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Madeleine
June 7th, 2005, 06:48 AM
This is the penultimate heat. After next week's Daniel & Friends poll we'll put all the winners into the final.

The episodes already chosen are: Best Loopy Daniel (http://forum.gateworld.net/showthread.php?t=12164)episodes - Legacy, Lifeboat and Absolute Power; the best eps for Daniel the Scholar and Explorer (http://forum.gateworld.net/showthread.php?t=11966) - Torment of Tantalus and The First Ones; the best Daniel the Hero (http://forum.gateworld.net/showthread.php?t=11743) - Meridian and Reckoning pt II; best Whumping eps (http://forum.gateworld.net/showthread.php?t=12310) - Evolution pt II and Prometheus Unbound; and the best Daniel Character Development (http://forum.gateworld.net/showthread.php?t=12574) - Maternal Instinct and Forever in a Day.

Hywel
June 7th, 2005, 07:32 AM
So hard to choose! But I had to go for Heroes, because of the scene where he gives the tape to Bregman. Brilliantly acted, and brilliantly directed. Or at least I thought so.

Madeleine
June 7th, 2005, 08:40 AM
To everyone who spotted the mistake - Thanks! It's fixed now, I think :o

L-JADE
June 7th, 2005, 11:46 AM
I choose MERIDIAN, coz in other episodes Daniel only loose something or a part of his life, but in Meridian he basically leave everything and fully aware of it, gotta full of angsty for doing that.

blingaway
June 7th, 2005, 12:54 PM
I went with Crystal Skull for several reasons. One, there's no angst like family angst. Daniel's conflicting feelings for Nick were a treat.

Two, I think this episode was the beginning of the disillusionment that would lead Daniel away from SG-1. Whatever *did* happen to working through the night? The look on his face when he said 'I'd do it for you...' just broke my heart.

Throughout Crystal skull Daniel gets pulled from emotional high to low to high over and over. He hears Jack say 'the one we need is Daniel' but then sees Jack call it a day while his team member and friend is still missing.

He gets to endure his grandfather's scorn again, but then gets the admission from Nick that Nick screwed up not adopting him.

He sees in Hammond's conversation with his grandaughter the love and attention he was denied as a child. But then he hears Hammond say he can't go see her performance because his "very good friend" is missing. Hammond will miss his grandaughter's play but Jack won't lose a night's sleep? WTF?!

He finally has a chance to build a relationship with his only remaining family, only to have Nick stay behind...

This episode was just a total angst-fest from beginning to end, and I LOVE IT!

fair_nymph
June 7th, 2005, 02:15 PM
I'd have to go with Threads, but that's not an option. :\

Osiris-RA
June 7th, 2005, 02:29 PM
I'd really go with Need, but It wasn't there so ... I went with Absolute Power. Just goes to show beneth the cute/geek lies a dangerous interior of maniacal power lust. Fantabulous! :D

tryxy
June 7th, 2005, 05:58 PM
I went for Menace because for this ep was the episode that finally broke Daniel.

Tucker Case
June 7th, 2005, 08:58 PM
Hm.

Not quite sure what to make of this one. Best angst? Things were pretty angsty in some of the loopy episodes, the Daniel-in-distress episodes, the character growth episodes, a few of the heroic episodes and even a handful of the exploration episodes. I’m actually a bit stumped.

“Which of these do you like best?”

Easy enough: ’There But For The Grace Of God.’

Do I think it’s the best Angsty Daniel episode? More angsty than ‘Secrets’?

Does it get more angsty than 'Secrets'?

Poor lamb: Sha’re is back, she’s within reach, their time is limited, and so much of the time they could have had was lost because Kasuf didn’t unbury the gate until the appointed Abydonian year had passed.

