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Thread: Stargate and Nudity

  1. #1
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    Default Stargate and Nudity

    But the two-part episode is not without its flaws -- most prominently a scene with full frontal nudity. In 1997 the decision was insisted upon by the Showtime network, which planned to air SG-1 at 10 p.m., but vocally opposed by Wright.

    "It doesn't belong in Stargate," Wright said. "I'm not a prude, [but] this is a family show. It has violence, there's no question it has violence, but it is almost always some sort of 'just' violence as opposed to random or gratuitous."
    This is something i cannot understand at all. Why are people so so scared of seeing people without clothing on screen but have apsolutely no problem with violence.

    Let me ask you all a question. In real life what would offend you more, a person walking down the street completely naked or a person walking down the street with a severed head (The Last Man)?

    Its really odd as in the real world sex and nudity are common and there is nothing wrong with it but on television its a big no no but violence is completely opposite where violence (killing people) is acceptable but in the real world you would get arrested and spend a very high amount of time in gaol.

    Why are people so afraid of nudity on television (specifically Stargate) but violence is far more acceptable?

    My opinion is that if it is tastefully done nudity should not be a problem for any tv show (including stargate).
    Last edited by ykickamoocow; April 6th, 2008 at 05:45 AM.

  2. #2
    Lieutenant General DigiFluid's Avatar
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    Default Re: Stargate and Nudity

    I don't think it's "people" in general, so much as Americans in particular. Gore, torture, massive violence, cursing like a drunken Irish dockworker are all a-okay, but for some reason a little skin chills their blood.

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    Lieutenant Colonel Ouroboros's Avatar
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    Default Re: Stargate and Nudity

    Quote Originally Posted by DigiFluid View Post
    I don't think it's "people" in general, so much as Americans in particular. Gore, torture, massive violence, cursing like a drunken Irish dockworker are all a-okay, but for some reason a little skin chills their blood.
    Well hey now lets not get carried away. Everyone knows that swearing is at least above torture and massive gun violence in terms of badness. It might not be quite as horrible as the naked human form or, god forbid, the vile act of human reproduction, but it's certainly not anything I want my precious little babies to be exposed to.

    Severed heads are just darling though, ditto on torture and making excuses for it.

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    Default Re: Stargate and Nudity

    Quote Originally Posted by DigiFluid View Post
    I don't think it's "people" in general, so much as Americans in particular.
    So how much nudity was there in Torchwood? Or any continental European sci-fi TV series aiming at the same audience... wait a minute, are there any such series? I know the Russian TV is way skimpier on nudity than anything American... in fact, most of what they show is American.

    To the original poster- Stargate's declared reason for keeping the sexully explicit content down is, as per your Wright quote, that it is a famly show. As in something people watch with their kids, or even that kids watch without the parent supervision. In your opinion, in real life is sex more common than cursing and violence for a 10 year old?
    The fancy word we use nowadays is "empathy"--entering into the emotions of others. I had appreciated and admired individual refugees but realized I had felt no blanket empathy for the Palestinian refugees, and finally I knew why.... It is hard to sorrow for those who only sorrow over themselves. It is difficult to pity the pitiless. To wring the heart past all doubt, those who cry aloud for justice must be innocent. They cannot have wished for a victorious rewarding war, blame everyone else for their defeat, and remain guiltless. - Martha Gellhorn

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    Default Re: Stargate and Nudity

    Quote Originally Posted by Womble View Post
    To the original poster- Stargate's declared reason for keeping the sexully explicit content down is, as per your Wright quote, that it is a famly show. As in something people watch with their kids, or even that kids watch without the parent supervision. In your opinion, in real life is sex more common than cursing and violence for a 10 year old?
    For a 10 year old cursing sex and violence are obviously not common. But my point is that for some reason violence is acceptable for a 10 year old to watch but nudity is not.

    As for your "Sexually explicit" comment that is not what im talking about. Sexually explicit content isnt suitable for young children but i dont see any problem with nudity.

