Replicating Ships

[Asuran]

I've always wondered this. Since we have the asgard replicator tech, cant we just replicate whole ships instead of just parts? Maybe some of the complex things we wont be able to replicate (hyperdrives) but shouldnt we be able to replicate the body of the ship and most of the computers?

[123NotIt]

i imagine the replicator pad needed would be too big to be practical, or the energy and raw conversion material requirements would be too enormous for something on that scale. i can still still see converters used to create parts or hull segments for final assembly though. even that would speed up build time tremendously.

[2ndgenerationalteran]

i believe we could do this, in ex dues machina we were easily able to beam an entire building into space and rematerializing it perfectly enough that the bomb still detonated on time. I'm sure we can scan all of our blue prints and even use the asgard blue prints in their data base to create ships with realative ease.

[Wraith_Boy]

I've always wondered this. Since we have the asgard replicator tech, cant we just replicate whole ships instead of just parts? Maybe some of the complex things we wont be able to replicate (hyperdrives) but shouldnt we be able to replicate the body of the ship and most of the computers?

They won't be able to do it like that because they'd be able to chuck out whole craploads of ships in no time at all! The writers always have them struggling in the ship dept, keeping the numbers low to give the enemies the advantage. So I don't ever expect them to be able to throw out ships like the Asgard, or even the Asurans (which seemed more impressive in that 20/30+ ships were getting done in the space of a couple of months).

They may be able to replicate small parts, but I can't honestly ever see the writers giving them a huge industrial sized replicator that allows them to throw ships off an assembly line. Would be cool if they did but not really realistic.

Also I don't personally believe that's how the Asgard made their ships. The O'Neill was unfinished. So if it was done in a single go, then it should have been already built. What I think they do is replicate all the individual parts on the ground. Then start beaming the pieces together in a dock situated in the air. They then put Asgard on board to check out all the systems to make sure they are working etc before the ship goes into service. Still the ships should be very quick to be constructed, just testing the individual systems throughout the ship would take up most of the time in the build. They probably have a central computer core to diagnose problems. However for safety reasons everything would need to be inspected manually prior to active operations just incase the diagnostic system was malfunctioning. You go into combat, the system was wrong & you get everyone killed & the ship destroyed.

i imagine the replicator pad needed would be too big to be practical, or the energy and raw conversion material requirements would be too enormous for something on that scale. i can still still see converters used to create parts or hull segments for final assembly though. even that would speed up build time tremendously.

If they have the Asgard replication technology, then they also have ther power generation technology. So there shouldn't be any problems in doing it exactly like the Asgard did. Even easier if you can tie in a ZPM or a whole bunch of MKII Naquadah generators to give the standard powersource a little boost.

Such a thing would probably needed to be done off-world though. Dont think there was anywhere in the air back on Earth that they could build a construction dock like what was seen in 'Small Victories'. I'd love to see an aircraft flying by, when a blinding flash suddenly develops, they look in astonishment as this 500+m part of the ship is sitting staring them right in the face. They couldn't do it in space because they'd be spotted by people who don't know about the Stargate.

Best place would be the possible closest empty planet to Earth that can support human life. They then can use it solely for construction. Build a crapload of Neutrino Ion generators, then replicating systems all over the planet. Chuck ships out as fast as they can, then very quickly they'll have the best fleet in multiple galaxies. Ready & waiting the next time the bad guys come looking for a fight in their big fancy ships.

[Emperor Tippy]

They won't be able to do it like that because they'd be able to chuck out whole craploads of ships in no time at all! The writers always have them struggling in the ship dept, keeping the numbers low to give the enemies the advantage. So I don't ever expect them to be able to throw out ships like the Asgard, or even the Asurans (which seemed more impressive in that 20/30+ ships were getting done in the space of a couple of months).

Thats an out of show reason. What is an in show reason they can't do it?

They may be able to replicate small parts, but I can't honestly ever see the writers giving them a huge industrial sized replicator that allows them to throw ships off an assembly line. Would be cool if they did but not really realistic.

Actually, it would be quite realistic. Obscenely powerful? Yes. Show ruining? Yes. Unrealistic in the SGverse? No.

Also I don't personally believe that's how the Asgard made their ships.
<snip>

Yes, well the Asgard were not known for intelligently using their tech. I mean the Asgard could have crushed the Ori with 1 ship and around 30 secodns worth of time. Properly using time dilation in battle would make you unbeatable.

As for safety checks, the matter reconfiguration machine is assembling these things on the atomic scale, every one will be exactly the same. They could turn cow dung into O'Neill class ships if they were inclined.

The real fun happens when you make a large ship in space with both beaming tech and matter reconfiguration systems. You fly it over an uninhabited planet and it starts beaming the planet up and turning the matter into more useful things. It makes the Starwars World Devastators look like flies. Oh and you can also use all of the trash on a planet or in space.

[IcyNeko]

Uhh let me see.. power requirements?

It takes considerably less power to stream matter from one point to another versus creating something from nothing. The matter used to create all the tech and intricate components on the replicated starship have to come from SOMEWHERE. It's either going to be converted from the ship's energy core, which is very energy-expensive, or you have to be pulling it from a planet nearby, converting it to usable form, and then going from there.

