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Athosian Death facilitator
April 18th, 2008, 01:02 AM
Do you think that the earlier episodes of both shows had more depth???

I agree with this because the episodes lately even though they have weight, are not as...depthy. IMO they seem more RUSHY.

PLEASE DISCUSS.................

ykickamoocow
April 18th, 2008, 01:08 AM
Ive always thought that Stargate Atlantis has gotten better over time. I enjoyed seasons 1 and 2 of Atlantis but looking back those 2 seasons dont hold a candle to seasons 3 and 4. I personally think as time goes on the writing has improved and you are getting more story for each episode.

Athosian Death facilitator
April 18th, 2008, 01:15 AM
maybe it's just that they are so jam packed these days.

ykickamoocow
April 18th, 2008, 01:20 AM
maybe it's just that they are so jam packed these days.

Maybe so and i think each episode could some good team moments. The only problem i had with season 4 was the lack of team episodes or even moments but i cant really blame the writers as Rachel Luttrell's pregnancy really through a spanner into the works and made it very difficult to have "team episodes".

jenks
April 18th, 2008, 02:48 AM
Has Atlantis ever been 'deep'?

naamiaiset
April 18th, 2008, 03:06 AM
I personally think as time goes on the writing has improved and you are getting more story for each episode.
I think that's the problem. the writers are trying to fit more than they have time to into 45 or so minutes. I kind of agree episodes seem a little rushed, but season four was great to me.

Cam_Mitchell
April 18th, 2008, 03:15 AM
The new ones are good.. don't get me wrong.. but i really think although the old ones didn't have such a good story line, the wraith were much better in the old episodes and the fact that the team were stranded brought about a real sense of excitement...

Gaz

Athosian Death facilitator
April 18th, 2008, 05:14 AM
The new ones are good.. don't get me wrong.. but i really think although the old ones didn't have such a good story line, the wraith were much better in the old episodes and the fact that the team were stranded brought about a real sense of excitement...

Gaz

I tend to agree with you there.

The lost and vulnerable aspect was great. But then again they would have always needed, Deus Ex Machinas, to help in sieges. I really wish they "stole" the ZPM on M7G-677, even though it isn't really configured for atlantis.

Anyway I am rambling- thanx for the support pal.

kymeric
April 18th, 2008, 08:37 AM
Do you think that the earlier episodes of both shows had more depth???

I agree with this because the episodes lately even though they have weight, are not as...depthy. IMO they seem more RUSHY.

PLEASE DISCUSS.................

Its funny im actually the opposite. I dont care much for the earlier seasons, specifically SG1. Although i own the dvds i nearly never watch them, same with SGA. I usually watch the most recent season the most, followed by wutever episodes tickle mah fancy when i sit down to watch something.

I thought the early sg1 stories were inconsistent as were the characters, the special effects blow by 2008 standards and the relationships werent really there yet.

I like em, i respect em, but i never watch em. Gimme the new stuff!

Mitchell82
April 18th, 2008, 08:40 AM
Ive always thought that Stargate Atlantis has gotten better over time. I enjoyed seasons 1 and 2 of Atlantis but looking back those 2 seasons dont hold a candle to seasons 3 and 4. I personally think as time goes on the writing has improved and you are getting more story for each episode.
I agree. I lover season 1 and 2 and I still watch them but seasons 3 nd 4 have been alot better.

kymeric
April 18th, 2008, 08:41 AM
maybe it's just that they are so jam packed these days.

That is soo true. So much happens in todays episodes it makes the oldies look positively stretched out. Im still amazed at how much they can fit into a new episode like BAMSR. By comparison The first big battle with apophsis was 2 episodes of running around a ship followed by a kaboom.

Teslan
April 18th, 2008, 09:12 AM
I like the older SG-1 episodes better than the newer ones, but the newer Atlantis episodes better than the older ones.

I thought SG-1 was better at establishing the characters and the team dynamics at the beginning which allowed viewers to work their way into the show.

Atlantis had a little more trouble finding its feet but after it did it really took off from there.

Reiko
April 18th, 2008, 09:21 AM
.: The old episodes of the first three seasons were much better.

.: In season four they crashed and burned.

