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Thread: The Long Goodbye (216)

  1. #41
    Second Lieutenant LoveYouBaby's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Long Goodbye

    Quote Originally Posted by gambit
    From what I could tell, it didn't look like the alien was supposed to be all that different from Shep(military,killing etc). Where as the alien in Weir was a psycho.
    The alien in Weir was proud not a Pyscho - she was determined to knock her enemy down for her people. Their consciousness took over their bodies, that includes their personality, behavior, et cetera. They were suppose to be different.
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  2. #42
    Chief Master Sergeant Wolf Eire's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Long Goodbye

    To be honest I'm not sure what Phoebius was supposed to be. As the episode goes on her disregard for others and her "psychoticness" seems to increase as the episode goes on.

  3. #43

    Default Re: The Long Goodbye

    The episode was from great but it did have its moments.

    Pros:

    - Higginson's performance was better than expected even if I still don't care too much for her as an actress.
    - It was nice to get some follow-through for Colonel Caldwell.
    - Some nice moments here and there: Weir's face after Caldwell mentioned the kiss right before the credits roll, Caldwell clearing the chain-of-command issue for McKay, Weir (or the alien rather) shooting McKay when he started babbling on the radio.

    Cons:

    - The plot. If you're going to do the possessed-by-aliens routine for the 1000th time at least add a twist to it. Not to mention that the feud between the two aliens felt very contrived.
    - Everyone knew exactly how the situation with Teyla and Shepperd would end, of course Rodney would hack the system in time. No tension whatsover.
    - The people in Atlantis behaved like a bunch of idiots. Apparently they haven't learned not to trust someone who is possessed by an unknown entity.

  4. #44
    Second Lieutenant LoveYouBaby's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Long Goodbye

    I actually liked the psychoticness, it brought an element of depth to the alien, masked by determination, the alien risks anyone or anything just to see her enemy get slained, defeat spreading throughout the face of the man that so tormented her for so long. So... invigorating.
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  5. #45
    Major xfkirsten's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Long Goodbye

    Personally, I absolutely loved this one! Granted, I'm a big Weir fan, so that probably slants my opinion quite a bit. I thought Torri Higginson did an amazing job with this one! Great portrayal of Phoebus. I thought Joe Flanigan played Thalan a little too much like he plays Sheppard, so the two kind of blended together. But Torri did an amazing job differentiating between Phoebus and Weir.

    The infirmary scene at the end was great! Sheppard had the awkward "I can't look her in the eye" vibe going, and Weir was hilarious in her embarrassment. That last shot before the credits rolled had me on the floor laughing!

    The action was great - I really loved the change in camera style they used for the action shots. Reminded me a bit of the "Gladiator" style. And I couldn't help but think that that storage area would be an awesome lazer tag arena...

    Off to watch this one again!
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  6. #46
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    Default Re: The Long Goodbye

    Argh. Halfway done with my post and accidentally deleted it. This is why I should update on desktops and not laptops; less chance of me screwing up.



    On the issue of the plot being overdone/predictable: yeah, and? Read the synopses of the eps before you watch; the show's much more enjoyable if you go in knowing whether to expect character eps, information vital to the season's plot arc, or fun one-offs with guns and running and fighting.

    I think I may be one of the luckier ones in this fandom in that I'm young enough not to know the earliest incarnation(s) of Star Trek and too busy too have watched much other sci-fi. So while you guys are going, "They did this so much better in episode 513 of Show X," I'm going, "Hmmm, Alien-in-a-box. Should they be bringing that back to the city? Did no one get the Possession=Bad! memo? Oh well, let's see where they take this."
    ---------------

    And now on to actual episode comments.

    John & Rodney telling the Alien Twins about TV was much fun. "fictional representations of ridiculously attractive people in absurd situations" *cough*Stargate*cough*

    Love Liz's "talking to old people" voice; it's so much softer and gentler than what we usually see. It's nice to remember she has that side.

    Torri Higginson flat-out rocked in this ep. The difference between Weir and Phoebus was evident from the moment she opened her eyes in the infirmary, and she injected just enough extra girlishness into Phoebus-as-Weir to give the feeling that something was off, even if you couldn't tell what that something was.

    I loved Rodney's line, "You're remarkably sanguine about all this," and only partially because that word always reminds me of Mal from Firefly.

