Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

S10: Critique & Contemplation

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

    Originally posted by TameFarrar
    Hi Gang
    Might I suggest that when having a problem with posters that seem determined to stray Off-Topic and/or be inflammatory towards the posters of the thread that you NOT quote the person's post nor acknowledge them in any way. While for some this never helps it may help your blood pressure to just ignore the person breaking the rules and let the Mods clean up everything while you continue playing
    My bad!

    Comment


      Originally posted by binkpmmc
      Doesn't it seem hypocritical, bordering on farcical really, that TPTB say they cannot read or use fan ideas (ideas that are SOOOOO much better then the crap they are putting out these days) but they can wholly and totally rip-off Xena, Star Trek series and have the gall to call it their own or homages? Please they need to get off this crap and start writing decent material - use some of the fans ideas because really and truly they are much better than recycled sci-fi cliched cheese and faulty homages that stink like days old warm cheese.
      This is just my opinion, but I think the days of "decent material" have vanished forever. For whatever mysterious reason, those responsible for Stargate SG-1 seem to be comfortably plugged into the cheap-easy-shallow mode of scriptwriting; unfortunately there are enough people around who will swallow whole whatever is dished out as "new" and "fresh" and be perfectly happy with it. And if that's what they want.... (My apologies to those of you whom I respect who are enjoying the new SG-1---we'll have to agree to disagree.)

      If SG-1 had always had weak writing, it wouldn't be so bad. But when you look at (for example) seasons 1-4, the over-all quality of the stories and scripts was golden. That's how I want to remember Stargate SG-1. Not the way it is now. It's like ordering chateaubriand and getting beef jerky instead.
      In the past 10-15 years, it's become fashionable in the entertainment industry to pay homage to other people's works. I'm really sorry to see it happening with SG-1. The boys at Bridge are making a cottage-industry out of "homage".

      When we were kidding around about Vala's spawn a couple of months ago, I never imagined we'd be hitting so close to the mark...... I just can't believe they're really doing this. Inconceivable! (Sigh....and I wish it had been.)
      Last edited by SimilarCadence; 12 January 2006, 09:14 AM. Reason: neurotic obsession with subject-verb agreement

      Comment


        Ummm… now I feel bad for ever saying they should bring back the old intro music or longer intro. It would have served to put a distance, a *really* big distance between the original SG arc and the ‘new and improved’ SG arcs, to have kept that 10 second short one. ‘Specially if the suits at MGM/Sony refused to change the name of the show like Cooper said in one of his interviews in the late summer/fall.

        And that speaking of the intro in which the new, but different gate figures prominently in, specifically the new spoiler info on the 1st ep of S10 that talks about everybody but D/V/baby going off on a SHIP….. *sighs*…. Are we ever going to see the stargate again? If it’s only used once in a season or not at all if the Stargate saga will now around spaceships and shoot ‘em ups, then the moniker STARGATE sure as heck doesn’t belong to the show anymore. Not even as Stargate Command like Coop & many fans thought would be appropriate. Flying spaceships don’t come under the jurisdiction of those involved with the management of the stargate…

        Gee…. Someone remind the corporate suits that the idea of wormhole travel through the gate in a television series WAS one of the big things that made this show unique!
        Convention Pix Shore Leave ('06 to '09), AT2, AT3, & AT4 ('06, '08, & '09), and Vancouver ('07)
        My SG fanfic! ..Click Here.

        Comment


          Originally posted by AGateFan
          Question:

          Does anyone think that TPTB have written themselves in a bit of a corner with the Sodan cloaking device? I mean if we now have a personal cloak I would think we would incorporate it into our arsenal. Or will they just drop it into a plothole?

          I guess they kinda already did that. I mean surely they kept the one Nerti had in RITE OF PASSAGE. And then there is the Puddle Jumpers cloak from ITS GOOD TO BE KING. I mean thats not a personal cloak, but if Atlantis can modify a jumper cloak to cloak the entire city of Atlantis why wouldnt they take the time machine\jumpers cloak and use it on the Deadleus or something... but then that would make us to powerful and not doomed enough. God (gods\ori\wriath) forbid we not be DOOOOOMMMMMMEEEEDDDD and actually explore the universe or something.
          Are you actually asking the writers to be logical or even have knowledge of the previous episodes???