Briangate78
April 18th, 2008, 09:25 AM
Season 2 was more of a crash and burn. The premiere was good, but then it fell off tangent. The mid-season was decent, and the finale was the weakest finale of the series, imo. But I still enjoyed Season 2.

maxbo
April 18th, 2008, 09:49 AM
Season 2 was more of a crash and burn. The premiere was good, but then it fell off tangent. The mid-season was decent, and the finale was the weakest finale of the series, imo. But I still enjoyed Season 2.

I agree. I loved Season 1, but Season 2 almost turned me into an ex-viewer because while Season 1 seemed to have a clear direction, the writing for Season 2 was all over the place. Thankfully, in Season 3 TPTB tried to correct some of the issues I had with Season 2 and as a result, I'm still a regular viewer - complaints and all.

jasminaGo
April 18th, 2008, 10:33 AM
I like the older SG-1 episodes better than the newer ones, but the newer Atlantis episodes better than the older ones.

I thought SG-1 was better at establishing the characters and the team dynamics at the beginning which allowed viewers to work their way into the show.

Atlantis had a little more trouble finding its feet but after it did it really took off from there.

ITA :)

Briangate78
April 18th, 2008, 10:35 AM
I agree. I loved Season 1, but Season 2 almost turned me into an ex-viewer because while Season 1 seemed to have a clear direction, the writing for Season 2 was all over the place. Thankfully, in Season 3 TPTB tried to correct some of the issues I had with Season 2 and as a result, I'm still a regular viewer - complaints and all.

I know you said you liked Season 4 also or was that 3 you were talking about? You seem to be very critical on SGA, which is good, hey makes a very passionate fan, imo. It's the dooming of the show that irks me, but can't do anything about that.

ToasterOnFire
April 18th, 2008, 10:51 AM
One reason why it may feel like the newer eps have less depth is because there was a run of eps toward the end of s4 (Harmony, Outcast, Trio) that had only one plot/POV and featured only a few of the team members.

maxbo
April 18th, 2008, 01:44 PM
I know you said you liked Season 4 also or was that 3 you were talking about? You seem to be very critical on SGA, which is good, hey makes a very passionate fan, imo. It's the dooming of the show that irks me, but can't do anything about that.

I've enjoyed many episodes and moments in Season 4, however, I've been frustrated with what I perceive as a lack of overall direction in Season 4. My feelings about The Last Man pretty much summarizes my feelings about Season 4 because although that episode had several moments that I enjoyed, it didn't make sense to me as a season ender.

Infinatus
April 18th, 2008, 05:00 PM
I actually thought The Last Man was the deepest Atlantis episode to date. The early episodes were just a romp in another galaxy shooting space vampires and making half hearted attempts to throw in out of place moral dilemmas such as whether or not you can take hope away from a few people in Pegasus by blowing up Atlantis to save billions in the Milky Way. On the other hand, the season 4 finale touches on the complications of altering the timeline (especially the possibility of making things even worse). But I liked all seasons of the show so I'm not complaining.

EdenSG
April 20th, 2008, 08:18 PM
For me, it has always been difficult to compare the first season of any TV to subsequent seasons in terms of depth. I think one thing the first season of a TV show always has going for it is it’s “newness”; new characters, a new story, a new place/environment and finding out how those characters interact with each other and respond. It is a season of discovery for both the characters and the viewer. I think there is a feeling of freshness and an excitement of newness in a first season that can never quite be matched in the same way in subsequent seasons.

The foundation of both the story and the characters needs to be well established in season 1. If the writers and actors don’t establish a good story premise and interesting characters there will likely not be a season 2. So for me, a season 1 – if done well – needs to have a lot of interest and depth. I think this was done very well in Atlantis season 1 . I was intrigued by a good story, interesting characters and a unique place. It drew me in, made me a fan and got me to return for season 2.

For me, season 2 has been the weakest, with the least depth. Season 1 had a very strong, compelling focus; survival after being cut off from Earth and find a defense against the Wraith. And while season 2 did have its “focus”, keeping Atlantis a secret and general exploration, I do not think it was as compelling as season 1. And many of the episodes are what I would term “light.” However there were a few stand out episodes for me that - in my opinion – had depth that did a good job of combining both an interesting story that was unique to Atlantis and good character building/exploration; these were “Duet”, “Trinity”, “Conversion” and “Michael.”

