Suggestions for ZPM's(beware spoiler of Unending SG1)

[linus22]

Hey, i've seen in SG1 10x20 that carter can "copy" everything they need using the modified beaming technology, how about duplicating ZPMs ?(4 for Atlantis, one for Daedalus, 2 for Odysseus,1 for appolo and 1 for earth)

[SaberBlade]

It's never been stated what can exactly be created with it.

It's possible that the ZPMs are just too complex to just be materialised. It's possible, but hard to say at the moment until the PTB's decide on how mucb of the Asgard tech we can use effectively

[genius21]

we can use all of the asgard knowleadge for 2 reasons:

1:the database is much easy'er to understand, find and work with like is seen in unending (carter finds the way to adjust the transport beam)

2:The asgard AI that is build in the computer core (seen in unending THOR helping carter)


but i do believe they can not make a zpm becouse it's to complex and they need the blueprint/schematics from a zpm and upload it to de asgard database and otherwise the asgard would have done it.

[B O Y S C O U T]

They could but it wouldn't work, ZPM's draw their power from portions of subspace right? So If you were to create an exact copy of a ZPM wouldn't it be drawing power from the same portion of subspace and just run out twice as fast?

[B O Y S C O U T]

Besides that linus22, your ZPM distribution is all wacked lol

[Ravroz]

If they could just use asgard technology to replicate zpm's then wouldn't the asgard have been able to manufacture them a long time ago?

[marty2006]

I doubt that the replecator thing will be able to recreate everything its a far to easy way to end our problems, must realise by now that everything we get something bigger harder and more evil arrives to rival us.

[fugiman]

I'm sure you could make a deplted ZPM but to put energy into the ZPM would take energy out of the Asgard Core in the first place thus making a ZPM but losing power for Asgard Core thus making it worthless to replicate a ZPM

[genius21]

what i'm wondering is what kind of knowleadge, blueprints and schematics are stored in the database.

replicating a zpm is not possible and most are right if possible the asgard would have done it.

[monkey_man132]

That would make Atlantis (and Earth) too powerful and would ruin the whole "Struggling-Against-A-Greater-Enemy" plot of both shows.

[PunCra]

My First post.

You can create a ZPM with the materialization technology BUT it would need atleast power of a whole ZPM to create just one ZPM. You just can't create stuff out of nothing. Well of course you could create an empty ZPM with little energy but whats the point in that.

[K-9]

Here`s my post from another thread with a similar discussion in it.

This talk of creating ZPM's is something that has been mentioned in the past, leading to the the usual comments on how the laws of thermodynamics (specifically number 2) prohibit such an activity.

This generally follows through as one person mentioning that we should make a ZPM, followed by the comment that ZPM's harness quite enormous amounts of energy such that creating a fully charged ZPM is not a feasible option. This of course either in reference to, or by direct explanation of, the second law of thermodynamics.

As clarification at this point - the explanation being that it would require more energy to create the ZPM than it would produce, due to the limitations of entropy.

While by all means not all arguments are made in this fashion, a good number that I have seen here are. But there is an inherent flaw to this argument, and actually in this entire mode of thinking.

A "fully charged ZPM" is essentially one that can draw on the vacuum energy of an "unused" (as it were) artificial region of subspace time. As such, it is of no purpose to attempt to "recharge" a ZPM. Once the zero point energy is used up then it is in a sense time to move on.

But recharging a ZPM is clearly not the same situation as creating a new ZPM. This is demonstrated in that it does not require the energy of a ZPM to create a new ZPM. Otherwise it would be fairly pointless to create, and thus the creation of a ZPM must be performed in such a way that it will provide energy. This can be thought of in the same way that it does not take the power of a nuclear reactor to create a nuclear reactor used to harness the energy of uranium. Otherwise, it would be pointless to build a nuclear reactor.

In actual fact, the energy expenditure involved is in creating the means by which the energy will be "extracted" from the uranium. This is analogous to building the ZPM which will extract the energy from the subspace time. It is not the ZPM structure itself that contains the energy, but the energy is produced due to the ability of extraction from the subspace time it contains. Which again is the same way in which a nuclear reactor itself doesn't contain power, but generates it from the uranium contained within.

The power generated from the ZPM thus comes from extraction of zero point energy of the vacuum, just as the power in a nuclear reactor come from extraction of energy from uranium. The self-contained artificial region of subspace time is the key.

Thus, claims (again not made by all, but by some) that you can not generate a ZPM due to limitations imposed by the second law of thermodynamics are inaccurate. When claiming this roadblock to production of ZPM's, this must be in oversight of that fact that ZPM's were created and presumably through using less power than they produce. Though it would be correct to say that you cannot "recharge" a ZPM due to this effect, unless you can effectively replace the region of subspace time (though this is a different matter entirely).

To summarize, it does not take more energy than a ZPM contains, and thus does not violate the second law of thermodynamics, to generate a ZPM in the same way that a nuclear reactor is built in used. So too, ZPM's were able to be built and used. But the second law does not allow for the "recharging" of a ZPM without expending more energy (if "recharging" is even possible"). This is why a ZPM becomes essentially worthless when it reaches "maximum entropy".

While there are no great implications that come forth from this discussion, I hope this has somewhat clarified what has appeared to me to be a murky concept to some. I am not claiming that this explains or allows for proposed methods of production, but merely explaining a concept that has been incorrectly spoken of.

[genius21]

even if earth/atlantis can make zpm's then they are not all powerfull.

if the wraith come full force what do we have a few drones and a shield they bombart the shield drain it and destroy atlantis.

same for the asurans.

we have nothing that can stop them before that we now have what 2 ships in atlantis and they can barely win against the wraith, and then the asurans they won now becouse they didn't expect the attack but they damaged atlantis and got it to leave.

even with zpm's and asgard upgrades and knowleadge were still the underdog.

[PunCra]

K-9 has a point but so did I. Using materialization tech it creates stuff from energy. Creating a ZPM this way you would need to create the artificial subspace region aswell. Creating a ZPM shell doesn't magically create an artificial subspace region. So you have to either use other methods to create a ZPM or use more than a power of a ZPM to materialize one(which is really stupid move as you won't gain anything).

[wise one]

well u could make a zpm shell but getting the energy is another thing