          I watched FS and really enjoyed it, but these actors are given nothing to work with. I read better fan fic than the plot outline of Season 10.
          sigpic
          Distinguished Service Ribbon Goa'uld Campaign
          My Stories zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz Artwork by Mala

          Comment


            Originally posted by SimilarCadence
            This is just my opinion, but I think the days of "decent material" have vanished forever. For whatever mysterious reason, those responsible for Stargate SG-1 seem to be comfortably plugged into the cheap-easy-shallow mode of scriptwriting; unfortunately there are enough people around who will swallow whole whatever is dished out as "new" and "fresh" and be perfectly happy with it. And if that's what they want.... (My apologies to those of you whom I respect who are enjoying the new SG-1---we'll have to agree to disagree.)

            If SG-1 had always had weak writing, it wouldn't be so bad. But when you look at (for example) seasons 1-4, the over-all quality of the stories and scripts were golden. That's how I want to remember Stargate SG-1. Not the way it is now. It's like ordering chateaubriand and getting beef jerky instead.
            In the past 10-15 years, it's become fashionable in the entertainment industry to pay homage to other people's works. I'm really sorry to see it happening with SG-1. The boys at Bridge are making a cottage-industry out of "homage".

            When we were kidding around about Vala's spawn a couple of months ago, I never imagined we'd be hitting so close to the mark...... I just can't believe they're really doing this. Inconceivable! (Sigh....and I wish it had been.)
            You make some excellent points, SC. And I totally understand where you're coming from. My perspective is probably a bit different than that of a person who watched the show in the beginning. I joined at the end of S6, and I've caught up on every episode, but it just isn't the same, because I didn't experience the stories AS they were aired. By the time I had the DVDs, I knew the team wasn't in danger of dying (as a whole or individually), and I knew a great deal about several arcs before I saw the episodes involved.

            That said, I also rarely pick up on the "homages" like others do. Still, when they're brought to my attention - both by PDL and astute fans - I always wonder how necessary it was. I'm very interested in the field, in regards to directing and producing, so I normally don't begrudge them the opportunity to do what many, many, MANY directors have done for decades. However, a lot of the stuff that's been going on IS a bit overboard - especially over the past couple of years.

            For me, it all comes back to the fact that SG-1 was able to thrive on a premium cable network during a time when Tracy Takes On (HBO) was the only popular series that people really knew about. They didn't need to compromise, and they didn't need to justify their actions or their stories. They just did them. And fans all over the globe flocked towards a series that critics never really gave a chance.

            I don't wanna call them sell-outs now, because I think that's extremely harsh. But I do have to wonder what their motives are and where their priorities lie these days. Is it about preserving the original qualities (and quality) of the series that kept on picking up fans throughout the years during its time on Showtime? Or is it about preserving their job (and that of many, many other people) by "compromising" with a network that no longer has to rely upon them for ratings?

            I understand the dilemma they have. They essentially sold their soul to Sci Fi when they developed Atlantis. Now there's even more at stake should they go the controversial Farscape route - assuming, of course, they disagree with the directions Sci Fi is taking them.

            It's just a weird situation, one I doubt we'll ever know the true story behind until several years from now.



            ON EDIT: Also, the fact that fans called this play WEEKS before it was announced is another sign of how bad the story is. *shudder*

            Comment


              Originally posted by ShimmeringStar
              Ummm… now I feel bad for ever saying they should bring back the old intro music or longer intro. It would have served to put a distance, a *really* big distance between the original SG arc and the ‘new and improved’ SG arcs, to have kept that 10 second short one. ‘Specially if the suits at MGM/Sony refused to change the name of the show like Cooper said in one of his interviews in the late summer/fall.
              I feel badly about that, too. I was one of the folks who didn't want them to change the name of the show...now I see the profound logic of re-labeling something that has become an entirely different product.

              Of course, if they had actually created a new name/identity at the beginning of S9, they would have lost me far sooner. So, being in a very awkward position, TPTB took the easier road, and, in essence, their strategy worked. I was sucked into thinking it would be the same show and have been patiently waiting for what is never going to happen, more quality TV. I think I understand why they felt this was the best strategy (I mean, who wants to lose half your viewship automatically?), but it just makes me even more unhappy that I have been wasting my time.

