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    #16
    **This post is an organizational place holder to be used for future additions.**

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      #17
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        #18
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          #19
          Three things:
          First you assume that the Wraith use weaker blasts against the Ancient shields because they drain them better.

          I have another idea about why those ships fired different energy blasts at Atlantis:
          The weapons have variable charge levels, and a full charged blast is to owerful, and will overload the weapon. So in continuous fire, they are less usefull and will take longer to drain a ZPM then say the weaker fast firing ones.
          So it is not a matter of using a more effective weapon, but a weapon more effectively over time.

          Comment


            #20
            While at first I thought the Wraith 'male' commander caste used telekinesis on Colonel Sumner in Rising, I think now he just used his own pure strength to send him flying. I think you can also safely say that the 'Hybrids' created by the retrovirus can be added to the caste list as I think one of the interviews Gateworld made had one of the creators say that Micheal is essentially a 'fifth caste'.

            I am a bit surpised that the shapes are 11 km's in length as I always thought they were more along the line of 5 km but I might have been conservative in my thoughts there.

            Was it ever confirmed that the Scoutship in 'Aurora' is the same as the transport ship in 'Allies'? Its a reasonable assumption but not sure if its taken as fact yet. Also I think mention needs to be made about the Wraith Cruisers, the ancient Wraith Supply Ships and the Wraith Computer Virus. In regards to the ships, they look like an amalgamation of mechanical and biological designs since the engines and the hanger bay look a lot more machine-like compared to the blue organic skin of the ship.

            Also I think it needs to be mentioned that the Darts plays another vital role for the Wraith in fleet engagements. Namely, as an interceptor to stop incoming projectiles or drones from hitting the Hiveship. Another point is that while Darts are short ranged, it does seem that they can be enhanced for long 'scouting' roles as was the case when that lone Dart scouted Atlantis before exploding and sending its data back to the Hive ships. Presumably, this enhancement made allowed it to travel under sublight at faster and longer speeds after exiting from a nearby Stargate close to the Lantean System.

            As for Wraith telepathy, I would concur pretty much on what you said though it does seem that now there is a change in it after Teyla's little 'incursion' into the Hivemind since Fords group said that they learnt the Wraith are separating their telepathical communication structure to ensure that vital information is not lost again to outside telepathic 'espionage'. Also that lone Wraith are incapable of summoning their comrades but when combined can actually act as biological boosters as you mentioned with Micheal and his colleagues in their 'ritual'.

            Anyway, missing pieces of technology I think can include the 'solid' holograms the Wraith scientist used when he first made the mistaken of leaving Wraith DNA in humans. There is of course the
            Spoiler:
            telepathic generator showed recently
            and the already mentioned computer virus weapon. There is of course two things mentioned but not seen on screen, one of which is the subspace booster relays that transmit tracking devices to the Hiveships and the 'stronghold' mentioned by the team when under the sway of Lucius in Irresistable though its quite possible that this 'stronghold' was not a fixed based structure but rather a Hiveship that landed.

            If some of this has already been mentioned then please excuse that part.


            'Hallowed are the children of the Ori. CROWD: Hallowed are we. Hallowed are the Ori.' -

            'Great holy armies shall be gathered and trained to fight all who embrace evil. In the name of the Gods, ships shall be built to carry the warriors out among the stars and we will spread Origin to all the unbelievers. The power of the Ori will be felt far and wide and the wicked shall be vanquished' -


            Contribute to the Stargate Wiki a source for any information on the Stargate universe from the books, RPG to games and comics.

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              #21
              wow guys i'm impressed with the level of detail here, well done you get green

              i was wondering when this would be posted, i remember Ouroboros mentioned it a while ago...

              i think you've covered everything though
              Robert Jastrow (self-proclaimed agnostic): "For the scientist who has lived by his faith in the power of reason, the story ends like a bad dream. He has scaled the mountains of ignorance; he is about to conquer the highest peak; as he pulls himself over the final rock, he is greeted by a band of theologians who have been sitting there for centuries."

