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Thread: Creating an Earth Galactic Union/United Systems of Earth/etc..etc...

  1. #61
    Chief Master Sergeant donnie_darko's Avatar
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    Default Re: Creating an Earth Galactic Union/United Systems of Earth/etc..etc...

    Seems to me that the Ancients owe us, they are like neglectful parents. This seems fitting since we are descended from the Ancients.

    Fist that bring us in to the world then expect us to take care of ourselfs, they expect us to fend off the Goa’uld and Wraith alone.

    When we use their tech to do something they don’t approve or they smack us and treat us like children.
    "Khattam-Shud," he said slowly, "is the Arch-Enemy
    of all Stories, even of Language itself. He is the Prince of
    Silence and the Foe of Speech. And because everything ends,
    because dreams end, stories end, life ends, at the finish
    of everything we use his name. 'It's finished,' we tell one
    another, 'it's over. Khattam-Shud: The End.'"

    -excerpted from Haroun and the Sea of Stories,

  2. #62
    Chief Master Sergeant
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    Default Re: Creating an Earth Galactic Union/United Systems of Earth/etc..etc...

    But do you really want them meddling in our business? Sure we are "very young" but do we actually want to be treated like children?

    Seems to me the Ancients, like all good progenitors, know when to back off and let the bird leave the nest and fly on its own. If you ask me, we are better off without them.

  3. #63
    Chief Master Sergeant hail_jack's Avatar
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    Default Re: Creating an Earth Galactic Union/United Systems of Earth/etc..etc...

    I agree if they are our "parent race" than they should of helped us out when the Goa'uld first came and started spreading us guys across the galaxy...i hate all that non intervention business...
    Jackson: Hathor was the Egyptian goddess of fertility, inebriety, and music.
    O'Neill: Sex, drugs, and rock and roll?

  4. #64
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    Default Re: Creating an Earth Galactic Union/United Systems of Earth/etc..etc...

    i am from france and i have been reading about this "global america". May i reminde you that the rest of the world is about 5 times older then the US of A. Plus has a french men i'd like the idea of a big space ship with the french flag, english flag, or the american flag painted on it.

  5. #65
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    Default Re: Creating an Earth Galactic Union/United Systems of Earth/etc..etc...

    What has being older got to do with anything? Most countries which existed at all more than 200 years ago existed under a radically different form, both in terms of culture and government.

    Even if you could prove that a civilization had a consistent existence longer than that, it wouldn't necessarily prove anything. To bring this back ON TOPIC, since this is a Stargate forum, consider the Goa'uld. Their civilization is several thousands of years old. Does that make it in any way superior to ours, which is, at best (taking "Western Civilization" as a whole, which includes Europe and America) only 2,000 years old? If so, why?

  6. #66
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    Default Re: Creating an Earth Galactic Union/United Systems of Earth/etc..etc...

    well let's see. The go'auld ARE more advance then in a lot of way. Any how the idea of a global america kind of scares me. What makes our planet so different from any others in the univer is the diversity. I would like the idea of a global unity of the world powers (the us, england, france, china, russia, and japan).

  7. #67
    Colonel Major Tyler's Avatar
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    Earth Symbol Re: Creating an Earth Galactic Union/United Systems of Earth/etc..etc...

    Quote Originally Posted by michael
    I would like the idea of a global unity of the world powers (the United States of America, the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland, France, the People's Republic of China, the Russian Federation, and Japan).
    There are more world powers than those three. You have to at least include Germany, India, and the Scandinavian countries (for their economic strength).

  8. #68
    Major General greytop's Avatar
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    Default Re: Creating an Earth Galactic Union/United Systems of Earth/etc..etc...

    Quote Originally Posted by michael
    well let's see. The go'auld ARE more advance then in a lot of way. Any how the idea of a global america kind of scares me. What makes our planet so different from any others in the univer is the diversity. I would like the idea of a global unity of the world powers (the us, england, france, china, russia, and japan).
    Don't we have something like that called the United Nations?

  9. #69
    Lieutenant Colonel aAnubiSs's Avatar
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    Default Re: Creating an Earth Galactic Union/United Systems of Earth/etc..etc...

    Ah yes but the UN doesn't follow USA's lead so something must be wrong

  10. #70
    Probie metatron's Avatar
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    Default Re: Creating an Earth Galactic Union/United Systems of Earth/etc..etc...