And the angst is just getting warmed up: She’s pregnant, for starters, the implications of that are devastating, she’s herself but only as long as she’s carrying the child of the being who kidnapped and enslaved her, and she’s certain Daniel despises her and he’s too shell-shocked at first to show her otherwise. One of the few times Daniel ever takes a moment to feel sorry for himself and there’s Teal’c all over him, asking him to force his wife into captivity above and beyond being taken as host by a Goa’uld and, oh dear, looks like he’ll have to deliver the baby, too. They come so close – so damn close - to getting her home and it falls apart in the dying seconds, Sha’re lost to the parasitical entity inside her, then physically lost again, as Apophis reclaims her, with Daniel trying to hold it together just enough to reassure her that he loves her, hand her child over to its grandfather and try to get himself and Teal’c home in one piece, even if it means getting knocked around by a snakehead on top of everything else.

All told, a helluva day at the office.

Six years and change later and I’m still haunted by Daniel’s eyes in this episode, the way he managed to do so much while in this daze of pain, as though the only way to get through any of it was to just do it before too much of what was happening sunk in.

I should vote for this one - I should - but I like ‘There But For The Grace Of God’ better, darn it.

The angst is not as focused as it is in episodes like ‘Menace’ or ‘Heroes,’ and that kind of focus so often translates into a more acute sense of suffering. Smaller pressure points will do that (and an actor that has matured as much as Michael had by that point doesn’t hurt, either).

But what I like so much about ‘TBFTGOG’ is the enormous scale of it all, how the weight of the world has fallen on Daniel’s slender shoulders – and no one can see it (or believe it) but him.

In this corner, a universe through the looking glass, hostile, disbelieving, doomed and a portent of the horrible devastation to come in his universe, the one he may not live to see again. And in this corner, Daniel Jackson.

Little Season One Daniel Jackson, who’s never met an Asgard, hasn’t developed that P-90 bulge, has never travelled to Kheb, hasn’t gone to another plane of existence and back and come to accept that the relative powerlessness of this existence is where he possesses his greatest strength, and who doesn’t have a head full of Ancient knowledge for those especially perilous occasions where it helps to have an edge. It’s Daniel the frustrated, flaky and small - lost, alone and overwhelmed, and all he needs to do is save the world.

And the friends he’s counting on to help him do it aren’t “his” friends at all.

He moves from the dread of being left behind again, to the relief of thinking he’s made it home, only to be faced with a roomful of strangers wearing the faces of his friends, holding him at gunpoint, restraining him, drugging him and refusing to even believe in his existence. He not only has to find a way to explain himself to these people – when he has no idea himself what’s going on – but convince them, in the middle of the end of their world, to take a moment or two out of meeting their fate to try and send him home.

To accept their end, but give him a chance to avert that end for himself and his world (and for Daniel to have to ask that is an incredible, terrible thing).

What really sets ‘TBFTGOG’ apart, for me – while I’m trying to make a distinction for myself between just plain “angst” and loopy/whumped/growth angst – is that, far from just feeling so deeply for Daniel, when I watch this episode it’s like I’m sucked, bodily, right into the angst-fest with him.

I get frustrated when I watch this episode. I get agitated, impatient, stressed-out, exasperated and anxious, and all these years later I still can’t watch those final few minutes on the “other side” without bouncing in my seat, chanting, “Hurry, hurry, hurry!” (It’s pathetic, but it’s so damn cool.)

And most agonising of all, the ordeal isn’t over when it’s over. Daniel’s home, he should be safe, it’s been enough already, and he gets to live the nightmare all over again, only worse: Another imminent attack on Earth, only this time it’s “his” Earth; another staff weapon blast, only this time more deadly; and once again he’s surrounded by familiar faces who won’t believe him, only these familiar faces really are the people he loves (and still they doubt him).

*sigh*

I do have to give a shout-out to Emmett Bregman, for not only reaching out to a closed-in, grief-stricken Daniel, but offering something that actually helps him, and doing so in a way that is so sympathetic and respectful of the kind of space Daniel needs, not trying to make him feel better, but giving him the tools to make things better for himself. ‘Heroes’ is too deeply flawed an episode to be a real contender for me, but their interaction merits some mention (it’s one of the few perfect notes the episode does hit, and saves the whole thing for me on many levels).

And I still feel like my vote should go to ‘Secrets.’

But I'm it to ‘There But For The Grace Of God' anyway, even if it's mostly because I can.