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                #22
                My EYES Hurt!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

                Haven't even read anything just scrolled down the damn page!

                Now in use. pps is at 4,929 Terawatts
                pps = power per second
                The power that power's the great cities of the Ancients.
                xfire = zpm
                [m2k] klan, and forever will be.
                http://m2kclan.com
                vent info: voice250.hurricanehost.com
                port: 3785
                P90>M4A1+AK47+Machine Gun
                halo player and cs:s, cs:1.6, cz, cod2.
                Save Stargate NOW!!!- http://www.ipetitions.com/petition/Stargate/

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                  #23
                  Originally posted by An-Alteran View Post
                  Three things:
                  First you assume that the Wraith use weaker blasts against the Ancient shields because they drain them better.

                  I have another idea about why those ships fired different energy blasts at Atlantis:
                  The weapons have variable charge levels, and a full charged blast is to owerful, and will overload the weapon. So in continuous fire, they are less usefull and will take longer to drain a ZPM then say the weaker fast firing ones.
                  So it is not a matter of using a more effective weapon, but a weapon more effectively over time.
                  Mr. Oragahn did the weapons part of this and all the calculations related to that so I'll let him answer in more detail when he gets here.

                  Basically though there are two types of Wraith bolts we observed. One type seems to be able to cause catastrophic damage to shields but has significantly less effect on matter. This type is what Mr. O calls "falling stars".

                  The second type observed causes vastly more damage to matter but significantly less to shields. He calls this type "fireballs".

                  Falling stars do petaton level damage to the ancient city shields where as fireballs do gigaton level damage to matter. The falling stars then are actually singificnatly more powerful if they are being used against shields but their effect on matter remains negligable. Mr. O goes on to comment about how this might have played a role in the sinking of the city of Atlnatis and why the ancients felt it would offer them worthwhile protection.

                  Originally posted by Prior of the Ori
                  While at first I thought the Wraith 'male' commander caste used telekinesis on Colonel Sumner in Rising, I think now he just used his own pure strength to send him flying. I think you can also safely say that the 'Hybrids' created by the retrovirus can be added to the caste list as I think one of the interviews Gateworld made had one of the creators say that Micheal is essentially a 'fifth caste'.
                  We looked at the scene from Rising and the way the Wraith raises his arm seems to imply telekenesis of some sort was used. It's not clear cut but it seems like it would be very difficult to physically shove a person the way he does it.

                  Hybrids like Michael are just Wraith males who were transformed into humans before turning back into normal Wraith males again.

                  I am a bit surpised that the shapes are 11 km's in length as I always thought they were more along the line of 5 km but I might have been conservative in my thoughts there.
                  We had originally pegged them at around 5-6km to but new scalings done on no mans land/misbegotten upped the numbers. Mr. O did the scaling here and it's interesting because the 10.9km figure he got from those eps meshes almost perfectly with an 11km figure given by SGAs FX people in a recent magazine interview.(I think Mr. O rememebrs the name of the mag) Given this we felt 11km was as close to an official canon length as we had at the time.

                  Was it ever confirmed that the Scoutship in 'Aurora' is the same as the transport ship in 'Allies'? Its a reasonable assumption but not sure if its taken as fact yet. Also I think mention needs to be made about the Wraith Cruisers, the ancient Wraith Supply Ships and the Wraith Computer Virus. In regards to the ships, they look like an amalgamation of mechanical and biological designs since the engines and the hanger bay look a lot more machine-like compared to the blue organic skin of the ship.
                  They were both reffered to as scoutships in the show as I recall. It's possible that the one in Aurora may have been different but we didn't actually see it so it's tough to say. We didn't really get into cruisers or supply ships because they're not something that's part of a hiveship, they're ships in their own right Maybe at some point in the future we will though.

                  The computer virus does seem like a good candidate for an addition though. It's another type of weapon.