    For example in the episode "The Tower" (yes i know it was a bad episode) the woman strips infront of Sheppard and we get a view of her back then she begins kissing Sheppard and they cut away to the next scene. I would not have a problem with children seeing her breasts in that situation and as long as they cut away at the same time they did in the episode then there shouldnt be a problem. If she stripped naked and we got to see her breats then we saw her and Sheppard having sex then i agree it wouldnt be appropriate but i dont see the harm of the camera briefly showing her breats before they cut away to the next scene.

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    Default Re: Stargate and Nudity

    Quote Originally Posted by ykickamoocow View Post
    For a 10 year old cursing sex and violence are obviously not common. But my point is that for some reason violence is acceptable for a 10 year old to watch but nudity is not.
    Because we would find it less of a problem were they fighting than were they trying to have sex at that age, perhaps?

    As for your "Sexually explicit" comment that is not what im talking about. Sexually explicit content isnt suitable for young children but i dont see any problem with nudity.

    For example in the episode "The Tower" (yes i know it was a bad episode) the woman strips infront of Sheppard and we get a view of her back then she begins kissing Sheppard and they cut away to the next scene. I would not have a problem with children seeing her breasts in that situation and as long as they cut away at the same time they did in the episode then there shouldnt be a problem. If she stripped naked and we got to see her breats then we saw her and Sheppard having sex then i agree it wouldnt be appropriate but i dont see the harm of the camera briefly showing her breats before they cut away to the next scene.
    I don't see how that scene could possibly benefit from the actress' breasts being exposed... except being made more sexually explicit.

    We associate nudity with sex, for what I should think are glaringly obvious reasons. Are you saying we shouldn't?
    The fancy word we use nowadays is "empathy"--entering into the emotions of others. I had appreciated and admired individual refugees but realized I had felt no blanket empathy for the Palestinian refugees, and finally I knew why.... It is hard to sorrow for those who only sorrow over themselves. It is difficult to pity the pitiless. To wring the heart past all doubt, those who cry aloud for justice must be innocent. They cannot have wished for a victorious rewarding war, blame everyone else for their defeat, and remain guiltless. - Martha Gellhorn

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    Default Re: Stargate and Nudity

    Quote Originally Posted by Womble View Post
    I don't see how that scene could possibly benefit from the actress' breasts being exposed... except being made more sexually explicit.
    Except it wouldnt as there was no sexual contact. You can decribe having a brief shot of a womans breats as "sexually explicit".


    Quote Originally Posted by Womble View Post
    We associate nudity with sex, for what I should think are glaringly obvious reasons. Are you saying we shouldn't?
    Sometimes we should sometimes we shouldnt. I have never and will never find a woman who is breast feeding her baby to be something of a sexual action.

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    Default Re: Stargate and Nudity

    Quote Originally Posted by ykickamoocow View Post
    Except it wouldnt as there was no sexual contact.
    Excuse me? You don't count striptease and making out as being sexual actions?

    You can decribe having a brief shot of a womans breats as "sexually explicit".
    Depends on the context.

    Sometimes we should sometimes we shouldnt. I have never and will never find a woman who is breast feeding her baby to be something of a sexual action.
    That is a different cattle of fish altogether. Even the most conservative cultures often make an exception for breastfeeding. Likewise with undressing a person in order to administer medical treatment. But you were talking about nudity in a clearly sexual context.
    The fancy word we use nowadays is "empathy"--entering into the emotions of others. I had appreciated and admired individual refugees but realized I had felt no blanket empathy for the Palestinian refugees, and finally I knew why.... It is hard to sorrow for those who only sorrow over themselves. It is difficult to pity the pitiless. To wring the heart past all doubt, those who cry aloud for justice must be innocent. They cannot have wished for a victorious rewarding war, blame everyone else for their defeat, and remain guiltless. - Martha Gellhorn

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    Default Re: Stargate and Nudity

    I just thought of scenes in Atlantis where nudity does make alot of sense. The Dart culling beams seem to not only take people but also clothing aswell which seems really odd to me as a person could be carrying weapons with them. Why wouldnt the Wraith modify their beams to take clothing aswell to prevent being attacked. Do you think the Wraith would care if the human they were about to feed on was naked?
    Last edited by ykickamoocow; April 6th, 2008 at 07:23 AM.

