Fair is Fair

[STARGATE7777]

Over the past week I have seen many people's reaction to the possible loss of AT and MS. And while everything seems to now be back on track I want to relate what happened that week to what has already happened.

I read comments such as, If there is no Sam I won't be watching or If Daniel leaves there won't be a show because he is the heart and soul of Stargate. Fans were noticably concerned and upset over the possible loss of what they perceive to be the "best" part of Stargate.

Well, for me, I have watched Stargate for Jack and the relationships that Jack had with other characters. For me, his character was the central part of the show, the "Heart and Soul' you might say. To me, without him, the show is not the same.

Now, when I have tried to express this I have gotten negative comments from "Leave the man alone." to "Get over it, he's not coming back." I am not talking about the reasons for RDA leaving. I have no control over that. What I am talking about is the reaction of people who will not accept that for some of us the loss of Jack in the show is just as devastating as the perceived loss of Sam or Daniel. I didn't see anyone saying that Sam fans were delusional for wanting Sam to be part of the show. I didn't see people telling Daniel fans that he could be replaced and have the show continue as if nothing happened.

Whether or not RDA returns, his fans have the right to express a loss over the character and to make the choice to continue watching the show or not. We are not traitors or delusional or selfish or any other terms you wish to use. We are simply fans who have lost, what to us, was the best of Stargate.

[Lida]

Over the past week I have seen many people's reaction to the possible loss of AT and MS. And while everything seems to now be back on track I want to relate what happened that week to what has already happened.

I read comments such as, If there is no Sam I won't be watching or If Daniel leaves there won't be a show because he is the heart and soul of Stargate. Fans were noticably concerned and upset over the possible loss of what they perceive to be the "best" part of Stargate.

Well, for me, I have watched Stargate for Jack and the relationships that Jack had with other characters. For me, his character was the central part of the show, the "Heart and Soul' you might say. To me, without him, the show is not the same.

Now, when I have tried to express this I have gotten negative comments from "Leave the man alone." to "Get over it, he's not coming back." I am not talking about the reasons for RDA leaving. I have no control over that. What I am talking about is the reaction of people who will not accept that for some of us the loss of Jack in the show is just as devastating as the perceived loss of Sam or Daniel. I didn't see anyone saying that Sam fans were delusional for wanting Sam to be part of the show. I didn't see people telling Daniel fans that he could be replaced and have the show continue as if nothing happened.

Whether or not RDA returns, his fans have the right to express a loss over the character and to make the choice to continue watching the show or not. We are not traitors or delusional or selfish or any other terms you wish to use. We are simply fans who have lost, what to us, was the best of Stargate.

Everyone has the right to express their feelings over the loss of an actor, if it done with respect. I have seen the loss of RDA from SG-1 discussed many times and I myself miss him very much and I also feel the show has changed because of his leaving. However, people have the same right to discuss the loss of any character, major or recurring guest. As for continuing to watch the show, well that's up to the individual. You feel Jack was the best of Stargate. Well, others feel that perhaps Amanda Tapping (Sam) or Michael Shanks (Daniel) is. It's their right to discuss these feelings. I truly don't understand what your problem is.....I don't recall people being called delusional when RDA decided to leave. I do recall much saddness and "threats" to stop watching the show, but that was totally expected. I never once read that Jack could be "replaced"....quite the opposite. RDA is irreplaceable. Sure, they added other characters, but they didn't try to replace Jack, because TPTB knew it couldn't be done. So what isn't fair? That RDA decided it was time for him to move on? Or that AT and MS are remaining?

Sorry if I'm sounding dense, but I truly don't understand. I remember tributes to RDA as Jack, and people singing his praises. I'm sorry if you received any negative comments to your posts about his leaving, but often people here confuse the actor with the charater he/she plays. Perhaps that is a kind of tribute to how well the actor has developed his character and played his role.

Anyway, I'm rambling. RDA is gone, but far from forgotten. The rumors of MS and AT not returning have been exposed as just that, rumors. As for what else the future holds for SG-1, who knows. However, you are correct....the feel of the show has most definitely changed, whether it is all from "Jack" leaving, or the introduction of many new characters, I don't really know, but I have to say, so far, I have been disappointed in the so called "new and improved" SG-1 (to quote tptb). But that's just my opinion.....

