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donnie_darko
August 24th, 2004, 03:25 AM
Let’s do a system check on the X-303/BC-303/Prometheus, a previous version made by me on the Delphi forums but was incomplete. I have added more info and sources; beware of SPOILERS ranging from every season 1-7. If I am missing some information, need more elaboration or have gotten something wrong please post a reply.

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donnie_darko
August 24th, 2004, 03:27 AM
Power System:
Naquadria Reactor - The main power system of the X303 uses the rare mineral isotope Naquadria a variant of Naquadah (521-Meridian,714-Fall Out), it produces a high power output but becomes very unstable and dangerous in proportion to the amount of power being produced (601-Redemption Part 1). The reactor can provide power to all systems running at full power. It is capable of powering the Hyperspace Window Generator (Hyperdrive) and is integrated with it, making the lost of the reactor the lost of faster than light travel. The reactor is modular in design and can eject in emergency cases. (611-Prometheus, 620-Memento)

Buffer - A subsystem of the Naquadria reactor, used to manage power fluctuations. While capable of managing the power fluctuation of the reactor alone, with the added energy of an external source it can burn out. The buffer is not needed for the Naquadria reactor to function but is needed to prevent an uncontrolled chain reaction. (620-Memento)

Reactor Control System - Using feedback controls, adjustments and active/passive safety system, the changes in temperature, reaction, pressure, and flow can be managed. Normal active/passive systems can manage small changes automatically and manual systems can handle large variation over time but a large variation in a short amount of time tends to damage the control system and without a buffer to release the excess power, this can lead to an uncontrolled chain reaction. (620-Memento)

Naquadah Reactor(S) (?) - The auxiliary power system of the X303 using Naquadah, it produces a stable high power output under normal conditions. The reactor(S) can provide power to normal systems but not energy weapons, shields and Hyperdrive. The Naquadah reactor(S) has its own control system but does not seem to have a buffer system because it has a very stable power output. (305-Learning Curve, 409-Scorched Earth, 503-Ascension)

Batteries/Reserve(S) (?) - The final power system of the X303 is series of batteries and capacitors. The batteries are kept charged and used when power fails or, as an extra boost is needed. The capacitors provide a quick store of energy for weapons and shields. Batteries tend to be lead acid but in cold temperatures they don't perform, well so regenerative fuel cells are most likely used. Regenerative Fuel Cells (RFC) use hydrogen and oxygen (air) to produce electricity, water, and heat. The water, with another energy source like thermal or solar energy, can then be can be broken back into hydrogen and oxygen and feedback into the cell. This cycle is better suited to space than any other battery. They also operate at a better temperature range than acid based cells, -20°C to 120°C temps.

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donnie_darko
August 24th, 2004, 03:28 AM
Propulsion Systems:
Hyperdrive - The main drive system of the X303, it allows the generation of a Hyperspace Window, a way of entering another space/time configuration (Subspace/Hyperspace). This is a point-to-point way of travel meaning that you can't turn and change course in mid-flight, you have to exit hyperspace to change direction. By using hyperspace, we can travel faster than light without traveling at faster than light speeds. In order to stay in hyperspace you need to create a continuous distortion field or you will reemerge into regular space/time (real space). The hyperdrive, based on our understanding of Goa'uld hyperdrive technology, is still crude compared to Goa'uld or Asgard designs. The hyperdrive has a buffer to manage the unstable power form the Naquadria reactor. The generator is modular in design that can be ejected in emergency cases. Other power sources do not produce enough power for the drive.(1) A Goa'uld hyperdrive can be replace our hyperdrive but the only ship which with a hyperdrive small enough and powerful enough for the x303 is the Al'Kesh. However, since the Al'Kesh hyperdrive was designed for a ship 1/10 the size it is limited in speed and has to cool down after prolonged use. (611-Prometheus, 620-Memento, 713-Grace, 709-Avenger 2.0)The Prometheus now has Asgard designed engines a gift for helping them with the Replicators. It is unknown the range of the engines but since they are Asgard designed they should be Intergalactic speeds. But do to our power limitations we might be limited to high intragalactice speeds.

Unidirectional Force System (?) - This system is used in the Death Glider and other Goa'uld ships. It is unknown what make this drive system works. However, we know that we can't fit our version of this system in the X302 since we have human drive systems there. Ships with this drive system do not have large exhaust nozzles. (2) (601-Redemption Part 1)

Sub-Light Drive (?) - The second drive system of the X303, it allows the acceleration of to speeds near light speed (c). But due to the relativistic effects of near light speeds, travel speeds are limited to .25 to .5 c. it is unknown what type of technology is used in this drive system. Chemical burning systems are out of the question, the X303 does not carry large amounts of solid/liquid fuel, and rockets do not reach the speeds reported. At high sub-slight speeds, particles impacting the hull will cause lots of damage so a shielding or deflection device is needed. In addition, inertia dampeners would have to be used to accelerate very fast without killing the crew or tearing apart the ship. The drive system is similar to the Al'Kesh system, but we don't know what the Al'Kesh uses. There are two possibilities, the Ion drive system, and the Impulse drive system. (611-Prometheus)

In an Ion drive system a constant stream of ions are released accelerating the craft, this drive system still needs a propellant of some kind probably some kind of gas like xenon or hydrogen. Our current Ion drive systems do not provide enough thrust to use on a ship like the X303. However, we have and Al’Kesh and Hebridan drive to study. (618-Forsaken, 709-Avenger 2.0, 708-Space Race)

The Impulse drive system uses the controlled reaction (explosion) of (fusion, fission, matter/anti-matter) to push the ship. A continuous series of close reactions are need for constant acceleration. A human model of this drive has not been built but research is still being done.

Deceleration/Maneuvering/Directional thrusters (?) - A part of the sub-light drive system. From what we know, it does not seem to be based upon chemical rockets or a propellant system. It is probably based upon the Unidirectional Force System of the death gliders/pyramid ship, which allows them to move with out jet engines or rockets in space. Although in Unnatural Selection the thrusters were fired indication some kind of propellant system, but this could be just a standard phrases used to indicate the thruster are used. (612-Unnatural Selection)

Vertical Lift Drive (Anti-Gravity System) (?) - Another sub-light system that allows the ship to move vertically to take off or to hover above a location.

Inertial Dampeners - This subsystem of the drive systems helps lessen the effect of accelerating high mass and accelerating quickly. This system does not create a force to move but removes inertia from the ship. The system removes about ~80% of the inertia of a ship at maximum setting. At low accelerating the dampeners, do not need to be set on high only for high acceleration. This would make the g-forces feel like a fast elevator ride. (611-Prometheus, 612-Unnatural Selection, 703-Fragile Balance)

Drive Control System (0) - The drive systems can be controlled from the main bridge controls or the engine room.