    Shep was very Shep-ish-ly reluctant to enter the pod, which makes you wonder why he agreed to it. Did he do it just because Weir asked? Did he know Rodney would mock him mercilessly and he'd end up doing it anyway? Shep doesn't like being under the command of someone else, being unable to do things his way (see Season 1's "Hot Zone"), so his reluctance to do this was very IC. I think he was just taking Weir's word that it was okay, which shows his trust in her. I may be making all of this up, though; I tend to read more into characters than was meant in the writing.

    Yes, it was remarkably stupid of them to believe Phoebus-as-Weir and let Shep be taken over, but I think they were comparing her possession to Rodney's extra-consciousness episode, rather than Caldwell's Goa'uld possession, which was much more similar to this. Hey, the whole command staff has been possessed now; they have something in common. Expect this to come up in season 3 or 4 when someone on Earth wants to make changes to the command of the Atlantis expedition.

    Rodney's power tripping on Caldwell: nice to keep in character. Dear, dear, Rodney. Also nice to see that Caldwell is not used to the Rodney-panic, using an order instead of just saying his name like Weir or Shep would have done. That just drove home the fact that this was a stranger at the wheel and that our fearless leaders were in danger.
    Caldwell handled the situation well; props to Kindler on not harping on the power-play issue, which would have been really easy and entirely pointless here.

    Ronon=entirely too trusting of Sheppard. Guess it makes sense for a Runner, he's used to depending on his senses and field logic, which does not include alien possesion. If it looks like a Shep and quacks like a Shep, it's a Shep.

    More evidence that McKay hates being taken for granted. Something we already knew, but it's fun to see from time to time.

    I loved Teyla's "I do not believe you". Depending more on what she knows than what she sees. The reluctance to harm Sheppard but her willingness to do it when there's no other option was a good character scene. She cares about John but will do what is necessary. You gotta wonder what John was screaming inside his/Thalan's head at that moment. I was kinda hoping it would be revisited at the end, but oh well. I liked the ending we got.

    Phoebus was definitely more ruthless that Thalan. Even after he disparaged Ronan for giving him the stunner he still used one, and he also called a med team, which was more than Phoebus did on her hunt. I think that might have just been because we know Shep can kill and be cool about it; it's more interesting to see Weir (even if it's not Weir) shoot someone without thinking about it.

    Teyla's saying to John "You would have shot her either way." It makes sense. Neither Thalan nor John was in any rush to die. Teyla did the only thing she could in the situation and didn't stop to fret unneccessarily. I'd love to see her and McKay stuck off-world by themselves, if only to see Teyla as a tactician. It could be interesting.

    Caldwell got the McKay stamp of approval (even if McKay will never admit it). That makes me smile; if McKay likes him, he has to be cool.

    I'd kind of relegated the kiss to the non-important things about this episode until Caldwell mentioned it at the end. Their reactions (especially Weir sliding down in the bed) were so high-school-embarrassed. It was fun.
    Shep not paying too much attention to Weir when she was talking in the hospital bed was fun, too. She's all, "let's talk about it" and he's "you know, you shot a member of my team, good, you feel bad, now let's forget this ever happened."


    When I first heard about The Kiss in this ep, I had a fully formulated rant about pseudo-ship on the show, but after watching it, my rant is unneccessary. This was a fun ep (made more so by the fact that it followed The Tower, which I detested), and the pseudo-romance was such a minor part that it didn't tick my Irk-o-Meter.
    ------------------------------


    I must finish by giving mad props to the DOP and the director for bringing back the helicopter shots of the city first seen in the Siege eps. They gave this episode even more of an action feel.

    And this post has gone on way too long already, so I'm gone for now.
    Last edited by starfox; January 3rd, 2006 at 10:27 AM.

  7. #47

    Default Re: The Long Goodbye

    Just out of curiosity, does anyone know if TPTB read these forums? Is there any known & working method of directly interacting with said Powers That Be in regards to the quality of the shows? Aside from cornering them at a convention, of course...

    It's one thing for fans to b.itch about the quality of a show in the relative anonymity of a forum, but it would be nice to be able to deliver a bit of direct feedback to the producers, i.e. the people who could actually make things happen. Far be it for me to suggest the production of Stargate be turned into a democracy (as if...), but I'd rather complain about quality now and see some results rather than get involved with a (mostly hopeless) campaign to revive a cancelled series...