    You know, maybe they could evolve the current UN as a real world governement and then create the UN SPACY like they do in a lot of anime ('Macross' for exemple).

    But then the USA wouldn't like that, would they?

  11. #71
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    Default Re: Creating an Earth Galactic Union/United Systems of Earth/etc..etc...

    Sure there is a lot more world powers but the one who have a big history together in working against the same enemy are the one who in my opinion are the most impoortant. The current UN do not include china, and japan.

  12. #72
    Colonel Major Tyler's Avatar
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    Earth Symbol Re: Creating an Earth Galactic Union/United Systems of Earth/etc..etc...

    Quote Originally Posted by michael
    The current UN do not include china, and japan.
    China is a permanent member of the United Nations Security Council.

    http://www.un.org/Docs/sc/unsc_members.html
    Last edited by Major Tyler; September 4th, 2004 at 07:48 PM.

  13. #73
    Lieutenant Colonel Ancient 1's Avatar
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    Default Re: Creating an Earth Galactic Union/United Systems of Earth/etc..etc...

    Quote Originally Posted by aAnubiSs
    Ah yes but the UN doesn't follow USA's lead so something must be wrong
    Today's UN is a nearly-disfuntional beauracracy. Scrap the whole thing and start anew.

  14. #74
    Chief Master Sergeant donnie_darko's Avatar
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    Default Re: Creating an Earth Galactic Union/United Systems of Earth/etc..etc...

    Well been reading what everyone has to say about starting a galactic civilization and have come up with a few ideas

    1) All Earth/non-planetary nations can keep their sovereign rights.

    2) The Stargate stays in control of the planet/nation that predominately uses it. (Since the Stargate program is funded and was developed by the USA it is under our jurisdiction. Other nations participate in the Stargate/Home world Security program will be evaluated on a case-by-case basses.)
    Other planets may run their own Stargate program.

    3) The creation of a multinational organization (UE) that will deal with creating colonies, deep space exploration, global protection etc. (Because the USA has the technology and the resources to fund such programs, they will rely heavily on the USA support) The organization will not interfere with global politics only non-planetary affairs. This is one of the fist points on the organization charter.

    4) The creation of the Tau'ri Alliance Assembly, a multi-planetary council, that deals with trade, territory, technology exchange/development, galactic security etc. Each member planet will receive votes based on population/colonies/technological development. The votes given to each planet can be divided upon the nation of the planet participation or given to that planets organization that deals with extra planetary affairs.
    Last edited by donnie_darko; September 5th, 2004 at 01:23 AM.
    "Khattam-Shud," he said slowly, "is the Arch-Enemy
    of all Stories, even of Language itself. He is the Prince of
    Silence and the Foe of Speech. And because everything ends,
    because dreams end, stories end, life ends, at the finish
    of everything we use his name. 'It's finished,' we tell one
    another, 'it's over. Khattam-Shud: The End.'"

    -excerpted from Haroun and the Sea of Stories,

  15. #75
    Colonel Major Tyler's Avatar
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    Earth Symbol Re: Creating an Earth Galactic Union/United Systems of Earth/etc..etc...

    Quote Originally Posted by Ancient 1
    Today's UN is a nearly-disfuntional beauracracy. Scrap the whole thing and start anew.
    The United Nations does not have any power to coerse or make other countries do what they want, but they have the very vital ability to grant legitimacy to anything the United States or any other country does. The UN is in the unique positive of having every single nation in the world (except two) as a member.

    When the UN passes a resolution saying something we are doing is good, they can rightly claim that they are speaking with the collective voice of the entire world. Though they can't force anyone to do anything, the General Assembly is an amazing debating body. Every country, large or small, has one voice, one vote.

  16. #76
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    Default Re: Creating an Earth Galactic Union/United Systems of Earth/etc..etc...

    all righty then. But i still think that the idea of a global america is crazy.

  17. #77
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    Default Re: Creating an Earth Galactic Union/United Systems of Earth/etc..etc...

    I agree, I don't want a "global America" in the sense you mean. I don't want the rest of the world to look or be exactly like the United States. To do so would not only deny everything that is good and great about the rest of the world, it would also degrade what makes the US unique and special. I certainly would like to see other nations adopt a sovreign constitutional government similar to the US, because I believe it to be the system that allows for the greatest freedom and security of individuals of any known in all of history.