Season 3 I think tried to make up for some of the short comings of season 2. There was more conflict for the characters, the introduction of the Asurans, and the continuation of the Michael saga. There were a lot of good team moments and characetr moments. For me, Season 3 was a season of extremes because it has some of my most favorite and what I think are some of the best Atlantis eps – “Sateda”, “Common Ground”, “McKay & Mrs. Miller” and “Tao of Rodney,” and two of my least favorites; “Irresponsible” and “The Game.”

I think Season 4 started out with an abundance of really good ideas- Teyla’s people missing, Weir missing, introduction of Carter and Keller, the Asuran/Wraith War, introduction of the Travelers and later on the Michael saga - that held the promise of what looked to be very compelling, dramatic storylines that could be carried through the season. And while I really enjoyed season 4 and on a whole think it was a good season with a good amount of drama and depth, I thought one weakness was the sort of hit and run feel I got with some of these storylines. While I think I can see there was a conscious effort to try to weave these plots into several different stories, it still felt a bit choppy to me and took to long between eps to follow up, revisit or simply update these storylines. When you really get into a story line it can be frustrating to not see any progression with it for several episodes or worse, half a season. You run the risk of having the viewer lose interest because the storyline loses importance, it becomes less compelling. I think the eps that did feature these storylines were dramatic, excellent and had strong character moments; “Adrift”, BAMSR, “Spoils of War”, and “Kindred 1&2". “Miller’s Crossing”, “Reunion”, “Midway” were great stand alone eps that I think also had a lot character interest and depth.

Even though I have some issues with season 4, overall I think it was a great season. In season 5, the storylines of the renegade Asurans, Michael, Carson, and Woolsey are ones I am most looking forward to see continuing. I hope for season 5 that we are given a compelling mission or storyline/s that can be more evenly and well delivered through out the season. I think it will give additional drama and depth to the story and characters. And while I don’t mind stand alone eps, (some of my most favorite eps have been the stand alones), overall I would like season 5 to be more compelling, less hit and run and offer more personal challenges and even more tension for the characters. I don’t want to see serial eps like Lost and BSG, but just more connections between storylines & episodes and more progression of the major storylines. It is a fine line.

Mitchell82
April 20th, 2008, 11:08 PM
Season 2 was more of a crash and burn. The premiere was good, but then it fell off tangent. The mid-season was decent, and the finale was the weakest finale of the series, imo. But I still enjoyed Season 2.
I agree that season 2 was the weakest but it still s a good season. I loved the season finale but it still is the weakest.

Mitchell82
April 20th, 2008, 11:11 PM
I agree. I loved Season 1, but Season 2 almost turned me into an ex-viewer because while Season 1 seemed to have a clear direction, the writing for Season 2 was all over the place. Thankfully, in Season 3 TPTB tried to correct some of the issues I had with Season 2 and as a result, I'm still a regular viewer - complaints and all.

Season 2 was the weakest of the four we've seen so far but it wasn't bad enough to make me consider not watching. The writing was a bit wonky at times but still a decent season.

SGFerrit
April 21st, 2008, 07:49 AM
One reason why it may feel like the newer eps have less depth is because there was a run of eps toward the end of s4 (Harmony, Outcast, Trio) that had only one plot/POV and featured only a few of the team members.

I think they should have dropped either Quarantine or Harmony. I enjoyed them, but IMO three standalones was a bit too much. I enjoyed Trio more than those two though. Outcast is debatable as a standalone episode, I think it ties more into the overall Replicator arc really.

SGFerrit
April 21st, 2008, 07:52 AM
Season 2 was the weakest of the four we've seen so far but it wasn't bad enough to make me consider not watching. The writing was a bit wonky at times but still a decent season.

Season 2 was the weakest IMO also. It had the weakest finale and the weakest mid-season 2 parter, and the weakest line-up overall IMO. But there were some great episodes in there, and a great premiere too. I think season 5 will be great, very strong. Out of 10 episodes of the first half, I am dying to see 6, and considering we don't even know what two of the other four are about, I'd say that's pretty good, for me atleast:D

Mind you, I was really looking forward to Travelers for season 4, and look how that turned out...