Tucker

Dani347
June 8th, 2005, 05:02 AM
I'm torn between Secrets and Menace. I love Secrets. I thought the most meaningful moment was when Daniel told Sha're it was a boy. It was the exact tone of a proud father. And, then, he repeated the words and the tone was completely different. The wonderful moment was over, and all the implications of this child, Apophis child, being a boy hit him. And, the poor guy just looked so wiped out and confused when Teal'c came in, disguised as one of Heru'ur (sp) guards. I think the confused look I saw wasn't because he was really confused so much as he was in a daze about everything.

I totally fell in love with Daniel in Singularity, but I think this episode really sealed my feeling about MS as an actor. True, it's not as big as Need or the other Daniel goes nuts episodes (which he excels in) but it just connected with me.

But, there's also Menace. He connected with Reece. He really started to care for her. And, his reaction when Jack shot her was complete anguish. And, worse, he felt betrayed by someone he loved. I don't think his reaction would have been so fierce if he didn't care about Jack. It wasn't just the words, but his tone of voice. (although I might save this for Daniel and friends, even if isn't a happy friendship episode.)

I think I'll go with Secrets.

Seshat
June 8th, 2005, 05:21 AM
This was a tough call for me. My first inclination was to vote for Secrets, for the obvious reasons already outlined so well above. But I chose Menace instead, mostly for the incredible scene between Jack and Daniel at the very end. Daniel's anguish over the reaffirmation of his and Jack's fundamentally differing life philosophies, including this "what is more important, the 'life' of one being or the safety of all" question, was extremely moving to me and underlined what I see as the basic premise of the entire series. The conflict of these two friends, and the examination of their continual struggle to remain friends despite the differences in their basic natures, has always been the most compelling aspect of the show to me.

.:Lemon:.
June 8th, 2005, 09:50 AM
I chose There But For The Grace Of God thinking I was near or enough alone in my opinion, but it turns out quite a few others have picked it as well so well done to them! :p

This was actually a really tough choice. Heroes, Secrets, Crystal Skull and Meridian all come close seconds :)

MartoufMarty
June 8th, 2005, 10:40 AM
I was thinking about Crystal Skull for a moment (first episode I saw, still love it).

But then I noticed Menace.

Menace tops any other episode in my books.

Menace had everything. Replicators, angsty Daniel, great acting, effects.

MS did so well in acting in that episode.

... Words cannot express how much I love that episode :P

Edit: Holy crap! 3,000 posts! Whoohoo! :)

AncientKnowledge
June 8th, 2005, 10:43 AM
Had to go with 'There but for the Grace of God'.......Really great ep.and I liked it alot,and I think MS did a awsome job in that ep.!.....But I for seconds I would have to go with Meridian or Heroes(what a tear jerker:().....

MartoufMarty
June 8th, 2005, 10:51 AM
Had to go with 'There but for the Grace of God'.......Really great ep.and I liked it alot,and I think MS did a awsome job in that ep.!.....But I for seconds I would have to go with Meridian or Heroes(what a tear jerker:().....
Meridian was great (even though I just have to make fun of it almost everytime I see it).

TBFTGOG was good, but not GREAT... I've seen that episode too many times lol.

SimilarCadence
June 8th, 2005, 11:09 AM
I think this was the toughest of all the Daniel polls because nobody angsts like Daniel! I sat staring at the poll for several long times before finally coming to a decision....

I was torn between "Crystal Skull", "Heroes 2" and "Secrets".

"Secrets" was a heartbreaker with all the trauma of having the lost love of his life unexpectedly reappear, very pregnant with the child of not-just-another-man (bad enough) but of a hated enemy (really bad). The wounded male pride, the sense of loss, the confusion, the concern for mother and child----you could go on and on for a very long time with this one.

"Heroes, Part 2" was certainly upsetting for me as an SG-1 fan so I can only imagine what Daniel went through with the loss of Janet. More loss for Danny who has become an expert on the subject (and experts know that dark, little cubbyholes are the best places for angsting in).