[Madeleine]

Over the past week I have seen many people's reaction to the possible loss of AT and MS. And while everything seems to now be back on track I want to relate what happened that week to what has already happened.

I read comments such as, If there is no Sam I won't be watching or If Daniel leaves there won't be a show because he is the heart and soul of Stargate. Fans were noticably concerned and upset over the possible loss of what they perceive to be the "best" part of Stargate.

Well, for me, I have watched Stargate for Jack and the relationships that Jack had with other characters. For me, his character was the central part of the show, the "Heart and Soul' you might say. To me, without him, the show is not the same.

Now, when I have tried to express this I have gotten negative comments from "Leave the man alone." to "Get over it, he's not coming back." I am not talking about the reasons for RDA leaving. I have no control over that. What I am talking about is the reaction of people who will not accept that for some of us the loss of Jack in the show is just as devastating as the perceived loss of Sam or Daniel. I didn't see anyone saying that Sam fans were delusional for wanting Sam to be part of the show. I didn't see people telling Daniel fans that he could be replaced and have the show continue as if nothing happened.

Whether or not RDA returns, his fans have the right to express a loss over the character and to make the choice to continue watching the show or not. We are not traitors or delusional or selfish or any other terms you wish to use. We are simply fans who have lost, what to us, was the best of Stargate.

Yup, I hear you.

I think the reason you have found yourself getting negativity is that some of the people who don't like to hear "I miss RDA" or "The show is better with RDA" just can't separate individuals. If one person (you, perhaps) is saying "I miss RDA" and another is saying "RDA should come back right now, the selfish rotter" then most people are going to spot the difference, but there are a few people who would have trouble and accuse you of the selfishness that the other person displayed.

In addition, when there are many many people all saying the same thing there is a tendency amongst some to react badly, in a sort of "lot's of other people have said that and i'm not interested, therefore you are bad for saying it too" way that really doesn't make sense. A newbie might mention, for the first time, that she missed RDA, and there are people - thankfully hardly any, but they exist - who'd pounce on her and tell her to give it a rest, already.

The trick is knowing who to ignore . The vast majority of people here are nice and sane. Well, nice and relatively sane....

Well, nice anyway.

[AGateFan]

<snip for space>

Now, when I have tried to express this I have gotten negative comments from "Leave the man alone." to "Get over it, he's not coming back." I am not talking about the reasons for RDA leaving. I have no control over that. What I am talking about is the reaction of people who will not accept that for some of us the loss of Jack in the show is just as devastating as the perceived loss of Sam or Daniel. I didn't see anyone saying that Sam fans were delusional for wanting Sam to be part of the show. I didn't see people telling Daniel fans that he could be replaced and have the show continue as if nothing happened.

Whether or not RDA returns, his fans have the right to express a loss over the character and to make the choice to continue watching the show or not. We are not traitors or delusional or selfish or any other terms you wish to use. We are simply fans who have lost, what to us, was the best of Stargate.

RDA was a very important part of the show. The show is not the same without him and can never be. He was one of the best all time scifi characters (IMHO) not just Stargate. Everyone has a right to express this opinion. And everyone has a right to express this opinion whether they choose to continue watching the show or not. Yes people can still have opinions after choosing to stop watching, some people dont understand this. If they give you negativity or red rep you for this, that is just wrong IMHO.

All that being said, the three things that have made RDAs leaving somewhat barable for me are.
1) We know that he choose to leave and even stayed a couple of years past when he actually wanted to leave. So I have great respect for his choice and thanks for him staying as long as he did.

2) He has been getting less and less screen time so its not a sudden lack of Jack and they didn't kill off his character or give some lame excuse for him not being there. The promoted him so I know Jack Oneill is doing just fine and is a live and well in the Stargate universe.

3) They are trying to fill his role by bringing in another character that at least makes since in terms of the show. A character that may, over time, gather enough steam to keep the ship from sinking. Hes not Jack but he is at this point at the Jonas level and in retrospect Jonas was a pretty good character.

The rumors that are going around about AT and MS (oddly no CJ) are upsetting because the above 3 do not appear to exist.... Well MS (I personally cannot see as leaving) would apparently do by choice so hes got at least one of the 3. But he definitly hasnt gotten less screen time lately so if he did go it would be an immediate shock and absence. And how would TPTB write it, who would they replace him with...yada, yada, yada... all that is concerning and upsetting.