              Now that I know from the spoilers that S10 will be more of the same (it will be the "second season" of the "new show" really), I can stop caring. So in a way, that's a good thing! I can now stop being disappointed all the time and not mind when I automatically flip to another channel after the first commercial break and never feel compelled go back. I am excused from having any expectations anymore.

              Comment


                homages are a fine art.

                find a fanfic writer who hasnt' homaged something. Heck i had a fic once based on the mash eps where hawkeye walks across the camp naked on a bet...and had jack do it. but, at least i dont' think, it wasn't a complete and total rip off, just the idea, twisted adn tweaked.

                i had another fic where i had a mimick of the 'hawkeye and margaret lost and bickering as they're found in the rain' scene...but again, it was a scene in a whole story and unless you've seen that episode, you don't get it.

                and in some ways, homages are fun. like the mimicking of star wars in enemies (the scene of teh big skeleton in the sand) but in other ways they're just so blatant that you just roll your eyes, especially when the homage is a whole plot arc.

                i'm still remembering ron moore's pod cast where he says that there's a fine line between a homage and a rip off and the key is knowing when to call it a day. sometimes, such as little scenes here and there, they do it good. Like in B5 where the swearing in of the new prez was a recreation of the LBJ swearing in on AF1 after Kennedy was shot.

                other times, well like with vala's baby. it's too much. they are literaly and unapologetically taking the whole plot of another show and inserting it into thiers.

                the key to a good homage is finding a twist to make it unique and make it fit. now, it is early days yet but i don't see much effort going into making it unique.
                Where in the World is George Hammond?


                sigpic

                Comment


                  Originally posted by STARGATE7777
                  Maybe Jack will come back in season 10, take a look at the present situation and say "Well, this is a cliche."
                  He will then ...send Vala back from whence she came, with said baby/evil Ori, relagate Cameron to Sg -some other number, sweep Sam up into his arms, send Daniel to a clinic for personality disorders and tell Teal'c to get a haircut

                  AND THEY LIVED HAPPILY EVER AFTER
                  I might start watching again.
                  sigpic
                  Distinguished Service Ribbon Goa'uld Campaign
                  My Stories zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz Artwork by Mala

                  Comment


                    Originally posted by Skydiver
                    homages are a fine art...
                    Yes, I think the key is in making it your own. It should be much more about, "how can we sneak in some subtle references as a tribute to something we love/care about/want to reference for dramatic/comedic effect?", and not "how can we make this ep look exactly like that movie that was so freakin' popular last year?"

                    Comment


                      BOO to that!

                      Comment


                        Originally posted by Skydiver
                        homages are a fine art.

                        <snip>

                        other times, well like with vala's baby. it's too much. they are literaly and unapologetically taking the whole plot of another show and inserting it into thiers.

                        the key to a good homage is finding a twist to make it unique and make it fit. now, it is early days yet but i don't see much effort going into making it unique.
                        This is true. I don't search for homages or connections to movies or other series, because I'm just not cultured enough. But more and more fans are noticing them, which is a problem.

                        And the sproglette is just too blatant to ignore. I hope JM acknowledges it in his next blog...

                        Comment


                          thedancerofspaz wrote:

                          For me, it all comes back to the fact that SG-1 was able to thrive on a premium cable network during a time when Tracy Takes On (HBO) was the only popular series that people really knew about. They didn't need to compromise, and they didn't need to justify their actions or their stories. They just did them. And fans all over the globe flocked towards a series that critics never really gave a chance.




                          I remember when SG-1 was on Showtime the network penned the saying that Sci-fi has used since it got there. Sci-fi Fridays. There where two shows I'd watch SG-1 and The Hunger (based on the movie).

                          Well The Hunger went south and SG-1 stayed.

                          And in it's wake it showed HBO and Showtime that movies alone didn't draw people in. It was quality programming. The Sopranos, Queer As Folk, Soul Food, ...etc. All of the programmes that appeared/appears on these two cable
                          really owe something to SG-1. Because without it, I'd think that the R&D people would have passed on these shows.

                          Comment


                            <sigh>

                            Well, reading the plot of S10's premiere has just about killed it for me. I struggled to retain hope, but this garbage...I'm through.

