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Thread: Creating an Earth Galactic Union/United Systems of Earth/etc..etc...

  1. #41
    Lieutenant Colonel Ancient 1's Avatar
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    Default Re: Creating an Earth Galactic Union/United Systems of Earth/etc..etc...

    Well, I've read everybody's posts..replies, rebuttals...all of it. And I was right all along...

    I knew it would give me a fronache!

  2. #42
    Chief Master Sergeant
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    Default Re: Creating an Earth Galactic Union/United Systems of Earth/etc..etc...

    Quote Originally Posted by aAnubiSs
    It would be important to get people from all over the world if we colonized something, otherwise it would become like putting all the white ppl on planet 1, all the black ones on planet2. Then we'd start seperating religions and sexual preferences... then the wars would begin.
    But what if all those people didn't want to live together? Should we force them? I don't think so. I don't believe in enforced diversity. I believe that diversity is a good thing, but only if it's by choice, otherwise it just creates strife. The only way to avoid cultural conflict is to have a reasonable degree of separation between differing people. Hence the axiom "Good fences make good neighbors" applies equally to neighborhoods and nations.

    To put it another way, saying that all different kinds of people have to live together in the same society is just another way of saying that everybody has to be the same.

    That is the problem with the idea of a giant galactic government (or even a One World government on Earth), the only way to make it work (except in a hypothetical world where every single individual is a saint) is to force everybody to live a certain way and believe a certain way, and since ultimately it's impossible to acheive except through tyrrany, which cannot be maintained forever, you wind up with civil war.

    Wars don't happen because people are different. Wars happen when people try to make everyone the same.

    In a world (or a galaxy) where there is enough room for all, why not let each man choose to live where and how and with whom he believes best, as long as he doesn't try to force his way of life on everyone else. Let groups of people with common interests band together, and let them choose whom they allow to enter into their society. If some do not want to live in that kind of society, that doesn't necessarily mean the society must change. There is enough room for another community based on their values and to allow both communities thrive and grow to their fullest extent. By all means, let them interact, let them be friendly with one another. Let them trade where it would be mutually beneficial. Let them share whatever elements of their culture and society they chooose. But let them choose.

  3. #43
    Lieutenant Colonel Major Fischer's Avatar
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    Default Re: Creating an Earth Galactic Union/United Systems of Earth/etc..etc...

    Quote Originally Posted by Starfury
    Wars don't happen because people are different. Wars happen when people try to make everyone the same.
    That's an... interesting statement.



  4. #44
    Lieutenant Colonel Matt G's Avatar
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    Default Re: Creating an Earth Galactic Union/United Systems of Earth/etc..etc...

    Quote Originally Posted by Starfury
    Given the situation in the Stargate universe, space exploration is a practical road to solving poverty. Not only does it open new possibilities for trade, but for those poor and disenfranchised people on Earth, it also offers an opportunity to escape poverty through colonization.

    I just got a mental picture of the Stargate with a banner above it that says "Give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses..." and a LOOooooooong line of people waiting to step through.
    Right with you there though I've been shut down when I've offerered similar theories elsewhere(OK, I didn't bring in the Stargate but...). Last time I tried it the reply I got was along the lines of 'If your best solution to an African familiy's poverty was travelling to other planets then they'd be serverely insulted as that sort of thing is inconcievable to them'.

    In short - we need to find a Stargate!

  5. #45
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    Default Re: Creating an Earth Galactic Union/United Systems of Earth/etc..etc...

    Yeah, well it's probably true that if we offered people the chance to go through the Stargate, not many would believe us--at least at first. Plus, it'd be scary. But there would be some eager enough, or desperate enough, to give it a chance. And I think it'd become a sort of snowball effect, then eventually peter off to more of a slow dribble of people coming or going.

    I wonder if it would make a difference to "3rd world" people if there were offered to colonize a planet already populated by people who originally came from their own ancient culture. That would really be interesting.

  6. #46
    Lieutenant Colonel Major Fischer's Avatar
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    Default Re: Creating an Earth Galactic Union/United Systems of Earth/etc..etc...

    Quote Originally Posted by Starfury
    I wonder if it would make a difference to "3rd world" people if there were offered to colonize a planet already populated by people who originally came from their own ancient culture. That would really be interesting.
    Might the people who already live on such a planet object?



  7. #47
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    Default Re: Creating an Earth Galactic Union/United Systems of Earth/etc..etc...

    They might. Or they might look at it as an opportunity to be reunited with their long lost people. Just then, I was mainly thinking of how interesting it would be from the Earther perspective.