FreeJaffa
April 21st, 2008, 08:23 AM
maybe it's just that they are so jam packed these days.

:vala:I like jam!

On topic: I think new episodes of Atlantis are much improved from the old ones. As far as the old eps of SG-1 are concerned, I like em all.

Redhooks
April 21st, 2008, 09:06 AM
Season 2 was the weakest IMO also. It had the weakest finale and the weakest mid-season 2 parter, and the weakest line-up overall IMO. But there were some great episodes in there, and a great premiere too. I think season 5 will be great, very strong. Out of 10 episodes of the first half, I am dying to see 6, and considering we don't even know what two of the other four are about, I'd say that's pretty good, for me atleast:D

Mind you, I was really looking forward to Travelers for season 4, and look how that turned out...
I thought season one of SGA was pretty darn good and then after the strong start of The Siege, Pt. 3 in season 2, I thought it gradually went downhill and I lost interest in the show. Not until I learned that Jill Wagner would be guest starring on the show did I come back to it and I saw that I missed some good eps in the first half of season 3.

As I stated, I came back to SGA due to Larrin and the Travelers. I was excited with all the info/spoilers that were out in the late spring and summer and that TPTB were heavily promoting the Travelers as the "new" race in SGA. My excitement was tempered when I saw the episode because I thought there were much better scenarios for the episode in the pre-airing/speculation thread here on GW than what was actually shown in episode. From all the promotion this new race had, I had hoped that TPTB would use the Travelers to give a better history of the PG after the Ancients abandoned Atlantis 10,000 years ago. Unfortunately to me, the episode was much more an action shoot-em up than the intelligent, reflective history lesson of how some Humans had survived the Wraith along with more info on the Ancient gene Sheppard has and why the Travelers had seemingly never come across any PG native who had the gene like the ruling family in The Tower. It only seemed the Travelers were a convienance in order to get more ships for the BAMSR space battle and I wonder if Alex Levine's comment in his Sci-Fi blog for Travelers about there originally going to be another episode using the Travelers' ship set ever got past the planning stage? For as much as JM & PM promoted them during last summer, it seems to me that basically 1.5 eps was not enough time to show this new race. I hope one of the things done this season is to show more history about the PG galaxy which should have been done in season's four second half instead of the weak (in my opinion) stand-alones that were presented.

Mitchell82
April 21st, 2008, 11:11 AM
Season 2 was the weakest IMO also. It had the weakest finale and the weakest mid-season 2 parter, and the weakest line-up overall IMO. But there were some great episodes in there, and a great premiere too. I think season 5 will be great, very strong. Out of 10 episodes of the first half, I am dying to see 6, and considering we don't even know what two of the other four are about, I'd say that's pretty good, for me atleast:D
I don't think the lineup of season 2 was that weak the only ones that were really weak for me were "The Tower" "Condemned" and "Epiphany." The rest were really good IMO like "Instinct" and "Conversion" for example. Overall yeah it was the weakest season but still had lots of great moments.


Mind you, I was really looking forward to Travelers for season 4, and look how that turned out...
I did like it but yeah it didn't turn out as good as I expected either kinda like Epiphany though like that ep I still enjoyed it.

Athosian Death facilitator
April 24th, 2008, 02:00 AM
.: The old episodes of the first three seasons were much better.

.: In season four they crashed and burned.

CRASHED and BURNED? that's a little bit harsh to me.

They did a great job(not with the replictors IMO, you can't destory a superace in a year(even though the replicators are still out there somewhere.)

I mean, the themes were great Travelers could have been better(definitely storyline wise.). But eps 10/11/12, are IMO so rushy.

OLd 1's rule

Athosian Death facilitator
April 24th, 2008, 02:03 AM
One reason why it may feel like the newer eps have less depth is because there was a run of eps toward the end of s4 (Harmony, Outcast, Trio) that had only one plot/POV and featured only a few of the team members.

really good point.