  8. #48
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    Default Re: The Long Goodbye

    Quote Originally Posted by Micronaut
    Just out of curiosity, does anyone know if TPTB read these forums? Is there any known & working method of directly interacting with said Powers That Be in regards to the quality of the shows? Aside from cornering them at a convention, of course...

    I know some of the writers check these forums; one of the Martins (I think it was Gero) mentioned on the DVD commentaries that he did so.

  9. #49
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    Default Re: The Long Goodbye

    Quote Originally Posted by Micronaut
    Just out of curiosity, does anyone know if TPTB read these forums? Is there any known & working method of directly interacting with said Powers That Be in regards to the quality of the shows? Aside from cornering them at a convention, of course...
    Yes, "they" have admitted to lurking here to see how their shows go over with the audience. Posting your opinion in an intelligent fashion, is the best way to get your point across to them.

    As for the episode - Torri proved she can do much more than she has been given in the past. She needs to be used more to her potential.

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  10. #50
    Major GatetheWay's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Long Goodbye

    Quote Originally Posted by starfox
    Ronon=entirely too trusting of Sheppard. Guess it makes sense for a Runner, he's used to depending on his senses and field logic, which does not include alien possesion. If it looks like a Shep and quacks like a Shep, it's a Shep.
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  11. #51
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    Default Re: The Long Goodbye

    Quote Originally Posted by GatetheWay
    ROTFLMAO! You get green!
    *grin*

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  12. #52

    Default Re: The Long Goodbye

    Quote Originally Posted by FoolishPleasure
    Yes, "they" have admitted to lurking here to see how their shows go over with the audience. Posting your opinion in an intelligent fashion, is the best way to get your point across to them.

    As for the episode - Torri proved she can do much more than she has been given in the past. She needs to be used more to her potential.
    Cool... thanks to all for the info... it's nice to know that my (and many others, I'm sure) carefully phrased ranting may elicit some actions...

    Ultimately, I think all of the actors on the show have been used to far less than there full potential. While I wasn't a big fan of the episode's writing, I did enjoy Torri's energetic portrayal of Phoebus.... indeed, as good a job as she did, I'm sure she could have played the character with even greater levels of viciousness and/or instability, further illustrating the descent into psychosis.

    While she and David Hewlett seem to have been given some of the better, meatier dialog lately, I have no doubt that the rest could easily keep up given smarter writing. This is an action show of course, but it is a dramatic action show (it's not the A-Team...), and the first part of that phrase - "drama" - seems to have been ignored lately...

  13. #53
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    Default Re: The Long Goodbye

    I actually quite enjoyed this episode. It had that sci-fi meets Die Hard feel of The Storm and The Eye. I admit that the alien posession thing has been done. And done. And done again. And, oh look, there it is again. So I wasn't really expecting to see anything new come of this episode but I was truly impressed with Torri's acting in this one. Plus the kid in me really loved to see Weir finally kicking some ass. Bring on Action Weir!

    Part of me wonders what the ep would have been like if they had gone with the posession story in the way it was set up in the beginning before they started shooting at each other. It would have been an interesting character piece I think to see Elizabeth and John posessed by 2 beings who truly were in love and only had a couple of hours to say good-bye. It would have been wrenching and emotional and really give the actors something to sink they're teeth into. Still, I did really enjoy Weir playing the bad guy..woman and hopefully the ramification of this ep will show up down the line. Atlantis seems very good at continuity that way. As evidenced by Caldwell. I was really glad to see him back in action and I hope that we've not seen the last of him. I only wish that they had given some sort of timeframe as to how long he'd been taken over by the Gou'ald. That was one thing that had me wondering during Critical Mass. I wasn't sure if he'd be Gou'alded the entire time or just recently. Maybe in another ep they'll clarify that one.

    The ship-go-round continues of course. I didn't really expect anything less. The one major area where IMO TPTB have a real weakness. It's all tease tease tease and no pay off. This is why I don't really care what they do with ship on Atlantis. If it follows true to form they'll tease it for the next 7 or 8 years and then forget it exists.