Landing-Struts - used in ground landing, this gives the ship the ability for not only space assault but close ground assaults as well. (612-Unnatural Selection)

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donnie_darko
August 24th, 2004, 03:29 AM
Weapons :(?)
Missile (?) - The X303 carries a number of missiles for offensive and defensive means. Since this ship was designed by the United States Air force, standard missiles and armaments are available for ship use. They would have to be augmented to be used in space, with different warheads and with anti-Goa'uld systems.

There would be long range missiles used in orbit to bombard planets or to hit targets at a long distance, short range missiles meant to be used against ships or ground forces. Depending on the force needed a standard warhead or Naquadria/Naquadah enhanced can be used. They can be equipped with shield frequency modulator to penetrate shields of ships. The X303 has six rear and four front missile tubes. This gives it excellent front and backfiring arcs. (611-Prometheus, 713-Grace)

Point Defense Weapons (?) - These weapons are primarily used as defensive means. The X303 carries Anti-Aircraft guns for close range defense and to target ground targets. It is unknown what type of weapon is used in this system could be a standard AA gun, a rail gun design or even energy based weapons. Tracers are frequently used to track weapons fire. Most are mounted on turrets to give it wide firing arcs and the ability to track targets. (722-The Lost City Part 2)

Energy Weapon (?) - The X303 is equipped with weapons based on Asgard and Goa'uld designs. They are most likely bolt type weapons of plasma or other charged particles.

Jamming Weapon (?) - A Goa'uld system jamming that can block the control signal used by most Goa'uld control devices. (715-Chimera)

Shields (?) - The shields on the X303 are based on Asgard designs and are made to withstand Goa'uld weapons. In order for the shields to be effective, they need to be kept constantly charged. The shields are also responsible to keep the ship together, and to deflect particles at high sub-slight speeds. Also, the effectiveness of shield in an atmosphere is less than in space. (722-The Lost City Part 2)

Sensors - the sensor array of the X303 can scan a wide range of frequencies, energies and distortions from visual, radio, subspace and gravity. (The range is unknown)

Communication - the communications systems can transmit and receive on multiple frequencies, it is unknown if it has sub-space capabilities. (But if it did then it would not have been so easily lost)

Ring-transport - A direct lift of technology from the Goa'uld/Ancients, one of the completly alien systems on the X303. It allows the transport of matter from one location to another set of rings, the rings are also mobile so the can travel from ship to surface.

Asgard transport beam - A gift from the Asgard for helping them with their Replicators problem. This transport system can take you from any location to the ship with out any other device, you still need to go to the ship to transport to another location.
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donnie_darko
August 24th, 2004, 03:30 AM
Life Support :(?) (I'm, thinking that a ship like a submarine rather than a battle ship would be a model for the life support needs of a spaceship)
Atmosphere - the ship needs to be able to maintain minimal levels to keep the crew alive. A mixed atmosphere is used rather than pure oxygen.
Pressure control - normal sea level pressure.
Temperature control - temperature of 70 - 80 F.
Recycler - filters out the CO2 and other gasses from the air.
Circulator - keeps the air from becoming stale and moves the air around the ship.

Hull/Structure support - The hull, frame, and bulkheads of the X303 are made of a Trinium alloys. The entire ship has access tubes and junctions for all ship systems. There are several decks (number unknown) and compartments of the ship, the rear drive, forward, command and engineering, sections as well as cargo bays and launch bays for X302s fighters and large enough for a cargo ship. Decks and compartments can be individually pressurized. (713-Grace) There are heat/radiation/impact absorbent and insulation layers that make up the outer hull. There must also be some heavily armored areas of the ship for important systems.

Refrigeration systems - keeps the food stores fresh

Water/Waste Recycler - recycles the water/waste used by the crew, bathrooms (should they be uni-sex ?), etc.

Gravity - this provides gravity for the ship, but the ship is designed for non-gravity use in case of complete loss of gravity. The halls have hand holds and the chairs have seat belts.

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donnie_darko
August 24th, 2004, 03:32 AM
Computer/Control systems: Most systems on the X303 are a combination of chips and wirers and crystal technology. It is only recently that we have been able to combine the two to work together. Since the ship was build with as little alien tech as possible (ring transport, shields, some weapons not included) we must have a stable supply of crystals or can make them ourselves. It is apparent to me that the crystal technology is a form of quantum storage/processing being able to move and manipulate energy very fast. (611-Prometheus, 713-Grace)

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donnie_darko
August 24th, 2004, 03:32 AM
Other:

X302 - The X302 is a fighter interceptor made to take on ships like the bomber, cargo and death gliders (with special weapons it can disable/destroy mother ships with shield frequency modulator Naquadah enhanced missiles (AIM-120) and micro-jumps(small hyper-space jumps) through the shield)(701-Fallen, 412-Tangent). This ship was a test for many of the systems used in the x303, like the Hyperdrive, Inertial Dampeners, Control Crystals, Anti-gravity, etc. It has four engines jet, high altitudes, rockets and the Hyperdrive (limited to short bursts). The inertial dampeners lessen the effects of high accelerations, and G-forces making it the fastest and most maneuverable ship build to date. It is also air and space flight capable. The ship in the short run will out performs the Goa’uld death glider in speed and maneuverability but due to the solid/liquid fuel used in the engines in the long run a Goa'uld death glider would win. I it is like other modern fighters it can refuel in the air. The weapons of the X302 also have a longer range and are more accurate than their Goa'uld counterparts are but the X302 does not have energy weapons yet so the fighter is limited in how much time it can fire rockets and guns. (Feldger needs to stop daydreaming about Carter, get his ass into gear, and make that plasma weapon work!) The prototype was designed and made at Area 51 completely backward engineered from Goa'uld technology, we currently have ~20 (I tried to count all of them from the 722-The Lost City Part 2 but could not, and how many in a fleet of ships according to the Air force?)

Naquadah - First discovered in the analyst of the Stargate, the mineral substance is capable of high-energy reactions greater than Plutonium or Uranium. It does not emit high levels of radiation in its normal state and is not normally toxic. There are several forms of the substance raw, liquid, refined, and weapons grade. There is also a heavy version of the mineral, which might be a stable isotope form (see Naquadria). The mineral is capable of bonding to biological molecules facilitating the use of most Goa'uld technology, in fact the Goa'uld have it in their blood. We have several mining operations that supply or need of ore and processing.