Athosian Death facilitator
April 24th, 2008, 02:09 AM
I've enjoyed many episodes and moments in Season 4, however, I've been frustrated with what I perceive as a lack of overall direction in Season 4. My feelings about The Last Man pretty much summarizes my feelings about Season 4 because although that episode had several moments that I enjoyed, it didn't make sense to me as a season ender.

In a factory, and it caves.

How many people survived the twin towers(lest we forget.)??
Yeah...because the asgard saved us at the last moment. (not!!)

I think it made me see how vulnerable the show could possibly be without Joe Flanigan. Unless Jason Momoa really stepped up the show is doomed if Joe does what RDA did. No matter his personal reason for quitting(touch wood) it's doomed without him.

However, Ronon would become the new "SCI-FI Rambo." A lil bit emotional at times. LOL, I can't wait for the wraith worshipping Ronon episode. I have a feeling unless it's badly written, i am going to cry(and I never cry).

Season ender... very open ended to me. not that gud tho

Athosian Death facilitator
April 24th, 2008, 02:19 AM
I think they should have dropped either Quarantine or Harmony. I enjoyed them, but IMO three standalones was a bit too much. I enjoyed Trio more than those two though. Outcast is debatable as a standalone episode, I think it ties more into the overall Replicator arc really.

I wish they cancelled both Quarantine, Harmony, and Trio, because of how meaningless the episodes became. They should have just... made a couple of other episodes like, Outcast, two episode arcs. Maybe even they should have made midway a two-episode arc.

Start to feed on Teal'c and then END IT QUICK so me and you the viewer are like "WTF. TEAL'C??, WAIT WE'rE COMING TO HELP!"(bust through the TV set. lol)

Pitry
April 24th, 2008, 11:06 AM
One reason why it may feel like the newer eps have less depth is because there was a run of eps toward the end of s4 (Harmony, Outcast, Trio) that had only one plot/POV and featured only a few of the team members.

I'm not sure. Some of the "deepest" SG episodes of both shows - at least IMO - had just one plot/ POV and features only a few of the team members, like Grace (with all of my dislike for this episode, I can't call it shallow ;)), The Real World, Crusade, and I won't say Grace Under Pressure cos I suspect I'd be crucified, but I'm whispering it. ;) - to name but a few. The opposite is also true - as much as Irresponsible was a team episode (as much as they exist in SGA), it isn't exactly what I'd call a textbook case of depth. It's what the plot is and how the POV is used that determines the depth.


I wish they cancelled both Quarantine, Harmony, and Trio, because of how meaningless the episodes became. They should have just... made a couple of other episodes like, Outcast, two episode arcs. Maybe even they should have made midway a two-episode arc.


"Our main weapon is fear, fear and surprise, surprise and fear..." Sorry, couldn't resist ;)

Out of these three that seem to be critisised here - and with my compelte and utter dislike of season 4 - I actually thought Quarantine and Trio were pretty decent, all things considered. I actually enjoyed Quarantine, which is a rarity with season 4....

But I have to admit that personally, I sort of agree with Jenks' sarcastic comment from the first page - did Atlantis ever have depth?... Sarcasm aside, it always had its share of shalow, blow 'em up episode - a lot more so than SG1, I'm afraid, as the season premiere/ finales tend to be CGI and explosion and fast camera movement for all seasons, while in SG1 we had a clip show(!), a comedy act, a couple of episodes where the key was the mystery and intelligent problem solving rather thanthe CGI etc. Stargate Atlantis tries to be fleshy, and sexy, and fast - and it pays in depth. That's not to say that a television programme can't be fleshy and sexy and fast and deep and intelligent - it's just that Stargate Atlantis doesn't do it - and on all seasons, the deep episodes tend to be the quieter ones, some of them even bottle episodes. For SG1 I'd say this devision of old vs. new might be more accurate even though it's not completely so - as the newer seasons do tend to be more fleshy and fast etc, and pay with depth on several occasions. But sGA was that way from the get-go.