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  14. #54

    Default Re: The Long Goodbye

    Quote Originally Posted by Shipperahoy
    Part of me wonders what the ep would have been like if they had gone with the posession story in the way it was set up in the beginning before they started shooting at each other. It would have been an interesting character piece I think to see Elizabeth and John posessed by 2 beings who truly were in love and only had a couple of hours to say good-bye. It would have been wrenching and emotional and really give the actors something to sink they're teeth into.
    Actually, I think a mix of the initial premise (a couple with only a few hours to say good bye) and the main plot (two aliens trying to kill each other) might have been a cool twist... Imagine, one character still in love with the other, but the other is damaged, psychotic, deadly, but perhaps with moments of lucidity (or even moments where Weir or Sheppard pop out and wonder what's going on)... the interplay of hate and love, mixed with violence and compassion and sacrifice... the two struggle against each other, one trying to kill for hate, the other trying to save for love... one is indescriminate of the damage caused, while the other works with the SGA team to stop the killer, knowing that death might be the only solution for both..... All kinds of possibilities in that mix.... now that could have been a real twist on the alien possession story.

    Sigh....

  15. #55
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    Default Re: The Long Goodbye

    Are there any more pics than those LJ ones??? Not that they weren't fab (GO TORRI) but I loved the ep, pics pics!!!! ???

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  16. #56
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    Default Re: The Long Goodbye

    Weir/Torri was HOT!!!
    She was also just fantastic in almost every other sense of the word.
    It's too bad we didn't see her face in the fight. I'm sure there's going to be people saying how it was a stunt double, when it wasn't (at least not all of it)
    Good representation of everyone else, even though it's focused on Shep and Weir
    Nice directing, very nice.
    That "Home" music again, very "Scifi-ish"
    Plot's a little "been-there-and-done-that", but the end was still tense as hell.
    Repercussions from Critical Mass, and Mitch handled it perfectly.
    The ending was hilarious!

    All in all, a pretty good episode.

  17. #57
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    Default Re: The Long Goodbye

    Loved the ep. Everyone was good. Joe was the best though. Torri did well but it's easy to play straight out good vs evil sides of a character. Joe had to pull off fooling everyone. Phoebus never tried, except at the very beginning and I wasn't fooled for a minute. Shep had to fool everyone and he did a great job. With Ronon. With Teyla it was like..hmmm...is he or isn't he. Not easy to do and he was fabulous. He kept me guessing.

    Loved everyone's reaction to Caldwell. Shep checking out his neck. Bwah.

    Just a fun ep, great shots. Good acting.

    Loved the end scene in the infirmary. Funny.

  18. #58
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    Default Re: The Long Goodbye

    Quote Originally Posted by xfkirsten
    Personally, I absolutely loved this one! Granted, I'm a big Weir fan, so that probably slants my opinion quite a bit. I thought Torri Higginson did an amazing job with this one! Great portrayal of Phoebus. I thought Joe Flanigan played Thalan a little too much like he plays Sheppard, so the two kind of blended together. But Torri did an amazing job differentiating between Phoebus and Weir.

    The infirmary scene at the end was great! Sheppard had the awkward "I can't look her in the eye" vibe going, and Weir was hilarious in her embarrassment. That last shot before the credits rolled had me on the floor laughing!

    The action was great - I really loved the change in camera style they used for the action shots. Reminded me a bit of the "Gladiator" style. And I couldn't help but think that that storage area would be an awesome lazer tag arena...

    Off to watch this one again!
    I think the whole POINT of it was for him to play it like he was still Sheppard. Torri just had to be blantantly different. Easier to do, actually. We know Joe can do bad. IE:Conversion. So he played it perfectly.

  19. #59
    Major GatetheWay's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Long Goodbye

    Quote Originally Posted by MajorSam
    Are there any more pics than those LJ ones??? Not that they weren't fab (GO TORRI) but I loved the ep, pics pics!!!! ???

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    There are some screencaps here.
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  20. #60
    Major xfkirsten's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Long Goodbye

    Quote Originally Posted by Merlin7
    I think the whole POINT of it was for him to play it like he was still Sheppard. Torri just had to be blantantly different. Easier to do, actually. We know Joe can do bad. IE:Conversion. So he played it perfectly.
    I could understand that, except he was exactly like Sheppard even when he wasn't pretending to be Sheppard. And I think what may have helped in that respect is if he did something along the lines of what Torri did when she was Phoebus-pretending-to-be-Weir: put in a slight twist to the character (in her case, being a bit too "girly") that made you know something was up. At the end, they were certainly trying to play up the is-he-or-isn't he, so it makes sense there for him to try and act like Sheppard. But not in the middle of the show, when it was just Phoebus and Thalan.
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