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BC-304 vs. Imperial Star Destroyer

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    #31
    Originally posted by Jimbo-DR View Post
    You have typed the very reason why this is a REALLY stupid topic. Star Wars never followed ANY kind of realistic physics at ALL, or made any kind of attempt to do so. It was complete "magic", nothing was ever explained and we have no numbers or names for any of the real weapons and shield systems in Star Wars.

    For that reason, this comparison is totally pointless.
    Again, and again and again, same people say the same thing.

    Star Wars does not explain their stuff?
    Does it make it less real?

    Don't you think that Stargate didn't actually come with in fact far more technimagic over the years? Not counting people with magical powers.

    Just screw it. Star Wars is even more realistic than Stargate. It's not because it has the US army or whatever in it that it precludes the fact that it's getting closer to the technobabble levels of Trek.
    The Al'kesh is not a warship - Info on Naqahdah & Naqahdria - Firepower of Goa'uld staff weapons - Everything about Hiveships and the Wraith - An idea about what powers Destiny...

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      #32
      Star Wars is completely unrealistic in almost every way.
      multi-teraton main weapons?
      The idea of the Death star is the most idiotic thing ever. why create a space station made just for destroying planets if your main ships, which the empire has tens of thousands of, are capable of destroying planets on their own?
      Just one shot from a heavy turbo laser would probably destroy all life on Earth, but yet they need multiple shots to take out ships smaller than a kilometer long.

      Star Wars is a great Sci Fi universe, as long as you don't try to make sense of it, because then it just... doesn't make sense.
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        #33
        Originally posted by fugiman View Post
        Regular Star Destroyer
        50 heavy turbolaser batteries (10D)
        50 heavy turbolaser cannons (7D)
        20 enhanced ion cannons (3D)
        10 class III tractor beam projectors
        72 Tie Fighers

        I think that might punch a hole thorugh the Odyssey

        And if thats not enough lets see the Odyssey face a Super Star Destroyer

        Super Star Destroyer has
        250 turbolaser batteries
        250 heavy turbolaser batteries
        250 ion cannons
        250 concussion missle tubes
        144 Tie Fighters


        So I'm pretty sure the Odyssey would get blown out of the water because they don't have the weapons to match the Star Destroeyer
        And you think that... how? What about, again, that ZPM that can directly power energy weapons? Just as much as it powers the shield.
        Plus you're citing EU stats from RPG books that have yet to be demonstrated onscreen.

        The ISD is utterly toasted. I mean, do people get the meaning of a ZPM powering the ship's systems?
        It's just almost like a magic card, like God filling your weapons with his own personnal angry juices.
        The Al'kesh is not a warship - Info on Naqahdah & Naqahdria - Firepower of Goa'uld staff weapons - Everything about Hiveships and the Wraith - An idea about what powers Destiny...

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          #34
          The surface of the Executor was dotted with all sorts of weaponry. Its front arc was covered by 200 heavy and light turbolaser batteries, 50 concussion missile launchers, 100 ion cannons, and 20 tractor beam projectors. Its side arcs each boasted coverage by 75 light turbolaser batteries and 50 heavy turbolaser batteries, as well as 75 missile tubes, 50 ion cannons and 10 tractor beam projectors. The rear arc, traditionally the least defended area of a vessel, had an impressive weapons array of 50 heavy turbolaser batteries, 50 missile tubes, and 50 ion cannons.
          Source
          http://www.starwars.com/databank/sta...stroyer/?id=eu

          So they have lots of firepower that would destroy the Odyssey. Even if the Super Star Destroyer missed a few shots it would only take one shot to cripple the Odyssey
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            #35
            Gonna go with the Star Destroyer for the reasons I said the empire would beat the SG universe in the ultimate vs thread.

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              #36
              One on one situation the upgraded odyssey would not be destroy in any situation, it will always come out alive.

              Simple reason is whenever they are about to lose, turn on the time dilation device, freeze time, spend months coming up with alternative plan.

              Reverse time and put the plan into action.

              The upgraded odyssey would never loose in a fight.

              The odyssey with out the upgrades from unending went up against a sun and came of out intact.

              I guest the asguard would of upgraded odyssey shield with any enhancements they can think of plus made sure they were also top of the line.

              So I have to say odyssey would win, with out little struggle, especially with a ZPM on board.

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                #37
                Deadalus survived for a few minutes against 9 or ten hive ships and around 30cruisers. As well as thousands of darts. It had a ZPM but no advanced weapons and though it was unable to do damage against such odds the upgraded version would have taken down at least 2 more in teh battle before it had to retreat. Now I'm sure the wraith armada had as much, if not more firepower then a single super star destroyer. All Oddessy would have to do is plug in its handy dandy zpm and go out of phase, pop into phase under neath it and rapid fire its main cannons into the base of the ship. Without a doubt the oddy would escape and a wedge of swiss cheese would be left floating in space.


