Telford off of Young.

The ending isn't justifiable but there was no "phyisical" torture.

[EllieVee]

Scott also has a conflict because Young is his superior officer. Who's next? And who can be trusted? Should Wray take over, given her agenda? There's no one here with clean hands so Young brought in someone from Earth.

Who did he bring in to do the interrogation? I seem to remember Colonel 'I have a conflict of interest' Young doing that.

[Krazeh]

Out of curiosity, which professional or personal interest do people think that Young would be able to benefit by exploting the situation with Telford?

[xxxevilgrinxxx]

Out of curiosity, which professional or personal interest do people think that Young would be able to benefit by exploting the situation with Telford?

it wouldn't serve any professional interest at all, and Young strikes me as someone that may take personal joy in beating the stuffing out of Telford, but I doubt he'd get much personal joy from exploiting the situation either professionally or personally. When Young has shared things with the people above him, he seems so far to have been avoiding dishing on the people beneath him, preferring to keep it in house. There is nothing to be gained by trying to exploit the situation with Telford. In fact, the only person that would have anything to gain is Telford and even then, it doesn't put him on the Destiny.

[Krazeh]

it wouldn't serve any professional interest at all, and Young strikes me as someone that may take personal joy in beating the stuffing out of Telford, but I doubt he'd get much personal joy from exploiting the situation either professionally or personally. When Young has shared things with the people above him, he seems so far to have been avoiding dishing on the people beneath him, preferring to keep it in house. There is nothing to be gained by trying to exploit the situation with Telford. In fact, the only person that would have anything to gain is Telford and even then, it doesn't put him on the Destiny.

That is what i'm thinking, and if that is the case I don't see how there can be a conflict of interest. Would like to hear from other people as well, especially those who do think there is a conflict of interest.

[EllieVee]

That is what i'm thinking, and if that is the case I don't see how there can be a conflict of interest. Would like to hear from other people as well, especially those who do think there is a conflict of interest.

Young has personal issues with Telford about his wife. He has beaten Telford up on a previous occasion. Conflict of interest right there. Anyone who doesn't think that's a conflict of interest is wearing blinkers.

[Krazeh]

Young has personal issues with Telford about his wife. He has beaten Telford up on a previous occasion. Conflict of interest right there. Anyone who doesn't think that's a conflict of interest is wearing blinkers.

A conflict of interest, as far as i'm aware, arises when someone is in a position to exploit a situation in such a way as to benefit one or more of their professional and/or personal interests. So what are the personal or professional interests that Young could exploit the situation to beneift? Taking the issue with his wife as an example, how could he exploit the situation to benefit his interest, which I assume is a better relationship with his wife?

[EllieVee]

A conflict of interest, as far as i'm aware, arises when someone is in a position to exploit a situation in such a way as to benefit one or more of their professional and/or personal interests. So what are the personal or professional interests that Young could exploit the situation to beneift? Taking the issue with his wife as an example, how could he exploit the situation to benefit his interest, which I assume is a better relationship with his wife?

Um, where are you getting your definition from? There needs to be no position to exploit. A private interest that may conflict with the public interest. Young has a private issue with Telford (Emily) which conflicts with the public interest (information about the Lucien Alliance). This may influence how he acts and indeed what accusations he makes. He should step away.

[gildor23]

How is Scott thinking for himself??? he got bullied around by Wray nothing more, that just showed hes spinless. Scott seems to have a "nice guy" complex and always tried to do what others want him to because he wants them to like him.

Scott is way too much of a "people pleaser".

[Deevil]

Scott also has a conflict because Young is his superior officer. Who's next? And who can be trusted? Should Wray take over, given her agenda? There's no one here with clean hands so Young brought in someone from Earth.

Erm, a conflict of interest does not exist solely because Young is Scott's commanding officer. Especially when Scott has been standing up, and away from Young. There is no hero worshipping going on now.

As for Wray's 'agenda'. Do you mean the agenda to get home? The fact that she doesn't trust Young to look after the interests of those on the ship who aren't the military? Her objection to the little dictatorship he has going on? Her desire to look out for the little man that Young refuses to do? Yeah, that's terrible. But Young being in the position to once again, potentially, enact his revenge against Rush and Telford is acceptable.

Out of curiosity, which professional or personal interest do people think that Young would be able to benefit by exploting the situation with Telford?

The fact that he has a very deep, personal conflict with both Telford and Rush (they have an uneasy truce these day's, but that truce does not mean I'd trust him with Rush's life) means that he will not be making clear decisions and form clear impressions. Everything he does is clouded with his own paranoia.

In the real world, had people known about this conflict (which no one on Earth seems too), he would have been removed from it for the reason above.

[Sami_]

Dictator's don't usually report to their superiors like Young did and then he facilitated O'Neill coming aboard Destiny.

I don't think he acted improperly toward Telford at all this episode, if he suffocates to death in the next episode I might change that stance.

In fact he openly stated that he wanted to give Telford the benefit of the doubt, he said he didn't believe Rush, that he would do his best to help him and even said that it was mind control and not his fault - none of this sounds like someone who has personal vendetta against the man.

He never even assaulted him at all even when Telford attacked him, he appeared calm and rational throughout the whole episode.

[Deevil]

Dictator's don't usually report to their superiors like Young did and then he facilitated O'Neill coming aboard Destiny.

Some Dictators even hold elections.

The fact that he got O'Neill over doesn't mean he isn't acting like a dictator. It really doesn't mean that there is no conflict of interest, because despite what Young said in this episode the history of his character and his paranoid towards both Rush and Telford tend to discount those words to me. First, and lasting impressions and all that (that's not to say if he starts to act rationally on a regular basis that I wont cheer a little, then I'd be sad. Unstable Young is interesting.)

[Shai Hulud]

Scott is way too much of a "people pleaser".

The Scott charcter is an enigma at the moment, he's totaly weak willed and that lack of backbone has been a theme thats run throughout his life; letting down the priest who raised him by fathering an illigitemate son with a stripper - with the sexual promiscuity theme continuing with the whole James / Chloe situation, questioning and disobeying orders from his superiors, giving out military information to civilians. Greer needs to kick his butt into line and beat the whole morality thing out of him.

[EllieVee]

The Scott charcter is an enigma at the moment, he's totaly weak willed and that lack of backbone has been a theme thats run throughout his life; letting down the priest who raised him by fathering an illigitemate son with a stripper - with the sexual promiscuity theme continuing with the whole James / Chloe situation, questioning and disobeying orders from his superiors, giving out military information to civilians. Greer needs to kick his butt into line and beat the whole morality thing out of him.

[xxxevilgrinxxx]

The Scott charcter is an enigma at the moment, he's totaly weak willed and that lack of backbone has been a theme thats run throughout his life; letting down the priest who raised him by fathering an illigitemate son with a stripper - with the sexual promiscuity theme continuing with the whole James / Chloe situation, questioning and disobeying orders from his superiors, giving out military information to civilians. Greer needs to kick his butt into line and beat the whole morality thing out of him.

Scott is naive but I think it's a stretch to claim that he's weak willed
-he was 16. What person at 16 hasn't made a mistake? You've never made a mistake? I know I made a crapload of them, so who am I to judge?
-how you get to a grand total of three women and call it sexual promiscuity is beyond me. Seems sort of healthy to me.
-questioning and disobeying orders seems remarkably strong willed to me, especially given how much he regards Young, that he's willing to defy him the way he does, when the occasion calls for it.
-as much as I don't agree with telling Wray anything, I don't think it's necessarily weak willed to do so. He made a choice. Weak willed people don't make choices.

beat the morality out of him....seriously?