As you've all pointed out, yes, we can replicate hand-held weapons that are very complex. It took a WHILE for the computer to even simulate out how to construct the device. And that's a hand-held weapon. On an asgard science vessel. Now apply that concept to a starship, which is at least 20,000 times larger.

When the matter stream beams a building from one point to another, it doesn't have to recreate the design. It just passes the stream from buffer to emitter.

So please, for the love of god, stop using that episode as evidence that "YEW CAN BUILD FLEATS OF SHIPS HUR HUR". Because you can't. They don't even do this in Trek. It's explicitely mentioned in the Next Generation manual why you can't.

[Emperor Tippy]

Uhh let me see.. power requirements?

It takes considerably less power to stream matter from one point to another versus creating something from nothing. The matter used to create all the tech and intricate components on the replicated starship have to come from SOMEWHERE. It's either going to be converted from the ship's energy core, which is very energy-expensive, or you have to be pulling it from a planet nearby, converting it to usable form, and then going from there.

As you've all pointed out, yes, we can replicate hand-held weapons that are very complex. It took a WHILE for the computer to even simulate out how to construct the device. And that's a hand-held weapon. On an asgard science vessel. Now apply that concept to a starship, which is at least 20,000 times larger.

When the matter stream beams a building from one point to another, it doesn't have to recreate the design. It just passes the stream from buffer to emitter.

So please, for the love of god, stop using that episode as evidence that "YEW CAN BUILD FLEATS OF SHIPS HUR HUR". Because you can't. They don't even do this in Trek. It's explicitely mentioned in the Next Generation manual why you can't.

What power requirements? Beaming goes matter -> energy -> to target -> to matter. Matter reconfiguration really shouldn't be power intensive. Matter creation is though.

As for designing the ship/weapon, that is fairly easy. You already need computer models of that detail level before you start building the ship the regular way, you just feed them into the computer and tell it to spit out matter in that configuration.

[IcyNeko]

What power requirements? Beaming goes matter -> energy -> to target -> to matter. Matter reconfiguration really shouldn't be power intensive. Matter creation is though.

The "Power requirements" part was in response to why we can't replicate fleets.

As for designing the ship/weapon, that is fairly easy. You already need computer models of that detail level before you start building the ship the regular way, you just feed them into the computer and tell it to spit out matter in that configuration.

Uh no. I think not.

This isn't auto-cad. When using matter-creation (which is what we're doing here, folks, stop kidding yourselves), you need all elements captured on the sub-atomic level. That requires precision. Extreme precision.

[Mick^]

Could also be computational bottlenecks also, its why i believe creating the matter from raw energy may be easier(computationally speaking(Getting the quantum states of the matter into the computer and shuffling them all around must take one insane CPU and RAM solution!)) than resequencing the matter in a transport buffer on a large scale and spitting out something new as a finalised product. Using it to create smaller items and weapons(crystals etc) A OK by me, synthesising large/structural features of ships is impractical at best.

[Emperor Tippy]

Uh no. I think not.

This isn't auto-cad. When using matter-creation (which is what we're doing here, folks, stop kidding yourselves), you need all elements captured on the sub-atomic level. That requires precision. Extreme precision.

Um, it really should pretty much be like Auto-CAD. You don't need to design the object on the atomic level, atom by atom. You can Auto-CAD it and then say make this part X material, this part Y material, etc. The matter reconfiguration device handles all of the precision work, you just tell it what the final product is supposed to look like (in great detail).

As a side not if you build 1 thing the regular way you can beam it to somewhere else and just copy its pattern from the buffer, add more energy and tell it to pop out more copies.

[AvatarIII]

Could also be computational bottlenecks also, its why i believe creating the matter from raw energy may be easier(computationally speaking(Getting the quantum states of the matter into the computer and shuffling them all around must take one insane CPU and RAM solution!)) than resequencing the matter in a transport buffer on a large scale and spitting out something new as a finalised product. Using it to create smaller items and weapons(crystals etc) A OK by me, synthesising large/structural features of ships is impractical at best.

but as 2ndGA said, a 304 can transport an entire building

i believe we could do this, in ex dues machina we were easily able to beam an entire building into space and rematerializing it perfectly enough that the bomb still detonated on time. I'm sure we can scan all of our blue prints and even use the asgard blue prints in their data base to create ships with realative ease.

although making matter from energy is not efficient,
1 kilogram of matter is equal to 89,875,517,873,681,764 Joules
and how much do you think a 304 weighs?

[Emperor Tippy]

although making matter from energy is not efficient,
1 kilogram of matter is equal to 89,875,517,873,681,764 Joules
and how much do you think a 304 weighs?

Thats why you beam up some random matter, garbage for instance. Or perhaps some green house gases. That matter is turned into energy and then into the matter you want.

[AvatarIII]

thats a good point, perfect recycling, i like that!

you could probably create zpm equivalent power with enough

[jds1982]

thats a good point, perfect recycling, i like that!

you could probably create zpm equivalent power with enough

Except of course you'd be using energy to turn matter into energy, and then back into matter. You'd always be operating at a net energy loss.

[Crazy Tom]

As i see it:
If u can't make realy bog things, then have a whole bunch of smaler replicators dishing out parts.
i think for waht we are talking a bout, yes, u would have to pay attention to details and everything, but once that is done and alllowing for power requirements u can start roling out ships on a almost dayly basis.