                  Also I think it needs to be mentioned that the Darts plays another vital role for the Wraith in fleet engagements. Namely, as an interceptor to stop incoming projectiles or drones from hitting the Hiveship. Another point is that while Darts are short ranged, it does seem that they can be enhanced for long 'scouting' roles as was the case when that lone Dart scouted Atlantis before exploding and sending its data back to the Hive ships. Presumably, this enhancement made allowed it to travel under sublight at faster and longer speeds after exiting from a nearby Stargate close to the Lantean System.
                  The super fast dart is something of a mystery. Even if it was launched from the next system over and travelled at .99c it should still have literally taken years to get to Atlantis. The alternative is that it was launched by a hiveship that passed even closer to the city but then that makes you wonder why that hive was never detected while as numerous others were.

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                    #24
                    EDIT: Ouroboros already adressed certain points.

                    Originally posted by An-Alteran View Post
                    Three things:
                    First you assume that the Wraith use weaker blasts against the Ancient shields because they drain them better.
                    No. This was based on the level of damage done to the satellite with the "falling star" bolts.
                    Though they were particularily fast, and according to one of the theories incorporated into the essay, this would mean less powerful bolts, it's not going to mean that those bolts were significantly more powerful if slower.
                    But above all, it's a theory meant to make sense of the existence of two distincitively types of weapons, and even seen within the same episode, and why the other Wraith hiveships bared those weapons when they attacked the city.

                    We stipulate that the falling stars are either particularily efficient against lantian shields, or they're a tech that is only possessed by a fraction of the Wraith, explaining why the ships comprising the armada sent to attack Atlantis had this tech, but not the hiveships seen in No Man's Land, which one of them actually belonged to a minor queen.

                    It was also done to explain the point of sinking a city beneath a mere 100 m or 200 m water barrier.

                    I have another idea about why those ships fired different energy blasts at Atlantis:
                    The weapons have variable charge levels, and a full charged blast is to owerful, and will overload the weapon. So in continuous fire, they are less usefull and will take longer to drain a ZPM then say the weaker fast firing ones.
                    So it is not a matter of using a more effective weapon, but a weapon more effectively over time.
                    It does not work because you can see that in Siege part 3, the hiveships and cruisers were firing the fireballs at the Daedalus at rates of fire which were just extremely close to the ones for the falling stars against Atlantis.

                    So the ROF is quite irrelevant here.
                    Last edited by Mister Oragahn; 07 December 2006, 03:54 PM.
                    The Al'kesh is not a warship - Info on Naqahdah & Naqahdria - Firepower of Goa'uld staff weapons - Everything about Hiveships and the Wraith - An idea about what powers Destiny...

                    Comment


                      #25
                      Originally posted by Prior_of_the_Ori View Post
                      While at first I thought the Wraith 'male' commander caste used telekinesis on Colonel Sumner in Rising, I think now he just used his own pure strength to send him flying.
                      I disagree. Sumner is clearly sent flying without the Wraith male dealing any particular powerful punch. In fact, I think he just rises his hands and the human goes flying backwards.

                      I think you can also safely say that the 'Hybrids' created by the retrovirus can be added to the caste list as I think one of the interviews Gateworld made had one of the creators say that Micheal is essentially a 'fifth caste'.
                      Michael is more an artificial creation than a real caste of wraithized humans or ancients.

                      Ouro and I have been talking about how those Wraith display powers that have only been attributed to evolved humans and ancients. Counting the FTL multi LY range mental connection, the Wraith actually evolved pretty fast in that department, and we don't believe that the insect part in them is responsible of this.
                      Then comes plenty of theories about where the Wraith really come from, if the ones we see aren't just a subcaste, and if they didn't actually convert Ancients and genetically enhance humans or themselves, etc.

                      I am a bit surpised that the shapes are 11 km's in length as I always thought they were more along the line of 5 km but I might have been conservative in my thoughts there.
                      The 5 km figure is the one hich was thrown around based on calcs from the schematic seen in Allies. However, that schematic has an oversized Daedalus, and I was plesantly surprized to see that using external shots resulted into a 11 km long hiveship, pretty much what the art director said in some SF magazine one or two months ago when complaining about how there were visual screwups, especially in scalings, and that the hiveships were supposed to be 11 km long.