  10. #10

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ouroboros View Post
    Severed heads are just darling though, ditto on torture and making excuses for it.
    To some.

    Which is the problem with generalizations ... whether they are made by people making writing and marketing decisions or made by others.

  11. #11
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    Default Re: Stargate and Nudity

    I have never understood how people get offended by seeing a naked person. Should we ban people of television, because obviously the human body in all its pride is not allowed.
    http://img525.imageshack.us/img525/494/1293025055loj3.jpg

  12. #12

    Default Re: Stargate and Nudity

    the human race prides itself in violence...the front page of any major newspapaer is incomplete without news of violence....

    someone has to start a war with someone ...for real reasons or imaginary reasons.....although femists would want to belive otherwise ....this world is male driven...violence and aggression...if your child asks for a gi-joe figurine...he is more than cool...its is that whole kicka** attitude...it'c 'cool'

    as for nudidty...as far as adults are ok with it, or actually enjoy it...they are not toward the influence it has on children...pervertion....it crosses a blurry line when you have that sort of stuff on family time...where a family is suppossed to have a plutonic environment...even the children up to a certain point beliee their parents to be plutonics...and they'd much rather continue to believe so...even as adolescents

    so having this kind of imagery kinda is like the elephant in the room
    .

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    Default Re: Stargate and Nudity

    Quote Originally Posted by ykickamoocow View Post
    I just thought of scenes in Atlantis where nudity does make alot of sense. The Dart culling beams seem to not only take people but also clothing aswell which seems really odd as they dont seem to pick up any other objects other than people and clothing. Why would the Wraith modify their beams to take clothing aswell. Do you think the Wraith would care if the human they were about to feed on was naked?
    Who knows. Maybe they capture objects by the shape. Or maybe culling also serves as sampling of the local fashion.

    Seriously though, justl like every other narrative or visual element, nudity scenes in the movies and TV must serve a purpose. I've seen scenes where nudity was used for very justified reasons. There was a scene in a certain Israeli movie of a male character portrayed by a famous actor, former sex symbol, showering and exposing to the camera his now-aged, repulsive body; it contributed a lot to the characterization and highlighted the semi-autobiographical nature of the role. I remember the nudity moment in a tragic scene in Alexander Dovzhenko's "Earth" where a woman in completely shredded clothes symbolized the poverty and destruction of peasantry. I can understand that kind of use. But let us be honest, what is the underlying reason behind the nudity scene in "Children of the Gods", or most nudity scenes in the modern movies and TV, other than to boost the ratings by giving the male part of the audience something to ogle?
    The fancy word we use nowadays is "empathy"--entering into the emotions of others. I had appreciated and admired individual refugees but realized I had felt no blanket empathy for the Palestinian refugees, and finally I knew why.... It is hard to sorrow for those who only sorrow over themselves. It is difficult to pity the pitiless. To wring the heart past all doubt, those who cry aloud for justice must be innocent. They cannot have wished for a victorious rewarding war, blame everyone else for their defeat, and remain guiltless. - Martha Gellhorn

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    Default Re: Stargate and Nudity

    Quote Originally Posted by Womble View Post
    Who knows. Maybe they capture objects by the shape. Or maybe culling also serves as sampling of the local fashion.