                Oddy wins hands down.


                Another note don't missles pass through shields in the SW universe? So Oddy flies in launches a horizon or what not and the SD is down.

                Oddessy
                at least 6 asgard beam weapons
                multiple railguns
                Unknown number of nuclear devices
                phase device
                Cloak
                Asgard power core
                asgard shields
                time dilations device
                ZPM

                That is a ship built for a tactical god.
                Last edited by Øsiris øf the Øri; 28 March 2007, 05:12 PM. Reason: more info

                "Their victims knew no peace until the Ori came and whispered to them"Sleep for the end draws near"and on that day all will rejoice when the Ori come and lay them low. "

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                  #38
                  in the SW universe, ships have 2 kinds of shields. ray shields and particle shields. ray shields protect against energy weapons like turbolasers, lasers, ion cannons, etc. particle shields protect against stuff like physical objects impacting the shields and concussion missles/proton torpedoes which detonate upon impact with the particle shields. by far particle shields seem to be the weaker of the two. SW universe shields can take massive amounts of damage from energy weapons before collapsing, whereas they can only take a limited number of proton torpedo/concussion missile hits before collapsing. starfighter squadrons have been known to collapse shield arcs with only 1 volley. considering the number of missiles and their yields being higher than those on starfighters, a cap-ship could unleash a swarm of missles, knock down a shield arc, and pound a hull. the trick is getting close enough to use said missile weapons, which traditionally have had short ranges.
                  That's the plan?!? That's the plan. That plan sucks!

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                    #39
                    Originally posted by BlankDots View Post
                    You fail to address the issue that a star destroyer has inferior shields. Remember when a x wing was able to penetrate the shields by firing at one spot. Or when a fighter smashed into the bridge, destroyer the executor.
                    As one of the resident starwars fans here, let me correct you. In all the novels it has to be a COORDINATED missile barrage from all 12 fighters in an Xwing sqadron hitting the shields at the same time (or within a few seconds of one another) with proton torpedos to knock down that shield. And that would only be one quadrant.

                    Originally posted by BlankDots View Post
                    As per my last argument the star destroyer was DESTROYED by an asteriod smashing into it. That said all the odyssey needs to do is fire at one spot, the bridge, continually and break through the shields. Destroying the star destroyer.
                    Which episode showed a SD getting destroyed by the bridge being hit by asteroids? I only remember the one captain comming the Executor saying they had suffered serious damage. And after that long being in the asteroid belt, i can understand..

                    Originally posted by BlankDots View Post
                    In short the star destroyer has greater firepower but isnt' able to utilize it in time because of its shoddy shields.
                    I disagree. I have yet to see any SG weapons destroy a moderate size asteroid in one hit, where the sw weapons do easily (as seen in ESB). As to the beaming nukes over, i doubt that with shields up, it would work.. IMO they would block them, like the jamming wraith do.

                    Originally posted by fugiman View Post
                    so the Star Destroyer would overpower there shields with its numerous firepower (Turboblasters, Ion cannons, Missles, etc......)
                    Heck, SW Ion cannons GO THROUGH shields... SO i see no reason why they would not go through SG shields...

                    Originally posted by fugiman View Post
                    Odyssey has a few Gatebusters while the Star Destroyer has tons of weapons that are just as powerful and don't run out after a few shots
                    IIRC Each stardestroyer has 60 turbolaser BATTERIES (where there are 4 cannons linked together), as well as 60 heavy ion cannons.. 20 in each arc.
                    Thats a lot of firepower coming at ya..

                    Originally posted by Arania View Post
                    However, if the 304 were to attack from an alternative vector, say direct up underneat or from behind, where defenses are significantly lower (Most of a destroyer's weapons are concentrated on the equatorial ridge and the rear-centre reinforced section behind the hypermatter reactor), then the 304 would probably have an edge if it could hit either the reactor or the engine array.
                    I will give you that, though i am not sure the ISD could 'bring it into the hanger bay.. AT most, they would send a few Gama assault shuttles to dock..

                    Originally posted by Arania View Post
                    Personally, I think the 304 carries the technological capability to either destroy or cripple a star destroyer, but the pilots and commanders dont have the imagination or training to get space combat tactics right. The Empire, although uninmaginative, does have the edge on space combat experience.
                    Agreed. Though i could see Oneal, cam or someone else coming up with some cool tactics..