                      Was it ever confirmed that the Scoutship in 'Aurora' is the same as the transport ship in 'Allies'?
                      No, but it's the most probable solution thus far.

                      Its a reasonable assumption but not sure if its taken as fact yet. Also I think mention needs to be made about the Wraith Cruisers, the ancient Wraith Supply Ships and the Wraith Computer Virus. In regards to the ships, they look like an amalgamation of mechanical and biological designs since the engines and the hanger bay look a lot more machine-like compared to the blue organic skin of the ship.
                      We still have to refine the essays, despite the time we've spent on them, but I'm not sure we'll devote a large part to other ships.

                      There are missing parts which do exist, since we already talked about, notably regarding the super structure, the use of culling beams as a defense system and the existence of the giant docking arms, plus a whole chapter titled Locations of Interest.
                      We'll update all that, but we can't guarantee this to happen ASAP.

                      Also I think it needs to be mentioned that the Darts plays another vital role for the Wraith in fleet engagements. Namely, as an interceptor to stop incoming projectiles or drones from hitting the Hiveship. Another point is that while Darts are short ranged, it does seem that they can be enhanced for long 'scouting' roles as was the case when that lone Dart scouted Atlantis before exploding and sending its data back to the Hive ships. Presumably, this enhancement made allowed it to travel under sublight at faster and longer speeds after exiting from a nearby Stargate close to the Lantean System.
                      Yeah good points. Those are already present in freshier versions of the essays. We've been pretty much working on some older basis, since I had to move to another city during the following months.

                      Anyway, missing pieces of technology I think can include the 'solid' holograms the Wraith scientist used when he first made the mistaken of leaving Wraith DNA in humans.
                      I think it's actually very similar to the dart fake canopy. A forcefield of a given colour, though it clearly lacks the very precise recreation of a fake rocky wall.

                      There is of course the
                      Spoiler:
                      telepathic generator showed recently
                      and the already mentioned computer virus weapon. There is of course two things mentioned but not seen on screen, one of which is the subspace booster relays that transmit tracking devices to the Hiveships and the 'stronghold' mentioned by the team when under the sway of Lucius in Irresistable though its quite possible that this 'stronghold' was not a fixed based structure but rather a Hiveship that landed.

                      If some of this has already been mentioned then please excuse that part.
                      Ah, I'm curious about those relay boosters. Where is the reference to be found?
                      The Al'kesh is not a warship - Info on Naqahdah & Naqahdria - Firepower of Goa'uld staff weapons - Everything about Hiveships and the Wraith - An idea about what powers Destiny...

                      Comment


                        #26
                        Originally posted by Mister Oragahn View Post
                        I disagree. Sumner is clearly sent flying without the Wraith male dealing any particular powerful punch. In fact, I think he just rises his hands and the human goes flying backwards.
                        Which is why I also at first thought it was telekinesis but the lack of seeing it or even mention of it on the show makes me think otherwise. Just checking through Rising part two again and the male Wraith 'commanders' had is capable of touching Sumner but the thing is his back is towards the camera which may be disguising the Wraiths reach. Just letting you know about this, could be wrong here but just thought I should mention it.

                        I think it's actually very similar to the dart fake canopy. A forcefield of a given colour, though it clearly lacks the very precise recreation of a fake rocky wall.
                        Interesting line of thought there. I always thought they were separate but now that you mention it, it does remind me of the protective 'shield' of the Dart. Though the research lab one was keyed more to allow Wraith DNA to pass through.

                        Ah, I'm curious about those relay boosters. Where is the reference to be found?
                        I believe they were mentioned in that early season 1 episode when Teyla was using her 'necklace' and it was transmitting to the Wraith. I think they mentioned at that time, the 'relay' stations. So it would mean that Wraith tracking abilities are done so through standard subspace use while communication may be done by the Hivemind.