Crichiel
April 25th, 2008, 10:35 PM
Speaking about both shows here:

I think that the earlier episodes had a slow-burn kind of pacing that gave a lot of depth to those episodes, even the one-offs. The pace seemed to get faster and faster each season...BUT, I still thought the later episodes had a depth to them that they got from the rich history and mythology of all the shows that came before them. I always place what happens in an individual episode in the context of where it occurs in the entire series. Although, this rapid pace does to hurt the 'depth' of the episodes that are supposed to be complete stand-alones.

So, I guess if you were looking at each episode individually, and not as a whole in the series? I would say that the earlier episodes were better at this. Partly because the 'newness' of a show kind of dictates that you take more time to explore and explain what if happening. You don't have the kind of shorthand that you can use later in a series.

fuzzylogicman
April 26th, 2008, 04:34 AM
i generally agree with the thread but i believe season 4, specially near the end has been the best so far. i mean they have finished off some great storylines and modified other ones to fit into the existing storylines. The wraith are starting to become a real enemy (before they were almost story filler) and now we see why they are more of a threat than the ori or replicators. i can see at least two more seasons out of atlantis yet to fill the holes left, specially since they are exploring more about the events in the galaxy and characters.

Heaven
April 26th, 2008, 07:52 AM
As I stated, I came back to SGA due to Larrin and the Travelers. I was excited with all the info/spoilers that were out in the late spring and summer and that TPTB were heavily promoting the Travelers as the "new" race in SGA. My excitement was tempered when I saw the episode because I thought there were much better scenarios for the episode in the pre-airing/speculation thread here on GW than what was actually shown in episode. From all the promotion this new race had, I had hoped that TPTB would use the Travelers to give a better history of the PG after the Ancients abandoned Atlantis 10,000 years ago. Unfortunately to me, the episode was much more an action shoot-em up than the intelligent, reflective history lesson of how some Humans had survived the Wraith along with more info on the Ancient gene Sheppard has and why the Travelers had seemingly never come across any PG native who had the gene like the ruling family in The Tower. It only seemed the Travelers were a convienance in order to get more ships for the BAMSR space battle and I wonder if Alex Levine's comment in his Sci-Fi blog for Travelers about there originally going to be another episode using the Travelers' ship set ever got past the planning stage? For as much as JM & PM promoted them during last summer, it seems to me that basically 1.5 eps was not enough time to show this new race. I hope one of the things done this season is to show more history about the PG galaxy which should have been done in season's four second half instead of the weak (in my opinion) stand-alones that were presented.
I agree completely, very well put.

and I also think the new seasons have too much action and not enough story
the new episodes fall on one of two categories
"action" stories, which usually have a lot of action scenes and very little and simple storylines.
and "character" stories which usually have a lot of emotional scenes with a story that has nothing whatsoever to do with the overall Atlantis plot.

expendable_crewman
April 26th, 2008, 07:54 AM
So, I guess if you were looking at each episode individually, and not as a whole in the series? I would say that the earlier episodes were better at this. Partly because the 'newness' of a show kind of dictates that you take more time to explore and explain what if happening.

I like the way you put this. Makes me see season one as a set-up season. In SGA, the first season gets lots of points, IMO, for building momentum, creating a problem, a very big epic-scale problem (they woke *all* the Wraith), and laying it out as a story that could not be solved in one season. The "fish out of water" idea with a fresh, vital twist, ending on a note of apocalyptic proportion. But ...

i generally agree with the thread but i believe season 4, specially near the end has been the best so far. i mean they have finished off some great storylines and modified other ones to fit into the existing storylines. The wraith are starting to become a real enemy (before they were almost story filler) and now we see why they are more of a threat than the ori or replicators. i can see at least two more seasons out of atlantis yet to fill the holes left, specially since they are exploring more about the events in the galaxy and characters.

I could re-write this, replacing the words "season 4" with "season 2" and the words "ori or replicators" with "Genii" and, for me, it would fit.

And I could do it again, saying "season 3" and leave in "ori and replicators" and get the same effect, which is to say that, IMO, all that momentum eventually becomes unsatisfying if the wave never reaches the shore. The wave, I think, is the depth a show develops in its stories and characters. For me, it's not the flash of an explosion around an enemy ship that has meaning, it's that I have an interest in seeing that particular ship stopped, or its fictional crew obliterated. The show has to make me feel, and on that note ...


