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Col. Newman
May 16th, 2005, 07:16 PM
I think that the Ancients would use warp drive because my understanding is that warp drive is much more complex than hyper drive.

_Owen_
May 16th, 2005, 07:27 PM
Warp drive is and isn't more complicated, they are very diffrent, you can check out the Hyperspace thread if ou want to learn more. However theoreticaly you can get from point "A" to point "B" in a far shorter time. Warp drive and hyperspace eventually reach the same objective, In Star Trek it is Warp 10, you may know what I am talking about, at warp ten you occupy all of the universe at the same time. Eventually a layer of hyperspace will achieve the same point. Both hyperdrive and warp drive are useful and they both have positive points and negative points. However, I do not believe that this would be true because there would be some pretty big lawsuits, allthough they could call it something else.

Owen Macri

Col. Newman
May 16th, 2005, 07:44 PM
You make some very good points i have read the hyper space but i will go back and read it all. I just scanned some of it and read others.

P.S. Is Warp Drive copyrighted by Paramount( I think its paramount that owns Star Trek)?

Col. Newman
May 16th, 2005, 07:47 PM
O and they could call it Bubble Drive. because a warp drive forms a bubble of energy of sorts around the ship.

Seastallion
May 17th, 2005, 07:10 AM
You make some very good points i have read the hyper space but i will go back and read it all. I just scanned some of it and read others.

P.S. Is Warp Drive copyrighted by Paramount( I think its paramount that owns Star Trek)?

I don't think 'Warp Drive' is copyrighted by Paramount. I'm pretty sure that Isaac Asimov used it in his books. Also, it is such a staple of popular culture Paramount would have a hard time enforcing such a copyright. Also scientist use the Term to describe an actual theoretical phenomenon. Warp Drive has actual science behind it, so can you really copyright a term specifically used to describe a technology that doesn't even exist yet?? I doubt it. :)

Elite Anubis Guard
May 17th, 2005, 10:31 AM
P.S. Is Warp Drive copyrighted by Paramount( I think its paramount that owns Star Trek)?

Starship Troopers used it aswell.

The way you desribe warp ten is similar to the Inprobability drive then. :D
And since we know they're several layers of hyperspace it would be possible to eventually create a hyperspace engine which would do something like that.

_Owen_
May 17th, 2005, 01:50 PM
Lol, buble drive would work! Or they could call it a "Contortation Drive" (Contort is a synonym of warp). As for the copyrights, it might not be copyrighted, but they could find a way to sue someone.

I don't remember Starship Troopers, I assume, Inprobability drive was used in this?

Owen Macri

6thMonolith
May 17th, 2005, 04:26 PM
Naw, Inprobablity drive was only used by the Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy. And Inprobablity drive doesn't accelerate your evolution and leave you as a large slug. But close enough :D

_Owen_
May 17th, 2005, 04:47 PM
lol, that was just a side effect, with enough research they could probably fix that. It was a coincidence that that episode just happend to be on today, it is one of my favorite episodes.

I think that Voyager should have just used the Warp 10 technology to get back to Earth, then have the ship automatically induce the anti proton treatment that the doctor used. They would have to set up antiproton generators all around the ship but that wouldn't be problem. lol, sorry to go off topic.

Owen Macri

Col. Newman
May 17th, 2005, 05:04 PM
I have seen that episode and that evolution side effect is total impossible that’s not who evolution works it can't be predicted like that.

_Owen_
May 17th, 2005, 05:18 PM
Evolution works in two ways.

1) There is what I call "Forced Evolution." Forced Evolution is when your body adapts to conditions that are changed. For example if the humans lived completly in the water they might evolve with fins to increase thier swiming ability.

2) There is what I like to call "Natural Evolution." Natural Evolution is the evolution of your body that will occur for no seemingly apparent reason, for example having human gene sequnces altered to changed your physical make up. There may be no demand for this, as would be required in option 1) but it will still happen.

Natural Evolution occurs all of the time, it is occuring right now, in us, and it will occur forever. While on Voyager there was no need for Lt. Paris to evolve to breath 80% nitrogen and 20% acidichloride, this was an instance of Natural Evolution. Paris evolved with two hearts and a bunch of other organs that seemed to have no apparent function because this was natural evolution, so it was possible for Paris to evolve in that way.

Is this how humanity will evolve in the future, no probably not, but the genetic evolution that Paris underwent was entirly possible.

Owen Macri

Vetesn
May 17th, 2005, 05:33 PM
I think that the Ancients would use warp drive because my understanding is that warp drive is much more complex than hyper drive.

