They have always played fast & loose with the regenerations. Remember how Romana "tried on" different bodies?
Re: Matt Smith, Actually the 12th Doctor?
They have always played fast & loose with the regenerations. Remember how Romana "tried on" different bodies?
Although bow ties are cool, the scarf is cooler!
Re: Matt Smith, Actually the 12th Doctor?
I don't think it's ever been said on screen how/when/where the limitations were imposed, other than the whole point of The Five Doctors - which was that Rassilon was seeking anyone who wanted immortality (ie to continually regenerate - or at least, to never die) and "put them out of the way". I don't recall any reference to regeneration being linked to the symbiotics of the TARDIS...Originally Posted by FennerMachine
Well yes, but it's long been considered that those different bodies were not actual regenerations, but merely an ability of a Time Lord to have a quick test run... presumably not a function the Doctor has been able to achieve, possible as he's never regenerated on Gallifrey/in more ideal circumstances than falling from a radio telescope/etc...
Most Time Lords, like the First Doctor, simply wear their bodies out...
Re: Matt Smith, Actually the 12th Doctor?
But if you go by what was said onscreen.....Well yes, but it's long been considered that those different bodies were not actual regenerations
Although bow ties are cool, the scarf is cooler!
Re: Matt Smith, Actually the 12th Doctor?
Um yes... go on try another one he says... doesn't say go on, use another regeneration... or stop messing around wasting your lives being silly just because Douglas Adams wants to have some fun...
Re: Matt Smith, Actually the 12th Doctor?
You're right cosmichobo, never stated on screen as far as I'm aware either.
Lot's of 'answers' can be found in books/novels.
Although not canon as they have not been on TV some of the books help make sense of seeming contradictions and anomalies on-screen.
The books also answer how Romana can control her regeneration to some degree and the Doctor cannot.
Again, not canon but they help to make sense of it all!
Re: Matt Smith, Actually the 12th Doctor?
I would just like to point out to all of you people who are arguing over whether this is the last doctor or not that BBC admits that they are making The Doctor immortal. "Edict that Time Lords can regenerate only 12 times before they die has been quietly ditched." They are going to continue to make as many Doctors as they so choose or until the show dies which will most likely never happen.
But just to clarify, Matt Smith is the eleventh doctor according to BBC. Thank you.
Re: Matt Smith, Actually the 12th Doctor?
11th Doctor... 11th regeneration.
(whereas for example 5 says he's the "fourth" regeneration)
Re: Matt Smith, Actually the 12th Doctor?
Obviously, there will be more Doctors after the 13th Doctor. The question is how are they going to do it. But there will be a lot of fans disappointed if the regeneration into the 14th Doctor is as "routine" as any other.
Re: Matt Smith, Actually the 12th Doctor?
The sad part with some of today's TV viewers, is that if something isn't more spectacular than the previous version, the audience gets bored.
Instead of it being mindless entertainment, regardless of how something is done (which it is exactly that most of the time to me), the rejected creation(s) gets tossed into the winds of time to be forever forgotten.
I'd rather have mindless entertainment of fictional stories in repeats than NO Tv at all. Otherwise, there's always the gardens and fields to go tend to and grow veggies, and take care of the cattle, etc. If people get so annoyed with watching fictional stories via various technologies, there seems to still be some crazy countries out there that just might hurl everyone back into the dark ages and living conditions even prior to that, where sitting in real-life arenas watching people and/or animals getting mauled was the mindless *entertainment* of the day.
I'd rather have the current technologies where no one gets hurt in the world of entertainment, than the real life alternatives. Sometimes I wonder where our real world (in entertainment) is heading.
BTW, once I finally understood what DOCTOR WHO was, and *who* the Doctor was, I thought the program was a truly novel idea.I'm glad it has lasted as long as it has, so far.
It has certainly had its moments of how to work around traveling thruout all of time, and yet using cheap visuals (props and effects, etc) in contrast to its counterpart sci-fi space series which was predominantly Star Trek.
Re: Matt Smith, Actually the 12th Doctor?
The new showrunners of Doctor Who have certainly followed this principle (especially RE season finales). I personally disagree. At least - the stories don't need to be more and more epic... Arguably THE most popular story of Classic Who was simply about the Doctor and companion becoming embroiled in a local petty war, which they spent the entire time trying to extricate themselves, ultimately at the cost of the Doctor's life... I'd watch that again over most of the modern era's season finales...
Well, before we get to that state, there's always Reality TV... Watch people on the tv being thrown to the lions first... eh?
The Classic Who production teams were renown for their ingenuity when it came to making $ go a long way... Sometimes the result worked well... other times...BTW, once I finally understood what DOCTOR WHO was, and *who* the Doctor was, I thought the program was a truly novel idea.
It has certainly had its moments of how to work around traveling thruout all of time, and yet using cheap visuals (props and effects, etc) in contrast to its counterpart sci-fi space series which was predominantly Star Trek.