Naquadria - variant of Naquadah should not be mistaken for heavy Naquadah, it is a much heavier and much more unstable isotope. During an accidental explosion, the sub-atomic particles released caused a chain reaction with the Naquadah depots in the ground and converted it into more Naquadria. The only planet where it is found is Langara. At first the deposits created in the first explosion was completely mined but due to the first test and use of the Naquadria bomb more deposits have formed (714-Fall Out).

Steps to make Naquadria:
1: Find large Naquadah deposits. (Or build underground bunkers and fill them with Naquadah)
2: Set off a small Naquadria bomb over the area. (Make sure you don't blow up the planet or set off the Naquadah in the ground)
3: Wait a few years for the deposits to change.
4: Mine the deposits.

Trinium - 100X stronger and lighter than steel, first found by Captain Conner and SG-11 on the PX4807 (213-Spirits), it is used in the construction of all advance space crafts and weapons systems.(611-Prometheus,509-Between Two Fires, 401-Small Victories) The SGC have several mining operation that supply our need of ore and processing.(509-Between Two Fires)

NOTES:
(###-Title) Season/Ep. - Title
(S) Not sure if there are one or many, more likely more than one
(?) Means that not much info on the subject lots of guess work here.
(0) Crystal technology and human technology to interface the control systems and systems.
(1) Most systems on the X303 can be powered by the auxiliary power systems except energy weapons, shields, and Hyperdrive. Remember that the more power you try to draw from the Naquadria reactor the more unstable, so you would want to keep power demand low on the system. That is why we have a secondary power system although for full use of all systems at the same time the Naquadria reactor will have to be used.
(2)The Goa'uld glider, cargo, and pyramid ships have no large exhaust nozzles only the midrange bomber.

http://www.gateworld.net/omnipedia/index.shtml
http://www.stargate-tech.net/

Mio
August 24th, 2004, 04:10 AM
It's the first Sci-Fi space ship I've ever seen with seatbelts....

donnie_darko
August 24th, 2004, 12:54 PM
The show has made many comments on how advance races tend not to have simple but expected devices. Many times Jack would ask where the extra chairs were or seatbelts. Even we fall prey to this with our own ship the X303, we don't carry extra parts for the buffer, the most important part on the ship, in case of break down. But it is expected of us we are not as advance as other alien races but I expect more from other so called advance races.

Mio
August 24th, 2004, 12:55 PM
The show has made many comments on how advance races tend not to have simple but expected devices. Many times Jack would ask where the extra chairs were or seatbelts. Even we fall prey to this with our own ship the X303, we don't carry extra parts for the buffer, the most important part on the ship, in case of break down. But it is expected of us we are not as advance as other alien races but I expect more from other so called advance races.
We weren't supposed to drive the ship through...what was it? A collapsing star?

donnie_darko
August 24th, 2004, 01:01 PM
We drove through the gravity waves of an collapsing star. This is understandable since we don't have a complete map of the galaxy for safe hyperspace travel. Once we maped out the areas of safe travel away from black holes, collapsing stars, stange gas clouds and evil aliens we won't make the same mistake again.

UltraMarioMan
August 24th, 2004, 02:42 PM
I've always wondered how would the Prometheus fair in a one on one fight with a Goa'uld Mothership.

donnie_darko
August 24th, 2004, 11:34 PM
Prometheus VS Ha'Tak pyramid ship
Winner Prometheus
*****I am using a final version of the BC-303, full hyperdrive, shield and weapons capabilities. This includes the addition of energy weapons and full power from the reactors.******

In a one on one fight with a Ha’Tak ship, the Prometheus wins easily. As we seen, an attack from a distance of slow moving missiles is not effective; the other ship has time to take out our missiles. Therefore, we will be using our own energy weapons and Asgard weapons at close range. The energy weapons being developed are based on Goa'uld designs so they would be on par weapons wise. However, due to our superior shields and the Asgard weapons we would last longer with out major damage

Prometheus VS Ha'Tak pyramid ship + Death gliders
Winner Prometheus
Same stats. As above, the battle will take more time because of more targets our missile defense would take out most of the gliders before they come into range. We would have light damage.

Prometheus VS Ha'Tak pyramid ship + Death gliders + Al'Kesh support
Winner Prometheus
Same as above, the Prometheus would have heavy damage.

Prometheus VS Ha'Tak pyramid ship + Death gliders + Al'Kesh support + Command Ship
Winner Goa'uld, major damage to support ships and destruction of most gliders
Some damage to the Ha'Tak, no damage to Command ship
Same stats. However, due to the extra fire power from the Command Ship we would be taken out by sheer force.

Prometheus + 8 X302 VS Ha'Tak pyramid ship
Winner Prometheus, no damage

Prometheus + 8 X302 VS Ha'Tak pyramid ship + Death gliders
Winner Prometheus, light damage

Prometheus + 8 X302 VS Ha'Tak pyramid ship + Death gliders + Al'Kesh support
Winner Prometheus, light damage, loss of fighters

Prometheus + 8 X302 VS Ha'Tak pyramid ship + Death gliders + Al'Kesh support + Command Ship
*Winner Prometheus, major damage or destruction of ship due to suicide run loss of all fighters
*Winner Goa'uld, loss or damage to all glider squads and major damage to Al'Kesh and Ha'Tak light damage to Command Ship.

This is just a quick study of possible situations. Some may be too positive or completely off the mark.

DownFallAngel
August 25th, 2004, 09:19 AM
Wow. Thats a really nice big chunk of info there.

But I still want to know one thing. Why did they change from the X-303 to the BC303?

aAnubiSs
August 25th, 2004, 10:18 AM
eXperimental

donnie_darko
August 25th, 2004, 10:22 AM
The X are for experimental, BC is Bomber Transport, once the X303 the experimental craft was completed and become the prototype for other ships it was given the BC.
But because it is the prototype and a spaceplance it should be YBCS-3.