    As I've said earlier, I'm only in favor of colonization of populated planets with permission, but alas, I'm not all that confident that it would actually happen that way.

  8. #48
    Lieutenant Colonel Ugly Pig's Avatar
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    Default Re: Creating an Earth Galactic Union/United Systems of Earth/etc..etc...

    Quote Originally Posted by Starfury
    Wars don't happen because people are different. Wars happen when people try to make everyone the same.
    But if people weren't different, there'd be no need for anyone to make everyone the same.

  9. #49
    Chief Master Sergeant
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    Default Re: Creating an Earth Galactic Union/United Systems of Earth/etc..etc...

    Of course, if we were all Ugly Pigs, that would make Amanda Tapping look far less attractive. And it would make your sigline pointless. You wouldn't really want that, would you?

  10. #50
    Colonel Major Tyler's Avatar
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    Default Re: Creating an Earth Galactic Union/United Systems of Earth/etc..etc...

    I don't think Earth should try to form an all-encompassing government that includes other non-Terran (not settled by Earthers) planets for a long time. Once we have a stable global government, then we can start branching out to other worlds.

    The national governments of Earth could hold a constitutional convention in Geneva, or San Francisco, or where ever, and begin talks on creating a very, very loose confederacy that would allow nations to maintain most of their sovereignty, but defer extreterrestrial matters to the international authority (which henceforth I will call the Terran Confederacy because I think it sounds cool). The Terran Confederate government will handle matters outside of Earth, and national governments will handle Earth matters as they always have.

    The Terran Confederacy will have a permanent capital in Geneva, Switzerland, where the legislative buildings would be, and a special "Executive Capitol" that will be located in a city in the country from which the Terran president is elected (it will move around like the Olympics). Their will, of course, be transport rings between the two capitols incase the President needs to address the legislature. So, if the first Terran President is American, the Exec capitol might be in Philadelphia, and if the next president is Russian it might be in St. Petersburg...national capitols cannot be chosen as executive capitols, no Moscow would be a no-no.

    I'll have to think of more useless crap like this to post...I'm sure no one will think it's possible, but this is kinda fun!

  11. #51
    Chief Master Sergeant
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    Default Re: Creating an Earth Galactic Union/United Systems of Earth/etc..etc...

    Quote Originally Posted by Major Tyler
    I don't think Earth should try to form an all-encompassing government that includes other non-Terran (not settled by Earthers) planets for a long time. Once we have a stable global government, then we can start branching out to other worlds.
    Agreed...if we ever get that far.

    The national governments of Earth could hold a constitutional convention in Geneva, or San Francisco, or where ever, and begin talks on creating a very, very loose confederacy that would allow nations to maintain most of their sovereignty, but defer extreterrestrial matters to the international authority (which henceforth I will call the Terran Confederacy because I think it sounds cool).
    I like that name. It's got a ring to it.

    The problem is, could you get all (or even a majority) of the national governments of Earth to agree on even the most basic principles necessary to have a functional Terran Confederacy with a comprehensible extraterrestrial policy? I don't think so. We can't even seem to agree on what constitutes a fully "human being" let alone the implications and complications of non-human sentient life.

    But I still like the name.

  12. #52
    Lieutenant Colonel Ugly Pig's Avatar
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    Default Re: Creating an Earth Galactic Union/United Systems of Earth/etc..etc...

    Quote Originally Posted by Starfury
    Of course, if we were all Ugly Pigs, that would make Amanda Tapping look far less attractive. And it would make your sigline pointless. You wouldn't really want that, would you?
    I don't know... As much as I pride myself on being one of a kind, having everyone else look like me would do wonders for my self-esteem.

  13. #53
    Major General greytop's Avatar
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    Default Re: Creating an Earth Galactic Union/United Systems of Earth/etc..etc...

    The names sound too much like the United Nations here on Earth, especially with Earth in the name.

    How about something like the Milky Way Union of Planets?

  14. #54
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    Default Re: Creating an Earth Galactic Union/United Systems of Earth/etc..etc...

    You want to have a name that accurately reflects the makeup of your organization. "Terran Confederation" would imply a government of either all the nations of Earth (Terra), or possibly of all or many "Terrans" or people who originated from Earth. It's possible that within the Stargate universe, a "Terran Confederation" could include some of the worlds "seeded" by the Goa'uld by humans originally from Earth, but likely only those with very similar cultures.

    Most of us so far have agreed that some sort of Earth Federation would be the next necessary and logical step, long before any sort of more inclusive federation would be possible.