But, being a graduate of the School of Family Angst, I finally went with "Crystal Skull". Daniel's vast assortment of doubts and insecurities were almost tangible in this episode. All the loss and past rejections of his parents dying and Nick not adopting him must have hit him like a ton of bricks. Add to that his personal disappointment that the rest of his team preferred sleep to finding out what happened to him (more perceived rejection) despite the team motto of "no man left behind"......To top it all off, Daniel had no idea what had happened to him and whether or not life would ever return to normal----the uncertainty of his very existence was staring him right in the face and he had no idea of what to do to remedy this. (Yay!, though, for Hammond of Texas and his verbal concern for "his very good friend" and for Nick's apology, too.)

Switch42
June 8th, 2005, 11:14 AM
I had to go with "There But For the Grace of God" because it's the first time we've seen Daniel have to try and deal with this stuff on his own. Plus, I in my head, I group the following episodes with it where the rest of his team doesn't believe him. They are all excellent choices though.

Kerri

Scarym1
June 8th, 2005, 12:26 PM
Hm.

Not quite sure what to make of this one. Best angst? Things were pretty angsty in some of the loopy episodes, the Daniel-in-distress episodes, the character growth episodes, a few of the heroic episodes and even a handful of the exploration episodes. I’m actually a bit stumped.

“Which of these do you like best?”

Easy enough: ’There But For The Grace Of God.’

Do I think it’s the best Angsty Daniel episode? More angsty than ‘Secrets’?

Does it get more angsty than 'Secrets'?

Poor lamb: Sha’re is back, she’s within reach, their time is limited, and so much of the time they could have had was lost because Kasuf didn’t unbury the gate until the appointed Abydonian year had passed.

And the angst is just getting warmed up: She’s pregnant, for starters, the implications of that are devastating, she’s herself but only as long as she’s carrying the child of the being who kidnapped and enslaved her, and she’s certain Daniel despises her and he’s too shell-shocked at first to show her otherwise. One of the few times Daniel ever takes a moment to feel sorry for himself and there’s Teal’c all over him, asking him to force his wife into captivity above and beyond being taken as host by a Goa’uld and, oh dear, looks like he’ll have to deliver the baby, too. They come so close – so damn close - to getting her home and it falls apart in the dying seconds, Sha’re lost to the parasitical entity inside her, then physically lost again, as Apophis reclaims her, with Daniel trying to hold it together just enough to reassure her that he loves her, hand her child over to its grandfather and try to get himself and Teal’c home in one piece, even if it means getting knocked around by a snakehead on top of everything else.

All told, a helluva day at the office.

Six years and change later and I’m still haunted by Daniel’s eyes in this episode, the way he managed to do so much while in this daze of pain, as though the only way to get through any of it was to just do it before too much of what was happening sunk in.

I should vote for this one - I should - but I like ‘There But For The Grace Of God’ better, darn it.

The angst is not as focused as it is in episodes like ‘Menace’ or ‘Heroes,’ and that kind of focus so often translates into a more acute sense of suffering. Smaller pressure points will do that (and an actor that has matured as much as Michael had by that point doesn’t hurt, either).

But what I like so much about ‘TBFTGOG’ is the enormous scale of it all, how the weight of the world has fallen on Daniel’s slender shoulders – and no one can see it (or believe it) but him.

In this corner, a universe through the looking glass, hostile, disbelieving, doomed and a portent of the horrible devastation to come in his universe, the one he may not live to see again. And in this corner, Daniel Jackson.

Little Season One Daniel Jackson, who’s never met an Asgard, hasn’t developed that P-90 bulge, has never travelled to Kheb, hasn’t gone to another plane of existence and back and come to accept that the relative powerlessness of this existence is where he possesses his greatest strength, and who doesn’t have a head full of Ancient knowledge for those especially perilous occasions where it helps to have an edge. It’s Daniel the frustrated, flaky and small - lost, alone and overwhelmed, and all he needs to do is save the world.

And the friends he’s counting on to help him do it aren’t “his” friends at all.

He moves from the dread of being left behind again, to the relief of thinking he’s made it home, only to be faced with a roomful of strangers wearing the faces of his friends, holding him at gunpoint, restraining him, drugging him and refusing to even believe in his existence. He not only has to find a way to explain himself to these people – when he has no idea himself what’s going on – but convince them, in the middle of the end of their world, to take a moment or two out of meeting their fate to try and send him home.

