How come John is an idiot all of a sudden?

[FallenAngelII]

Supersonic wave that will lead the creatures right to it and he decides to activate it before setting up the charge?! On top of that, there's the very creaky well, which alerted the creatures to his presence even before he activated the tablet.

What kind of a moron is John?! The most logical thing to do first would've been to set the charge, then activate the tablet. And why did he have to crank the bucket all the way up? I mean, he did it pretty much as far as he could instead of just within easy reach.

That wasted precious time and elicited more sounds. This was the dumbest John we've seen in months if not years. Shame on you, PTB, shame on you!

And the plan wasn't even that good. And that stupid he-man order that his subordinates had to stand back no matter what. Did anyone else get a "I'm the man, so I can handle it!"-vibe from him in this episode?

[prion]

Ah come on, he had a parasite in his brain! That would explain ALL the stupidity abounding in this episode (aka THE SHRINE)

[FallenAngelII]

Ah come on, he had a parasite in his brain! That would explain ALL the stupidity abounding in this episode (aka THE SHRINE)

Umm... that was Rodney.

[Flyboy]

John is a career pilot. He hasn't done an O'Neill and MAGICALLY had an entire flight career (including test pilot) before the rank of Captain then become a commando. He has spent his entire USAF career flying things. Sure as a pilot you'll have basic ground combat training, any role would, but it would be absolutely minute compared to the ground training of an infantry man for example.

To put it simply, I can accept John as military IC of Atlantis, if he'd do his job and stay in Atlantis and make sure he actually reads personnel files, instead of galevanting off on a field team which is a job that is beneath his position. But he doesn't, and it is CRAZY to put a pilot in charge of your flag ship combat team. Sure, maybe let him be the key jumper pilot, but the Marines are there for a reason, and I bet you, even in Series 1, there was a Marine higher than the rank of Leiutenant, probably even a Captain or a Major considering the highest Marine rank was a Colonel, so THEY should be leading the flag ship team.

I think the Major in Whispers said she was USAF, am I correct? If so, I wonder if she was another bloody pilot, or an actual groundie. If it's the latter, SHE should have been planning the tactics, not Shep, and he should have delegated.

[FallenAngelII]

Stuff.

Yes, yes. John shouldn't really be doing what he's doing, it's not realistic. We know.

The question is, though, why John was so stupid in this episode. I mean, anyone with half a brain would've known to set the charge first.

[Flyboy]

Yes, yes. John shouldn't really be doing what he's doing, it's not realistic. We know.

The question is, though, why John was so stupid in this episode. I mean, anyone with half a brain would've known to set the charge first.

Ok, I'll rephrase. He's an idiot because he hasn't had the proper training and actually isn't all that good under pressure when not airborne.

Happier?

[FallenAngelII]

Ok, I'll rephrase. He's an idiot because he hasn't had the proper training and actually isn't all that good under pressure when not airborne.

Happier?

4 and a half years fighting the Wraith and other threats. He's gone through enough, IMO, to be able to at least think straight under pressure. Also, I'll repeat, anyone with half a brain would've known to set the charge first.

He had time to plan it out in his head in the house/hovel. What, did he just go through it once in his head and went "Tablet first, charge second"? Also, it's simple logic. If so, then he should immediately be stripped of his position. Taking only a minute or so work out a half-assed plan without planning out the details in a life and death situation... if that's not incompetent, I don't know what is.

"Hey, the sound will lead them straight to you!"
"Alright. I'll set it first before setting the charge, which will take some time, so that they'll have extra time to kill me!"

I mean, he makes mistakes sometimes, but this is something any 12 year old could figure out (I hope. I could've at age 12).

[Flyboy]

4 and a half years fighting the Wraith and other threats. He's gone through enough, IMO, to be able to at least think straight under pressure. Also, I'll repeat, anyone with half a brain would've known to set the charge first.

He had time to plan it out in his head in the house/hovel. What, did he just go through it once in his head and went "Tablet first, charge second"? Also, it's simple logic. If so, then he should immediately be stripped of his position. Taking only a minute or so work out a half-assed plan without planning out the details in a life and death situation... if that's not incompetent, I don't know what is.

"Hey, the sound will lead them straight to you!"
"Alright. I'll set it first before setting the charge, which will take some time, so that they'll have extra time to kill me!"

I mean, he makes mistakes sometimes, but this is something any 12 year old could figure out (I hope. I could've at age 12).

I agree.

Which means we have two options.

A) Blame the writers for being gash.

B) Find an incharacter reason for why he was so rubbish. Which I still think is because he's ACTUALLY fairly crap at tactics. He might be good in a firefight, but really he doesn't often have to think up tactics, it's probably a very good thing he has Teyla and Ronon to baby sit him. He was also probably less willing to listen to the female squad as he was attempting to assert his masculinity.