    It's important here to note the distinction between a (con)federation and an alliance. The one implies a much greater degree of solidarity, a more consistent type of government within the larger federation, a stronger central authority. An Alliance may be anything from a loosely connected group of people or governments working together solely for a single, limited purpose (ie: beat the Goa'uld, but otherwise don't bother us and we won't bother you), up to something resembling my description of a federation.

    But as far as names for a larger alliance, I'm not sure that anything with the name "Milky Way" or even "Galactic" in it would be appropriate, since it would almost certainly include the Asgard and probably some worlds from the Pegaus Galaxy. We'd need a name even more inclusive.

  15. #55
    Major General greytop's Avatar
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    Default Re: Creating an Earth Galactic Union/United Systems of Earth/etc..etc...

    Quote Originally Posted by Starfury
    But as far as names for a larger alliance, I'm not sure that anything with the name "Milky Way" or even "Galactic" in it would be appropriate, since it would almost certainly include the Asgard and probably some worlds from the Pegaus Galaxy. We'd need a name even more inclusive.
    I agree, Starfury, but MilkyWay Union of Planets was all I could think of at the moment.

  16. #56
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    Default Re: Creating an Earth Galactic Union/United Systems of Earth/etc..etc...

    I wonder if the alliance between the 4 races (Ancients, Asgard, Furlings, Nox) had a name, and if so, what it was? I'm thinking "The Great Alliance" is a bit pompous, even for an alliance involving 2 member races that have been known to pose as gods.

    Maybe the alliance members just called themselves "The Alliance" and everybody else called them "their set"...you know, like when you have a group of friends and between themselves they don't really have a name for their group, it's just "us" but outsiders are always looking at them through narrowed eyes and sneering or being jealous and calling them "that set," "the in crowd," "those stupid posers" or some other semi-derogatory nickname.

    Speaking of the 4 Races...we're supposed to be (or become) the 5th race. Well at least 2 of those races posed as gods...if humans started posing as, or being mistaken for gods...we could call the alliance "The Pantheon". Or, um, not.

    How about The Intergalactic Alliance of the Really Cool Races? (kidding)

  17. #57
    Chief Master Sergeant donnie_darko's Avatar
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    Default Re: Creating an Earth Galactic Union/United Systems of Earth/etc..etc...

    i don't think they were gods like the goa'uld.
    They did it for the protection of other races.
    "Khattam-Shud," he said slowly, "is the Arch-Enemy
    of all Stories, even of Language itself. He is the Prince of
    Silence and the Foe of Speech. And because everything ends,
    because dreams end, stories end, life ends, at the finish
    of everything we use his name. 'It's finished,' we tell one
    another, 'it's over. Khattam-Shud: The End.'"

    -excerpted from Haroun and the Sea of Stories,

  18. #58
    Chief Master Sergeant
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    Default Re: Creating an Earth Galactic Union/United Systems of Earth/etc..etc...

    Benevolent or not, they were still posing as gods. You don't find that arrogant?

  19. #59
    Captain Janus's Avatar
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    Default Re: Creating an Earth Galactic Union/United Systems of Earth/etc..etc...

    Quote Originally Posted by Starfury
    Speaking of the 4 Races...we're supposed to be (or become) the 5th race. Well at least 2 of those races posed as gods...if humans started posing as, or being mistaken for gods...we could call the alliance "The Pantheon". Or, um, not.
    How can we be the fifth race ?
    I mean, The (Old) Alliance has fallen apart.

    The Nox no longer fight.
    The Furlings have just gone up in smoke.
    And the Ancients have ascended.

    Only the Asgard remain, so shouldn't we be the 2nd race ?
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  20. #60
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    Default Re: Creating an Earth Galactic Union/United Systems of Earth/etc..etc...

    Hey, don't blame me, I'm just quoting Thor. "You have already taken the first steps to becoming the Fifth Race."

    We don't know where the Furlings went, maybe they're still here but hiding; maybe they'll come back. As far as we know, the Nox have always been pacifist--Thor never said it was a military alliance. It could have just as well been a trade alliance, or a bird watching alliance, for all we know. The Ancients may have ascended but are still "around". Who knows, maybe some of them are still hiding out someplace non-ascended, or maybe some of the ascended ones will get over that whole desembodied higher plane crap (I always thought being disembodied was HIGHLY overrated myself) and de-ascend. Even if they stay ascended, that doesn't mean we couldn't have some sort of alliance with them (though they seem pretty snooty to me, so they might not want to hang out with us).

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