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    Ship vs Ship ratios

    I know a lot has been done on what it would take to beat a 304 and I feel that some of the previous work will feed into this thread.

    I would not like the 304 debates to dominate this thread though and I hope that it covers other ships.

    My question is this, how many of one type of ship would it take to take out another in a fair fight?

    Here is an example. We have seen from Unending that 2 Ori motherships were capable of overpowering a 304. (even though the 304 escaped)

    We have also seen from The last man that 3 Wraith hives can take out a 304 therefore 3 Wraith hives could go take on 2 wraith motherships. (although 4 would probably end up better off.)

    In the fight with the Ori in Crusade numerous Ha'tak took on 4 Ori ships to no effect so it would take loads of Ha'tak to take out one ori ship and therefore 1hive.

    So how many ha'tak would it take to beat a Hive?

    I've decided to summarise what I have worked out as follows.

    2 Ori > 1 304
    3 Hives >= 1 304

    But what of the other races? Goa'uld, Travellers (they could never make that many), The Ancients, the aliens from Grace, etc
    Last edited by Zalenka; 19 September 2008, 07:23 AM. Reason: spelling

    #2
    Originally posted by Zalenka View Post
    I know a lot has been done on what it would take to beat a 304 and I feel that some of the previous work will feed into this thread.

    I would not like the 304 debates to dominate this thread though and I hope that it covers other ships.

    My question is this, how many of one type of ship would it take to take out another in a fair fight?

    Here is an example. We have seen from Unending that 2 Ori motherships were capable of overpowering a 304. (even though the 304 escaped)

    We have also seen from The last man that 3 Wraith hives can take out a 304 therefore 3 Wraith hives could go take on 2 wraith motherships. (although 4 would probably end up better off.)

    In the fight with the Ori in Crusade numerous Ha'tak took on 4 Ori ships to no effect so it would take loads of Ha'tak to take out one ori ship and therefore 1hive.

    So how many ha'tak would it take to beat a Hive?

    I've decided to summarise what I have worked out as follows.

    2 Ori > 1 304
    3 Hives >= 1 304

    But what of the other races? Goa'uld, Travellers (they could never make that many), The Ancients, the aliens from Grace, etc
    i think you mean ori motherships,
    it would probably take a lot of hataks, since they're weaker than the 304 and therefore much weaker than the hiveship.

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      #3
      An interesting idea, Although i find some of your examples strange. The 304 in Unending had full asgard upgrades and a ZPM, but also (IIRC) its shields were damaged by the exploding asgard planet, and the same 304 took a hell of a lot ori shots in AOT. And for 3 hives ttaking out a 304, thats also very uncertain, we didnt see enough to know and the pheonix was said to be rushed out. After all, weve seen a 304 take out a hiveship in 3 shots, so the Pheonix shouldnt have had much problems against 3. Micheal could have upgraded his ships. but than thats not a normal hiveship anymore.

      Personaly, i' say a regular 304 (non Odesey-no ZPM) is about = to a ori ship.
      Wraith hive ships could be somewhere 3-6 hives to 1 304, do to the cheap beamzz.
      Gould hataks by now are pretty crappy against anything, i cant imagine them posing a threat to a 304, a hiveship or an ori ship without outnumbering it something like 50 to 1.
      Ancients ships in the beggining were described to be very powerfull, possibly a single one comparing to 2-4 304s, but them in BAMSR they were more like 1 304 to 2-4 auroras so who knows.
      Personaly i thought the grace ship was pretty cool, but we know very little about it, and for some reason, it didnt seem like a warship to me, so i cant compare.
      And ofcourse the asgard ships; To be honest, we've seen almost none of their capabilities, so its mostly speculation, but personaly, i'd put an asgard beliskener to more or les equal to 1 post unending 304 and an O'Neill to be as powerfull as 2-4 304s.


      Covering up scandals and keeping secrets is almost a racial trait.

      Isn't it funny how the word 'politics' is made up of the words 'poli' meaning 'many' in Latin, and 'tics' as in 'bloodsucking creatures’?

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        #4
        I would guess about 5 Ha'tak against one hive, (without cruisers, but with darts.)

        Comment


          #5
          I would say

          2 wraith cruisers = 1 Hatak (Because the Hataks shields but Cruisers were able to drain Daedalus's shields pretty fast).

          2 hives = 1 BAMSR Aurora (Aurora's shields seemed very weak in BAMSR I mean I wouldn't have expected a wave of darts and 304's to take down there shields as quickly as they did).

          4 Hives = 1 ORI Toilet (Once again the only ship we've seen take down there shields and destroy them conventionally was the 304 beams and we have no way of estimating there strength against hives weapons).

          9/10 cruisers = 1 Aurora (I think it depends wether or not the Aurora's have the secondary weapon which they should have but we haven't gotten any hard evidence to prove that they have).

          2/3 BAMSR Aurora's = 1 304 (There shields were very poor from what we would've expected from an Ancient vessel controlled by replicators and they weren't shown firing drones enmass but they did almost destroy the Apollo over Assuras so they must have some good damage dealing abilities)

          1 302 = 7ish darts (The 302's missiles are very good at destroying fighters but they only have 4 and I would assume that they could take another 2 or 3 darts with its onboard railgun before being weared down and destroyed).