[FallenAngelII]

I agree.

Which means we have two options.

A) Blame the writers for being gash.

B) Find an incharacter reason for why he was so rubbish. Which I still think is because he's ACTUALLY fairly crap at tactics. He might be good in a firefight, but really he doesn't often have to think up tactics, it's probably a very good thing he has Teyla and Ronon to baby sit him. He was also probably less willing to listen to the female squad as he was attempting to assert his masculinity.

I agree with the bolded part (yes, John-lovers, bring it!). As I wrote in the OP, he seemed awfully "I'm the man, so you'll listen up to my hair-brained plan, girls!" by the end there. What's-her-name tried helping but he was all "No, no. Man here. Shut up."

Soooo... what were they thinking?!

Still, it's a no-brainer. Bad at tactics or not, you have to actually be of the single digit IQs to not know that you set the charge first and then turn the thing that will lead the enemy straight to you on. He must've gotten a bump on the head that morning or something because as muh as I dislike John's random (and occasionally alarmingly frequent) bouts of immature, he was supposedly smart enough to get into MENSA and he's not entirely stupid most of the time.

He should know better. I'll go with "Blame the writers" this time. This was just a supremely badly written episode:
* John's stupidity
* The fist bump
* John's "I'm the man, so shut up. I'm not listening to any womenfolk!"-attitude at the end

The little things add up and suddenly it's one of the worse episodes this season...

[rarocks24]

Supersonic wave that will lead the creatures right to it and he decides to activate it before setting up the charge?! On top of that, there's the very creaky well, which alerted the creatures to his presence even before he activated the tablet.

What kind of a moron is John?! The most logical thing to do first would've been to set the charge, then activate the tablet. And why did he have to crank the bucket all the way up? I mean, he did it pretty much as far as he could instead of just within easy reach.

That wasted precious time and elicited more sounds. This was the dumbest John we've seen in months if not years. Shame on you, PTB, shame on you!

And the plan wasn't even that good. And that stupid he-man order that his subordinates had to stand back no matter what. Did anyone else get a "I'm the man, so I can handle it!"-vibe from him in this episode?

Must you bold every other word?

And I've said this before to you, and I'll say it again, the writers sometimes have to sacrifice common sense in order to bring dramatic tension. And to be completely honest, why are you fretting about characters acting stupid in perhaps one of the stupidest 43 minutes of SGA?

[antigravity]

That wasted precious time and elicited more sounds. This was the dumbest John we've seen in months if not years. Shame on you, PTB, shame on you!

And the plan wasn't even that good. And that stupid he-man order that his subordinates had to stand back no matter what. Did anyone else get a "I'm the man, so I can handle it!"-vibe from him in this episode?

yep!! i thought the same. in fact i thought there were a three key tactical errors made that just made me cringe:

1) there was way insufficient questioning of the villager dude who for all we know let the zombies out, or could have had good intel as to who they were, how they behaved, where to hide etc.

2) no plan B was devised. stupid. and you're totally right about the machismo.

and 3) didn't set the charge first.


but boy wasn't it convenient at the end that after all that work, only 9 happened to show up and then all the rest that was soon discovered to exist came running straight into gun-fire?

[FallenAngelII]

Must you bold every other word?

And I've said this before to you, and I'll say it again, the writers sometimes have to sacrifice common sense in order to bring dramatic tension. And to be completely honest, why are you fretting about characters acting stupid in perhaps one of the stupidest 43 minutes of SGA?

So you agree with me that this was a very badly written episode? I incidentally just made a thread about this very subject.

1) there was way insufficient questioning of the villager dude who for all we know let the zombies out, or could have had good intel as to who they were, how they behaved, where to hide etc.

Yeah. "Oh, you look harmless, we'll just let you go despite you behaving very suspiciously". That was... bad.

2) no plan B was devised. stupid. and you're totally right about the machismo.

Or even a "What happens if it goes south"-contingency plan.

but boy wasn't it convenient at the end that after all that work, only 9 happened to show up and then all the rest that was soon discovered to exist came running straight into gun-fire?

Yeah, those must've been the failed experiments, the one with insufficient brain matter. "Let's run straight at them and hope we get to them before they kill us!".

[hisg1fans]

IMO his behavior isn't 'all of a sudden', it always has been...shall we say.....not sound.

[FallenAngelII]

IMO his behavior isn't 'all of a sudden', it always has been...shall we say.....not sound.

But surely you must agree that he's usually... less not-smart than this.

[hisg1fans]

But surely you must agree that he's usually... less not-smart than this.

Agreed. Usually not quite this less-than-good.

Trying to stay positive here