It is also the same for the X302/F-302 should be known as FS-2.

http://www.designation-systems.net/usmilav/aircraft.html

Great info on the X303
http://www.stargate-tech.net/starships/earth/x303.htm
Info on ships

donnie_darko
August 25th, 2004, 09:20 PM
http://www.stargate3d.fsnet.co.uk/X303show.htm
This has some nice pics. Trying to find some 3d mods.

aAnubiSs
August 25th, 2004, 09:23 PM
you've checked www.scifi-meshes.com right?

donnie_darko
August 25th, 2004, 10:00 PM
I did a search and found some gate meshes but not any x303s. I might try and make one but I'm a novice at 3D art, and my texture skills lack the real life style and look. It would look like someone painted some boxes gray.

aAnubiSs
August 25th, 2004, 10:41 PM
Well as a modeller-to-be I can tell you that the BC-303 isn't the model to start with ;) Try doing the Omega Destroyer or the Nova Deadnought from Babylon 5 to start with.

donnie_darko
August 29th, 2004, 10:07 PM
Spoilers Season 8 ep. 8 COVENANT (highlight to read)
We have confirmation that the private sector has been involved in the contraction the X302, Colson Inc. built the module that switches the X302 between atmospheric/space flight modes. This means that the construction of the X303 is also aided by the private sector.

donnie_darko
September 23rd, 2004, 07:36 PM
The Prometheus:
Spoilers S8

The Asgard have installed a site to site transport beam system on the Prometheus. The seem to be installing a new hyperdrive also.

Updated info to include Asgard help. Propulsion and Weapons Systems:

donnie_darko
December 6th, 2004, 12:23 PM
A rework of the guide will be posted as major information about the ship is revealed in the series, which is around the Prometheus Ep. in SG1, and the series end of Atlantis. If you would like me to add a category or correct me on something I wrote email me at: save_donnie_darko@yahoo.com

jenks
February 15th, 2005, 06:52 PM
The X are for experimental, BC is Bomber Transport, once the X303 the experimental craft was completed and become the prototype for other ships it was given the BC.
But because it is the prototype and a spaceplance it should be YBCS-3.

It is also the same for the X302/F-302 should be known as FS-2.

http://www.designation-systems.net/usmilav/aircraft.html

Great info on the X303
http://www.stargate-tech.net/starships/earth/x303.htm
Info on ships

BC stands for 'Battle Cruiser' , you find this out in '7x07 enemy mine'.

Tarrifist
February 15th, 2005, 07:34 PM
Hmmm, I remember, I think, that it was said that the 303 carries 8 squadrons of 302s. Not just eight 302s.

Anyone know which episode(s) that talk about the 302s on the 303?

donnie_darko
February 16th, 2005, 12:34 PM
BC stands for 'Battle Cruiser' , you find this out in '7x07 enemy mine'.
I use the US Tri Service naming scheme for aircraft and not the Navy system for ships, because it describes the ship more accuracy than the navy system. So depending on who you ask the BC can stand for Battle Cruiser or Bomber Transport, the Battle Cruiser people have series support on their side because in ep707 they name the ship type as battle cruiser.

ancient1978
February 17th, 2005, 08:56 AM
Hmmm, I remember, I think, that it was said that the 303 carries 8 squadrons of 302s. Not just eight 302s.

Anyone know which episode(s) that talk about the 302s on the 303?

How much aircrafts does a squadron have..Is it 8 or 12 per squadron??

Keffler
February 17th, 2005, 11:01 AM
Support Craft:
Hanger bays supporting 8 F-302 fighters or similar sized ships (Gliders can also dock).

NOT 8 SQUADRONS

Tarrifist
February 17th, 2005, 07:32 PM
How much aircrafts does a squadron have..Is it 8 or 12 per squadron??

Each nation may have different size squadrons.



Support Craft:
Hanger bays supporting 8 F-302 fighters or similar sized ships (Gliders can also dock).

NOT 8 SQUADRONS


I will keep an eye on this. Im pretty sure Major Davis said 8 squadrons. However, this may have be changed in later season.

Agent_Dark
February 17th, 2005, 07:46 PM
I will keep an eye on this. Im pretty sure Major Davis said 8 squadrons. However, this may have be changed in later season.
I seriously doubt it was 8 Squadrons. The F-302 is a fairly large fighter and the Prometheus defiantly isn't that big. 8 302's sounds alot more reasonable.

TheDarkLordAres
March 30th, 2005, 11:16 AM
I use the US Tri Service naming scheme for aircraft and not the Navy system for ships, because it describes the ship more accuracy than the navy system. So depending on who you ask the BC can stand for Battle Cruiser or Bomber Transport, the Battle Cruiser people have series support on their side because in ep707 they name the ship type as battle cruiser.
The USAF naming scheme isn't relevant. The SG writers as well as the characters IN the show have stated the BC stands for Battle Cruiser. Period.

Tarrifist
April 4th, 2005, 07:27 PM
I seriously doubt it was 8 Squadrons. The F-302 is a fairly large fighter and the Prometheus defiantly isn't that big. 8 302's sounds alot more reasonable.

Yep, saw the episode again some weeks back and it is 8 F302's. Wondering how I came up with 8 squadrons. :confused:

Panther
April 8th, 2005, 09:32 PM
It isn't a battle cruiser. A battle cruiser technically speaking is a cruiser sized ship with the armaments of a battleship. They were popular for a very short time in the early 20th century, as commerce raiders thought that wasn't their original role. They were to be a cheaper battleship class but it was discovered thanks to their thin armour they were next to useless in a proper fleet on fleet engagement. HMS Hood is a case in point, those poor pussers copped it good when a shell from the Bismark penetrated it's armour and exploded in the magazine. The ship went up like the 4th of July.

Since the Prometheus has a capability to launch two flights of fighters it automatically disqualifies it as a battlecruiser. It's a jack-of-all trades ship, and Bomber Transport is closer to it's capabilities than battlecruiser.

alaskannut
April 9th, 2005, 04:53 PM
Oh for the love of god people...it has been called a battlecruiser on both SG-1 and Atlantis....whether or not that is entirely appropriate is irrelevant since the shows take place in a fictional alternate universe which abides by the nomenclature that they (the creators of the show) have created/adapted for their own uses.....get used to it. Also, it is entirely inappropriate to apply USAF classifications to the Prometheus/Daedalus class as they are an entirely new paradigm unlike anything in current USAF OR USN service.....to even consider classifying them as bomber/transports is I'm sorry to say, utterly insane...if anything they should be classified battliers, but thats neither here nor there.

Note: battlier= BATTLeship-carrIER, and is an unofficial term very occasionally used to describe the Japanese Hyuga class battleships of WW2, as well as modifications to the USN Iowa class in the 80's that were not actually followed through on.

Panther
April 10th, 2005, 12:06 AM
Well no-one said the world was short of morons, have they?

gallywag
April 12th, 2005, 02:40 PM
if the promethus can hold 8 302's how come so many were ovea antarctica and u forgot to mention the control crystal that liks the alien and human tech together

Panther
April 12th, 2005, 04:06 PM
Well I do believe they mentioned an F302 Squadron. A squadron is anywhere from 14-24 planes depending on which country and unit it's from. 8 planes is just two flights, a (wingman+lead)x2 formation.