          1 SuperHatak vs 1 Hive (This is a battle I would love to see both have powerful weapons and are humongass with a good amount of fighters. Would be a fun fight to watch and I think it would be very even).
          if it wasnt for Carters new plot shield we would be dead


          Comment


            #6
            I thought of an example for the Asgard. 2 maybe ha'tak took out the belkishner. the Asgard then had to send 3 O'neils to take on the two ha'taks. They wouldn't of known one had left when they set off.

            In regards to the Odyssey in Unending it had a ZPM but were they upgrading its shields. Thor mentioned the Asgard upgrades would not impinge on the ZPM. Were the shields included in this?

            In AOT I imagine the replicators were able to upgrade the shields as they had the knowledge of the Asgard.

            Comment


              #7
              I think the reason the shields were so strong in AOT was because the big repli-bug was feeding it with power which is why we saw it interfacing during the seige of the Oddysey. It would also explain why the shields weren't as strong as that in Unending.
              if it wasnt for Carters new plot shield we would be dead


              Comment


                #8
                Originally posted by a6346 View Post
                I think the reason the shields were so strong in AOT was because the big repli-bug was feeding it with power which is why we saw it interfacing during the seige of the Oddysey. It would also explain why the shields weren't as strong as that in Unending.
                Replicators use energy - more likely, with hyperdrive and other systems offline full power from the ZPM and other power sources were diverted to the shields.

                Comment


                  #9
                  REplibugs feeding power? i thought it was the other way around, they were using the power to replicate. Why would they feed the ship power (especialy as the ship already had a zpm powering it) or the shields? if they felt threatened to any degree by the ori ships, they could have tried to escape instead.


                  Covering up scandals and keeping secrets is almost a racial trait.

                  Isn't it funny how the word 'politics' is made up of the words 'poli' meaning 'many' in Latin, and 'tics' as in 'bloodsucking creatures’?

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Originally posted by Character View Post
                    REplibugs feeding power? i thought it was the other way around, they were using the power to replicate. Why would they feed the ship power (especialy as the ship already had a zpm powering it) or the shields? if they felt threatened to any degree by the ori ships, they could have tried to escape instead.
                    I was going for the idea that the Replicators were channeling power from the ZPM to the shields in amore efficient way. They'd of needed the ship to consolidate their position.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Originally posted by Zalenka View Post
                      I know a lot has been done on what it would take to beat a 304 and I feel that some of the previous work will feed into this thread.

                      I would not like the 304 debates to dominate this thread though and I hope that it covers other ships.

                      My question is this, how many of one type of ship would it take to take out another in a fair fight?

                      Here is an example. We have seen from Unending that 2 Ori motherships were capable of overpowering a 304. (even though the 304 escaped)

                      We have also seen from The last man that 3 Wraith hives can take out a 304 therefore 3 Wraith hives could go take on 2 wraith motherships. (although 4 would probably end up better off.)

                      In the fight with the Ori in Crusade numerous Ha'tak took on 4 Ori ships to no effect so it would take loads of Ha'tak to take out one ori ship and therefore 1hive.

                      So how many ha'tak would it take to beat a Hive?

                      I've decided to summarise what I have worked out as follows.

                      2 Ori > 1 304
                      3 Hives >= 1 304

                      But what of the other races? Goa'uld, Travellers (they could never make that many), The Ancients, the aliens from Grace, etc
                      Forgive my complete incompetence, but are we talking about 304's BEFORe asgard tech and stuff?
                      Cos Ori motherships are the ****
                      and wraith ships are only in trouble when those nukes are actually able to be beamed aboard.

                      But hey.
                      anyway, a full fleet would be fun
                      Like 20 304s
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                      Comment


                        #12
                        okay i would say atleast 6 or more to take out a hatak, those cruisers may have powerful weapons but its possible abit bigger than a 304 and hatak weapons are quite powerful respectively so a few shots to a cruiser would kill it

                        about 8+ would even out a hiveship, 8+ would maybe even out a single ori ship, one shot from the ori ship would either slice the hive or cause a heck load of damage and not to mention the pulse weapons on it would take on additional cruisers and darts.

                        take 2 or 3 ori ships to take on the oddessy if the priors have been taught space combat and tactics
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                          #13
                          Originally posted by wise one View Post

                          take 2 or 3 ori ships to take on the oddessy if the priors have been taught space combat and tactics
                          Space combat and tactics will be a major factor. If the ships Ori or Wraith are far enough apart a 304 won't be able to out maneuver them, or get caught in the explosion when one goes.

                          Comment


                            #14
                            A Ha'tak couldn't take out a cruiser in a few hits. Those Asgard uber beams took 2 hits to do it, the Ha'tak will take many more. All in all Michaels cruiser withstood 4 direct beam hits, 2 were kill shots. I seriously doubt a Ha'tak can do it in a few shots.
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                              #15
                              How would Anubis's mothership do against the Wraith or the Ori. I'd guess it'd destroy the Ori with the focused weapon and it'd decimate the Wraith.

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