                    Originally posted by .jolinar. View Post
                    And if you've seen how drap sots the star destroyers are
                    Come again??

                    Originally posted by NATIK View Post
                    smaller (hard to hit and the SW turbocannons are notoriously bad at hitting anything smaller then a capital ship),
                    Yes it is smaller, but what is it's size? 500m? that is easily still cap scale. Heck corellian corvetts are only 180m or so, and they still get hit repeatedly.

                    Originally posted by chilapox3 View Post
                    The idea of the Death star is the most idiotic thing ever. why create a space station made just for destroying planets if your main ships, which the empire has tens of thousands of, are capable of destroying planets on their own?
                    Just one shot from a heavy turbo laser would probably destroy all life on Earth, but yet they need multiple shots to take out ships smaller than a kilometer long.
                    The difference there, is a SD can only raise the surface of the planet, and if people are deep underground/protected by shields enough, they will stand upto that bombardment well./ THE DS was made to blow the planet up entirely...

                    Originally posted by knowles2 View Post
                    One on one situation the upgraded odyssey would not be destroy in any situation, it will always come out alive.

                    Simple reason is whenever they are about to lose, turn on the time dilation device, freeze time, spend months coming up with alternative plan.

                    Reverse time and put the plan into action.
                    Thats assuming they would even have the time let alone the ability to activate that device... Since Ion cannons shut down systems, and they go through shields, i can easily see the Odessy being taken out.

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                      #40
                      I believe the Death Star's primary purpose (well, the first one in any case) was actually to serve as a symbol of the Empire's might as part of Tarkin's Doctrine of Terror ('Fear will keep them in line'). The vast majority of the Imperial fleet was scattered across most of the SW galaxy to keep the various Imperial-subjugated worlds in check, and it would still require a fair-sized fleet of Star Destroyers to devastate most developed planets which attempted an uprising due to the aforementioned planetary shielding (unless they brought along a Torpedo Sphere or two, although those didn't seem to be too commonplace in the fleet). And even then, there were still a number of ways to successfully defend against a small fleet of Star Destroyers, such as the surface hypervelocity cannon or the ion cannon battery as shown in ESB.

                      That's where the Death Star came in. It was bigger than anything the Empire had ever constructed up to that point in time, was capable of interestellar travel and could pop up without warning in any star system and blow a world or two to bits in very little time with its superlaser, which was more than powerful enough to punch right through the planetary shield. As such, any worlds which were planning to rebel, no matter how well developed, would have second thoughts about doing so even without an actual Imperial presence in the system to keep them in check.

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                        #41
                        A Star Destroyer would kick its butt. More Weapons and its made by the empire!

                        Also they can take loads of bamage.

                        OWEVER IT DEPENDS WHOS IN THE oDESSY IF sg-1 IS THE HAVE more of a chance becuse its SG-1 however if Abniral Ackbar was in it then they would win 100% becuse his a fish who knows how to battle. I mean "consentrait your fire on that super Star Destroyer" thats military thinking at its best. XD
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                          #42
                          Ok heres the deal

                          Star destroyer pros and cons

                          Pro's

                          A LOT of firepower.
                          Decent Hull
                          A lot of fighters

                          Con's

                          Slow Maneuverability
                          Crap shielding (target one spot and you break through)
                          Crap sensors (mellenium falcon blended in with the destroyer)

                          BOTTOM LINE

                          Star destroyer if it can hold its shields up for 5 minutes it will turn odyssey to JUNK.

                          If odyssey can target the shields and break through, the star destroyer will be done for.

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                            #43
                            SD bad points (EU considered): shields can be puncturated by a cohesives forces of fighter scale warheads. Kilotons of very low megatons.

                            Odyssey: has plenty of nukes, beaming tech, and has the energy of two supernova in a sac powering everything, like shields and energy weapons.

                            Please, people, read this and think a bit about it.
                            The Al'kesh is not a warship - Info on Naqahdah & Naqahdria - Firepower of Goa'uld staff weapons - Everything about Hiveships and the Wraith - An idea about what powers Destiny...

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                              #44
                              ISD are slow and bulky, the Oddyssey could easly defeat one. And even if it was damaged to much, it could jump away safely anywhere, because SG hdrives use sub-space and can pass thru anything, while SW hdrives use reletivly normal space, and cant pass thru objects, like planets and stars, they have to use hspace lanes.

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                                #45
                                ISD's may grossly outclass the Odyssey in terms of weapons volume, weapons yield, in general, all technical specifications. Unfortunately, they are subject to the Stormtrooper Effect.

                                Therefore, decision goes to Odyssey by default.
                                "I disagree with what you say and I will deny, to your death, your right to say it." -Bucky Katt

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