Re: Matt Smith, Actually the 12th Doctor?
Actually, when River Song poisoned The Doctor with her lipstic and she gave The Doctor her remaining regeneration lives, The Doctor could have gotten more regenerations from her, but i still dont think the 11th Doctor still isnt the 12th one. why? THEY WOULDN'T HAVE NAMED THE FIRST EPISODE WITH MATT SMITH "ELEVENTH HOUR", OR ON THE EPISODE "THE GOD COMPLEX", THE DOCTORS DOOR WOULDNT HAVE BEEN 11! Still, good thinking.
Re: Matt Smith, Actually the 12th Doctor?
I have something for you to ponder.
If the 4th doctor was 913 years old one would assume that he (assuming they have the same life span as a human) would have regenerated at least 8 time before hartnell. Therefor we should just about to celebrate the 21st regen when Matt does the deed
Re: Matt Smith, Actually the 12th Doctor?
For what it's worth...
The Fourth Doctor, in Pyramids of Mars, says he has lived for "something like 750 years"... Which makes sense to him having had a 500 year diary when in his 2nd incarnation. There certainly is no rule of thumb that a human lifespan equates to 1 regeneration.
The 7th Doctor's age is given, at the beginning of his era (ie Time and the Rani) as 953... The new series then abandoned that basically and has been all over the place with his age.
Re: Matt Smith, Actually the 12th Doctor?
No one pays for an author's work, they pay for the product. The author is not selling labor. When someone buys a book, what they care about is whether it is a good book. If an author easily writes a good book, should they be paid less than a book of similar quality that the author had to work hard to
It isn't a matter of everything needing to be epic, but some things really are big events. We know they are going to keep having regeneration after regeneration, but making him officially immortal (that is, making it official within the Whoniverse) would be a letdown. Fans know that the 13th Doctor is supposed to be the last - unless something special happens to get him more regenerations. By Timelord standards, the Doctor is burning through regenerations. He lived a very long time as the First Doctor, but since then, he's been reckless. If he has an infinite number of regenerations, then this is negated. If he has an infinite number of regenerations, then he risks nothng.
By all means, get the Doctor some more regenerations. But make it a barrier to overcome. To get around the regeneration limit by simply ignoring it is a tremendous waste of a story opportunity.
Re: Matt Smith, Actually the 12th Doctor?
Actually, the 11th Doctor is the 10th regeneration. The First Doctor is the original, so the 0th regeneration. The regeneration number is 1 below the Doctor number (5th Doctor is 4th regeneration (original 1+4 regens). Hence the 13th Doctor being the 12th (and possibly final) regeneration.
Re: Matt Smith, Actually the 12th Doctor?
Re: Matt Smith, Actually the 12th Doctor?
still makes one more to go, makes perfect sense
Re: Matt Smith, Actually the 12th Doctor?
Just found this forum and have enjoyed reading the speculation. I thought I would add my take on it.
TimeLords are not immortal (otherwise they would not have lost the Time War and you would not have had House boast to the Doctor that it had killed hundreds of them) the Regeneration however is not a guaranteed thing. Presumably this simply means that the death has to be slow enough for the process to kick in. The Doctor tends to get poisoned a lot, the switch from 6 to 7 is the odd one where he appears to have fallen off an exercise bike. Instant "Battlefield" death is for real.
The number of re-generations is a strange one. Gallifreyan law and custom clearly prescribes 12 but neither the Doctor nor the Master have ever cared much for those boundaries. Matt Smith habitually refers to himself as the Eleventh so the partial regen of Journey's end cannot be counted no more than when River Song used regen energy to save 11 after poisoning him with a substance that blocked the re-gen process in his own body. It also gave him an undefined number of extra re-gens
**Spec and spoilers TNOTD/50th Anniversary Special-Bagpuss**
Spoiler:
Last edited by Bagpuss; May 20th, 2013 at 05:51 AM. Reason: Tag applied.
Re: Matt Smith, Actually the 12th Doctor?
I Have the Answer, "Regeneration" he was returned to full health using (regeneration) regardless of weather or not he took a new body, he still regenerated. he cheated the cycle and made the new body an optional extra that understandably he opted out of but here is my Point;
He, Regenerated if it made a difference if he had a new Body or not, it would be called reincarnation The Doctor entered his (Regenerative Cycle) there for he used one of his twelve regenerations meaning, he has one regeneration remaining But I must Agree Matt Smith is 11th incarnation, if anyone dis-agrees with that I want a reasoned argument documenting why you think I am wrong.
I Hope this Answers Your Question,
Regards, Ben
Re: Matt Smith, Actually the 12th Doctor?
I Dis-Agree the doctor is portrayed as honourable and not brake the rules set forth by his people so that they die like everyone else I think he will regenerate one last time and then he will accept he must die just think we will be alive/interested to see it and come on it'll be amazing stop trying to drag it out doctor who is getting more and more farthetched as technology progresses, Fact Excuse Spelling
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