To accept their end, but give him a chance to avert that end for himself and his world (and for Daniel to have to ask that is an incredible, terrible thing).

What really sets ‘TBFTGOG’ apart, for me – while I’m trying to make a distinction for myself between just plain “angst” and loopy/whumped/growth angst – is that, far from just feeling so deeply for Daniel, when I watch this episode it’s like I’m sucked, bodily, right into the angst-fest with him.

I get frustrated when I watch this episode. I get agitated, impatient, stressed-out, exasperated and anxious, and all these years later I still can’t watch those final few minutes on the “other side” without bouncing in my seat, chanting, “Hurry, hurry, hurry!” (It’s pathetic, but it’s so damn cool.)

And most agonising of all, the ordeal isn’t over when it’s over. Daniel’s home, he should be safe, it’s been enough already, and he gets to live the nightmare all over again, only worse: Another imminent attack on Earth, only this time it’s “his” Earth; another staff weapon blast, only this time more deadly; and once again he’s surrounded by familiar faces who won’t believe him, only these familiar faces really are the people he loves (and still they doubt him).

*sigh*

I do have to give a shout-out to Emmett Bregman, for not only reaching out to a closed-in, grief-stricken Daniel, but offering something that actually helps him, and doing so in a way that is so sympathetic and respectful of the kind of space Daniel needs, not trying to make him feel better, but giving him the tools to make things better for himself. ‘Heroes’ is too deeply flawed an episode to be a real contender for me, but their interaction merits some mention (it’s one of the few perfect notes the episode does hit, and saves the whole thing for me on many levels).

And I still feel like my vote should go to ‘Secrets.’

But I'm it to ‘There But For The Grace Of God' anyway, even if it's mostly because I can.

Tucker

This is just Amazing!!!! You know I never even considered this ep when I voted. You really do have a grasp on what makes Daniel tick. Are you sure you don't write fic?;) :D

emily_reich
June 8th, 2005, 12:26 PM
yay! a slightly easier one this time around :D HAD to go with there but for the grace of god! definately THE best ep of the first season and the best BECAUSE you can just feel daniel's frustration and (at least i :D) KNOW that in his place i'd be VERY desperate to get back and you get that from daniel as well, so it's excellent! :)

yasureubetcha
June 8th, 2005, 12:33 PM
Definitely Menace. The tension between him and Reese, and then him and Jack was gorgeous.

Captain-Peregrine
June 8th, 2005, 01:39 PM
I had to vote for Menace. The end is what really decides me. I love that episode. THAT is one angsty episode.

Jace021903
June 8th, 2005, 01:57 PM
It was tough for me to choose, but I went with Menace for the final scene--good stuff but painful to watch.

Heroes part 2 was a close second.

Michael's performances in these two episode were so good--he does quiet devastation better than anyone.

Jace

SlytherinGal
June 8th, 2005, 02:36 PM
I chose Meridian as well...but a lot of good other choices were there as well...:D

starfish
June 8th, 2005, 03:11 PM
I probably angsted most during The Light but for my own reasons rather than feeling for Daniel. To me The Light can't really be considered a true Daniel Angst episode as the angst is brought about by an alien influence rather than arising from Daniel's internal struggle/situation.

I voted for Menace as watching Daniel in the gateroom at the end almost breaking apart before your eyes was so intense. I see Menace one of the most obvious episodes showing the crescendo in intensity and emotion that preceded the events in Meridian.

CKO
June 8th, 2005, 09:16 PM
had to go with Meridian... cuz its one of the saddest eppys and what's more sader then danny losin' his life and makin' the choice to accend and watch his friends suffer.

chakka
June 9th, 2005, 04:43 AM
It was a hard choice but i had 2 go with Menace in the end, the last scene with Daniel and Jack was just so moving and angst filled that you were moved by it.

DJFavorite
June 9th, 2005, 05:05 AM
This was a tough one (but then which poll hasn't been). It really is hard to choose when you enjoy all the episodes. I ended up going with Secrets.