And AT, well lets not even get into that because from the RUMORs they would be violating all 3 of the above so AT fans are prettly much in revolt. With Jack they replaced him with the same archtype (just not as good), Carters replacement would (apparently from rumors) be a completely different archtype and would seem to swing the direction of the show.... It would be as if they decided to replace Oneill with Maybourn or Samuals.. but whatever.

I know for mysef if AT were to choose to leave and they choose to replace her with another female airforce officer who was intelligent and professional I would be sad (like I am with RDA) but not as upset (as I am with the rumors). And if MS chose to leave and they repaced him with Jonas or an equiviant character I would not be as upset as if they went a whole new direction. But at this point with everything changing, I think the ship is listing from the loss of RDA and any more hits (main characters losses) at this moment in time and it will sink. Just MHO.

I miss O'neill. I miss the fun of finding the O'neillisms in each ep and then committing them to memory and repeating them to everyone at work. I miss how he interacted with all of the team members. I miss how SG-1 was a show about a Team and did Exploring. I hold the faintest of hopes they can get back to that with Mitchell, Carter, Danile and Teal'c... faintest of hopes that is getting fainter with every ep that does not do this. I miss ONeill.

[Presley_Carter]

Whilst I miss the O'Neill character, I think they went about the exit in such a good way that it did not damage the show as much as it could have.

And I may be a doe eyed, fresh faced innocent but I love new things and seeing what can happen....as Plato (I think) says - All is flux, nothing stays still.

[Abodie]

With the original cast the SG-1 had all the right ingredients (RDA, AT, MS, CJ and Don Davies) to create the perfect receipe for success. Much like all classic shows that had staying power....Friends, X-Files, Frasier, etc. The show will never be the same because despite TPTB's best efforts it is lacking the heart and soul it once had. Although fans noticed the difference when Don Davies and especially RDA left, it would have been the same if any of the other central characters (AT, MS or CJ) had been the first to leave. Whether you accept all the changes and continue watching is a personal choice. Some are avid sci-fi fans...doesn't matter who's in it or what it's about, they'll continue to watch. Other's tuned in and fell in love with the original cast and their relationships and now to them the show is over. All sides have a right to their opinion and a right to air them on these boards.

[Skydiver]

i understand where you're coming from and it is frustrating.

i miss jack. i miss the class he brought to the show. and it has irreparably changed. for the better??? that's up to each person to decide.

but i miss him and while i would never dream of demanding that he come back so that i can get my jack fix...i sure as heck wouldn't discourage him

[ShadowMaat]

Sometimes it isn't what you say, it's how you say it. This is becoming a big issue on the forum right now. Again.

What you (generally speaking) see as an innocuous, positive comment could be seen by others as harsh and overly critical.

What you think is a joke could be seen by others as vile slander.

This all goes double when you apply those comments to the actors/characters/situations on the show. People feel very deeply about them and can get extremely defensive about it. The Jack/RDA situation is hardly unique, it's only the most recent hot button topic.

[STARGATE7777]

hey, remember I wrote this when the whole debate over MS and At was just started. My point was that people were very quick to say that the show for them was over if their favorite character left. Well, mine has. I still care about Stargate because I watched it for 8 years. It really doesn't matter the reasons. You still feel a loss. I also think it would have been easier to accept his leaving if the writers had put more time and effort into having him exit the show. For fans who do not go online they must be thinking "Where is Jack?"

[Abodie]

hey, remember I wrote this when the whole debate over MS and At was just started. My point was that people were very quick to say that the show for them was over if their favorite character left. Well, mine has. I still care about Stargate because I watched it for 8 years. It really doesn't matter the reasons. You still feel a loss. I also think it would have been easier to accept his leaving if the writers had put more time and effort into having him exit the show. For fans who do not go online they must be thinking "Where is Jack?"

This is about the only site (besides poker) that I visit. I know about Jack leaving but I wondered what RDA is up too. Besides protecting baby seals and spending time with his daughter, what has he been doing acting wise....anything? I'm tired of MacGyver reruns and would like to see him in something new. Does anyone know if he is retiring from acting or is he just taking a break?