                        'Hallowed are the children of the Ori. CROWD: Hallowed are we. Hallowed are the Ori.' -

                        'Great holy armies shall be gathered and trained to fight all who embrace evil. In the name of the Gods, ships shall be built to carry the warriors out among the stars and we will spread Origin to all the unbelievers. The power of the Ori will be felt far and wide and the wicked shall be vanquished' -


                        Contribute to the Stargate Wiki a source for any information on the Stargate universe from the books, RPG to games and comics.

                        Comment


                          #27
                          Guys in may be interesting for you 2 to note the ways in which larger Wraith ships are controlled e.g the mental interface as it shows how their tech is similar to the ancients...

                          also maybe some speculation on things like tractor beams and such (for example when they moved the asteroids to attack atlantis and in No Mans Land when johns f-302 was seemingly pulled towards the hive ship)...
                          Robert Jastrow (self-proclaimed agnostic): "For the scientist who has lived by his faith in the power of reason, the story ends like a bad dream. He has scaled the mountains of ignorance; he is about to conquer the highest peak; as he pulls himself over the final rock, he is greeted by a band of theologians who have been sitting there for centuries."

                          Comment


                            #28
                            Originally posted by Prior_of_the_Ori View Post
                            Which is why I also at first thought it was telekinesis but the lack of seeing it or even mention of it on the show makes me think otherwise. Just checking through Rising part two again and the male Wraith 'commanders' had is capable of touching Sumner but the thing is his back is towards the camera which may be disguising the Wraiths reach. Just letting you know about this, could be wrong here but just thought I should mention it.
                            Hm, I've checked the scene, and it's clearly TK. The problem we're facing is a lack of consistency.

                            Interesting line of thought there. I always thought they were separate but now that you mention it, it does remind me of the protective 'shield' of the Dart. Though the research lab one was keyed more to allow Wraith DNA to pass through.
                            Much more elaborate it was.

                            I believe they were mentioned in that early season 1 episode when Teyla was using her 'necklace' and it was transmitting to the Wraith. I think they mentioned at that time, the 'relay' stations. So it would mean that Wraith tracking abilities are done so through standard subspace use while communication may be done by the Hivemind.
                            Yes, exactly, I recall that now!
                            It doesn't undermine the super psycomm ability displayed in Misbegotten though, otherwise, if there had been a relay on that planet, Michael would have not needed that kind of ritual.
                            The Al'kesh is not a warship - Info on Naqahdah & Naqahdria - Firepower of Goa'uld staff weapons - Everything about Hiveships and the Wraith - An idea about what powers Destiny...

                            Comment


                              #29
                              I've had a thought on the Wraith culling beam:

                              The problem is the massive energy levels involved in converting people-sized masses into pure energy. If the darts have the ability to handle that much energy, why don't they just pick up a few rocks and blast the raw energy at a target, or convert every other atom in a target into energy, or antimatter.

                              Originally posted by Ouroboros View Post
                              Also, take a moment to think about the amount of computer processing power that would be required to scan and save the complete atmoic-level assembly instructions of an entire human being in the mere split second he is dissassembled by a culling beam.
                              So, here's my hypothesis ...

                              Firstly, look at this:



                              This is Bob's dart apparently 'scanning' Atlantis. Looks rather familiar too doesn't it. We know Bob beamed down sometime, probably onto a balcony or something, but that beam is being used to scan Atlantis as well.

                              My hypothesis is that when a human enters a Wraith culling beam, it shunts them into a transdimensional holding area, a small pocket of subspace contained within the dart, rather than turning them into energy Star Trek transporter style.

                              In Duet, Cadman's mind get's stuck in McKay's body after an accident with a dart beam. So what's going on there?

                              My second hypothesis is that as the dart shunts the target into the subspace pocket, it scans their mind state, storing their brain patterns in a computer on board the dart. When their bodies are zapped back into the real world, their mind states are returned back into their bodies.

                              Maybe, when the target's body is sent into subspace in the dart beam, it gives their nervous system such a huge shock that it shuts down, or maybe it's harmful in some other way, so for the prey to still be alive when they come out of the process, they've got to be stored elsewhere.