I think I view Angst a little different. I don't think I really saw much in the way of angst in either Menace or Meridian. I mean there was some, but I just didn't see a huge amount. Same with some of the others.

I ended up going with Secrets, because I've always felt horrible after watching that episode. I felt so bad for Daniel, being so close and having a few moments with Shar'e, but then having that taken away. (I'm just glad FIAD wasn't on this list, then I never would have been able to decide. :S )

Tok'Ra Hostess
June 9th, 2005, 05:36 AM
Angst: A feeling of anxiety or apprehension often accompanied by depression. (courtesy Dictionary.com)

Had it been included on the list I would have chosen the series opener, Children of the Gods. My second choice is Secrets.

gatehorse
June 9th, 2005, 09:09 PM
I think I view Angst a little different. I don't think I really saw much in the way of angst in either Menace or Meridian. I mean there was some, but I just didn't see a huge amount. Same with some of the others.


I guess I must too, because I agree with you. I voted for Secrets.

Tucker Case
June 10th, 2005, 08:56 AM
I think I view Angst a little different. I don't think I really saw much in the way of angst in either Menace or Meridian. I mean there was some, but I just didn't see a huge amount. Same with some of the others.

It might just be a matter of looking at 'Menace' or 'Meridian' as isolated incidents or seeing them as connecting points in a larger whole.

'Menace' is often seen as Daniel's breaking point. It's less about "the Reese incident" than it is the final straw after a year's (or even two years') worth of escalating disillusionment and disappointment. And, if we use the definition supplied by Tok'ra Hostess, where the anxiety and apprehension gives way to depression, by 'Meridian' the depression has sunk in, and goes a long way to explaining Daniel seeming so accepting of his fate, nowhere near as angry as Jack is about what the Kelownans are accusing him of, and so reluctant to see himself as worthy of the second chance Oma is offering him. Those two episodes are regarded as the last two steps in a long, continuous undercurrent of existential angst.

Although, I suppose, 'Secrets' works best it in that way, too, as part of the ongoing "Sha're angst" story (as opposed to the less overt "long, bitter road to ascension" story). I think the specifics of the Sha're episodes are so unique, though - kidnapped, pregnant, killed - and so wholly personal to Daniel that the angst seems more self-contained, within each episode. You don't have to throw them into any wider context in order to pin it down (although you can certainly intensify it, if you do).

My problem in answering this particular poll was that there were too many good arguments to be made for too many of the episodes, to the point where it was tempting to vote for episodes I don't think are all that great, on the whole, just because that one element - Daniel, angst-ing - was sooo effective and moving. In the end, the only thing for it was to just pick my favourite of the bunch and run with it.

Still feel like I'm cheating. :)

Tucker

surfinmuffin
June 14th, 2005, 08:25 AM
A hard choice but it has to be Past and Present without a doubt an amazing angsty episode.

Hex.FTB.enabled
June 14th, 2005, 12:18 PM
Also wanted to go with Need for the last scene with Jack (but that's one of my favs :)). But had to go w/Heroes. Obviously the scenes with Bregman, but kudos to MS because you can feel the desperation and fear in his voice when he's screaming for a medic.

LMichelle
June 15th, 2005, 05:41 PM
Forever In A Day should be listed among those eps. His wife died. That sounds pretty angsty to me. :eek:

GaterGina71
June 23rd, 2005, 04:46 PM
Been lurking way more than posting but here I am since it's about Daniel. I am (I think) the only one who said Gamekeeper. I chose it because having gone through the death of a parent and not being able to do anything about it sucks. Especially when he had to see it over and over again. I know it would probably drive me mad.
I also voted for this because I believe it's the one thing that set his course of life in motion. Granted, he does some pretty amazing things related to his job, but there is also the possibility that much of his pain never would have occured had his parents not died, i.e. his grandfather abandoning him, foster care, no encouragement, etc.

Second would have to be Secrets. When he was talking to Teal'c outside the tent after he found out about Sha're being preg the look on his face can't be put into words. My heart broke for him, as he was given a few moments of joy,(Sha're being herself for a while) then got his heart broken again.