    Seriously though, justl like every other narrative or visual element, nudity scenes in the movies and TV must serve a purpose. I've seen scenes where nudity was used for very justified reasons. There was a scene in a certain Israeli movie of a male character portrayed by a famous actor, former sex symbol, showering and exposing to the camera his now-aged, repulsive body; it contributed a lot to the characterization and highlighted the semi-autobiographical nature of the role. I remember the nudity moment in a tragic scene in Alexander Dovzhenko's "Earth" where a woman in completely shredded clothes symbolized the poverty and destruction of peasantry. I can understand that kind of use. But let us be honest, what is the underlying reason behind the nudity scene in "Children of the Gods", or most nudity scenes in the modern movies and TV, other than to boost the ratings by giving the male part of the audience something to ogle?
    Something which also doesnt make sense is the fact that Wraith can feed on a person who is wearing clothing (even bullet proof vests which are incredibly tough). Every paracitical life form needs skin on skin contact to feed but for some reason Wraith dont. The reason for this is because that would mean every person who is feed upon must be topless (including women) and even if there is nothing sexual about a Wraith feeding we still cant have topless women on Stargate. Nudity as a requirement of feeding does make sense and the fact that it isnt required really doesnt make sense to me.

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    Default Re: Stargate and Nudity

    Quote Originally Posted by ykickamoocow View Post
    Something which also doesnt make sense is the fact that Wraith can feed on a person who is wearing clothing (even bullet proof vests which are incredibly tough). Every paracitical life form needs skin on skin contact to feed but for some reason Wraith dont. The reason for this is because that would mean every person who is feed upon must be topless (including women) and even if there is nothing sexual about a Wraith feeding we still cant have topless women on Stargate.

    Nudity as a requirement of feeding does make sense and the fact that it isnt required really doesnt make sense to me.
    As far as excuses to see exposed female bosoms go, this one's pretty lame.

    Seriously, how do you imagine, say, the Wraith vs. Ford scene in "The Siege" if the Wraith had to undress him? Wouldn't it need to kiss him first?
    The fancy word we use nowadays is "empathy"--entering into the emotions of others. I had appreciated and admired individual refugees but realized I had felt no blanket empathy for the Palestinian refugees, and finally I knew why.... It is hard to sorrow for those who only sorrow over themselves. It is difficult to pity the pitiless. To wring the heart past all doubt, those who cry aloud for justice must be innocent. They cannot have wished for a victorious rewarding war, blame everyone else for their defeat, and remain guiltless. - Martha Gellhorn

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    Default Re: Stargate and Nudity

    Quote Originally Posted by Womble View Post
    Seriously, how do you imagine, say, the Wraith vs. Ford scene in "The Siege" if the Wraith had to undress him? Wouldn't it need to kiss him first?
    Hardly undress. A Wraith would have the strength to easily rip Ford's vest and shirt off him.

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    Default Re: Stargate and Nudity

    Quote Originally Posted by Womble View Post
    As far as excuses to see exposed female bosoms go, this one's pretty lame.

    Seriously, how do you imagine, say, the Wraith vs. Ford scene in "The Siege" if the Wraith had to undress him? Wouldn't it need to kiss him first?
    I do think the Wraith need skin connact with their victim but for the women it would be easy to just rip their shirt and keep their bra on. We have seen the Wraith suck the life from the top of peoples chests before so it shouldnt be a problem.

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    Default Re: Stargate and Nudity

    While I'm a big fan of female nudity, I agree with Mr. Wright in that the scene in question from Children of the Gods is jarring and doesn't fit with the rest of the show. If the rest of the series had been filmed with that sort of tone, that would be one thing. But as it stands, I won't miss that shot at all.

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    Default Re: Stargate and Nudity

    Quote Originally Posted by Womble View Post
    That is a different cattle of fish altogether. Even the most conservative cultures often make an exception for breastfeeding. Likewise with undressing a person in order to administer medical treatment. But you were talking about nudity in a clearly sexual context.
    That scene wasn't even remotely sexual, it was parasite getting a better look at a potential host. Considering it was also designed to show how vulnerable and helpless she was, showing her bare really was appropriate.

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    Default Re: Stargate and Nudity

    The problem I have with Wright's argument is that he is justifying violence and trashing nudity in the name of *this being a family show*. I would rather my daughter not see either of those things until she is a tad bit older, or more like WAY older.
    To me, he is saying it is ok for kids to see violence, death, torture, blood, guts, etc, but not something as harmless as a naked body. And I am not talking about sex. A naked body is not going to give kids nightmares.

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