Tarrifist
April 13th, 2005, 09:53 PM
There must be more 302's than 8 by now. And the 302's range may be great and not need a lift from a BC303.

Panther
April 14th, 2005, 01:13 AM
Exactly my point. It seem the F302s in Antarctica probably flew escort for the Prometheus, in addition to the two flights stationed on board.

Also, I do believe the Hyuga classes were retrofits, and would therefore subscribe to the theory the name "Battleship-Carrier" would probably define as thus, and not any proper class of ship.

Gremalcon
April 22nd, 2005, 06:28 PM
The X are for experimental, BC is Bomber Transport,

If it was for bomber transport, it would be BT instead of BC. However, it stands for what the ship is, a Battle Cruiser, thus the BC. Also, the element is Naquadria, just an fyi.

As for the Daedalus, it is going to be an upgrade and that class will be the daedalus class ship. The prometheus was built for naquadria reactors, while the daedalus was designed around asgard neutrino-ion generators for hyper drive, along with asgard shields and weapons. It will be somewhat sleeker than the prometheus, though it will retain a similar shape. Earth still has to design for function instead of aesthetics. Though the daedalus is a 303, I believe it will carry significantly more f/a 302s than the prometheus.

Panther
April 22nd, 2005, 08:39 PM
NO! T stands for trainer! C is transport or literaly "Cargo".

And IT IS NOT A BATTLE CRUISER! This is has been enunciated in previous pages of this thread!

Chris O'Farrell
April 24th, 2005, 05:22 AM
NO! T stands for trainer! C is transport or literaly "Cargo".

And IT IS NOT A BATTLE CRUISER! This is has been enunciated in previous pages of this thread!

Easy Panther :)

I've been ticked off at the writers insisting the 303 class is a 'Battlecruiser'.

I live in hope that somewhere Sam and Daniel will have one of those 'walking through the base moments' where Sam almost absently corrects Daniel over calling Prometheus a Battle Cruiser. Causing Daniel to ask WHY does everyone call it a BC...and Carter just shrugs and says it sounds catchy.

Realisitcly the nearest contemporary equivilant to the 303 is a Russian Kiev or Kuznetsov class Cruiser.

And its 8 302's, not 8 sqadrons.

And I am sure Area-51 has produced more then 8 302's, even if Prometheus can't carry them all at one time. The Alpha Site would get an allocation, so would follow on 303s. Hammond almost certianly just took everything Area-51 had combat ready down South with him.

_Owen_
April 24th, 2005, 09:26 AM
When in the show have they called it a BC 303? just wondering, I don't think I have ever heard that.

Owen Macri

Panther
April 24th, 2005, 11:18 PM
There is mention of an "F-302 Squadron" which could mean up to 18 planes, and perhaps Prometheus' complement is either a detachment or another unit altogether.

Jarnin
April 24th, 2005, 11:58 PM
NO! T stands for trainer! C is transport or literaly "Cargo".

And IT IS NOT A BATTLE CRUISER! This is has been enunciated in previous pages of this thread!
Reference the episode Enemy Mine:

LORNE
Core sample analysis still coming in, but so far? Highest concentration is 2.3 parts per million.

EDWARDS
2.3 parts? Major Lorne, we need enough naquadah to manufacture 303s. You know how big a battle cruiser is?
It's a battle cruiser. When it's in the show, it's canon, unless they change their minds later on. So far they haven't.


When in the show have they called it a BC 303? just wondering, I don't think I have ever heard that.

Owen Macri
Also from Enemy Mine from season 7.

HAMMOND
Colonel, General Vidrine is down from the Pentagon. He's been put in charge of BC-303 production.

Panther
April 25th, 2005, 12:27 AM
Reference the episode Enemy Mine:

It's a battle cruiser. When it's in the show, it's canon, unless they change their minds later on. So far they haven't.

So then you agree a the term monkey and ape are interchangable?

Despite, that the writers chose it does not make it correct! If 50 million people agree to something wrong, it is still wrong. TPTB are quite simply wrong. The Prometheus, as it stands now, never has and will never be a Battle Cruiser. It is a Battle Transport plain and simple, or if you want to accept a strictly naval term let's invent "Battle Carrier".

If we choose to accept that remark it could simply be ignorance on the part of Edwards or slang. Examples include calling the USS Wasp, strictly speaking a landing ship or assault ship, a carrier. For slang, calling a battleship a "battlewagon". Edwards is of course USAF, not USN, so I would highly doubt he knows his ship classes. I doubt he'd probably know what a sloop, or cutter were either.

Jarnin
April 25th, 2005, 12:49 AM
So then you agree a the term monkey and ape are interchangable?
No, but those aren't their scientific designations either. Both monkeys and apes are simians however, which is interchangable. That's a bad analogy you have there.


Despite, that the writers chose it does not make it correct! If 50 million people agree to something wrong, it is still wrong. TPTB are quite simply wrong. The Prometheus, as it stands now, never has and will never be a Battle Cruiser. It is a Battle Transport plain and simple, or if you want to accept a strictly naval term let's invent "Battle Carrier".

If we choose to accept that remark it could simply be ignorance on the part of Edwards or slang. Examples include calling the USS Wasp, strictly speaking a landing ship or assault ship, a carrier. For slang, calling a battleship a "battlewagon". Edwards is of course USAF, not USN, so I would highly doubt he knows his ship classes. I doubt he'd probably know what a sloop, or cutter were either.
That's strange. According to this article at Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naval_ship), the writer was using modern USN designation:
Naval ship classification is a field that has changed over time, and is not an area of wide international agreement, so this article currently uses the system as currently used by the United States Navy.

Surface Combatant - large, heavily armed, surface ships which are designed primarily to engage enemy forces on the high seas, including various types of battleship, battlecruiser, cruiser, destroyer, and frigate.

I can see why that article would say "not an area of wide international agreement" after reading the last few posts here :rolleyes:

Panther
April 25th, 2005, 03:17 AM
No, but those aren't their scientific designations either. Both monkeys and apes are simians however, which is interchangable. That's a bad analogy you have there
I disagree. It is not a bad analogy because each word as a definition associated with it and looking at those definitions we clearly see that there is a small but rather fundamental difference between the two, and thus we can conclude the two terms are not interchangable.

Secondly, no he was not. The USN classification for battlecruisers is CC and is currently retired, as evidenced here (http://www.answers.com/topic/hull-classification-symbol), here (http://www.fas.org/man/dod-101/sys/ship/names.htm) and here (http://www.chinfo.navy.mil/navpalib/factfile/ships/ship-cru.html).