But I have to admit that personally, I sort of agree with Jenks' sarcastic comment from the first page - did Atlantis ever have depth?... Sarcasm aside, it always had its share of shalow, blow 'em up episode - a lot more so than SG1, I'm afraid, as the season premiere/ finales tend to be CGI and explosion and fast camera movement for all seasons, while in SG1 we had a clip show(!), a comedy act, a couple of episodes where the key was the mystery and intelligent problem solving rather thanthe CGI etc. Stargate Atlantis tries to be fleshy, and sexy, and fast - and it pays in depth. That's not to say that a television programme can't be fleshy and sexy and fast and deep and intelligent - it's just that Stargate Atlantis doesn't do it - and on all seasons, the deep episodes tend to be the quieter ones, some of them even bottle episodes. For SG1 I'd say this devision of old vs. new might be more accurate even though it's not completely so - as the newer seasons do tend to be more fleshy and fast etc, and pay with depth on several occasions. But sGA was that way from the get-go.

I kind of agree with this, but I had to go backward to do it. In season one, I was starry-eyed over the premise and more than willing to wait for the glue, the underlying intelligence, awareness, and depth, that binds a good show, even an action show with busy stories and busy characters. Season one was, for me, so beautiful to look at. So much was new, so much to learn. Even the characters, knowing nothing about them, were fascinating to me. In season two, I was still patiently waiting for some deeper layer to emerge, thanks to wonderful portrayals by the cast. In season three, I began to lose patience. (That is not to say the cast has done less; the cast is usually quite fantastic making the most of what they are given.) When asked was the depth really there, even in the beginning, I am not sure I can say it was. But the potential, wow, the potential.

Heaven
April 26th, 2008, 08:06 AM
For me, it's not the flash of an explosion around an enemy ship that has meaning, it's that I have an interest in seeing that particular ship stopped, or its fictional crew obliterated, and on that note ...

ahhh I wish I could have said that. :)
I know exactly what you're saying, and this feeling has waned completely after the Siege
the only race who still has that effect on me are the Genii, but to be honest not so much now that Kolya and Cowen are gone.

Betelgeuze
April 26th, 2008, 08:11 AM
The last season of Atlantis was the best so far imo. I think that Atlantis has gotten deeper in the later seasons. The Wraith have gone from rather superficial bad guys to more interesting antagonists as their nature and culture is explored in more depth.

SG-1 has definitely gotten deeper in the last two seasons. The Ori and their worsippers are far more familliar enemies than the Goa'uld. The later seasons of SG-1 deal with much deeper issues such as the importance of freedom of choice and the dangers of fanaticism and indoctrination.

Mitchell82
April 26th, 2008, 11:58 AM
The last season of Atlantis was the best so far imo. I think that Atlantis has gotten deeper in the later seasons. The Wraith have gone from rather superficial bad guys to more interesting antagonists as their nature and culture is explored in more depth.

SG-1 has definitely gotten deeper in the last two seasons. The Ori and their worsippers are far more familliar enemies than the Goa'uld. The later seasons of SG-1 deal with much deeper issues such as the importance of freedom of choice and the dangers of fanaticism and indoctrination.
Agreed. While each season of both shows has been great in their own right both shows got more exciting year after year.

Pitry
April 26th, 2008, 01:20 PM
The last season of Atlantis was the best so far imo. I think that Atlantis has gotten deeper in the later seasons. The Wraith have gone from rather superficial bad guys to more interesting antagonists as their nature and culture is explored in more depth.

SG-1 has definitely gotten deeper in the last two seasons. The Ori and their worsippers are far more familliar enemies than the Goa'uld. The later seasons of SG-1 deal with much deeper issues such as the importance of freedom of choice and the dangers of fanaticism and indoctrination.

I dunno. THat was definitely what I thought udirng season 9 but then season 10 came along and it felt all the great potential of the Orii disappeared - a part of the problem was, in fact, that there was a lot of depth, in my opinion, and a lot of thoughtr at the question of the first half of season 9 - how do you kill ascened beings, ie real gods. How do you fight them. But they kinda cheated their way out of this question with one episode and concentrating on the "real" fights with their warriors...