                            Spoiler:
                            First of all - enough with the 'superchild who ages rapidly' crap. Seen it all before in better shows, thank you very much. Bored me to tears then, hated it, and not expecting to like it any better now. Also feel enormously resentful that this cheesy old plot has been resurrected simply to fit in with the fact that CB is pregnant. Secondly, where have we heard all this before? Harsesis child anyone? The writers need to go back to school and start coming up with new, original plots. Not warmed over leftovers from SG1's earlier seasons and other shows. They're getting money for zip these days if you ask me.


                            Feeling very bitter right now because I don't believe it had to be this way. The changes between S8 and S9 could have been handled well and given us a great S9 and beyond. Instead, it's been one stupid, inane decision after another from TPTB.

                            Ah well, at least I have 8 years of the REAL SG1 to watch.

                            Albion
                            Listen, we had General Ryan come on and do a little cameo for us, and he's a real live four star, one of the big guys. And I had to ask him point blank, because there's a certain irreverence that I bring to the character, and denseness, but while we were doing this scene, I just looked at him and said, "Do you have guys like me in...?" and he stopped me and said, "Yes, and worse, and you're doing a fine job, son."

                            Richard Dean Anderson

                            Comment


                              Originally posted by Skydiver
                              homages are a fine art.

                              find a fanfic writer who hasnt' homaged something.
                              It's actually remarkably difficult to come up with truly original concepts. It's even hard to do "tweaks" on common themes that haven't been done before in some shape or form. For all our supposed differences, the human brain tends to think the same way a lot of the time. Great minds (and not so great minds) do often think alike.

                              I worked for a professional fantasy magazine for a brief period of time, and the editor commented more than once about how every month, she'd get a slew of stories on the same theme from unconnected writers all over the world. There just seemed to be a weird cosmic consciousness that caused the same plot device to be spewed out at the same time. One month it would be vampires, the next would feature thieves with a heart of gold, and the month after that it would be dragons, and so forth.

                              So I believe that it is marginally possible that
                              Spoiler:
                              Vala's Ori super-baby
                              was conceived (pardon the pun) independently by TPTB without any influence from Xena or any other show featuring a similar plot device. I won't speculate on the probability of that, but I do admit its possibility.

                              The problem I have with it is that, no matter what unique Stargate spin they put on this particular story concept, I have seen something hideously similiar done (at least on the bare bones outline level) very recently (in Xena), and I thought it was fairly silly when it was done then.

                              This is not a concept that I am predisposed to like.

                              You know, if you didn't like Shakespeare's Romeo and Juliet, chances are pretty good that you're not going to like any storyline based on Romeo and Juliet, even if the language is changed, the characters names are changed, the plot is tweaked, and the story is dropped into a different setting. Maybe it will be more accessible to some, but a tragic romance is a tragic romance whether it's set in Shakespearian England or 20th Century New York. And
                              Spoiler:
                              evil, fast-growing, super-babies intent on taking over the universe
                              isn't exactly Shakespeare to begin with. It's not even good science fiction. In the right hands, it MIGHT be the basis for a good fantasy.

                              I suppose people who enjoyed the Xena/Hope arc might really like this storyline, and good for them. And who knows, perhaps I will be pleasantly surprised. But I'm not too optimistic about it.

                              My LJ

                              Comment


                                Is it ironic that the Xena\Hope saga happened in the last "bad" year of Xena. Not that any of the years actually qualified as "great" or "good" but it had definitely jumped the shark by the time that this storyline came up. The fact that it was swimming in the same waters with sharks the whole time is irrelevant.

                                I find it really, really hard to beleive that TPTB came up with this all on their own, considering how many times it has been done... and the fact that they already had a superbaby early in the shows tenure... one that disappeared after 1 episode, came back for one and then thankfully disappeared again.

                                Could care less about a "darker" daniel... I care about as much about that as I care that all my characters be "hot"...(Im still p'd about that, hot , hot, hot... who freaking cares, grow up I dont watch sci fi for hottness I watch it because I like good scifi\action adventure ----rant over).
                                Joseph Mallozzi -"In the meantime, I'm into season 5 of OZ (where the show takes an unfortunate hairpin turn into "the not so wonderful world of fantasy")"

                                ^^^ Kinda sounds like seasons 9 and 10 of SG-1 to me. Thor, ya got Aspirin?

                                AGateFan has officially Gone Fishin (with Jack, Sam, Daniel, Teal'c) and is hoping Atlantis does not take that same hairpin turn.

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X