While there is no rigorous international agreement on ship types the disagreements mostly lie in details. For example how do you classify, to refer to your source, the Kirov Class missle cruisers when clearly they are larger than your average ones, and look to be different enough to warrant their own classifications. It's the same with the use of frigates.

alaskannut
April 25th, 2005, 06:19 AM
I disagree. It is not a bad analogy because each word as a definition associated with it and looking at those definitions we clearly see that there is a small but rather fundamental difference between the two, and thus we can conclude the two terms are not interchangable.

Secondly, no he was not. The USN classification for battlecruisers is CC and is currently retired, as evidenced here (http://www.answers.com/topic/hull-classification-symbol), here (http://www.fas.org/man/dod-101/sys/ship/names.htm) and here (http://www.chinfo.navy.mil/navpalib/factfile/ships/ship-cru.html).

While there is no rigorous international agreement on ship types the disagreements mostly lie in details. For example how do you classify, to refer to your source, the Kirov Class missle cruisers when clearly they are larger than your average ones, and look to be different enough to warrant their own classifications. It's the same with the use of frigates.

No, actually, its CB...CC was only used for the Lexington class ...when the Alaskas :D were built during WW2, the designation was changed to CB and they were classified as "Large cruisers" because of the british experience at Jutland and with the Hood..if they had been officially classified as battlecruisers, Congress never would have funded them...Also warship designations are EXTREMELY fluid and changeable...witness the whole frigate/cruiser/destroyer-leader thing with the USN during the '50s, '60s and '70s....and ships that really don't seem to fit the classical sense of a particular designation are being designated as such....there are 6000 ton "air defense frigates" and 15000 ton "destroyers" which are bigger than most WW2 heavy cruisers and equipped with 155mm howitzers in the design/construction stage right now...everythings relative as the saying goes.

And btw...you should checkyour first link...its first definition of a battlecruiser is " a cruiser with maximum speed and firepower"...sounds like the Daedalus to me ;)

Also...why are we having this argument...its a fictional ship, in a fictional universe....what does it matter one way or the other???

Agent_Dark
April 25th, 2005, 06:23 AM
Ummm, well not to detract from the debate going on here... ;)

Anyone have an esimate or otherwise at how many people crew the Prometheus?

alaskannut
April 25th, 2005, 06:30 AM
Ummm, well not to detract from the debate going on here... ;)

Anyone have an esimate or otherwise at how many people crew the Prometheus?
Off hand I'd say as many as the number of extras the producers can afford to hire for any particular show ;)
Otherwise...not the foggiest...perhaps in the range of 50-75 without the fighter squadron and its maintenance detachment.

Anubis69
April 25th, 2005, 08:41 AM
Also...why are we having this argument...its a fictional ship, in a fictional universe....what does it matter one way or the other???
i know it's a fictional universe and all, and i agree, it is called a BC given they've said it, but i remember readingin a book that SG-1 employ some air force folk to ensure that their termonology and things in general conform with the air force? surely if they did the mistake would've been noticed, either that or like Chris O'Farrell said above, it's because it sounds cool. and lets face it, BC-303 prometheus does sound macho.

_Owen_
April 25th, 2005, 01:55 PM
I could ask you, why do you watch stargate, it is a fictional universe, why would you spend time watching fiction when you can watch fact? I believe that the answer to this would be that it entertains you or something along those lines, well I guess talking about what BC stands for, or whatever they have moved onto now, is entertaining for them, even if it doesn't even exist.

I personaly like X - 303 Prometheus, although BC-303 isn't bad either.

Owen Macri

alaskannut
April 25th, 2005, 03:46 PM
Chris O'Farrell said above, it's because it sounds cool. and lets face it, BC-303 prometheus does sound macho.
My friend, you have hit the proverbial nail on the head; Which sounds bigger, tougher and cooler?

Battlecruiser (forget the friggin' semantics already)

or

Battle-transport/bomber-transport (Which really just sounds like an Alkesh-type vessel, and at least for me, evokes ridiculous images of a Goa'uld shuttle with missile ports sticking out every-which-way...heavily armed but ridiculous)

My point exactly

That said, another point expanding on the matter of type-classification. Science-fiction writers have to work with subjects that are so far beyond any precedent in our real world it isn't funny. This is especially the case with the starships they create for their story's universe and their type classifications...how do you classify something that carries dozens of people and can travel unimaginable distances at equally unimaginable speeds using technology that if we experienced it in real life would seem like magic? The writers have to take real-life designations and decide what type of ship they feel comfortable applying it too...sometimes the result is very peculiar...witness the Omega class "destroyers" from Babylon 5 and the Star Destroyers from Star Wars...would you rather they just took the Star Trek route and with great originality classified them as....Starships :rolleyes: ??

To lambast the writers for their decisions in this regard is arrogant, conceited and ill-concieved...just watch the show and enjoy it for what it is...good, fun, action-filled science fiction that helps you forget the stress of the previous week and relax as the heroes once more sally forth and vanquish the bad guy....or if you can't do that, go write your own show, pitch it to a network, and see how well you do.

That all said, you know guys...this is intended to be a thread for the discussion of the technical aspects of the BC-303's, not a place for insane arguments over its proper designation...if you really want to continue this ....discussion...why don't you create a dedicated thread??

Orange Crush
April 25th, 2005, 06:55 PM
Although, from a more relative standpoint--each navy/military force classifies its vessels based on what the other vessels are called and by tradition. Prometheus & Daedalus are unprecedented as they're the first space/atmospheric ships of their size and kind . . . yet are under the Air Force rather than the Navy, so would be considered aircraft rather than "ships" by the suits.

A retcon I like is that the 303's actually are Battle Cruisers, with the added feature of being able to carry a small number of fighters due to the Goa'uld's heavy use of Alkesh and Death Gliders. A single vessel going toe-to-toe w/ a Hatak could be easily overwhelmed by the fighters, so strategy and Earth's limited resources dictate having a jack-of-all trades ship, where it should really function solely as a Battle Cruiser. I like to think there are designs on the board for a proper Space Carrier, Battleships, and other support craft to build a whole fleet. However, for Earth's present needs, all they can realisitically construct ATM are battle cruisers with a few hangars tacked on for well-roundedness.

-Nick

Panther
April 26th, 2005, 12:42 AM
Type classification is a technical argument.

Secondly, by choosing to classify their space vessels as ships I think it is to be expected that they follow the norm. If they choose to rigorously apply a general term, then that is generally acceptable, as our sciences do so. However, if they choose to use a specific word and apply it ambigously and/or uncorrectly it is the same as breaking the rules of grammar and language. "I talk english proper" is obviously incorrect as opposed to "I speak english properly". It is the same with misuse of nouns.