    I believe that most countries would be able to adopt a similar system without damaging their cultural heritage or consciousness, that indeed it would allow them to more fully develop their culture along its natural lines, enhancing rather than destroying diversity. But not all--some countries/cultures have such diametrically opposed worldviews that it would be impossible, however I also believe, and not for wholly subjective reasons, that such societies are evil and ought to be abolished for the good of everybody, including its own members. I'm thinking here primarily of certain extremist Islamic regimes, though not exclusively.

    I also think the idea that the UN has power to grant legitimacy to anything is a farce. However I am going pretty far off topic here, this isn't the appropriate forum for political arguments.

    Back to Stargate--it is pretty difficult for me to see how an equitable arrangement could be made when there can be only 1 Stargate per planet, and we live on a world where a 1 world government would be (in my opionion) not only impossible but not even necessarily desirable. I can't see the rest of the world's governments tamely submitting to US-dominated control of the Stargate. I'd like to think the US would try to be as fair as possible in sharing it with other countries but it would be extremely unlikely. In fact I think the way the show has portrayed the international politicking vis-a-vis the Stargate thus far has probably even been a little too rosy in its view of all sides, including the US.

    I like the name "Tau'ri Alliance Assembly" and the general idea. I think something like the UE could work, but though I hate to be cynical I think it would have some serious problems, but hey, that's one thing I like about Stargate as opposed to Star Trek. In Stargate we don't live in a perfect society, there is a lot of internal conflict, and that's interesting. Internal conflict always produces more anxiety than external conflict. That's why people get more worked up over their 'ships than they do about big honkin' space battles.

    Basically, I'm idealistic enough to want a peaceful, united Earth but realistic enough to know that it won't happen for a very very long time. And frankly as a viewer I'm opposed to it on the show because it would not only be unrealistic, it would be boring.

  18. #78
    Major aschen's Avatar
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    Default Re: Creating an Earth Galactic Union/United Systems of Earth/etc..etc...

    Yeah, you really don't wanna let the puppet American leaders to run the world. That'd be horrible.

  19. #79
    Second Lieutenant Jakebbq's Avatar
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    Chevron Re: Creating an Earth Galactic Union/United Systems of Earth/etc..etc...

    did you know as powerful as the USA is it is nothing to the power of the commonwealth united under the queen which makes her the most powerful person on earth although she doesnt use this power and lets the prime ministers of these countries lead them if she wanted to she could take control and probley defeat USA because the commonwealth has like lots of differferent countries under it including Australia and Canada

  20. #80
    Colonel Major Tyler's Avatar
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    Earth Symbol Re: Creating an Earth Galactic Union/United Systems of Earth/etc..etc...

    Quote Originally Posted by Jakebbq
    did you know as powerful as the USA is it is nothing to the power of the commonwealth united under the queen which makes her the most powerful person on earth although she doesnt use this power and lets the prime ministers of these countries lead them if she wanted to she could take control and probley defeat USA because the commonwealth has like lots of differferent countries under it including Australia and Canada
    If thinking that makes you feel big and bad, go right ahead, but if you study international politics you'd know how wrong that is.

    Even if the Queen could somehow direct the militaries of the entire Commonwealth to attack the United States (which she couldn't in her dizziest daydreams) they would still be under the management of the sovereign state ("state" meaning "country") governments.

    Collective action theory has demonstrated time and time again that putative balancers are always fundamentally weaker that a single, robust command structure. In other words, U.S. capabilities not only vastly out-strip the capabilities of any other nations across the board, they are under the control of one central government. The Commonwealth may be able to surpass the U.S. in quantity, but not quality. Most Commonwealth countries (excluding Canada, Britain, and, to a lesser extent, Australia) lack any substantive power projection capability, so they couldn't even get here. Heck, the NATO air war in Kosovo ran into serious problems because European members had no adequate air and sea lift capabilities, and Kosovo is practically in Europe's backyard! The improvements made since the Prague Capabilities Commitment in November 2002 and the new NATO Response Force are making great strides to mitigate these issues, without U.S. capabilities to prop them up, they couldn't even begin.

    The preceeding was also assuming that the U.S. would not use its strategic nuclear weapons against the Commonwealth, which it most certainly would if there was the slightest chance of defeat. Oh, and before you tell me to fear French and British nukes...please...read a book or something...have some basis in fact for your claims.

    If thinking that the Queen can stomp all over America gives you a happy, then by all means keep thinking that...I just wouldn't mention it to anyone who's had an education or they might burst your bubble.

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