                              So, going back to the picture of Bobs dart above, I think that the shimmery, transparent beam we actually see is a scanner that images a target's nervous system. This can also be reconfigured for recon as above.

                              *********

                              Some thoughts on the Wraith stunner:

                              It overloads the nervous system, and knocks a target unconscious, but it also can damage puddle jumpers and blow pieces off crates. So what's the deal with that then?

                              For the primary sensory overload syatem, I think it's just a high-voltage ion gun. It concentrates a massive electrical potential onto a sharp filament inside the weapon, which causes a corona to burst from the tip. It's this stream of electrons that interferes with the target's nervous system and does the actual stunning.

                              However, such a device would have a range of a few feet, from "aaaaaaargh that hurt" close to the corona tip, to "oooh, it tingles" a few metres away due to the electrons dispersing.

                              So, I hypothesise that the second part of the weapon is a sonic cannon that produces some sort of vortex that carries the corona pulse towards the target. This vortex produces the air distortion effect around the blue glowing part of the stunner projectile.

                              It would be this sonic vortex that chips pieces off crates and sometimes pushes people over who've been shot with the stunner.

                              The larger rifles' projectiles seem to go faster, produce a stronger air distortion effect, and hit harder, possibly because they can produce a more powerful vortex than the smaller pistols. They also seem to stun for longer with more lasting effects, so they seem to be able to generate a more powerful stunner shot too.

                              Comment


                                #30
                                Originally posted by Wraith Scientist View Post
                                I've had a thought on the Wraith culling beam:

                                The problem is the massive energy levels involved in converting people-sized masses into pure energy. If the darts have the ability to handle that much energy, why don't they just pick up a few rocks and blast the raw energy at a target, or convert every other atom in a target into energy, or antimatter.



                                So, here's my hypothesis ...
                                This is similar to something I'd considered myself but it's fairly obvious from dialog that it is taking people apart.

                                Originally posted by Duet
                                ZELENKA: Uh, well, yes, (he bends down to his computer again) but it’s very complex. This interface controls the machine that dematerialises people, stores their information and then rematerialises them again when commanded to.
                                SHEPPARD: Great. Command it to!
                                ZELENKA: Uh, I can’t.
                                BECKETT: From what we can tell, the materialiser is storing two lifesigns.
                                ZELENKA: Yes.
                                SHEPPARD: Which is good!
                                ZELENKA: Yes, but there is only enough power in the Dart’s energy cell to successfully rematerialise one of them. (He shows his laptop to John. The screen indicates two signals stored in the materialiser.) Power to the rematerialiser has been completely severed and emergency back-up power has been completely run down.
                                SHEPPARD: OK.
                                ZELENKA: You have to decide which one we’re going to beam out. (He pushes the laptop towards John.)
                                BECKETT: It’s a terrible choice to have to make.
                                SHEPPARD: It’s easy. Beam out McKay – he’ll figure it out how to get Cadman free.
                                ZELENKA: No, no, no, sorry – I was unclear.
                                BECKETT: There’s no way of telling which is which.
                                ZELENKA: Yes. They just read as lifesigns.
                                SHEPPARD: Perfect(!) (He looks at the screen.) Alright – that one. (He points to one of the lifesigns.) Go. (To the others) Stand aside.
                                (Everyone stands clear and Radek activates his computer. A beam shoots out of the Dart and a moment later, Rodney is standing there. He looks around blankly.)
                                SHEPPARD: Rodney, you OK?
                                It dematerializes people and stores them as something they call a "lifesign" which is presumably some sort of energy packet that equates to a person. It also records their information (how to put them back together) and stores that.

                                Like I mention in my article there's no real reason why they shouldn't be able to copy people like this, just use the same information copy and additional raw energy or matter to make a second person. The only thing I cans ee standing in the way of this is if Atlantis is going to introduce some idea of a human "soul" that the Wraith technolgoy can not copy/create but only store.

                                That in itself is rather creepy as it would mean that they can literally imprison a human soul within their machines.

                                Pity the writers never use any of these possabilities to actually make them scary huh?

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