Secondly, I hardly think a criticism of the lack of research by writers is lambasting them. Yes, I called them morons indirectly, but I hardly think one off-the-cuff name call is evidence of this. I enjoy the show for it's mix of modern military and out-there sci-fi and where the military aspect is not executed properly I lose some of the suspension of disbelief. I will not accept units like "assault sniper teams", because this is BS. Basically, these things annoy me and decrease my enjoyment of the show. If that occurs, then I think I have a right to complain. I don't complain for the sake of it, nor do I enjoy it or "feel big" after doing it. It is simply something I belive must be addressed.

Lastly, by virtue of the fact that they have cargo space and significant hangar facilities means they are not battlecruisers. Surface combatants usually carry no more than 4 aircraft (helos), and they are used for anti-submarine warfare, anti-surface warfare, and light utility work. The F-302s are fighters which are far more capable than that and there are 8 of them. If you look at the Prometheus' blueprints you will see the hangar space is not a "tack-on" but a design requirement from the get go. Therefore it is not a battlecruiser. The evidence of it being called a battlecruiser has been off-cuff remarks. There have been no technical briefings of the ship type, so the conclusion leans more towards ignorance of the part of the character.

Nurgle
April 26th, 2005, 09:42 AM
Mebbe the writers had been playing Battlecruiser 3000AD (*shudder*) and thought it was a cool term?

alaskannut
April 26th, 2005, 09:57 AM
And I maintain that the 303's are so far beyond anything we have right now, that any designation the writers choose is apprpriate...frigate, corvette, destroyer, battlecruiser, aircraft carrier....its their baby, they have the right to name it waht they want. They chose battlecruiser and it works for me, so how about we just agree to disagree Panther??

Panther
April 26th, 2005, 07:06 PM
Always. :D

alaskannut
April 27th, 2005, 01:13 AM
Always. :D
Laugh it up boy, laugh it up ;) :p

EnigmaNZ
August 16th, 2005, 03:10 AM
I would think AF personel would know ship designations more so then laypeope, they are military, they overfly ships, write reports and do briefings, they know their ships.
Nothing the AF flies equips it to manage something the size of, or with the endurance of the 303. If they choose to borrow from naval terms, fine. General Hommond has also referred to the 303's as Battlecruisers, remember when they were using a CVN to power the gate to contact the Asgard, and were using naquadah for the power cable. Hammond stated that a general had to give up a battle cruiser for that supply of naquadah.
It is a Battle - it is heavily armoured, thick skinned, Cruiser - a well armed warship with the capability to carry out a variety of missions. A destroyer is more dedicated to one role. Battle ship would be kept for future larger more capable classes, Carrier was not used as you can hardly call a large ship with 6 A/C a carrier, unless that was it's primary weapon, the 303 has other primary weapons systems. I think the early term for such a warship was armoured cruiser, which evolved into the BC. In this case BC is not a cut down BB like the Hood, but a uparmoured multirole cruiser.

"The armored cruiser was a naval cruiser protected by armor on its sides as well as on the decks and gun positions.
Battlecruisers (short for battleship-cruisers) were large warships of the early 20th century. They evolved from armored cruisers as new technology made it possible to build bigger ships." Wikipedia

Really the Prometheus has more in common with the Russian Kiev-class CVHG.

_Owen_
August 16th, 2005, 01:05 PM
Personally, I like X-303 better than BC-303.

Owen Macri

Anubis69
August 16th, 2005, 02:31 PM
Yeah, and everyone knows things with the letter "X" in them sell better anyway! :D

Seriously though, i prefer BC-303. sounds macho.

Panther
August 16th, 2005, 05:11 PM
I think the the total stupidy factor of people as they put their heads together increases exponentialy.

_Owen_
August 24th, 2005, 11:46 PM
I would like a program that is really easy to use except can create very detailed three dimensional images. It also has to be free (lol). But I don't know where to look, and they all seem overly complicated.

Owen Macri

Auralis
August 25th, 2005, 01:45 AM
Owen: You might want to check out Blender, its pretty powerfull and with a bit of patience to get past the initial learning curve. And yeah its free too.

_Owen_
August 27th, 2005, 11:07 PM
Ok, thank you very much.

Owen Macri

talyn2k5
September 3rd, 2005, 10:02 AM
Just to change the subject away from the Prometheus' correct designation debate, I`d like to add that the Prometheus nor the Daedalus are equipped with Asgard weapons. It is said by McKay in (SGA 202 - Intruder, I think) that the Asgard will not give us weapons for fear that we could turn them against them.

Both ships are only equipped with missiles and railguns (unless you count the Asgard Beams on the Daedalus as they can use them as a weapons platform)

For details on railguns, see http://www.power-labs.com/index.html

Panther
September 3rd, 2005, 08:10 PM
Hopefully we'll see proper standoff engagements instead of "cool broadsides".

_Owen_
September 4th, 2005, 09:38 AM
It is said several times, not only in "Intruder." It is mentioned in "The Seige III" as well.

Owen Macri

alaskannut
September 25th, 2005, 08:23 AM
Weapons :(?)
Missile (?) - The X303 carries a number of missiles for offensive and defensive means. Since this ship was designed by the United States Air force, standard missiles and armaments are available for ship use. They would have to be augmented to be used in space, with different warheads and with anti-Goa'uld systems.

There would be long range missiles used in orbit to bombard planets or to hit targets at a long distance, short range missiles meant to be used against ships or ground forces. Depending on the force needed a standard warhead or Naquadria/Naquadah enhanced can be used. They can be equipped with shield frequency modulator to penetrate shields of ships. The X303 has six rear and four front missile tubes. This gives it excellent front and backfiring arcs. (611-Prometheus, 713-Grace)

Point Defense Weapons (?) - These weapons are primarily used as defensive means. The X303 carries Anti-Aircraft guns for close range defense and to target ground targets. It is unknown what type of weapon is used in this system could be a standard AA gun, a rail gun design or even energy based weapons. Tracers are frequently used to track weapons fire. Most are mounted on turrets to give it wide firing arcs and the ability to track targets. (722-The Lost City Part 2)

Energy Weapon (?) - The X303 is equipped with weapons based on Asgard and Goa'uld designs. They are most likely bolt type weapons of plasma or other charged particles.

