Ascended Ancients - Morale or im-morale

[Dragon_Heart]

What i mean by this is if the Ascended Ancient rules or good or bad? Should they just stand by and watch millions by killed? Watch diseases spread? let lifeforms become slaves?

Surely, their morale is not in the correct place. IMO, if you have the ability to free an entire galaxy or 2, maybe even more, and help them better themselves with peace, then why not do it?

A few examples of the ancients rules:

1. Let the ori waltz in and kill thousands for having a free will.

2. Punish their own for doing what they think is right, and in most respects, is. (this ex-cludes when one of the ascended gave a species the technology to defend themselves against threats, but they then used it to conquer.

3. Not to interfere with any lower planes of existence no matter what. Even if this means the entire decimation of a species.



There are many views you can take on this, as they have done some pretty amazing things. Heck, they have even been shown to be lenient. But this only happened when morgan healed tealc and disrupted adria, and then fought her. Just to mention, they could of at least helped either oma or morgan when they were fighting, i mean i now they think they are beyond it, but to have them locked in eternal battle for doing what they thought is right, is thatnot rong and im-moral?


There are many examples you can use to support your own opinion, so please dont hold back.

What is your own opinion? and please try to support it with evidence or make a decent debate, this could turn out to be very fun

[Jeffala]

3. Not to interfere with any lower planes of existence no matter what. Even if this means the entire decimation of a species.

Which species should be saved? What if the species that was going to be destroyed due to some cosmic event was saved by the Ancients and later went on to conquer the galaxy, enslaving millions and killing millions more? Interfering in the natural progression of events has consequences, some good and some bad, but it's not their place to get involved in things that don't concern them.

Here's what the Ancients know: They're not God(s). It's not their place to make these decisions about who lives and dies in the universe. They are simply another inhabitant that mostly keeps to their own affairs (aside from a few rogues and the circumstances that those rogues cause).

[thekillman]

how can you know what they know? if we had APBW's in s1e1, would things have gone the normal way? after the goauld were down, what wouldve happened? galactic conquest

[Synate]

personaly I think they ment good with their rules, I mean rules are there for a reason.
Earth humans are enough proof that interfering brings bad things.

[Jeffala]

Their collective action speaks to their attitudes.

One of their kind gave weapons tech to another in defiance of their wishes. He was banished and the civilization wiped out.

One of their kind saved a planet from the Wraith. She was banished to that planet for eternity.

Daniel tried to use his powers to interfere in Anubis' conquest of the galaxy and he was stopped and banished by another rogue.

They believe in allowing the natural progression of events to play themselves out and that none of their kind should interfere.

[Dragon_Heart]

Their collective action speaks to their attitudes.

One of their kind gave weapons tech to another in defiance of their wishes. He was banished and the civilization wiped out.

One of their kind saved a planet from the Wraith. She was banished to that planet for eternity.

Daniel tried to use his powers to interfere in Anubis' conquest of the galaxy and he was stopped and banished by another rogue.

They believe in allowing the natural progression of events to play themselves out and that none of their kind should interfere.

Well for a start, does that not seem im-moral to you?

What im trying to get across is that they can bring every species to peace. Easily. why don't they do it? We don't know. Maybe they want to be above us, or maybe they are just ignorant and selfish.

If you had the ability to stop, say, the goa'uld enslaving an entire civilisation, would you just sit there and ignore it while thousands die and are enslaved? They should have learned by now from past experience that leaving things to play out themselves can lead to dire consequences.

What if everyone was brought to the exact level as them? Every single sentient lifeform as an ascended being. They could not fight eachother, and if you ask me, with all the knowledge they would gain, i'd think even the goa'uld would realise what they did was wrong. IMO, the wraith would become just a faction. If they no longer need to feed on humans, then they become peaceful. Then again, where's the fun in that?

In conclusion, my opinion is that the ancients are lenient in some cases, and have done some brilliant things, but they have placed their morale's in the wrong place (well at least the majority of them), which is turning a blind eye to the galaxies needs.

To think, a click of the fingers and everything is better. They aren't as smart as you'd think

[Splitsecond]

The Ancients are so far removed from us that the question becomes similar to the concept of animal preservation. Is it right to kill the Cain toad in Australia, we introduced them to the environment and now they are killing off the indigenous species. If the toads killed off all competition, they would become the dominant species and a new stable ecosystem would form. This is almost a direct analogy to the Wraith.

An alternative view of this is aid to Africa. The populations exploded because we gave them medicine without reducing birth rates. We gave them countries and governments that were built along fractured tribal divisions. We gave loans to corrupt governments and held the country to these loans, now they are almost bankrupt. We gave them food during famine, which only postponed the problem and made it worse. Should we continue to intervene? This is analogous to the Goa'uld, who got most of their technology from the Ancients.