Hyperdrive is tens of thousands to millions of times faster than warp drive.

_Owen_
May 17th, 2005, 05:41 PM
And your basis for this conclusion is?

Owen Macri

Vetesn
May 17th, 2005, 05:51 PM
Calculations i've read on other boards based on the estimated time of arrival when SG-1 were stranded in that other galaxy and the speed of Asgard ships to traverse galaxies.

_Owen_
May 17th, 2005, 06:04 PM
Eventually both types of transportation even out to the same speed. Eventually you will be traveling at infinite velocity and occupy all of the universe at the same time. So technically neither is faster.

Owen Macri

Vetesn
May 17th, 2005, 06:29 PM
I don't see how that awful episode of Voyager pertains to general warp travel.

_Owen_
May 17th, 2005, 07:33 PM
There is no such "General Warp Travel" there is Warp Travel and that is it. Warp 10 is included in Warp travel, as well as a certain layer of hyperspace is included in Hyperspace Travel. In that episode (which by the way was not awful) they passed the transwarp threshold allowing them to travel at warp 10 allowing them to be in every place in the uiverse at the same time, just as a ceratain layer of hyperspace would do the same thing.

Owen Macri

Vetesn
May 17th, 2005, 08:42 PM
There may be a warp 10 but no one ever reaches it or tries to. If they want to attain faster velocities they have to switch to transwarp or slip stream. Basic hyperdrive however has superior observed speeds with no known upper limit.

aAnubiSs
May 18th, 2005, 03:49 AM
Warp 9.99: 9000c
Ha'tak: 32,000c
BC-303Nr: 230,000c
DaedalusZPM: 250,000,000c
Asgard, x,000,000,000c

_Owen_
May 18th, 2005, 12:01 PM
Hyperdrive does have a known limit, it is at the point when you are occupying every point in the universe at the same time. You are missing my point completly, both warp drive and hyperdrive have the same theoretical limit, there for they both have the potential for equivilent speed.

It is true if they want to go faster they do have to switch, but that is the same with hyperdrive, if they want to go faster they have to acces new layers of hyperspace, potentialy the equivilent of slip stream.

Owen Macri

aAnubiSs
May 18th, 2005, 12:53 PM
Actually there's no speed in hyperspace where you exist everywhere at once, it's just that it takes very little time to get anywhere. Perhaps 10^-435 seconds, but that's still time passed.

_Owen_
May 18th, 2005, 01:02 PM
You are right according to the theory on hyperspace, each layer of it is smaller than the previous, but are stretched, so you can travel a shorter distance in a faster amount of time. In the particular layer of hyperspace where travel could theoretically be instantaneous, it would be so small that only the size of your ship would fit in it, so you could enter and come out anywhere in the universe that you want to.

Warp drive is diffrent, it will accelerate you to such a speed as where you can exist at every point in space at the same time.

Owen Macri

Col. Newman
May 18th, 2005, 04:03 PM
What would that layer of hyperspace be called? Slip Stream?

_Owen_
May 18th, 2005, 05:12 PM
It could be called several things, however hyperspace has not been charted, untill they do this, names, numbers, or designations, will not be assigned to each layer.

I don't think they would call it slip stream, slip stream is used in many other science fiction series' for example, it was used briefly in Star Trek, and is commonly used in Andromeda, among other things.

Owen Macri

Col. Newman
May 18th, 2005, 05:22 PM
Well ones things for sure the ancients clearly would have reached that level of hyperspace (The one capable of almost instantanius travel anywhere)

_Owen_
May 18th, 2005, 05:43 PM
It is definetly a possibility, perhaps this is a fuction of Atlantis that they have yet to discover.

Owen Macri

6thMonolith
May 18th, 2005, 06:27 PM
This theory really reminds me of another I read about awhile ago. This is my take on hyperspace.

Layers of Hyperspace would just be other universes, that are smaller than the one we are in now. The further you go into hyperspace, the smaller the universe, the smaller the distence traveled. Since the universe is expanding, eventually the distances you would need to trave increase, but ours is expanding also, the relitive distance would stay the same. Eventually, you get to a hyperspace-universe of infinately small proportions, that you could instantaniousely transport into and out of, covering as much distance as needed.

But sence you are traveling in a ship, the universe must be bigger than the ship, so there is a limit to how fast you can travel. If the universe is too small, say goodbye to E-deck...

_Owen_
May 18th, 2005, 07:01 PM
Yes, this seems to be the concensus, it seems logical, and theoretically possible, unleess we hear otherwise.

Owen Macri