Jamming Weapon (?) - A Goa'uld system jamming that can block the control signal used by most Goa'uld control devices. (715-Chimera)

#

Update:

Following the defeat of the Goa'uld, the problematic and nonfunctional energy weapon installation has been removed at the request of the Asgard as it was no longer needed to even the field against attacking Goa'uld ships*, and replaced by a large caliber railgun capable of use against ships and planetary targets (Beachhead). This system has also been installed on production Daedalus class vessels (Aurora) either in refit or during construction, with several cannons being fitted as standard. For the moment it appears these are fixed and non-traversible, requiring the ship to be facing directly at the target

Prometheus has also been fitted with several VLS launchers as are fitted ,albeit in larger numbers, as standard on Daedalus class vessels (Beachhead). Presumeably these are either to carry/launch new larger missiles that cannot be launched from the preexisting wing mounted launchers or are intended to allow rapid salvoes of large numbers of missiles to be launched in any direction, so as to saturate and overwhelm enemy defenses.









*note; this has been proposed by the folks at stargate-tech.net

BC - 303
November 20th, 2005, 04:15 PM
Well mabey the missiles launched in Beachhead (the ones that launch from the top) are space to surface missiles. where as the others are space to space missiles.

Also has the deadelus ever been called a BC 02 before because i sware ive heard it being called an 02

And did it say anywhere that weapons have been taken off the prometheus, mabey they never worked in the first place so thor just helped manufacture the Railgun.

And when the Goa'uld died the asgurd were sure not to make sure noone as evil as the Goa'uld takes over. so they decide no more shiny weapons 4 us

I really hope they keep the Promethes in the show and dont distroy it, i know they like blowing things up but not this ship please!!

Milleniumlance
November 20th, 2005, 05:23 PM
The Daedalus has "DAEDALUS 02" marked on each side of its fighterbays, and im guessing that the ************* will have the same markings..

RA the sun god
December 12th, 2005, 03:52 PM
The Daedalus has "DAEDALUS 02" marked on each side of its fighterbays, and im guessing that the ************* will have the same markings..
that the what???TELL ME!!!

Milleniumlance
December 12th, 2005, 08:42 PM
that the what???TELL ME!!!



The Odyssey and the Orion the 2 new Battlecruisers that premiere in the second half of the seasons 2 and 9 where the hell have you been RA???

rarocks24
January 14th, 2006, 08:51 AM
It's the first Sci-Fi space ship I've ever seen with seatbelts....
It has seatbelts? LOL. Actually, I think the ship in the redone Lost In Space had seatbelts. I think one of the ships in Event Horizon had them too.

rarocks24
January 14th, 2006, 08:53 AM
The Odyssey and the Orion the 2 new Battlecruisers that premiere in the second half of the seasons 2 and 9 where the hell have you been RA???
I knew about the Odyssey, I didn't know about Orion. Will they have seatbelts as well.

Cory Holmes
January 14th, 2006, 09:23 AM
So here's a new question for all you knowledgable types. Just how long are the Prometheous and Daedalus?

aAnubiSs
January 14th, 2006, 10:12 AM
Since we know the length of a Slammer missile, and hence know the size of the F-302, we also know the size of the hangar doors on the Daedalus, from which we can calculate a size for the Daedalus.

Too bad I don't have any useful program installed ;)

Assuming the hangar doors on the Prometheus are the same size as the ones on Daedalus we can also calculate a size for the Prommie.

Seastallion
January 14th, 2006, 10:40 AM
Ya know... the only offensive weapons I can recall any Battlecruiser ever using are the Rail-gun implacements, (slow) missiles, and the F-302 fighters. I have yet to recall seeing any energy based weapons being used on any Battlecruiser.

I do recall Thor mentioning that the Asgard were giving us Shields (which we've seen) and weapons... but I've never yet seen any of those weapons. Where, oh where could they be?? At the moment, the most effective ship-to-ship weapon the Battlecruiser has are its Rail-guns. The use of the Teleporter to beam nukes was effective for a while, but with the countermeasures, it's useless.

For the time being, the only thing I've seen the Battlecruisers having going for them are excellent shields, and very fast hyperdrive engines. Offensively, I'm not yet impressed, or convinced that a Battlecruiser could really defeat a Ha'tak mothership. A Ha'tak could easily shoot down the missiles a BC-303 could launch, and I'm not sure how effective the Rail-guns would be against Goa'uld shields. On the otherhand, it would take considerably many shots from a Ha'tak (as seen in Lost City) before the shields would fail, and if it came to running, Earth ships (thanks to the Asgard) are much faster than their Goa'uld counterparts.

SG-1ssm
January 14th, 2006, 10:54 AM
That's a pretty comprehensive guide.

kirmit
January 14th, 2006, 11:28 AM
Since we know the length of a Slammer missile, and hence know the size of the F-302, we also know the size of the hangar doors on the Daedalus, from which we can calculate a size for the Daedalus.

Too bad I don't have any useful program installed ;)

Assuming the hangar doors on the Prometheus are the same size as the ones on Daedalus we can also calculate a size for the Prommie.

there ya go
Length 195 m
Width 80 m
Height 65 m
Mass 1,500,000 kg

Thas wot it says for the prommie on wiki

EnigmaNZ
January 15th, 2006, 03:24 AM
Sorry, but I am tired so I'm just gona post the thread on another forum where we were discussing this. Basically used the 12' or 12' 6" lenght of the amraam to work out sizes.

http://forum.spacebattles.com/showthread.php?t=86728

donnie_darko
January 18th, 2006, 09:17 AM
I have looked into this and did some scaling from pics and est. of different lengths, it looks like the ships are around +200 meters. We will not know the real number untill we get a tech book from the Stargate series or from the series eps.

Sleeper919
February 21st, 2006, 09:59 AM
What I'd like to know is, how effective are Earths rail guns against other ships?

Do they do any significant damage to shields?

ancientaction
February 21st, 2006, 02:06 PM
ok. to answer the major confusion on page three of this thread:

**clears throght**

""ITS A TV SHOW"".

and no. rail guns do not do much damage to other ships. loads of damage to small craft like fighters. but to capital ships, it does damage, but minimal.

Ludofjn
March 18th, 2006, 10:23 AM
Janus could build a better f-304

Kirath
March 18th, 2006, 08:22 PM
ok. to answer the major confusion on page three of this thread:

**clears throght**

""ITS A TV SHOW"".

and no. rail guns do not do much damage to other ships. loads of damage to small craft like fighters. but to capital ships, it does damage, but minimal.
In Off The grid The Oddysseywas ablr to do damage to the Lucian Alliance motherships in a combat. Our ships were designed to be a fight the Goauld. The Daedelus could probably hold its own against any Hatak but the ships the Ori and Wraith fielding are far larger and more advanced than anything the System Lords were able to throw at us.