The Ancients drastically changed the shape of the galaxies they went to. They set up gates, terraformed planets, created sapient life and seeded the universe with their cast-offs. How can anyone say that one lesser being deserves a helping hand along the evolutionary road compared to another lesser being? Morality fails in this situation because the Ancients have no right to define what is morally correct.

[tjoflojt]

Well for a start, does that not seem im-moral to you?

What im trying to get across is that they can bring every species to peace. Easily. why don't they do it? We don't know. Maybe they want to be above us, or maybe they are just ignorant and selfish.

If you had the ability to stop, say, the goa'uld enslaving an entire civilisation, would you just sit there and ignore it while thousands die and are enslaved? They should have learned by now from past experience that leaving things to play out themselves can lead to dire consequences.

What if everyone was brought to the exact level as them? Every single sentient lifeform as an ascended being. They could not fight eachother, and if you ask me, with all the knowledge they would gain, i'd think even the goa'uld would realise what they did was wrong. IMO, the wraith would become just a faction. If they no longer need to feed on humans, then they become peaceful. Then again, where's the fun in that?

In conclusion, my opinion is that the ancients are lenient in some cases, and have done some brilliant things, but they have placed their morale's in the wrong place (well at least the majority of them), which is turning a blind eye to the galaxies needs.

To think, a click of the fingers and everything is better. They aren't as smart as you'd think

thats really just like saying "Kill the lions, they're killing all the boars and deer!"

The ancients can't decide whats right and wrong just becouse they're higher evolved than the rest of us. sure, they can mess with the Ori since they're just as evolved, but if they started messing with wraith or Goa'uld, that would be like Australia going to war with crocodiles for eating fish.

[Dragon_Heart]

Yeah but i didnt say kill them off, i said to ascend them all. This would bring equality and no need for fighting. Maybe in some cases like a power hngry goa'uld, but come on, with the knowledge they gain they should also gain a better perspective with it.

Although on the other hand, the do not really have the right to tip the balance of power in any shape or form. It can cripple another species, so its all a matter of your opinion. with mine being to ascend everyone, there comes alot of things to think about.

[tjoflojt]

thats the same thing as genetic manipulation. like making monkeys smart enough to be integrated into our society. thats not the way it's supposed to be, every race should evolve at it's own pace, even if that means getting extinct due to stronger rivals.

[Guest750]

"They don't interfere 'cause they don't know what'd happen."
Orlin said that.
Yet un-ascended beings can travel through time when ascended can't, that's rubbish. Leave me un-ascended please.

[peragrin]

Their collective action speaks to their attitudes.

One of their kind gave weapons tech to another in defiance of their wishes. He was banished and the civilization wiped out.

One of their kind saved a planet from the Wraith. She was banished to that planet for eternity.

Daniel tried to use his powers to interfere in Anubis' conquest of the galaxy and he was stopped and banished by another rogue.

They believe in allowing the natural progression of events to play themselves out and that none of their kind should interfere.

Orlin gave weapon tech to help a race defend against the gould. That race then went on planing to conquer the galaxy with their new weapons.

Anubis himself was let loose by the ancients to teach Oma Personal responsibility in exactly why you don't help out. Oma Helped Anubis just like you want them to help the rest of us. And look at the damage that caused.

Oma an ascended being couldn't see through Anubis's duplicity. How could anyone else? You don't ever interfere simply because you can't guarantee the results. Sometimes it is better to let things be, than to get involved and make them far far worse. If Oma didn't break the rules then Anubis would have died and never risen again thousand of years before SG1 started to travel through the gate.

[tjoflojt]

but then an entire arc of SG1 would have to be re-writen!

[peragrin]

"They don't interfere 'cause they don't know what'd happen."
Orlin said that.
Yet un-ascended beings can travel through time when ascended can't, that's rubbish. Leave me un-ascended please.

um, time travel isn't normal. and every time SG1 did time travel a new timeline was created and had to be corrected by what? more time travel.

[Dragon_Heart]

Yeah, but bringing every sentient, intelligent lifeform up to the exact same level, will give them all a better perspective and equality. And with equality comes peace. ?Therefore, everything works out. The wraith wouldnt need to feed, the gaould wouldnt have jaffa factions because the jaffa would gain knowledge that they are not gods and are on the exact same level as them. It's all for the best, really. Its an acceptable risk that some may rebel and create factions as ascended beings, but they can move galaxies then couldnt they. I mean, certain things have to be taken into consideration, yes, but wouldnt everything be alot better? yuuup.